Contrary to what I have read here, I think "Pawn Stars"

[goodthanksandyou]

is appropriate for the History Channel.

The same goes for "American Pickers" (if I have the name of that show correct).

To some, they may seem like superficial shows, but I think you can learn quite a bit about history from them.

If someone brings in an old piece on Pawn Stars, for example, they will usually call in an expert to both appraise and explain the history of the piece in detail.

I find these explanations entirely fascinating and educational. In 30 minutes, I can learn several things that I did not know before watching a particular episode.

And Chum Lee is a trip.

The only thing I don't like is Rick's laugh. That's gotta go.

[Scuba]

1. I like both those shows. Pawn Stars would do well to drop the name-calling that goes on ...

... between the players. It's the historical significance of the items that makes the show, much like "Pickers".

"Hard Core Pawn" on the other hand, is about the tragic lives of people, and not fun to watch at all.

[goodthanksandyou]

3. I never saw Hard Core Pawn

but it sounds like I would not like it.

I agree about the name calling, it gets on my nerves.

I've read that "Pawn Stars" would not exist without Chum Lee. Apparently, he is quite a celebrity and people view him as a regular guy who has risen to an unconventional success.

[pipoman]

5. Couldn't agree more about the Hardcore disfunctional

family of morons..None of them would know a true collectible (not talking about Franklin mint, baseball cards or Hallmark ornaments here) if it walked in the door. I have thought that they would do well to buy stuff in Detroit from the people who are desperate, then have a shop in Chicago, to sell the stuff..but alas, they can't even be civil to each other...

[Bay Boy]

26. They are only pretending to

not be civil to each other. It's all scripted.

[Mnpaul]

44. Pawn shops are not antique stores

Pawn shops are about making money and lending money to people who are unable to borrow money by other means. 99.9% of pawn brokers would probably tell you the business model used by the Pawn Stars bunch is idiotic. You never allow the customer to know the true value of an item if you know and they don't. You never give a customer more than what they are asking. Hardcore Pawn is a realistic view of how pawn shops work. Pawn Stars is not.

[pipoman]

50. Yeah, nobody has ever made money buying and selling antiques..

My point is that pawn shop owners who don't value the valuable in favor of used nintendos are not fully realizing the opportunity before them..Now I am sure they can make money on used nintendos, but they can also loose money on ignorance driven missed opportunity.

I guess I've been doing it wrong all these years, eh? Oh, and the courts don't quite agree with you. I first learned of this several years ago in a case where a man sold an indian blanket to a known collector of blankets for 10k and the buyer revealed that the blanket was a rare first chief's blanket worth 100k+. The seller sued, even though the seller set the price. The buyer lost and had to pay because he was an expert who failed to disclose that the known value was far higher than the price asked..the court found that the expert was obligated to tell the seller. I have paid people more than their asking price a few times over the years. The easiest way to chisel a price is to convince a person they are asking too much, and that I am going to see a profit or I'm not buying it.

This seems more of a business ethics question...I don't think I wish to do business with your business model..

[Mnpaul]

53. I'll take the pawn shop profits before the antique shop profits any day

The problem with your example is that the buyer was an expert. You are comparing apples and oranges. Show me a case where a pawn shop has been sued for paying too little.

Pawn shops are usually only interested in buying items that they can turn quickly and items they can pawn at well below value which will bring them the monthly interest every month or will sell quickly if the person doesn't come back. All you have to do is look at the comparison between the two stores. One is huge, the other a little hole in the wall being sued for violating a previous contract. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/12/pawn-stars-lawsuit_n_2285052.html

The owners of both shops started out with small shops that were family businesses. One guy practiced smart pawn practices and turned his his tiny story into a huge one. It is not hard to see which one is the proper way to run a pawn shop.

[pipoman]

55. what ever..lol

if I buy an ipods for $20 knowing I can get...what ever my margin..$60..then that was a good buy. If I can buy a winchester hammer for $20 and get $60, why would I let that walk out the door? Nobody is saying they haven't made money on ipods,

Further, these two examples have vastly..vastly different client base. One is in the most depressed city in the US with among the lowest disposable income (i.e shopping for necessities of life), the other is in a city among the least depressed in the nation with literally millions of people bringing all of their disposable income, big winners, and convention goers (looking for cool shit to waste money on). Those vegas guys sell that stuff, it isn't a museum.

