Hatred never ceases by hatred

[keepthemhonestO]

Hatred never ceases by hatred, but by love alone is healed. We all know the saying, right?

We know Martin Luther King was a big advocate for this.

Does anyone have any ideas how possibly we could be compassionate with these "Americans" who we hate, strongly dislike or have no respect for?

I struggle with this and I'm am a practicing Buddhist and trying to find any solutions for peace and avoid civil war. So many of my family I've cut off for now(obnoxious ones.)

[Voltaire2]

1. Yeah we loved Hitler right out of office.

[keepthemhonestO]

3. Right

Excellent point.

[Voltaire2]

8. Gandhi thought the Jews ought to have volunteered for annihilation.

“Hitler killed five million [sic] Jews. It is the greatest crime of our time. But the Jews should have offered themselves to the butcher’s knife. They should have thrown themselves into the sea from cliffs.....It would have aroused the world and the people of Germany.... As it is they succumbed anyway in their millions.”

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/gandhi-on-the-holocaust

[keepthemhonestO]

12. I've never heard this quote

That's absurd and I know he did and said some not sane things but that's pretty disgusting. I cannot imagine in what way he intended those words to be interpreted but I don't like it. That will be the last time I mentioned Gandhi. Thank you for the link.

[Uncle Joe]

30. I believe that we can oppose someone or something without hatred, Hitler was only the avatar of hatred.

Hatred just makes opposing easier from an emotional standpoint, but emotion diminishes reason.

The loss of reason makes people easier to manipulate which in turn stokes resentment.

Resentment is the breeding ground for hatred and the rise of more hatred empowered avatars.

[keepthemhonestO]

34. Thanks for responding

I'm sorry I somehow missed your response there.

Valid points

[Voltaire2]

41. I cannot take seriously assertions that Hitler had no agency but was some metaphysical

manifestation of a platonic form of 'hatred'. That is nonsense. He was a really awful person, like Trump is, and was fully responsible for the awful hateful shit he did, just like Trump is.

Also fascist theory is 'reasoned'. It has a philosophical tradition and a large volume of 'reasoned' literature that justifies it's ideology.

[Uncle Joe]

42. The subject is hatred, which is an emotion, not a person, and I never said that they

weren't or aren't responsible for their actions, nor that we shouldn't oppose them.

Everything is either reasoned, faithed or feared.

[Voltaire2]

45. "Hitler was only the avatar of hatred"

No, he was a human. He wasn't an 'avatar of hatred' or 'the embodiment of evil' or any of the other phrases that place some sort of metaphysical entity in place of the human.

[Uncle Joe]

47. Hatred is a universal emotion, everyone is capable of it, even good people have been consumed by hatred

down thru the ages.

Hatred is thus an immortal dynamic; which can only make its' way into our very temporary reality via humans.

Had Hitler not been consumed by his hatred, history would be different and we most likely wouldn't know him.

It reminds me of a saying about alcoholism

“First a man takes a drink, then the drink takes a drink, then the drink takes a man” is a saying that conveys the consequences of alcoholism. It is often attributed to F. Scott Fitzgerald, the author of The Great Gatsby, but the saying was well-known before his time.

Hitler is long gone but the narcotic of hatred which fed him and his followers still plagues humankind.

[keepthemhonestO]

49. I just read something similar

But how we all have hatred and love within us and sewing those seeds of love ( damn it now a song in my head.) Water and nurture those instead of hate.

[Walleye]

2. I think I am allowed to hate an unrepented rapist

[keepthemhonestO]

5. I guess

I wasn't thinking of Trump , Steven Miller and Bannon however I Martin Luther King and Gandhi would have handled this differently.

[Walleye]

6. I agree in principle. I just get pissed off sometimes.

[keepthemhonestO]

9. I do too

I'm very angry about this whole thing and the things they're doing to America. I was just hoping that maybe we'd be able to avoid a civil war but I think I know the answer.

[SilasSouleII]

4. Sorry, I dont have any ideas

I feel the same. It's definitely a struggle.

[keepthemhonestO]

7. Thank you

For your honest reply. I don't really either, I just know there's a lot of smart people on here from various backgrounds. I was hoping that somebody would have an inkling of an idea whether that was something we could apply , although it's probably not feasible. I admit that. 🤷

[Lulu KC]

10. We can have compassion

but recognize that someone is dangerous and want to remove them from a role of power. I think it draws on a larger-scale compassion for all who are affected by their behavior. Even if we know a bully or sociopath has a story that started with some kind of deep injury, it doesn't give them permission to inflict the effects of their pain on others.

I think Anne Lamott might have written about this recently but I'm not sure where I read it. She manages to walk in both lanes simultaneously, with verve.

[keepthemhonestO]

13. Right

I wholeheartedly agree and of course I want him out of office.

Ok I'll check her out, I would love to hear more about this. How to walk that fine line.

[CrispyQ]

11. I've cut a few off, too & good fucking riddance.

It's harsh, but this has gone beyond politics. This is morality. Human decency. And they picked the wrong side. They will have to show true remorse before I give them the time of day.

