It is peculiar that the shooter escaped.

[drray23]

Usually, they shoot themselves or get caught quickly. This person shot at Kirk from hundreds of yards away and then escaped. This strongly suggests training and a premeditated act. This was carried out like a covert operation.

[FarPoint]

1. Just a thought.....

This may not be the last one for this gunman....

[brush]

39. A trained pro, who unlike the trump would be assassin IMO, had admin backing...

Last edited Wed Sep 10, 2025, 10:37 PM - Edit history (1)

green light and getaway assistance.

They'll use him/her again. Seems there was much dislike among magats towards Kirk. Is it because he ran against trump from the right?


;

[Irish_Dem]

2. Yes professional training.

One perfect shot from a long distance.

Clean get away with no leads.

So far shooter has made no mistakes.

[malaise]

5. and an overdose of confusing statements

and rubbish about two different persons detained and released

[Irish_Dem]

10. The shooter also had some good luck because of the incompetence?

Or was some of the confusion part of his plan?

[malaise]

11. His plan theirs

or both?

[Irish_Dem]

20. Very good point.

[bdamomma]

141. You know

I wouldn't put this past for this regime to do. Kirk the sacrificial lamb??? or am I just paranoid. Too change the narrative from Epstein to Kirk ( a worthless POS).

[Prairie Gates]

26. The arrest of the person at the scene for obstruction was very stupid

Everyone sees a guy in handcuffs and relaxes. Meanwhile Trigger sidles out of UVU and Provo and may be halfway to Reno by now.

[Irish_Dem]

43. Yes. Police should have been interviewing all witnesses asap.

While events are fresh in their minds and before they disappear.

It is critical to get witness statements right away.
And other evidence at the crime scene.

A professional could be out of the country by now.

It was a remarkable shot and the shooter was calm, focused, and confident.
Perfect shot and clean get away.

Right now the FBI should be reviewing any and all video of the event.
Any clue could be helpful.

[travelingthrulife]

127. Too bad Trump didn't hire him for his fake assassination attempt..

[taxi]

138. It is possible that both events were similarly choreographed.

Many people are discussing the fatal shot from the perspective of it being too high for a torso shot and too low for a head shot, and I agree. If the shooter was looking to hit the trapezoid muscles, the muscles that go down to the shoulders from the neck, then it would be like nicking an ear. The shot would be the correct height and a near miss would place a deadly shot in the artery versus a flesh wound. But that's just my thinking.

[AZJonnie]

106. Or Halfway to Moscow (nt)

[Eliot Rosewater]

41. Doesn't help that the FBI director and Kirk have identical ideology

Although the people who would benefit from this the most would be people like the piece of shit who wants to send the military into every area where Democrats vote, what better reason than lots of shootings to do exactly that.

[malaise]

119. Which is hilarious given the FBI director's ethnicity

These are sick people

[colorado_ufo]

84. Perfect setup, with him on a raised platform alone.

No one very close to him, a lot less chance of anyone being collateral damage. No bulletproof screens around him. I don't think anyone was behind him. No trees or other obstacles.

[Irish_Dem]

116. The shooter must have known this in advance?

To make such a perfect shot on the first try means he had scoped it out before perhaps?

[colorado_ufo]

142. One more thing . . .

He wasn't behind a lectern; he wasn't walking back and forth on the stage/platform with a portable mic; he was SEATED IN A CHAIR. Motionless. Still target.

Sitting duck.

[sboatcar]

96. Looks like he had at least one person running cover for him

The guy who was initially arrested and then charged with obstruction distracted the police while the shooter made his getaway

[Jack Valentino]

98. Seems like maybe just an innocent witness to me

[sboatcar]

101. The obstruction of justice charge after the interview and all that though

that's what struck me as odd

[Irish_Dem]

115. Do you know the details of the obstruction?

If another person is part of the crime it makes it more likely the shooter will be caught.
Once one other person knows your secret, it is no longer a secret.
The person running cover for him could flip.

But interesting plan if this is the case.
Have another person running cover for you as you escape.

[sboatcar]

122. I don't know

But it sure seems like a professional job to me, 200 yards away, got away clean, one shot, one kill.....something reeks.

