*** The GOP Debate reality show 9pm ET - live blog thread ***

[Tx4obama]

Live stream link: http://www.rentadrone.tv/debate/

The GOP debate starts at 9pm ET. It will air on TV on FoxNews



=======

The Democrats had 26 debates during the 2008 primary campaign.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_democratic_debates

The GOP had 21 debates during the 2008 primary campaign.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_republican_debates

This time around The GOP will have a total of 24 during the 2012 primary campaign
LIST of all scheduled Republican Party 2012 presidential debates:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_republican_debates

[joshcryer]

1. Another link:

http://live.foxnews.com/

(Yes, it's FOX News but it's very crisp for me.)

[oberliner]

2. Thanks for getting this started

The "pre-show" on the Fox News website was unbearable.

Hopefully the debate will be more fun!

[Tx4obama]

27. Then I'm glad I missed the pre-show :) n/t

[ellisonz]

83. Take this debate as an opportunity...

To Join your DU Democratic Groups (A Group for Every Flavor of Democrats): http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1099

Al Gore
Barack Obama
Democracy for America
Democrats
Dennis Kucinich
Hillary Clinton
Joe Biden
John Kerry
Precinct-level Politics
Southern Democrats and Progressives

Also: Activism: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1007

Activist Headquarters
Economic Activism and Progressive Living
Peacemaking and Community
Propaganda Debunking
Sibel Edmonds and Other Whistleblowers
Socialist Progressives

And: Government and Elections: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1089

Campaigns
Congress
Election Reform

DU Groups need all the help they can get so we can better organize to fight Republicans!

[Tx4obama]

95. No no no, I missed the 'pre-show', but I AM watching the debate :)

I'll get over to the 'groups' after the debate and after the post-debate analysis

[ellisonz]

108. Psst...I'm PSAing.

It's like Tebowing, but cooler.

TEEEEBOOOOWWW!

[TlalocW]

3. Two questions

How many debates have there been, and has this been a usual number for debates?

TlalocW

[Tx4obama]

14. The 'number' of GOP debates is within the normal range. See the link below for 2012 numbers

List of all scheduled 2012 GOP debates here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_republican_debates


-----------


The Democrats had 26 debates during the 2008 primary campaign.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_democratic_debates

The GOP had 21 debates during the 2008 primary campaign.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_republican_debates

This time around The GOP will have 24 during the 2012 primary campaign
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_republican_debates

[thescreaminghead]

262. Did Newt Just Say He'd Kill Judicial Review?

Did Newt just advocate killing judicial review in the name of God? GUARDS, ARREST THAT MAN

[ncrainbowgrrl]

4. Huntsman's there! yay!

[jenmito]

102. Why are you so happy that the self-described "Consistent Conservative" is there? n/t

[BadgerKid]

5. Final debate! Yeaaaaaahhh!

[Tx4obama]

101. There are TEN more debates scheduled after the one tonight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_republican_debates

[gateley]

6. Hope it's on C-Span (TV) because I don't know what channel Fox is on in my area.

And I don't need to know.

[oberliner]

8. You can watch it online

foxnews.com if you can stomach it

[gateley]

40. Not on my laptop, but I caved and found it on my channel lineup. Not sure how long I'll last,

though. I've already gone back to Rachel about 7 times.

But thanks!

I think I'll probably just wait until I see the "highlights". Preferably from Colbert and Stewart.

[Tx4obama]

19. Live stream link

http://www.rentadrone.tv/debate/

[gateley]

32. The laptop I'm stuck with sucks, but sigh - I found Fox on TV.

But I find I keep zipping back to Rachel.

Thanks, though!!

[struggle4progress]

7. Teed off with the Grinch!

[ncrainbowgrrl]

9. watch out for Newt-hunting.

should be fun

[struggle4progress]

10. Grinch wishes us Merry Christmas and remembers St Ronnie

[ncrainbowgrrl]

13. drink something- alcoholic or not- st. ronnie

[bullwinkle428]

11. Newt opens up with a nice "Fuck you" to Jews and all other non-Christians!

[Summer Hathaway]

12. Is this the same show as -

The Biggest Loser, just under a different name?

[oberliner]

15. Serving up softballs to Newt

Boring.

[flying rabbit]

16. I'll see if i can make it through this one

[w8liftinglady]

17. I'm here...

[oberliner]

18. They keep trying to get Paul to pledge to support the Republican nominee

It's really annoying.

[struggle4progress]

20. Ron Paul: Any of us can beat Obama!

[joshcryer]

22. Jinx!

[Wind Dancer]

268. OMG!

He really said that? They are truly delusional. (shakes head in total disbelief)

[joshcryer]

21. Ron Paul "Anybody up here could beat Obama."

Delusion.

