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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsN.J. woman refuses to meet daughter she gave up for adoption after being raped over 30 years ago
N.J. woman refuses to meet daughter she gave up for adoption after being raped over 30 years agoIn 1964 when Kathleen Hoy Foley was 16 years old and pregnant from a rape, the New Jersey woman knew she didn’t want to raise a child. Abortion was illegal at the time, so she opted for a closed adoption with Catholic Charities.
She wanted to move on.
“The day I walked out of that hospital, it was the day it ended for me,” Foley, now 65, told the New York Daily News. “I was emancipated. I truly believed I was free.”
Foley kept the door closed on that horrible chapter of her life for many years, never telling her husband or daughters that she gave a baby up for adoption. She didn’t want anyone to know what happened. Over 30 years later she was forced to face the past.
Foley was contacted by the unwanted child she put up for adoption 15 years ago. How Elaine Penn found her birth mom is questionable. Foley claims Penn hired a private investigator and that Catholic Charities unlawfully passed over important information. With a closed adoption the birth certificate is supposed to remain sealed and the birth mom’s name never revealed.
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Penn, now age 48, became interested in meeting her birth parents after having her own child in 1996. First she found out that her biological father was dead and then she was rejected by Foley. She admitted to the New York Daily News that her mom’s reaction was like “a knife to my heart.”
“It’s really sad,” Penn added. “It is very hard for somebody in this time to put their brain back in 1964 in that society. I’ve never experienced it. But I would hope that whatever happens in that situation that at this point, I would get myself help and I wouldn’t take it out on the person I gave birth to.”
http://blog.sfgate.com/sfmoms/2013/03/11/n-j-woman-refuses-to-meet-daughter-she-gave-up-for-adoption-after-being-raped-over-30-years-ago/
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Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)and wanting to find out something about her heritage and ancestry and medical history. Sounds like Foley knew who the rapist was, if Penn found out he was dead.
kelliekat44
(7,759 posts)loving, caring for, watching over.... I My mom left me with my grandparents when I was six weeks old. i don't hate her for it and I understand her position. And I never felt her to my mother...my grandmother was mother to me. There is not attachment without contact and this mother surely feels no attachment to a daughter she has not seen, or held or raised in any way. If you are raised by a woman and never told if she is your mother or not, you don't know any difference. How many babies are switched at birth in the hospital and are taken home by someone who is not their mother, grow up only knowing and feeling that the woman who raised them is their mother. When they discover their real mom and dad, there is little attachment...all the feeling of attachment is with the parents who raised you.
tblue
(16,350 posts)The human heart is a deep well of secrets and convictions that are profoundly personal and unique. So while I can see both sides, I just hope Ms. Penn can understand and move on for both of their sakes.
southernyankeebelle
(11,304 posts)Ms Penn called the mother's son-in-law and other family members. She is kind of stalking her. I certainly can understand the bio mother. If she is this pushy. I do see both sides but I can't understand why Ms Penn can't realize that every time her mother would see her all she could see is raped. The mother wanted privacy in giving up the baby and it should have been respected. Honestly if it were me I don't think I would want to meet with her either. I think she overstepped the line once she went looking for extended family.
My husband was an adopted child. He was born in Germany and adopted by an american family when he was about 4 yrs old. On his birth certificate it showed the bio mother. In Germany that have a pretty good system of keeping a trail where people are. We were able to find his bio mother through relative in Germany. They wrote his Aunt. Of course they were worried what he wanted. All he wanted to do was connect say hello and find out his history. It ended up she married a man and moved to america. She had a son and we got to meet them all. Of course his half brother was leary of my husband. Their mother did a lot of comparing and that bothered my husband because it was interferring his relationship with his brother. My husband asked her not to do that. My husband was raised by wonderful people who did right by him. He was raised right and went into the military because he wanted to give back to a country that did alot for him. While his brother did all the wrong things. His brother resented it. It never worked out. It put a strain and finally it just didn't work out. So I always tell people to be careful when you are adopted and go looking for your natural parent. Sometimes things don't work out the way you want. If you want to know your medical history I think that is fair game and people should have to give that kind of information out and be happy with that.
kentuckyangel
(1 post)Most people visualize absolute horror with physical injury to the mother by her attacker and psychologically I don't think a woman ever gets over the trauma, the mental horror of what was done to her. This child was created out of a possible violent stranger circumstance who attacked her and might have tried to kill her and he might have gone to prison based on her identification or testimony. This is before DNA identification. We do not know all the facts. This birth mother was promised privacy which now this promise is violated. For her own private reasons she does not want to see or meet her daughter. The daughter might look like the rapist. We do not know what the birth mother has been through throughout her life. The rapist's relatives might hate that the birth mother's identification or testimony sent their relative to prison. We just do not have the whole story. This woman's rape and aftermath went on for 9 months and to meet this daughter would make her revisit what she suffered. No, it is not the child's fault, but she needs to understand and accept that her birth mother just can't handle meeting her. There is a book, The girls who went away,by Ann Fessler that discusses what times were like for these girls back then and those were girls who became pregnant by their boyfriends, and it had to be so much worse for young girls who had been raped. If abortion had been an option back then, this birth mother likely would have taken advantage of that option so she might harbor resentment toward the unwanted child she was forced by law to carry to term. She obviously never bonded with the baby she was forced to give birth to. Back then women were knocked out and never saw the infants or touched or held them. She endured a pregnancy against her will and just wanted this 9 month nightmare to finally end. So this has to be terrible for her to contemplate now. The birth daughter needs to understand and accept the birth mother's decision. She might not have finished school or been blamed by her relatives for "allowing" this to happen and bring shame to the family. We do not know what this girl who was 16 when she gave birth, really experienced and suffered long term as a result of winding up pregnant against her will. If she had been living in Ireland when this happened she might have wound up trapped doing laundry in a Catholic laundry for the rest of her life. The Magdalene Sisters documentary shows that this forced servitude trapped young women for the duration of their lives and these laundries were still operating in Ireland as late as 1996. I found my birth mother when I was 25 but my mother had not been raped, had not been a teen, and had been over 21 when she put me up for adoption. It was a different set of circumstances. I sympathize with the adoptee but I feel the birth mother of a rape situation should have her wishes for privacy trump those of the birth daughter. Medical history could be given via the agency that arranged the adoption.
catbyte
(39,009 posts)
Donald Ian Rankin
(13,598 posts)It's entirely possible for two consenting teenagers experimenting together to each be legally guilty of raping the other. Many jurisdictions try to formulate Romeo-and-Juliet laws to get around this, but it's never perfect.
All non-consensual sex is rape; statutory rape runs a continuum from "just as bad as nonconsensual sex" to "not a big deal at all".
This is one of the reasons why sex offenders registers are such a troubling idea.
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)Besides...men can't be raped, as such, by a woman, since his cooperation is necessary.
Donald Ian Rankin
(13,598 posts)
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)In 1977 there was a famous case. A former Miss Wyoming was obsessed with a particular guy who wanted nothing to do with her, sexually. While most men would jump at the chance, he didn't. He wasn't gay either, he was a strict Mormon. She got some of her guy friends to tie him in bed, take his clothes off and she got on top of him. Nature took its course, even though he didn't want to, he rose to the occasion and she raped him.
It happened in England, which had no statute to deal with that kind of rape.
In 2010 it was made into a documentary movie, Tabloid
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormon_sex_in_chains_case
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)....leveraged by statutory rape laws by their parents who didn't like the boyfriend, and threatened to have them arrested if the guy didn't break off contact, and/or the daughter didn't give up the child for adoption. Age differences of a year or two (this is crucial) used to break up a family forever. That shit happened all the time in 1964, and probably still does in some places where people don't have knowledge of their legal rights.
That's clearly not the case here, anyone who read the original story should figure that out....but it did/does happen. A former professor of mine found out he was the product of such a deal, and his mother reached out to him when he turned 18.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Thank you for pointing it to me.
Donald Ian Rankin
(13,598 posts)Ter
(4,281 posts)All forms are awful, but there are different levels. Saying a racist joke is disgusting. Now wanting your daughter to marry a black man is worse. But joining the KKK is far, far on a higher level of racism than the other two.
Likewise, a relationship of a 20 year old with a 17 year old is nowhere on the same level as forced rape.
TheOther95Percent
(1,035 posts)Last edited Tue Mar 12, 2013, 06:57 PM - Edit history (1)
http://womaninhiding.org/newsite/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=37&Itemid=56Woman in Hiding: A True Tale of Backdoor Abuse, Dark Secrets and Other Evil Deeds is a non-fiction narrative detailing the destruction of a child's spirit by her stepfather; how that destruction beckons a sexual predator who devours her young life and impregnates her, resulting in a confidential adoption and a lifetime of fear and trauma. And how at the hands of a stranger that haunting, catastrophic secret explodes inside an unsuspecting family and a marriage of 30 years.
renate
(13,776 posts)And wow, I'm going to look up that Magdalene Sisters documentary... I can't believe that even in Ireland women were still treated in such a Dickensian way in 1996. How horrible. 
Welcome to DU! 
smokey nj
(43,853 posts)There's also a movie called "The Magdalene Sisters" that was based on stories from the documentary. Sinead O'Connor served time in a Magdalene laundry.
