Does the Democratic Party need to make any changes before the next election?

[kentuck]

David Hogg, a young leader in the DNC, has been raising money to challenge some Democrats in primaries before the next election. He has been criticized by James Carville and others for saying some members need to be primaried.

At the present time, the approval rating for the Democratic Party is somewhere around 29%, according to recent polls. That is not good. In fact, that is terrible. Something needs to be changed.

If we can get good, young candidates to run for Congress, then perhaps it is time for some of them to retire, or to be challenged in a primary, in my opinion. Just because someone is an incumbent does not mean they can never be challenged,

If the Democratic Party needs to change, which most agree that it does, isn't this a good place to start?

[GreenWave]

1. Smart phones are sneaky snaking blame the democrats links every day. So investigate that.

Friendly advice: Show the voters your anger and concern. Do not speak like we are at a funeral or telling beddy bye stories to kids.

[comradebillyboy]

2. I don't think the Dems need a purity purge led by Hogg.

When he and his friends start winning elections as Democrats he might gain some credibility. But right now he's just using his DNC post to fundraise for his own PAC.

[Ping Tung]

10. Or anyone else of whatever wing of the party.

[bucolic_frolic]

3. I wonder if we know enough about the opposition to make an accurate judgment

I'm referring to grass roots operations. Republican turnout for Trump was solid. I think it is a mix of Turning Point, familial ties, texting, business ties. The areas they live in are remarkably stable over generations. Same families own everything.

We're getting there. We are building grass roots now. We organize. Witness our success in elections where Trump is not on the ballot. I'm thinking money is their edge. Eloon and Donnie. Motivating money. Boots.

I'm not optimistic about David Hogg's endeavors. Youngsters running the asylum and all that baggage. Because it's partial I think it an attempt to make change, but it's also a test to see how it flies. We are in the worst of both worlds. Tearing down while striking a new path. Things could get worse before they get better.

[KPN]

5. Money is their edge, including the far-reaching influence of money above and beyond free and fair elections.

[ForgedCrank]

16. This is

a point I've tried to make repeatedly, but I only get called a heretic for my troubles.
Based on what I see and hear in media, and even what I read here, many have no idea what really drives the MAGA movement.
While calling them Nazi's, Hitler, and fascists might make one the life of the party, it's a seriously misguided picture of what we are up against. This position does nothing more than apply the needed heat for complete galvanization. All of us on both sides of politics need to hear the grievances of the opposition and take it seriously, rather than simply villainize one another in an attempt to relegate each other to the status of meaningless. We have some good ideas, and we need the opposition to listen and take it seriously. In addition, we need to recognize that the opposition also has valid issues and ideas. When we just call each other Nazi's, this can never happen because we never proceed past the dick-waving insult phase.
Want lower egg prices? Want lower energy prices? Want lower crime rates? Want less war? How can anyone possibly disagree with any of those goals? Of course where we differ is how to achieve such things. But we can never come to a consensus and actually move on these things until we get to the point where we are willing to accept that that some of their ideas may be sound, and we need for them to see that some of ours are quite sound as well. But for now, we are burning Teslas and deporting people to El Salvador, all while flipping each other off. This isn't the recipe for a path forward, and it never will be.

I am in the unfortunate position of being in the political minority, not only in my state, but locally. It's at least 60-70% Republican and MAGA around here. I don't see roving bands of racists hunting down Gay and Trans people as is often portrayed, and they take offense to being accused of such things. Have you seen the MAGA perception of what we are? It is equally absurd. There are small bits of truth to what we all say about each other, but the exaggeration and mythical caricatures are not doing us any favors. I see what MAGA say about us, and it's just as bad, and just as misguided and false. None of us can survive with an all or nothing approach to philosophy and governing.
So who will blink first and start working in the best interests of the nation as a whole? In my personal opinion, adopting more rabble-rousing in leadership is just a continuation of the disastrous loop we are in, probably even an escalation. Victories will not be secured, and objectives will not be met. And while I agree that aging career politicians should be pushed aside, I also believe that older generally means wiser. There is a common ground in all of these issues, we just need to stop fighting and find it... together.

[Cirsium]

17. Both sides?

No. Just no.

The two sides are not equivalent, and it is shocking that any Democrat would suggest that they are.

