On Time

[H2O Man]

“ A hollow entity, not human.” – How a university classmate described Brian Kohberger


Decades ago, in the cook house at Onondaga, some of the Elders were discussing the future of the United States. Traditional people tend to understand “time” in a different manner than what has become the high-tech society. Longhouse traditionals appreciate Handsome Lake's 1798 visions of environmental degradation future results. We are there now.

At the large university my brother worked in until retiring, he liked having lunch with the “earth science” professors. They told him that even if all pollution stopped on a dime, the damage already done would cause severe problems at an increasing rate. Again, that is where we are at.

I remember one of the Clan Mothers saying that along with the environmental issues, society would see an increase of destructive people with no souls. Her description fits what we refer to as psychopaths/sociopaths. Or hollow entities, not fully human. Today we witness them in the current administration, in the corporate world, and other places and positions.

In 1973, Rubin Carter told me that “everything under the sun is as it should be, or it wouldn't be.” We discussed this more over the decades. He thought that all life on Earth existed solely for the Earth's purposes, with humanity as the highest level of consciousness. He noted that because today is a direct result of yesterday, that in order to change tomorrow for the better, is to consciously change ourselves today. Humans are the product of an amazing process of evolution, but that our only option for continuing to evolve was found in our consciousness – and that humans cannot evolve unconsciously.

The Elders told me to look to the newest generation, and see seven generations ahead, rising from the Earth. That a responsible society invests its time and energy in helping the helpless. A Jewish Mothers for Peace group hold that we must be responsible for the little children, orphaned by war, crying for their parents. I know that prophets such as Jesus and Gandhi spoke about children's speaking perfected truth. There is a way that goes beyond what society under hollow entities who are not fully human can achieve without the best efforts of you and I.

I remember Rubin, speaking on the steps of the Capital in DC on July 4, 1976, saying, “Miracles do happen. They just take a dog-gone lot of work.”

[LoisB]

1. Excellent. Thank you.

[H2O Man]

2. Thank you!

Much appreciated.

[CuriousSavage]

3. Glass of cheap whiskey in my hand

After a truly shitty day at work and a grief factor 8.2 commute home, I am soothed by your words even if they are not intended to be comforting. The current events and general apathy of the people around me suffocate me on a daily basis. I fully acknowledge that I am part of a privileged part of society… I do not know how the truly oppressed and marginalized people put 1 foot in front of the other. Thank you for sharing your experiences with and the wisdom of the Native Americans and elders. It helps me reset my perspective.

[H2O Man]

13. Thanks!

If you get a chance, you can find Bill Moyer's interview with Onondaga Faith Keeper Oren Lyons. He is 95 now, and still active. One of the wisest human beings of this era.

(I first encountered Oren when he trained the great Carmen Basilio's last fighter, Greg Sorrentino, more than 50 years ago. My brother-in-law fought Greg twice, so Oren and I worked opposite corners. Eventually I ended up meeting with Oren and Chief Waterman at Oren's cabin. My boys were cute little ones then, and Oren and Paul spoiled them. Now, when my son drags me to fight cards, we encounter Greg and Oren. My younger son was 4 when he first met Oren, so it was nice to see how surprised my boy had gotten. I think that public school children should be exposed to the Traditional way of thinking.)

[cachukis]

4. Spot on.

"Humans are the product of an amazing process of evolution, but that our only option for continuing to evolve was found in our consciousness – and that humans cannot evolve unconsciously."
We are at a crossroads.
With AI intermingling, and leadership dumbing down, will their be enough world wide intellect to overcome this onslaught?
Survival is adaptation, not control.
We don't have control.

[H2O Man]

14. Very interesting!

Thank you for this!

Humans have out-sourced knowledge to the mechanical. In many instances, this is great ...... for example, in the field of health care. It used to be somewhat of a shared goal among citizens, at least until January of 2025 on the national level of government, for the most part. Yet some who believe they are "more equal than others" would deny other social classes access to full care.

However, as others have noted in my lifetime, our knowledge has out-paced our conscious evolution that allows for a just society.

[Saoirse9]

5. Great essay as always

I have been reading posts from people who believe that this destruction of our country will lead to the breaking of the old ways of doing things, and that we would evolve into a fairer more unified and peaceful society. I like that idea a lot. I hope they are right.

I don't know why Brian Kohberger did what he did. All I can do is pray for the families of the people he killed.

I feel like we're in a very psychologically sick society now. All the lies and disinformation have destroyed so many minds. I wonder, how do we heal all these sick sick people?