Politicub
(12,327 posts)
Ruby the Liberal
(26,626 posts)Not real sure where I fall on this - I can definitely see both sides, but currently leaning one over the other. This thread should be fascinating.
REP
(21,691 posts)If I were that woman's daughter, I could not bear to bring more pain to her.
Dorian Gray
(13,850 posts)but when she began her search, she probably was completely unaware of the circumstances that led to her mother giving birth and letting her go for adoption. So the pain of the past was brought up unaware.
tblue37
(68,406 posts)birthmother wanted to be left alone, she continued to stalk her for 10 years, repeatedly trying to contact her and making contact with her family members whom she had never told about her past, thus exposing her secrets against her will.
Iris
(16,868 posts)How arrogant and self- centered can a person get?
Dawson Leery
(19,560 posts)Ruby the Liberal
(26,626 posts)She isn't anonymous by any stretch.
niyad
(131,618 posts)somebody revealed what was supposed to be sealed information.
so, I can see her writing a book about it ONCE HER PRIVACY WAS VIOLATED. please do not make it sound as though this was her choice, because it clearly was not.
Ruby the Liberal
(26,626 posts)before it was edited. 
BainsBane
(57,724 posts)I understood the mother's position until I read your comment and went back and saw that you are right. If she wants to remain anonymous, why the book?
niyad
(131,618 posts)was broken, I can see her writing a book. once again, her anonymity was taken from her, she did not give it up.
BainsBane
(57,724 posts)it only sheds further light on her. Now she is in the newspapers and online.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)She might have decided that so long as she's been forced to have a conversation about it, she might has well have the conversation she wants.
niyad
(131,618 posts)Last edited Mon Mar 11, 2013, 10:26 PM - Edit history (1)
BainsBane
(57,724 posts)
Tien1985
(923 posts)What kind of backlash she experience when Penn outed her. I can easily imagine how nasty people may have gotten, and writing about it would be a way to tell how it really was without having to deal with the nastiness of people face to face.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)has been made uncomfortable maybe worse by the illegal invasion of her privacy. That is what is wrong here.
She was a very young girl when she was raped. She wanted to live her life without the shadow of her rape hanging over her. That was her choice.
This story illustrates how important it is for women to have a choice when it comes to giving birth.
What this woman's life would have been like had she not kept her rape and illegitimate child a secret we cannot know. Judge not that ye be not judged. It was her decision, and it should have been respected.
JustAnotherGen
(37,979 posts)This story illustrates how important it is for women to have a choice when it comes to giving birth.
riqster
(13,986 posts)Choice, dammit. That is the point.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)I wonder if anyone ever bothered to document suicides that happened in young girls in such a horrible situation back in the 60s? I would imagine there were a few. I grew up in the 70s - 80s and with my Mother's attitude it would definitely have been an option I would have considered if I had ever had an unplanned pregnancy. Even if I were raped, I figured my Mother would blame me. I was just damned lucky.
That's what always sticks in my throat about stories like this, no one knows how accepting a girl's own parents would have been, or if an unplanned pregnancy or even rape would have been used a source of mental and emotional abuse from them for the rest of their lives. I used to have a friend (she passed from cancer a couple of years ago) who got an abortion when she was young and her parents tormented her with that to the point that she couldn't be around them, they continued to try to use it as emotional torture on her until their own deaths. They literally couldn't see their own child without abusing her with having an abortion. People like that are more heartless than a woman who gave a baby up for adoption and just doesn't want contact.
uppityperson
(116,011 posts)daughter, and do not know enough of the story to pass judgement on her. I feel sorry for the birth mother for not having her choice respected.
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)of any adoption many years ago. It is absolutely WRONG for ANYBODY to invade the privacy of any woman who gave her child up for adoption.
LiberalFighter
(53,544 posts)Unless the mother expressed interest in meeting by signing up giving permission if the daughter was interested it shouldn't have gone any further. All the daughter was doing was dragging up bad memory about what happen for the mother. Some people can handle it and others either can't or don't want to.
Warpy
(114,547 posts)their children and birth parents.
Somebody broke the law in this case.
Birth parents and adoptees both have the right to say "no," and this daughter needs to respect that.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)When I was still searching for my first-mother I had found my bio father who would not assist me in my history nor in finding my mother. Screw that. I am a human being and is owed knowledge of my history. I have since found my mother and we are very happily in reunion. My sisters and brother are also very happy that I have found them, for it was them and my mother's husband who have had to soothe her pain for as long as they have known her.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)I also find it sad they are basically pitted against one another in the media. No one wins here.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)I was 33 when my family and I found each other. I am fortunate that my result was a positive one.
I think that the daughter was wrong in how she went about things and I feel so badly for both of them. It's really a no win situation. fresh wounds all around.
I found my family through an old post they had put on an adoption registry. It wasn't exact to what I thought my information was, but it was close, so I took a chance.
My little sister contacted me and then together we contacted social services and they verified the match. It was pretty obvious from the pictures though.... I look EXACTLY like her. MY daughter looks just like my sister 
niyad
(131,618 posts)
Control-Z
(15,686 posts)adoption worked out so well.
I'm curious. Do you think adoptees are generally happy about their situation? I've heard about more negative outcomes than happy ones but I'm thinking that might be because the happy stories are exploited less.
Again. I am really happy for you and your family(s). 
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)I think that as with most things, you hear the negative more then the positive. I really couldn't guess at percentages though.
My parents made sure I always knew that I was adopted and that they chose me. I love them very much for that. They wanted a 2 year old healthy girl and instead got tricked by the nurses into seeing a very sick, failure to thrive 6 month old ....my mom said it was love at first sight and she never looked back.
Birth mom and adopted mom have met and that too went really well. They thanked each other
Dorian Gray
(13,850 posts)I've made the opposite choice to never meet the biologicals. I've had a positive upbringing and have been given many opportunities that I would have most likely missed having been raised by a 16 year old single mother.
It's occurred to me that my biological mother might want to meet me some day and I'm nowhere to be found on any registry. That makes me sad because I have absolutely no animosity toward her. But I can't consider anyone other than my mother and father who raised me since I was an infant to actually be my parents. (I am now 41 years old.)
truegrit44
(332 posts)I wasn't conceived from rape however. My birth mother was not married year 1946 a real problem at that time + she wasn't that "into" my father just an accident and she had things she wanted to do with her life and couldn't care for a child alone. Anyway, even tho mine was suppose to be a sealed adoption my birth mother demanded to know who the adoptive parents were and wouldn't sign final papers until she knew. So, she and my parents did meet and birth mother kinda kept up with me over the years, however I wasn't aware of that fact.
My mother did always let me know as I got older that anytime I wanted to meet my real mother she could put me in touch with her. I choose not too, I just never had the inclination to know her seemed really strange to me.
However, when I was about 38yrs old I did meet her and keep in touch with her per phone up until right now occasionally, she is now 96yrs old.
I have never formed any kind of attachment to her other than just knowing she is my real mother but other than that just feels like she is a casual friend. She never had any more children and has no idea what happened to my father and I never tried to locate him. I'm a very private person and I kinda think this is a private matter, so for ME I can see the mothers point of view in this story.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)
I went off on a rant below, but I am always so glad when people are able to truly and willingly find each other.
againMarrah_G
(28,581 posts)My younger sister was also a Wiccan. What are the chances of both of us being part of the same small religion.
I also have a brother, 10 aunts and uncles and a grandfather/grandmother. All living maybe 50 miles from where I was raised and my mother lived in the town we had a summer home in on Cape Cod when I was young.
Behind the Aegis
(56,089 posts)I wasn't adopted, but I was conceived by rape. My mother kept me, but I have had nothing to do with my biological father. My bio uncle made contact through various friends of my mother, and left it up to me to contact him. I did. I am glad I did, but I still have nothing to do with my bio father. I am an only child for him and I only have one cousin from that side, and we met last year. That was surreal. We have the same eyes.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)I have no interest in even finding out who my father is. My mother can't or won't say. It's too painful for her. I like to think that even though I have his genes, those genes also belong to thousands of other people who are probably good people so it doesn't reflect on me. My only though is some sadness that my mother was hurt when she was so young and vulnerable.
Rowdyboy
(22,057 posts)Hope that you've all come to appreciate each other. Thats what family really is.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)I have two families!
Rowdyboy
(22,057 posts)And also your fathers family. I have no idea why some stories have a happy ending but that never makes me appreciate them any less! Salut!
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)I don't remember ever not knowing that I was adopted. I grew up knowing it was normal, that I was loved, that I was chosen. My mother always told me that what my birth mother did was done out of love for me and she was right. She gets the credit for making being adopted a positive in my life and not a negative.
Adoption has a wonderful place in our society as long as it is done right. I think there are many, many happy stories out there.
Rowdyboy
(22,057 posts)I have two favorites, my niece Trisha and my nephew Chris. Trish is adopted, Chris is blood. Who gives a damn? I love them equally because they're my family and they know it and thats all that really matters.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)
Rowdyboy
(22,057 posts)other. I see my nieces and nephews as a crew of trouble-making brats and I love them with all my heart. Thats just how it is.
