General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPresident Obama, Democrats need to disavow the rumored offer.
They know and have acknowledged that Social Security does not add to the deficit.
It appears another issue of disagreement has surfaced in regard to the negotiations over the so-called "fiscal cliff".
White House spokesman Jay Carney said Monday that Social Security is one entitlement program that should be addressed on a "separate track."
"We should address the drivers of the deficit and Social Security currently is not a driver of the deficit," Carney told reporters today. The senior retirement program is solvent for another 21 years, at which time recipients could see a reduction in benefits.
It's a similar position taken by Sen. Richard Durbin, D-Ill, the number two Democrat in the Senate, on Sunday. "Social Security does not add one penny to our debt -- not a penny. It's a separate funded operation, and we can do things that I believe we should now, smaller things, played out over the long term that gives it solvency," Durbin said on ABC's "This Week."
- more -
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-34222_162-57554437-10391739/white-house-social-security-should-be-off-limits-in-fiscal-cliff-talks/
Why on earth would the President or any Democrat drag Social Security into the deficit negotiations?
Response to ProSense (Original post)
Post removed
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)I see, and when were the last ones?
teddy51
(3,491 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)And I'll go away.
Just which "phony tears" were you referring to?
spanone
(135,855 posts)Response to jberryhill (Reply #2)
In Truth We Trust This message was self-deleted by its author.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)teddy51
(3,491 posts)side? Sorry, I've had enough of the great bargaining power that we are seeing here. Fire him and let someone else bargain for him.
Cha
(297,405 posts)Smearing the President with "more phony tears".
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)always 'rumors' to you.
this is the same offer obama made in round one, it's nothing new for him.
Cha
(297,405 posts)The post got deleted it was so Ugly.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)spreading the rumors.
i.e. democrats spreading the rumors. bad democrats, bad!
Cha
(297,405 posts)media gets a lot of things wrong.. I will wait see to what actually happens.
You know why I know that he doesn't shed "phony tears?" Michelle. I know women, and I know people, and I'm telling you that if he did that she would jerk a knot in his ass and you'd know it right off.
She's got that look about her. She doesn't put up with that kind of shit. I'll wager this whole First Lady thing sticks in her craw like a bone from an underdone chicken.
In fact I know she didn't want this from the beginning.
So no more of this phony tear shit. He's the real deal. This was as fucked up to him as it was to the rest of us. Even the republicans, even if they won't admit it 99% of the time.
Cha
(297,405 posts)know it from living through these last 5 year of observation.
But, yeah, Michelle is real, too.. and they don't do "phony'.. tears or otherwise. It was an especially cruel bogus insult.
sheshe2
(83,824 posts)I want to see the cards on the table...the full deck.
Not the rumors.
Cha
(297,405 posts)4 years to trust the President.. in that I know he's doing the very best he can to watch our backs.
As Yogi said.. "It's not over till it's Over.. And, it's far from over now.
I think some writers like to portray the President as a weak negotiator when it's the opposite.
sheshe2
(83,824 posts)CakeGrrl
(10,611 posts)I saw a Fox news-watching 'winger say the same thing on another blog about POTUS' reaction to Sandy Hook.
Funny how some people devolve so quickly and easily into the flipside of the same RW coin in their rush to insult this President.
And very telling.
Cha
(297,405 posts)it's the stupidest thing possible. Assholes.
CakeGrrl
AldoLeopold
(617 posts)I've looked into your posts in the past and nothing would indicate this sort of hatred for the President.
What's with the hostility?
Because Social Security is on the table?
I suppose I would be pretty scared, too. But we're kind of screwed financially. Whether it be by overspending on the past for whatever reason, constant wars, foreign aid. Lots of things.
Things change, and we all get screwed sometimes.
So, what's with the hostility? I actually want to know what you're pissed about. There's nothing about this man, that I can see, that would indicate that he's simply under the gun in a really bad situation.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)Doesn't seem appropriate here.
forestpath
(3,102 posts)turn around and stick it to other vulnerable groups?
