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What cities would look like without light pollution (Original Post) n2doc Dec 2012 OP
creepy cool FirstLight Dec 2012 #1
Cool. It would be almost that good with some sensible restrictions. Deep13 Dec 2012 #2
Now THAT is pretty damned cool! arcane1 Dec 2012 #3
amazing. roguevalley Dec 2012 #29
Perhaps, if you had eyes the size of dinner plates. TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #4
Second that. NutmegYankee Dec 2012 #5
It's obviously a composite. AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #11
There is no place in the continental US free of light polution RomneyLies Dec 2012 #15
As an amateur Astronomer, I've been saddened by the amount of light pollution .... BlueJazz Dec 2012 #6
Sound pollution is even worse IMO. Sorry to sidetrack. KittyWampus Dec 2012 #34
I was in NYC during the last blackout (2003) DollarBillHines Dec 2012 #7
I never thought of that. UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2012 #8
I'll never forget seeing the stars in Arizona when we were UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2012 #9
Having been born in 1944, one of the saddest changes enough Dec 2012 #10
I remember Liberalagogo Dec 2012 #12
light is only one thing that obscures the sky, moisture does too CreekDog Dec 2012 #19
I've been far out in the Gulf of Mexico and the Atlantic in the middle of the night on couldless Incitatus Dec 2012 #13
pretty but light are needed in the city at night. Heather MC Dec 2012 #14
Let's examine the logic of what you are saying TalkingDog Dec 2012 #23
I guess people enjoy not being able to see their way walking down the street at night AZ Progressive Dec 2012 #28
ok Heather MC Dec 2012 #31
It's so dark out here you walk into shit without a flashlight & the sky looks just like that. OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #16
Something approaching that is possible and I don't know why it isn't being done Vox Moi Dec 2012 #17
Gorgeous. nt Mojorabbit Dec 2012 #18
94 Northridge quake - we stood outside and saw the stars because Liberal_in_LA Dec 2012 #20
I saw the sky while on the island of Moorea vanlassie Dec 2012 #21
one highlight of being out of power for 2 weeks after sandy was the night sky tk2kewl Dec 2012 #22
I just glance outside at night. LWolf Dec 2012 #24
It's what rural denizens who are often vilified by those with urban privelege enjoy nightly TransitJohn Dec 2012 #25
Top of the Beartooth Mtns postulater Dec 2012 #26
It doesn't really look like that, I've driven around the country and I know that AZ Progressive Dec 2012 #27
Love it! From a lighting and lighting controls professional Ibisa Dec 2012 #30
This is great! savebigbird Dec 2012 #32
Some great night sky photos from Utah here. bluedigger Dec 2012 #33
Phenomenal, thanks. Some definite wallpapers there. KittyWampus Dec 2012 #35
While I appreciate the sentiment and energy savings, Nikia Dec 2012 #36
25 million North Koreans already know. TheManInTheMac Dec 2012 #37

Deep13

(39,154 posts)
2. Cool. It would be almost that good with some sensible restrictions.
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:50 PM
Dec 2012

full cut off lighting where necessary, and no wasteful, unnecessary omnidirectional lighting.

roguevalley

(40,656 posts)
29. amazing.
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 09:29 PM
Dec 2012

I imagine city folks would have a hard time with a rural area where it gets really dark at night. Even here in a small town I find the country in winter rather scary. I will say that it makes the auroras better.

 

TheMadMonk

(6,187 posts)
4. Perhaps, if you had eyes the size of dinner plates.
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:04 PM
Dec 2012

The best dark sky sites in the world couldn't produce a view that speccy without a couple of thousand dollars worth of telescope and electronic sensors. (Or a film camera and several hours of exposures.)

NutmegYankee

(16,177 posts)
5. Second that.
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:07 PM
Dec 2012

I was at Bryce Canyon, UT (which has a spectacular dark sky) during a new moon and the milky was no where near that bright. You could see it, but it didn't glow like that.

 

RomneyLies

(3,333 posts)
15. There is no place in the continental US free of light polution
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:45 PM
Dec 2012

Not even Bryce Canyon, UT.

That said, he's right. It would not be that bright even if 100% of light pollution was eliminated.