Hayabusa
(2,149 posts)I know the mother doesn't want any reminders of a very traumatic experience in her life, but on the other side of the coin, it's not like the daughter had anything to do with it.
Rowdyboy
(22,057 posts)Quite honestly, I don't know. I have an inclination to side with the mother mainly because she experienced the initial trauma that led to giving up a child, which must be the most incredibly difficult decision imagineable. However, I can see and understand the childs desire to know. But shouldn't the mother have some rights? I really am not sure what the answer is, or even if there is one.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)In 1964, she was raped. The conception was forced. The birth was forced; there was no legal "choice." Her only choice was a closed adoption that allowed her to leave the events in the past.
That choice was taken from her.
If we support a woman's right to choose, her right to choose not to connect with a child she gives up for adoption is part of that.
DevonRex
(22,541 posts)The mother would be terrified of seeing her rapist's face in the face of the child, and that it would make her react in the moment they met. Even if she knows logically she shouldn't, etc. But what if she did? That would be worse for the child, no matter how old she was by that time. That's one thing that would really, really weigh on my mind in that position.
And, what if the woman had never told her husband and family? She had the right to put it behind her and move on. In fact, in 1964 she would have had to pretend it never happened. That's how these things were done. Otherwise she would have been branded as a whore, no matter the circumstances. That's also how things were done in 1964.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)My Mother despised this one little girl I went to grade school with and ALWAYS told me to not have anything to do with her and that her Mother was nothing but TRASH. Why? Her mother gave birth to her as a single Mom in 1964.
DevonRex
(22,541 posts)horrible back then for the mothers and the child, if the child wasn't given up. It reminds me of another thing, too. Just how many girls would have wanted to keep their babies but had no choice. To go through that and mourn all that time just because society blamed only women, never men, and would have treated the child badly too.
How messed up it was.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)niyad
(131,618 posts)to sound like a heartless creature out to hurt the daughter. and the daughter "well, I would have just gotten help" her comment that she cannot imagine what it was like in the 60's is probably the most intelligent statement she has made.
This is a terribly sad situation all the way around. and I hope all parties involved can find some kind of peace.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)"Foley was contacted by the unwanted child she put up for adoption 15 years ago."
The birth mother probably should have put the child up for adoption before the child was over 30 years old.
Ilsa
(64,222 posts)She was raped and got pregnant and adopted out the baby in 1964. Where is the author getting this "15 years ago" number and setup?
This must be misplaced modifier: the mother was contacted 15 years ago about a baby she adopted out in 1964.
niyad
(131,618 posts)in 64.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)DevonRex
(22,541 posts)gollygee
(22,336 posts)Forced intercourse against her will, then forced to give birth against her will, her information given against her will, then forced to have a relationship against her will? Should she have anything else forced upon her? I've heard there are situations where rape victims can be forced to pay child support to their rapists. Hmm, what else can we come up with?
I do feel bad for the woman who was hoping to meet her birth mother, but not bad enough that I think this woman should be forced to have a relationship she doesn't want, or any contact at all. She's had control taken away from her over and over again. If my math is right, she's 65 years old and she was raped a half century ago, and yet it's still controlling her life.
Edit: OK, yes, before anyone responds, "controlling her life" is overstatement. I'm sure she has some control over her life.
niyad
(131,618 posts)lunasun
(21,646 posts)and who let the name out ? Closed is closed!
If she wanted to reopenthe file for contact it should have been her choice
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)If you're trying to convince women to do the right thing when they are birthing a baby they do not want - for any reason- you need to respect that she has made that difficult decision. Society should not try to force her.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)My bio father is a scumbag and doesn't want communication with me. I don't want a relationship with him either, but I am owed my history.
Tikki
(15,097 posts)single mothers and their children. That would be fulfilling.
Tikki
dsc
(53,371 posts)Yes, give the child medical information, list of diseases and the like, but if a woman gives up her child for adoption, then it should stay given up if the woman wants it that way. Similarly, if a woman has given up her child for adoption she shouldn't be able to hunt the child down either.
pnwmom
(110,241 posts)So a willing biological parent and adult child can find each other?
dsc
(53,371 posts)TheMadMonk
(6,187 posts)...via a full on official change of records request via the appropriate statuatory bodies.
pnwmom
(110,241 posts)where the only names listed are biological parents and adoptees who decide to submit their own names and state they are open to being contacted?
Hekate
(100,133 posts)... indicating willingness to meet. If they both do that, by all means proceed with my blessings.
pnwmom
(110,241 posts)People who are willing to be contacted sign up with their info.
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)This daughter found out the truth, so she needs to leave the birth mother alone.
In 1964, she was pretty much forced to give birth, too. She should be left alone.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Is it practical? Now that we know, we don't want to end up marrying a sibling or cousin by accident. I think we have to know who we are biologically related to, now that we know it has a lot to do with our medical history.
dsc
(53,371 posts)the fact is if adoptions don't remain closed then women will be less likely to give up their babies for adoption which would be a horrible policy outcome.
Samurai_Writer
(2,934 posts)Actually, the opposite is true. This is making news because it is RARE that a birthmother doesn't want to be found. Today, 'open' adoptions are the norm, because agencies figured out that after Roe v. Wade (mostly in the 80s and after), they couldn't just force girls into closed adoptions. So they switched tactics, ensuring these 'open' adoptions that are not legally enforceable -- the adoptive parents can close them off at any time. Honestly, do you think closed adoption was invented because society was thinking of these poor, single, unwed mothers? No... it was invented because of the 'bad seed' theory... and the adoptive parents didn't want these 'tramps' having any access to the baby. Most young women weren't even allowed to see their own children after birth, BEFORE their parental rights were relinquished and the adoptive parents claimed the child.
The case of a child being conceived from rape AND given up for adoption is rather rare, especially in these times. The closed adoption laws were not written with rape victims in mind.
HOWEVER... I do believe that once the daughter had made first contact, and was rejected, she should have left the woman alone. The mother could provide medical history (which changes over time) through the adoption agency.
dsc
(53,371 posts)has already made up her mind that she wants nothing to do with the child for whatever reason. I find it hard to believe that such a woman would want there to be a probability of being tracked down later. As to your other point, I think it is perfectly reasonable to not want to deal with a birth mother because they are real parents who should have all the right of real parents including not having to share the child with a birth mother. Now, if the enter in to the adoption agreeing to deal with the birth mother being in the picture, then that is one thing. But if they didn't then they shouldn't have to deal with a birth mother no matter what kind of person the mother is.
Samurai_Writer
(2,934 posts)I'd be interested to know how you reach the conclusion that because a young woman 'chooses' adoption, that she wants nothing to do with her child. She will not be the legal parent, but that doesn't make her some faceless womb. The majority of birthmothers WANT to be found, whether from closed or 'open' adoptions.
And your comment about adoptive parents 'not having to deal with the birthmothers' is quite revealing. I bet if you had an adopted child, and suddenly that child needed bone marrow, or a kidney, or had a rare or disabling medical disease/disorder, you'd want to find that birthmom immediately.
Adoption should be about the child, and what is best for him and her. And pretending that the woman who gave birth to your child doesn't exist, and keeping her away out of fear, is not in the best interest of the child. IF that birthmother lost that child due to abuse, neglect, etc, that is one thing. But the majority of birthmoms voluntarily surrender their child for adoption as newborns. There is no need to fear they are going to usurp your authority as a parent or harm the child in any way.
dsc
(53,371 posts)about the child having been deprived of parents. The fact is our society doesn't respect adoptive parents and one big reason is we don't count them as real. Your post is typical of the genetic fetish our society has. Your parents are the people who stayed up with you when you were sick, helped you with your homework, put a roof over your head, and a host of other things parents do. It isn't the person who happened to give birth to you or provided sperm.
Samurai_Writer
(2,934 posts)I adore my son's adoptive parents... they are his 'real' parents... I never implied otherwise. All I said is that most birthmothers /do/ want to at least know if their child is alive and doing well, and it is an adoptee's right to know about their birth family if they want. And it's definitely their right to know their medical history. It is not a matter of 'nature vs. nurture'. Both are important.
uppityperson
(116,011 posts)If it went on for a couple generations, there could be a problem but not so much for only 1 generation.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)The famous issues of European royalty took many generations to arise.
"Accidentally" having kids with a biological sibling is only slightly more likely to cause health issues than having kids with a non-relative. If it's a single generation.
And with the internet there are plenty of ways to find each other if both parties want it.
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)The mother has every right to have expected to not be contacted since the daughter was conceived through an act of violence.
Why is this so hard to understand?
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)consent. Why is this so cut and dry to you?
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Her forced female biological parent did not deprive her of anything and has no responsibility for anything.
HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)That was an off comment by Ed, I have no interest in his reply though. I have read enough.
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)Was she not adopted????
So, as an adoptee myself, you are telling me that I was deprived of parents?
I think that my Mom and Dad, as well as my brother and I, would seriously beg to differ!!! My Dad, who worked 2 jobs to put me through private school? My Mom who worked hard, came home and made dinner every night? You mean those 2 who put a roof over my head? Held me when I was sick or scared?
Shame on you for that post.