[w8liftinglady]

42. Oy,vey! go Beat yourself,Ron

He literally said "Obama is beating himself"

[deminks]

23. Ugh, I am watching Fox. nt

[oberliner]

24. Santorum needs to hang it up

He is going nowhere.

[ellisonz]

91. Santorum is running for...

Vice President.

[starroute]

200. So he wants to be the bottom of the ticket?

Makes sense, I guess.

[ellisonz]

214. It's a dirty job...

...but someone's got to do it. Reminds me of a certain scene in Kevin Smith's Clerks if you've seen it about a certain job at certain establishments with booths.

[starroute]

261. I haven't, but Google has

http://www.dailyscript.com/scripts/clerks.html

[struggle4progress]

25. Santorum: I'm gonna burn down Iowa!

[bullwinkle428]

26. Megyn Kelly to Santorum: "Why does everyone hate you?"

[oberliner]

29. Tossed in a little dig on Newt

Romney must be itching for his chance.

[tawadi]

28. Santorum looks nervous

[w8liftinglady]

30. first question..newt,are you electable?

[w8liftinglady]

31. ...as electable as carter

[Enrique]

33. "People like the consistency of Santorum"

[GoneOffShore]

136. They like the frothiness.

[tawadi]

34. Yes, Mittens knows all about hurting

[oberliner]

35. Mitt doesn't answer the question asked

He just spits out the lines he has prepped to go regardless of question.

[deminks]

36. Mittens. How are you more of an Obama hater than Newtie? Answer : Private Sector Private Sector

[struggle4progress]

37. Romney: Government doesn't create jobs -- the private sector does

So I'm running for President to create jobs!

[Whisp]

38. Michele just said she's an action figure that sits on her hands.

[oberliner]

39. Thought Michelle was going say "sit on my ass"

Went with "sit on my hands"

[struggle4progress]

41. Crazy Lady: Americans trust me!

[gateley]

52. Seriously, why is she even still showing up? nt

[Whisp]

43. Redeye Rick was hitting the sauce

just look at those peepers

[tawadi]

44. Perry..

[tridim]

45. Uh oh, Perry just said he wants to "get it on" with Obama.

[lunasun]

46. Batshit has new look tonite !!

[gateley]

55. Which batshit?

[lunasun]

110. Ms. B

[ellisonz]

123. "Crazy Eyes"

[DissedByBush]

271. Oh you know who

They're all lacking in various ways,

But "batshit crazy" really best describes Mrs. B.

I don't know what she's doing here. Only the few truly crazy, most right-wing Republicans could possibly support her, and that's not enough to get nominated.

I can watch any of these people talk, and Ron Paul is even entertaining and sometimes insightful, but I seriously can't even stand to see this crazy bitch anymore. I'm getting the willies just thinking about her in this post. I need a shower.

[gateley]

275. Seriously, I was wondering the same thing - why is she still there? nt

[bullwinkle428]

47. Oh Jesus...Perry now comparing himself to Tim Tebow!

[w8liftinglady]

71. I nearly puked on that one!

[lunasun]

72. How unpatriotic he can never say America...only"merica" how disrespectful that is( if he was Obama!)

[deminks]

48. Perry up. Your Party is afraid of you going up against debater Obama. Perry-I'll get there early.

[struggle4progress]

49. Goodhair: I think I'll ramble on about sports

[ncrainbowgrrl]

58. Heads to Perry- Tebow changed his throwing motion before the draft...

eyes

[oberliner]

50. Perry hitching himself to Tim Tebow

Weak.

Crowd not digging it either.

[joshcryer]

51. Perry should do a Tebow.

Would be epic.

[quinnox]

53. Many Americans like me scratching head at Perry, "Who the hell is Tim Tebow?"

Not all of us watch or are obsessed with football dumbass.

[tridim]

54. So is Newt the only clown who said "Merry Christmas"?

[tawadi]

56. Huntsman..

"I'm not going to show up at a Donald Trump debate."

Zing!

[oberliner]

57. Hunstman dissing Donald Trump

Is that going to help him?

[tawadi]

60. He's the best of the lot

Of course that is saying NOTHING.

[joshcryer]

59. Huntsman mocking the Trump debate.

[struggle4progress]

61. Huntsmen: I'm not a pretzel.

[coalition_unwilling]

62. The Fox News live stream is really choppy. Ugh

[Seedersandleechers]

68. This one is good

http://www.rentadrone.tv/debate/

[struggle4progress]

63. Santorum: Don't believe in me! Let me believe in you!

[tridim]

64. Someone needs to fluff Perry's hairpiece at the commercial break.

[w8liftinglady]

77. lol...my mind just went to a BAD place.

[oberliner]

65. This sound effect is annoying

Keep thinking something wrong with my laptop.

[rainbow4321]

74. +1000!!!

And I keep thinking it's my cellphone getting a text!!

