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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums"We are in a State of COLLAPSE - This is WORSE than Recession!" - Jeffrey Sachs Warning
Renowned economist Jeffrey Sachs delivers a scathing critique of the current state of the U.S. political and economic system, warning that America is spiraling into chaos—and dragging the world with it. In this gripping and urgent talk, Sachs compares the U.S. economy to a reckless credit card spender and calls out leaders like Donald Trump for failing to understand the fundamentals of international trade.
He warns that if the world continues to normalize "craziness," there's no way out of the spiral. Sachs explains that the U.S. trade deficit isn't about cheating foreign countries, but rather a deep systemic problem of overspending and political incompetence. He sheds light on how the rest of the world must act responsibly—turning to the United Nations, World Trade Organization, and international cooperation to prevent a total collapse.
From economic mismanagement to geopolitical irresponsibility, Sachs paints a picture of a nation at the edge. If you're concerned about the future of democracy, global order, or the collapse of empires—this is a must-watch.
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Lovie777
(22,947 posts)what will be the new name for depression?
Old Crank
(7,045 posts)It is from the 70s where we had a stagnant economy, high inflation and high unemployment.
usedtobedemgurl
(2,046 posts)It has been around for a while and absolutely is not the same thing. Look up the term and find out about unemployment, inflation and stagflation.
SpankMe
(3,715 posts)Because I get depressed every time I hear the word, "Trump".
Johnny2X2X
(24,187 posts)You'd know that over and over I have warned people not to let politics interfere with their investing. The markets went way up under Trump his first term and people who hedged against risk missed out on massive gains big time. I've said it under Obama and Biden too, don't get caught up in politics when planning your retirement.
I am a free trade proponent, I think free trade is the only thing that consistently delivers for regular people and the only thing that can consistently get governments to change and countries to seek peace when conflict was on the table. For most of my life, you didn't have to twist the GOP's arm on this issue, they wanted free trade, they wanted the mutual benefit.
This tariff war is a disaster and is only going to get worse. And it's being amplified by 100 by the feckless nature of Trump who is doing everything on gut feels and without any relevant data. The US economy hasn't experienced a shock like this in my lifetime of 53 years. Not the oil shock of the 70s, not the Reagan bubbles that popped, not the Reagan inflation, not the dot.com bubble popping, and not the real estate bubble popping under Bush, and not even Covid because Covid was so temporary.
Businesses don't know what to do, they can't make plans, they can't hire, they can't expand, because there is so much risk they can't even predict how much anything will cost. Consumers are frightened, they are terrified of everything, of how much things will cost, of losing their jobs, and of civil unrest. Nations are forging trade deals without the US, every day we are being weakened. It's the perfect storm and we're just starting to see the downward spiral forming. Trump and the GOP must reverse course on trade or we're going to be in a recession that is deeper than anything we've seen since the 1930s.
We're in uncharted territory. Never before has an administration been this reckless.
Anecdotally, I have never seen as many businesses announce they are closing their doors in my part of Michigan. It's one after the other almost daily. Bars and restaurants, small factories, bigger factories, service companies, just closing, not just announcing layoffs, but announcing they are ceasing to exist.
Farmer-Rick
(12,643 posts)Delivers for regular people.
Ask the Irish during the potatoes famine how they liked "free" trade err Laissez-faire economics. It was a major cause of the 2008 crash remember the repeal of Glass–Steagall to allow more "free" trading in the stock market by US banks? They crashed the economy and got bailed out for it. What did regular people get?
"Free" traders don't realize that along with a lack of tariffs, comes deregulation with their "free" trade. Foreign cheap labor is allowed to compete with regular citizens in their own country's market. Markets the citizens developed and paid for. NAFTA and those other "free" trade agreements seem to be worthless now that Trump is doing retaliatory tariffs. Why didn't those "free" trade agreements prevent such obvious market manipulation?
As Ross Perot explained, that sucking sound was our manufacturing jobs being sucked into foreign cheap labor countries. Thank "free" trade agreements for that. How did that help regular people?
Not sure if you saw all those stores closing during the W administration in the 2008 crash. If what you are seeing now in Michigan is more than that, man we are in for a world of hurt.