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)Should her mother have been forced to marry her rapist father too? Then she would have had "parents". Has she contacted "Daddy Dearest" too? Closed should mean CLOSED except for medical history.
Her ADOPTIVE parents, who raised her, ARE her parents. I guess they mean nothing at all to her, do they?
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)nt
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)Shame on you for treating a fellow D.U.er with such disdain.
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)Are you adopted?
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)acknowledge their feet might hurt.
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)nt
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)Plural. She was looking for TWO parents.
Edit: She admitted herself she has "problems". Oh, yeah, I agree with that. Only your BIOLOGICAL parents can be parents? She is totally dissing the people who raised her. Her ADOPTIVE parents.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)is out of line. Life has horrible and tragic consequences. I'm not saying that the mother should be forced into a reunion or whatever, I just don't think it's fair that the unwanted product of a rape is viewed as a villain for seeking out the direct link to her heritage.
There is more to it than a FOX news-like "Both sides of the issue" argument. There is nuance and layers and deep seeded repressed emotion for both people involved extending to both genetic and adopted families.
I refuse to let you paint me as the bad guy because I can see there might be pain and issues dealing with the tragedy from both sides.
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)This happens all the time and not just with the children of rape. No, means NO. Have you ever heard that women do say that one reason for aborting unwanted children is that they don't want them searching for them years later? To quote my Aunt, as a middle aged married grandmother at the time in the 1950s, "One reason (among others) WE, her husband's child too, decided for an abortion was that we didn't want an adopted out child looking for us in our old age." She told me this when she was in her 80s.
Blunt? That is what she said. I guess they didn't trust "closed" adoptions.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)condition of here parentage. I'm simply at a loss to figure out how people in this thread could in clear conscience vilify the offspring for want to connect. I'm not saying it's easy or right. I'm simply stating that it must be hard when you want to so badly to meet your biological mother/father and you aren't able to for whatever reason. I feel the daughter's pain on some level. Does that make me an evil and heartless misogynist prick who cares not for the wishes of one who was raped? I don't think so contrary to popular belief. I'm simply acknowledging the existence of two, most likely more, victims each with their own feelings and agendas. Neither agenda less valid than the others.
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)gave her LOVE and NUTURED her. She needs to let go of her biological mother who was raped as a teen and forced to get birth to her. She didn't want to be contacted as a teenager, and still doesnt't in her latter years as an old woman.
I had a friend who was raped, and beaten and knifed, as an 11 year old on her way home from school in the early 60s. Fortunately, the police took her immediately to a hospital where her parents (Catholics BTW) consented for her to be giving high dosages of BC pills (today's Morning After Pill) so she wouldn't conceive a rapist baby. My friend told me years later that if she was forced to bear a rapist baby, she would have jumped from her 14th floor apartment, killing both herself and the child. As it was, she was tormented for years afterward. Even her father could not touch her. I can imagine what this woman must have gone through being forced to have this rape baby she didn't want.
Her daughter needs to let it go, and accept the love from her ADOPTIVE PARENTS. and move on with her life. As I said on my other post, solely giving birth does not a mother make. It is the years of nurturing which does.
me b zola
(19,053 posts) 
TwilightGardener
(46,416 posts)The biological mother is entitled to her feelings and her privacy.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Can we talk about the uncle who never saw his niece in Idaho next?
JI7
(93,483 posts)given out.
pnwmom
(110,241 posts)in front of the news media, on opposing sides regarding some adoption legislation currently under consideration in NJ.
The daughter got hold of some confidential files related to the woman who gave her up -- and made them public.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)So anything to perpetuate the secrecy and lies of the infant trade gets pushed to the front. You will ignore the pleas of thousands biologicals searching for each other via social media wih just one demented story like this one.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)I'm sorry for the daughter Elaine Penn's disappointment, but she is a grown woman who presumably was raised by people who loved her dearly. But she said, “It’s really sad... It is very hard for somebody in this time to put their brain back in 1964 in that society. I’ve never experienced it. But I would hope that whatever happens in that situation that at this point, I would get myself help and I wouldn’t take it out on the person I gave birth to.”
Honestly, I just wanted to slap her one. I was 16 in 1964 too. If she cannot muster the empathy to wrap her head around the circumstances of a 16 year old being raped at any time, she needs some serious help herself. THIS IS NOT HER PERSONAL FANTASY world that another person is obligated to fulfill.
Somewhere deep inside her biological mother is a 16 year old little girl who just tried to get on with her life and never told anyone because of the deep, deep shame she felt. Shame on top of shame, because she got pregnant from it and then everyone knew. THAT was 1964. If you as a teenager got pregnant even from your boyfriend, forget about "wanting to raise a child," because chances were very good your parents would send you to the Booth Home or its equivalent as soon as you started to "show" and then your baby would be taken from you before you even got to hold it or name it. My Gods, WE ALL KNEW THAT. 
Sacrifice your firstborn on the altar of social acceptability, suck up the grief and walk away.
Elaine should just grow up. Her parents were not in love, and that is a very sad fact. Her very young mother was raped. She should be glad her biological father was dead already -- ewwww, did she fantasize a "relationship" with him, too?
The person I truly feel sorry for is Kathleen Foley. She gave up her baby for adoption to a family who would love it, and out of a sense of shame for something that was in no way her fault she carried that secret for decades. She made a new life for herself. And then a stranger came and turned everything upside down and inside out. I hope that Elaine can learn a sense of compassion and understanding for the girl who gave birth to her and did the best she could.
Okay, rant off.
There were an abundance of adoptions in the 1950s and 1960s, when I was growing up. With young girls being forced to give up their babies, of course there were plenty of babies available. As a consequence I have 2 adopted cousins, in 2 separate families. I have many friends in my age cohort who were adopted.
At a certain point I realized (probably along with the rest of the country) that propaganda aside, adoptees really did want to know who their biological families were, no matter how much they loved the Mom and Dad who raised them. I do know one happy outcome, from a woman who was a "love child" in the 1930s. By the time she went looking for her original mother in the 1990s, that woman and her grown children were ready and open. For the first time in her life she was surrounded by people who looked like her, moved like her, talked like her. It was a heartwarming experience. But I know of two other reconnections that did not go well at all.
I just think that there should be a way of leaving a message with the agency or the county or whoever. Bio-mom leaves a message saying, If you ever come looking, here's how to find me. Adult adoptee (18+ years?) leaves a message saying, I am looking for you. But proceed cautiously. You just do not know a stranger's circumstances.
There was a family friend of my parents who was adopted (probably in the late 1920s or early '30s) and ended up having to adopt her own 3 kids. Ironically she found herself at the same agency that had placed her as an infant, and -- in an echo of the unprofessional behavior of someone at Catholic Charities -- when her file got pulled the social worker said something like, "Aha! you are the scion of an extremely wealthy and well-known family here in Los Angeles! Would you like to know who?" My mother's friend said, "Have they ever at any time asked after me?" When the answer was "No" she said she did not want to know who they were. Personally, I think she was wise.
Hekate
The daughter should have never tracked the mother down. There are search sites out there where people can find each other IF THEY WANT TO BE FOUND.
JI7
(93,483 posts)if she wanted to take it out on the person she gave birth to she wouldn't have put her up for adoption but kept her and harmed her for what the rapist who was the bio father did to her.
i find the woman put up for adoption to be ignorant and selfish.
Tikki
(15,097 posts)and the fact that the adoption was closed would be a clue that the woman suffered
a great trauma.
Penn needs to accept the fact that she is here, is loved and maybe she could volunteer at rape crisis
center...it may help her understand that reality.
Tikki
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)
fizzgig
(24,146 posts)the last bit of this quote makes her look so. “It’s really sad,” Penn added. “It is very hard for somebody in this time to put their brain back in 1964 in that society. I’ve never experienced it. But I would hope that whatever happens in that situation that at this point, I would get myself help and I wouldn’t take it out on the person I gave birth to.”
this woman has no respect for her birth mother.
edit: as far as adpotees rights, i think they should be given a copy of their parents' medical history with the identifying information redacted.
Spirochete
(5,264 posts)her father's tendency to push him/herself on people when he/she is not wanted. not that rape and stalking are the same thing, but both indicate an attitude that it's only what they want that's important, and other peoples' wishes don't matter.
applegrove
(131,665 posts)anyone who had anything to do with it. I have PTSD. I don't want to make my health situation any worse than it already is or my life so much harder. I see it from the mom's perspective too I guess I'm saying. Of course it is not the young woman's fault she was the result of a crime. Very tough on all the people involved.
MrSlayer
(22,143 posts)If abortion were legal she'd have had one. As it is, she gave the baby up and walked away, never told anyone, forgot about it all. And now this person comes along, unwanted, and ruins everything for this poor woman. Has to relive the rape horror, the shame. Has to tell people that she didn't want to know about it. It's just wrong all around.
How about being happy with the people that did want you and did raise you? Your parents.
Sen. Walter Sobchak
(8,692 posts)and when everything was on the table wished they had never picked the scab. All they found were two very tragic stories and the only living DNA contributor serving a life sentence for murder.