I think it is Fox's version of a soft ball sound effect for the repukes...make it a soft, wimpy sound that they can talk on thru instead of a loud sound that will tell them STFU!!!!

[Tx4obama]

107. For some reason I keep thinking the sound is a 'DU jury summons' BUT there is no DU sound for jury!

LOL

[ellisonz]

127. I thought it was Facebook.

[tawadi]

66. Ricky..

"Frankly, we should have never gotten to this point at all."

YES, AGREED. Now go talk to your chubby twin Dubbya about this.

[deminks]

67. Romney sayuz he'll use bipartisanship to be a leader, unlike our current president.

[bullwinkle428]

69. SAUL ALINSKY!! Take a drink, everyone!

[tawadi]

73. I'm out. eom

[oberliner]

70. "Saul Alinsky Radical"

Why does he say that? Who is that for?

[struggle4progress]

76. Throwing red meat to the neanderthals

[oberliner]

80. Do neanderthals know who Saul Alinsky is?

Seems like a pretty obscure reference.

[struggle4progress]

169. It's been a cave-dweller meme for quite a while now

Our SoS discussed Alinsky in her undergraduate honors thesis, so "eek! Alinsky!" became a staple of the rightwing noise machine

[underpants]

94. That is RW radio talking point and the same tactics TeaBaggers have used at the same time

they have no understanding of irony

[struggle4progress]

75. Crazy Lady: Ask all 535 members of congress to sit down together

Somebody should explain to her about the house and the senate

[SecurityManager]

78. Be sure to watch ESPN in the morning Perry will regret that Tebow analogy /nm

[Whisp]

79. a topic that has not been raised so far in the debates, coming up

inney or outty?

[joshcryer]

81. FOX News salivating, absolutely falling all over Gingrich.

Epic. Guys. Fucking landslide. FUCKING LANDSLIDE.

[oberliner]

82. Newt did better last time I think

Seems like his schtick is getting old.

[SecurityManager]

84. Chris Wallace goes for the MEAT!!!!

LMAO here we go!

[Enrique]

85. Bain Capital

[bullwinkle428]

86. Time to review Bain Capital with a fine tooth comb.

[one_voice]

87. Ummm...

isn't it kinda shitty and a little unfair for Gingrich to be at the debate moderated/hosted by fox people...he worked there. He was a favorite on all their shows...doesn't seem right to me...

[underpants]

88. Speaking of CLOWNS Brett Baier has on a Nemo clownfish tie

just saying

[oberliner]

89. Romney's lines are not landing

He seems off his game - just like last debate.

[quinnox]

90. Romney seems a bit subdued tonight like he has a cold or something

Maybe he is under the weather.

[underpants]

98. #1 Romney tactic - sit still and continue to be rich

politically he just sits still and lets the clowns spill out of the car

[ellisonz]

106. He felt a soul pang...

...and doubled up on the Valium.

[SecurityManager]

92. ROCK ON Chris Wallace

Asking newt about past and present fannie mac LOL

[joshcryer]

93. Damn, hard ball toward Newt about Freddie Mac.

[oberliner]

96. Paul snuck in a compliment to Romney

Let the tag-team begin!

[muriel_volestrangler]

97. "the final slugfest between, well, a pack of slugs"

The Guardian - who else?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/richard-adams-blog/2011/dec/16/republican-debate-iowa-fox-news

[joshcryer]

99. LOL, Paul believing that private industry would more fairly help people...

...get loans and such as opposed to "government sponsored enterprise."

[Enrique]

100. was that really Ron Paul talking?

it sounded like Bad Lip Reading.

[SecurityManager]

103. Newt moving to center?

"Lots of good government programs"

[coalition_unwilling]

104. Did Ron Paul just imply that Gingrich just might be a 'fascist'????

Bwa-ha-ha-ha

Even the devil can quote scripture

[oberliner]

105. Bachmann full on attack-Newt mode

Fun times!

[deminks]

109. Gingrich: I did not have lobby with that bank. Never.

[Whisp]

113. lobby relations.

[neverforget]

111. Would like to say thanks to those of you who have the stomach, stamina

and fortitude to watch these awful human beings talk about how they want to take America back to the 19th Century. For that, I toast you for you are a stronger person than me.

[SecurityManager]

112. Damn they are hammering newt is this the plan to get him out???????

LMAO

[Enrique]

114. Gingrich pouring on the sincerity

[coalition_unwilling]

115. Bachmann implying that Gingrich is a 'whore' - bwa ha ha ha

[oberliner]

116. Why is Newt kissing Mitt's butt?

Wonder what the strategy is there.

[SecurityManager]

117. O crap I knew it was to good to last

Kumba ya newt an mitt blech

[SecurityManager]

118. Santorum and Huntsman left in the cold with sinking numbers

Look for Rickey to step out next week!