 

BlueJazz

(25,348 posts)
6. As an amateur Astronomer, I've been saddened by the amount of light pollution ....
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:08 PM
Dec 2012

..that's been allowed to proliferate.

When I was a boy..here in the Tampa Bay area, I could see stars to the 6th magnitude.
Now, I'm lucky to see a 4th, and most nights I have to strain to see a 3rd mag.

I could accept normal growth but it seems like people do everything to light up 40% of their houses and the other 60% goes into the night sky. Not only is it non-caring but also wasteful.

Call me Johnny-pissed-off

DollarBillHines

(1,922 posts)
7. I was in NYC during the last blackout (2003)
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:09 PM
Dec 2012

The sky was surreal.

You could spot the locals, they were walking around like tourists - looking up.

 

UnrepentantLiberal

(11,700 posts)
8. I never thought of that.
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:32 PM
Dec 2012

I wasn't here at the time. I wonder if anyone thought to take pictures with a long exposure?

 

UnrepentantLiberal

(11,700 posts)
9. I'll never forget seeing the stars in Arizona when we were
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:35 PM
Dec 2012

on our way to a concert. You felt like they were right on top of you.

enough

(13,235 posts)
10. Having been born in 1944, one of the saddest changes
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:38 PM
Dec 2012

I've observed in my life is the lack of darkness at night.

These photos seem beautiful to me, but very sad.

 

Liberalagogo

(1,770 posts)
12. I remember
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:44 PM
Dec 2012

back in 1989, I went to Australia, and was out at Ayers Rock (Uluru) at night...and the sky was unbelievable. I'm a city boy, so it completely floored me how much you could see in the desert night sky. I saw satellites moving overhead with the naked eye. Whenever I'm in the country (usually central Texas) and it's clear, I always try to go outside and stargaze. It's not anywhere near as good as the Aussie desert, but it's refreshing.

PS. I was living in San Francisco for a bit and we had a city blackout, and the sky, while star-filled, looked nothing like the 3rd pic.

CreekDog

(46,192 posts)
19. light is only one thing that obscures the sky, moisture does too
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 04:55 AM
Dec 2012

that's why getting away from light sources and moisture sources (going to the desert) improves the view of the sky.

also, higher altitude means you're looking through less atmosphere.

so go somewhere in the high desert away from cities and you will be amazed --the hinterlands of Utah and Nevada even eastern Oregon have amazing night skies.

Incitatus

(5,317 posts)
13. I've been far out in the Gulf of Mexico and the Atlantic in the middle of the night on couldless
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:44 PM
Dec 2012

nights. The sky was amazing compared to where I live in Florida, but it did not look as great as in those pictures.

 

Heather MC

(8,084 posts)
14. pretty but light are needed in the city at night.
Thu Dec 27, 2012, 11:45 PM
Dec 2012

I see these pictures and think gee I wonder how many houses are getting broken into right now, and how many people are getting mugged or worse. Not that people don't do those things with the lights on. but eeek very scary with the lights out

TalkingDog

(9,001 posts)
23. Let's examine the logic of what you are saying
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 07:56 PM
Dec 2012

If you drove by a totally dark house and saw a guy with a flash light on the outside trying to get in (because only the very skilled can pick a lock without seeing what they are doing) would you figure that the house was being broken into or.....what?

Muggings same thing. Studies suggest muggers pick victims based on body language. Can't see body language if everybody is in the dark.

Street lights and "safety" lights allow burglars and muggers an easy way to spot targets. We have never had safety lights in our yard. They are worse than pointless.

AZ Progressive

(3,411 posts)
28. I guess people enjoy not being able to see their way walking down the street at night
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 09:15 PM
Dec 2012

and maybe tripping on something and falling, or a car hitting someone because no lights at night are there to illuminate the person until the last second when the person walking is in view of the car lights. "Light Pollution" in cities like Los Angeles and Chicago actually helps to illuminate streets at night that are not lit by street lights.

