General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSome DU thread talk about purchasing pop-guns, peashooters, and cap-guns? (just what they are by comparison).
What exactly are you all gonna do with that shit? Armed conflict won’t get us anywhere at this point. If you believe that shit, I’m sorry, but you’re crazier than Meal Team, Six Pack Brigade
The answers lie somewhere in the tactics growing out of the daily battles playing out here on the streets and in the fields of California as well as other major cities and small towns across the rest of our nation. Organizational skills and the courage to take on these masked criminals armed with only our resolve and, of course, superior intellect are the keys to a stronger democracy than ever. We must think and act creatively while our numbers approach ever closer to critical mass.
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ret5hd
(22,124 posts)jade-helm cracker jacks that imagined they could take on the u.s. military.
intelligence, wits, creativity will win before a 9mm in the face of overwhelming police powers.
There is a reason that Afghanistan is called "The place where empires come to die"...They literally were barefooted nomads when the Soviet Union invaded them. A few 100 year old rifles and some Stinger missiles from the US, and the Soviets had their asses handed to them.
The VietCong kicked the United States' ass wearing sandals that were made out of old tires, hand-me-down junky chinese rifles and black pajamas.
Don't ever think just superior firepower wins wars.
Oeditpus Rex
(43,094 posts)fit in the analogy?
Also, I'm pretty sure the North Vietnamese Army, aided by Russia, had a little something to do with the U.S. getting its "ass kicked" than just the VC.
Stop trying to convince people who don't want guns that they should get them.
TnDem
(1,390 posts)Vietnam was lost materially by China much more "Russia", (or actually the Soviet Union).
The point is that vastly superior firepower is always the tired analogy people that don't know any better like to argue with...."buh, they got tanks and planes...blub, blub"..
The fact is the massive standing armies have lost over the course of millenia by small factions that had tiny arsenals in comparison.
The NVA army had no air force to speak of, SAM missiles from China, and a whole lot of semi-auto Chinese SKS 7.62x39's, a few AK's and thousands of Model 53 bolt actions in the 1891 caliber of 7.62x54...
The US had everything at its disposal and still couldn't win that war in a decade fighting a ground war like the Vietnamese fought...the same thing happened to the Soviets in Afghanistan and then the US in Afghanistan..
Oeditpus Rex
(43,094 posts)Who are you? What previous points have you made that I've "missed"?
TnDem
(1,390 posts)And I always counter with two things:
1) Don't argue a point you don't fully understand
3) The gun issue is not cut and dried across the Democratic board. There are many many Democrats that do not agree with the hoplophobes that permeate some of these threads. This is a massive turn off to rural Democrats.
I know because I am one...
Oeditpus Rex
(43,094 posts)And I haven't discussed firearns "several other tines "
Have a nice whatever.
TnDem
(1,390 posts)
RandomNumbers
(19,040 posts)Compare and contrast to result of non-Jewish Palestinians use of violence in attempt to improve conditions in Gaza and the West Bank.
TnDem
(1,390 posts)No one mentioned the colonial UK or Gaza or the Palestinians, nor do they have anything to do with this thread
RandomNumbers
(19,040 posts)(in contrast to organized non-violent resistance)
does seem germane to this thread.
Sorry if you don't see it that way. Have a good day.
gay texan
(3,147 posts)You'll travel armed, trust me.
I'd love to move, but i have elderly parents to take care of.
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)gay texan
(3,147 posts)I would like to keep it that way.
FirstLight
(15,757 posts)As a single woman living alone in the woods, I should have had a gun a long time ago.
With all these assholes that are pretending to be government agents, it's probably in our best interest to be prepared for somebody trying to bust into our house should things go South on a mass level.
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)Like what happened at Ruby Ridge.
If I was a baddy and wanted to take someone out, I wouldn’t risk a direct confrontation. I’d study their routines and behavior first for some time and use that info to come up with a plan to ambush them
FirstLight
(15,757 posts)If somebody's going to snipe me through my windows then I'm over it and I'm done LOL
EX500rider
(12,132 posts)
indusurb
(295 posts)And when you've got an armed MAGAT knocking down your door so he can kill "another damn liberal", no matter how much resolve and intellect you have, you're going to want a good gun in your hand.