From a very young age they realized they were adopted, they were both blue-eyed and blond/blonde and their adoptive mother was Japanese and father Jewish. The elder of the two was driven by a recollection of an older sister and just a desire to know more than just that she had been born in San Francisco. The younger had no recollection of anyone other than his adoptive parents but went along for the ride.
JoDog
(1,353 posts)It is the opinion of my PI brother that many adopted children will not like what they find if they search for their birth families. By all means, look for connection websites to see if voluntary information is available and try to get medical records, but other than that, be prepared for the chance of some painful truth.
Sen. Walter Sobchak
(8,692 posts)The eldest of the two found her mother had been hit by a car stumbling through traffic on drugs several years after she had been taken away. Her father was serving life for murdering a gang member and the older sister she recalled did indeed exist but was not the sort of person she wanted to make contact with.
The younger of the two found practically nothing other than that his mother was a missing person and assumed to have been murdered in the summer of 1992. At the time of his adoption she was in prison for an armed robbery and subsequently went back prison for stabbing another woman. At the time of her disappearance she had racked up a ton of recent drug, assault and prostitution related charges.
Their mom warned them that their birth mothers were not naive unwed teenagers, but was supportive of the endeavor none-the-less. Both are extremely successful and were made physically ill when they contemplated how their lives might have turned out had the State of California not snatched them.
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)Her mother was a prostitute and addict. She didn't even know who the father was. The state of NY took her daughter, and son, away from her and put them in foster care. She was given the right to see her children. Because of her lifestyle, her daughter by the time she was 12 refused to go see her. The girl did not want to go to her home because of the drugs and difference Johns all around. It was very dangerous for a young girl to be in a place like that.
Her foster parents went before a judge to get maternal rights denied. The girl, then 13, testified before the judge. The court ruled in favor of the daughter and her foster parents. After this, they adopted both the girl and her brother.
My daughter's friend is now almost 30 years old, and has not seen in 16 years, or wants to see, her biological mother.She considers her foster/adoptive parents as her parents.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)JoDog
(1,353 posts)But what part of that post was a lie? I simply wrote what is my brother's professional opinion, as he stated it to me.
If you are going to be so rude as to call me a liar, at least have the decency to explain yourself so I may correct any problems that may be in the post. Although there are none in that one. A statement of opinion, even that of someone else, can be neither truth nor lie. It is only an opinion.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Sorry, this woman is despicable. Just read her words. It's horrendous.
No one owns her anything. Period. Get bloody used to it.
Her biological female parent has all my sympathy and support.
that's quite a characterization.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Sorry, she soundss like a holier than my arse little arsehole.
Well, do get yourself some help, please. And a little bit of friggin compassion would be nice too.
Her female biological parent was raped and forced to give birth. That wasn't enough. Lets wait 40 years and victimise her all over again.
WOW indeed.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)Wanting to connect with a biological parent seems natural to me. The whole situation is horrible and unfortunate, but to call either victim in this tragedy an arsehole demonstrates a real lack of empathy. We have no right to take sides in this. Just chalk it up to tragic, work to find a way that it won't happen to anyone else, and remain human. Don't be finger-pointing and finger-wagging. Just agree that it's a shitty situation all the way around.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Biological offspring should have used available legal means of contact. That's what adoption registry is for. No one owns her anything.
Her being conceived through rape doesn't make her a victim of a crime. When she embarked on illegally tracking down her biological parents she should have thought twice what might have happen instead of picturing Kodac moments from last Oprah show.
JI7
(93,483 posts)the birth daughter is selfish and ignorant.
really, how the fuck can't you understand why a woman who was raped may not want to see you ? it's not blaming her but it is a reminder. some people can get passed it but others can't.
Tien1985
(923 posts)It is a crappy situation all around.
IMO, it's Penn's words that are hanging her. Implying that the birth parent should "get help" because she wants privacy is heartless and ignorant. For myself, I felt bad for both of them until I read the quote. She seems to be missing the fact that given the woman had a choice, she likely wouldn't have been here at all.
Response to Ed Suspicious (Reply #82)
HangOnKids This message was self-deleted by its author.
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)Closed adoption is closed adoption.
I have no desire to ever meet my birth parents. I had a Mom and Dad. Enough said.
The daughter did the wrong thing, IMO.
JI7
(93,483 posts)there might be some curious to know why and who they were but not much beyond that. as you say they have their own family that raised them and it's just like anyone else who grew up with whoever raised them .
Dorian Gray
(13,850 posts)I was interested in getting my medical history, but I got genetic testing instead. I've never been interested in meeting my biologicals, though I might be mildly interested to learn why I was given up. As long as I didn't meet them. I've got my parents.
I looked nothing like my parents. I am 5'11", blonde and blue eyed. My parents had dark hair and dark eyes. My Mom was kinda short. But I didn't care. We were a family. All of my cousins were my cousins....all of my Aunts and Uncles were my Aunts and Uncles....my brother was my brother...
Back in the day, they were able to match up nationalities pretty closely. Plus, where I was born was mostly Polish....so I am actually the same nationalities of my parents.
Anyway, I digress...
me b zola
(19,053 posts)No, its not the same/
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)My parents didn't fucking buy me. They SAVED me. I was 6 months old, 10 pounds and in a hospital. They rescued me and gave me a wonderful childhood. I am now 42 and they are my rock.
Your choice of words is really offensive to me.
Dorian Gray
(13,850 posts)I've never been interested in meeting my biological mother or father, but I do see both sides to this. I view the parents who raised me, however, as my only parents, and I don't feel as though I need to search for my biologicals to feel a sense of who I am. I hope that they haven't searched for me. (I had a closed adoption, as well.)
JoDog
(1,353 posts)who sometimes has potential clients who offer him these kind of cases--adopted children who are now adults who want to find their birth parents.
He very rarely takes these cases, and this story is an example of why. From what he tells me, many of the adopted want to satisfy their curiosity and frequently have romantic ideas about their conceptions. As he says, "Each one is convinced their mother was a head cheerleader, their dad a football captain, and their parents kept them apart tragically like Romeo and Juliet." Experience has taught him the stories often are not so pretty.
My brother knows that they eventually will find a PI willing to take the case, so he warns them, "Think long and hard about this. It is very likely you will find out that your life started as a crime, a betrayal, or a tragedy. Your birth parents may want nothing to do with you. Can you handle that if it happens? It may be better to accept the life you have than chase after another one."
The only times he has taken these cases are when the adopted child needed to know about parental and family health history because of a possible or diagnosed disease.
mercuryblues
(16,343 posts)did know who raped her.
Kathleen has been violated over and over again by people who believe their wants are greater than Kathleen's rights.The rapist who decided that she had no right to say no. The society that decided they knew her better than she knew herself, forcing her to give birth to her rapist's child. Then the child who decided that she wanted to find and contact Kathleen, overrode Kathleen's right to remain anonymous.
Kathleen never told her husband about this until she was forced to.
Here is an article with more detail:
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/adoptee-search-birth-mother-ends-rejection-article-1.1284242#ixzz2NGUY2PLo
idwiyo
(5,113 posts) 
Crepuscular
(1,068 posts)I was adopted in a closed adoption, born in the 60's, so in a similar time frame to the story in question. I was adopted at 6 months and was raised by wonderful parents, had a really idyllic childhood and would not have wanted to change anything. I've never made any attempt to find my biological parents but I have to say that I've always had some mild curiosity about them. The limited information that was provided in my records raises more questions then it provides answers. I have no desire to have a relationship with my biological parents but there is a more than reasonable likelihood that I have half siblings and it would be interesting to find out whether that's the case. As far as the story that is the subject of this thread, I think that adopted children have a right to information regarding their biological backgrounds, more than the limited information provided in sealed adoptions of that era but that right does not include the guarantee of a relationship. An overture was made and rejected, that should suffice. Anything past that is an intrusion of privacy.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)
More than 30 years later, the child defied the odds and found her, shattering the life Foley had created and forcing her to reveal a dark piece of her past that she had wanted to keep hidden from her grown daughters and husband.
“It was beyond devastating,” said Foley. “My life before that and after that are two different things.”
...
The adoptee, Foley said, then went even further and began contacting her family.
The most hurtful offense, she said, came when the woman reached out to her son-in-law, a lawyer, who then revealed Foley’s past to his wife, Foley’s daughter.
“It was horrible,” Foley said. “It was humiliating, degrading, dehumanizing.”
Elaine Penn, the adoptee, acknowledged she made contact with Foley’s son-in-law. Penn said at the time she simply thought he was Foley’s attorney.
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/adoptee-search-birth-mother-ends-rejection-article-1.1284242#ixzz2NGUY2PLo
Mother would have been best served if abortion had been legal at the time.
niyad
(131,618 posts)about rape survivors:
There may be no solution for Foley or Penn, but Foley said she is instead focused on helping others in similar situations realize that there is life after pregnancy from rape.
“I was always taught that it was my fault,” she said. “It’s a long process of acknowledging, understanding — but you can liberate yourself.”
(apparently she did know the rapist, since he was a senior at her high school)
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/adoptee-search-birth-mother-ends-rejection-article-1.1284242#ixzz2NLIxkwlQ
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)her for wanting to not relive that experience.
I guess the daughter got her father's behavioral genes.