[rainbow4321]

119. Waiting for them to attack NG's comment today that homosexuality is "caused" by "1/2 genetics..."

and 1/2 environmental"....

He was being interviewed by someone in Iowa when he was asked about his sister who is a lesbian. Paraphrasing here, but he was basically asked about it being a "chosen" lifestyle after they asked about his sister and showed a pic of them together. He couldn't make eye contact with the interviewer, fumbled with some stuff in front of him, and then said he believed it was part genetics, part environmental.
You know the right fringes heads are gonna explode for the genetics part of his answer!

That part of the interview was just a blip on the news today so maybe it has not hit the radar of Fox News and the other clowns on stage with him.

[nolabear]

120. I'm tuning in late, but boy does this audience seem tired.

And boy does Perry look confused.

[oberliner]

121. We are in the "Fox Gotcha Question" section of the debate

This is just pointless.

[coalition_unwilling]

122. It's official - I now hate Mitt as much as I hate Newt and will

eagerly cast my vote for Obama as a way to express my hatred for either of them, whoever is the nominee.

You heard it here first

[SecurityManager]

124. Hey Huntsman no rational talk allowed! Back to blood letting!!! /nm

[Tx4obama]

125. Hey Perry, may be if we had a legislature that actually 'worked' more here in Texas

things wouldn't be so screwed up here !!!

[rainbow4321]

139. Not to mention how many damn special sessions have to be called!

He kinda left that out!

And I can't wait to read (online, I don't live in Austin) what the Austin American Statesman newspaper has to say about his dig at them..."don't believe everything you read in there...."

[nolabear]

126. Boy Huntsman just pissed off a whole lot of Saudis.

The US and China are the only relationships that matter? Oh, sorry, I mistook him for a contender there for a minute.

[Enrique]

128. Santorum dropping names of Iowa towns

as if he has a chance.

[oberliner]

129. Illegal Immigration Questions coming up next?

That's my prediction.

[coalition_unwilling]

130. Paul is batshit crazy. The guy's a total loon - n/t

[Enrique]

131. Megyn Kelly on the warpath

her nostrils are flaring

[bullwinkle428]

132. MITT JUST CONTRADICTED HIMSELF! He criticized Obama for not putting enough faith in

GM's ability to develop batteries for electric vehicles, after trying to knock him for taking steps to save GM a couple of years back.

[BadgerKid]

174. GM didn't make the pre-application cut, according to whatever criteria the DOE applied.

It could be the DOE wanted to foster small companies near start-up status. Smaller companies are generally more innovative and reactive than large companies. (Besides, GM and the other auto manufacturers had how many decades to work on alternative energy technology?)

http://www.ndia.org/Divisions/Divisions/EnvironmentAndEnergySecurity/Documents/Content/ContentGroups/Divisions1/Environment/Energy_PDFs/LG%20final%20press%20release%2010%204%2007%20%282%29.pdf

I wondered if Mitt was suggesting the federal government should be automatically turning to large corporations. If he wanted to cite a large company, why didn't he say GE?

[deminks]

133. 'One nation under Gawd' is Newties litmus test for judges. More dog whistles.

[coalition_unwilling]

134. Megyn Kelly nailing Gingrich to the wall for his

suggestion that judges have to testify in Congress about their decisions.

[oberliner]

135. Now Gingrich is throwing out the red meat to the crowd

This is his moment! Onward Christian soldiers!

[Enrique]

137. "historian"

[ellisonz]

161. +1

[bullwinkle428]

138. Oooh...is Newt suggesting that Citizens' United is not omnipotent?

[Enrique]

140. not to mention Bush v. Gore

[coalition_unwilling]

141. Bachmann is insane. The courts are not the final

arbiters of what the law is??? WTF???

[Tx4obama]

157. Bachmann must have gotten her law degree the same place Orly Taitz did ;) n/t

[Matariki]

266. Don't you know, Baby Jesus is the final arbiter of the law.

[karynnj]

272. In some ways that is true -

If you are speaking of a particular case, the courts are the final arbiter on that case, but Congress can then change the law - though that is obviously not retro active. I guess you can also say in case of a person, the President can pardon them.

[coalition_unwilling]

274. But that's not how Batshit Bachmann was speaking. She was

basically offering contempt for the judiciary branch in response, IIRC, to a question or thread asking whether federal judges should have life terms. She was basically giving the good 'ole wink and nod to those, for example, who might feel it's OK to discriminate against someone even after judges have ruled that it's not.

You had to see it to believe it. My jaw just about hit the floor.

[karynnj]

278. Completely agree - and I doubt that Bachmann was thinking of it as I wrote it

In a weird way, saying which one has the final say is like the kids' game "Rock, paper, scissors". The Congress can write a law, the Supreme Court can call it unconstitutional, and (though very hard) the Congress can initiate the process of changing the Constitution.