Just remember, they voted for this: https://democraticunderground.com/100219963235

[keepthemhonestO]

14. I don't

See any of my estranged family saying that they finally see what he was. We've got some stubborn jeans in my family.

[CrispyQ]

22. IDK how painful it has to get for them before they come to their senses.

The pain being inflicted on others clearly doesn't bother them, & this is something about them I will never forget. They're gonna wear that orange stain fucking forever.

[Gore1FL]

15. I submit that D-Day was a glorious day of hate. nt

[keepthemhonestO]

17. Right

And obviously it worked, we won. It sounds like there's no way of avoiding a war with this rooting out this guy.

[EdmondDantes_]

16. In general, I find talking about mutual areas of agreement works

For example if they love camping, talk about how to preserve places to do that. If all we focus on are the differences, then that's all that is seen.

But that said, you absolutely don't have to try to make peace with everyone. I have people I've tried and found that we can't make common ground and removed myself. But I don't waste time hating them. I go do things or be around people who match my values.

[keepthemhonestO]

19. Great suggestion

For family and friends, I was thinking on a bigger scale though how do we heal this problem in our nation.

[RJ-MacReady]

18. I may go against the grain here

But I feel the whole "kill them with kindness" is fairy tale nonsense. If there was a time it worked that was very long ago.

[keepthemhonestO]

21. Yeah

That is similar in meaning and I guess we're past that point.

[get the red out]

25. It is

"Thank you sir, may I have another".

[keepthemhonestO]

36. I feel that

I'm not a glutton for punishment believe me. So I'm just wondering if there was going to be any way to avoid a civil war. I don't think it's possible.

[Oopsie Daisy]

20. Meh... I'll stick with hate, than you very much.

[keepthemhonestO]

37. Response

Noted.

[stillcool]

23. emotions come and go

I have lots of repeat performances with a whole variety of emotions towards many people, places, and things. Hatred is not something I enjoy, nor where it leads me. I find the causes of it unsustainable. But that's just me. I guess my emotional state can't handle as much illness as others can.

[lapfog_1]

26. I hate them with the burning hatred of a 1000 suns

and this will never change.

[get the red out]

27. I'm done

This is a movement that has destroyed our contry. I think part of the reason is Democrats trying to be loving and nice to really bad people for decades.

Obviously their rage works. I have rage against people who support the abandonment of human rights, and always will.

[keepthemhonestO]

32. Great

Points and I can't blame you for feeling that way as do I. I'm just curious how it will all be resolved.

[Basso8vb]

28. I will never love nazis.

[keepthemhonestO]

33. Same

I don't know if I can apply these words that wisdom, myself.

[Think. Again.]

29. I see, and sincerely appreciate what you're saying...

...and I would also like to find a way to bypass the old survival instinct, and somehow stop them from harming so many people without feeling hatred toward them for doing that.

Because I do hate them for choosing to be people who harm others for fun, and I resent that they make me feel this way.

Edit to add:

And I won't be fooled by the old forgiveness nonsense, because if people don't feel remorse for what they've done, it isn't forgiveness we're giving them, it's permission.

[keepthemhonestO]

38. I agree

Excellent point about permission. Yeah it would be nice to think we could come to a resolution without conflict but look who we are dealing with?

[JustAnotherGen]

31. No

I want them punished for their behavior, and for their ancestors (The CSA) that go away with it. No mercy for those who hate America.

[keepthemhonestO]

39. Right

All things I agree with, I believe there should be consequences. They made their beds now they have to lay in them.

[OneGrassRoot]

35. Sadly, no. I'll tell you what made me realize that that approach is hopeless for the cultists:

They literally have been demonizing compassion and empathy for a long time now. Their churches are preaching that empathy is a sin.

We can't love a hateful death cult out of being. We cut them off and don't give them the benefit of the doubt. When they leave the cult and are then seeking connection, that may be different, depending upon your own choice.

No amount of love is going to get through. Just look at what happened with Bishop Budde and her deeply loving message.

[keepthemhonestO]

40. I'm

Afraid you're correct. Sadly the Bishop was a perfect display of the mental state they are in.

[Paladin]

43. I'll be damned if I'll relinquish my hatred for my political enemies.

It is they who have taken this country into the toilet in such a remarkably short time. It is they who threaten the health and wellbeing of my loved ones and myself. It is they who are seeking the ruination of our society in as thoughtless and mean-spirited a fashion as possible. These people could never grasp the concept of love healing hate---not if you gave them a thousand years to accomplish it.

To hell with them all. And to hell with giving in.

[keepthemhonestO]

44. As many

Times as I've heard this, well every time I've heard this quote "only Love alone can do that" I really could never understand it. It was baffling to me that it could work. I agree with you, I think in these times I don't think I can work, I know I can't work.

[Hekate]

46. Possibly your dilemma could be addressed in the Buddhism group

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1249

As for Gandhi — his pacifism was not absolute, but used as one tool …

[keepthemhonestO]

48. Thank you

I didn't realize we had one. 🙏 Much obliged