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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhy Democrats Are Losing Americans Without a College Degree--and How to Win Them Back
Why Democrats Are Losing Americans Without a College Degree—and How to Win Them Back
Voters intuitively know that the economy has not worked well for most of us for decades. Democrats must offer them a transformative vision, and stick to it for as long as it takes.
NEIL KRAUS and JON SHELTON
https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/democrats-economy-election-working-class/
"SNIP............
What Democrats must do, instead, is to offer a big transformative vision, and stick to it for as long as it takes to actualize it. Offering such a vision is not as daunting as it sounds. Rather, the Democrats need to tap into their own history of changing the nation’s economic tapestry, through traditions like the New Deal and Great Society, which made them a majority party for decades, to improve the livelihoods of the people who do all the work.
Democrats must craft a vision of economic rights that tells a story of how we got here and what we need to do. It needs to be big and repeated over and over. We suggest, as Harvey Kaye and Alan Minsky have proposed, a modern version of FDR’s economic bill of rights, which includes the rights to housing, universal healthcare, a job with a living wage; and tuition-free public education.
Crucially, labor unions must be a central component of this vision, and organizing around economic security must be central. It isn’t difficult to understand. Organized labor is enjoying its highest support in over 50 years, as roughly 70 percent of Americans (including almost half of Republicans) approve of unions.
The villain in this story is corporate America. Democrats can side with corporate interests, or they can win elections. But they cannot do both. As a mill worker once wrote to FDR: “Mr. Roosevelt is the only man we ever had in the White House who understood my boss is a son-of-a-bitch.” Democrats must invoke the FDR ethos, and for God’s sake, no Democratic candidate should ever call themselves a “capitalist” ever again.
...........SNIP"
Applegrove: not sure I agree with getting rid of the word capitalism. Maybe it could be replaced with 'mixed market economy'. Food for thought.
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Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)The poorest states vote for republicans who don’t do anything for them . Marjorie green is for working people, no she’s mean and crass and they like that. Economic inequality is not the problem . They keep voting for people who give them nothing except thinking they are better than others and if they are not better someone else is responsible.
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)move in greater numbers to the Republicans? Your comment seems to just be saying 'the voters are dumb'.
Bettie
(19,704 posts)honestly, I live among magats. They are not smart.
Or they are blinded by their racism and hatred for anyone who isn't exactly like them.
Either way, with a media intent on putting forth a narrative that white people are all being oppressed by everyone else....well, they do love their victimhood.
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)strong Democratic voting blocks (working class, Hispanics, Black males) what is the path forward?
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)Stop watching Fox news or make them stop listening to right wing radio. They have to want to live with others and understand immigrants make us stronger. He told you what he was going to do and he is doing just that. Until they want to make a better America for all of its people ,nothing will change. When they start cutting programs they will be first to feel it, maybe then they will stop following charlatans and crooks. His cabinet picks are disgraceful and our countries is in danger but they don’t care. The people in Florida who voted for this crook aren’t hurting but they are mean, look at desantis, they don’t have a problem with his six week abortion ban , don’t say gay and all of his totalitarian edicts. You need to stop saying they are stupid and understand they are getting what they want, they may not like the end result but these are the consequences of their decisions.
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)voting in abortion rights at the state level - FYIGM) we will be looking at losses at the national level for many cycles to come.
Sad state of affairs ......
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)This is what they voted for. Stop asking the party that you think failed to talk to these voters.
What he said was abhorrent to anyone with a sense of decency and caring, they were not horrified when he accused Haitians of eating pets ,that he would pardon people who tried to overthrow our government. You must have a core to see how repulsive he is as a human being. They find his false bravado energizing. Go talk to your neighbors and friends who are maga and let us know how to give them a conscience.
Meadowoak
(6,606 posts)landslide, if our candidate was a white male. Sorry but it's the truth.
travelingthrulife
(5,179 posts)The MAGAs believe the most ridiculous things. My sister says she listens to every word Trump says and she thinks he's a kind man who is a great business success. Reality does not enter in to it.
'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities' maybe Voltaire.
This is why it is so successful with evangelicals. They already believe in a lot of nonsense.
RandomNumbers
(19,156 posts)(assuming she's competent, which both Hillary and Kamala are) - I have to agree with your assessment.
The Democratic Party - and the primary voters - need to get out of fantasy land.
Of course 2024 was not that. I'm not sure Biden would have "won in a landslide" if he didn't step aside; and unfortunately by Harris being Veep, there really was no other choice to step in. So does this mean we can't have a woman veep until America grows the f*k up and respects women? Unfortunately I fear so, but that will not be palatable with progressives.