Johnny2X2X
(24,187 posts)NAFTA was a net gain in jobs for the US. Trade didn't kill the middle class, domestic labor policy did. Greed did. The destruction of labor unions did more to kill the middle class than trade ever did. We have a country where productivity increased several fold, but wages were left stagnant and instead shareholders and CEOs got all the benefits. NAFTA was good in that it recognized that low skilled manufacturing jobs were becoming increasingly low wage, so we needed to export those jobs and retain the more highly skilled jobs while retraining the work force. The execution was poor in that we just let the owners take all the gains. But I'll say it today still, we do not want most manufacturing jobs to come back to the US, they are low skilled and low wage and people do not want to do them. We need high tech and highly skilled jobs, those that the Biden CHIPS Act brought back, those that clean energy development produces.
Free Trade doesn't mean abandoning our principles on labor and the environment, it means exerting more control of them.
Tariffs are idiotic when they're not based on any real data. It's simply a tax on businesses and consumers. It's going to cause a collapse.
And comparing what I am seeing to 2008. 2008 had more layoffs, but at the start I do not remember as many companies forgoing initial layoffs and just going right to closing their doors like we are seeing. It would be one thing if a company with 1200 workers said, we're laying off half our workforce in North America, but they aren't they're saying, we're closing our doors in North America by the end of the year. It's getting scary.
Farmer-Rick
(12,643 posts)I made good money. I was able to put money away to go to college.
I only worked there during the summer standing in on different jobs so permanent employees could go on vacation. In fact, my friends who worked at the Mall made significantly less money than I did.
Free Trade made the US into a service economy. We are a nation of sales clerks and waiters now.
I had friends who skipped college and went right into factory jobs. They owned their own homes and bought new cars while I was still a college kid trying to make ends meet.
Sorry but No. NAFTA was a wage lowering, union busting cheap labor deal for corporations. It even lowered the wages of Mexican workers in Mexico. It was all one big push to kill unions and obtain cheap labor.
If These "free" trade agreements were so great, why aren't corporations and countries filing complaints left and right. Those agreements' disputes settlement systems were designed especially for tariffs. What with the retaliatory tariffs pedo Trump is laying on there must be numerous violations to the agreements. Why aren't Mexico and Canada filing disputes one after another?
Every free trade agreement comes with deregulation. It has to by it's very nature. Otherwise countries can not sell their exports in markets outside their own country. There are banking laws that must be change in order for money to move to foreign entities quicker. There are local licensing and regulations that must be ended in order to allow foreign countries to build their factories. Their are citizen ownership policies that must be ended. There are dispute resolution systems that must be developed outside a country's own judicial system.
But you are probably right, those jobs are never coming back. I agree that instead of basic factory jobs like furniture, clothing, canning and cars, the US should focus on more high skilled manufacturing.
But none of that will be possible as long as pedo Trump is in control of the executive branch. I'm afraid it will got a lot worse before it gets better.
Thanks for the info on what you are seeing. I use to be very in the know about business in my local area but not so much since I retired. I did notice that Farmers Markets all have waiting lists anymore. It use to be difficult to get enough farmers to fill out a market but not so much anymore. I think it's folks trying to make a few bucks because they can't find other ways.
democratsruletheday
(1,879 posts)you forgot to mention the most important part. He's doing this on purpose. The orange fuck stick and his minions are crashing the economy so they can rule as oligarchs. No free elections, no Medicaid or Medicare, no social security, no support systems for Americans. This is all by design to bring us to our knees and we're starting to see it 'work' for them. And yet, in my area of West Michigan (north of Grand Rapids) there are still multiple sheeple with his signs in their front yard. They'll never know what hit them when the time comes. Fucking idiots.
Johnny2X2X
(24,187 posts)Is if this is a deep and long recession like I am starting to think it will be, the GOP has dismantled much of the social safety net, people are going to be panicked. And if they take over the BLS, much of the social safety net enhancements will never kick in because the recession and high unemployment will never be recognized. It's a perfect storm.
JCMach1
(29,198 posts)
wnylib
(25,956 posts)Corporate American did not like Biden's and then Harris' economic plans, but they chose to back a financial loser who has bankrupted several businesses and has been sued for his fraudulent businesses.
Really, how could they back Trump and why aren't they publicly opposing his economic mess now?
