My (actual) thoughts on banning TikTok in the U.S.

[speak easy]

Last edited Sun Jan 19, 2025, 04:44 PM - Edit history (1)

I have been a long time critic of efforts to ban TikTok. To put my cards on the table, my worst fears, that the GOP would use a 'Biden Ban' attack against Democrats in 2024, never came to pass: A breathtaking lie, given that the ban originated in the Trump Administration, and was championed by Republicans right up to the moment Trump changed his mind, but that never stopped them before.

I don't buy, have never bought the National Security argument. Byte Dance offered to relocate its servers to Texas, but that was not enough. Nothing less than selling TikTok to an American business would suffice.

If I had to weigh hypothetical risk of the CCP demanding data from ByteDance, against the very real 'discomfort' of Google, Meta, and their parasite economic spheres facing competition and the gaggle of Tech-Bros wanting to buy in at cut rates, I would find, and do find the National Security argument the least convincing explanation of it all.

The whole thing was a shakedown. The 'Biden Ban' attack never came to pass (The president could not have made a veto stick - there were super majorities in both the House and Senate back in the day when Dems thought Big Tech was on their side) but its Ghost lives on in 'Trump will save us' MAGA world .

"Trump is awesome"a DUér reported a 13 year old said to his Democratic family and relatives. 'He will save TikTok.' When push came to show the Democrats did not stand up for us but Trump will?

EDIT: Why haven't other NATO members banned TIkTok outright, including counties in the famously restrictive EU? Ocam's Razer: Because they did not have ultra-rich Tech-Bros wanting to buy it. 'Sell it to Americans' was the demand.

My 2c. I'll shut up. But if Musk gets a majority stake in TikTok (U.S.), I will say I told you so.

[Lovie777]

1. I have a total different response from young users................

maybe because my family and friends talked about why tic tok may be ban, and they understood.

Plus they know the dangers of magas, and I feel good about the outcome.

[MaryMagdaline]

2. This is a total shakedown

I’m so sorry Biden fell for it.
The one and only act of his administration that I opposed.

[Phoenix61]

7. What do you think he did?

[karynnj]

9. It was in a bill to fund Ukraine and Israel

In addition, this ban had support from a large bipartisan majority. I suspect it was because the idea that it could be a national security risk from CHINA meant voting against it could be used against Democrats. ( Consider the percent of legislators who would be profiles in courage AND many might have thought there was sufficient risk.)

As to the risk, consider what the Republicans, Russia and Cambridge Analytical probably did in 2016. The combination of the voting rolls and data mining FACEBOOK along with putting stuff on Facebook took targeted marketing to a new level.

I actually see MORE risk with a Musk owned Tik Tok which could alter algorithms like he did on Twitter to blatantly push his agenda. The concern over whether China could use Tik Tok may stem from having seen Russia and possibly other countries use other social media. What makes Tik Tok more vulnerable may not be that it is more risky, but that it is overtly owned by a hostile nation.

[D23MIURG23]

3. I have no idea if the security argument makes sense, but your reasoning certainly does. n/t

[malaise]

4. Great OP

Rec

[speak easy]

6. ty

[HAB911]

5. IMO, FB/Google/Meta

are the greater danger for sure

[brer cat]

8. Good post, speak easy.

[Igel]

10. ByteDance offered to relocate its servers.

But along the way the claim--which was either not denied or was confirmed--was two fold: Backups were not in the US and as a PRC-based company for all its incorporation in the US it was bound to comply with PRC governmental requests for data while not divulging publicly what data was divulged.

[speak easy]

14. "[ByteDance] was bound to comply with PRC governmental requests for data."

I agree.

If I had to weigh hypothetical risk of the CCP demanding data from ByteDance

I say hypothetical because the question is not whether the CCP has accessed, has access, or has analyzed TikTok data, but rather, than it can.

What is not hypothetic is the competition TikTok delivers to Meta, Google, and their hangers on, nor the desire of American Tech Cos it buy it at a good price.

So ... if I had to say what got the ban over the line, it would stone cold reality of business, not national security.

And that is what I am saying.

[Johonny]

11. If TicToc is banned, why is WeChat available

It is almost certainly more Chinese bias. I understand fewer Americans use it. But it is out there and has a lot of features that could make it popular here in the USA.

[LeftInTX]

22. Weird...I believe We Chat was in the bill. It's still available.

Good catch. And I think that's weird.....The law does state 1 million users here in the US and gave specific definition of SM. I thought that included We Chat. Unless We Chat is considered "Private" like "Whats App"?

But yes, it should be banned if Tik Tok is banned due to potential Chinese data harvesting. That is the purpose of the ban.

