I'm Personally Sick Of The Divisive Posts Calling For So Called 'Blue States' To Secede From The So Caled 'Red States'

[MayReasonRule]

Last edited Sun Mar 2, 2025, 07:01 PM - Edit history (1)

It is divisive for our party.

It's antithetical to our support of representative democracy.

I would like a clear statement to be made that prohibits such future posts.

[Shellback Squid]

1. Lighten Up Francis

I've not seen these posts and I'm an active lurker

[MayReasonRule]

3. Huh, Your Disregard Is Duly Noted

[Dave says]

44. You've been here since 2022 and you're telling us what we can and cannot post? Wow.

MayReasonRule states: "I would like a clear statement to be made that prohibits such future posts."

If I were an Admin, my answer would be simple: No.

The nature of the truly occasional post calling for blue states to separate from red states amount to blowing steam by some. It reflects despair. But it is not divisive, at least not to me. Instead, recognizing the despair, it is an opportunity to pull together in a kind of group hug. We need that from time to time.

MayReasonRule: Reason without emotion births cold, cruel figures in world history. May we not embrace that here.

[MayReasonRule]

60. Your Disdain And Disregard Is Sadly Noted.

[VMA131Marine]

185. Your disdain and disregard are ignored

Respect has to be earned and you haven’t done it.

[MayReasonRule]

190. I Have Neither Disdain Nor Disregard For You

Your belittlement and derision is duly noted.

[VMA131Marine]

192. Good! Excellent!

[brush]

81. Right. It's just a dream secnario of being away and out of the criminal felon's reach.

[artemisia1]

83. I've been here more than 20 years and I wouldn't tell the Admin's what to do. I might suggest something, but not call

for it. That being said, secession talk is, imho, potentially dangerous -- though I agree it is mostly just blowing off steam right now. I'm thinking of the last time it was tried...

[VMA131Marine]

188. Secession would be dangerous ...

The last time it was tried we had a civil war to stop it.

Then again, if you have a President who ignores the Constitution and ignores orders by courts to follow the Constitution then we no longer have a country based on the rule of law and anything goes. Trump is presiding over the dissolution of the rules that give him the authority to govern.

[DoBW]

72. Stripes! .. I got it right off...........nt

[hlthe2b]

2. If THAT is what is most disturbing to you right now--I think you need to rethink your priorities and..

maybe catch up on all that is going on to destroy this country and all of us.

[MayReasonRule]

4. Divisiveness Within Our Party Is Antithetical To Our Success

Your reply is disappointing.

[hlthe2b]

5. I don't advocate surrendering to the NAZIS and MAGATS in the name of UNITY.

DO YOU? At some point we have to stand up for democracy and that does not mean while giving up everything we believe in.

[EdmondDantes_]

17. Perhaps you've heard the expression that you catch more flies with honey

The other poster didn't say the words you're putting in their mouth. They didn't say anything about giving up everything we believe in or not standing up for democracy. The other person is arguing that our current approach of writing off the red states isn't working. That it takes Republicans nominating a guy who didn't think going after underage girls to win in Alabama is really bad for us as a party given the reality of the Senate. It makes it harder to win the house too. Yes we've won the presidential popular vote 7 out of the last 9 times, but we lost the president 2 more time.

Recent polling suggests the party isn't viewed positively. That's a problem. For whatever reason Democrats aren't nearly as good at getting our voters to turn out on hate/anger. Doubling down on what hasn't been working nearly as well as we'd like, doesn't seem like the best approach.

[hlthe2b]

20. So we give up on turning red states blue (because Dems aren't viewed positive)? That is what I hear from you.

and others who maintain they should not be expected to fight to turn a red state purple or even blue--as I helped to do in the past decades in Colorado- which was decimated after the passage of the anti-gay Amendment 2 in the 90s and remained regressive red for years thereafter. We fought and turned it around. Now, I am being told that such efforts are not appropriate- yet the alternative- to leave red states to their own is anathema as well. So, what the hell do YOU want to do?

[karynnj]

152. Those of us in blue states need to value and thank Democrats like you

Theoretically, we could win every vote in every solid blue state and still lose the Presidency, House and Senate. The seats we win in the blue or purple areas of the House are why we can win the House. The only way to win the Senate or Presidency, both of which in different ways are easier for the Republicans to win, is the very hard work you did in Colorado.

In the time DU has existed, the color of some states has changed. 2004 was the first election for DU, Virginia, Colorado, and Arizona were all considered red while we needed 2 of the then swing states, PA, OH, and FL. OH and FL have become drastically redder. On the other hand, CO and VI were blue even in the last terrible election. ( I may have missed other states with big changes, but these show that there can be change.)

Like others say, any succession post is just blowing off steam. It is worthwhile that this poster in their posts here is clearly hurt by what is seen as attacks or at least lack of support for Democrats living in red states. I don't think an explicit rule is needed, but an early response to ask the poster to consider that they are attacking the very people we need to win. This is NOT giving up beliefs, it is asking for civility.

[JohnSJ]

138. Thank-you. That is the only way we can go forward when we have a real and present danger to our Democracy. In

resistance is required anyway we can without cutting our nose off to spite our face. In other word we have to do it in a smart way.

As I said other times we should use the Civil Rights Movement as our example on how it is done.

Marches, boycotts, voting, etc, and that takes organization, and it will take years. It took years and complacency to get us where we are today.

Ironically, I suspect that we will be helped by this administration in their efforts to tear everything down when their policies start to “trickle down”, and adversely impact the people.

[LeftInTX]

6. We know what's going on.

Calls to cede and join Canada are fantasies.

We can always move from our red states if that happens. At this point, it's pure fantasy.

[hlthe2b]

8. Yes...

And no one is ALLOWED to express such frustration-incited thoughts? That's what the OP is maintaining.

[bluestarone]

12. EXACTLY!!

Holy shit!

[yardwork]

7. I live in a purple state and I would move in a heartbeat.

I have another post that considers a nation made up of just the states that voted for Harris in 2024. It's a pretty damn impressive set of resources.

Trump is taking us down. Our only hope might be to secede and create a new, more enlightened nation of people who want to thrive. I'm quite serious. I don't want to live in a Russian puppet state. I would be glad to move to a blue state to avoid that.

[MayReasonRule]

15. The Majority Of Those That Would LIke To Move Are Unable...

Throwing away a hundreds of millions of individuals because they are disenfranchised is not the way.

Ever.

Together we stand.
Divided we fall.

May reason rule.

[yardwork]

25. We're ALL being thrown away.

I don't mean this as an attack on Democrats in red states. This is not one of those "all the people in TX can go..." I know that Democrats in red states are just as good or better than Democrats in blue states.

But we lost. This is the election that changed everything. A lot of good things are going away forever. And I have no confidence that we'll spring back after four years. Our Constitution gives unequal power to former slave states. We're always fighting an uphill battle against the Electoral College and Senate. It's crazy that a sparsely populated state like Arkansas has just as much power in the Senate as CA or NY. And now many states have undemocratically gerrymandered districts.

