Perspective for Apple Haters, re: Foxconn/Boycott. Tweeted by Steven Fry...

[onehandle]

Less than 25% of Foxconn's production is for Apple. The lion's share is for Dell, HP, Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Lenovo, Samsung... pretty much every tech company out there. A part of the device you are using to read this post is likely made by Foxconn.



http://twitter.com/stephenfry/status/164504399610265600

[DonCoquixote]

1. Ok

so in other words, it's better to be in Alcatrazthan Auschwitz, so we should support sending children to Alcatraz.

[redqueen]

2. Disappointing. nt

[Dreamer Tatum]

3. "So shut the FUCK up and get in line. The new iThing is coming."

Seriously - I never thought the 1984 Apple commercial was foretelling its own future bullshit.

[meegbear]

7. +1

[Safetykitten]

49. That about sums it up.

[tridim]

4. Slavery rocks!

As long as I get my Apple cult products. Way to live up to the myth fanboyz.

Booooooooo.

[MattBaggins]

48. Yeeee fucking haaaww

I gots to to get me a piece of some iCrap now.

Wow let's wave Apple propaganda around and promote them.

[FSogol]

5. LOL: Step away from your brand worship.

[tridim]

6. I think it's time for fanboy interventions.

They don't give a crap about anything but their Apple brand electronics. It's exactly like drug addiction.

[onehandle]

9. What brand device are you using? I'm on a Lenovo laptop right now.

It was made in part by Foxconn. I trust you are Foxconn free.

[tridim]

14. I build my own systems.

The major parts are from Taiwan.

I'll be buying a new MB and CPU soon, and will not buy foxconn built products. As a non-fanboy I have that choice.

[onehandle]

19. Ha ha. Name the parts. Name the makers.

Track down every circuit and processor in the drives, the power, each switch, screw, and wire.

Then do the same for every piece of electronics in your life. Your refrigerator, your thermostat, your microwave, your car, your bedside clock.

You are not Foxconn free and you are certainly not Chinese labor free.

Nice try.

[Dreamer Tatum]

25. Wow, you must REALLY love Apple to defend Foxconn so avidly. Or maybe you love Foxconn.

Which is it? Both?

[onehandle]

34. What are your brands?

Surely you are Foxconn free.

[Dreamer Tatum]

42. No, I am instead rationalization-free.

In contrast to you.

[tridim]

44. Asus, built in Taiwan at the Asus factory.

Hard drives are from Japan. Pro sound card, Taiwan. CPU and GPU, no idea.

Of course you discount the fact that my PC's aren't ASSEMBLED at Foxconn by slaves, they are assembled by me in America. Typical Apple apologist coping mechanism.

At the very least I'm trying to avoid using components manufactured by slaves and not apologizing for the mother corporation.

[onehandle]

50. Assembly is less than ten percent of production.

Blackberrys for instance, are made in 'Canada.'

That is if China is a Canadian province. The assembly is done in Canada, which is typically 10% of production.

And Asus, like just about every technology company, is a client of Foxconn.

When you have disassembled your hard drive from 'Japan' and your sound card from 'Taiwan' and have tracked down every single sub-contractor that made the individual parts of these components, get back to me.


Additionally, less than ten percent of the 'cost' to make an iPhone goes to Foxconn. 90% of the cost happens here in the U.S.

Can you say the same about your Asus product? Asus, like Foxconn, is a Taiwanese company, btw.

Your Asus was made in China.

[tridim]

54. Foxconn manufactures Asus MB's for use in name brand computers like Dell.

The Asus OEM MB's I buy are manufactured at the Asus plant.

There are no MB's or CPU's manufactured in America, if there were I'd buy them. I'm not sure what you're driving at here, it is off topic.

Again, you're discounting the business I take away from the Foxconn sweat shops by choosing not to do business with major manufacturers like Apple and Dell that assemble their systems from top to bottom at Foxconn. When you choose Apple, you are stuck with the assembly plant they choose for you. You pay a 200% markup for that 'privilege', I don't.

[nadinbrzezinski]

68. And I am betting some of your components came from

A certain province in China...in fact, Foxxcon most likely since they're the biggest producer.

I will give you points for trying.

But you see, tv components, telephone components, mostly any electronics you have at home...or do you build your tv and phone too?

Time to step away from the hate for a single company (in this case the dang tree) and look at the forest.

It is the slavery stupid, and to stop it Chinese need a union movement and we need strong regulations forbidding doing business with countries that allow slave like conditions.

[FSogol]

10. Know those mini van stickers with stick figures representing spouses, kids, and pets?

I saw one the other day where the guy was representing his family using the Apple logo.

[Dreamer Tatum]

12. Let's take this idiotic graphic apart, shall we?

1. Suicides - over what time period? What is the "national average"? Is it controlled for the same demographic mix as that which work at Foxconn? And so forth.

2. There are a million workers at Foxconn? Is this stratified by industry?

3. What is the cost of living? Is this a real or nominal amount? Shouldn't the median be used? Is salary the ONLY metric used for worker wellbeing?