[SecurityManager]

142. Kelly "left leaning" 9th circuit court of appeals

FOX is consistent LOL

[deminks]

143. Ron Paul has a moment of sanity in a sea of sociopathy.

[coalition_unwilling]

144. Holy Shit! Ron Paul isn't insane after all. He just made

a pretty compelling argument for separation of powers.

[ellisonz]

148. Except for the whole...

...eliminating five departments of government, abortion, and re-enacting the gold standard.

[coalition_unwilling]

155. Yeah, he's like the family crazy uncle. A few lucid moments mixed

in with general crazy rants.

[Javaman]

221. I had an uncle like that...

back in the 70's he wanted to blow up all the toll booths in NY.

But he was a heck of a singer and guitar player. LOL

[spanone]

145. santorum the slug...he made it happen bwahahahahaa

[oberliner]

146. This whole - "give me a name" thing is so stupid

Idiocy.

[Enrique]

147. "gotcha" question for the candidates

name a supreme court justice!

Cain is feeling lucky he's not up there.

[Tx4obama]

149. Of course the republican candidates are going to pick the REPUBLICAN Supreme Court justices

that were appointed by a Republican president.
Grrr...

p.s. I hope President Obama will have the opportunity to appoint TWO more justices by the end of his second term

[coalition_unwilling]

159. I hope Obama gets to appoint 4 more (replacing Thomas, Scalia, Alito and Roberts).

Ugh, what a bunch of losers, i.e., the 4 Justices but also all these Repuke candidates.

[spanone]

150. another whole hour? holy shit.

[ellisonz]

172. "We have not yet begun to display our insanity"

[SecurityManager]

151. Was the question not "whats your fave supreme court justice?"

Perry does not know any?

Paul???

Santorum?

Seems only the crazy nuts newt, mitt, and bachman would pick????

[oberliner]

154. To be fair, Perry, Paul, and Santorum didn't get to answer the previous question

I think they wanted to make sure to get their two cents in on that.

[coalition_unwilling]

152. Perry looks like he's drunk or high. He now wants Federal judges

not to have lifetime terms. What a tool!

[nolabear]

160. Because there's nothing so uninfluenceable as a judge trying for appointment.

[oberliner]

153. Iran, Immigration, and "Social Issues"

Now we're talking!

[SecurityManager]

156. Iran coming up, my god I feel like a corner man in a Ali/Foreman fight! /nm

[oberliner]

158. And they start with Ron Paul

Good stuff!

[SecurityManager]

162. RON PAUL WILL NOT DEFEND THIS COUNTRY!

Son of a bitch is NUTS

[nolabear]

163. *sigh* I wish Paul wasn't crazy. If he could use his power for good...

[coalition_unwilling]

165. I used to say that about my crazy uncle - :)

[deminks]

164. Ron Paul has 2 sane moments with this anti war tirade.

[oberliner]

171. But it ends his chances of doing well in Iowa

Which is why I think the Fox guy kept goading him.

[ellisonz]

199. I dunno about that...

Iowa is a pretty funky state - it's not Texas or Florida. They have a certain mid-western sensibility - I frankly could see him placing second behind Gingrich and ahead of Romney. It would be

[oberliner]

203. I agree - but not because of foreign policy

When he talks about domestic issues he gets a lot more traction with those voters than when he talks foreign policy - I think that is where he loses the non-hard core Paulites.

[ellisonz]

218. There's a faction of the GOP...

...that now realizes how dumb the war was in the long run - the veterans are coming home and it's having some effect on the mindset in the heartland IMHO. The Ron Paul position once was the position of the GOP before WWII.

[oberliner]

166. Fox is knocking out Ron Paul here

The foreign policy stuff will sink him with this crowd.

[deminks]

167. Now the Iran war drums come out starting with Ricky S.

[deminks]

168. and the crowd cheers.

[coalition_unwilling]

170. Paul is serving Fox News a major shit sandwich, saying

Iran war-mongering is "another Iraq"

Holy shit!

[one_voice]

173. Did Romney just catch himself...

and stop himself from saying President Obama?

[Enrique]

175. yeah

there must be a Luntz memo about that.

[Enrique]

181. any predictions about the fact check on Bachmann?

I'm guessing she pulled the IAEA stuff out of Marcus's ass.

[one_voice]

187. Yeah I think that's...

exactly where she got it from.

[oberliner]

176. Bachmann view on Iran vs. Ron Paul view on Iran

Listen to the cheers for Michelle.

If Ron kept quiet about foreign policy he'd have a much better shot.

[apples and oranges]

177. Ron Paul is acting like a grumpy old man

tonight.

[Javaman]

216. Well, that's because he is. nt

[coalition_unwilling]

178. I hope Paul knocks Bachmann out right now, with

all of her pro-Israel (pro-Likud) saber-rattling.

