General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsMy Latin gardener has "disappeared."
Last edited Wed Feb 19, 2025, 02:07 PM - Edit history (1)
Carlos has been our gardener for approximately five years now. At the very beginning of the pandemic, he rolled up to our house in his old rust colored truck, the vehicle's best years far in its rear view mirror. Stepping out, the young man introduced himself. In a timid voice which only became more confident when we indicated that we speak Spanish, Carlos explained that he'd recently lost his job with a construction company but that he was hard working and was going to turn around a bad situation by starting his own landscaping business. "No vine tan lejos sólo para perder." "I didn't come this far just to fail."
Carlos was from El Salvador, a fact which immediately ingratiated himself to us, since our own family's roots extend to that country. "Were we interested in being his first client?" "Do you have an edger?" I asked. I can mow a lawn with the best of them. But, for some reason, edging is a skill I've never mastered, my personal kryptonite. "Yes, I have all the tools I need." The earnest and hopeful look in Carlos' eyes transcended language and culture. Salesmanship begins with the ability to engender trust, the awareness of which is lost on legions of fancy suits hawking their equally fancy financial products. We'd never had a gardener before. But, now we did.
Over the ensuing years, Carlos transformed our lawn and gardens into the envy of the block. His business too flourished. He took on first one, then a second assistant. The old rust colored truck gave way to a bigger spanking white one. Despite having more clients, Carlos' care and attention to detail never diminished. At the slightest sign of yellowing, the lawn was fertilized. Failing sprinkler heads were swapped out. Groaning sprinkler valves were replaced. Along the way, Carlos told us in his steadily improving English about his family and his pride in beginning to achieve his American dream. His son, he said, would also work with his hands. He would be a surgeon.
And now, without any notice whatsoever, Carlos and his two assistants have simply vanished. He has twice missed Monday, his scheduled day to work at the house. The first time it happened was brushed aside. Perhaps he was ill. When the second Monday passed without seeing Carlos and his crew, we became concerned. Calls to his telephone number first went unanswered, then were met with a full mailbox notification. A visit to a neighbor on an adjoining street who had also become one of Carlos' clients was met with a similar story. "We don't know what happened to him. We're worried." A man, his livelihood and his American dream are all as though they never existed.
Prairie Gates
(8,108 posts)Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)Prairie Gates
(8,108 posts)Blues Heron
(8,794 posts)Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)There's a word for that.
Wonder Why
(6,956 posts)to sympathize with others.
Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)You can't have sympathy for someone whose entire life has been upended because he works for someone who can afford to pay for the work he does?
That's quite the neat trick. That way you don't need to care about anyone.
Is that the plan?
Wonder Why
(6,956 posts)about the situation in the post?
There was sympathy because he came from the same country.
He worked hard.
He made the place be the envy of the neighborhood.
His business started growing.
He suddenly disappeared.
They knew a little about his family.
Did they know his last name? Where he lived? Where his business was? Did he have a business name? Did they check with other landscapers to find out more about what might have happened to him? I don't know from the post.
40 years ago when we lived in southern NM in a rural area, a young newly married "undocumented" couple stopped by looking for work. I told him we didn't own a farm but pointed out some people who he could talk to. My wife and I talked and decided we could have them help us for the day and paid them well over the minimum wage so they would have some cash. At the end of the day, they asked if they could sleep by our house for safety. We told them "No Way", made our two sons temporarily share a bedroom, fed the couple and put them up overnight. The next morning after breakfast, we again pointed out where to go and told them they would always be welcomed back.
A year later, the man came by alone. Se stayed at home with their first child so we told him to stop by on his way home as we had plenty of clothes or kids had outgrown. He did on his return and we gave him what we had. The next year, he came by again alone and said he now had a couple of kids. He said he wouldn't be able to come by again and we wished each other well. We never saw him again. We had their names but they were moving and he never wrote.
I mention this because I do care. I cared about them, not the work they did for me.
I am not criticizing the OP. He may have done just as much and probably more and does care. But I don't see it in his post and possibly Prairie Gates didn't either.
Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)to me by my sister. I know his name and his phone number.
He's a great plumber.
I don't know his friends, I don't know where he lives. I know he has a wife but I don't know if he has children. I don't know where his office is or even if he has one. I don't NEED to know those things.
I find many of your expectations about the poster's relationship to this man to be absurd. He hired a gardener. He watched him prosper over the years and was happy for him. Now the gardener has disappeared due to our terrible politics.
You ARE criticizing the OP. You're judging him and acting like he's somehow hypocritical because he's concerned for the man but hasn't said enough for you to feel he's earned the right to express concern for him.