Mr Dixon
(1,185 posts)This is one of the truly sad stories I have read this year, I feel for both parties, but I think the mother has a right to be left alone in regards to the situation.
Heidi
(58,846 posts)Outside of a possible need for medically-related information, I cannot think of a single reason to contact my biological parents. Even then, I would ask my attorney to make the contact. My right to privacy is not less valuable than my biological parents' rights to privacy.
By her comment, Ms. Penn strikes me as feeling she is owed contact with her biological mother, and her comment ("...I would get myself help and I wouldn't take it out on the person I gave birth to." is just hateful.
HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)Foley got help, she got the child adopted. I smell a different angle here, Penn is looking for money. Her adopted family is not as wealthy as Foley's is my take. She wants something here and it is not family love. IMHO Penn sounds like a grifter and a jerk.
Response to HangOnKids (Reply #116)
Heidi This message was self-deleted by its author.
Response to idwiyo (Reply #148)
Heidi This message was self-deleted by its author.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)I do like your posts though and always read them.
Response to idwiyo (Reply #160)
Heidi This message was self-deleted by its author.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Hel with it, I am going to create a Facebook page under this name. That would be my first one and its your fault.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)I don't see that she's "taking it out on the person she gave birth to", she has tried to go on with her life after horrific emotional pain, probably with no access to psychological help during the ordeal back in 1964 either. I hate that the daughter has not gotten the happy ending she wanted, but does anyone really have the right to expect that someone else be able to give her that? Her birth mother was a 16 year old girl raped into pregnancy for God's sake.
I can understand asking for family history of disease and such, fine, but contact and a relationship shouldn't be "demanded" to the point that you are, in effect, defaming the birth mother by your actions.
There has to be a way that vital medical histories can be given to adoptees without an undesired relationship being forced upon the birth parent when it is not wanted. There are people who just can't give that, some things in life just aren't going to happen.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)~snip~
Foley claims she wants nothing to do with Elaine, was destroyed by being "found." However she is publicizing a book, or a second book, she is writing about her life and giving up a child for adoption who later is able to find out who she, Foley, is. If someone wants to stay out of the limelight, you would think that she would not write two books about it. The cover design of the first, Woman in Hiding, a True Tale of Back Door Abuse, Dark Secrets and Other Evil Deeds, is so putridity bad it is
laughable--reminiscent of horror art done by demented adolescents--and I imagine indicative of the verbiage inside. Certainly it is a good thing that the Daily News saw fit to use it because it announces that there is something amiss here. One could see Foley's pathetic attempts to garner sympathy as the fallout of the trauma of giving up a child, and the guilt she feels over that act. However, what come across is anything but sympathetic, but rather, sick.
WHAT TO CALL HER?
It's hard to even know what words to use in writing about this because Foley calls herself a "maternal source" or "biological source," rather than a birth/first mother. Elaine is trying to walk away from her "biological source's" false accusations that she has been stalked, etc., because they have never even met. Elaine was merely trying to find out who she--Elaine--was! The short story is that Elaine, without getting her name or identifying information from Catholic Charities, was able to find her mother, aka, Foley. Elaine spoke to a lawyer on a public deed related to Foley, and discovered he was Foley's son-in-law. Elaine has never even called Foley. However, Elaine says she has relationships with other members of her maternal family, who found her through Ancestry.com, and she also has a relationship with her paternal family, both of whom insist that what Foley writes is not true. Does Foley's family gather at Thanksgiving? But I digress.
~more @ link~
http://www.firstmotherforum.com/2013/03/to-stay-in-closet-dont-publicize-being.html#links
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)me b zola
(19,053 posts)idwiyo
(5,113 posts)This poor woman is Rape victim who was victimised over and over and over. To call her a sociopath is absolutely beyond the pale.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)People intentionally choose not to see the reality of the billion dollar industry that is the infant trade. See no evil. Hear no evil. Speak no evil.
But when someone so twisted up from the cluster-fuck that is adoption speaks up to perpetuate the rancid industry that exists on secrecy and lies, well everyone responds with sympathy for the devil.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Now you totally went off the rail.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)Sit with that for awhile.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)The lady who is a rape survivor had no power in the "adoption industry" when she was 16, destroyed, and desperate. I don't believe blaming her for the wrongs of an industry is appropriate or helpful.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)....off this real life soap opera.
"One could see Foley's pathetic attempts to garner sympathy as the fallout of the trauma of giving up a child, and the guilt she feels over that act."
So that's what this is about? Shaming a woman for her choice? That makes me sick. I don't know that writing a book was a wise thing to do, but the timeline as to who went public with this garbage is important.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)Lorraine is a first-mother and activists who lives for reform of a sick system that trades infants as if they are commodities and treats first-mothers as if they are brood mares.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)They did not live this woman's life. They don't get to speak for her and how she should feel about her decision all those years ago.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)She is biological parent, rape survivor and you are totally out of bounds. Shame on you.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)idwiyo
(5,113 posts)HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)me b zola
(19,053 posts)...and I am a mother and grandmother.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)To do with their biological offspring they were forced to produce. She has every right to feel as she feels.
Maybe it bothers you but it's not your business to dictate to her what she should call herself.
You have no right to dictate to her how she should and shouldn't behave.
Shameful.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)Last edited Tue Mar 12, 2013, 02:17 PM - Edit history (1)
...and is shameful. Ask my first mother whom was forced to relinquish me. Her husband of 47 years and subsequent children have had to comfort her pain particularly on the date of my birth.
I will meet her in person for the first time this summer. Shame on any and everyone who perpetuates the infant trade.
on edit: I said "shame" on those perpetuating the infant trade. What I really mean is a pox on those perpetuating the infant trade.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Is this what you are trying to say?
me b zola
(19,053 posts).and contacted the adoption agency wanting information before she would sign papers.
niyad
(131,618 posts)nor is it in any of the other sources I have read. Link, please
Hekate
(100,133 posts)However, a 16 year old girl was raped. What about her choices? What about her life? Was she supposed to be forced to raise the child of her rapist? Because, please think about this -- if adoption was not an alternative to being forced to keep the baby, what other alternative would you suggest?
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Because everyone's life is exactly like yours, right?
All mothers who give up babies for adoption really, really don't want to, right?
The world is much larger than you believe. There are a host of situations that arise. Your case is your case. It is not all cases.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)My life is not one of abuse or shame.
I'm going to put you on ignore for a while because frankly, what I want to say to you would probably get hidden.
HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)Bye.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)...it doesn't fit into
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)I have one mother....the one who raised me.
And I was not adopted through a "billion dollar industry". I was born in the 60s and adopted through Catholic Charities. No money changed hands. Just a lot of time and love.....
Taverner
(55,476 posts)You really can't
Xithras
(16,191 posts)Apparently the now-deceased biological fathers family insists that it "wasn't really rape". The daughter has a relationship with that family and agrees with their assessment that she was a "mistake", but wasn't really rape. The family has openly called Foleys description of the conception "untrue" and a "mischaracterization". All these years later, this poor woman is STILL facing accusations that her rape wasn't a "real rape", and now her own biological daughter has joined that chorus.
The daughter is also one of these real anti-adoption nutjobs who believes that all adoption is evil, and is tantamount to a modern day slave trade. Apparently she believes that biological mothers should be legally forced to associate with their offspring. According to one claim, she's even gone as far as to attack Facebook pages of newly adoptive families who are celebrating their new arrivals, accusing them of stealing children from their birth families and robbing them of their real heritage.
I had a bit of empathy for her after reading the initial article, but that empathy quickly evaporated as I continued reading. She apparently inherited her people-skills from her father.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Maybe still an unwise choice, but if Foley is being slandered by someone that angry and unhinged, I can see why she felt she had to go big with her defense.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Biological offspring did sound like one of those.
Also this might Elaine post 115. Have a look at it.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)One of the reviewers is "E. Penn" -- the daughter. Others piled on in a pretty coordinated fashion, one calling Foley (the rape survivor) an "evil crone," "Mommie Dearest," and "a depraved, empathy free woman." The negative reviewers sound like friends of "E. Penn."
It's taking me awhile to get to the more supportive voices, but they are there. At least one made the point that daughter is like father: unable to take "no" for an answer.
It is interesting that she has developed a relationship with her late father's family, accepting their word that no way was her conception by rape.
Shankapotomus
(4,840 posts)Last edited Tue Mar 12, 2013, 12:44 PM - Edit history (1)
(and I'm not presuming i can), it seems having to meet the child one never wanted in the first place would just be an extension of the rape, would it not?
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)sounds absolutely horrifying. Never mind all the people who condemn this poor woman because she rejected any notion of "sacred motherhood" bullshit.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)
unblock
(56,145 posts)she acted on illegal information and got hurt in the process.
the birth mother wanted never to be contacted, and penn took steps to circumvent the law and her birth mother's wishes.
my older brother was adopted (my younger brother and i were not) so i'm familiar with some of the emotions involved. in his case, when he reached 21, in fact his birth mother tried to contact him. my brother wrote her a letter saying, essentially, i have parents, thank you, and i have no interest in meeting you (well he said it nicer than that, but that was the gist of it) and that was the end of that.
joeybee12
(56,177 posts)There's a reason why adoption agencies have strict privacy laws...the daughter now should move on.