[Irish_Dem]

123. Yes the shooter had some training.

And he stayed calm and cool as cucumber during the kill. One shot right on the money spot.

[Bobstandard]

108. Have you any idea how many Utah sportsmen could have made that shot?

Any one of a huge number of Utah hunters could have made that shot. Opening day of deer season is a secular holiday in Utah. Businesses close. Uncountable households harbor one or more super accurate, overpowered deer rifles. It needn’t be a professional.

[Irish_Dem]

114. The public assassination of a human being is different from shooting a deer.

Quite different.

It requires a different skill set and planning.

To make that shot requires training and practice.
Do you realize how many people in Utah CANNOT make that shot?

How many are capable of remaining calm, cool, professional while they kill someone?
A federal capital offense resulting in life in prison or the death penalty.

Then pulling off the escape without a hitch.
Clean quick getaway.

And did it all with producing no leads, no witnesses.

This is a man with nerves of steel. Some sort of gun training.
Remains calm, focused, skillful even under pressure.
Perhaps military training.

Some of the skill set is not necessary when killing a deer.

[Johnny2X2X]

125. And 200 yards is still a very long shot

I bet the number of hunters in America who have actually made a 200 yard shot on a deer or elk is exceedingly small. I'm sure there are many that will say they know someone who made a 200 yard shot, but if you actually went to the location of their shot and stepped it off it'd be 100 or 120 at the most.

And then you've got wind to deal with.

But I agree with your points about having the nerve to do it and the skill to have a pan to escape at least for now. If this person is still at large a month from now, they're almost for sure funded by a government or an ex spy of some sort who knows all the ins and outs of the FBI's tools for tracking them.

I've been to the range, I've shot targets in the woods. People aren't even practicing 200 yard shots from what I have seen.

[Irish_Dem]

132. Good points. I assume sniper had a wind meter.

It is going to be hard to guess wind speed and direction in such an accurate way
especially at that distance. He had to only fire once to get the money shot.
He is either very lucky or had considerable skill, experience and equipment.

Yes of course. How many Americans have experience accurately killing human beings
at 200 years?

Yes we will know more as time goes by. If this man is at large one month from now with
no clues, we are looking at a professional. At the very least military training.

[Johnny2X2X]

133. Sounds like they may have found the gun

Left in the woods with prints on it.

That kind of makes it seem amateur, but we will see, could be a decoy.

[Irish_Dem]

135. Yes, bad mistake if true. An amateur who got lucky.

So someone with training but by no means a professional hit man.
Unless the prints belong to someone else.

[Bobstandard]

130. All very true, thankfully. nt

[Cosmocat]

124. That seems to be the consensus

of some of the actual tactical experts who have commented on it.

That said:

I still tend to believe that is it was someone with some military background because it was so well executed as a live kill and the shooter got out clean at this point. Hard to see how an "average" citizen pulled this off.

At the same time, if it was an "average" citizen, I have a hard time seeing how it is someone "liberal" cause this takes someone who is a gun nut and thinks in the ways needed to plan this out and again make an escape. Just almost seems to have to be a right winger to have this mindset and gun expertise.

[Blues Heron]

126. Deer hunters- lol! Come on man, this was no weekend warrior.

[SheltieLover]

4. Read this

Who had motive? 🤔

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=20624932

[Just_Vote_Dem]

6. Very interesting

Maybe a message to other MAGAs not to turn on the boss?

[SheltieLover]

16. Could be

[strongermessage]

36. My thoughts exactly.

[yellow dahlia]

13. One of my thoughts, as well.

[ancianita]

46. And read this along with it...

what could be the motive of Homeland's layers of trumpcult help...

https://archive.ph/wchem

[SheltieLover]

49. Ty!

[SheltieLover]

50. Holy hell!

[Delphinus]

51. My words exactly!

[SheltieLover]

57. Scary!

[ancianita]

54. Scary to contemplate, but that's the kind of stuff putin type dictators do.

I'd post it separately but we don't need any more scary news to deal with than we have right now.

[SheltieLover]

56. Post it pls!

[ancianita]

59. Okay... I put it over in GD if you want a look...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100220626758

[SheltieLover]

60. Ty!

Going to k&r!