 

Heather MC

(8,084 posts)
31. ok
Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:13 PM
Dec 2012

the city would be lit up by the stars and the moon you would be able to see.

and a well placed towel and Hammer would do the job of breaking a window and no 1 would hear it. So no need for fan y lock picking tools

or they just find a window that is not locked.

pardon me for living in a world where crime is committed in the dark

 

OneTenthofOnePercent

(6,268 posts)
16. It's so dark out here you walk into shit without a flashlight & the sky looks just like that.
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 12:04 AM
Dec 2012

It really is breath taking. During that Gemini meteor shower a week or so ago, you could see little & big ,eteors every couple of seconds.

Vox Moi

(546 posts)
17. Something approaching that is possible and I don't know why it isn't being done
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 12:36 AM
Dec 2012

LED lighting is an energy and cost-saving alternative right now.
Light pollution conventional light sources blaze forth in all directions while the directed illumination with LEDs is superb.
The technology is firmly in place and the economy of the switch well documented.
I'm not shilling for LEDs, but I spent many years living in a city and thinking how beautiful it would look if we put light only where we needed it.

vanlassie

(5,637 posts)
21. I saw the sky while on the island of Moorea
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 07:30 AM
Dec 2012

in the South Pacific... I had never seen the Southern Cross- WOW.

 

tk2kewl

(18,133 posts)
22. one highlight of being out of power for 2 weeks after sandy was the night sky
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 02:02 PM
Dec 2012

i enjoyed going outside at night and seeing stars for a change

LWolf

(46,179 posts)
24. I just glance outside at night.
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 08:02 PM
Dec 2012

Living rurally, my night sky is breathtaking. It makes driving at night a little different; around here, things close up and people go home. There are some street lights in town, but as soon as you get to the edge, no more street lights, at all. Even on the highway.

The small city to the south creates some light pollution, but nothing in comparison to large cities.

It's so dark that, with no moon, if the porch light is off I need a flashlight to find my way from the car to the front door.

Once, about 8 years ago, my son wandered outside, forgot the flashlight, and ran into a cow. Literally. It breached the fence from it's pasture next door. Black angus in the dark.

TransitJohn

(6,932 posts)
25. It's what rural denizens who are often vilified by those with urban privelege enjoy nightly
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 08:32 PM
Dec 2012

Most of my life was spent in Wyoming. I got to see that a lot.

AZ Progressive

(3,411 posts)
27. It doesn't really look like that, I've driven around the country and I know that
Fri Dec 28, 2012, 09:08 PM
Dec 2012

I've driven around the country several times and were in very rural in the middle of nowhere areas between cities many times (especially in the west) and...

The skies are not nearly that bright at night. Those pictures are taken only with cameras set to take long exposures (30 seconds or more) that exxagerate the brightness. Many photos taken at night outside exxagerate the brightness (because the photographer cares more about making a beautiful photo than being accurate.)

Besides, cities need light partly as a crime deterrent. If everywhere would be dark it would be easier for criminals at night to do their stuff. BTW, even small cities I've been to have significant light pollution that glows from at least 10 miles away.

Ibisa

(9 posts)
30. Love it! From a lighting and lighting controls professional
Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:50 AM
Dec 2012

I am in the lighting industry. It kinda makes me sick when I fly into Chicago and see the glowing sky and think of both all of the waste as well as the harm to the visual environment.

We won't eliminate light spill and reflections completely, but all of the 'wall packs' and such just blast light everywhere with no real direction.

The only thing we need to watch for is that some cities and designers are retrofitting with LED fixtures without considering the previous light spill onto the sidewalks, from a safety standpoint. If they aren't careful, they save lots of energy (while spending high $ upfront unfortunately), but also at the expense of pedestrian safety. There are plenty of ways to address it, but people need to be diligent.

savebigbird

(417 posts)
32. This is great!
Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:19 PM
Dec 2012

Whenever I bring up the topic of light pollution with people I know, they look at me like I'm strange. I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking about it.

Nikia

(11,411 posts)
36. While I appreciate the sentiment and energy savings,
Sat Dec 29, 2012, 02:02 PM
Dec 2012

I was so glad that there are city street lights for when I went running in the mornings before work when I worked during the day.
Now that I work until 2 am in a town 30 miles away in a non metro area, I have been so relived when I have had the "city" lights when driving through fog or snow.

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