I live in North Carolina, home to wonderful research universities. Trump is destroying them. Literally. Not an exaggeration. I don't know what the economy will look like in four years. Our Republican legislature literally stole numerous Democratic seats from Congress with a disgracefully gerrymandered map. The SCOTUS is no help. Democrats would have a majority in the U.S. House if just NC alone had fair district maps. How many other states are doing this now? It's getting worse, and too many people are going along with the loss of democracy.

Secession and creating a new country probably won't happen but we have to face the fact that things are never going to be the same. We will need radical solutions in order to survive.

[JustAnotherGen]

86. For me it isn't a pipe dream

Sitting at a coffee talk with young dems this morning (up through age 25) . . .

I'd rather us leave than allow the horrors of the backlash and literal chest pounding I heard this morning. They made a joke that I believe was made at the Wannsee conference - specifically a 21 year old Jewish woman . . . "they will go in Red (Repugnants - her word- )and come out . . .". They all.laughed.


I think our fellow Dems in Red States - and MagAmerica in general underestimate the cold rage those of us in Blue States feel. Most important - the intolerable theft of financial resources being redistributed to people who these young folks believe hate us.

I sat down this morning with them (I'm a Committee Member) as a STRONG Spiller supporter - and left leaning hard towards Baraka for Governor supporter.

They showed me this:
https://m.

"How can you find common ground with someone who us trying to kill you?"

These are smart young Americans. They are also terrified of people 40 miles west (Pennsyltucky) and in turn - want to terrify them.

It's tone deaf to tell.people in a trifecta state in the Northeast to sacrifice our own safety, security, and future for a majority of people who want to kill us.

That would be dumb.

If the Constitution is not upheld by the SCOTUS - and that document is what makes us a country -

Then we don't have a country anymore.

I'm exhausted. But I have just enough energy to help these young Dems find their North Star.

Let us go. Dear Red States - Let us go. Let go.

[MayReasonRule]

101. Quitters Never Win -- Only Cowards Abandon Their Fellow Countrymen

Reject cowardice.

Embrace reason.

[Joinfortmill]

105. Mean never works, it just alienates folks further.

[MayReasonRule]

106. Indeed --- Truth Is Truth - Cowardice Is Cowardice - Division Is Division

Alienating half or more of the members of this forum and this country that are located within so called 'Red States' is the VERY DEFINITION OF MEAN.

The very definition...

[JustAnotherGen]

182. Aren't Red States

Being cruel to Blue States?

This is your Governor.

New York governor rejects Louisiana's extradition request for doctor in abortion pill case
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ny-gov-hochul-rejects-louisiana-extradition-doctor-abortion-pill-case-rcna192156

The case is the first known criminal indictment of a doctor’s being charged with sending abortion pills across state lines after Roe v. Wade was overturned. The indictment could also be the first direct test of New York’s shield laws, which are meant to protect providers who prescribe and ship abortion medication to states where abortion is outlawed.

You guys are one step away from bringing back Fugitive Slave laws.

Question? Could you guys maybe storm your Governor's mansion and forcibly remove him by any means necessary?

I'm not doing it. Its your responsibility to show us how far you are willing to go to pretend America is worth dying for.

[JustAnotherGen]

178. Am i a coward?

Fair question.

This has never been MY country. It's of the white folks, by the white folks and for the white folks.

That's why every single CSA officer wasn't hung, and their descendants did not lose the right to participate in the USA government for two generations.

Would you agree we hang traitors and enemies both domestic and foreign?

Because if you want me to continue to subjugate myself to the South and have my money stolen and given to dirt bags who say the n word with a hard -er- - you have to give me something for the intolerable act of being taxed without fair representation.

I need to see public executions of that ENTIRE Cabinet.

Oh wait - We don't say things like that. Its not nice. Right?

Too bad, so sad. I want blood.

[VMA131Marine]

191. Be very very careful about who you are calling a coward ..

Word to the wise …

[alarimer]

206. Not when a substantial number of people in this country do not embrace reason

They LIKE Trump; no they WORSHIP him. You cannot reason with people like that. They voted for this; I'm not crying for them.

Nor do I have any hope that it will EVER get better. Not until a significant number of them die.

I'm through with "hope."

People who can leave, should. I told my niece she should look to Europe for her science careers because we sure don't appreciate it.

[MayReasonRule]

214. I Agree With You Wholeheartedly -- Our Nation Has Recovered From Greater Trauma In The Past

I cast aside the delusions of hopes and prayers long ago.

I and mine reside within the the troubled state of Louisiana, currently under the rule of Y'all Qaeda's Fascist Nat-C mob bosses.

Louisiana is in even worse shape that the Carolinas.

I, my honey and our daughter are actively seeking out other life opportunities within non-fascist locales.

Finishing repairs on my childhood home, finding a new place to purchase that fits with a new work paradigm, health care, and life's desires are the battles I and mine work towards on a daily basis.

Our nation can recover and be better than we ever were.
I do not know that will happen within my lifetime.
I do not know that it will not happen within my lifetime.

I do know that:

United We Stand
Divided We Fall

[angrychair]

210. Respectfully disagree

Any state that voted for TSF is dead to me. I truly, deep in my soul, couldn't care less about them.
I wouldn't left a finger to help any of them. Not one penny.
They voted for that psychopath despite everything we know and lived through last time, including an insurrection. He is a convicted felon for crying out loud.
Every person I used to know, that voted for him, I've disowned and disavowed and told them so.
Those people caused what is happening and that, in my eyes, is unforgivable.

[MayReasonRule]

213. Wow - Blaming And Punishing Fellow Democrats That Fight By Your Side In States With Vote Suppression

Perhaps rethink that.

Perhaps.

I'll wait.

[angrychair]

219. There was no voter suppression

In states like Pennsylvania and Michigan and Wisconsin and Nevada.
They voted for that Nazi and whatever bad happens to them so be it. I have no sympathy and won't life a single finger to help them.

[MayReasonRule]

220. Your Disdain And Disregard Of Our Fellow Democrats Within Those States And Others Is Duly Noted

That's truly sad.
Have a nice life.

[Initech]

9. What do we do? As long as Fox rules the airwaves, they control the narrrative.

And he who controls the narrative controls the outcome of elections. And he who controls the outcome of elections controls whatever policies are written and laws are made. And people who watch Fox will never, ever cross over to the other side. What can be done? I'm tired of hearing that we should reason with them or that we need to find common ground. These assholes cannot be, nor will they ever be, reasoned with. They need to be kicked in the ass hard for what they've done in the last month to my country.

[Traildogbob]

42. John Mayer

“when you own the information, you can bend it all you want” (waitin on the world to change, 2006)

[The Madcap]

10. The main reason it won't work

(other than being a massive constitutional issue) is that there is no real thing such as red and blue states (except maybe Oklahoma ). It's more like a vast range of purple shading. The closest divide I can come up with is urban vs. rural, and even that's not really red vs. blue.