Or something. It's absolutely ridiculous.
Upthevibe
(10,172 posts)I completely agree with your response....
Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #37)
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GP6971
(37,983 posts)Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)GP6971
(37,983 posts)be honored!!!
soldierant
(9,348 posts)was choosing his words carefully to keeo himself out of the way of what he felt was someone else's story. Like an actor who works hard not to steal another actor's scene.
But I saw humanity though that. I saw it in that, actually..
JI7
(93,568 posts)and might only say hello and a few words. One day we realize we hadn't seen them for some time. We can still care about them without knowing much about them.
pnwmom
(110,255 posts)The point was obvious. The writer was concerned about his gardener and the people who worked for him. The rest of us should be, too. Carlos was a man who'd worked hard to take care of himself and others -- not some threat who should have been deported -- but it is natural to fear that's what happened.
Pinback
(13,593 posts)to keep up with the yard weve maintained for decades, so a little help now and then is worth the expense.
WarGamer
(18,590 posts)When I lived in Scottsdale it was a full acre lot.
Late 90's two Mexicans guys would come by every 6 months and skin my palm trees... 7 of them... and pick weeds in the large yard.
$100 every time and I'd kick in 50 for a tip.
Wonder Why
(6,956 posts)Wonder Why
(6,956 posts)future, we chose instead to move closer in with less property and hospital nearby.
spooky3
(38,589 posts)Im looking at your post 12.
Im not sure how your situation is different in an important way from someone who chooses to stay put and pay for help as needed.
Silver Gaia
(5,357 posts)years ago and replaced it with fruit trees, shrubs, and roses. Great, right? Yes, but... all those trees, shrubs, and roses need to be pruned, plus the huge leaves the neighbor's giant sycamore dumps in our yard are very hard to remove easily. It has been difficult but we love our yard this way, only now, we are both getting too old to keep up with it.
So, we hired the lawn care guy who does our neighbor's yard once a week. It's an added expense we have to plan for, but I am the younger of the two of us and it had all fallen on me to do alone, so I am so happy we found a way to do this.
I know little about him or the young guys who work for him. I don't speak Spanish, and his English is spotty, so it's not like we can be chatty. But I CARE about him, and I CARE about his workers. They are nice. They smile and they do great work. They have helped me immensely.
I'm telling you all this because I simply don't know their status, but he prefers cash payment, so I suspect he may be undocumented. It hurts my heart to think they may not return, that their families could be torn apart. It is my hope that my state will protect them.
Just because I don't know the intimate details of this man's life or of his workers, does not mean I dont care about him. It just means he is a private person who says little about himself, even when I ask, in part because we have a language barrier.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)We don't hire anyone, but it's tons of work.
We really should remove some of it.
Silver Gaia
(5,357 posts)This is California, so growth is nuts. We learned too late that whatever dimensions the tag on a plant says it will achieve at maturity should be at least doubled! Sometimes tripled. It's crazy to keep up with.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)That's why we did it. My plan won a prize from our water utility in 1996.
Silver Gaia
(5,357 posts)Fruit trees drink a lot... but... at least they give us something delicious in exchange.
Cool about that prize!
mgardener
(2,349 posts)Imagine not being able to have empathy or concern for others because you can't afford a gardener.
How sad.
Jack Valentino
(4,955 posts)gardeners, or maids, or butlers, or "staff"--- ???
I think that was more the point that the OP was trying to make,
rather than looking for "sympathy" over their loss of 'services'....
MadameButterfly
(4,034 posts)the people who hire gardeners, how they should behave, whether they are too rich
when the point is the GARDENERS.
People are being kidnapped and sent God knows where. Lives are being upended. The OP gave a face to it.
I'm horrified. I know its just the beginning. I don't know how we just pick up and keep going with what's going on. And I don't know what to do about it.
JI7
(93,568 posts)usually it's becsuse they are older or have some condition where they can't do it themselves.
It's just something they pay others to do becsuse they can't do it themselves. They probably have to cut back in other areas becsuse of this.
quaint
(5,056 posts)He was also the first person to aid me when I walked off the ladder while cutting a limb. At the time, all I could offer in thanks was a loaf of home-baked, day-old bread.
Most of my late friends employed yard workers, even though the older women lived on social security.
There seems to be a mean wind blowing.
