At Least Now We Know the Truth

[dweller]

It’s ugly, but necessary to face.
By David Frum

At least the Oval Office meeting held by President Donald Trump and Vice President J. D. Vance with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky was held in front of the cameras. False friendliness in public by Trump and Vance, followed by behind-the-scenes treachery, would have been much more dangerous to the Ukrainian cause.
Instead, Trump and Vance have revealed to Americans and to America’s allies their alignment with Russia, and their animosity toward Ukraine in general and its president in particular. The truth is ugly, but it’s necessary to face it.
Today’s meeting gave the lie to any claim that this administration’s policy is driven by any strategic effort to advance the interests of the United States, however misguided. Trump and Vance displayed in the Oval Office a highly personal hatred. There was no effort here to make a case for American interests. Vance complained that Zelensky had traveled to Pennsylvania to thank U.S. ammunition workers, because, Vance charged, the appearance amounted to campaigning for the Democratic presidential ticket. “Let me tell you, Putin went through a hell of a lot with me,” Trump angrily explained. “He went through a phony witch hunt where they used him and Russia, Russia, Russia.”
Both the president and vice president showed the U.S.-led alliance system something it needed urgently to know: The national-security system of the West is led by two men who cannot be trusted to defend America’s allies—and who deeply sympathize with the world’s most aggressive dictator.

https://archive.ph/tQ7wx


Much more at link


✌🏻

[Wounded Bear]

1. That "truth" has been out there for decades...

That's how assholes act.

[Basso8vb]

2. We're being led by fucking nazis.

[orangecrush]

20. I'm not being led by them.

[Mr. Evil]

25. Neither am I!

Thank you!

[arthritisR_US]

43. I'm afraid you are😞😔

[TomSlick]

50. It's a subtle point.

We are governed by fascist Russian sympathizers but I for one am not being led by them.

[brush]

51. Even before Putin, the Soviets cultivated trump as a potential asset. Their investment has paid off big time.

trump's US is aligned with Russia...and we're the junior partner. Pootie must have some very devastating kompromat of tump.

[Bev54]

3. Have always known the truth, hope those that voted

For this are fucking proud of themselves.

[lefthandedskyhook]

30. I am proud of every vote cast yet...

It seems that most elections have cheaters tilting results. When an election is called there is no legal remedy until the next miscount

[arthritisR_US]

44. I hope the shame and reality are catching up to them 😖

[Beartracks]

53. Those that voted for Trump probably don't hear about any of this...

... because they clearly don't pay much attention in the first place and voted for him because they heard Biden was too old and eggs cost too much, or else they spend their time getting malinformed by rightwing media where Trump is a hero and god and contrary facts and truths get omitted.

=================

[zorbasd]

4. Now, even the blind can absolutely see

for themselves. It is undeniable as ever that the country is ruled by out-and-out f#cking fascists.

[KPN]

16. Problem is, 35% of the country are f'g fascists

themselves and support and revere him; and he has firm grasp on the levers of national government.

Only significant violent tragedy will shake the grasp he has on those levers.

I have no doubt he will use violent force against Americans at some point in the next couple of years. His loyalists will try to temper it so it seems like reasonable force. But they can only temper so much and only to a point. At some point there will be significant violence and loss of life. I have no doubts about that after watching the video today. He is a sociopathic narcissist with a 2 year old’s maturity who happens to have complete control of the nation’s police state and military, not to mention a many million-fold militia.

I don’t see any way around this except Congressional Republicans decide to care about America rather than themselves and support impeachment. And I don’t see that happening before lives are lost, if ever.

[Justice matters.]

31. Impeachement and removal of the convicted felon would result...

in the installment of the second in line ... a stooge of the South African "tech bros" ...

More of the same lies, lies, lies, and a lot younger despot.

[Blasphemer]

37. It wouldn't happen until after the midterms anyway...

At which point, I would expect things to be so bad that both Trump and Vance are impeached. That's probably our best case scenario.

[Hekate]

45. Reality must be faced. Next after Vance is Speaker Johnson, a complete theocrat...

…who believes his god has ordained him (The one I’ve called Li’l Pervey ever since I found out about his son having a mirror app to his that tattles on them to each other if they look at porn. And that business about taking his daughter to a Purity Ball and giving her a promise ring to guard her chastity until her very wedding night. Uck, ick, pew)

Our choices are — well, there is only one viable choice and that is to flip the House and Senate 2 years from now.