To do something like that peacefully would require the movement of a gigantic proportion of the population (likely about 40% or so) from one side to the other, then the construction of hard borders. I don't see that happening anytime soon. The only alternative that would "relocate" everyone on the wrong side of the border would be violence and mass death, which would be utterly tragic for both sides.

I'm actually more in favor of state combination to reduce the number of states to something more manageable (more like Canadian provinces), but with the way our House and Senate work, I don't see that ever happening.

[lame54]

13. Wash. Oregon and Cali joining Canada...

Is very appealing

[yardwork]

33. The Electoral College makes them red and blue states.

Like it or not, we don't have a democracy. Our leaders are not democratically elected. There are too many states that are lost to the Democrats. Lots of reasons for this and plenty of blame to spread around, but the facts are the facts. We are not going to win most of the former slave states, nor Appalachia, nor much of the Midwest and upper West. They are lost to us even though they are full of wonderful Democrats. We're outnumbered and our Constitution gives those states way more power than is representational. Now those states are busy gerrymandering and suppressing the vote to guarantee that we will never, ever win again.

[BannonsLiver]

41. Even in Oklahoma the most populous county is dark purple.

Biden almost carried Oklahoma County which has a bit more than 1.5 million people. As in all red states it’s the shit heel rubes in the hinterlands that are the problem.

[The Madcap]

45. Reforms I would like to see...

1. Eliminate the electoral college.
2. More political parties so building consensus would be necessary to accomplish anything.
3. Moneyed interests out of politics/government.
4. Fewer states. Fewer than 20.
5. Make the House truly proportional based on statewide vote percentages instead of using congressional districts.
6. Term limits for all judges
7. Less presidential power.
8. Term limits for Reps and Senators
9. Real prison time for political corruption
10. Cabinet selections would have more oversight at the beginning of the process so as to prevent the crazies from being appointed in the first place.
11. The executive making backroom deals with our enemies would be dealt with as a traitor and immediately thrown out of office.
12. Extremely limited presidential immunity
13. No fake cabinet posts. All posts must be approved by congress.

[yardwork]

49. All excellent ideas.

We'd have to start over from scratch to do those things .

[JustAnotherGen]

87. 14.

The loss of the right to vote or serve in office for any member of the current Administration. Cabinet members, Doge employees, Appointees made by The Felon etc etc.

That way the people who turned American into MagAmerica can serve as an example for others.

We never punished the leadership of the CSA and it shows.

[Polybius]

167. Looks like it was close in 2024 too

Vice President Kamala Harris had an early lead in Oklahoma County, but that quickly changed as more votes started coming in. Trump won the county by about 4,800 votes, with the president-elect getting 143,522 votes and Harris getting 138,665.

https://www.koco.com/article/oklahoma-election-results-county-by-county-president-donald-trump/62825966

[usedtobedemgurl]

122. The main reason it would not work is trump has itched to use nuclear weapons.

He wanted to shoot protesters. He wanted to nuke a storm. If I tell you they have no idea about fallout, magas reading this are thinking,"Everyone loves trump, there will be no fallout.". They have no clue as to how devastating a nuke would be for the entire cpuntry , from deaths to no food.

[Polybius]

166. West Virginia too

Oklahoma was not the only all-Red state in 2024, as West Virginia also saw Trump winning in all counties.

[Haggard Celine]

11. All the cards are on the table now.

Anyone can see that Trump is doing his best to destroy our country, and he just might succeed. He's working for Putin, so it's imperative that he causes chaos and loads of animosity. I don't think secession posts should be banned, however. The best response is what you're doing here. If you see a post and disagree with it, say something. That's what this site is for.

[MayReasonRule]

142. Thank You For Your Considered Reply

[Emile]

14. You have links to all these divisive posts? I haven't seen any lately.

[MayReasonRule]

18. Today Was The First Day In A While That I Encountered One Emile

I alerted it.

Perhaps other's meanings are somehow lost and misconstrued on my end.

It's just really, really disheartening to be deep within the bowels of the fascist beasts and hear members of your party calling out for your abandonment.

Thank you for inquiring.

I'm grateful on a daily basis for the opportunity to engage with those of like mind.

[sinkingfeeling]

21. Just curious. What DU rule did the post break?

[MayReasonRule]

22. Divisiveness

[hlthe2b]

26. As we experience a devastating barrage of DIVISIVENESS from TRUMP MAGA that threatens our

constitutional democracy, I again ask you, HOW THE HELL IS THIS YOUR PRIORITY? Someone on DU expressing a frustration-incited fantasy of regrouping like-minded states- something that the posters themselves are admitting isn't going to happen? And then you advocate for censoring such posts instead of merely taking them for what they are- expressions of devastation at what is going on all around us... Might you perhaps instead engage the poster in a discussion about what directed efforts they might focus on right now? Acknowledge their frustration and venting and move on from there?

Yeah. It is DUers who are being divisive.

WAKE UP TO WHAT IS HAPPENING AROUND YOU AND ALL OF US! Please!

[yardwork]

35. It's providing me with some lighthearted levity, actually.

Arguing about silly things on DU is so 2024. I miss it.

[hlthe2b]

36. hah... yeah there is that...

[muriel_volestrangler]

102. There's no rule about dividing the USA

just one about dividing the Democrats.

But yeah, you've admitted you've seen just one of these threads. You alerted, without apparently a good reason to alert, and I presume the thread stayed. Maybe you should take that as an indication that DUers can bear these threads (which, yeah, are pretty rare now, as you've admitted; they used to be far more common on DU, before your time, but we managed quite well).

[MayReasonRule]

104. Your Disregard Of Fellow Democrats Is Duly Noted

Have a nice life.

[muriel_volestrangler]

131. Oooh, we're up to 9 "duly noted"s now! That'll teach us!

Would the member like to table a formal motion to keep their notes on us all in? Because taking names of DUers who disagree with you about how DU should be run is in no way divisive, is it?

[JustAnotherGen]

184. Point of order

[BannonsLiver]

40. It's considered a call out.

[Iggo]

77. So there was one. And it was the first one in a long time.

But you’re sick of all these…

Yeah, whatever.

[MayReasonRule]

84. Callous Disregard Duly Noted

[mchill]

93. Think of it this way

Losing California would weaken Trump. In any case, do you think what I wrote in the first comment is really fair?

[Iggo]

164. "Quack."

[MayReasonRule]

103. Perhaps Take A Look Within This Thread...

There are repeated call outs for national division.

I find this quite distressing.

Thanks for your ongoing work,

Happy Sunday...

[Emile]

117. Who started this thread?

[MayReasonRule]

119. I Started The Thread Emile -- I Was Uncertain Whether To Discuss This In The General Forum Or The Admin Forum

[lapfog_1]

16. we are at war.

a global war. WW3

On one side is the dictators and oligarchs and their owned assets and useful idiots.