[womanofthehills]

31. Trump said he changed his mind because TicTok helped him win the election

I also read that some of Trump's doner's are heavily invested in TicTok - BlackRock , General Electric & other large companies owning around 40 percent or more.

Ted Cruz actually said on news - we need to get rid of TicTok because it is too pro Palestine. So different Congress people have made different claims why they wanted it gone. Sounds like Israel really wanted it gone as there were too many pics of injured Palestinian kids day after day.

[Arazi]

13. China has banned it in its own country

And they would never allow a US based TikTok type app in their own country. In fact they censor US social media all the time and if it IS allowed, the Chinese govt has to have back doors to spy on its own people.

I agree it’s a shakedown but I also agree there’s some NatSec aspect we’re not seeing. This was a bipartisan bill, a 9-0 SCOTUS vote, and Biden also felt it had to be divested. We were not privy to all of the NatSec issues that were given behind closed doors.

Furthermore, their dick move last night praising Dear Leader Trump has pushed me over into the camp that they’re toxic and divisive for the US. Fuck them

[speak easy]

15. "China has banned it in its own country"

Indeed. And China has no pretensions to being a free country.

When congress voted on the ban, it had near unanimous support from the Tech sector. That does not mean it was in the national interest, but it was certainly in their interest.

[Arazi]

16. My only point was that the NatSec concerns are real

And not manufactured. They’ve all seen something behind closed doors that we haven’t and China’s own ban on the app isn’t for nothing (probably because the data mining is easier than we know/exploitable).

And again, their behavior yesterday means I’m not going back when it’s up again. Any half-aware Dem should be deleting it anyway now

[speak easy]

17. "They've all seen something behind closed doors that we haven't"

Reminds me of the IWR.

[Arazi]

18. Just say you're addicted without saying you're addicted

😂

I totally get it. I left Twitter cold Turkey the day after the election and that was my social media “place” for 10+ years.

The first day without that dopamine hit is tough but I’m hopeful TikTok addicts find other shit to keep themselves busy. That old adage go outside, touch grass …

And again, I repeat, TikTok should be dead to Dems after last night’s fuckery.

[speak easy]

23. As I understand it, all that matters

is that the CCP can demand data from ByteDance, and legally they have to comply - that is a real Security concern - and does not require require behind doors evidence.

I don't use TikTok, and I abhor the Chinese Community Party rule under Xi. But day to day, I am more concerned about the immedite conduct of our Tech-Bros, than hypotheticals about what the CCP might get up to. Like I said - there is a reason no other NATO member has banned TikTok outright - they do not want to buy it.

[Arazi]

25. 100% with you on the tech bros

Fuck those guys and I say that as an active and daily (past) user of both TikTok and Twitter. I had no illusions about the algos there but was committed to abortion rights groups/friends/activists on both platforms so I didn’t delete. Now?

The election should have provided some bright lines for Dems and anyone still participating in either app now is not helpful.

I have no illusions about Bluesky atm and am prepared to dump it when/if it’s proven to be as shitty as the rest (which realistically is probably only a matter of time).

I’m hopeful TikTok's latest maneuver peels off some percentage of Dems. From personal experience you can survive weaning oneself off the addiction. Today’s teens are experiencing their first social media platform collapse.. it IS difficult lol . 😏

[womanofthehills]

32. I hate people telling me what to watch and if I am aware or not

Lots of fun things on TicToc - great dance moves, recipes, etc - plus I want to see what my grandkids are watching.

[vanessa_ca]

19. Not banned in China. International version of TT has no presence in China because of its sister app Douyin

TikTok is not banned in China.The app operates under a different name, Douyin. While TikTok is available internationally, Douyin is specifically designed for the Chinese market and follows different regulations and content guidelines set by the Chinese government.

But there are a million easy workarounds such as this one

No, TikTok is not banned in China, it just isn't available under the same name. Although it is true that TikTok is not available for download in mainland China, it is not banned. The Chinese version of TikTok is actually the original version of the app, called Douyin.

Douyin is a video-sharing social media service, used to create and share short-form videos of a minimum of 15 seconds and a maximum of 3 minutes in length.

In an effort to expand the Chinese-owned app, which by the spam of one year had earned 100 million users in China, Douyin founders created the international version of the social media platform. They called it TikTok.

https://brandmentions.com/wiki/Is_TikTok_Banned_in_China

[Arazi]

20. Mark Cuban is hoping to do something similar attached to Bluesky

China’s handling of it’s social media platforms is a whole other topic.