You never did say why you think it is a-ok to make an obscene profit off of desperate people instead of paying a fair price? Trying to talk someone who has just asked for 20% the value of what they are selling down to 10% because they are desperate..

[Mnpaul]

58. Obscene profit?

You obviously have no idea of what is involved. They are many costs you don't see. Those security guards are a big cost. Everything has to be reported to the police and tracked. Pawn software is expensive. Not everything you bring in brings you huge profits. Sometimes you get stuck with junk. Sometimes the item is stolen and the police take it. You may or may not get reimbursed. You have to keep your costs down so that you can sell it at least 25% below the price of new and that is only if the item is in excellent condition. To get to that point and still make a profit you need to pay roughly 25% to 35% of new. People who shop at pawnshops want a bargain too. That is why they shop there.

[Peter cotton]

61. I used to go to used book stores and buy books for $3 that I knew I could flip for $30 or more

on Ebay. It took a lot of hunting, and such finds weren't common...but it helped me pay for a number of trips around the country. On a couple of occasions I wound up with more money in my pocket after the the vacation than before, and that was after paying for the vacation.

Those days are over now, of course...used booksellers almost invariably check the online prices for collectible books at Amazon, Abebooks, etc.

Tell me: when I found a handful of rare Roswell High paperbacks at a paperback exchange and bought them for $20, subsequently selling them on Ebay for $500...was that an "obscene" profit?

[pipoman]

63. It's a different kettle of fish..

I have done exactly what you describe many times over the years..a few times I have actually went back to the seller at a later time and handed them some more money..usually because such a move will make the seller happy and guess who the seller called next time they picked something up they thought might interest me. If you open a used bookstore, OTOH, and advertise to buy books. Someone comes in with those same Roswell books. You ask them what they want for them, and they tell you $30, then you ponder incredulously, and bounce back with, "they're really only worth $20 to me (knowing full well they are worth $500) then, you are an expert taking advantage of someone. If a person walks into your bookstore with the same books and asks you what they are worth (you know they are worth $500) and you say they are worth $20, you may have at least opened your self to civil liability and possibly committed a criminal act and are making an obscene profit because of that..

[pipoman]

64. I know that there isn't a single retail business

whose standard profit margin on their products of 600%. Every business has expenses, overhead, software, breakage, labor. If margins are within reason, there is no problem. 'Within reason' is subjective up to a point..it would be a hard sell to justify ripping someone who consulted you (as an expert) about the value of the item they wish to sell, by paying them 10% of what you will sell it for. It is hard to say you are not an expert if you are engaged in the business of selling the item being purchased.

Again, there is a business ethics point here. I know people who lurk for desperate victims...I choose not to patronize their businesses..they are usually self important rethug asses...I wasn't born yesterday and can usually tell a greedy con artist with a few minutes. There are many others who are fair..it's an easy decision for me..I have rarely been desperate when selling anything..others aren't so lucky. So if you think it's perfectly cool to see how cheaply you can buy something from someone who is trusting or depending on you to be fair with them...you're probably a merchant I may shop buy would only buy if I knew you had made a mistake. There is just such a shop a few miles away from me. I have shopped them periodically for over 20 years. A number of years ago I witnessed this shop owner telling an old lady her dolls were not that collectible and bought them cheap..the woman no more walked out the door and the owner was calling a doll collector friend telling them of the conquest on this super rare doll. They get good stuff but I never buy or negotiate for items which are priced as they should be, I have bought several things over the years which were far under priced...karma is a bitch..

[Mnpaul]

71. 600%?

You really have no clue what you are talking about. You won't even find that kind of profit margin at any pawn shop. In reality the best you might see is 100% and that is rare. I know because I worked at one for 5 years and ran it by myself for half of that time. I will give you an example of how that 10% is misleading you.

About a year ago I purchased a Logitech Z-5300 speaker system from a pawn shop. They originally sold for $400. I purchased them from the pawn shop for $80. At the time they were selling on eBay for $170. When I got home I found out that two speakers were blown. I went back and told them the problem. They offered to refund my money. I told them that I would be willing to buy them at a reduced price. I figured that they paid $40(roughly 25% of going price on eBay) and offered them $50. They consulted with their manager and he said yes. So there you have it. They paid 10% of new price but did not make 600%. Not even close. They made $10. A 25% profit and that is before you take their costs out.