[Danmel]

58. Nick LaLota is my congressman

A complete maga sycophant.

[SheltieLover]

63. I'm sorry

I'm stuck with blackburn, so I empathize.

[Danmel]

77. It's mortifying

[niyad]

68. JFC

[PatSeg]

62. Sounds like it could be a paid

professional assassin. Anything to do with Epstein and his clients tends to be dangerous.

[SheltieLover]

65. Sure does!

Cripes 200 yards...

With a clean get away screams pro to me.

EPSTEIN, MAXWELL, & MALARIA

[ancianita]

71. "a clean get away screams pro to me" -- absolutely!

[SheltieLover]

72. Prob already on his way back to russia

[ancianita]

74. LOL ... or FLORIDA!

[SheltieLover]

75. Is there a difference?

[ancianita]

78. I hope so. I'm exiled here.

[SheltieLover]

79. I'm sorry

I'm stuck in the red hellhole TN, so I empathize.

[ancianita]

83. Parters in suffering through the historical sickness of the South.

I'm just glad winter's coming, and still keeping my eye on NOAA. So far so good.

[SheltieLover]

137. Stay safe!

[lastlib]

76. 200 yards isn't all that difficult with a good rifle and scope....

Lots of hunters are capable of it. Sure, there was a fair amount of skill involved, and a bit of luck to get a fatal shot when he missed the head. Trump's assassin in PA wasn't much closer, IIRC. I couldn't do it myself, I'm sure, but I know people out here who could.

[sarisataka]

90. Correct

A scope would not even be needed at that range. If a person had only iron sights and aimed for the head but did not allow for drop, they would hit the neck.

[PatSeg]

136. Yeah and with just ONE shot!

Maybe I've watched too many spy movies, but it is hard to believe that that was just a lucky shot by some unhinged nut.

[H2O Man]

64. Right.

I had just said this to my cousin.

[SheltieLover]

67. Yup

[True Dough]

73. I don't rule out a Russian agent

Putin is always looking to sow political discord in the U.S. This act would further his cause.

[roamer65]

92. That is a distinct possibility.

[thomski64]

105. So Agent Krasnov the corpulent??

[UTUSN]

7. K&R

[MrWowWow]

8. Just Like the 3 Fake Hobos Who Killed JFK

All three were sharpshooters. Would not be surprised if this shooter was one of putin's own....brought im to stir up shit by killing a very visible reichwingNut. Time will tell.

[yourout]

15. Interesting angle that I had never thought of.

[ancianita]

70. Or... speaking of motive...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100220626758

and then there's this...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=20626832

[Cha]

9. Yes! Very different... and

all those things you suggested. Surreal.. but here we are.

There will be never ending conspiracy theories even after, if he should be caught.

[Cha]

12. I just realized... A Sniper? nt

[SheltieLover]

18. Read this, Cha

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=20624932

Who had motive? 🤔

Aloha 🌺

[Cha]

22. I did.. I Rec your other post that

that had the link. That's one of the reasons I suggested a sniper. putting all the clues together.

TY, Sheltie! 💙

[SheltieLover]

27. Mahalo, Cha

Aloha 🌺

[kentuck]

14. Was Kirk seen as a threat to Trump in any way?

We know he was a big supporter of Trump but has he pushed for the Epstein files to be made public lately. At one time, he made a statement that he would have no more to say on it and that he would believe what came from the government.

[Ace Rothstein]

81. There were also hundreds (thousands?) of people to blend into after.

I'm assuming they dropped the weapon though as they probably would have stuck out with a bag large enough to carry it.

[Xolodno]

111. Check the roof drains.

I'm guessing it was quickly dissembled and dropped into them as they are essentially commercial somewhat flat buildings. So they often put drains in the corners for the water to go somewhere.

[jeffreyi]

19. Yep. Who benefits.

Reading up on Charlie, who was not known to me before, he was a prominent "influencer." And he apparently was not on board with blocking the epstein files contents.

[SheltieLover]

29. Absolutely!

[Baitball Blogger]

21. Patel won't find him.

All the competent people no longer work for the FBI.

[Prairie Gates]

31. There are cameras all over every college campus

We'll have a visual on the shooter by morning, but whether it is a worthwhile visual is another matter. This is going to be a Luigi situation but maybe without the mental illness and silly mistakes.