[oberliner]

185. Bachmann's POV is much much more popular than Paul's with the Iowa Republican voters

I feel like she is knocking him out here not the other way around.

[this bird has flown]

198. Why do you feel that way? Because they possibly stacked the audience full of Bachmann supporters?

Remember that the Military Industrial Complex is very, very powerful. I don't doubt that the powers that be would fill that audience full of voters for warmongerers like Michelle. I find her views to be extremely dangerous and I hope that you would, too.

[oberliner]

264. I don't think the audience was stacked full of Bachmann supporters

She got crickets for some of her other remarks.

I think this "toughness" with respect to Iran is something that the rank and file Republican primary-goer (especially in Iowa) is looking to hear.

I certainly do not share Bachmann's views on this subject - just noting as an outside observer that Paul's POV will not win him any points with the Republican base.

[this bird has flown]

270. Maybe but I think he is appealing to those outside the base.

I read an article this morning about how many young people he drew at a rally at University of Iowa recently. They had to open two other rooms to accomodate the overflow crowd.

Think about it: if you are a male between 18-24, you are REQUIRED to sign up with the Civil Service to get financial aid for college! I would be terrified to sign on the dotted line. I would also be frightened for my son if I were a parent.

War is a deal-breaker for many people. Besides the moral outrage, there is also the bleeding of dollars involved.

[oberliner]

277. He is - but will that help him or hurt him in the Iowa Caucus?

I guess we will find out soon enough.

My prediction is he finishes third, at best.

[this bird has flown]

279. Of course that will help him! He can draw votes from both parties

I think that any Dems who choose to caucus for him will have to switch affiliation to Independent, but it can be done if people are motivated. From my vantage point, it seems like small town are disporportionately affected by these wars. Just on that issue alone Paul may draw from the Left. Whether they'd vote for him in the general against Obama is another story but right now they might want to ensure that it's him instead of Bachmann!

I predict that he will win this caucus.

[oberliner]

280. The Iowa caucuses only admit Republicans

Democrats and Independents are not permitted - only registered Republicans.

[coalition_unwilling]

263. In the heat of the moment last night, didn't see your response. I actually agree

that Bachmann got the best of Paul in this exchange. Although she's almost certainly wrong and Paul is at least part ccorrect, she issued declarative sentences and Paul just came across as sputtering and stuttering gibberish. (Part of that is the format used where candidates are allowed impromptu rebuttals of one another so a premium goes to those who can speak over one another but still keep good sentence structure.)

I had hoped Paul was going to dispense with her in that exchange, but she actually got the better of him

[oberliner]

265. Paul could have made his point a lot more effectively

I think if he had simply limited his comments to saying that wars are expensive and Iraq was wasteful and all that kind of thing, he would've been ok. By delving into the whole "Iran is really not that bad" line of attack, he was not winning any support.

[LBJDemocrat]

188. Has anyone noticed how Paul gets his mic cut off to prevent

him from interrupting, but Bachmann is free to speak over Paul? Coincidence? Doubtful.

[jakeXT]

276. Fox’s Chris Wallace: If Ron Paul Wins In Iowa, It Will Discredit The Iowa Caucuses

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/chris-wallace-if-ron-paul-wins-in-iowa-it-will-discredit-the-iowa-caucuses/

[SecurityManager]

179. UGh nothing but bang the war drums and puttig the last punches on nutty Paul! /nm

[deminks]

180. Avowed mad man? Who on this stage would you let within a foot of lauching a nuke?

I ask you.

[oberliner]

182. Fox is in the tank for Newt

That's what I am concluding from this debate.

They are sinking Ron Paul (or letting him sink himself) - tossing softballs to Gingrich.

[elleng]

183. Good to see Paul taking no b.s., re: war-mongering.

[coalition_unwilling]

184. Too bad Paul is crazy, because he just served Bachmann (that war-mongering

expletive)

[oberliner]

189. Other way around

At least to the relevant audience.

This will sink Ron Paul in Iowa.

[coalition_unwilling]

193. I doubt it will sink Paul in Iowa. He has a pretty good

ground game there and Iowa Repukes may actually rally to his anti-imperialist stance.

He just put Bachmann in her place (and did a shout-out to JKF in passing) by mentioning the Cuban Missile Crisis.

[oberliner]

196. There are a lot of "I would vote for Ron Paul if it weren't for his foreign policy views" voters

This exchange in the debate may not have a big impact because of his ground game and the other more important issues, but I think that the more Ron Paul talks about foreign policy the worse he does with undecided Republican primary voters.