[H2O Man]

16. Thank you!

I try to see the destruction as decay. As you know, I have a simple mind. So I think in terms of the large compost pile I have next to my garden ...... that after a period of decay, we will use that compost to grow a just garden for human beings.

[Saoirse9]

31. You mean like entropy?

The degradation of the matter and energy in the universe to an ultimate state of inert uniformity. Or a process of degradation or running down or a trend to disorder.

So right now a large part of society is experiencing entropy.

[H2O Man]

32. Kind of.

We must always keep in mind Lennon's favorite Harry Nilsson quote: "Everything is the exact opposite of what it really is." In that context, we might be more in the secondary context of the trend to disorder. At least "disorder" in the manner that a healthy mind defines our society today.

I saw a report about one of the people who has threatened the life of a juror on the Karen Read case. Similar threats have been made to other jurors and their children. Disordered minds cause humans to act out in disordered ways. And isn't that what we are now witnessing today in America? The Karen Read case has nothing to do with the threatening people's lives on a personal level. It is important in the context of our justice system, of course. But only a diseased mindset would find it an excuse to threaten people's lives on the internet.

In my mind, it is simply part of the cycle of all organic life on Earth -- from the smallest to the largest -- either grows or decays. Every empire on the planet has participated in this process. We are in the midst of it now. The only thing that can change that is people. Yet to do this, we must move to a higher level of consciousness. It is that, and only that, which can change the mechanical process we find ourselves in today. And that requires an understanding of the unconscious mind, which is the level that a jackass threatening jurors, or a president threatening society, inhabits.

[Saoirse9]

35. Great answer. Thank you!!! n/t

[Easterncedar]

6. I have shared this post

Thank you

[H2O Man]

17. Oh, that's nice.

Thank you.

[DENVERPOPS]

7. Good one

World's Top scientists have been saying for years that we are past the point of no return.......

[H2O Man]

20. Right!

My brother worked there for years. He has always been interested in this topic. I remember how much he supported Al Gore in 2000, when he had learned how bad it was then.

People know this, but largely continue to live similar life styles. It's not easy. I understand that people in cities can't grow their own produce at a rate to fit everyone's needs. This at times makes the deer season here uncomfortable, for "city hunters" are often as drunk as the local hunters. Yet I am okay with them attempting to harvest some deer, which tend to over-populate on cycles. And teenaged deer make a game of jumping out on the highway, damaging vehicles and increasing insurance rates.

However, I have had talks with an area buisiness man. He might buy a farm to grow produce for the rural poor, and the increasing number of homeless human beings in local towns and cities. He asked me if I knew anything about farming, which I do. I would hope that under the next Democratic president, there is a move to do more of this to make healthy food available to all. I think federal programs similar to the CCC and WPA are necessary.

[DENVERPOPS]

23. And another great

commentary WaterMan.........

[H2O Man]

25. At my age,

I couldn't do a lot of the hard farm work. But when I was young, working on farms was the best workout for boxing. Now, I was in good enough shape to beat most opponents ..... but I worked with guys in their mid-80's that could out-work my brothers and I. It didn't matter what part of farming. Even putting hay in with a fork (not baled) into the loft of a barn on a 90 degree day, and they never stopped. They had different lifestyles, healthier diets.

I know a number of my friends who, like myself, would be glad to volunteer in teaching the needed skills.

[Clouds Passing]

8. Choose the healing path.

[H2O Man]

21. Yes.

And Rubin liked to tell audiences that "yes" is much more positive than "no." Understanding this is an important part on that healing path.

[Hekate]

9. 🌺❤️🌺

[H2O Man]

22. Thank you!

We are all in this together, and I like the community/team here on DU very much. For I meet good people like you!

When people approach the level of consciousness that the true leaders inhabit, we can practice the Haudenosaunee's exercises called The Power of Ideas and The Power of the Good Mind. In doing this, we win in a victory that benefits everyone.

[patphil]

10. I've found that people who take great pains to make children cry have no connection to God.

Their souls are not grounded in love, They just wander about the earth, causing pain and suffering for their own self gratification.
They are essentially dark side entities who can never appreciate anything outside of themselves.
They think everything exists for themselves; never understanding the joy of living a life that embraces the wonder of human diversity.
What a terrible shame to be so clueless; so unknowing; so unrepentantly ignorant of the immensity of life.
And yet here we are with so many of these people on the earth today. I can only think that there is some sort of Karmic resolution about to befall humanity for it's unwillingness to learn the lessons of love.
As a species, we are bordering on failure to come to grips with this fundamental lack of understanding of love.
I'm concerned that we have run out of time to recognize what life is really all about.
It's about love.