[returnee]

47. Just to clarify on succession...

…as I understand it, the only way the Speaker would become President would be if both the President and Vice President die or become disabled or are removed simultaneously. Otherwise, if the President dies or is removed or disabled, the Vice President becomes president and then nominates someone for Vice President, who then has to be confirmed by Congress. If I have that wrong, sorry.

[Hekate]

49. People keep fantasizing about different scenarios. What we had when Nixon got the boot was a GOP ...

… where there were still Republicans with a sense of honor, a crooked VP who could be persuaded to leave first, and a Congress who sought out someone with a clean record (they were reported to have said to Ford: “Jerry, examine your conscience” ) — and that we no longer have.

I watched the trump impeachment and investigations — this new MAGAGOP will not do the honorable thing, and will not lift a finger to save the country. Having to live with their decisions is one of the consequences of the voters and nonvoters making the Dems a minority in Congress.

I just get tired of the bursts of fantasizing that take place here.

[dchill]

21. I bet they can't.

They've been denying the undeniable for many years now.

[Bluetus]

5. Absolutely agree. We need to stop covering up for these fascists

and force the media to show the ugly truth. Every time we do the "adult in the room" thing, this gives NYT and the rest of the legacy media permission to whitewash it.

[SheltieLover]

6. Was there every any doubt? Nancy: "All roads lead to russia"

[617Blue]

7. I agree with this. Show people Putins Puppet

[littlemissmartypants]

8. One of the...

Truths of psychological science is that anger is fear in translation. So what is President Psychopath afraid of because there's clearly something?

[BattleRow]

14. And why wasn't Musk completing the unholy Trinity of Inquisitors?

[msfiddlestix]

9. I didn't watch, but I heard about it from neighbors. I don't get the surprise, like it was some sort of big secret

even my neighbor seemed shocked as she described the news conference. My response was simply that's pretty much what we've always known since his first administration, and his recent campaign.
I never watched any of the batshit psychotic rants, but I knew enough skimming reports right here on DU. His attitude and position on Zelenski and Ukraine was pretty much revealed during the impeachment hearings as well. So who here is surprised by anything said and done today?

We always knew the truth on this matter.

How could we not?

[BattleRow]

13. Hopefully a lot of folk will be surprised

Assuming is not the same as seeing the visible proof.

[msfiddlestix]

56. Words might be invisible to the eye, but it is certainly visable audibly.

I mean, their hero SAID OUT LOUD everything we're seeing unfold. Promised it to his followers.
the people who voted for him had good reason to expect everything that's happening because it's what they wanted to see happen.

[BattleRow]

57. Except it what they wanted to see happen to others...not to THEM..

The vultures will be coming home to the MAGA roost...

[mnhtnbb]

10. Nicole Wallace is now quoting this article.

[Aussie105]

11. The collective outrage is mounting . . .

Trump's agenda is becoming clearer day by day.

What next?

(I guess Trump forgot to make a public telecast - Russia is now our friend, and Russia's enemies are now our enemies.)

[keep_left]

12. Kudos to Frum, with whom I usually disagree. As for my 2 cents' worth...

...I'll just repeat what I posted a couple of weeks ago.

If you had told me back when I was in high school (Gen-Xer) that Eloon and Drumpf were the leadership to which we could look forward in the 21st century, I would have recommended that you report immediately to an insane asylum. Enough said.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100220021173#post10

[peggysue2]

15. We learned something else, as well

According to Trump, he and poor Putin are the biggest victims in the world.

The Russia, Russia, Russia scam was humiliating and hard for Trump and Putin alike. It was so-o-o unfair and it was all Zelensky's fault. Because Zelensky wouldn't participate in the investigation into Joe Biden and Hunter's grift, the innocent Trump was unjustly impeached, his reputation ruined (as if he had one beyond being a narcissistic fool). And poor Vlad was forced into protecting Russia when Zelensky insisted entrance into NATO. What could poor Vlad do but invade and butcher Ukrainian men, women and children? The war was suppose to over in 3 days but Zelensky dragged it out because he had the audacity to defend his country against the mighty Bear.

Front row seat to the Universe of disinformation and delusion we're a-living in. Also a peek into the deceit and vindictiveness that is Trump's mind and character.

But hey, it made great TV which is one of the few things Trump actually cares about while distracting the press from Elon Musk's dismemberment of the US government.

Never forget, never forgive.

