Our country is sick! Massive ammo shortages in gun shops!

[Maraya1969]

http://money.cnn.com/2013/03/12/news/companies/guns-ammo-shortage/index.html

I say now is the time to levy a high tax on ammo since the price just went up. Let them pay through the teeth to get their fixes.



Gun enthusiasts are buying firearms with unparalleled zeal. As a result, ammunition is in short supply nationwide.

"We can't get any inventory within a 100-mile radius," said Mark Campbell, owner of Mid America Arms in St. Louis. He's having a hard time keeping ammo in stock. "It started right around the election, as soon as President Obama mentioned gun control. But right after the school shooting in [Newtown] Connecticut, that's when it went crazy."

Even the big ammunition retailers are feeling the pinch. Wal-Mart (WMT, Fortune 500) has been rationing its ammo since January, to three boxes per customer per day. And when a gun retailer like Cabela's (CAB) gets two or three shrink-wrapped pallets of 5.56 mm or .223 ammunition for AR-15 assault rifles, they're "cleaned off like locusts, within a couple of hours," according to Brian Rafn, a research director at Morgan Dempsey Capital Management in Milwaukee who follows ammo manufacturers.

[graham4anything]

1. The mayors against guns should buy them all, then buy the business and shut them down

[hack89]

2. So a new generation of businessmen can open up new gun shops.

sound good - young blood would help revitalize the industry and bring in new ideas.

[graham4anything]

3. Change all the ordinance rules like they got rid of porno stores.

Have zero gun stores allowed in any radius of any child living near there.

Do what they are doing in California to stop pervs from living in an area.
Already on the book is no pervs allowed near a park.
California is buying up land and turning them into little parks.

and the radius for pervs is smaller and smaller.

Just how far would the NRA go when they make their threats?
Why don't they just admit what they are?
Terrorists and pervs are not given carte blanche to sell their wares on the streets of America

[hack89]

5. You realize none of that is remotely possible? nt

[graham4anything]

6. Once the court/law/candidates are changed, the world will be an anti-gun oyster

[hack89]

7. Better get cracking then - you have a monumental task ahead of you. nt

[LiberalFighter]

9. Easier said then done.

[graham4anything]

13. Hillary/Napolitano 16/20 Michelle24 Michelle/Schlossberg28 Schlossberg 32 36

[Lurker Deluxe]

8. Great

Then all the have to do is redefine "porno" and the mechanism is already in place to ban that speech.

Wonderful idea. Free speech dies to a roar of applause.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

12. That group has a higher felony rate that CCW holders

and you want them buying firearms?

[Hoyt]

46. How many folks have mayors shot, like CCWers such as Zimmy, Holmes, Stawicki, & other CCW'd yahoos?

How about the so-called law-abiding, responsible gun owners who let their kids get hold of guns (Lanza comes to mind)? Or those that have them stolen, sell them to criminals, and worse.

[kittykitty]

82. It's too late. You can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. N/t

[graham4anything]

83. A good dentist can ask "Is it safe" and eradicate the cavities

Sometimes dental work is painful, but it's worth it when the rest of ones existence is painfree





Is it safe?


[img][/img]

[Submariner]

4. "Doomsday Prepper" show probably freaking out the gun nuts

so they are stockpiling for their Apocalypse.

[DainBramaged]

15. The paid NRA hacks just keep showing up too.

[Eleanors38]

26. Do you mean posts #1 anf #4? They are wonderful at this.

[guardian]

49. No

The antigun nuts are freaking out gun owners with their rhetoric, vitriol, and legislative initiatives. Antigunners are 100% responsible for that panic gun and ammo sales. The anitgunners will probably be responsible for increasing gun ownership in this country by 1/3.

[Fumesucker]

73. The gun buying frenzy went into overdrive immediately after Sandy Hook

Before anyone had a chance to say anything at all ghouls were snatching the same weapon used to kill that classroom full of first graders off the shelves.

