"They will never get rid of Social Security"

[edhopper]

is the new "They will never overturn Roe vs Wade"

*Borrowed from Facebook

[XanaDUer2]

1. I know

That's what I think everytime I hear that

[Silent Type]

2. Fortunately, Social Security is codified by Congress. That's tougher to overturn, unlike a Sup Court ruling from 1970s.

[edhopper]

3. Trump is ending a lot of things

codified by Congress.

[Silent Type]

4. Examples? Firing employees, as bad/unnecessary as that is, isn't ending a program.

[edhopper]

5. Defunding a dept or program

is the same as ending. USAID, is one. The Dept of Education could be next. Also
Musk's tech boys now control Gov payments. they can stop SS checks anytime they want.
Beyond that it looks like Congress is trying to largely defund Medicaid and SNAP, you think SS and Medicare are not far behind?

But sure, don't worry about this.

[Silent Type]

6. Congress cutting or defunding something is a different matter, with different people to blame. Musk does not

control government payments, though he certainly thinks he is.

Fear-mongering ain't gonna help us in Midterms, it darn sure didn't in November. trump is still a POS, but I prefer not to fear stuff that is highly unlikely to happen.

[FoxNewsSucks]

8. Muskrat doesn't directly control, his hackers do.

That's what they should be called. Not kids, teens, bros or whatever, Hackers. Because that's what they are.

If there is no funding to perform a program, it is effectively ended.

[JustAnotherGen]

9. The Doges are in the Data Warehouse

They have far more than need to know knowledge.

Data Warehouse in large enterprise orgs? You don't let just anyone monkey around in there.

That's the problem - it's their ability to do damage to the core data.

[edhopper]

15. Trump works for Putin

he is tasked with dismantling the US Government.

This isn't fear mongering, this is dealing with reality.

[TBF]

20. Here we go again -

pushing everything off, discouraging, "wait for the midterms" ...

Mid-terms? You really think there are going to be fair mid-terms after they got away with rigging every swing state in a presidential election?

[Jazz Jon]

29. Mid Terms 50/50

There is about a 50% chance that we will have mid-term elections. I am still waiting for the big uprising of the American people. The big boycott that was supposed to happen Feb 28th didn't happen. Nobody is talking about the March 15th boycott (see Shutdown315 on face book). I do think SS and medicare will go the way of Roe vs Wade... with a whimper. ....I am expanding my home vegetable garden as much as humanly possible. I stocked up on mason jars too.

[TBF]

32. My phrase was "fair mid-terms" -

I think they rigged the swing states, and they'll do it again.

Expanding the vegetable garden is a good idea! We definitely need to find ways to survive this administration's shenanigans, and to help others if we can. I have 0% trust in this crew.

[quakerboy]

36. Last I heard, it did

A one day boycott is practice, it is more for us doing it than for actual effectiveness in bringing change. And at least some reading i did indicated the 28th was actually the single largest consumer boycott in US history so far.

[Jazz Jon]

54. Hope you are right.

Thanks for the update. I scoured the news and couldnt find anything about it afterward. Make a post on DU if you see anything about the upcoming 3/15 boycott. Thanks

[elocs]

48. Give Republicans credit...they played the long game with Roe, worked to overturn it for

nearly 50 years and never gave up.
Democrats? We were all convinced that Roe was a done deal and safe, all but a constitutional amendment. Stupid.
Too many Democrats are complacent and overconfident. All Democrats should have shown up in record numbers not to just beat Trump, but to crush him.

Biden got 6 million votes against Trump in '20 that Harris never received. Where did they go and who were they? That is a huge question.

[Silent Type]

41. Yes, I do. But if you want to live in fear, that's OK. I don't.

[TBF]

99. No, you're too busy selling their talking points. nt

[elocs]

44. Yep! So many are confident that we will crush them in the midterms.

Free, fair, and not rigged midterms? Unlikely. Trump/Musk would never allow that to happen. And as Democrats, we are too proud to admit that we could be screwed over by a bunch of dumb ass Magas.

So where did the 6 million votes that Biden received against Trump in '20 go that Harris didn't get in '24 go?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

28. If SS was eliminated tomorrow you would literally have societal collapse in a month

And yeah I know what literally means.