[Tx4obama]

186. Politifact: Bachmann said Iran has promised to use a nuclear weapon against Israel. False

From Twitter

@politifact PolitiFact
Bachmann said Iran has promised to use a nuclear weapon against Israel. False. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/nov/23/michele-bachmann/michele-bachmann-says-iran-has-threatended-launch-/

[ellisonz]

204. I like how Bachmann plays smart.

Like it's a high school Christmas recital. Deep down she knows it's all an act

[coalition_unwilling]

190. This is the first Repuke debate I've watched (altho I've

kept up with debate threads here).

I needed to see this to remind how much I hate Repukes as a group. There's not a one up there I can stand, except for Huntsman and he never gets any time to speak.

Huntsman just mentioned George Kennan, in saying his cold war policy was outdated. Most of the other Repukes don't even know who Kennan was.

On edit: I don't hate Paul - he amuses me with his 'crazy uncle' schtick

[ellisonz]

211. Welcome to the Schtick. n/t

[flying rabbit]

191. Paul got all feisty! nt

[deminks]

192. Newtie is concerned about appearing zany

[Enrique]

194. he's unbearable

my main feeling toward him is wanting him to go away.

[provis99]

195. Huntsman using big words; trying to make sense.

Audience won't like that...

[BadgerKid]

197. Huntsman calling for energy independence via natural gas.

And he went there: Break up the oil monopoly.

[SecurityManager]

201. Bachman please stop saying "When I and As" President of the United States good god! /nm

[NRaleighLiberal]

202. as Meryl Streep says in Out of Africa - "You're So Brave"....I can't watch!

But am grateful you all are - finally found this thread and am catching up....

[flying rabbit]

205. Never really paid attention to Perry,

but he is a dim fucking lightbulb. Just wow.

[one_voice]

206. OMG...Perry is so...

creepy. He reminds me of the sheriff from an old tv show called American Gothic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Gothic_%28TV_series%29

[oberliner]

207. The pundits are saying "Ron Paul jumped the shark"

I am telling you - he destroys his chances with Republicans when he talks foreign policy.

[coalition_unwilling]

210. Give him props for sticking to his guns (npi). He didn't

back off his anti-imperialist views one iota, thereby demonstrating that even a broken clock is right twice a day. I now hope Paul wins Iowa and Gingrich comes in 4th or 5th.

[oberliner]

229. I give him props for sticking to his gun

However, I think this will sink him with Republican primary voters.

I think Gingrich will win Iowa - not at all saying I am happy about that, it's just my prediction.

[ellisonz]

212. That's because they're worried...

Romney tanked.

I'd love if this became a Newt vs. Ron Paul showdown for the soul of the GOP.

[SixthSense]

254. he called them out

he got the biggest cheer of the night when he called them out for promoting "war propaganda"

Fox News is notorious for taking cheap shots at Ron Paul... remember that Jon Stewart sketch?

[oberliner]

258. But then Michelle Bachmann got huge cheers for attacking Ron Paul's views on Iran

I just think that issue is a loser for him among this group of primary voters.

It is what attracts some anti-war Democrats to his POV - but in the Republican primary, it will do nothing but hurt his chances.

[ellisonz]

208. Ron Paul is winning this debate.

They're all flailing at him and he just keeps on going like the goddamn Energizer Bunny of the old old Republican Party. Go Ron Paul, do your thang. 2nd place in Iowa. Loser: Mitt Romney.

[oberliner]

213. I think you are thinking like a liberal Democrat

Which is, of course, understandable.

But Paul did himself a huge amount of harm with potential Republican primary voters with his comments on Iran.

[ellisonz]

223. We'll know soon enough...

RCP Average 11/30 - 12/13 -- Gingrich 26.0 Romney 17.6 Paul 16.6 Perry 10.2 Bachman 9.6 Santorum 6.0 Huntsman 3.4 -- Gingrich +8.4

People are trusting the media less - social dissolution is spreading and Ron Paul is poised with a ground game to seize the moment.

As of September 30 - Ron Paul was 3rd in GOP fundraising. http://www.opensecrets.org/pres12/index.php

[oberliner]

226. I'll be curious to see the post-debate numbers

And, more importantly the post-debate-spin numbers.

[SecurityManager]

209. Needed popcorn the racism segment is about to start /nm

[jacktaylor70]

215. Mitty is really shitty

This guy is sleezy and full of hypocrisy. At least Newt and the others show their stripes, but this arrogant thinks that he can fool us elect him the same way he did in MA. The more I look at these "guignols", the prouder I am of my president.

[deminks]

219. He has a sliminess about him.

[ellisonz]

227. It's because he's spent time...

...with Santorum backstage trying to get him to drop out and endorse for a VP nod.

[coalition_unwilling]

222. Me too. I'm not too enthusiastic about Obama this time 'round, but

watching this debate just reinforces how much I hate Repukes!

[coalition_unwilling]

217. Perry's jumping the shark! Iranians penetrating the U.S. at the El Paso border. OMG, toof

fucking funny

[SecurityManager]

220. Santorum: Drug cartels planning attacks on the U.S.

Like with sidewinder rockets from the look on his face!