[guardian]

74. if you say so. nt

[Fumesucker]

75. ...

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/01/18/16570552-gun-stores-running-low-on-weapons-as-sales-surge-owners-say?lite

Documents obtained by NBC News from the state of Connecticut through a Freedom of Information Act request show a spike in gun sales in the hours and days after the deaths of 20 schoolchildren and six staffers at Sandy Hook Elementary.

(...)

As the first news was breaking in Connecticut a month ago, buyers were having the same reaction. Between 11 a.m. and noon Dec. 14, firearms retailers in the state were busy performing 105 background checks – nearly double the amount logged in the same lunchtime hour a week earlier.

A total of 725 background checks were performed that day, up from 585 a week before. The trend continued in the days ahead, resulting in a 55 percent week-over-week increase in checks.

Across the country, background checks were also surging: 900,000 more background checks were reported in December 2012 than in the same month of 2011. In total, over 3.1 million more background checks were recorded in 2012 than in 2011.

[guardian]

78. chicken and the egg?

The antigunners were just as fast in calling for tighter restrictions, outright bans, new laws, etc. on tv, radio, twitter, facebook, DU, etc. Did most people buy "before anyone had a chance to say anything at all"? No. So an extra 52 people statewide in CT bought guns between 11am-12pm. Let's say for the sake of argument that all 52 people decided to buy before they heard anyone call for gun bans. It doesn't take unusual prescience on the part of people to anticipate the reactions of the antigunners. They are as predictable as the orbit of the planets.

[Fumesucker]

84. A classroom ankle deep in the blood of first graders tends to upset and disgust normal people

Ghouls on the other hand immediately want to go out and buy the implement that put that classroom ankle deep in the blood of first graders.

I was on the ROTC target shooting rifle team in HS and then I was a Marine for three years, in my youth I have fired everything from a BB gun to a .378 Weatherby magnum to a .577 Holland & Holland Nitro Express elephant rifle, guns don't scare me, ghouls with guns do though.

Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional.

[guardian]

85. name calling 101

Why do you impute ghoulish motivation of those buying guns? Do you have any evidence whatsoever that those buyers bought because they took delite in the deaths of those at Sandy Hook? So there could be no other motivation?

[LiberalFighter]

10. This has been going on for several years now.

I'm wondering how much ammo is just laying around in homes that has not been used?

[Remmah2]

11. I hate hoarding.

Homeland Security aims to buy 1.6 billion rounds of ammo

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2490336



What next, toilet paper hoarding?

[graham4anything]

14. Terrorist rightwing extremists with guns need to be nipped in the bud.

[Remmah2]

16. They're hiding everywhere.

Yup.

[graham4anything]

18. Every other reason for having a gun has been rebuked. There is no other.

I wonder if the gun people would be in favor, shortly, when there is 100% amnesty, one hundred percent citizenship, if on the day the first part happens, each person is given a lifetime supply of bullets and guns.

11 million new legal gun holders.

Will the gun people applaud that?

(and no need to have any checks, let's do that in a state with no checks).

[wandy]

32. The great toilet paper shortage trick has allready been done...

Much to the amazement of not only the show but of toilet paper factories across America, 20 million people that watched the Carson show that evening ran out in the morning and bought as much toilet paper as they could carry. By noon on December 20, 1973, practically every store in America was out of stock.

http://thelongestlistofthelongeststuffatthelongestdomainnameatlonglast.com/trivia74.html

It's actually a neat marketing trick. You say theirs going to be a toilet paper shortage and the price of toilet paper skyrockets because people buy up all the toilet paper.
You make it known that their will be a shortage of Kumquats and people who don't even know what a kumquat is will rush to the store, empty the shelves and provide a higher profit for Kumquat givers.
So considering the herd animal mind set of the right, the Teapublican cheer "Obama goon take away you're guns" and WOW....
Gotta get a bullet, gotta get a bullet. Homeland security is buying them all up. I don't care what it costs, gotta get a bullet.