[markodochartaigh]

31. It means an incredible buying opportunity.

Seniors will be forced to sell their homes into a market rapidly spiraling downward in order to get money for their living expenses. Seniors will lose their homes and the next generation will lose their inheritance. But hedge funds will have an incredible buying opportunity as they buy up homes in bulk for pennies on the dollar in cash.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

37. Social Security will pay out 1.6 trillion dollars in 2025

People would literally starve. The economy would go into freefall. There would definitely be mass violence and unrest. It would be a Mad Max World. Markets would crash. There would be bank runs.

[markodochartaigh]

55. The markets would crash. Bank runs

very likely wouldn't last long since Trump and doge want to get rid of the FDIC. Mass violence and unrest are great opportunities for a Strong Leader to crack down and increase his popularity.

The fact that people would starve is not something that maga would care about. Maybe some "religious" organization could give them free watery soup to convert.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

56. What's in it for them if they cause a depression?

Broke people can't buy stuff. As to bank runs there are literally more guns in this country than people. You think Jethro and Billy Bob are just going to throw their hands up when they can't get their money and say oh well?

[markodochartaigh]

58. It isn't just about money.

Ever since Ford paid his workers enough so that they could buy the cars they made, our oiligarchs have understood that more money for workers trickles up to them. They do not want a bigger piece of an ever expanding pie. It is not enough for them to be rich, the poor must be destitute. It isn't all of the oligarchs, but in the US it is a good proportion.

All those people with guns? Do you think that they are going to show up at the banks? The banks won't have any money after a couple of days. And without the FDIC there won't be any more money coming. Jethro and Billy Bob won't have any understanding of how we got in the situation, or how to get out. Jethro will go after whoever Trump tells him to, and Billy Bob will go after other Billy Bobs. And that will give the authoritarian leaders the excuse they were waiting for to crack down. If it's dozens of Wacos and Ruby Ridges so much the better for the authoritarian leaders.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

60. Why would a sane person want to rule over ruins?

We would be back to Hobbes state of nature where life was nasty, brutish, and short. You think Musk will be selling Teslas, Tim Cook will be selling I Phones, and Jeff Bezos will be fulfilling Amazon orders in this anarchic state?

[markodochartaigh]

61. What is sane?

I'm sure that Trump, Putin, etc. can pay any number of psychiatrists to diagnose them as sane.

People like Musk, Bezos, etc. know that with the amount of money that they have they will always be powerful. And the psychopathic need for power is not something that can be logically explained. Like an addiction, the need must be met, it can never be permanently satisfied, nor does it seem logical to those without the addiction.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

62. How does Bezos's business model work if people are broke?

Just because you're a millionaire or billionaire you can only want to buy so many pairs of sneakers. Ditto for Cook with his I Phones and Musk with his Teslas. Even Putin sent out stipends to help Russians burdened by inflation.

[electric_blue68]

70. That's partly why I wonder if such things (destroying Soc Sec, the Medi's, and collapse) really make sense to some...

oligarchs at least.

At least here in the US I don't see them quite as holed up as certain oligarchs in countries that have way more instability economically, militarily etc, like South America.

Sure, here, they travel, live in rarified circles, and fly all over to other fancy digs, and beautiful places.

Do they really want to live in way more hunkered down ways that way more devastated America would be. Though I suppose they'll just up, leave, never to return.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

74. I assure you Bill Gates, Tim Cook, and Jeff Bezos don't respect Trump.

They likely see him as a clown like we do. One example is TSF made inappropriate comments about Bill Gates's daughter. They do fear him.

[electric_blue68]

80. Eww, hadn't heard about Gates's daughter. He's so disgusting, besides all his other hideous qualities..

Well, he's an evil clown, for sure!

Unfortunately, I think there are certainly reasons to be afraid of him while he's President.

[creon]

75. Better to rule in Hell

They do not care.
They want the money.
And, to destroy for gratification

[DemocratSinceBirth]

79. Whose money? Everyone is broke.

Banks keep 3-10% of their deposits in reserves. What happens when people can't pay their loans because they're broke? They go out of business. Money is useless for exchange. Gold? You can't eat it. You can't wear it..And you can't wipe your --- with it.

[creon]

85. Deflation

The money just disappears.
It is fiat money

[DemocratSinceBirth]

87. If money is no longer a means of exchange how do people pay for goods and services?

[creon]

90. Barter

This for that

[defacto7]

63. But who do you think they'd shoot? Trump? Musk?

??