On the other side are the rest of us that believe in democracy, the rule of law, and personal freedoms and personal responsibilities.

It is not as easy as it was in the US civil war era where mobility was much less common. You had the industrialized North versus the agricultural South... that mostly depended on slave labor.

We are divided between college educated and non-college educated, urban versus rural. Religious freedom ( including freedom from religion ) versus Christofascists.

But this is just the USA. There is a global war happening too. And to fight that war, our side needs to be in control of as much resources around the world as possible. Currently "national resources" ( tax money, military, etc) are controlled by the other side... the dictator and the oligarch. Not wannabe anymore. And they are directing OUR national resource to the side of global dictators and oligarchs.

We cannot wait 4 more years to try to win an election. Not when the war will likely be decided long before then.

So... choose a side in the global conflict.

I believe to win this conflict the side of the good guys ( us ) need to be in control of our tax money, our military assets. Sure, it should have been Kamala in the White House yesterday... handing a big fat over sized check to Zelenskyy for $1 Trillion dollars to fight the military war. ( ok I am exaggerating here ) But, because Putin hacked the minds of 60 or 70 million US citizens and another .5M to 1M were not allowed to vote... we got the dictator and the oligarch. So we now need to go our own way. We cannot wait 4 more years... even if the dictator would allow a fair election by then or even have an election by then.

Put another way, when would YOU choose to pull the democracy "fire alarm"? ( Break up the USA )

[stillcool]

19. I am sick of red states.

the people they elect, and what they value is horrendous. They like it, so fine...but I don't. How many elections do you have to have before you realize it's who red states are, and it's what they want.

[Diraven]

23. I'd end up way behind enemy lines

Would kind of suck.

[MayReasonRule]

24. Dig Your Avatar! Homer Rules!!

[Autumn]

27. You have a problem with what other people want that's on you. People are entitled to

not want to be part of Trumps shithole country. All the fucking red states want to do is take aways peoples right. Fuck them.

[MayReasonRule]

58. Wow, You're Hatred Of Me And Mine Is Duly Noted...

I'm a Democrat in Louisiana.
As is all my immediate family.

Wow.

[Voltaire2]

75. Zero hatred of you or your family was expressed.

Perhaps discuss the issue you raised, rather than attacking people for things they didn’t say?

Or not.

[MayReasonRule]

95. Perhaps Dont Deflect...

Have a nice life.

[Full Serrano]

120. What is "You Are Hatred Of Me And Mine"

???

[MayReasonRule]

123. I'll Edit It.. It Was A Typo...

[MayReasonRule]

100. Your Disregard For Fellow Democrats In So Called Red States Is Duly Noted

Have a nice life.

[Autumn]

147. I have a very nice life. Thank you very much.

Enjoy your attenpts at controling what other people think .You will fail and that's fine with me

[Autumn]

148. I'll be sure and post my contempt for red states and their desperate attempts to control blue states

as often as I can.

[Emile]

149. I live behind the Hoosier Iron Curtain and I thank you.

[dchill]

28. I don't see any.

[mchill]

29. Imagine this: As a Californian

We send $83 billion more to DC in taxes than we ever get back and at the same time my Republican Congressman wants to send the Fed money we do get for high speed rail back to DC because he doesn’t like it. If we kept that money we could have built that hi speed rail in less than 2 years and generated even more revenue for us to keep. Yes, seceding makes a lot of sense for this Californian.

[Blasphemer]

52. Good reason for a revolution, no? This is precisely the type of dynamic that makes major political change inevitable. nt

[MichMan]

53. I see that same argument given by wealthy suburbs not wanting to send their tax money to the inner cities

They want to keep it for themselves.

[Shambala]

56. I think at least trying would be worth it

I hear too many insults about Commiefornia, the land of fruits and nuts, and that we should be kicked out of the union anyway. Let's force the issue on those that are pushing us out and they can put their money where they mouth is. If they want to keep our tax dollars and state in the union then they can STFU about requiring us to change our policies in exchange for disaster relief and opening stupid valves up in central California to put out fires. If secession is successful, then all the better for the fifth largest economy in the world.
Hell, we can even give up state of Jefferson up north.

[yardwork]

66. Imagine a country made up of just the states that voted for Harris in 2024.

Full disclosure: my state is not one of them.

It's an impressive set of states, though. CA, OR, WA. CO and NM. IL and MN. VA, MD, and DC. NJ, NY and every state to its northeast.

We'd have borders with Canada and Mexico, shipping ports, amazing research institutions, agricultural powerhouses, and high tech industries. We'd be allowed to protect beautiful national parks and wilderness areas. We could write a better Constitution and restore democracy.

We'd lose a lot of military bases (which Trump will probably close anyway) and most of our gas and oil. NM is ideal for solar farming, though, and our affluent states could fund green energy initiatives. They'd probably sell oil to us anyway because they'll be desperate for cash.

They'd get TX, FL, OH and some other big states, but they'd also get a lot of desperately poor states, and under TrumpPutin they will get unhealthier and poorer. Faced with supporting those states, I suspect a number of red states would join us sooner or later.

Sure, it's a pipe dream but maybe it's time to dream bigger.

[mchill]

91. Oh please no! I live in the State of Jefferson

And Shasta Lake does too and a major source of agricultural water for California.

[Shambala]

199. My bad

I have friends in Shasta. We’ll keep Jefferson

[MayReasonRule]

67. Wow, Your Disregard Is Duly Noted

[VMA131Marine]

197. Your little red notebook must be getting full

with all the disrespect and disregard going on here.

Seriously, if you want people to not discuss something the last thing you should do is tell them they can’t discuss that thing. Democrats are stereotypically tolerant but that does not mean tolerating your intolerance.

[Voltaire2]

30. I'm not.

You should consider the serious possibility that there may not be a remotely honest election for the foreseeable future. This regime is not acting as if it is at all concerned about its electoral prospects. Why is that?

The tech-fascists have a coherent plan. That plan includes deconstruction of the federal government, replacing it with a ‘network state’ of corporate controlled and operated regions. It is a plan for corporate feudalism.

I have no intention of living in such a system, nor do I wish to live in a Christian Theocracy. As far as I am concerned, the social compact our ancestors agreed to with the adoption of the current constitution is reaching its end.

[AntiFascist]

31. Trump's director of OMB has put forth the idea that we are in a post-Constitutional era...

If a majority of Americans go along with that, then I'll be ready to secede and/or fight for independence. At that point we are no longer a democratic republic under the rule of law, and the need for a "democraticunderground" may become very much underground.

[PuraVidaDreamin]

32. Seriously.... It might need to happen.

Bring on all the ideas.

This shit requires outside the box.

[demmiblue]

34. ...

[mahina]

37. who would benefit from such an outcome?

same as always.

I agree.

[Autumn]

38. Blue states would benefit. Our tax dollars would not have to subsidze their self chosen

poverty fetish.