Look, at this rate we're heading for one of two scenarios. First is a complete and hostile takeover by the fascists à la Nazi Germany, where neighbor turns on neighbor, violently. In this case there is also going to need to be an armed resistance, much like the White Rose was. Second scenario is a civil war. In this instance it won't be like the first one on the Eastern front with set piece battles and civilians who, for the most part kept out of the line of fire. No, it's going to be much more like how Missouri experienced the Civil War, lawless raiders, neighbor against neighbor, and people using the cover of war to settle old scores or simply using it as a license to rape, pillage and plunder.
I've owned guns, and been around them all of my life. I don't hunt, I target shoot at times just to keep in practice. I don't believe in violence, and don't go out armed. I do however believe in being prepared, and have foreseen the ultimate outcome of the road we're on decades ago. We can continue to use non-violent methods to try and change the course we're on, I still do that myself. But sadly, ultimately that is going to fail, and when it does, when the proverbial wolf is at the door, yes, you're going to want a gun in your hand. It maybe an utterly futile gesture, but I'd rather go down swinging than to go down without a fight.
Magoo48
(6,687 posts)Owning firearms and using them to protect oneself and one’s family are not my concern and wasn’t my point. Rushing out to acquire firearms as an initial response to the looming presence of fascism is perhaps understandable if one acquires the proper training and uses common sense.
My point was that creative nonviolent response is growing and it’s progressing. I believe that we are on the right track, although too many people are still trying to decide whether they will sacrifice a few comforts to be inconvenienced enough to protect their freedoms. If we now begin throwing spit wads at the battleship the entire nature of our resistance will change immediately, and we will lose whatever progress has accrued to this point.
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)Who studies your routine and plans to ambush you while you are outside of your home?
hlthe2b
(112,609 posts)I can't imagine buying any of that. And guns at all? Limited utility if a MAGA force under the official auspices of Trump et al comes for you... Want to fight off an unidentified masked assailant who grabs you or follows you home while refusing to identify themselves? Pepper (or bear spray) and call 911.
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)Getting a gun and going to the shooting range once in awhile may be adequate for training for the sport if target shooting but is woefully inadequate for self defense
If you buy a tool, (any tool), you need to be very familiar with it and comfortable using it.
Who buys a chain saw and then just fires it up without knowing how to tighten the chain , sharpen the blade, mix the gas/oil mixture, etc.?
CentralMass
(16,835 posts)I guess any natural skill level with a firearm might vary between individuals but even police with extensive firearms training and practice lose accuracy under high stress situations. "Stress-induced physiological responses interfere with the fine motor control, visual processing, and mental clarity required for accurate shooting"
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)In a stressful situation, some people experience tunnel vision. The only thing they see is the threat. So I very much doubt I’ll see the sights of my gun when confronting a bad guy who wants to do me great harm.
I also practiced breaking tunnel vision by looking to the left and then to the right after firing.
LeftInTX
(34,013 posts)One day there were a bunch of baby rats in our pyracantha bush which was next to the garage. I started shooting at them and hubby said, "You're making dents in the siding". That was the end of the bee-bee gun.
PragmaticLiberal
(930 posts)Arm ourselves AND act/think creatively.
Hotler
(13,717 posts)Kaleva
(40,116 posts)
KentuckyWoman
(7,365 posts)Yes, it sounds like big talk, especially since most around here are old white ladies. Not likely they'll bother with us any time soon. But I have a history of getting in the middle of people being shitty and know me well enough that I know I'll do it again without thinking twice. If one of those gestapo wannabes shows up around here, he won't get a warning shot. And if I'm out and see something, you can bet someone will be posting a clip of me getting all kinds of mouthy with those idiots.
frogstar0
(211 posts)Erica Chenoweth discovers it is more successful in effecting change than violent campaigns
CentralMass
(16,835 posts)With the Mango Malefactors mask armed goons roaming the the country in increasing numbers I can see why some might.
Melon
(981 posts)A gun is a tool. If you have access to any, I don’t know why you would not familiarize yourself with said tool.
I grew up hunting. My daughter said she will never harm an animal, which I think is great, but she needs to know how to shoot. There are guns in my house in at least half her friends homes so I see no reason why she is not familiar with their operation.
I believe in being accountable to my own and families defense. I would be running after someone breaking into my home with a bat nor be reliant on the government like in hurricane Katrina.
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)What constitutes your home invasion drill?
Mine varied depending on the time of day and if the grandkids were over
Melon
(981 posts)I believe she needs to be familiar enough with a gun to use one in a drop dead situation and to know enough that they aren’t a toy if she finds one. She’s made her decision that she’s not comfortable with firearms enough to use them in that role. But she needs to be familiar with their use.
Kaleva
(40,116 posts)