Upthevibe
(10,172 posts)I don't think that paying someone to take care of your yard is extravagant. He didn't mention maids or "staff."
pnwmom
(110,255 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(101,842 posts)Doesn't make the poster Thurston Howell.
pnwmom
(110,255 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(101,842 posts)A poster suggested hiring someone to take care of your lawn is a character flaw.
pnwmom
(110,255 posts)lastlib
(28,202 posts)(or, more correctly, "DAMN repuglikan".... I know it's two words, but they could be joined together....)
senseandsensibility
(24,905 posts)Why don't you just say what you mean?
sagetea
(1,555 posts)Are you suggesting that the Op should not have hired the man who was starting a new business in service? How DOES a person who is offering service get a job? I can't afford to help those around me, but I do what I can and posting a 'rolling eye' emoji is worse than OP hiring a person to do a service in exchange for money. Your comment was rude and uncalled for, there is no reason for it.
sage
Response to Prairie Gates (Reply #6)
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Prairie Gates
(8,108 posts)True!
Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)have disappeared.
Just what we needed.
LymphocyteLover
(9,814 posts)Jack Valentino
(4,955 posts)I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, that you think Carlos departed for his own safety---
but your lack of details leaves doubt about your opinion on the matter.
Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #3)
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GoYouPackersGo
(233 posts)Skittles
(171,620 posts)usual MO is "fly under the radar"
Skittles
(171,620 posts)do you have a problem with people who don't want to associate with fascist bootlickers?
Torchlight
(6,792 posts)Iggo
(49,913 posts)dalton99a
(94,093 posts)XanaDUer2
(15,772 posts)Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)UpInArms
(54,932 posts)Hopes crushed
beaglelover
(4,465 posts)night before. I really hope he is OK. We finally got approval from the HOA and water company to replace our front lawn with artificial turf and he was going to do it for us. He did an excellent job last fall replacing all of the irrigation in our back and side yards and he's an excellent weekly gardener as well.
Our cleaning lady said her cousin who is not documented and living in the USA has not left her house since tRump was inaugurated. So sad.
druidity33
(6,912 posts)Prairie Gates
(8,108 posts)Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)druidity33
(6,912 posts)Plenty of real life examples to pull from. Really no need to make stuff up. Tellingly... no response from the OP.
Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)going to school and whose families have suddenly moved.
This is happening everywhere.
spooky3
(38,589 posts)Latinx students did not show two weeks ago.
Fortunately, she said they returned last week. Not sure why.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)Two weeks later, attendance was back to normal.
I think there was fear that ICE was going to be raiding churches and schools.
Response to spooky3 (Reply #101)
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spooky3
(38,589 posts)Feminists find it sexist to be labeled with masculine terms, eg for a long time he was presumed to refer to both men and women, when it actually disappeared women. In this context, a gender neutral term is preferred to either using Latino to apply to a group of people that includes both genders, or to a wordy Latina or Latino usage.
Sensitivity to ethnicity issues should not crowd out sensitivity to gender issues.
Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #74)
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MadameButterfly
(4,034 posts)Has the OP done anything to you?
druidity33
(6,912 posts)I appreciate HONESTY. If you want to tell a story to me... i appreciate knowing whether you are drawing from an ACTUAL EXPERIENCE or are telling tales. Yes the story is 'plausible'. I'm sure (like I said) there are many REAL LIFE examples to pull from. But the way this OP is written... it sounds FICTIONAL. I work in a Mexican restaurant. I know ACTUAL PEOPLE who have recently left the country because of this situation. Why hasn't the OP responded to anyone here?
Shrugging again...
MadameButterfly
(4,034 posts)We don't ask whether they are lying. We take them at their word--if it's their life, not some political fact that we can check. This isn't a story that couldn't happen or that makes no sense in relation to what's going on. There's no reason to single this person out.
If a few people get away with telling personal stories that aren't true, I'd prefer that to insulting people who are telling the truth.
The poster might be busy or prefer not to engage with this. I certainly wouldn't if it were me.
druidity33
(6,912 posts)i appreciate honesty. If this is real, i'd be happy with the OP saying "This is real". I don't need proof of anything.. and this is just my opinion after all. On a forum, where i presume we all have opinions. I view all single source accounts as anecdotal and i take them at face value. That does not mean i can't or shouldn't seek truth. I do not think i've been insulting. I don't know if this story is "true" or not. But it really doesn't matter whether i believe it or not, does it?
I asked the question of the OP "Is this true or an allegory?" and got no response. It's a powerful story. Depending on the response i was going to urge the OP to use it as an OpEd.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)I don't have a gardener, but my plumber just fixed my sink this morning.
I wouldn't know how to reach him if his phone number didn't work. And I don't know his friends or address.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)Also there are a few programs that help you find people. I use Been Verified.