[haele]

46. Not as well as we'd think we will.

We're going to have an issue because most of the would be chainsaw wielding TechBros and Hedge Fund types live in Blue States, despite their claims that these states are run by envious Commie fascists slackers.
They don't want to live in Arkansas or Iowa, they want to live in successful, already established gteat economic locations and literally shit in the bed that sustains them and their businesses.
Not to mention de-tangling federal government jobs and infrastructure debts from the state economies.
If, say, the West Coast and Hawaii do a soft, slow break off and form their own economic buffer zone separate from the Federal Government, that's one thing. Just seceding is another.

[yardwork]

51. True, but what if they had less power?

What if the power of billionaires was reduced by having a new Constitution that doesn't allow any donations to political campaigns? No Citizens United decision. No private donations, period.

What if campaigns were mandated by a new Constitution to be funded only with limited public dollars?

Imagine not being pestered for money all the time. No political ads on TV. Campaigns run like local city council campaigns, with written answers to questionnaires and town halls?

[MorbidButterflyTat]

196. Agree

Blue states have carried red states long enough.

I remember Moscow Mitch suggesting New York declare bankruptcy, (for some reason, I don't remember why, Covid maybe) and Chuck Schumer responded, "Who would pay your bills?"

These thieves have gotten away with it for far too long.

[BannonsLiver]

39. Haven't seen that lately but rec'ng because of the meanness.

[Blaukraut]

43. Misery loves company?

Why do Democrats in red states bristle at the idea of blue states seceding? It's not like anything would change for them. They'd still be in those same red states under the same conservative rule they've been under for decades now. A handful of states deciding they'd rather not be forced to live the same way under an autocratic government shouldn't be so offensive to red state Democrats - unless misery loves company.

[JustAnotherGen]

88. This is a good point

It really would be business as usual for Red States with an exception -

Their taxes would increase.

[MayReasonRule]

96. Wow - Your Disregard Is Duly Noted

[VMA131Marine]

194. Going to write that down in your little red book are you?

Oh no!

[Oneironaut]

47. I think it's a response to MAGA doing the same.

Furthermore, Trump actually wants to treat blue states like second class citizens in the union. Not sure commenters here are the ones who started it.

Regardless, it’s settled law that no states can leave the Union. We litigated this from the civil war.

[MayReasonRule]

55. Hear, Hear!!!

[LS0999]

144. Nothing is settled

We're not supposed to have a dictator yet we have one. If those states decide not want to live under a MAGA Nazi/KKK dictatorship then what is the problem?

[Nimble_Idea]

145. this is inaccurate

[Oneironaut]

157. Which part?

[ProfessorGAC]

48. If I Could Vote Against An OP...

...this would be one of them.
It's priggish & condescending.

[MayReasonRule]

54. To Whom Are You Referring?

Last edited Sun Mar 2, 2025, 05:54 AM - Edit history (1)

Ah...

Well be careful lest you fall and injure yourself from the height of your moral ground...

[Dave Bowman]

208. +1

[Blasphemer]

50. Why is that divisive? There are TWO Americas. We are NOT a united republic.

I wish we would stop pretending that we are.

[Raftergirl]

57. I'd love to secede. Red states hate us so why in the world would they even care? Except for all the money we

give them so they aren’t stuck living in abject poverty.

We have nothing in common with the people of the Red States. Our morals and values are completely different.

I resent being blamed that the D’s in those states feel I need to care about them and come to their rescue. I’ve been done with caring about the Red states for years.

Move away or quit complaining about your plight and whining to those of us who live in Blue states. It’s not the people of the blue states fault you live in shithole places controlled by crazy motherfuckers.

[MayReasonRule]

73. Wow. Your Hatred And Blatant Disregard For Other's Humanity Is Duly Noted

[Ocelot II]

59. Nobody is seriously calling for that. It wouldn't even be possible.

All red states have blue areas and vice-versa, meaning that the schism is mostly urban vs. rural; anything approaching a civil war would be more like The Troubles in Northern Ireland. None of the states can or will secede (although I wouldn't mind if Canada annexed Minnesota).

[MayReasonRule]

65. I Would Like For That To Be True

It's truly disheartening to live within a so called red state and have my fellow DU members call out for the red state to go ahead and secede or for the blue states to secede.

Either way it's sickening.

It's divisive in the worst of ways.

[ms liberty]

74. Then if you want to be a DU'er, you need to develop a thicker skin

Red states and the South in particular are regularly disparaged here, and have been since the beginning. I'm a Southerner in NC who grew up in Florida, and I can assure you that DU is never going to give any red state a pass just because one or more DU'ers live in it.
If you can't handle that, you probably won't enjoy your stay.

[MayReasonRule]

121. Your Disregard Is Duly Noted

Have a nice life.

[yardwork]

68. I used to think it was a crazy idea, but now I don't.

A lot of things have changed in one month, and more destruction is coming.

[Cirsium]

61. Are you serious?

I guess your call for prohibiting posts that you disagree with is not divisive?

I am personally sick of the posts by people telling us that they are sick of seeing posts that they don't agree with.

I don't think secession is a good way to go, and have calmly made a counter argument. I haven't told them I was "sick" of their posts nor that their posts should be prohibited just because I disagree with them.

[MayReasonRule]

62. It's A Call For The Admins.

They'll make the call, it's up to them.

[Cirsium]

79. OK

You are calling for the admins to make a call, and make it the way you want them to.

[enid602]

63. Secession

Secession and joining Canada would stack the deck for the free world. And if Trump wants to attack, he’ll have to attack NATO. This is the time to consider it. Start with CA, and see who follows.

[AntiFascist]

71. There may be a ballot initiative, but only to prepare a report on the viability...

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
January 23, 2025

Proposed Initiative Enters Circulation
Requires Future Vote on Whether California
Should Become Independent Country. Initiative Statute


Sacramento, Calif. – Secretary of State Dr. Shirley N. Weber announced that the proponent of a new initiative was cleared to begin collecting petition signatures on January 23, 2025.
...
REQUIRES FUTURE VOTE ON WHETHER CALIFORNIA SHOULD BECOME INDEPENDENT COUNTRY. INITIATIVE STATUTE. If enacted, this measure places the following question on November 2028 ballot: “Should California leave the United States and become a free and independent country?” If at least 50% of registered voters participate in that election, and at least 55% vote “yes”, it would constitute “a vote of no confidence in the United States of America” and “expression of the will of the people of California” to become an independent country, but would not change California’s current government or relationship with the United States. Creates commission to report on California’s viability as independent country. Summary of estimate by Legislative Analyst and Director of Finance of fiscal impact on state and local governments: Around $10 million dollars in one-time election-related costs and to form the new commission on national sovereignty and independence. Around $2 million in annual state costs to operate the commission. (24-0001A2.)

https://www.sos.ca.gov/administration/news-releases-and-advisories/2025-news-releases-and-advisories/Proposed-Initiative-Enters-Circulation-Requires-Future-Vote-on-Whether-California-Should-Become-Independent-Country

[Iggo]

78. For California to secede from the union, it would take a civil war.

[Bev54]

64. So you think it should be business as usual?

You are in a very different time and if people want to blow off steam by dreaming of a better life, they should be censored? Wow, that is not very democratic, they are not raging against democracy but against the new fascism taken hold in the country.