[DemocratSinceBirth]

65. Probably each other. A man, a starving family, and a gun is a scary prospect.

I'm glad I have a passport.

[usedtobedemgurl]

94. It is not being embarrassed by the blackmail material mother russia

Has on them. You heard all about them hacking DNC emails but nothing about hacking the rnc emails. They have a ton on republicans. And they will survive when we collapse. This is a war on the US.

[Baron2024]

66. You Are Exactly Right

If they stopped Social Security payments it would definitely be a Mad Max World. Crime would go through the roof. I live in a University Town but there are a lot of impoverished areas in this small/mid-sized City. A lot of people here survive on SSI, SNAP, and Medicaid. I see people using their SNAP cards in the Convenience Stores all of the time. There is already a certain amount of crime in this City. If they cut off payments I expect the City to turn into a war zone. No one will be able to pay rent or buy food. People will start preying on other people.

I also used to work in Human Services. There is a lot of government and nonprofits in this City (I am in a State Capital). There are many disabled folks in Town that depend on Social Security. The nonprofits that help these people often are funded by government grants. All of that is in danger of getting funds cut, and those Human Service Workers could be out of jobs too.

We have a pretty big Healthcare Sector as well. The Medical Center and a lot of Clinics depend on Medicare and Medicaid for a lot of their revenue. Doctors, Nurses, and Support Staff all depend on government revenue to help pay their salaries and the operating costs of the hospitals. If they kill all of these programs it will result in a massive collapse of the economy here and throughout the country.

Trump is actually stupid, with his tariffs and federal firings. He does not know what he is doing, and he is going to run the economy into the ground, just like one of his shitty casinos. God help us, it will be on the scale of the Great Depression, with added features of war, violence, and crime. If Trump were a rational actor, this would not be happening. But he is not a rational actor and he is surrounded by malevolent idiots and sycophants.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

67. I said there would be bank runs.

Banks only keep 3-10% of their deposits in reserves. Most of the money is lent out. What happens when people have no money to repay their loans? The banks go broke. Are we going to have a barter society? This is madness. The bank lost all my money and the markets have crashed along with my investments. Are people going to schlep their flat screens to the grocery store and trade it for a sack of potatoes?

[Baron2024]

68. You Are Right

I have been reading your posts in this thread and I think that you are exactly right. Bezos, Cook, and the rest of these Oligarchs will not be selling much in the Apocalypse. The only thing that could save us is if a strong Democrat gets into office and implements an FDR style New Deal program.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

71. This economy is huge and complex. We saw it during The Great Recession.

My hope it is too huge for TSF to destroy even if he does his best to, and even if he's suicidal the people around him aren't.

[Baron2024]

78. Suicidal

I don't think that Trump is suicidal. I think that he is a profoundly stupid grifter who is surrounded by malevolent right wing idiots who are deeply mistaken about what might happen if you destroy the Federal Government. As you say, the economy is huge and complex. And the Federal Government is massive and integrated into the national economy. Kill the federal government and you kill the economy. These right wingers are supposed to be such great businessmen but what they actually are is thieves who are profoundly ignorant of how the economy and the government actually work. Unless something stops him, Trump is going to run the American economy into the ground just like one of his shitty casinos.

[Justice matters.]

69. And those who don't own a home, rent an apt. and barely make ends meet each month?

Many of them will commit relatively small felonies just hoping to survive in jail, otherwise, it's under turnpikes' bridges?

[Silent Type]

42. Exactly, it would collapse. Oligarchs would lose what they have too. Kochs, Musks, etc., depend on little people buying

their products, using their websites, etc. They have nothing if society collapses. Yet, people think that's the plan.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

45. I see posters talking about recipients losing their homes and vultures buying them up.

A lot of them don't own homes. Some are already homeless and use their meager SS payments for food and clothing. Medicare is also tied to Social Security. You just can't take 1.7 trillion dollars out of the economy. Hitler, Stalin, and Putin didn't stop such payouts. TSF is capable of a lot of awfulness but he's not suicidal.

[Silent Type]

46. My feeling too. Although, sometimes it's more a Hope than certainty.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

47. What do they think will happens when sixty one million people don't get their benefits?

[krkaufman]

50. Trump is an idiot and isn't in charge

He’s letting the Project 2025 fanatics and Musk run wild, so long as he can grift and play king.