And none of these shows give you the other side of the coin, people who try to dump their broken crap off on the pawnshop. They will go to great lengths to cheat the pawn broker. If you ask any pawn broker if they ever bought a fake Rolex, you will see that almost every one has bought at least one and got burned bad.

[pipoman]

84. So above you were

saying something about, 'you never want to tell a customer at a pawn shop what their item is worth retail'? Why? The only reason it would matter if you are trying to make an unreasonable, and inexplicably high profit on the item and are ashamed or know it would blow your deal to be honest with the person.

Understand, I'm not saying anything much about the validity of either of these shows, for all I know neither pawn shop exists and these are filmed on a Hollywood lot. Justifying $.10 on the dollar for some customers by dishonesty or 'fraud by deception/omission' because other customers bring in broken TVs that you buy..I suppose that is fine for some..I would more likely see how many broken TVs I take vs. how many I buy, then reduce what I pay for TVs by that percentage or increase the price I charge. This is how other businesses deal with breakage..you do know all businesses experience breakage, no? Other businesses don't go steal a truck load of merchandise, or con someone out of their property to make up for breakage.

Mistakes cost money in my business too, mistakes happen...still not a good reason to take advantage of a desperate person. If you are in the business of buying Rolex, you should know what you're doing.

[Mnpaul]

85. If you tell a customer what it is worth

they are going to have unrealistic expectations on what they will get for it. You see it happen on Pawn Stars. They don't understand all the things I outlined above. The pawn shop software comes into play here as well. If someone is a good customer who reclaims their stuff every time, you can give them more. If someone never redeems their stuff, you give them little.

Taking advantage of desperate people happens every day. Take Apple's iPhone. They cost around $198 to make and that is made possible by workers that get slave wages working in factories so miserable that they have to put nets around the buildings to prevent people from jumping to their death. Do you have any new electronics in your house? If you do, you are taking advantage of desperate people.

[pipoman]

87. More justification of bad behavior IMO..

[sir pball]

70. The Pawn Stars shop really isn't a proper pawnshop though

They're more of a high-end collectables/antiques/memorabilia-type store that operates as a pawn shop; the value of the items they take in and consequently the kind of monies they move makes me suspect they wouldn't even think about making an exchange under a hundred bucks or so for something that isn't offbeat or interesting - not gonna go pawn a relatively cheap watch or ring there.

Hardcore Pawn is just sad.

[Mnpaul]

73. Hardcore pawn is reality

Pawn Stars is just a fantasy. It is more of a tourist trap than anything else. You can go on Youtube and see what is really in the store. Sure they have collectibles on the wall but it looks like most of it is Pawn Stars branded merchandise. Only one small part of the store is dedicated to doing pawn business.

And you are not going to be happy selling a ring at any pawn shop. They are going to base their price on the true value not what you paid for it. I have seen many people get sticker shock when trying to pawn a wedding ring. If you paid $2000, the diamond is probably worth $800-$900 and the gold is worth $10-$20. People then freak out because the pawn brokers only offer them $250(25% of actual value). Jewelers really take people to the cleaners on wedding rings often selling them for 100% more than they are actually worth. Diamonds over one carat are the exemption. They will bring more due to the fact they are easy to sell.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

83. Retail jewelry is a complete ripoff.

The value of diamonds is inflated because of the DeBeers cartel & their advertising campaigns. Diamonds are not that rare.

Also, the value depends on the quality grade. Just because it's bigger than a carat does not mean it's high quality. Most people see ads for SI and I (Slightly Imperfect and Imperfect). That doesn't sound bad.
Actually SI and I grades are full of flaws and should be in a grinding wheel, not set in jewelry.

If you looked at a clean diamond with a 10 power loupe, you would be able to see through it; the back facets would be clearly visible. Clean would be Flawless, Internally Flawless, (Very very slight) VVS1, VVS2, VS1 and VS2. That's six different grades.

Color starts at the letter D for colorless, and goes down the alphabet into yellow, which eventually turns into fancy yellow and the price goes up again.