[doc03]

69. This is the first post ever saw saying such a

thing.

[LeftInTX]

80. It's been going on since the election.

[doc03]

82. I just ignore those posts, it isn't going to happen anyway. nt

[MayReasonRule]

114. Yep...

[edhopper]

70. Someone once said

" When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation."

[MayReasonRule]

94. Are You Calling For The Dissolution Of Our Republic?

That would be antithetical to our party's platform and settled law...

[edhopper]

150. Not yet

but let's see if they end it?

[MayReasonRule]

151. The Battle Is On...

[kerry-is-my-prez]

76. I personally can't move but we need to do something drastic.

[Skittles]

85. THANK YOU

THEY ARE RIDICULOUS

[MayReasonRule]

99. THANK YOU Skittles!!!

It's disheartening to have so many fellow Democratic Underground participants calling our for our nation's dissolution.

Truly.

[Skittles]

183. what would Lincoln think

[JustAnotherGen]

187. Possibly this

"If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it".

[Skittles]

198. well, he WAS a republican

but without Lincoln, America would be like Korea

[GoodRaisin]

89. So, once the rule of law is ignored, elections are cancelled, the military is used against

protesters, social security and Medicare cancelled, and the dictator for life is firmly seated, what will be your potential solutions?

[MayReasonRule]

97. Together We Stand Divided We Fall

[usedtobedemgurl]

127. Divided we thrive.

You speak as if your way is the only way. Some of us do not want to live under Hitler 4.0. As for law, people change and laws change.

[GoodRaisin]

181. So, "stand", and keep taking it?

Once your health care and social security income is gone, along with your freedoms to choose? Stand, and all suffer together under the red dictator?

[JustAnotherGen]

189. It is recklessly

Selfish and cruel to expect Blue States to just allow Trump to erase us off the map.

He means killing tens of millions of us in NJ, NY, CT, etc etc. We will be under martial law and military rule years before Red States. Its going to be like living in France in 1941 - but no one will lift a finger to help us.

He's not talking about Louisiana or Pennsylvania. He's talking about New Jersey.

[GoodRaisin]

195. Right.

Although, I can foresee a whole lot of red state Americans heading for blue states if/when conditions become bad enough for them to want to bail too.

[MayReasonRule]

205. Your Doomerism Is Duly Noted

[GoodRaisin]

211. Ha! How is my position "doomerism"?

[MayReasonRule]

212. Morning Y'all! May Your Day Be Filled With All That You Love!

Once your health care and social security income is gone, along with your freedoms to choose? Stand, and all suffer together under the red dictator?

Doomerism:
--Expecting or predicting the imminent collapse of human civilization.
--Concluding that things that have not happened will inevitably happen without conclusive factual evidence

Happy Tuesday y'all, don't let the bastards keep ya' down!

[GoodRaisin]

215. That is what is called a hypothetical question.

I haven’t said anything about “human civilization” or concluded anything was inevitable in asking you that question. Either answer it or let it go.

[JustAnotherGen]

90. I'm personally offended that in 2025

Anyone in a Red State regardless of their political affiliation believes that those of us in Blue States are part of a representative Democracy.

We are not. We are taxed without Fair representation.

The lowercase "leader" has said "Blue States may disappear off the map".

Whenever that Thing says something punitive and cruel - it means it. When its minions say we are in a "post constitution America" - they mean it.

I'm not going to skip around singing fa la la and pretending that we are NOT in the first stages of an authoritarian dictatorship.

[MayReasonRule]

98. United We Stand Divided We Fall

[Scrivener7]

107. Don't look now, but we've already fallen.

[MayReasonRule]

109. The Reasoned Among Us Will Never Desist Because In Reason's Absence Our Freedoms Cease To Exist

Quitters never win.

Can't never could.

Won't never will.

Be a part of the change you want to see.

The reasoned among us have only begun to fight.

[Scrivener7]

110. Reason's absence in red states has taken away the freedoms of those states where reason is alive and well.

And schoolyard rhymes don't really apply.

Mump and their voters have put everything on the table.

So everything is on the table.

However this ends, nothing will be the same as it was when it began.

[MayReasonRule]

111. Dissolution Is Not On The Table

No reasoned American would say so.

[Scrivener7]

112. Of course it is. EVERYTHING is. And reasoned Americans who recognize that are not the ones who put it there.

[MayReasonRule]

113. Advocating For Dissolution Is Antithetical To The Our Nation

Only cowards will abandon their countrymen and give up vast swaths of territory and resources without a fight.

That's what the fascists want...
They want you to concede...

They want you to give up through their intimidation, threats of incarceration, and threats of extermination.

That is the province of fascists.

Standing and fighting is the province of patriots.

There is no in between.

[Scrivener7]

115. If the red state magats don't wake up and understand they are destroying our country, they will destroy our country.

And if they don't wake up, there will be no reason for the rest of us to let them take us down with them.

I'm not advocating for this, but if the magats make it necessary, it could happen.

Gilead looms. Reasoned Americans have no intention of living in it.

[MayReasonRule]

146. Reasoned Patriots Will Fight, Reasoned Patriots Will Not Abandon Their Fellow Americans

These are mere skirmishes.

The real battle has yet to begin.

[Raftergirl]

108. So what if we fall? Some of us will live in a democracy and the rest of you will live in the equivalent of

North Korea.

You don’t have to stay in your Red state(s).

Pack up and start a new life in a blue state. It’s not that hard. People move all the time. People moved with nothing from oppressive regimes for centuries to come here. Had to start from scratch because they had to leave everything behind. Many left their families behind to come and came alone to have a better life in their future.

Of course, you will have to pay more to live in a blue state, because we believe in paying taxes to live in a civilized society, but it’s one of the big reasons many of use haven’t moved to the crazy parts of the country.

[Scrivener7]

118. Well said.

[usedtobedemgurl]

116. Down with free speech.

Got it. There is an ignore button for words like freedom, worried, free speech, succession, civil war, etc

[MayReasonRule]

126. Down With Cowardly Divisive Calls For Secession

United we stand.

Divided we fall.

[usedtobedemgurl]

132. It is not cowardly to not want to live under hitler or hitler enablers.

I refrain from calling you names. Therefore I treat you with respect. You call people cowards. If I want the nation to separate then you are calling me a coward. You called anyone who escaped from Nazi Germany cowards? They left because there was nothing more they could do. I find them brave, especially Jews, but you think they were cowards if they talked about having there own country where people did not want to kill them?