You put in the phone number...
Been Verified isn't the best, there are better ones out there.
Also, the gardener has been coming weekly for five years, so there appears to be a relationship.
In 2019, we had a guy do our siding. He was here for about two weeks? I spent alot of time talking with him. Lots of small talk etc. He's from Uruguay. (However, I think he's a US citizen). I think I asked him where he lived. (Small talk, not being nosy) I know he lives near us. We have his card and we could easily find out where he lives, if we really wanted to.
We do develop relationships with people who work at our homes. Maybe it wasn't the particular case in the OP. But there is a chance they could find out where he lives.
Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)LoisB
(12,978 posts)BlueWaveNeverEnd
(14,145 posts)sagetea
(1,555 posts)For worrying about them.
sage
Comrade Citizen
(344 posts)My Guanaco friends are laying low. Local pupusa shop is nearly empty.
Tickle
(4,131 posts)landscaping business. None of his workers have come into work in a couple of weeks. If he has to hire a different clientele, he said that we would not be able to afford his services. Iets see where this all takes us
enigmania
(457 posts)Joinfortmill
(21,102 posts)AntiFascist
(13,751 posts)and they are starting to get ripe this time of year, but every time I drive by, I don't see a single migrant farmworker, not one! The fields are empty of any workers and this is very unusual.
Jack Valentino
(4,955 posts)White maggots better get out there, if they want to eat any more strawberries....
AntiFascist
(13,751 posts)Wounded Bear
(64,293 posts)B.See
(8,425 posts)Martin Niemöller can school us on how THAT'LL play out. And HE was initially a Nazi. Until they came for HIM.
Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)barbtries
(31,301 posts)so fucking WRONG.
have you any way to check on whether he was picked up? I feel like that could be so dicey, because if he hasn't, you may have put his name on someone's radar to do it.
omigawd it's excruciating watching everything going down the tube.
TexLaProgressive
(12,729 posts)ICE under tRump doesnt seem to discriminating. I am sorry to hear about Carlos and his workers. They may not be detained/deported but gone underground.
Last winter we had an enoromous cottonwood tree die. It was forked at 5 with one huge trunk endangering the house. I asked my trumpian cousin who had several trees die and fall.She suggested Vincente. This many may be a US citizen, I dont know ofcare, just wish he and his family are sare. His team conssitted of 3 men 2 how were Hondurans. This was a perfect team doing a very dangerous job. They are nice people, hard workers and conscentious. And we had some nice conversations during water breaks.
It was a great experience with a great outcoome - I worry for their safety, especially for the yooung Honduran brothers.
DENVERPOPS
(13,003 posts)in the UBER wealthy, gated communities......That would be LAST place on earth ICE would ever raid.......
Same for any big corporation...........
Hekate
(100,133 posts)Texasgal
(17,240 posts)guy... He came every two weeks religiously for over 10 years. Never missing times, except in the winter where the schedule turns to 3 weeks.
My Mother has tried his phone, his other clients, to no avail.
He is missing and we have no idea where he went.
MLAA
(19,738 posts)improve their lot and the customers who know, trust, appreciate and worry about them.
claudette
(5,455 posts)DSandra
(1,719 posts)
Cirsium
(3,919 posts)That has happened here in farm country many, many times over the last 20+ years.
The son of a friend works in building restoration. The sheetrock workers in the industry have all disappeared and work is at a standstill. They were all immigrants from the South.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)Even some plain old Latino US citizens are moving to Mexico.
awesomerwb1
(5,094 posts)Very nicely written sad story. I hope Carlos is ok.
Shame on some of the posters replying to this thread. Take your hate somewhere else.
Figarosmom
(11,861 posts)Of his own choice like Canada and wasn't snatched up and deported to who knows where.
Hopefully he cashed in and ran.
Response to PeaceWave (Original post)
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SalamanderSleeps
(1,018 posts)I love and hate everything about this thread.
Maru Kitteh
(31,744 posts)LiberalArkie
(19,775 posts)immigration. They do that a lot. Even if Carlos has all his papers and even if born in the US but doesn't have them when stopped, he is probably gone.
And how many carry their passports with them when they go to the grocery store?
4catsmom
(667 posts)well done, US. you are officially a third world shithole
Upthevibe
(10,172 posts)I'm sorry that happened.
I think we can assume what happened...
58Sunliner
(6,321 posts)Torchlight
(6,792 posts)will define the next four years, and from that, the next generation.
We can minimize, reduce, trivialize, mock, or ignore these abuses, giving comfort to their continuation and growth.