BaronChocula
(4,537 posts)Recessions/depressions have an upside for businesses including lower wage demand, better borrowing rates and so on. After the recovery under Obama, big biz sat on their money instead of hiring, claiming uncertainty over tax policy during a Democratic administration. They had the capital to afford that luxury. That's just by my recollection. In my wild imagination I thought they may have been conspiring to keep economic growth slow enough to get an anti-tax republican elected in 2012.
malaise
(295,961 posts)Worth viewing
orangecrush
(30,206 posts)Getting a pat on the head for wreaking havoc.
littlemissmartypants
(33,458 posts)It's all a ruse.
Pretending to stop a war for a Nobel. Actually, ludicrous.
One of the liabilities of psychopathy is the disordered mind convincing itself that bizarre ego driven aspirations are actually attainable.
Of course, that depends on the fools bestowing the accolades being psychopaths themselves.
As we've seen, some are drinking the kool-aid. They are the ones most likely to give Dictator Don a prize, along with the rich business men and the spineless members of the regime.
❤️
Characteristics of Psychopaths
1. Aggressive, callous, and cunning
2. Complete absence of conscience and empathy
3. Very adept at manipulating others
4. Willingness to engage in immoral, criminal conduct
5. Willingness to take what they want and do as they please, regardless of who is hurt or wronged
6. Deceptive ability to appear outwardly benevolent
7. Deceptive ability to behave in superficially charming ways to hide purely selfish motives
8. Willingness to use intimidation and violence to control others in order to satisfy their own needs
9. Willingness to intentionally violate the basic inherent human rights of others
10. Complete absence of any sense of guilt or remorse for the harm their actions have caused to others
11. Rationalization of their own immoral behavior
12. Will attempt to lay blame upon someone else for their own conduct
13. Denial, will deny their own wrongdoing outright
14. Utter contemptuousness toward the feelings and desires of their fellow beings
15. Pathological lying, will say anything without any concern for truth to advance their own hidden agendas
16. Ablity to feign [fake] normal human emotions and empathy
17. Distorted sense of the consequences of their actions
18. Total failure to accept any responsibility for their own socially irresponsible ways
19. Strong bellef that they will never be brought to justice for their criminal behavior
usedtobedemgurl
(2,046 posts)orangecrush
(30,206 posts)Kid Berwyn
(24,329 posts)Sachs spells out how Trump abuses the national security state to destroy Democracy.
dalton99a
(94,095 posts)
Mossfern
(4,715 posts)to my husuband.
I rarely do this.
Hornedfrog2000
(866 posts)He clearly hates trump, and explains quite well why he is an idiot. He would be good in a dem whitehouse.
progressoid
(53,168 posts)He's not a big fan of the Democratic leadership and vice versa.
delisen
(7,360 posts)Scolding Ukraine for irritating or annoying Russia or being stubbornly unwilling to get along with its bigger “neighbor” Russia is naive at best but promotes a policy of appeasement that has failed in the past.
Sachs sees certain aggregates; he sees economies, he sees nation-states but he does not see us. He does not seem to see us individuals who make up the 9 billion humans on our planet.
I think he regards us in the same way the British and the Roman empires regarded its citizens, as subjects of the empire, sort of owned.by their respective empires.
To Sachs, Trump is anti-war, Putin is pro-peace unless provoked, and Biden is pro-war. I think this is a misreading and is caused by Sachs believing that economics is more fundamental or foundational than society.
LisaM
(29,627 posts)He believes in austerity and the shock doctrine (for the masses) and as you say, has no understanding of - or perhaps empathy for - the personal misery either can cause.
markodochartaigh
(5,545 posts)Anytime someone calls out the US deficit or overspending without specifically saying that the deficit/overspending are caused by tax cuts for the extremely wealthy and wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and NOT by spending on our social safety net, then that person is immediately suspect.
Either the person is parroting reich-wing talking points with no real understanding or the person is trying to influence public opinion by misrepresenting the facts.
twodogsbarking
(18,751 posts)democratsruletheday
(1,879 posts)and most of us know that deep down. I'd be happy if it was just a recession. Headed to much worse territory than that.