The owners of GOP co. smile and give their lapdogs a pat on the head.

[Jenoch]

41. Nah, you are wrong.

An item needs to be universally used to become part of a 'shortage'.

[wandy]

44. Oh. Really? The Great Chicken Wing Shortage of 2013...........

The Chicken Council, along with other industry groups representing corn consumers, blame ethanol for the mess.

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2013/02/chicken_wing_shortage_drought_ethanol_standards_and_expensive_corn_have.html

Then get a few lapdogs to bark the tune.......

Who's to blame for nation's chicken wing shortage?

http://video.foxnews.com/v/2135145810001/whos-to-blame-for-nations-chicken-wing-shortage/

But no worry, theirs really not a shortage, just going to cost a 'bit' more...

The NCC highlights the fact that wing prices are now up to “about $2.11 a lb. (Northeast), the highest on record at the U.S. Department of Agriculture, up 26 cents or 14% from a year earlier.” But the numbers are misleading at best.

http://business.time.com/2013/01/31/reality-check-there-is-no-chicken-wing-shortage-prices-havent-really-soared-either/

[Jenoch]

45. I also remember

some sort of bacon 'shortage' a while ago. Both bacon and chicken are universal. You helped to reinforce my point.

[upaloopa]

17. If gunners think gun control will not happen

why are they treating the manufacturers to a field day?

[hack89]

19. So you agree that they are misguided?

hey - we finally agree on something.

[upaloopa]

21. We probably agree on a lot of things we just don't discuss them

[hack89]

23. I think you are right. nt

[Eleanors38]

30. Possibly another reason discussed recently...

Pro-2A folks, misguided as they mey be, politically tone-deaf as many are, have decided to go more public, and don't mind everyone seeing the long lines at gun shows:

It's a political statement with a middle finger, not a trigger finger. They are quite motivated and growing more so.

[beevul]

81. Its called voting with your wallet. N/T

[slackmaster]

20. Even reloading equipment and supplies are in short supply with long back-order times

I say now is the time to levy a high tax on ammo since the price just went up. Let them pay through the teeth to get their fixes.

FYI - There is already a federal excise tax of 11% on ammunition, charged at the wholesale level. In addition to that, people in most states pay sales tax on ammunition. With California's 8% sales tax, the compounding effect puts the effective tax rate on ammunition close to 20%.

I have bought no ammunition at all in several years. I plan to make most of what I use for the rest of my life, unless prices and availability get back to normal levels.

[bullwinkle428]

22. "It started right around the election, as soon as President Obama mentioned gun control"

Sorry, but this is one of those things RWers have pulled out of their ass. He never said ONE thing about it until Newtown!

[Eleanors38]

33. He may have been referencing the re-election.

[Jenoch]

43. You are wrong.

President Obama talked about gun control in one of the debates. The ammunition shortage was happening long before Newtown, it just became more acute since then.

[MicaelS]

24. You do realize that statements like your are why

People are hoarding ammunition, right?

I say now is the time to levy a high tax on ammo since the price just went up. Let them pay through the teeth to get their fixes.

Every person who makes statements like yours, every person who says all guns should be banned, just exacerbates people wanting to buy more.

[otohara]

54. Did You Run Out And Buy Gobs of Bullets

because of a poster or blogger?

If so, then you and those hoarders need help.

Now that they have all the bullets and guns, what's next?
Should liberals buy bullet proof vests?

[MicaelS]

72. No, but I did buy

A case of ammunition (1,000 rounds) when I bought my .45 pistol a year ago. Still have 700 rounds left. Those 700 rounds should last me another year or two.

You want to buy a vest, go ahead. That's your choice.

[Zax2me]

25. Maybe its because the govt bought 1.6 billion of them.

http://www.salon.com/2013/02/14/homeland_security_and_its_cache_of_bullets
Online rumors about a big government munitions purchase are true, sort of. The Homeland Security Department wants to buy more than 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition in the next four or five years. It says it needs them — roughly the equivalent of five bullets for every person in the U.S. — for law enforcement agents in training and on duty.