Trump has already killed a lot of people. He is killing people - look up USAID and how AIDS suppressant drugs are being withheld. Look up how long it takes after not taking those drugs to get full blown AIDS and die. That is only one example of how right now he is killing people.

If you have a country you love, yeah, stay and fight. Good on you. Some of us do not have a country any more.

Please do not call me a coward, or thereby call all the others who fled their country cowards. I will not exchange name calling with you. I respect this is your opinion we should stay together. Please respect a great many in this board who may have a differing opinion. Thanks!

[MayReasonRule]

140. Calling For The Dissoltion Of Our Republic Is What The GOP Wants You To Do...

Don't play into their hands.

[iemanja]

158. It is hardly courageous

to engage in imaginary musings that you can rid yourself of this government through a fictive secession. You're welcome to leave the USA at any point, but posting on a message board isn't going to actualize secession. That takes war and massive amounts of bloodshed. Is that what you dream of, slaughtering millions of other Democrats? Because that is what it would take. Do you think the Civil War was cute?

What the talk about secession does is to alienate other Democrats. It's not enough that the party has been locked out of power. Now people want to ensure Democrats never again wins another election. They effect of this sort of nonsense talk is to ensure that Republicans retain a permanent majority. We don't win elections by hating everyone in sight. We have to find ways to actually appeal to American voters, not systematically alienate them--even when they agree with you on 98% of issues.

BTW, I live in Minnesota.

[usedtobedemgurl]

160. I am not a coward.

I thank you not to call people on this board or in your party cowards. I am standing firm I will abide by TOS and not call you names. Attacking me will do nothing to further your agenda. Mom always used to say you attract more bees with honey than vinegar. Again, I will keep treating folks with respect.

[iemanja]

161. I didn't call you a coward or anything else

I addressed your ideas, not your person. You, understandably, offer no defense for what are indefensible ideas.

[usedtobedemgurl]

163. I offer this defense....

If it comes to civil war, so be it. I do not have to justify my reasons to you. I am all for splitting up this his forsaken country. I do not want to live with these folks any more than I want to sleep in a high security prison with folks I believe pose the same risk to me as free folks in our country do. Bloodshed? Sure. People killed? Check.

All of that being said, if you look at an earlier post I made today, I said it would not work because trump would drop a nuke on us.

But I seeing splitting up the country as self-defense. I was raped and a victim of mental abuse. It is hard to live in this country without being severely triggered ever. single. day. My PTSD is through the roof. My last panic attack was when trump was in office. Now they have started again. If you have never had a panic attack, you have no idea the fight I go through with it. If you have, then you are on my side and realize what I go through with the rapist in chief. For some of us, this is a means to survival. Who wants to share a country with folks you cannot even trust to tell where Anne Frank’s family was hiding because they would call the cops and have them dragged off and killed? I will not participate in acting like all of this is normal. Name one facial government that was lifted in stature and went out peacefully.

[iemanja]

165. I share your disgust with this administration

And my job is in jeopardy because of the cuts to research. What I do not agree with is abandoning this country and brining about war. As you yourself admitted, it could never work.

[usedtobedemgurl]

170. But the reason it would never work is their leader is

A bully. Not because we do not know how to negotiate. What do you do when you live under an abusive dictator? I do not want to live with more trauma the rest of my life. So either we (dems, not all of us, his fuckwads are loyal to him) take up arms against the US, or someone does away with our country. Until all of them are put in their place and they learn a lesson, nothing can be accomplished on our side.

We already know there was at least one plan to assasinate him. He told us that, when he said if Iran ever does it, they will be demolished. I said the first go round that he is such a threat to the world, I am amazed some country did not take him out. I am not advocating or encouraging anyone here to do that. I just do not see how we do anything with him in charge of the Looney Bin.

This is not my country, so I find no allegiance to it. My country was the great one that existed before all of this. As I stated in a post a long time ago, my country abandoned me. I have health problems. They do not care enough (actually, they are greedy and take money from lobbyists) to supply universal healthcare. We can go fuck ourselves. Well, if that is how they feel, why should I feel any allegiance to this country? If other countries take care of citizen’s healthcare, why can we not figure it out? Either we are too greedy or too many of our politicians are bought and paid for.

In my estimate, they may do elections in the future but the vote is predetermined before the first one is cast. That is how Putin does it. Trump has said there will be no need for any more elections. Trump just took over the election processs. No, this is not my country. This is a subsidiary of Russia. I would no more fight to keep it than I would Russia.

If my husband was not tied to insurance in this country, I would not be here. I do not wish to live in or fight for a country which I fear. I fear enough that I am afraid my Trumper relative will turn me in for being a liberal. I fear it enough, if our borders close, I will seek a way to get out by claiming my second country, the country I grew up in is my real citizenship and I will try to get kicked out of this one. Something is really fucked up when you have to make contingency plans, in case you cannot get out of the country and you are afraid of being turned in for your political beliefs. Fight for what? There is nothing left but hate, and that is nothing worth fighting for.

[J_William_Ryan]

124. "It's antithetical to our support of representative democracy."

It's also un-Constitutional.

[MayReasonRule]

125. Hear, Hear!!!

[Scrivener7]

129. The Constitution is no longer the law of our land. And that's on them.

[muriel_volestrangler]

133. The two are different things.

Yes, it's against the US Constitution. But a representative democracy can easily be run with the ability of parts to secede if that is the general desire. Czechoslovakia managed it, for instance. Try asking the average DUer if they think Scotland separating from the UK would be "antithetical to our support of representative democracy".

[MayReasonRule]

143. Dead On Point

[Irish_Dem]

128. It's a discussion forum and people discuss ideas.

They have a right to do so.
And I like to hear all sides of a story.

My father taught me this from a young age.
Get all the facts first, listen to all sides, then decide.

Once we start filtering our ideas, we are totally screwed.

[MayReasonRule]

130. Calling For The Dissolution Of Our Republic?

Tucking tail and running is what they want you to do.

Cowards will.

Patriots won't.

[Irish_Dem]

134. We must also face reality.

Another important life lesson.

The MAGAs want civil war in the worst way.
Putin and our enemies want the US to be embroiled in a civil war.
Putin particularly wants to balkanize the US.

If Trump keeps attacking, punishing, sidelining the blue states, it may come to open conflict.
If the red states try to extradite blue state citizens on made up charges, it may come to open conflict.
Or the blue states are made to pay huge amounts of money into the US Treasury but get nothing
back, no help, no assistance, no legal standing it may come to open conflict.

Whatever my personal feelings about the issue is not my point.
The point is that people have a right to discuss important issues of the day.
And we need to hear what people are thinking. Especially people on our team.

[Hugin]

136. Filtering ideas leads to group think.

Group think is our enemy and the enemy of adapting and evolution.

[MayReasonRule]

156. Patriots Persist -- Cowards Run And Hide

The wholesale rejection of the dissolution of our country is the key to our very survival.

United we stand.
Divided we fall.

The fascists want you to run and hide.