Finally, I thought the rabid defenders of the Holy Apple told us that Foxconn makes all sorts of stuff for other corporations. Why then does this fucking idiot Fry surmise from this highly misleading data that one should "buy Apple?" Makes no sense.

Epic fail, whoever-the-fuck Fry is.

[tridim]

47. I'm not the one with an iPhone as my avatar, Tesha.

[dmallind]

8. I own zero Apple products, and I agree

Never bought into the Mac-I-faddism but, presuming the numbers are accurate, how should they be refuted? I've been to China quite a few times and been to dozens of plants large and small - albeit not this particular one. I saw no chains. I did see lots of applicants to get jobs there. Why are those people wrong?

[Romulox]

11. I don't know who Stephen Fry is, so to me, he'll be famous for defending exploitation.

"But others in China are even MORE exploited!"

[onehandle]

15. He's a world famous Writer, Actor, Director, Atheist, Gay Rights Activist, and Humanitarian.

Kim Kardashian is not the be-all and end-all of fame out there. You should broaden your horizons.

[Dreamer Tatum]

16. And now he can add Goddamned Idiot to his credit. nt

[redqueen]

18. He's really not, though.

I hope he hears some feeback about this and realizes his mistake in repeating that Forbes nonsense.

[Romulox]

17. LOL. He's a British comedian who thinks worker exploitation is justifiable. nt

[LanternWaste]

29. As does anyone who uses modern electronic equipment

"who thinks worker exploitation is justifiable..."

As does anyone who uses modern electronic equipment, the only difference being in degrees. However, I realize we all rationalize our own habits-- quite often at the expense of the habits of others.

[Romulox]

31. Nonsense. These are rationalizations. Most of us are NOT defending worker exploitation--

Stephen Fry (and his defenders ) are.

BTW, noticed you ran away from your (bizarre!) claim that Al Gore isn't on Apple's Board of Directors; he is.

[smirkymonkey]

67. I am very familiar with him and have always liked his work..

This seems very out of charachter for him. Perhaps it was another Stephen Fry.

[leftyohiolib]

13. rationalization at its finest

[Romulox]

20. Tweet from TV's Whitley: "Would you rather be poisoned by Cadmium AND hungry???"

So I considered the matter settled!

[Snake Alchemist]

21. If Apple is at 24%, who is the 2nd highest and what is their percentage? nt

[onehandle]

32. Not sure, but my guess would be Dell or HP. However Foxconn makes all Kindles for Amazon...

...and although they are way, way behind Apple in 'tablet' sales, the sheer number sold may be more units than anything made for Dell and HP.

[Snake Alchemist]

38. My point is that it could be Dell and be 0.5%. Apple is the elephant in the room. nt

[bowens43]

22. Child labor isn't the only reason that apple sucks.

they oppose freedom. they lock down their devices. they prevent those who purchase their hardware from utilizing them in any manner they choose. they actively seek to stifle competition by initiating ridiculous and baseless patent violation lawsuits.

they are every bit is evil as microsoft.

open source = open mind

[joeybee12]

23. Doesn't the Stephen Fry we're thinking of spell his name FryE

[onehandle]

24. No.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Fry

[joeybee12]

27. You're right...I guess he has had some twitter controversy before...

about Poland.

I'm trying to find out if he works for Apple in some capacity, appears in their ads...the whole thrust of his post is, Apple doesn't suck like the rest...and he got this info from Forbes, hardly an innocent bystander.

[The Straight Story]

26. "But mom, all the other kids are doing it to" Let me put it this way:

If you use apple products and you think they should not be made with slave labor you damn well have a right to complain to them about their practices.

Since most of us have used everything from I-Tunes to iphones what do you want us to do, just say 'well, we expect this from apple and others, we are just like dell' - like that is something to be proud of.

Apple fanboys are deranged.

[Old and In the Way]

28. Well, the OEMs and Foxconn have a solution to deal with this problem.

Lay them off!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/01/foxconn-robots-replace-chinese-workers

This headache with worker exploitation will be dealt with by creating a laborless workforce. I'm sure that will help the average Chinese worker. Dumping a half million workers won't collapse the average wage paid in the rest of the non-Foxconn factories, either.

[think]

30. Steve Fry should know: You can't polish a turd /nt

[Dreamer Tatum]

33. Actually, the upcoming iTurd has a brushed aluminum case.

And therefore doesn't require polishing.

Designed in California - Excreted in China.

[think]

35. I busted a gut on that reply. Thanks! Still laughing!

[tridim]

36. The mythbusters disproved that

The current Republican field is pretty good at it too.

I'd say that turd polishing is par for the course these days, though no matter how shiny it gets it is still a ball of shit.

[think]

39. I stand corrected. Darn those meddling Mythbusters!

[katsy]

37. There are zero corporations that embrace

ethical practices. They are out for their investors and themselves.