[orangecrush]

69. Fact

[tinrobot]

89. Maybe he's been told not to find him

[BannonsLiver]

23. I'm not surprised

Modern law enforcement whether it’s the local yokels or the feds is largely incompetent.

[Tribetime]

24. Patel is on this like white on rice

[erronis]

47. Needles to say, I see what you did there....

[ananda]

25. And I wouldn't be surprised if it were a pro-Trump covert op.

Maybe staged so that Magats can blame Democrats
and give Trump the excuse to go nuclear on blue cities
and make sure elections are not free and fair.

[Deuxcents]

34. Something like martial law?

[ananda]

37. With a Reichstag Fire energy to it.

yes

[Deuxcents]

42. This is my number one fear..

[strongermessage]

40. I totally agree.

[Johnny2X2X]

28. This was a pro

To make that shot is hard. But to plan it such that you can get away from the scene takes a lot of know how.

Still will probably get caught, but this was not some amateur.

[Prairie Gates]

33. Heard the same about Mangione

It takes a little while to collect the cameras and piece together the movements, but that doesn't mean it's somebody who's doing anything other than what would require moderate planning.

[Puppyjive]

97. He didn't have secret service

So whatever he had for security, clearly was not enough.

[marble falls]

30. Pretty freaking obviously so.

[Bread and Circuses]

32. Indeed. Was he 'unalived' because he was bounding TACO to release Epstein files

[bucolic_frolic]

35. This is a great thread, no heavy thinking to do, just rec here or there. /nt

[erronis]

48. Unfortunately, that is the case. (I rec'd yours....)

[PJMcK]

128. I recc'd your post

This could be fun if it were to get out of hand!

[Vogon_Glory]

38. Someone was thoughtful, careful, and well-prepared

There is nothing written in stone saying that an assassin is required to be a thoughtless, careless, stumblebum who failed to use the right tools for the job or littered the crime scene with clues. Kirk’s killer was much less inept than Ryan Routh.

[Tree Lady]

44. It's just like all the sniper movies

Where the guy shoots, makes his escape perfectly planned quickly, takes off jacket, hat, shirt, changes with backpack...then takes gun apart and throws it away in pieces no fingerprints. Goes back to motel changes wig, glasses clothes and is out in minutes and using fresh passport flies out instantly from SLC and is already overseas by now never to be seen again.

If it's true he wasn't going to give up on Epstein like the rest of maga podcasters then maga or Trumps people might have taken him out as he had a lot of influence. Joe Ryan better watch out then.

[mcar]

45. One assumes a white man. nt

[Ocelot II]

52. Non-white in Orem, Utah, he'd have stood out, probably tackled to the ground immediately

just for not being white.

[mcar]

53. That's what I'm thinking too

[mnhtnbb]

85. Take a look at the video of the crowd.

All white.

[Emile]

55. What's next? Trump orders Martial Law across the nation?

[bluedigger]

61. I don't find it too surprising.

I believe the campus police force had all of six people, and Kirk's personal security detail would have been preoccupied with responding to him. I don't think six guys were ready to respond to all the resulting chaos effectively, other than some crowd control. The shooter had plenty of time to blend into the crowd and withdraw, if he kept his composure. Kirk was a soft target.

[drray23]

66. true, it was not the secret service with an extensive protective net.

That might partially explained why he easily pulled it off.

[Justice Brandeis]

80. The shooter may have planned everything out, including escape

Or it was an inside job, but I'm not saying that.
At this time.

[Prairie Gates]

87. They have a video of a guy double timing it on a nearby roof just after the shooting

Just a blob, but obviously a person moving deliberately in a run.

[spinbaby]

117. Might or might not be the shooter

Could just be some guy watching who panicked and ran like everyone else on the scene. What baffles me is that apparently no gun has been found. It would seem to me that either they find a gun at the scene or someone with a gun is seen running away.

[Prairie Gates]

118. For sure

Thanks for the qualifier. In another video, there were other people watching from a rooftop, so it's certainly possible that it was just a spectator.

Totally agree on the gun. I said so here: https://democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=20627370

[Iggo]

82. One shot from 200 yards.

That’s some sniper shit.