[Skip Intro]

50. Are they trying to create a shortage?

If not, then what are they doing?

[RiffRandell]

27. All the gun shops I drive past in GA always have "Sale!" banners out front.

Gross.

[The Straight Story]

28. We are not sick because of drones,wars, poverty, health care...but people buying before prices go up

I have more problems with we as a people on the whole than with some folks who want to save money because they believe the price of something they use is going up.

[greymattermom]

29. homeowner's insurance?

Just curious, wouldn't keeping an ammunition stock pile raise the cost of homeowner's insurance, or violate the contract?

[Eleanors38]

31. No. The biggest danger of huge ammo caches is caving in your floor.

[former9thward]

34. Why would it?

Do you think ammo just explodes when it is stored? It doesn't. Does your homeowners policy limit the amount of ammo you can have? Mine doesn't.

[slackmaster]

55. Not at all, unless your area has some kind of fire code that limits storage of ammunition

It's not dangerous.

[Lint Head]

35. Gun manufacturers should have to display photos of mangled corpses and wounded people

on their ammo boxes.

[Eleanors38]

37. I know one company which has zombies on their's.

[The Straight Story]

38. We need the same on our paychecks and car ads

We kill people all over the world and such news items rarely warrant a discussion. The pollution from cars is a killer (and in CA they have stickers saying some items in cars cause cancer, so might as well add pictures).

Every post we make uses electricity, much of it from coal - so maybe some pics of dead miners and black lung to remind us.

Hell, we just need google glasses with flashing pics of dead people to entertain and remind us all of what a few people do so we can all feel responsible for the actions of others.

[NCTraveler]

88. Do you think the IRS should have photos...

of "mangled corpses and wounded people" on the 1040 EZ?

[Eleanors38]

36. .223s: Keep talking about bans, and more will be sold. nt

[Earth_First]

39. They blame the government.

The ammunition shortage is being touted in gun circles as being perpetuated by the government.

"They can't take yer guns so they're creatin' ammo shortages..."

[frylock]

40. there was a line that stretched a mile-long to get into the gun show in san diego..

last weekend. that doesn't include the 4-mile backup of traffic on the freeway. reports had people wheeling cases of ammo back to the vehicles. idiots are buying up 6000 rounds and then complaining about shortages.

[Earth_First]

42. THIS.

They are creating their own supply and demand shortages and crying foul at the same time!

[mwrguy]

47. Why do we allow people to manufacture their own ammunition with no regulation?

You can't distill your own booze without a federal license, but you can make as many deadly bullets as you want with no oversight and no way to track them from crime scenes.

This has to change.

[Clames]

48. I can brew all the beer, wine, and cider I want...

...ad long as I don't sell it. I can give it away though. Moonshine? Largely the same since the BATF isn't bothering with tiny stills that aren't generating money for the owner. Making ammunition is a very technical and detailed process and takes an investment that the average criminal will never bother with.

[JVS]

51. Beer is restricted to 100 gallons/ individual or 200 gallons per household

http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/25.205

[Clames]

61. Which is more than 10x what I want to make.

Also, that doesn't well address batches that don't turn out and are thrown away and therefore not consumed. Difference between Googling a law and actually understanding how it is applied IRL.

[NutmegYankee]

67. That would be more than I'd ever want.

Five gallons makes 2 cases, so 100 gallons would make enough for 2+ beers a day!

[rdharma]

52. "Making ammunition is a very technical and detailed process"

You're kidding........ right?!!!!!

[sarisataka]

53. It is if...

you like your hands.

Failing to pay attention to using the correct powder (there are dozens and are most not interchangeable) in the correct amount (for the specific powder/primer/bullet combination) is a quick way to ruin a gun, loose a limb, die.