"While calling them Nazi's, Hitler, and fascists might make one the life of the party?" Uh, no, it is not about name calling. Call the phenomenon "MAGA" it still is a very dangerous threat with a ton of parallels to authoritarian regimes in Europe in the 30s. See? I made the point without using those words you don't like for some reason.

Now, if I ever yell "fire!" it will be because the building actually is on fire, not because I want to make myself the life of the party. If you prefer, I could yell "a lot of smoke and flames and heat that is burning stuff and could hurt or kill you!" No matter what I say, or what I call it, the building is still on fire.

Are we allowed to say "extralegal rendition!" or would that be too much dick waving? "Stop grabbing people off of the street and detaining them without probable cause or due process!" Can I say that? Or would that hurt their feelings and prevent us from finding common ground and moving forward?

"We need to recognize that the opposition also has valid issues and ideas?"

What MAGA "ideas" and "issues" do you think are good? What MAGA ideas do you think are not getting a fair hearing? What MAGA ideas do you think we should support?

"They are eating the cats and dogs of the people who live there." Valid issue?

"The children are going to school and being castrated to change their gender." Valid issue?

"DEI oppresses whites." Good idea?

"Global warming is a China hoax." Another good idea?

[ForgedCrank]

22. I find

it amusing when people hear things I never said. It screams of knee-jerking incomplete thought.
Conflation isn't very flattering

[Cirsium]

23. I quoted you

Last edited Sun Apr 20, 2025, 06:45 PM - Edit history (1)

Things you never said?

I find your reply amusing.

[ForgedCrank]

25. Ok, then

lets do this one line at a time since you "quoted me".
Where did I say that "the two sides are "equivalent" ?
Or were you imagining things that I never said?

[Cirsium]

28. "OK then" what?

Your entire post is about how both sides have good ideas, how both sides need to listen to each other, how both sides are engaging in dick waving contests, how both sides are insulting each other and calling each other Nazis.

[ForgedCrank]

30. Well, you

made the first line up, lets settle that one first.
So you made it up and I never said that or even insinuated it, correct? It's called conflating, exaggerating for effect. It's dishonest.
Shall we move on to the next point?

[Cirsium]

39. The first line?

The first line in my post:

"No. Just no."

Or do you mean the second line?

"The two sides are not equivalent, and it is shocking that any Democrat would suggest that they are."

What is wrong with that?

The third line is a direct quote from your post.



"Conflating, exaggerating for effect?" Pot meet kettle.

I had to go back and read this one again:

"We are burning Teslas and deporting people to El Salvador, all while flipping each other off."

smh

[mr715]

32. If one side...

If one side is pro life and goes to church every week, and the other side is pro-choice and wants common sense gun control...


You can still fix the highways.

[ForgedCrank]

35. My point

is that the other side is much less likely to agree with something as simple as fixing roads if we are running around calling each other Nazi's and Commies. At this point, if fixing roads were suggested by the current administration, a great many people would find fault in it and stand in defiance just for the sake of defiance. That is my issue, that is our mistake (and theirs). We need to knock it off with that stuff and move on.

[mr715]

40. Totally understood

And there is little incentive in bending over backwards to fix other people's problems when they keep punching you...

But I think that is the only path to win resoundingly. Charisma and pocket book issues to the level of pandering. A turkey in every pot.

[KPN]

4. I don't know enough about what specific Democrats would be primaried in Hogg's view. I do know AOC got her seat by

primarying a party stalwart. From where I sit, that looks like it was a big positive for the Democratic Party. Just saying ...

[Autumn]

6. Listening to Jefferies this morning on This Week with Snuffalufagus I say ...YES

[democrank]

7. Thank you for this thoughtful post, kentuck.

I’ve always thought about the Democratic Party in the context of my own family.What should I say, not say? What should I tolerate, not tolerate? My answer came when I thought about how clearly and how frequently I encouraged my two kids to not only think critically for themselves but to also question authority. Non-violence and situational respect was the key. My son and daughter agree on many, many political and cultural issues…..but they disagree on some important ones. I respect each of them for the way they reached their positions….and why.