I’m not going to go into nuances of algorithms and why Douyin isn’t exactly the same but it’s certainly fair to point out that China has its own version of the app-not-called-TikTok

[vanessa_ca]

21. Interesting about Bluesky. Thanks. eom

[ibegurpard]

24. No Democrats should've supported this

A comprehensive data protection policy across ALL social media? Absolutely.
This was a joke we will pay for.

[speak easy]

26. From a selfishly political point of view,

I do not want TikTok in the hands of Zuckerberg, Bezos or Musk etc.

And because ByteDance is a Chinese company, TikTok's operation is currently under serious scrutiny. Give it to an Oligarch and it's another nail in the coffin our democracy.

[womanofthehills]

33. So??? who owns lots of stock in Meta, Amazon, Apple & almost every large US Corp?? Answer. BLACKROCK

Big suprise that BlackRock owns lots of stock in TicTok. So, the same company (Blackrock) owns part of all of them.

[speak easy]

39. A stock holding is not corporate control.

[underpants]

27. Information

As I read here the other day, the powers that be (who done with Trump) want both the user info and access to the Tik Tok algorithm to direct WHAT users see.

We’ve been a short attention span culture for a while but it’s even shorter now. Something like 60% of people never read beyond the headline. If you control the headlines or what headlines specific groups/people see, you control what and how they see/think.

It’s not the mandatory viewing of a controlled propaganda as many writers have envisioned over the years, it’s unavoidable viewing.

[mike_c]

28. mine:

I don't care. Not even a little. I've never seen anything on TicToc but stupid stuff wasting time and electrons. At least YouTube has content that's actually informative and useful. Maybe I'm just missing the good stuff on TicToc?

[vanessa_ca]

35. You're missing the good stuff

TikTok is inconveniencing the war machine, "Al-Jazeera on steroids"

Link to tweet

[thebigidea]

29. It isn't about meta or x or google. it's about a foreign country launching cyber attacks

Including on our goddamn power grid. Google doesn't do that. Meta doesn't do that. Even Elon doesn't do that yet.

I hate the whataboutism. It isn't honest and it totally ignores the main point of criticism against China's bullshit. Their dishonesty and manipulation on this issue says everything you need to about the risk of a hostile foreign country completely owning a propaganda network it doesn't allow in it's own country that gives us zero transparency.

But of course, that doesn't matter at all to the folks who happily do China's bidding and help spread their talking points.

[speak easy]

30. Again

there is a reason no other NATO member has banned TikTok outright - they do not want to buy it.

That's what the legislation says - sell it to us.

[womanofthehills]

34. Only 10% of TicToc is in US -

90% of users are in the rest of the world - so why would they sell it to America? They make unbelievable amts of money from TicTok - doubt if they would sell or give it up for 10%. Plus they will have half of America angry at whoever bans it. Not a good political move to ban it. .

[Arazi]

36. Bytedance doesn't have to have a US buyer

They just can’t be majority owned by the Chinese because of the obvious control the CCP has over every aspect of Chinese lives and businesses.

I’m not a huge fan of Human Rights Watch but this is a pretty good overview.

https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/03/24/problem-tiktoks-claim-independence-beijing

Zhang Yiming is in the exact same position of the other Chinese tech billionaires who’ve been killed or disappeared into Chinese labor camps

[speak easy]

37. ByteDance can not sell TikTok even if they wanted to.

The IP is subject to Chinese export controls. And no approval will be granted (to say the least).

[Arazi]

38. Uhm, fairly sure that the CCP would make exceptions if they wanted to

They’re about as lawless as we’re about to become.

Anyway, the machinations are very interesting to watch. Like Kremlinology but w Traitor and China.

History being made by the hour. The tech sector edgelords finally emerge out of the shadows and take their place on the global geopolitical stage

[speak easy]

41. "Uhm, fairly sure that the CCP would make exceptions ..."

and give the U.S. a platform that could be used against them?

Put it this way, how happy would you be if an adversary closer to home, like Elon Musk for example, got his hands on TikTok and tweaked it to favor RW content?

[Arazi]

42. They'll find a Canadian/Chinese front man

Or someone from the EU. Doesn’t have to be a US front.

I’m guessing if Traitor can figure it out the parties will come to a mutually agreeable front man and business will go on.

China’s authoritarian reach is global as they’ve demonstrated by simply snatching anyone they want and extra-judicially executing or disappearing them from ostensible democracies, even their tech billionaires aren’t immune. I’m sure the new tech boss of Bytedance (if they sell) will understand his new terms.

Tbh, they let TikTok die in India in 2020 without a fight which had 200 million users. I’m not at all sure they won’t just let the US market go. I’m guessing Zuckerberg and Musk are happy to sell our data to the highest bidder - China can definitely get our data from either of them imo - Indian social media use is now dominated by Threads/Meta fyi