It's a legitimate question that deserves an answer, instead of an attack.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Yeah, I see your point.
forestpath
(3,102 posts)HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)middle classes.
average SS benefit is currently about $1200.
yeah, what's not to like about reducing that further?
more people will die because of this than were killed in connecticut.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Just stop.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)grandchildren? do you know anything about SS survivors' benefits?
not to mention that chained cpi will apply to *all* social programs with an inflation calculation, not just SS.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)And it's a shame Obama is taking a Bushmaster to all of them. Isn't it?
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Some of them are the children of disabled parents. Those children receive SS benefits, nearly 4 million of them actually. So yes, a cut like that to a family dependent on SS for food, clothing and every other need a six year old child has, would most likely be the tipping point for some of this 4 million.
We should be INCREASING those benefits, it is cruel to even think of cutting the pittance that the most vulnerable people, the disabled, the children of the disabled, widows and the elderly receive which they cannot live on as it is. It is beyond cruel.
But worse, that money is a fund paid for by the people. It is NOT part of the Federal Budget so it is a theft of the people's pension fund which will have devastating effects on many of the most vulnerable people in this country, to pay the gambling debts which they had nothing to do with, of the wealthiest and most corrupt of Americans.
Anyone who supports this is not a Democrat. I am truly hoping it is not true because if it is, there will be one of the biggest backlashes against the party we depend on to protect that fund from the corrupt and greedy Republicans.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)there is lots of fawning today, even though he said nothing about gun control. He going to to use the goodwill garnered with the speech to cut benefits for the needy, knowing that many of his apologists will believe and repeat that last night's performance more than makes up for a budget deal that Reagan would have been proud of.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)forestpath
(3,102 posts)leftstreet
(36,109 posts)Tossing us all over the cliff
Cha
(297,405 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Cha
(297,405 posts)an answer to what he meant about "more phony tears". But, we ain't gettin' that.
Not, that I don't like hearing from you, jberryhill.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Lol
Cha
(297,405 posts)And, I'm sure we're not finished.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Teddy51 sleeps with the fishes.
Cha
(297,405 posts)letting me know, jberry. It was beyond the pale of disrespect.
Cha
(297,405 posts)he lost his privileges to post anymore on this thread.
I'm sure we'll be seeing more of him elsewhere but, alas, we may never know about the phony tears.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)But then, that bunch of racist, libertarian patriots have made an industry of Obama hatred since 2008 and they can't give up now. And we know where the 'Fire him,' line came from, straight from the GOP convention. Strange that neither of those care abour the vulnerable. In fact they demand Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid money be ripped from our pockets to pay their masters, but they will do anything they can get away with to demoralize Democrats.
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)teddy51
(3,491 posts)BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Cha
(297,405 posts)gets real Ugly.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)absurd premise to this OP
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)DJ13
(23,671 posts)We do all the sacrificing, the 1% continues to take all the share all the wealth they can get away with.
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
The need to have him disavow every rumor gives rumormongers undue power over his time.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)atlanta constitution...
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Welcome back, btw.
Sid
eridani
(51,907 posts)Blaukraut
(5,693 posts)I want to believe this is just a rumor, but it's beginning to look like the chained CPI really is a part of Obama's counter offer, albeit with "protection of the vulnerable". What really aggravates me is that he's moved his 250k line in the sand to 400k now. An Boehner is STILL not happy.
Boehner and his ilk have zero leverage, but once it was reported that he and Obama moved to one on one negotiations, I figured the President was going to give away the store again.
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/obama-makes-boehner-new-offer?ref=fpa
The White House proposal would also allow the payroll tax cut to expire, and call for $130 billion in savings from Social Security benefits by adjusting the program's inflation index. The offer would include protections for the most vulnerable recipients, the person said.
Boehner's office welcomed the offer as positive movement, yet still characterized it as an unbalanced proposal.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)or a leader. Maybe the wingers were right about him being a Manchurian candidate - let into office so that a bunch of Dems would get behind Republican proposals just because he proposed them.