Whether I agree or not, I’m always willing to listen to new ideas. I love taking in different points of view. There are a few issues I’ll never change my mind about, but show me a new way to attack a problem or consider a point of view and I’ll at least listen….within reason. No, I don’t want to hear from the dangerous, soulless Trump or his cultists.

David Hogg lived through unimaginable trauma as did many of his peers, their families and friends. I totally understand why he’s frustrated with the overall inaction on gun violence. I want to hear from him. I agree with him that the Democratic Party needs a shakeup. Why on earth should we be satisfied with a (approximately) 29% approval rating? Apparently quite a few people want change.

Old ways and new ways should share space in the Democratic Party .What we should not do is expect different results from doing the same faulty or failed thing over and over. New ideas are not trashing or bashing. They’re new ideas. Imagine a party (or world) without them.

[ibegurpard]

8. We need more David Hoggs and fewer James Carvilles

Watch his interview here.
Don't just read headlines and listen to people who think the status quo is just fine as our nation burns to the ground around us.
https://m.

&t=11s&pp=ygUSRGF2aWQgaG9nZyBzY3JpcHBz

[Nixie]

11. Clueless. Again -- the reasons the oligarchs are in power now is because of this kind of sabotage.

David's movement needs to address the actual reality on the ground -- badmouthing "our party" (his words) has hurt the "brand." When they figure out that they use people like him to do their dirty work, we'll all be better off.

[mr715]

34. I don't like the smirk.

That is all.

[Ping Tung]

9. As always the party needs to find candidates and platforms that

As always the party needs to find candidates and platforms that are not too Liberal for the moderates or too moderate for the progressives.

I don't belong to an organized political party, I'm a Democrat. Will Rogers

[Blue Full Moon]

12. End 3rd way, no more billionaire control. Hogg is right

Carville do nothing.

[gulliver]

13. Outreach to men. Focus on core issues. Center normies.

We need men and boys and need to discourage and marginalize the tiny few silly voices who muddle that message. They don't speak for Dems, and we need to make that clear. The gender gap is cancer.

Prioritize issues that help hundreds of millions. Zero political capital wasted on fringe issues that cost us votes and jeopardize our core issues. Focus. Let's get 65% of the vote, not 49-51% all the time.

Dems are normies. If you call yourself a Dem (or a good person in general) you should be polite, peace-loving, honest, responsible, courageous, philanthropic, reliable, etc. Normies are good, respected, and appreciated in the Dem party, and they are its true base. The Democratic Party needs to emphasize the importance of normality and common sense. Harris and Walz did a good job this last time, but we're going to have to repeat that message over and over. And over and over.

[Iggo]

14. Of course not. Losing is best.

[WarGamer]

15. Wholesale changes.

[dalton99a]

18. To win the next round, Democrats will need votes from former Trump voters and independents

not just registered Democrats

[leftstreet]

20. They need to get back the 6+mil who didn't vote Harris n/t

[Prairie_Seagull]

19. Much better messaging about who we are, duh

and the fact that we support shoring up SS for generations to come.

Make this kind of "good noise."

I could go on.

IMO

[Silent Type]

21. One thing, we need to stop running just against trump. We needed a Dem Project 2025. Now we need a Project 2026/2028.

But I ain't seeing it. Every criticism of trump is deserved, but it didn't help us in November.

[betsuni]

24. Goldilocks obsession with finding just the right young good candidates who will say and do just the right things

on every little issue that everyone, even the bad people, can agree on and the wicked fairy's spell lifted and Americans will finally finally be happy forever 'n' ever. The End

[Nixie]

44. Nailed it again, betsuni. Hogg is being handed $20 million that

he didn’t have to work for, and his idea is to use it against other Democrats. He should have to raise every penny on his own for that endeavor.
Their fantasies are their reality.

[Sympthsical]

26. Depends on the young person

I know people - particularly here - don't want to hear it, but the path forward is to move left on economics and moderate on social issues.

Unfortunately, "young" progressivism seems to be monopolized by people who think we're not to the left enough socially while only throwing a fig leaf in the direction of economics. Remember, the first time Bernie ran, the main attack against him was that he was somehow racist because he kept focusing on economic issues.