Unless and until all governments are taken over by populists and these corporate monsters are broken up; living wages are established worldwide; workers unions represent workers worldwide; nothing will change except the villain du jour.

Corporations should be banned from funding elections. They should be banned from influencing governments.

That is the solution. It is unrealistic to expect any corporation to not exploit people for profit.

Break up those bad boys! The world needs living wages not slave labor.

[Whisp]

40. ''If you don't like it, move out of the country''

what that Allen West basically said and ones who were blabbering that during the Chimperor's reigh of terror.

This is what people are basically saying if you gripe about Jobs being part of the 1% and they say: well, you're using a computer, arent' you! so shut up!

That would mean we can't say anything about Exxon either then, if we had a car. Or we can't complain about big Pharma because we may need that Tylenol now and then.

silliness.
I have every right to think Jobs is an asshole, even while I type it out on my Mac. It's almost karmic.

[onehandle]

41. We can and should, still complain. But a boycott wouldn't help. nt

[Incitatus]

45. There were founding fathers that treated their slaves better than other plantation owners too. nt

[Incitatus]

46. The workplace fatalities statistic comparing America is misleading.

They are building computer products at Foxconn. Is that being compared to all workplaces in America that include farming, mining, building heavy machinery ,etc?

[onehandle]

51. Would you like to compare the farming, mining, building heavy machinery, etc rate in China...

...to the building of computer products here in the U.S.?

I think not.

[JackRiddler]

52. These are deranged apologies for horrible labor conditions.

Doesn't matter who else is buying from Foxconn or what their real rate of accidents and suicides is or how much worse the conditions may be at other workplaces. It's still a forced labor camp and Apple is still a valid target. Fry is telling the forced laborers to shut up and be grateful because conditions are worse elsewhere. This is a step away from "let them eat cake."

The accompanying graphic is disgusting, smug, and eminently illogical. Cost competition is so dominant nowadays because states drank the "free trade" Koolaid and economies have been tailored to the neoliberal dictates where every worker in the world must compete against every other. Higher wages in China would mean more of the product could be consumed at home. Even Henry Ford a century ago understood the utility of living wages for the labor, today's capitalists have fallen behind that standard.

Oh, and who cares what Stephen Fry thinks? He's a good comic, but any authority he has in economics would have to come from strength of argument and this one lacks it.

[Sea-Dog]

53. I ve got respect for Stephen fry

but I'm sure I've seem him shout out about his love of all things Apple before

[marlakay]

55. I still say they should each have small factory here

with made in america on products and when they see a good portion of us are willing to pay a bit more to have it made here with american workers they will continue to keep at least part of production here.

[we can do it]

57. I Agree. All American Companies Should.

[onehandle]

58. Eventually, production abroad will become too expensive. Some analysts say that is starting now.

Someone on MSNBC said that it will begin in earnest as soon as 2015.

Here's hoping.

[we can do it]

56. Don't Slow the Haters Down with Facts

[airplaneman]

61. Whats going on here?

Somebody tweets something on twitter and everyone believes it must be true?
Check out Wikipedia on this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_in_the_People's_Republic_of_China
snip:
"According to the journal Culture, Medicine and Psychiatry, there are over 300,000 suicides in China annually."
So where did the 220 come from?
So who do you want to believe?
-Airplane

edit:spelling

[Spider Jerusalem]

62. More perspective for Apple defenders:

25% of Foxconn's production is a larger individual share than any other single company whose products are also manufactured in those factories.

And not a single component in my PC was manufactured by Foxconn; I bought the components separately and assembled them myself.

[onehandle]

65. Ha ha. Name the parts. Name the makers.

Track down every circuit and processor in the drives, the power, each switch, screw, and wire.

Then do the same for every piece of electronics in your life. Your refrigerator, your thermostat, your microwave, your car, your bedside clock.

You are not Foxconn free and you are certainly not Chinese labor free.

Nice try.

[nadinbrzezinski]

70. You also assembled your tv

How about your cell? Your oven? How abou your microwave? Do you have a gaming console?

And given how many COMPONENTS were assembled in CHINA....

Get some perspective...this is a PRODUCTION SYSTEM, ad that is the forest.

[joshcryer]

63. You post an image that links an article by Tim Worstall?

Seriously?

Read the article. What a callous, evil point of view, and justification.

If I didn't know better (that Apple apologists were truly deluded about the product), I'd think the image was an intentional troll.

"Support the workers. Buy Apple."

[econoclast]

64. Velocity Micro. Assembled in Richmond VA

In an age where just about all electronics come from Asia...check out Velocity Micro. PCs are assembled in Richmond Virginia. Of course the components come from all over. But Velocity Micro is a fine first step for those seeking an alternative to 100% sweatshop electronics.

[onehandle]

66. Assembly is less than ten percent of production.

90% of your PC's production was done in Asia.

Although, 10% is better than nothing.

[nadinbrzezinski]

69. Where did the components come from?

Assembly is the last stage of production.