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)condemning her, and there are comments from the daughter in question and apparently others in the adoptee rights movement trashing her in reviews for Amazon.com assassinating her character, but all miss the point.
It doesn't even really matter whether she was raped by her boyfriend or not. The point is she expected the adoption to remain closed, and because of a bureaucratic screw-up, this daughter tried to get hold of her.
THAT is wrong. Sorry. If an adoption is closed, it should remain closed.
beevamp
(8 posts)How could you reject your own child? Deny her the chance to at least, just once, touch her REAL parent.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)me b zola
(19,053 posts) idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Or are you?
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Amazing....
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)In US. Mind boggling.
Mind you, for me personally abortion always was THE ONLY choice.
Hekate
(100,133 posts)Some wounds just don't heal all pretty.
Chew on that for awhile, why don't you?
Welcome to DU and enjoy your stay.
Hekate
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)....you can choose to meet them years later if you wish.
Otherwise, it's none of your business.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)My Sister is the MOTHER of two beautiful daughters by adoption, she is their real Mother, she cares for them and is the one there for them every day. They both have biological mothers somewhere, of course, but my Sister is a VERY REAL MOTHER EVERY DAY.
beevamp
(8 posts)...but still. To gaze into the eyes of the one who is responsible for your existence. That experience cannot be replaced. It is cruel to deny her that.
I can understand if it was only a few years after the rape. But now, *decades* later?
HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)Anything else is a fairytale.
Response to HangOnKids (Reply #173)
Post removed
Hekate
(100,133 posts)What choices would you make available to girls and women who do not want to keep their babies, for whatever reason?
me b zola
(19,053 posts)...they should abort the fetus.
Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)Hekate
(100,133 posts)I was 16 in 1964 and I wouldn't have known how to find an abortionist if you put a gun to my head. No one ever even spoke the word.
Sorry life has not worked out for you.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Apparently at your adoptive parents....so angry, you can't possibly comprehend that in some cases, adoption works out for people, as is seen through stories told here.
Response to beevamp (Reply #171)
Heidi This message was self-deleted by its author.
Dorian Gray
(13,850 posts)I have no desire to gaze into the eyes of the one who is responsible for my existence? You know why? She gave me nine months and then gave me up to people who raised me with love for over 18 years. Then they kindly led me through my college years. Now that I'm an adult, they continue to provide for my child. They've shown love and nurturing and care for 41 years. They are my REAL parents. No genetic material means more than the actions of 41 years.
I just think you're sort of clueless that families can be made of many different things.
I personally don't want my biological mother to gaze upon my existence, either. It's not that I'm angry. She relinquished all her rights to me as family when she gave me up for adoption. I have ANOTHER family. One whom I love very much. I'm just not really interested.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)Sorry to burst your baby-buying bubble. She has bought a baby, she is involved in the baby trade
Hekate
(100,133 posts)Shame on you.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)...but was not allowed to keep you. that is appalling.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)But blaming human beings who love their children does nothing to solve institutional problems. Despising adoptive parents everywhere does nothing to battle any institutional abuse because institutions just won't care. It may be personally satisfactory for a moment, but it changes no institution that has done wrong.
Dorian Gray
(13,850 posts)That doesn't mean that all adoptive experiences are the same.
get the red out
(14,018 posts)You are insulting, mud-raking, and using your opinions to attack loving people you do not even know. If you have issues, then by all means see to them with professionals. Insulting people who love their children is NOT an acceptable way to try to deal with your life difficulties.
me b zola
(19,053 posts)for whenever I shine light on the billion dollar infant trade, the only persons who feel that I am attacking them personally are adopters. You know, those who buy infants.
And "my life difficulties"? Yeah, that began when my mother was drugged and not even awake for my birth and forced to sign relinquishment papers.
House slave vs field hand slave. I am a free woman because I do not identify with the system that stole me and stole my identity
get the red out
(14,018 posts)Entirely by choice, since you are asking.
As I stated above, my Sister's two children are adopted. When you say adoptive parents are "baby buyers" that's pretty damned insulting to individual people, I'm afraid. My Sister is a Mother, she is not an "infant trader".
Response to beevamp (Reply #145)
Heidi This message was self-deleted by its author.
Response to Heidi (Reply #159)
HangOnKids This message was self-deleted by its author.
Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)She did not raise the child. She does not wish to come into contact with the child. She is for all intents and purposes, a total stranger.
haele
(15,317 posts)One of my good friends while I was in the military wished her mom had gone through with the abortion rather than raise her after conning the (wealthy) boyfriend to "do the right thing" and marry her. The constant abuse she went through - being told by her own mother that she should have been aborted after the first marriage went south, being molested by her step-cousin and being told by her mother and grandmother that it was her fault because she was pretty and obviously acting like a slut.
Melissa was always being told the marriage with the rich first husband might have worked if they hadn't been forced had to get married so soon, that she was the shame that blighted that relationship and her mother's "good reputation" forever, and the cause of all the crap in the second marriage her mom made. Her mother told her more than once that she wished she hadn't chickened out at the last minute and walked out of the doctor's door.
As soon as she could, Melissa joined the Navy, and only kept in touch with her much younger half-sister, partially to make sure that Alice wouldn't get molested like she had been.
Then there was the meth-head neighbor across the street from me in 1998, who was pimping out her two oldest daughters (ages 10 and 13) for drugs and rent who ended up with all five of her children, including the infant, being taken away from her. CPS only found out about the abuse when her son, the middle child attempted suicide at a friend's house - at the age of 7, he tried to commit suicide...
When they were taking the children away, we heard her yell at CPS "what do you mean, I lose child support now?" and she kept yelling "You can't tell me how to raise my kids" even as the police were handcuffing her and the owner of the cottage she was "renting" for child molestation charges. Yeah, she was a "real" parent all right. Lots of maternal love there.
That is all fantasy, claiming the only REAL parent is a birth parent. Anyone can make a baby, but that doesn't make them a parent, that only means that there was once a man who is a sperm donor and a woman who is a baby-incubator.
The Real Parent is the person or people who care for you, who would sacrifice to make your childhood stable, who supports you in becoming the best you can be. And it's an insult to the Real Parent to claim that someone like the two women above are somehow better
Whether it's a blood tie, or just paper, it doesn't matter - the REAL parent is the one who cared for the child.
You can't just wish someone who isn't capable of being a parent to you - for whatever reason - to be your parent.
If you try to force the situation, you're forcing your own reality on someone who doesn't want to be there - and that's pretty much being a bully or sociopath - trying to dominate the life of someone who wants to live their own life. It might be different if one birth parent didn't take responsibility and the other was struggling to make due, but as soon as someone took responsibility, there is no more "owing" to the child.
Forcing the bonds of blood after adulthood is the antithesis of "choice".
Haele
Hekate
(100,133 posts)It is what it is.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)xchrom
(108,903 posts)My adoptive parents are my only parents.
I know the family that gave me up - that is it.
They loved me - from what I know - but could not take care of me.
That's it. Period. No 1st mom or 1st dad can take the place, offer answers or anything else - than my mom and dad did.
I lived with the notion that I should no through the 70s - but you know what?
I have a mom and had a dad - who loved me more than I will ever be able to say.
The sad thing is that story isn't Sexy or Exciting - you can't make an after school movie about it.
It's boring - but it's my story and I was well loved and cared for beyond my dreams.
And that is more than enough.
Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)They obviously are so blinded by their own personal life's hell, they cannot possibly bring themselves to even consider that someone else may have thrived in a scenario they think is so evil.
Birth mothers can love, they can abuse
Birth fathers can love, they can abuse
Adoptive parents can love, they can abuse....
It goes on and on....
niyad
(131,618 posts)smokey nj
(43,853 posts)Hekate
(100,133 posts)smokey nj
(43,853 posts)
Phentex
(16,698 posts)because most of the family members died before they could tell my friend any of the circumstances. She did not even know she was adopted until she was in her 40's and then it was found out by accident. However, she had a burning need to know her "parents." Once she found out she was adopted she thought her life made sense because she had always felt different. She was always searching. (I think it's her personality, frankly, since plenty of people who are not adopted sometimes feel this way.) It took her years to find her mom but when all was said and done, her birth mother had settled into a whole different life and had never planned to search for the daughter she had as a teen. She was willing to meet with her but there was no overly joyous reunion or talk of a future with each other. (Insert the mini drama that ensued following the non happy ending she expected.) They still keep in touch and she has actually bonded more with her birth mom's other children than she has with her birth mom.
I can't tell her how to feel or what she should have done but I felt bad for both of them.
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)but that alone cannot make you a Mommy or a Daddy. I have seen this far too much in my own personal, and work life. I have to say I am infuriated at this woman for totally disgracing her adoptive parents. They ARE her parents, far more than her BIOLOGICAL parents.
She needs a lot of professional help to understand that fact. Life threw her a curve, but she doesn't know just how lucky she is. Her life could have been far, far worse with her BIOLOGICAL parents. A lot of adult children raised with their biological parents could tell her many a story about that one, including ME. What I cannot understand, as a biological mother and an adult child raised by biological parents, are the people on heer who seem to think this alone is BLISS and an answer to everything. That to me sounds like a right wing, religious, Republican talking point.