That's a huge part of their plan.

INTIMIDATION

Zelinsky is a patriot.

Trump is a coward.

[Hugin]

135. Yeah, Apartheids always work out great!

Look at India/Pakistan… Uh, North/South Korea… Well, there’s Israel/Palestine… Or, I know, Viet Nam… Wait, there has to be one here somewhere. Maybe, Northern Ireland/Ireland?



I worked with a very right wing dude for years that I could hardly stand being in the same room with. The ONLY thing we both agreed about is that the migration of people within the Federal United States should be as unhindered as possible. Otherwise, eternal conflict and exploitation would rule.

[DetroitLegalBeagle]

137. Its a discussion board. Let them have their fantasy

I doubt many take it seriously, they are just venting their frustrations. Secession isn't possible right now or in the immediate future. Any real attempt would be crushed by the Feds. Peaceful secession is not possible. Maybe in a distant future, but right now it would take a war.

[DonCoquixote]

139. Yes, the red states have been a pain, but

the fact is the "red" and "blue" divisions have nothing to do with the mason dixon line, but are all about rural vs urban. Remember when Georgia voted blue? Remember when the "blue wall" states were not red?

If we ant to be honest, the truth is that the attempts to disenfranchise black voters have been too successful, and NOT challenged. What also hurts is this attitude of SOME blue voters that they are not adding to the issues. when the blue collar voters look at some people who are Democrats and then go "wait a minute, those people voted for me to lose my job."

This is not to say the red states do not have a problem, they never allowed reconstruction to happen after the civil war, repaying Lincoln for his "malice toward none" with a bullet. However, if nothing else, there will be no way Democrats win without the black voters a civil war 2 will cost. It also will nto win when some centrist Dems rush in to comfort the offended wite voters, namely because they ae too scared to live in "the wrong neighborhoods" Regrettably, there are some blue blue states who also have some strign pockets of hate as much as Dixie.

[MayReasonRule]

141. You're Dead On Point. Thank You.

[pwb]

153. All I ever hear is that the red states want to leave again?

The $7.25 minimum wage in most red states is an embarrassment. A guarantee of every kind of government assistance to so many. Elon missed that abuse eh?

[relayerbob]

154. The divide is more rural vs urban

It’s not really state vs state, except in the farthest apart ones, and even there, there is a large mix of “red” and “blue”.

[MayReasonRule]

155. You're On Point

[the_liberal_grandpa]

159. Protest from a red state?

Sounds like a protest from a red state that couldn't make it without blue state money.

I live in a big blue state of California and I would rather become part of Canada than just secede but the way things are going I am up for either.

[MayReasonRule]

162. I'm A Democratic Party Member And Am Active Within My Community

I'm an American citizen and would like to remain as such.

Your argument is that because of geographic location the American citizens of those states no longer deserve the united resolve of the rest of the country.

An astonishing abrogation of moral values is not the way forward for our nation.

The way forward is through all of our mutual strength across states.

We're in the same party fighting the same fight as you.

United we stand.
Divided we fall.

[Alice B.]

168. Thank you. Those kinds of discussion ratchet up my anxiety level. Same reason I won't watch the recent Civil War movie.

n/t

[MayReasonRule]

172. Understood

[Nulock]

169. I think your point on divisions is valid. Although even that is limited in its scope.

I think your point on how to get past that is not valid at all and pretty reactionary. You don't fight against divisions and authoritarianism by creating more divisions and authoritarianism. Your call for silencing and censoring people is one of the reasons we've reached this point.

[MayReasonRule]

173. May Reason Rule

[Ping Tung]

171. Differences of opinion are what make horse races. Mark Twain

Being a Blue Stater I'm behind the one wih the prettiest tail.

[MayReasonRule]

174. Your "Safe State" Residency Is Duly Noted

Your brothers and sisters in arms are distributed widely throughout.

Casting them aside is no way towards victory.

Quite the opposite.

Consider that currently within so called "Red States" the GOP MAGATS are pissed off as hell and running their reps right the fuck out of town halls.

Something, something baby with the bath water...

United We Stand
Divided We Fall

Sisyphus peered into the mist
A stone's throw from the precipice, paused
Did he jump or did he fall as he gazed into the maw of the morning mist?
Did he raise both fists and say, "To hell with this, " and just let the rock roll?

[Ping Tung]

175. Well, good luck to the Red Staters. I'm sticking with the blue horse.

[MayReasonRule]

176. It's Exceptionally Difficult To Relocate For The Vast Majority Of Our Populace

Stay safe y'all.

May reason rule all across our troubled land...

[Dave Bowman]

177. Your Condescension Is Duly Noted.

[MayReasonRule]

180. Your Lack Of Understanding Is Duly Noted

[Dave Bowman]

207. So Is Yours.

❤️🥰❤️

[JohnSJ]

179. Here is what I will say about that

[pandr32]

186. As a nation we are already divided.

Traitor47 and Eloon prove we have fallen.

[MayReasonRule]

193. Doomerism Is Fatalism Which Is The Cowards Way Out

Patriots fight.

Cowards give up.

[pandr32]

202. I never said we will give up.

We have so much to fix.

[MayReasonRule]

203. Right The Hell On Y'all!!!

Fuck the fascists.
Fuck the doomers.

Love the one's your with and fight like hell!!

[EastBayGuy]

200. I'm Personally Sick Of posts that cause unnecessary division in our community. You behave like a troll.

[Iggo]

201. Exactly. I'm done with this poster.

[MayReasonRule]

204. Wow. You're Sadly Misinformed

Vote Blue... Have a nice life...

[hatrack]

209. So, after over 2 years (oooohh!!!) and over 2,000 posts (ahhhhh!!!) you're here to say how things will be on DU?

Well, lots of luck with that. Oh, and welcome to ignore.

[MayReasonRule]

218. Sarcasm Duly Noted... I Fully Employ The Full Ignore Feature...

Calling for secession is the very definition of being "divisive'.

I mean, it's not like I'm making it up...

This is a forum to promote our Democracy.
The only party promoting our Democracy is our party, the Democratic Party.

Calling out for secession is antithetical to being united under the large umbrella that is the Democratic Party.

Hence, the nature of the post.

Have a good one y'all...

Working on a fresh mozzarella and lamb breast pizza for supper...

Here's to reason's rule throughout our nation and unity throughout our party, in particular this forum.

Happy Monday!

[Torchlight]

216. I'd guess that such statements are more about expressing frustration

or emphasizing a contrast rather than a serious call for division. I doubt that a significant number of well-intentioned Democrats genuinely see dissolution as a practical solution. Thought-provoking rhetorical devices—juxtaposition, antithesis, oxymoron, paradox—can be compelling, even if they sometimes challenge us to engage them with more latitude.

And the few which do exist in fact seem to be efficiently removed not too long after they arrive.

[MayReasonRule]

217. Here's To That Being The Case... I'm Just Putting Those Individuals On Full Ignore