Also, the cut, symmetry, proper angles for maximum brilliance, and polish would be good.

A crummy diamond, like most of what they sell in chain stores, under a 10x loupe, looks terrible, has bubbles, flaws, lines, black spots, and so forth.

I took a week long course in Diamond Grading from G.I.A. and once worked at a lease dept. at a dept. store selling alleged "Fine Jewelry".

I was SO ASHAMED of it. It did not have GIA grading certificates on it and was not worth carrying out of the store. I was selling prematurely mined lumps of coal.

But there is this mystique about real jewelry and diamonds that is perpetuated so the jewelers can make money off an uninformed consumer. If you want high quality stones you will have to pay real serious money for them.

And they generally don't set crummy stones in platinum, as that is the highest-quality metal used for jewelry. It's extremely hard and does not wear away.

Anything else ya wanna know? I don't know anything about prices, we didn't learn that in our diamond grading class.

Someday I want to see a D flawless diamond.

[pipoman]

2. I don't know if it's exactly history..

but you have to hand it to them, they have a couple of shows there which are well received, watched by many, and has undoubtedly brought new viewers to their channel. I like them because I have been picking for 30 years. Knowledge is the key to picking...the more educated you are about many areas of antiques and collectibles, the less chance you will walk by the illusive 'home runs' which every good picker lives to find..

[goodthanksandyou]

4. I admire what you do

and I view picking as trying to find a needle in a haystack. You definitely need a lot of knowledge to make a consistent profit.

[pipoman]

23. I started as a child

my parents owned a used furniture store..they would buy estates and I would get all the cool little stuff out of the drawers and around the house. I didn't really sell anything, I just kept the things I thought was cool..we lived on a farm so had plenty of storage. Then I went to college and was poor..I went to a flea market and saw the prices people were paying for the kind of junk I liked. I set up at flea markets and lived pretty well through college on the junk I had accumulated. Then I was married with a child and again poor..I started buying and selling again and staved off financial despair.. Now I don't have as much time so I buy some, don't sell much..I plan to sell in retirement..It's been the difference between barely eating and having some disposable income..

[bluestate10]

81. I some time watch American Picker if I have the television tuned to that channel when the TV

is on. Some of the people that the pickers visit are interesting. I particularly was touched by the dirt poor guy with the dog. The guy had items on his property that if sold would make him rich for the rest of his life. But the man refused to sell any of the valuable items because of his emotional and historical attachment to them. To me, his story is both beautiful and sad, beautiful in that he shows there are feelings and items that are more important to a person than money. His story is sad because if he doesn't have an heir, his valuable possessions will one day be looted by people that don't love and value them as much as he does.

[truebluegreen]

35. I like Pawn Stars too, but the problem with bringing new viewers to the channel

is that most of the programming is crap. "The History Channel"? puhleeze.

[Ikonoklast]

6. It's total bullshit. Those 'customers' are shills, paid for by the producers.

With the Internet, one can find the worth of almost anything, and sell to a world-wide audience for the best price.

Why sell it in a dive Vegas pawn shop for pennies?


A History Channel producer was on NPR last month and spilled the beans on all of those 'reality' shows, they are all scripted, they use a formula for each show of fake drama, the players are all contractual employees of the channel.

[jorno67]

9. "Why sell it in a dive Vegas pawn shop for pennies?"

the answer is in your question...Vegas. People need/want quick cash to get back to the tables/slots/strip.

[Ikonoklast]

13. But that isn't what's happening there.

Where do you think the producers are finding people with rare items to sell?

They are scouring the Web, finding them when they post their stuff for sale and PAY them to bring it into the shop.

[TheCowsCameHome]

14. One guy brought in a unique piece of American history

(if real, and I forget at the moment just what it was) was CLEARLY Sotheby's or Christie's material.

WTF? Bring something like that into a hokey place theirs?

[Ikonoklast]

16. Because he was paid by the producers to do so.

And if sold to the shop for less than current market value, the show's producers make up the difference to the item's owner for a previously agreed-to amount.

All fake.

The show's ex-producer that went on NPR described exactly how they do this.