[Seeking Serenity]

17. Why are we posting the columns of a (bleep)ing NEOCON??

The asshole that was the chief speechwriter for Bushitler (remember that name), claiming it was in America's interests to (bleep)ing INVADE IRAQ?

Why? I don't care about Neocons now any more than I did 20 years ago. (hawk tuah!)

[niyad]

32. Stopped clocks, and all that.

[babylonsister]

39. I can't recall Frum supporting dt, but he sure hasn't lately.

Also, he's a fine writer who makes a lot of sense in this piece. I'll take it.

[Crunchy Frog]

40. Because this is a different time

and most of us aren't still fighting the battles of 20 years ago.

Did he say anything in this article that you think is wrong?

[writerJT]

55. The question bounces off the chamber walls...

[liberalla]

18. Agree with David Frum's comments in general...

I think many people already knew the truth, but now the whole world can see it.

[Evolve Dammit]

19. Orange Anus is holding a vendetta against the man who would not give in to his blackmailing for dirt against Biden

[DENVERPOPS]

22. Just like Trump

"Gish Galloped" Biden during the Debate, they decided to Double Up with Vance to "Gish Gallop" Zellenski........

Gish Gallop .............google it!

If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, bury them rapid fire with bullshit........

It was most obviously a "set up", most likely ordered by Putin...........This time they "ganged up" on Zellenski as they knew Trump couldn't handle him along..........Trumps typical behavior.....Two or more against one......

[Wonder Why]

23. He trusts Puty. Don't you? Tut! Tut! How could you not trust a face like that? 😁

[lefthandedskyhook]

28. He does not trust him

He OWES him

[Blue_Roses]

46. Exactly.

And this scares him.

[Dem4life1970]

24. Trump and Vance are traitors....

...they have betrayed the oaths they swore to uphold (no surprise, right)? But they are traitors, pure and simple. Traitors.

[Playingmantis]

26. The truth according to Trump

He is the toughest negotiator on Russia. He blames Ukraine for the war.. calls Zelinski a dictator..praises Putin and denies any connection between himself and Putin.

This is the test.. if Americans agree with Trump and turn on Zelinski this country is finished..Hopelessly divided and never will heal..

[Justice matters.]

33. Well, the convicted conman "promised" he would end that war in...

TWENTY-FOUR HOURS!

Of course he never delivers on any promise and never pays his fascist rallies' bills.

But the masa cultists still claim that he delivers ALL his promises and that if he doesn't pay his bills it's because the librul cities overcharge him unfairly, poor lil victim...

[lefthandedskyhook]

27. HELL David!!!

We KNEW the truth when you and your neocon pals were pushing the invasion of Iraq. Your opinions are all tainted. You are calling out now what was painfully obvious to us ALL ALONG. Sit down and shut up David Frum unless you can redeem your war crimes

[Cirsium]

29. Interesting

"Putin went through a hell of a lot with me. He went through a phony witch hunt where they used him and Russia, Russia, Russia."

That is revealing.

[Justice matters.]

34. Yep. The convicted felon wants to make us feel ashamed of treating his...

partner in crimes very very very unfairly...

Poor lil pootie... he's hated unfairly ... he only massacre pregnant women burnt alive... kills children in their schools... when he's not kidnapping them... poor lil pootie... so unfair...

[Cirsium]

38. His loyalty

He acknowledges there that his loyalty is to Putin (and himself of course) and not to the US. He and Putin were going through it - accusations that they were colluding - together. That proves that they were in fact colluding.

[malaise]

35. Classic Donvict Retribution

He has never forgiven Zelensky for not effin up Biden.

[ShazamIam]

41. Putin went throuigh a lot with me, sounds like an admission of 2016 election manipulation. Trump and Putin seem to

have been partners from the days of the Obama birther campaign.

[malaise]

42. THIS

Re

[GoodRaisin]

36. America's voters knew that Trump would hand over Ukraine to Putin.

They were specifically warned this by Kamala Harris and Tim Walz. Either they voted for it or they weren’t listening and voted for it out of their own ignorance.

[usonian]

52. They voted for racism and the "lower price lie"

Blinded by hate propaganda, they "couldn't see" plain facts.

There's a saying "I'll see it when I believe it"

And FAFO is what they got

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219770873

Economic daily disaster since that "Day one"

https://www.democraticunderground.com/111699331

[live love laugh]

48. Zelenskyy was smart to push for meeting in DC. It paid off by lifting the veil of diplomacy.

[wiggs]

54. 'the presidency doesn't create character, it REVEALS character.' nt