Like any DIY project, it can be learned by almost anyone but the consequences for not knowing what to do are greater than leaky plumbing.

[spin]

57. So you exercise caution when you reload. ...

I reloaded ammo for many years for my own shooting hobby.

I followed the load suggestions in a quality reloading manual. I only had one brand of powder on my reloading table when I was reloading and never left my powder measure half full but returned the unused power to the container it came in.

I used a single stage press not a progressive press so I took more time and care reloading. I always checked to see that the primers were inserted properly into the cartridge case. When dropping powder I always measured the first ten rounds and then every tenth round. I would then take a flashlight and check the level of the powder in every case to make sure I had not accidentally double charged one.

Consequently I never had a "ka-boom" during the 30 years I reloaded my own ammo.

[sarisataka]

59. All true and wise

IMO that makes it a "very technical and detailed process"

I changed from a progressive to single stage for just the reasons you mention. I like the idea of a light check to make sure there is no double charge; I will have to start doing that. You have twice the experience I do and I am fond of all of my fingers

[spin]

71. Drop your powder. Put the filled cases in a loading block. ....

Run the flashlight up and down each row both left and right, then examine adjacent cases.
Only takes a minute.

Never leave powder in your powder measure. I knew a very experienced reloader who blew up a S&W .357 magnum revolver. The cylinder was spit in half and the top strap was gone. Fortunately he only got a cut on his forehead but his spotting scope on his NRA gun box was ruined.

He suspected that because he left powder in his measure, moisture caused it to clump and he dropped a double magnum load and his loads were hot to begin with. He had over 40 years of reloading experience and had been a competitive shooter who had won a lot of pistol tournaments.

I'm not certain but I think he used a progressive press.

Another thing that I did was to segregate my brass so that all the cases had been fired the same number of times. When I examined them after shooting, I would discard the brass when I had more than one case split. (That's one of the main reasons I like to shoot revolvers as you can recover all your brass.) If I was reloading .38 caliber target loads, I could reload a box between 25 and 30 times before I threw the cases out. For magnum loads, I would only reload five times and then use the cases for target loads. I feel this also increased the accuracy of my loads.

Obviously it is a bad idea to drop powder while smoking but I also suggest avoiding alcohol or watching football on TV.

If you do a lo of shooting you can save money by reloading and you may find you can tailor loads to your individual firearms that are more accurate than factory ammo.

[sir pball]

89. It is but it isn't.

The basics of loading, while requiring reasonable attention, aren't really that technical or detailed. My first loads didn't even take an hour, and that included unpacking everything and reading the manuals. Really no harder than baking, honestly.

Now, making really GOOD ammunition requires fanatical dedication to every single detail, and extensive experimentation and development - I can pop out 100 hunting-grade rifle rounds in well under an hour, but it's been four years and I'm still hunting for perfection for the precision stuff.

[Clames]

60. For you and your demonstrated lack of technical understanding...

...it might be a different story. Those of us who pay attention to bullet selection, case prep, primer selection, powder selection, and double checking for final cartridge weight and dimensions it is a different story. You may not care about safety but I sure do...

[rdharma]

56. No regulation on reloading your own ammo.

I think some sort of certification and mandatory training would be a good idea before one can buy powder and primers for reloading. These are the components required for reloading that can't be produced easily.

However, it would not help in tracing ammunition used in a crime.

The weapon is the key to tracing weapons to criminals.

[SQUEE]

62. In theory great.

But who provides this training? at what cost, and who provides the credentials?

[rdharma]

63. Who provides the training, and who provides the credentials?

Well, the training and certification could be conducted by certified NRA instructors. The credentials to the reloader would then be issued by the state based on the NRA certificate of completion for a minimal charge.

The NRA does Law Enforcement Firearms Trainer Instruction for small PDs. Why not a similar program for reloading certification?

Or would that require too many NRA resources ($) that could better be used for lobbying?!!!

They do this (not through the NRA) in Germany and the system works just fine.