[Baron2024]

72. The Plan

I am convinced that Trump has no Plan other than to play king and to steal as much as he can. His "management style" is "incompetent bully". These Right Wingers who want to destroy the Federal Government don't understand that the Federal Government is massive and integrated into the national economy. Kill the Federal Government, kill the economy. Trump is not a rational actor and he is surrounded by malevolent right wing idiots like Stephen Miller and other similar sycophants. Trump is going to run the American economy into the ground just like one of his shitty casinos.

[NoRethugFriends]

82. Nice you're so sanguine.

Seems to be a Liberal Youtubers trait.

[krkaufman]

49. Firing much of the SSA ...

… wouldn’t be “ending the program,” but effectively would be if payments are missed or stopped, can’t be challenged doe to workforce shortage, or new enrollments can’t be processed for the same reason.

That they’re killing Congressionally-mandated programs all over the place, with the GOP Congress-members passively (at best) sitting back, is the issue.

[relayerbob]

23. So was USAID

[creon]

76. The attempt will be made

They will try.

[Silent Type]

77. That's for sure. Anything could happen, but not likely they'll be successful.

[creon]

86. I expect that the attempt will be made.

[Silent Type]

88. And, we'll -- including tens of millions of GOPers -- will oppose their attempt.

[creon]

89. I think so

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

7. Apparently not a single DOGE person has an elderly mother

or grandmother dependent on Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid.

Oh, wait, they do? And they're totally okay with now supporting Mom or Grandma, including perhaps having them come to live?

Okay then. Not a problem.

[JustAnotherGen]

10. They could take my

Money I've paid into since I was 8 (modeling for Kodak, Hawaiin Punch, etc. etc.) and re-assign it to their grandmother - giving her a bump up to my targeted maximum payout - and reducing my future payout to $800 a month.

That's theft, cheating, and a rip off.

[William769]

11. Never say never. Just ask women.

[anciano]

12. FWIW a more realistic likely scenario would be the privatization

of Social Security (similar to the current voluntary transition from Original Medicare to Medicare Advantage). Just saying.

[whathehell]

21. Privatizing Social Security would mean dumping

2.4 Trillion Dollars of a lifetime of savings onto the stock market..Very few Social Security recipients are going to 'volunteer' this. The idea isn't new, by the way. It was 'suggested' during Dubya's administration and soundly rejected.

[anciano]

25. Dubya's plan as I recall only would have applied to workers

55 and younger. Older workers and those already retired would not have been affected.

[whathehell]

43. Yup, and they still rejected it..

and I'm glad they did.

[krkaufman]

51. Doesn't seem all that radical ...

… a possibility for an Administration creating a Strategic Crypto Reserve.

[whathehell]

57. Nothing may be "all that radical" for Trump,

The issue is how those whose money is at stake would take it.

[TBF]

22. That's what I used to say -

I wrote a post about it lower down in this thread. I now think they will go for destruction first, just as they are doing with ambushing the agencies. Elon and Donald are businessmen first (albeit not great ones considering the bankrupt casinos and rockets exploding over the Gulf). I think in their minds they are doing a hostile takeover. How much they get in the end is up to how much we push back. The courts can be very powerful, but also very slow. What we need is people in the streets this summer. They know it too - that's why they are already starting to arrest community leaders like that young man who was leading the protests at Columbia.

We are in a pretty bad spot already, despite what the Pollyanna's waiting for mid-terms will have you believe.

[BonnieJW]

93. Courts are not powerful

If rulings are ignored

[TBF]

98. Yes that is also a good point. nt

[LiberalArkie]

13. I think that sometime this year this Administration will turn off the consumer GPS system and only allow

the military to use it like it used to be.

President Krasnov wants to bring the US to its knees.

[DownriverDem]

14. Who thinks 73,000,000 Americans

will stand for it?

[edhopper]

17. And what will they do?

Study Russia under Stalin to see the results.

[Lars39]

16. But he can break it beyond repair

[IronLionZion]

18. They have ways to sabotage and undermine it in stages

Red states had state laws that took effect as soon as Roe v Wade was overturned.

Likewise, GOP will cut staff, make it harder to apply for benefits or get questions answered, remove people incorrectly, make lots of mistakes all over the place, and so on. They want the public to be irritated with government programs.