That impulse in the party needs to be shit-canned, and I don't see any signs that younger people who live on social media all day will manage it. I've said it before, I'll say it again - the activist tail is wagging the party dog, and that is incredibly problematic from an electoral perspective. American voters who should be voting for us for economic and greater policy reasons see a lot of our loonier social positions and bail. Because that's the face we wear - the activist face. And most Americans just don't identify with it.

And when they don't identify with you, they don't vote for you.

But until people are ready to have that conversation - and after 10 years of eroding power, they still think doubling down is the way forward - then we're going to have our problems.

And if you think we're in a mess now, wait til the 2030 census kicks in. It's going to be a total shitshow for us. We should be laying a hardcore economic policy base right now so we are prepared to combat what will be a more electorally difficult 2030s for us.

But nah. We just talk about the crap that alienates people all over the map. So Twitter and Bluesky feel self-satisfied and righteous.

On the bright side, Trump is so awful at the moment, I think 2026 is going to kind of win itself. I'm not saying be complacent, but I think the conversation we should be having about the party's future is going to be delayed due to how easy Trump may make things for us. People will mistake that for not having to change a thing. When it may very well mean just the opposite in the medium term. Then 2030 comes, and then we get wrecked because we didn't adjust.

I dunno. I just don't feel good about things right now. We're just in this place where people cannot, will not, and actively resist learning. The Bubble is more fortified than ever. And it's going to kill this country. It's gotten us to this point. Why shouldn't it keep going?

[Skittles]

27. given the results of the last election and their current approval rating

YES, SOMETHING NEEDS TO FUCKING CHANGE AND IT NEEDS TO START RIGHT FUCKING NOW

[True Dough]

36. I, for one, would like to see more fucking

in the campaign messaging, I mean.

Skittles for POTUS!!!

[Skittles]

37. I know my cussing is getting out of hand lately.......

but HOT DAMN DO I HAVE A GOOD EXCUSE OR WHAT

[True Dough]

38. Go for broke, Skittles!

Try to figure out some combinations of profanity never used before!

[EdmondDantes_]

29. We didn't win and have limited opportunity to retake the Senate

Yes we need to make some changes at least in our approach. In terms of values I think the public agrees with us on many things like abortion and minimum wage laws, so those are good. We can do a much better job in selling our economic record. The biggest area of disagreement is on immigration, but at least with non-republicans, I think what Trump is doing isn't popular either.

[mr715]

31. David Hogg needs to pump his breaks

We need a lot of change, but those changes are going to have to be targeted and surgical. They need to be strategic. They should probably be some flash ones, but those are not going to be "fire all incumbents!".

The flashy changes I think/worry the Democratic party are going to have to embrace are going to be ones that make us, core supporters, a little uncomfortable. We are going to have to become a less empathic and ethical party if we expect to win knife fights in the future.

I realize that there is an internal conflict in that claim, but I do not think Hogg's approach is the correct one, while I acknowledge we are going to need to have major structural change in what our messaging is and what our core values are.

[PATRICK]

41. The GOP wins on public resentment

because as a negative it is turned every which way against the default "sane" party looking to be rewarded for losing the nation to fraud and dictatorship and gaming issues and "winnable" government posts that remain unstolen as of yet. It is not much of a strategy or rallying cry, all things considered. Dean's 50 states total effort at the bottom was a simple strategy left behind with extreme prejudice. Not delivering for the worker base while branching out in social rights liberation that only put more class victims in the front lines- in reality undefended. Now we can't "afford" to fight all the vital issues or campaign against Hell. No money, still no media, no Roosevelt, still no revolt by the greedy even for their own sake. Blame is even more impotent.

Still, the party does perform for the people when they get beyond a ludicrous parity situation with the fascists. In hard times many many countries go for the bastard who feeds off resentment and hatred and economic fear- who rarely delivers anything except evil for all.

BTW if any single strategy was necessary it was to protect the vote. Also to advance everyone economically. Destroying Corporate Pravda and obscene wealth in the process would be nice. If a party has a glass jaw regarding PR and election fixing it will lose probably every time until it has no power except to fill the jails with the just.

[Seeking Serenity]

42. Yes. When? Twenty years ago.

Next?

[everyonematters]

43. We need to get out of our own world and start relating better to the 40% who are not registered as

Republicans or Democrats. I doubt that it can happen until we get a nominee for President. Then that person has to lead us the right way.