I think what floors me, and upsets me so badly, is that your first statement is so true, EVEN WHEN the alternative is someone so clearly unqualified, corrupt, and cruel as Trump. I mean really, WTAF, America? But I guess we have learned our lesson now.
Meadowoak
(6,606 posts)Moving toward Republicans and away from democratic policies, they just won't support a woman. Sad, but it's just the truth.
Kaleva
(40,365 posts)If you look at the ratings, its in the mid single digits percentage wise of all adults.
And what percentage of adults listen to RW radio? I haven't looked for that info and my guess is that you don't know either.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)CNN town halls
Magazines at store check out
Newspapers
You tube
Twitter
Facebook
Fox News is the easily identifiable villain, but it is everywhere. You have to be open to it. You look at tv it’s trump all the time. The only time there was a great deal of coverage for president Biden was after that debate even MSNBC piled on with the question is Joe to old and none of the media questioned trump who said crazy stuff and is to old and filthy with his microphone nonsense. People had a choice and now we will all live with it.
IrishAfricanAmerican
(4,471 posts)Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)Prosperity gospel and grifting denominations should have been on the list ,But there are so many shady characters, Sherlock Holmes couldn’t figure this mess out.
Scrivener7
(59,522 posts)Look at the numbers. I agree that the economy doesn't work for everyone, but that's not why we lost.
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)Biden proves the protestant part is not a prerequisite. It looks like 'guy' is the last prerequisite. I fear it will be AT LEAST till 2040 for a female (Democratic) nominee to be possible.
Scrivener7
(59,522 posts)That's pretty rare in a politician. And Joe lost many, many times before he won.
I wouldn't want to take the risk. If we get another chance to vote, we have to win.
Nimble_Idea
(2,849 posts)Liberals love getting in the way and taking blame for magat choices. They always wanted to own the libs right?
Let them own it. fafo
krawhitham
(5,072 posts)Then wait 13-18 years, it a long game but the correct move
(I would use the word ignorant instead of dumb, but close enough for government work)
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)
no_hypocrisy
(54,908 posts)at that period of time, a majority of Americans didn't have college degrees, let alone high school diplomas.
We did it once, and we can do it again.
Fiendish Thingy
(23,240 posts)And once in, he governed progressively, fearlessly, without hesitation or filibustered obstruction.
It will likely take that level of suffering again, plus killing the filibuster.
Cosmocat
(15,424 posts)To your point.
Yes, there are those who genuinely are hard up. But things today do not even remotely look like they did in the 30s.
The general level of affluence is why people are free to get cranked up by all the stupid culture wars bullshit.
Raven123
(7,797 posts)Silent Type
(12,412 posts)segregation in military, interment camps, etc. We can’t go back to that to win red states.
Because of that, red states loved him because he enacted Social Security to feed rubes mom and grandma in retirement. Winning war helped too, but still.
JustAnotherGen
(38,054 posts)Someone will alert on me for *Right Wing Talking* points. I don't care.
Back then, my Grandparents were not a part of the equation. Wait - my grandmama wasn't - but my grand daddy went armed to the polls - but like most black Americans who COULD vote in the South (educated, land owning, business owning) - he voted Republican. He knew about Rosewood and despised Woodrow Wilson - who was an arch White Supremacist.
Here's what gets me the hide: The only way the white Magats will vote for it is if non-white people are left out.
They hate our guts (black people) and I hope to the Universe that people start to tell the truth about the New Deal.
You may have faith in the white Amerikkkan Magat - but I don't.
I see them for what they are and I hope the person I did NOT vote for inflicts the maximum amount of pain on them. They have it coming.
Black Americans have our ancestors grit and determination and know how to go behind the back of Amerikkka and take care of our own. If we lean into each other, hide our money, and thumb our noses at people who hate our guts - we will be fine.
So to be clear - the Magats will only allow it if it is ONLY for white folks.. They. Them. I'm just telling folks at DU what those bigots are.
And this is why I'm part of the 92%. Go ahead and win on that and watch me cheat on my taxes but pay just enough to keep the heat off of me to take care of my community.
Racism beats class every single time.
President Lyndon B Johnson:
""If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
The overwhelmingly white American Magat will blame everything this incoming Admin inflicts on them - on everyone but the rich white men inflicting the pain.
I will not lift a finger to help them.
This radical train of thought is brought to you by JAG -
Unapologetically looking out for other black folks the next four years.
Polybius
(21,902 posts)Certain social issues weren't a thing back then. Rednecks in the South (and elsewhere) are not voting for anyone they perceive to view as "pro-trans." It's a sad fact.