[TBF]

19. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt --

they are going for broke and will cut it if they want to. Reasonable people will say, as I used to, that they are far more likely to privatize it. Which may still happen - but I now think that is their end game. First, they will go for all out destruction. They have been bulldozing through the agencies to see how much resistance they get. Until people are wall to wall in DC, they are getting away with it. Sure, there are court cases, but they can wreak a lot of havoc in the meantime. They are being slowly forced with court orders to release funds and hire back folks. We'll see how far that goes, but I have very little confidence right now that they will stop without being forced to.

[Bettie]

24. Yep. They will

tear the entire country down to ensure that all of the money flows to the top .001% of people.

Millionaires will be horrified to find out that they want them poor as well.

They want 8-10 people who actually matter, a couple hundred who are kept well-off enough that they maintain a servile attitude toward the overlords, and millions of poverty-stricken people who will do as they are told in order to have....food.

[JohnSJ]

26. If they do the economy will go into an immediate economic implosion resembling the Great Depression.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

38. Some people would literally starve.

There would be bank runs. Markets would tank. There would be mass civil unrest and violence.

[SammyWinstonJack]

59. Probably worse.

[Wounded Bear]

27. Repubs have been trying to kill it since its inception. I don't expect them to stop trying...nt

[INdemo]

30. In 1994 when the the Repukes held Congress

and with Newt Gingrich the Repukes borrowed Billions from Social Security and to this day have not paid it back
Repukes would like everyone to believe that SS is funded by tax dollars and its not. It is a self funded retirement fund. Don't know why Democrats dont scream these facts to voters

[TimeToGo]

81. They do. People don't listen.

[Martin68]

33. Social Security and Roe vs Wade are two completely different things. Apples and oranges. First of all, SS isn't a

constitutional issue, it is a law which can be repealed or changed. However, unlike abortion, SS is extremely popular across the country, particularly in poor, rural red states where people depend on its for survival. Medicaid will prove to be just as dangerous to repeal for the same reason. Once SS checks stop coming in and people are refuse at the local hospital, the pain will set in and all hell will break loose.

[Joinfortmill]

34. I think the Traitors try this at their own peril. SS is a different type of dog in this fight.

Magas see it as money they paid paid for a benefit they earned. This will not fly with the vast majority of folks.

[zorbasd]

35. Oh they will destroy it by

a thousand cuts, little by little. Folks, the Krasnov party have been planning this for 70 some years.

[Towlie]

39. No problem, I have enough saved for the rest of my life.

I just won't be able to live as long.

[Johnny2X2X]

40. They've been talking about ending it for 40 years now

The only time they don't talk about destroying Social Security is a few months before elections.

[edhopper]

53. Yes

but now they have the power to do it.

[Godot51]

64. the republicans will

because they've always wanted to.

They wanted, still want and will always want to control that money.

[creon]

73. Musk and his children

Musk and his children want the money.

They loot and pillage to get it.

[dlk]

83. Even as we speak...

n/t

[creon]

84. Make sense?

Who said that it has to "make sense".
There is a strong current of nihilsm/atavism here. I am not meaning it in any religious sense.
It is a desire to destroy.
Not unlike a serial killer.

They cannot spend the money. It cannot be buried with them.
It is fiat money. It is not gold or silver.

It is not about money.

It is not about power. When they die, they cannot put power into probate. The power dissipates.

So, it is destruction for the sake of destruction. Emotional gratification.

[stillspkg]

91. Robbery

This is our money is it not? Are there no safeguards? WTH???

[AmericaUnderSiege]

92. Stealing livelihoods is a right brilliant way to conduct politics.

All the analogies about third rails, stepping on rakes, and rattlesnakes demanding not to be trod on don't even come close to the reality.

I'm sure we'll be disappointed in the cowardice of most, but there will be other kinds of moments. And really there only needs to be one.

[Emile]

95. Their intentions are to privatize it, not get rid of it.

Last edited Tue Mar 11, 2025, 07:14 AM - Edit history (1)

They will give people the option to instead enroll in a national social security 401k advantage plan. Thus defunding Social Security where it will wither and die on it's own.

[Timeflyer]

96. My first thought on hearing about this, too.

[Hekate]

97. How does a great nation fall? -- Very, very slowly. Then all at once.