[SecurityManager]

224. Mitt nit picking "bills brought to my desk"

Wallace on him about flip flopping again mitts trying to justify it.

[Cali_Democrat]

225. Romney is such a snake

flip flopper!!!

[coalition_unwilling]

230. Who's worse, Romney or Newt? That's like asking

whether you'd rather step in a puddle of puke or a pile of shit

[SecurityManager]

228. Chris Wallace seems to have a vendetta on Mitt LOL

Goes right to santorum about Mitts flip flops OMG this is great!

[SecurityManager]

231. LOL Newt "incorrect facts" that's like the third time he told Bachman that

Why wont he just call her a liar lol

[Enrique]

232. Michele doesn't like people saying her facts are wrong

[rainbow4321]

235. "Waaaahhh...I am a serious Presidential candidate!!"

If you have to tell people that, then, no, you are not

[ellisonz]

242. +1000

That goes for Newt being a "serious historian" too...

[SixthSense]

247. She's a raving lunatic

she should have a prescription, not a podium

[SecurityManager]

233. Protester in the crowd????? wtf was that????

Help???

[rainbow4321]

237. Good question...who or what was that? n/t

[SecurityManager]

243. I heard a mans voice and saw a guy walk behind Baier fast

Then it seemed for a second it got louder?

[this bird has flown]

240. I heard "Federal Reserve" so I assumed it was a Paul supporter

I was hoping it was an OWS mic check!

[Tx4obama]

248. All I heard was "Federal Reserve" too. n/t

[Cali_Democrat]

234. Newsflash to the Republicans

Ronald Reagan is DEAD and he was a shitty President.

[aletier_v]

260. Reagan is dead BUT...

there's nothing in the Constitution that bars him from being in the debate!

[coalition_unwilling]

236. Santorum is certainly a self-centered prick, isn't he? -n/t

[provis99]

238. shut up Bachmann. Reagan is dead, and so are his ideas.

[ellisonz]

253. AHHH! BRAINS!!!

*shuffle* *shuffle*

-What would a GOP Debate Thread be without Zombie Reagan?

[SecurityManager]

239. Closing remarks drum roll...............................

Anybody up here but Obama YAWN! O yea and Reagan blah blah fuckin blah!!

[flying rabbit]

241. Beating Obama is all we heve to do.

to Newt: isn't governing the country in a sane manner more important?

[flying rabbit]

244. I need a shower

I feel icky

[coalition_unwilling]

245. I'm glad Huntsman is polling so poorly, because he would give Obama

the toughest sledding of all of them.

[Tx4obama]

246. Time to switch back to MSNBC until the next GOP debate reality show :)

MSNBC: http://www.rentadrone.tv/msnbc-live-rockinroosters/

[oberliner]

249. FoxNews crew is saying this was a huge win for Newt

Shocker.

[SecurityManager]

250. O geez Juan Williams agreeing with the kraut man

I really liked Juan at one time

[Tx4obama]

251. MSNBC LIVE: Ed is doing a LIVE show with post-debate analysis right now.

http://www.rentadrone.tv/msnbc-live-rockinroosters/

[mvd]

255. The post-debate analysis by the MSNBC and Current TV liberals is all I watch

I can't stomach the debates.

[SecurityManager]

252. Hannity and Luntz about to spin the repub semen all over Newt!

UGH wheres that cutie Maddow

[Tx4obama]

256. Current TV is having post-debate analysis too. Live stream link below

Current TV: http://www.rentadrone.tv/special-viewings/

[47of74]

257. The girl in that pic of the moment...

...has the I skipped the Sexy Liberal Show for this?! look on her face.

[liam_laddie]

259. EarlG - is this an authentic picture?

It looks like a Kenny G concert crowd, or maybe Kate Smith. Really, is it an actual photo from tonight? If so, they are a sad, sad bunch of deluded R's. Almost comical, in fact. Tickles me funny bone!

[EarlG]

267. Yep

It's a real picture of the audience from last night's debate

[Bucky]

269. Kudos to Fox for running this show without a laugh track.

[DFW]

273. Correction--the GOP has had hardly any debates so far

They have had some farcical PR shows, but debates, where they discussed policy and world view differences?

There don't seem to have been many (if any) of those of late. Any time one of them, like Paul or Huntsman,
tries to seriously argue a viewpoint, the clowns hog the stage and bring the show back to its circus-like level
in a hurry. It more like a string of kids running for student council, except that my memory of kids in my school
running for student council had a much higher level of discourse. The Republicans seems to think the presidency
of the United States requires less sophistication than the person who represents the student body of a high
school--and if they DON'T think that, they disguise their feelings on the subject better than the winner of a Vegas
poker tournament.

[mmonk]

281. How can a circus of lies be reality?