Fiendish Thingy
(23,240 posts)If the most pro-worker/labor president since FDR didn’t convince no-college voters whose side Dems are on, nothing short of extended suffering will.
Until they reject their brainwashing overlords at Facebook, TikTok, etc, no persuasion will be possible, no matter what populist demagoguery is attempted.
EdmondDantes_
(1,798 posts)Or maybe an incredibly charismatic candidate like Obama, or Clinton benefiting from a third party candidate?
Sorry but just saying anyone who didn't vote the way we want is brainwashed and anyone looking to improve our message is a nincompoop isn't going to reverse our electoral issues.
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)seems to be the general (or al least a sizeable minority) consensus here on DU.
Fiendish Thingy
(23,240 posts)But the power of right wing news and social media overcame logic, facts, and reality.
Response to EdmondDantes_ (Reply #9)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Nimble_Idea
(2,849 posts)Nimble_Idea
(2,849 posts)what is "our" message? were you in charge of it?
Let me guess, we didn't have one? it needs to talk to the working class? or something else that corp news/mikajoe slob the orange shroom ring is off about?
Please let us know what the message was, and then edit it here for us all to see.
But to the 1st question, that will be up to the leopards.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)Refuse to look at how the media , propaganda and culture played into this loss.
paleotn
(22,218 posts)Pardon the fact that it irks the living hell out of me that they'd vote for the very people who've been screwing them all this time and punish those trying to help. But I get it. I've been advocating the same for years. Our message is muddled and incomprehensible to most people.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)The media put their bodies on the scale for trump and are continuing to kiss his butt.
paleotn
(22,218 posts)That's a misnomer. The media runs with anything that gets eyeballs, i.e. money. Sounding like a bunch of Ivy League college professors with ideas incomprehensible to the masses, doesn't get that. Being all over the place, without a succinct message doesn't get that. Allowing our enemies to define us doesn't get that. Keep it simple, consistent and to the point. Take a page from Repukes and repeat it ad nauseam until it becomes common knowledge. Listen to any random FDR speech and you'll hear exactly that. We use to be damn good it. Not for a long time.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)Bigotry and hate fuels them. When they see children taken from their parents crying , they said they shouldn’t have come here. 1/2 day once a week will not change them. They like what they see in trump because his dark selfish heart is their heart. Please stop acting like they are misguided and if we just say the right words they will come into the fold, they don’t hear you because the need someone to hate.
paleotn
(22,218 posts)More American voters didn't vote than voted for either Harris or Trump, ~90M. Turnout was 2% lower than 2020. That's ~ 5M voters. And that isn't because they're all a bunch of haters. That's because we didn't do it right. And haven't been doing it right for quite a while. Why? Here's one reason.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219822605
Sorry, but if you want to live in doom and gloom land, that's you're prerogative. I chose not to. Not only because it sure as shit ain't healthy, but also because it ain't reality.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)No one said all, the majority of people who voted for trump liked his message. They are eating the pets, immigrants are criminals, sex change operations in schools and more crazy. They loved it. If they believed any of his nonsense that tells you who they are.
paleotn
(22,218 posts)"They like what they see in trump because his dark selfish heart is their heart." You just typed that. Do you know all of them? Most people that is?
We can counter their message with one that reaches people if we'd only try. And, for god's sake, stop acting like Ivy League college professors. That shit ain't working. I may like it. You may like it. The bulk of the country, who are seething in anger at what's been done to them, does not. Tap into the damn anger. We CAN do that. We've done it before. We use to be good at that.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)You may continue this discussion without me.
paleotn
(22,218 posts)Some? Your absolutely correct, but your brush is way to broad and not the least bit helpful. But go off and live in doom and gloom land. As stated, your purgative. I don't play that game.
Yavin4
(37,182 posts)The key statement there.
msongs
(73,754 posts)
W_HAMILTON
(10,333 posts)...and yet these sorts of progressives seem to only exist and thrive in deep blue areas.
If they think red state America is just clamoring for these sorts of politicians and policies, don't tell us -- show us. Start winning races by running these progressive candidates in heavily Republican areas and let's see if this constant refrain by some actually bears out in reality.
MichMan
(17,151 posts)Meeting with union leaders isn't enough.
keep_left
(3,210 posts)There really needs to be a revival of labor politics in the country, and not just for the obvious reasons (e.g. reversing the overall decline of organized labor that began with the "Rust Belt" issues of the '70s). Labor unions have historically been some of the strongest forces for organizing in this nation, especially when it comes to a populace that is often divided politically. There used to be a significant emphasis on worker education. That needs to return--e.g. explaining how obsessing over culture-war issues ends up with billionaires busting your unions and picking your pocket. 
