So I guess there is some survey out about women who voted for Kamala

[senseandsensibility]

ranking having children and getting married at the bottom of their list of priorities and men who voted for trump ranking those at the top of their priorities. I happened to see coverage of this today by Katy Tur, Tim Miller, and another panelist whose name escapes me but he is male.

The male guests held forth about this topic for a while, seeming uncomfortable. Tim Miller, however, did revert to his R roots and say that it was a shame that women didn't want to have children as much as men.

Finally Tur said "Can I weigh in as a woman?" Both men seemed relieved. She did okay. She tried to say that women should value BOTH things and that it is a sign of trouble in our culture that men and women are not connecting anymore in a real way.

I would have appreciated her opinion more if she had said that women feel ambivalent about having kids because most of the responsibility falls to them for raising the child and it is extremely expensive in this day and age. Wonder if anyone else saw this discussion.

[JustAnotherGen]

1. I didn't

But it's a financial and health risk to have children these days.

If I'm in GA or FL I'd get my tubes tied.

[Totally Tunsie]

15. Texas too.

[JustAnotherGen]

18. If my

Salpingectomy that turned into an abortion AND salpingectomy in NJ in 2015 happened in Texas today -

I'd be dead.

[Dulcinea]

2. I'm a woman who voted for Kamala.

I'm past reproductive age, but I will continue to fight for reproductive rights for all women. My daughters are 23 & 21, & they have fewer rights than I did at their age. That will never cease to make me very angry.

[EdmondDantes_]

3. I didn't, but I agree with your take on why more women aren't interested in kids

It amazes me how many guys are effectively oblivious to women's perspectives. The red pill manosphere has done a lot of damage in trying to roll things back.

[senseandsensibility]

4. Yes, to me it is obvious that women

don't see most men as willing to be full time parenting partners. And instead of getting better, it seems to be getting worse.

[maxsolomon]

5. Is it actually getting worse?

I'd say there are plenty of men willing to be "full time parenting partners", and many more than there were decades ago, but not many of them are Trump voters as well.

Trump voters are going to be more tied to expectations of traditional gendered parenting roles.

[senseandsensibility]

8. I agree that there is something strange about comparing trump voting

men to Harris voting women. I mean, by definition their views on most things are not going to be similar. I wonder what the results would be if it were Harris voting men vs. Harris voting women. Would the same gender differences result?

[JustAnotherGen]

19. Ahh Harris voting men

And Trump voting women..

That would be interesting.

[Tree Lady]

7. Yes either men still don't help

Or they end up doing most of it with a woman who makes money and treats them like husbands in the 50's where the men have to do it all.

It took me more than one marriage to find a partner I share responsibilities without attitude about it.

But I watch my grand daughter who is the working one treat her husband badly, spending lots of time alone on weekends having fun while he is with toddlers all week and weekend. He went from being a super mellow guy in shape to overweight and depressed looking.

I told my daughter to talk with her as I am not that close to her.

People take advantage of each other and it can go both ways. And this country is doing little to foster any type of empathy and caring for others. A very selfish self centered society.

[Raven123]

6. When men can biologically become pregnant, experience childbirth and bear

the burden of child rearing, acknowledging the latter may indeed be shared though not predictably, we can have a conversation.

[Bettie]

9. Here's the thing

most women have, from childhood, seen dysfunctional marriages.

They have seen that what usually happens is that when children come in, Dad is Mr. Happy Fun time and Mom is the one who does all the day to day stuff.

They've seen ugly divorces and domestic violence, and many women have been sexually assaulted as well.

Why would that make women want to marry? Why would it make them want to have children?

Some women want kids. Some don't.

People who don't want kids shouldn't have them, its not fair to them or the kids.

People who do want kids should do that, but with the awareness that being a parent is brutally hard sometimes, especially in our society where there isn't a real safety net if things go wrong.

I know a LOT of right wing families.

Almost all of them have dads who come to sportsball practice and talk about "babysitting" sometimes. They make jokes about "my wife's kid(s)". Their lives are not impacted a lot by kids, meanwhile, their wives usually work a full-time job, take care of 100% of the household chores, and deal with all of the kid things as well as the sexual expectations of their husbands.

Gee Maga men, wonder why women aren't all that interested in you.

I've been married to my DH for 36 (almost 37) years. We have three boys, 23, 22, and 17 (today!). When the oldest was in first grade, the teacher was talking about household chores and they asked questions:

Who does the cooking? Mom

Who does the cleaning? Mom

Who takes care of the kids? Mom

Well, my kid's answers were: Both parents for the first three.

Then they asked: Who does the dusting? Everyone said mom, except my beloved child who said "What's dusting?".

Long winded way of saying WHY would anyone want to marry a right wing man who thinks he's a king?

[senseandsensibility]

10. Thanks for that reply and insight

and Happy Birthday to your youngest!

[Hekate]

11. Can I weigh in as a woman? MEN DON'T "HAVE" CHILDREN. They may want to be parents...

That’s nice — in fact, it’s ideal, if they can respect the other parent and can support a family.

But parenting for them will never mean risking their own lives to achieve it. Pregnancy isn’t merely uncomfortable — it can be life-threatening. And state after state is making absolutely sure of that.

I speak as a woman who voted for both Kamala and Hillary. I had two children — on purpose. Now I’m a grandma. That whole 1960s motto of “having it all” is really a bad joke and always has been, imho. OF COURSE WE’RE AMBIVALENT. Holy Mother.

[surrealAmerican]

12. I think the survey was specifically given to gen-z.

Their opinions may well change as they get older. I doubt that prior generations of women were very eager to have children when they were working entry-level jobs in a rough economy either.

You're right though, there are plenty of other reasons young women (especially those who are not religious fanatics) might want to avoid having children.

[senseandsensibility]

13. Thanks for pointing that out

The ages of the respondents is very important. Looks like the young are very polarized on this issue, but I still wonder what the results would have been if they compared GenZ male Harris voters and GenZ female Harris voters.

[Bayard]

14. I still have my Childless Cat Lady tshirt

You either want to have kids, or you don't. The problem comes when a woman doesn't want kids, but is forced to have them. Plenty of women want kids, but can't have them.

I decided not to have kids soon after getting married the first time. My husband was definitely not daddy material, and I don't have great genetics.

[Maru Kitteh]

16. I doubt she gaver her own opinions much voice. I think she was stating

the obvious, or what should be considered absolutely obvious and entirely neutral from a professional, journalistic perspective.

She’s essentially said:
1. Women should be valued for roles they choose in families and the work they do there. Women should also be valued for the roles they choose and the work they do as members of human societies.
2. We are seeing an ever-widening gap between the sexes in this country, and it is at the very least, less than ideal.

I think she was just introducing basic, ground-level facts in a conversation that was entirely lacking just that. It sounds like the conversation was, “Should women work OR should they have babies?” There is (almost) no such thing as a woman who doesn’t work, there is only paid and unpaid work.

The honest conversation would center around what really has the GOP males so upset. Loss of supremacy of the white male.

[mzmolly]

17. Women probably prefer a non-fascist state

before procreating.

[BootinUp]

20. Interesting thread. SWM divorced with humble

Opinion. These things depend more on actual existing relationships than what someone thinks they want. I think.