[H2O Man]

24. Very interesting.

I used to be employed in two positions dealing with family violence. As I know you know -- for your post shows that you give this thought -- it tends to be found in generations: though certainly not all do, many victims of abuse become older teens and young adults who repeat the cycle.

Another issue is that we have an increasing number of adults with near-zero or zero parenting skills. They can't practice what they don't know, any more than one can teach what they don't know. I was the director, long ago when helping people was in style, of a county program. I hired mainly older women to work a few hours a week to help teach good parenting in homes that were "at risk of abuse" or had already been convicted. It wasn't perfect, but those ladies knew how to communicate with the parents they worked with. I don't believe any of them did it for the low pay.

They cared about people. They wanted everyone's children to live in a safe home. They had real talent. In most cases, there were significant improvements. But the (republican) county leaders cut the funding. Rather than saving money, of course, it became more expensive, with family court, lawyers, Social Services, mental health, and foster families for the increase in violence. There used to be an auto commercial about oil: "You can pay me now, or pay me later."

Some 40 years later, we have good people who are the types of citizens we need. We need to get as much control over government -- from the grass roots/local level, to DC, and institute positive change.

[patphil]

30. They prefer the sharp stick in the eye, rather than seeing people come through a hard time.

It's not about the money, we both know that. It's about the pain; their pain, and the pain they engender in others.
I can't understand it. It flies in the face of intelligent, reasoning thought. But here we are.
If something works,they want it killed...lack of love, and a whole lot of animosity towards those who are able to be loving people.
We see this again, and again, and again.

[Easterncedar]

11. O - kick and rec!

This is profoundly beautiful writing.

[H2O Man]

27. Thanks!

[cannabis_flower]

12. What a coincidence you brought up Rubin

I drive for Uber. I picked up a car full of young black women. I’m not the whitest person but I’m pretty white.

Usually I play Sirius XMs Classic Vinyl station 26. Or when someone speaks Spanish I play my Spanish playlist or anything else by request.

There was a moment of uncomfortableness when Bob Dylan sings:

And to the black folks he was just a crazy nigga
No one doubted that he pulled the trigger

There was a few audible gasps and an uncomfortable silence. So I tried to say something about it being about something that happened. And anyway. What do you want to listen to?


Not this! How about Beyoncé. I’m like sure.

[H2O Man]

28. It's a funny thing,

but there were a lot of people who found Rubin scary. A black ex-con with a bald head, Fu Manchu and goatee, a middleweight with larger biceps that also scary heavyweight champion Sonny Liston. Rubin would tell me about his friendship with Sonny. While Rubin hoped his image would sell tickets that earned his wages, Sonny wanted to put his past behind him, and be a champion everyone could be proud of.

Working with his defense, I got to see how law enforcement viewed him. A lot of that was a result of a Saturday Evening Post article, "A Fight Made in the Jungle." Rubin was challenging Joey Giardello for the title. A friend told the reporter some stories about Rubin (that the movie inaccurately attributes to Rubin being interviewed in a bar) that did not go over well with law enforcement. Sugar Ray Robinson called Carter the morning after it was published, to say it was a problem.

So it was the hostile ex-con versus a champion who's contract was owned by a known mobster with felony convictions. I never met Joey, but he was a teenaged hoodlum who became a good man. Many fighters -- including most top professionals -- had to do some buisiness with gangsters. Heck, my brothers and I did. Our two BCI Senior Investigator uncles warned us about them. Maybe that's why they treated us well.

[I_UndergroundPanther]

15. Wow

In 2000 I had a dream of a bottle of mixed oil and water the bottle was set down and the water and oil slowly becoming unmixed and as the water and oil settled and seperated it will become clearer the ones with no soul and the ones with a soul are and what the proportions of oil and water are.

What this actually means I dunno but the op sparked the memory of that dream. Thought I would share it.

[H2O Man]

29. Interesting.

In 1798, a Seneca man named Handsome Lake went into a coma. When he came to days later, he spoke of a vision. Two spirits brought him on a trip into the future. He was shown -- among other things -- that in the future, the cool, clean water would warm up and become oily.