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)keep_left
(3,210 posts)The people who are obsessing over culture-war issues are the very people we need to return to the labor movement. Not all of them agree--in fact many of them disagree--with what most DUers think. A significant number of them are part of the MAGA movement. But I'm reminded of something I heard years ago in a talk by Noam Chomsky. He mentioned how many parts of America are like "devastated peasant societies". My guess is that he was speaking mainly of the Rust Belt. In the last couple of years, I visited some of these places, and I found that Chomsky is very much correct.
The thing is, for a lot of these people, their views are very "ad-hoc". If another charismatic leader had come along at the right moment, they would be following them, not Trump. Decades ago, labor leaders like Mother Jones and movements like the Wobblies were organizing many of these same people. A revival of the labor struggle is one of the most effective ways to counter these antidemocratic movements.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)It took the Supreme Court and the passage of civil rights legislation. To move the south forward. Every chance they get they go backwards and because of the propaganda Wurlitzer the middle of the country has joined them. This is a new century, many people don’t see themselves as labor. We no longer have shared values. Joe Biden did more for everyone in this country but hate won , many years ago I listened to a radio station. A gentleman called and said he didn’t need a union he could negotiate a contract for himself. The only thing that will bring unions back is desperation.
keep_left
(3,210 posts)...what it's going to take, and believe me, desperation is what they will get. Trump has assembled quite a wrecking crew that will lay waste to what was left of the civil society, and so it will become a far less civil society.
Your comments about the South are also correct, but the problems unfortunately go back literally centuries at this point and are basically unsolvable. The post-Civil War era absolutely required a radical "year zero" root-and-branch restructuring of that whole culture, and it never occurred. It wouldn't be that surprising if the country ended up splitting off or at least de-federalizing some of the Deep South. The problem is that even the reddest states have urban areas that will not be happy about that (to say the least).
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)Reconstruction was a monster and put black people into another form of slavery. I find it strange that immigrants and children of immigrants are leading this next adventure. Betty Davis said buckle up, it’s going to be a bumpy ride.
Jit423
(1,568 posts)I am tired of trying to convince us.
Abolishinist
(2,958 posts)Social/cultural issues, IMO, are a HUGE component of the loss of these voters.
https://www.niskanencenter.org/what-explains-the-diploma-divide/
betsuni
(29,078 posts)The 1% wealthy are Them for Left-leaning populists but somehow think both populisms are the same and all the Republicans will vote for progressives because Democrats make them have economic anxiety. Ridiculous.
Kaleva
(40,365 posts)In It to Win It
(12,651 posts)ZonkerHarris
(25,577 posts)But most of them are too damn stupid to do the best thing for themselves.
kacekwl
(9,148 posts)A billion dollars to run a campaign it can never happen. Get corporate money out of the elections.
brettdale
(12,748 posts)We are ot down by three with four seconds to go. There is no over time coming up. This was the last chance for America, there's no coming back from another trump term.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)Mango Mussolini encourages parents to go to school board meetings and loudly demand that books be removed from classrooms and libraries, and they adore him for it.
Trumpistas drive good teachers from the classroom, out of their jobs and out of their states.
MAGAGOP thinks Trump has literally been sent here by God Almighty to do the work of Jesus, by which they mean a whole lotta smiting and no helping the poor.
What college education are this generation of students in those states going to be fit for? The RWNJs want them all to have such a low literacy level they will be guaranteed to be the base of a new permanent lower class.
I hope with all my heart that Dems can magically craft a magic message. But I think we are up against an oligarchy that owns the airways, newspapers, radios, and cable. We Dems need a few billionaires of our own — but I’ve just watched the ones we thought were more or less on our side just slide on over to where the money is. Talkin’ to you, ABC. Talkin’ to you, Dr. Sunshine of the Los Angeles Times.
Apologies for the midnight Debbie Downerism.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)But if we work locally to help our communities and friends. We will be alright.
We now know the enemy ,that’s the beginning of being able to fight back.
Ndp5
(100 posts)The idea that Dems just need to repeat their message over and over is delusional. They did that. Trump’s voter outreach and media strategy were surprisingly sophisticated, and Democrats need to be at least as sophisticated in going after voters with low media literacy.
I don’t have a college degree and voted Harris. The other day I got trapped in a conversation with a Gen Zer without a degree who, it soon became clear, backs Trump and especially RFK. She gets all her news from TikTok (and, apparently, somehow also her local gym). Her main takeaways from this election were that daylight savings is bad and Trump wants to make America healthy again.
I tried to tell her Trump lives on a diet of fast food and RFK wants to take fluoride out of drinking water, which will enrich dentists but hurt average Americans. She didn’t know what I was talking about. Doubt I made any impact.