And it might not be that peculiar for a sniper to get away.

[sarisataka]

86. Not a difficult shot

for someone with a bit of experience

[Kaleva]

94. Many hunters are capable of doing such a shot

[sarisataka]

88. Why is it peculiar?

Is every person who shoots another always caught in less than six hours?

[roamer65]

91. Probably a FSB or GRU operation.

Aka Russian.

[Kaleva]

93. This guy wasn't a mass shooter

If. I recall correctly, close to half of murder cases aren’t solved .

[tonekat]

95. Trump's Horst Wessel? N/T

[Ned Low]

100. I've been thinking that all day.

Or Ernst Rohm, or Gregor Stasser. Wessell is more spot on. The Rohm and Stasser coincidences are still to come.

[Beringia]

99. Does seem like a professional hit, but what are the motives

[iemanja]

102. Obviously premeditated

Last edited Wed Sep 10, 2025, 11:47 PM - Edit history (1)

and possibly someone trained as a military sniper. Not, however, a covert operation in the sense of the government being involved.

[ToxMarz]

103. Well we've got Patel and Bongino at FBI, Blondie at DOJ

Ice Ice Barbie at Homeland Security, and anyone who was competent in any of those agencies has been Doge'd. I don't know if it's peculiar or what would be expected

[ReRe]

104. Thoughts:

Prescheduled rally. Probably a little female/male ex-military sniper. Everything planned out. Had to get in and get out in a jiffy. One shot. What the heck did he she/he do with the rifle on the way out? Hide it and come back for it later?
It HAD to be a sniper. Holy moley. I've been wondering whether this was going to start happening again,
like in the '60s: assassinations.

[Feel Good Inc]

107. Not really peculiar when it's a non-politician with his own security.

The way he shot was pretty remarkable but he likely got away in the chaos and I doubt there was any thorough level of security so no snipes to quickly pick him off like with Trump's shooting.

I also think having an incompetent FBI helps.

[Kaleva]

110. Was there heavy security present?

Having the event outside shows a lack of concern for security. Had it been held inside, attendees could have been screened and there would have been no opportunity for a long distance shot.

[Feel Good Inc]

112. No there wasn't.

Not sure what the poster said since it's been deleted but on MSNBC or CNN a local reporter said there was no mention of security beyond his personal security on stage. There were no metal detectors, either.

[Joinfortmill]

113. My thoughts, too - a sharp shooter likely ex- military.

[dlk]

120. It was a professional hit...

n/t

[Torchlight]

121. My guess is I'll be underwhelmed and unsurprised by who-what-why when they're caught.

The 'how' might be more surprising, but even then I'm betting myself a buck that the simplest process with the least moving parts was used.

[sop]

129. Oswald shot JFK from a distance of 265 ft. and made a clean getaway, he was only caught after he shot and killed

a Dallas Police Officer some time later. Using a scoped rifle, positioned inside a nearby building, most skilled marksmen could have made the shot that killed Kirk from 200 yds. then simply walked away. Unless Kirk's shooter is really stupid, left some evidence at the scene of the crime, or was seen by others who know what he did and turn him in, there's a good chance this guy won't be caught.

[exboyfil]

131. Yes if Oswald had a car

Then he would have been gone. He had to rely on buses and cabs to make his getaway.

Oswald was a crime of opportunity. Still there are things that make you wonder (such as the cluster f___ at the airport with Secret Service). The cop turning his head just as Ruby shot Oswald (like he didn''t want to see what was coming). Then you had the dead bodies afterwards (two reporters murdered - one in his home with his notes missing from a blow to the neck and the other shot in a police station by a cop).

[sop]

134. Right. For the sake of argument I'm assumimg Oswald was the "lone shooter," and he wasn't "a patsy."

Too many questions still remain.

[pwb]

139. He got away because no one was looking for him?

Killing a man to create false outrage is not beyond Putins pukes.

[bdamomma]

140. Premeditated???

Yes I agree.

Covert operation???? Maybe so to change the narrative from Epstein to targeting another group of people to be caught by ICE, and the felon and his cohorts to plant the seed of going after Americans and to thrust us into martial law???