Priscilla Sharp
(4 posts)1. Foley had a 1-1/2 year dating relationship with her boyfriend, Penn's father. He thought they were getting married and was stunned when Foley's mother slammed the door in his face.
2. The father's family tried to stop the adoption and wanted to take the baby (Penn) home with them. They were thwarted in their efforts by Catholic Social Services (CSS) and Foley's family who insisted the baby be adopted. Because they were not married, the father had no legal rights.
3. Penn's "non-identifying information report" from CSS contains nothing about any "rape" allegation and, in fact, is replete with touching details of how mother wanted to keep her baby and hesitated for several months signing the relinquishment papers. Thus, she had no warning or reason to think her mother would not want to be contacted.
4. Penn contacted Foley ONCE 15 years ago through the family attorney and NEVER again. She has kept Foley's privacy and silently endured Foley's abusive attacks ever since.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)do you have any proof? and especially on #4 that is the impression I got from the article
Priscilla Sharp
(4 posts)No. 4 - One cannot prove the negative. It is rather for Foley to prove the affirmation.
Everything else is provable by the father's family (he is deceased and conveniently not able to defend himself) and documentation from Catholic Social Services.
If you really want a glimpse into Foley's psyche, check out her website (warning - graphic content)
http://www.womaninhiding.org/speak/birth.htm
smokey nj
(43,853 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)and I was not clear #4 was what I found the most easily believable on rereading I realize that it seemed the opposite, my experience with adoption is second hand my ex-husband (we're still friends BTW) is an adoptee and it was a privately arranged through his mothers (both birth and adoption) church in 1955, thankfully his birth mother did not take that sort of attitude towards him, if Mrs Foley did not want to meet her daughter fine but obviously she's not shy about the circumstances and what she is doing strikes me as cruel and punishing the daughter for the circumstances surrounding her birth
niyad
(131,618 posts)as a teenager, by her family, by her church, by her society? hate her for expressing her feelings? hate her for not wanting to relive that nightmare? have news for you, dear. any person with an ATOM of empathy or compassion will only feel sorrow for the horror of what she endured, and anger for the repeated betrayals of trust. and, anyone with an ATOM of empathy and compassion will look at efforts such as yours with disgust. you picked the wrong audience for your campaign here.
smokey nj
(43,853 posts)niyad
(131,618 posts)like about your "information" and its source.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)I saw enough of absolutely disgusting statements made all over the Internet by rapist's family, his biological child and friends.
You should be ashamed of yourself by barging into something you have no right to barge into.
Please remember that this is progressive website and we support pro-choice, whatever that choice happen to be.
We do not question rape survivors.
We do not accuse people of falsehood unless we are ready to prove it with facts, not just empty words. And sometimes not even then.
Enjoy your stay.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)It appears you joined just to "set the record straight" so you must be personally involved? What is your involvement.
The link to Ms Foley's website doesn't make me feel anything negative toward her. What about that website should make me have negative feelings?
smokey nj
(43,853 posts)I found this with a google search of the name.
http://priscillasharp.blogspot.com/
gollygee
(22,336 posts)It appears this poor woman is yet again being victimized, this time by anti-adoption groups.
smokey nj
(43,853 posts)theinquisitivechad
(322 posts)EXCUSE ME WHILE MY EYES ROLL OUT OF MY HEAD
Guess you locked down your one-way ticket to Gullible City.
Let's not even get into the blogspot link the other user posted.
Priscilla Sharp
(4 posts)I have had experience with thousands of adoption search cases and have personally solved about 400 in the past five years. The non-ID report would give as complete a socio-economic-religious-education report about the parents and extended birth family as possible, including circumstances surrounding the birth and relinquishment. They would be particularly careful, as a matter of fact to point out an allegation of rape because they know we find mothers every day and would want to forewarn us of possible problems. Regardless of the circumstances of conception, birth and relinquishment, more than 95% of mothers are happy to be found and look forward to a continuing relationship with their lost son/daughter. We had one particularly tragic case where the mother was impregnated by her own father. She has risen above the horrible circumstances and has welcomed her son with open arms. She does not blame the innocent child for the acts of the rapist-father.
Every human being has a right to their original identity, family history and heritage, and the identity of those to whom they are blood related (if only to prevent innocent incest). Their family are entitled to accept a relationship or to be left in privacy. In this case, Ms Penn tried to contact her mother 15 years ago through the family attorney who turned out to be Ms Foley's son-in-law, was rejected, and has honored Ms Foley's demand to be left alone ever since. It is Ms Foley and her husband who have been going to the press, testifying at the NJ legislature in opposition to adoptees' right to know, set up her website, written her books, hired a publicist, and is now initiating these newspaper articles, which are filled with lies and false innuendoes, to peddle her books. She gave Ms Penn's name to the Daily News reporter and is now trying to get on talk shows. Ms Penn was contacted yesterday by Dr Phil and as of this morning decided not to participate further in this distasteful mess. We have encouraged her to seek legal counsel now that Ms Foley's false allegations have become public.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)would have mentioned 'rape' because they knew you find mothers every day and would want to forewarn you.
Do you really call yourself a "search angel?" What tripe. Your blog is one of the sickest things I've ever read on the Internet.
Enjoy your stay.
niyad
(131,618 posts)a positive.
idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Discussion.
How did you find about it? Do you check the web every damn hour for any new thread going on somewhere about this case? Did someone point it to you? Which one is it? I betting the former because of the way you talk.
You seriously make me sick.
FreeState
(10,702 posts)heres a clue, you diminish your arguments when its obvious by word use and patterns in your vocabulary you are the one waging the war on Mrs. Foley.
For those DU members who don't know what Im talking about look up the comments on Amazon under Foley's book. Its been reviewed by those with vendettas against here - its all cut and paste you see on every story about the topic. Its clear who is the one doing the damage, and it isn't Mrs. Foley.
Priscilla Sharp
(4 posts)This is fiction, right?
I cannot believe Ms. Foley would be allowed to write such a book if it is not. Did she use real names of people involved? If so, she's lucky her boyfriend/fiance is deceased, although his family might have a thing or two to say in his defense.
For another thing, to claim a "guaranteed confidential adoption process" is definitely a fiction, since no church, attorney, government or private agency was ever empowered to "guarantee" any such thing. Her name and identifying information are on every document that she signed and was filed in court. Furthermore, if the child had never been placed for adoption and had been raised in foster care instead, the original birth certificate would always have been available to them, and there is no way anyone could "guarantee" the child would be adopted or that the adoption would not fail.
I wish Ms. Foley the best of luck in her healing process; sadly, I have to say writing and self-publishing this book is not the way to do it. Like lovely lotus flowers grow from the deepest muck of the pond, sometimes children are born of terrible circumstances. Regardless of the way it was created, Ms. Foley gave birth to a beautiful human being. For her own sake, and for the sake of those who love her, she needs to embrace that beauty and throw off these dark demons that are weighing her down.
Priscilla Sharp
Mother of loss '64, reunited '86
Now search angel/adoptee rights advocate
niyad
(131,618 posts)to tell others how to live their lives, what they must do, and what they must feel. the weight of such certainty for everyone else in the world (and especially those who do not seek your advice or input) must be overwhelming and exhausting.
Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)To create accounts and go around posting cookie cutter character assassinations. If you have a problem with someone's argument or stance, let them know and leave it alone.
blueamy66
(6,795 posts)All last names were Xed out on all of my adoption paperwork, including my birth certificate.
Plus, my father changed our last name when I was 4.
There is no way in hell that I could be found.
Just let people be......
niyad
(131,618 posts)idwiyo
(5,113 posts)Should be ashamed of themselves but I out they are capable of it.
niyad
(131,618 posts)anything about what sort of legal punishment that person received. in the article linked a bit upthread, penn claims that nobody gave her this information, she just found it by searching all by herself. how would one go about that, if one had no information to start with?
cynatnite
(31,011 posts)The child that she gave up for adoption was wrongly handed information about his birth mother who was a victim of a brutal rape. The poor young man was stunned by her reaction to him when he went to see her.
It caused so much pain on both sides as a result. He didn't know his biological father had raped his biological mother. She felt that she had relived her horrific rape all over again despite the years that had passed. She said that she felt for him, but she believed that putting him up for adoption was her only option at the time and she wanted him to have a real chance at a good life. She knew she would carry her emotions about the rape for years and she didn't want to take it out on him.
I remember this because I teared up while reading it. It was a tragedy on both sides.
I can see why these privacy laws are in place. Not only that, young girls who are pregnant might be discouraged from choosing adoption if they feel their anonymity is not protected.
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)Meeting her child would just be a reminder of a time that she doesn't want to remember.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)I had an abortion, and I can tell you first hand it is not an emotionless experience. None of these circumstances are emotionless. yes, the mother has a right to not want to talk to her, but the daughter also has a right to want to talk to her. Sometimes in life there are no easy answers. There are no black and white answers. There are no satisfactory answers. Sometimes there are no answers at all.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)I would totally hire a PI to find my birth parents if adopted. I am too curious not to want to know.