Or we can stand.
DownriverDem
(7,012 posts)he was either arrested, being held, deported or left on his own. How many have done the same?
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)There is a chance if he is deported to El Salvador, he could end up in that awful prison in El Salvador. Might as well just go home!
Even if he was just plain old deported, guess what? He gets a record in the US and can't come back. (At this point, he may not have a record). He also will be detained. He also will have a hearing. He gets to go home in chains. Might as well just go home!
That's what alot of Mexican nationals are doing. My daughter's friend moved to Mexico City in 2017. She told my daughter that her birth certificate was forged and she wasn't born in the US. She was a physical therapist. When Trump came in office, she up and left.
booksenkatz
(3,472 posts)My mom's beloved caregiver is a US citizen born to parents who arrived legally from Mexico many years ago and became citizens themselves. All were working and thriving and contributing to society. Then the caregiver fell in love with, and married, a Mexican man who was also working and thriving and contributing to society, but did not have his papers. When Dump was elected, they knew they had to go to Mexico before things worsened. Although a citizen, she was forced to choose between her husband and her parents, whom she will likely never see again. The cruelty is absolutely endless and stunning. My mom misses her dearly, because they both hate Dump and it's nice to find someone in Texas who hates him as much as you do and you can talk about it freely.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)A generic white friend's little sister fell in love with a undocumented guy. She had two kids from a previous marriage. He got deported. She moved to southern Mexico to be with him in. She was living in a house with dirt floor and chickens running around. Apparently, she loved it. I don't know where her kids were in all of this?
I haven't talked to my friend in years, but her little sister was always "up to something". Odds are, she got bored and moved back here. This happened way back in 2009.
ETA: I just found her little sister on FB. She's back here, married to a white guy and posting pictures of snow and living in Wisconsin again.
marble falls
(71,884 posts)malaise
(295,832 posts)Rec
Response to malaise (Reply #88)
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calimary
(89,950 posts)and it always helps to have real-life examples.
It hurts my heart to see people who are honest and work hard and get wonderful results for their labors - and then have to live in fear. Or leave for someplace safer. Or worse.
This is not the America I learned about in school. I hardly even recognize it anymore. And I REFUSE to recognize the so-called President after what hes done to the country I still love. And shit - were only a month in.
I shudder to think what will be left of the America I grew up loving - by the time its finally freed from the clutches of the donald. And whether Ill even live to see that.
HAH! Never could have guessed, and certainly would never have expected. DAMN YOU, donald.
Response to PeaceWave (Original post)
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Scrivener7
(59,457 posts)You'll feel better about yourself if you do something productive.
Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #93)
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McKim
(2,426 posts)We had a crew of guys that would come by once a year and do the whole yard. We got to know them, then they retired to do commercial landscaping. The wife cleaned our house for years until she retired. Then the brother in law took over the home garden business and his sister in law cleaned our house. When then brother in law told us that Juan was in the ICE prison, we went into action with our local interfaith immigrant support organization. We got neighbors to write letters, letters stacked up and when we his court date came we showed up and it was a two hour drive to thew court. We dressed up. He was up against one of the nastiest immigration judges in the country but we got him out and now he is on a sure path to citizenship. Now HIS brother in law and family are threatened. We are in constant contact with them and really worried. So please no dissing about us affording some help. Our neighborhood was also involved and stayed involved. So please, just because somebody has money doesn't mean they have no heart.
LeftInTX
(34,211 posts)enid602
(9,681 posts)Ive been pretty worried about Jose Luis the last few weeks. Hes done landscaping and handyman jobs for everyone on Echo Lane for years and years. Hes taken care of everything at my house for 13 years. I finally got nerve enough to ask him last week how things were going Migra-wise. He had good news; my neighbor, very high up at the VA Hospital here was able to sponsor him and his wife, and helped him with his tramites to get his green card.
The only problem is that my neighbor received the email from DOGE, indicating that his job might be on the line. Ive known the neighbor for 15 years. Everything seems so temporary today.
Clouds Passing
(7,894 posts)LetMyPeopleVote
(179,499 posts)Your gardener sounds like a good person who should be treated this way by TFG
Response to PeaceWave (Original post)
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GP6971
(37,983 posts)PeterIsMyBrother
(34 posts)Deportation is of course a harsh Operation
Republican voters sure don't seem to Mind
That very few immigrants ever commit a Crime
LetMyPeopleVote
(179,499 posts)AmericaUnderSiege
(777 posts)Were you close enough with him to file a missing persons? If not, I would keep an eye on the phenomenon but not draw any conclusions.