[Martin Eden]

18. "everything under the sun is as it should be, or it wouldn't be"

The word "should" can be very subjective, because it implies judgment and/or opinion -- yet the 2nd half of Rubin's quote sounds like everything is preordained. This reminds me of Billy Pilgrim in Vonnegut's Slaughterhouse Five. He could visit any time in his life, but was powerless to change it.

And yet, "to change tomorrow for the better" requires a "conscious" decision in the "amazing process of human evolution." Which, when I really think about it, is as it should be or must be.

Perhaps wisdom can be found in what seems to be a contradiction but really isn't.

To a professor of earth science the written history of mankind is but a fleeting moment in the geologic record, yet an intense moment in one's life can feel like an eternity and be remembered in oral history passed from one generation to many that follow.

Both are true. It is up to each one of us to understand the broader context in our own conscious evolutionary path which, collectively, can chart a course for a better future.

Which brings us to the present, where we all live (except the occasional mystic or Billy Pilgrim).

[H2O Man]

33. Very good!

At the time Rubin wrote those words to me, he was in prison. Certainly, he did not think that was where he belonged for a crime he did not commit. And so I think it is best understood in that context. He was there because of mechanical, unconscious minds. To regain his freedom, Rubin had to reach a higher, conscious level. It was in prison that he found the fertile environment required for him to take that internal journey. And a person cannot evolve consciously by staying the same.

Time is a funny thing, as you note. We all experience it in a variety of different ways. And, at the same time, it is always "now." Always has been, always will be. But, being human, there are many things beyond our understanding (or fully understanding).

Thank you for your thoughful response! I will be thinking about it as I do my mechanical daily chores! Hopefully, I'll think of a way to continue this conversation. I like the direction you brought to it.

[spanone]

19. K&R

Hope is surely a rare commodity these days.

An atrocity a day.

[H2O Man]

34. "An atrocity a day."

Exactly! In large part, a purposeful effort to make good people feel overwhelmed, which is a step in the direction of feeling hopeless and helpless.

I remember a Clan Mother saying when things are moving too fast, to go into yourself to slow down and find firm ground. This can be an individual or group effort, with the majority of people opting for the small group. It is no coincidence that this concept is found in the older chapters of that Good Book.

It is there where we find hope, even in this terrible situation we find ourselves in.

[hay rick]

26. I will turn 80 later this month.

I have thought about our souls and salvation all my life- with great fear and longing when I was younger. As I have aged my outlook has changed from personal concern for my future to gratitude for what I have received and the unearned privilege of another day of human consciousness.

I was never able to imagine a meaningful salvation of a soul that lacked both memory of the past and a language to express it. I also accept that we are specks in the cosmos and much is beyond our ability to sense or comprehend.

I now think of the soul that men have or don't have as being a relationship with other living things, especially people, but also with all the things we deem as inanimate but experience through our senses. Our only immortality is our choices.

I believe modern society and technology has created a flood of people who are disconnected from each other and from any meaningful tradition. One of the miracles of modern science is an explosion of the number of people. The rapid increase in the number of people has not been offset by a corresponding increase in the efficiency of the use of natural resources consistent with maintaining the health of our environment. At the same time, the nature of work has changed as we become ever smaller parts in ever larger and more complex organizations.

We have evolved into a highly mobile society and most people are no longer rooted in a single community with family members and lifelong friends and neighbors. It is now common for people to be surrounded by strangers and live in a land that they did not explore as children and juveniles. In modern society, many of our friends and colleagues are virtual entities. We have not shaken hands in months, years, or in some cases, ever. This is not how we evolved or how our societies evolved, but here we are.

It feels like we are dispensable as individuals. I believe many people have a deep sense of being abused by their circumstances. We are learning that sociopaths thrive in this new environment. We have much to do.

[H2O Man]

36. Outstanding!

Thank you so much for this!

I am reminded of Emile Durkheim's description of modern society as a "disorganized dust of individuals." Fromm would later focus on this description in his classic "The Sane Society." The current culture has become out of touch with many of the things that gave individual life meaning in the group context. To quote Jim Morrison, "we are looking for something that's already found us."

Gandhi noted that a single drop in the ocean partakes in the greatness of its parent, yet dries up if it tries to become individual. I believe that.

I agree that many people have been abused by circumstance. Most of us can think of bad-to-horrible things that were parts of their life beyond their control. It is how we respond to these that matters. It is found in the sociological concept of locus of control. The far ends are internal or external, though the vast majority of people are somewhere in between. We can identify with the fact we cannot control anything but ourselves. A problem today is that too many people seek to identify as victims of circumstances and others.