If he gives in on this, it will disintegrate the party.
former-republican
(2,163 posts)ProSense
(116,464 posts)I'm in a heavily Democratic state, and a union here is about to endorse a friggin Republican: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022014860
And it's not like it hasn't happened before: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021310588
People do stupid things, and this is still only a rumor.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)It didn't dawn on me at the time, but I am now pretty sure that declaration was made to set us up for the "concessions" (SS cuts and backing off of the tax hikes) that we got this week. And in fact these aren't really concessions. Since the president is a Repuke, they're actually his true ideology. Didn't you ever wonder why he never fights back when attacked? Why he lied about supporting unions (comfortable shoes)? why the "negotiations" always end up be complete capitulations?
The speech Sunday night was brilliant - and more than a few DUers are willing to overlook his disastrous record because of it. Frankly, I think it's time he thought seriously about changing his party affiliation. If these proposals come to pass it will shred the party. At least if he registers as a (R) we can rebuild with some real Dems.
In Truth We Trust
(3,117 posts)jsr
(7,712 posts)Very disturbing development.
Jack Sprat
(2,500 posts)To placate the masters of money. It's not like earlier decades in America. The rich and wealthy don't want to participate in the general welfare anymore. They consider themselves privileged.
John2
(2,730 posts)Social Security, and Medicare are paid into. Most Baby Boomers are still working and paying in. The current Deficit belongs to Defense and other spending. You need to reduce those Drivers. That General that claims he wants to go into Africa, forget it! Get out of Afghanistan now! Reduce our troops in Germany, South Korea, and Japan. We have been in South Korea ever since the 1950s defending them. We have also been in Japan since World War II ended. Now he wants to keep a force in Afghanistan after 2014. He wants to go into Africa also. The only countries we haven't stayed in is South Vietnam and Iraq, and we are talking about Iran. This is the wasteful spending! This is maddening. The U.S. looks for the boogieman in every corner of the World! Our Constitution didn't ask for this crap and I doubt the founders ever imagined it either. Not only this, they are trying to pacify native populations on our backs!
Hekate
(90,745 posts)I no longer bother trying to follow the leaks and lies, (even though I sign the odd petition or email expressing my opinion). Between the GOP and the MSM, the production and transmission of false leaks and outright lies never ceases. I wait for the end result. So far President Obama has not been perfect, but he has been pretty darn good.
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)but DU runs on speculative outrage. It's in the life blood of many posters.
They're not happy unless they're running around with their hair on fire, screaming about something that hasn't happened.
Sid
ProSense
(116,464 posts)when the reports say that the President has made an offer, and Boehner is out rejecting it, creating the impression that it's real...
Obama 'cliff' offer is flawed but positive: Boehner aides
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/12/18/us-fiscal-offer-boehner-idUSBRE8BH04A20121218
...what do you think will happen next? Either the President made the offer or he didn't, but with Boehner rejecting it, someone in the WH is going to have to indicate whether or not the offer is real. The media will continue to report that Obama made an offer and Boehner rejected it.
Is this really where the negotiations stand?
LeftInTX
(25,437 posts)And Boehner rejected the offer. So, it will go lower. I'm bummed.
Overseas
(12,121 posts)from the Top 2% who have benefited so much
with painful cuts to the bottom 90% ?
The Republicans GENERATED the damn deficits with their wars and tax cuts! They should make up the trillions with tax increases at the top and a teeny weeny transaction tax on Wall Street!
Democrats should not have to make any more cuts until the GOP agrees to raise much more revenue-- at least the cost of the Iraq war and the years of top tax cuts.
on point
(2,506 posts)Union Scribe
(7,099 posts)Or is that another matter?
aandegoons
(473 posts)This coming from you is very helpful.
whistler162
(11,155 posts)going for you?
ananda
(28,868 posts)Don't sell out seniors and the poor!