LiberalArkie
(19,787 posts)Kind of like the "great depression" did not really bother the Rockefellers, Gettys, Vanderbilts and others. It was a buying opportunity.
twodogsbarking
(18,751 posts)Happy Hoosier
(9,531 posts)That's not a huge surprise.
One the best points of wealth (from a wealthy person's perspective) is insulation from financial distress. Wise qwealthy people have a mix of assets and can ride out (and even benefit from) economic hard times. It's why the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
I do think the economy is teetering on a structural precipice. The analysts are all over the place on how bad it could be. Some are talking the usual recession/bear market. Some are talking a long "lost decade." I hope it's not a lost decade. I plan to retire in 7 years.
progressoid
(53,168 posts)He looked at me with a sudden realization that there is no stopping them. And that electing Trump is hastening the transition of power.
Happy Hoosier
(9,531 posts)I think China's surge is fading. India has some structural issues that could blunt their growth. IF Asia takes over, it's likely to be more diffuse and less concentrated in one power.
I DO think US dominance in international trade is about over. Trump is taking us off the table.
hay rick
(9,593 posts)He praises China's "Confucian" system of a strong central government as a long-standing cultural tradition and suggests that autocracies are not all bad. The Chinese example does not indemnify the emergence of authoritarian takeovers of Western democracies. Eastern-style mandarins are not a reasonable analogue to the Western autocrats who have more in common with mob bosses.
Mr. Sachs blames the United States for blowing up Minsk II and for the war that followed. While there is surely some fault on all sides, I think Sach's position is way too kind to Russia.
SheltieLover
(80,379 posts)
Cosmocat
(15,418 posts)He looks like one of the few major figures in this country that actually knows what is going on.
The one area I would disagree, to an extent is that other countries caught up to and are over taking us.
While that is true, to me, it was more that we have chosen to diminish ourselves in a way that allowed that to occur. It was 100% self inflicted and primarily because we as a country chose to indulge right wing fuck wittery.
Rider - dems mostly are better on the big things, but also have been side kicks, either as willing go alongs or not fighting things hards enough.
Ex. to his point about electric cars and how China is way better positioned, well ... Right wing lunacy about BURNING COAL and everything they have done going back to Reagen tearing Jimmy Carter's solar panels off the White House.
Pompoy
(256 posts)From his attitude about China, Covid, Ukraine-Russia.
What's next, defending Trump on the Epstein issue?
AllaN01Bear
(29,458 posts)the carter years .
SunSeeker
(58,266 posts)He said "both parties" have "become the agents of tax cuts." No, Jeffrey Sachs, it's not both sides. Only one side, the Republicans, want tax cuts for the rich and continually push for it, with Democrats continually pushing back.
Bummer, he was doing so well, until then...
Justice matters.
(9,770 posts)Congress (as stated in the Constitution), and by "just" I mean one that returns a big chunk of it to the poorest taxpayers like it does in Canada.
Crunchy Frog
(28,275 posts)Envirogal
(316 posts)China deserves criticism AND we do need the US to seek alternatives because they openly steal our technology, make crap products with toxicity (very little regs), have massive human rights violations, polluted the oceans with plastic waste, toxic air pollution, and allowed American business to undercut even the thought of manufacturing here because of very unfair use of government funded industries (remember the GOP bellyaching over Obama’s funding of “Solyndra” solar panels that the Chinese cheap panels took out?). And they lie at every turn, fly spy balloons, buy our property and farms, send women here to have US babies (there are maternity homes set up for this and they go back when the baby is born), The list is long, yet Sachs looks the other way and says we are just jelly of their success.
I hate these myopic Chicago school minded economists that are so eager to look the other way over these very real harmful historical facts. China is an abusive friend to Big Business, and it is not in our best interests to sweep these concerns under the rug. Yet, the way Donvict operates has destroyed our standing in the world
So Sacha looks brilliant not like a Stockholm Synfrome Schill, yet he is.
Our strength WAS trust and reliability. That is now gone and Donvict has manger to make China now look like the reasonable regime. That is quite the accomplishment. China does have an advantage and that is they can make direct decisions and implement them immediately (turn on a dime) instead of having the stagnation of a messy, complex democratic process and the feet dragging of “conservatives” that are slow to recognize the need for change.
Renew Deal
(85,110 posts)Don't know if he's right or wrong, but he's heavily biased.