I have a relative who’s a fellow Millennial and who, if she voted at all, backed Trump. She has multiple advanced degrees. What they have in common is severely low media literacy (and right-wing male partners they don’t seem to question). They were ripe for voter outreach and media strategies that reached them where they are. And let’s just say they don’t know to differentiate between legitimate news sources and some crank like Rogan who’s got hold of a microphone.
The other lesson Dems shouldn’t miss is that American voters, for better or worse, are self-interested and impatient. A program that takes years to pay off is unlikely to survive because voters will eject its architects from office absent concrete improvements in their lives.
And there’s a certain sense of entitlement to proposing such a slow-to-pay-off program. Like voters owe them years and years of forbearance. Voters don’t owe either party sh-t, and they will act accordingly.
So Democrats need more than economic populism alone. They need an organized grassroots voter mobilization program, on a different level than Harris’ last-minute GOTV effort. They need more sophisticated earned and paid media targeting. And they need policy solutions that will see results in the short term as well as the long term.
They also, at some point, need to finally put their full weight behind saving local news. The ascent of right-wing media sources, from social media influencers to Fox News, did not happen in a vacuum. Trustworthy, legit local news is often a vaccine against misinformation (and polarization, corruption and a whole host of other things, research shows), and its decline created this opportunity for billionaires and right wing ideologues.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)But people no longer read newspapers, people can no longer differentiate fact from fiction. Many feel empowered by a bully and we can’t change a gut reaction. We have outreach in the rural areas and their culture will not let them vote for a democrat. Democrats have a problem with fighting for their constituents or lining their pockets. The only thing that will change this is not a pleasant option.
Ndp5
(100 posts)Newspapers are the worst information sources except for everything else that’s been tried.
Most of the actual newsworthy information out there is still generated by newspapers. Nothing has replaced them in terms of information-gathering, unless you count nonprofit newsrooms, which are basically online-only newspapers.
Social media influencers, blogs and even Fox News are just living off the original reporting done by newspapers, to which they just add their own spin.
So it’s not true that nobody reads newspapers anymore. Everybody in the media ecosystem still basically relies on them. If you read spin online for free, chances are the nugget of news that spin is built around came from a newspaper.
Keepthesoulalive
(2,304 posts)Our local fish wrap is conservative and not very well informed. People don’t pay to read it and it has been selling assets also laying off reporters. We’re seeing instances where the owner is overruling his editorial staff and one is donating millions to trump’s inaugural. This is not journalism, this is aiding a convicted felon grab power. We’re facing dark times and the media is complicit.
arthritisR_US
(7,810 posts)totally.
JI7
(93,617 posts)If it's about issues why aren't Trump supporters objecting to the wealthy people he is handing out positions to ?
valleyrogue
(2,715 posts)Aggrieved white males will NEVER vote for a woman for president of the United States.
bucolic_frolic
(55,143 posts)They are the Achilles heel of democracy. Elections decided by the dumb, uninformed, somnambulent voter.
Converting them is a lost cause. All they want is sex and more ammo.
NoMoreRepugs
(12,076 posts)It will, in 2028 come down to how fair will the election be IMO. I’m investing more aggressively than I ever have, I’m 75, so my kids and granddaughter have a chance in the coming decades. I belong to the group that KNOWS half the population are DumbFucks.
Nimble_Idea
(2,849 posts)sell them bitcoin and cashout at the top of the cresting crash that is coming.
valleyrogue
(2,715 posts)The only thing Democrats need to do is get nonvoters to vote Democratic to defeat Republicans. You don't appeal to racist, sexist MEN. They are lost.
I am sick and tired of this nonsense. The two parties have switched power continually for decades. You would think we never won an election in our lives.
Enough is enough.
haele
(15,402 posts)Propaganda implying that education itself is wasteful because anyone can learn Astrophysics or Organic Sciences micro-biology by reading a book, guesswork, and watching You-Tube videos.
Neo-Liberals/Neo- Conservatives - the people behind Nixon and Reagan - pretty much ensured that the general public was taught that Liberal Arts are for Nepo-Babies who could afford to sit on their asses and think about things that had no meaning in the real world where Real People (tm) had to work for a living. According to the propaganda, only Real People are citizens, while the Elite are fictional characters that reside in their own bubbles. And Real People don't have to concern themselves with what's behind that Media curtain...
People who take advanced degrees are snobby know it alls.
Why should any kid learn anything in colleg that isn't some sort of quicky, glitzy DYI training? Why should they learn how to think? That only makes them uppity and gets them in trouble...
Haele
mike_c
(37,051 posts)