It requires a waiver from the authorities and attendence of two days of instruction. It wasn't that expensive.

[Clames]

64. LOL

First it isn't technically demanding and now it requires training and certification? Which is it? No, there isn't need for such certification unless it is somehow involved with a business venture.

[rdharma]

65. A complete moron can learn to reload.

Many gun nutters have proven that!

The certification just basically goes over the steps of reloading. The main emphasis is on safe storage and handling of the explosive/ flammable components and legal requirements.

So yes....... any moron can reload....... the German system just filters out some of the more blatant morons and criminals.

[Clames]

68. Well that explains you and your method.

But it takes a more than a complete moron to reload safely and with certain performance specs in mind. Tuning handloads is as much science as it is art just like most hobbies. No, Germany can have its system. Even Canada has more sense than that.

[rdharma]

69. "Tuning handloads is as much science...."

You make me laugh!

Errrrr merrrrr Gerrrrd! Bwana Bubba have BIG MAGIC!

[Clames]

70. Ignorance.

Pity your ignorance is so humorous to you. Example of someone who shouldn't reload for even a slingshot...









I guess if you didn't laugh you'd cry...

[sir pball]

90. There's no oversight of commercial ammunition, either.

The manufacturers are regulated by the Feds, but as far as sale and use goes, I theoretically have to show ID as a proof of age but that's it. With few state-level exemptions there's no background checks, or purchase records, and certainly no serialization or tracing process. CSI can match fired shells to a particular gun, but only after they have the gun as well.

Maybe you should learn existing law before demanding new ones?

[aikoaiko]

58. And this is why its not unreasonable for a regular shooter to keep 10K of ammo on hand

These types of shortages happen from time to time.

I decided to capitalize and sold about 7K of 9mm to various people through local classified ads.

Buy low, sell high. It's still a good plan.

[KamaAina]

66. Three boxes per customer per day??!!

Why, that's nothing but pinko socialist communism, I tell you!!

[Drale]

76. I've been saying tax ammunition for years

You don't need more than 20 rounds in your home at anyone time to protect your home, anything after that is for sport or paranoid ant-government delusions. If you can afford to buy 2000 rounds of Ammo, you can afford a 2 cent tax on every bullet.

[Straw Man]

79. 2000 rounds of .22 LR ...

... costs about $80 if you buy the cheap stuff. Your 2 cents per round is a 50% tax. Tell me again why recreational shooters should bear this burden.

[pkdu]

77. Look! We have rules here at DU dammit...

10.DUSC. Sec Gunnut 12

Violation as first offense , punishment by rolling of eyes smilie

Violation as Second Offense , punishment by reply of "really? Was that necessary?"

Violation as Turd Offense....you get the point...

[Knightraven]

80. What are they doing with it all?

This is becoming pure insanity! And if all this is being bought, then how much is being made at home? I remember seeing a contraption on ebay one can buy to make bullets at home. Shocked me when I first saw it, now I am terrified!

[sarisataka]

87. What you do with all ammo

Shoot it.

Home reloading is a separate, related hobby to shooting. Most reloaders shoot, most shooters do not reload. My WAG is 15%. Individuals who do reload can run rather high totals, but tend to be avid shooters, going through 1k+ per month. There is likely a very tiny fraction who reload to stockpile, but most routinely shoot what they are making at home.

Those buying factory made ammo have several reasons. Some are avid shooters who do not reload and actually shoot that often. Some buy in bulk for the price break and will make a large purchase to be used over several years. Some are buying like the futures market; they are expecting price increases so are buying low. Another group are those who do stockpile for various future needs, some possible, some unlikely, some delusional...

[Recursion]

86. Bubbles can hit any commodity.

My very liberal best friend is stocking up on ammo. Not because of the zombie apocalypse, nor because he thinks Obama is going to take his guns, but because everybody else is and he knows the price is going to keep going up because everybody else is making the same calculation he is.