[pipoman]

15. I agree..

it is too good to be true in many cases..the educational value isn't eliminated for anyone who likes to go to garage sales, flea markets, antiquing, etc. I have met many 'pickers' over the years while picking myself. We all have our areas of interest, knowledge, and market (value of these things is based on a market which is extremely subjective). For instance one woman I know goes to all the same estate sales, etc. I do.. She looks for dolls, vintage clothing, and jewelery. I look for antique tools, advertising, postcards and photos. Over the years we have educated each other..she picks for me and I pick for her..we send pics to each other before buying. It happens all the time that I am walking through a sale behind 10 other people and I find something incredible and profitable...the more I know, the less chance I am the one walking by a $1000 bill..

[Art_from_Ark]

19. When you sell on the Internet, you take the chance that you will get stiffed

Some people who sell coins through the Internet, for example, have told me that they have had "customers" who wanted to get something for nothing-- they would order a coin or coins, pay with a credit card, then cancel the charge, claiming that the item was fake or was not as it was advertised.

[Ikonoklast]

21. You think a pawn shop won't rip you off?

It's the reason they exist.

Even reputable coin dealers get accused of shading their customers.

But what you're describing is outright fraud.

[pipoman]

24. I have been buying and selling on ebay and other

sites since 1995. I have had, maybe, 10 issues out of literally thousands. Of course it depends somewhat on what you are selling...auto parts and contemporary clothing vs. large market antiques and collectibles. The people who get burnt are buyers who don't know the area of antiques or collectables they are buying...ignorance...this has been the cause of 1/2 of my issues..as a seller being smart enough to be willing to cancel sales of people with little or no history on the site it the buyer doesn't respond quickly. So, as a seller of antiques and collectables, I've found the vast, vast majority of buyers pay and are happy as long as the photos are good and the descriptions are accurate..

[Jacoby365]

30. I don't know about how scripted Pawn Stars is

But I have owned a few antique stores, and you would not believe the stuff that walks in the doors sometimes, not unlike what you see on Pawn Stars. Surprisingly, lots of people don't have a clue about how to sell a rare item, or even how to research it.

[Posteritatis]

76. It's a safe bet that any reality show is very heavily scripted by now. (nt)

[In_The_Wind]

7. Color me uniformed again. Where can I find these shows you speak of?

[img][/img] now I have my coffee [img][/img]

[img][/img]

[goodthanksandyou]

40. Hi, they are on the history channel on cable TV.

[In_The_Wind]

41. I think I can find that!

G'night!

[goodthanksandyou]

42. Goodnight!

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

66. "Hardcore Pawn" is on TruTV

But it is an ugly show, featuring a disfunctional family of pawnbrokers and equally disfunctional parodies of customers.

It was too much, even for me, and I sort of LIKE some horrible TV.

If it's real, it's a sick view of the city and its people. If it's scripted, it's a sick view by producers and writers.

I like American Pickers. It's probably also fake, dumb, and scripted, but at least the characters seem happy and respectful.

[In_The_Wind]

68. I avoid all of the shows makin' money on the hardship of people tryin' to survive.

Sometimes life sucks.

[alphafemale]

8. A friend of mine was an actor on American Pickers

Most of the Reality Shows on TV now are "reality" in only the vaguest sense.

[Bay Boy]

27. Tell me more...

...details please!

[alphafemale]

29. Savannah episode

The "creepy" appraiser at the end.

[Bluenorthwest]

65. And so that person is not an appraiser?

nt

[alphafemale]

67. Most "reality" shows are scripted and played by actors.

Also?

Santa and the Easter Bunny are Mom/Dad.

[Mnpaul]

75. Market Warriors on PBS

presents are more realistic view and you see what happens in the real world. Most of them lose money each week.

[Squinch]

10. I can agree with you, but the fact that this is the closest they get to actual history programming

- in among the ice road truckers and the swamp people and the gun love whatever those interlude things are - means they have seriously lost their right to call themselves a history channel.

[truebluegreen]

37. +1000 n/t

[Squinch]

60. Wouldn't it be nice to see a biography of Tsar Nicholas, or Attucks Crispus, or Ghengis Khan?

OR something on an archeological dig?

I guess that doesn't make as much money as a guy in a swamp.

[TheCowsCameHome]

11. Both shows are interesting

Both shows are interesting, but I don't think the History Channel is doing itself (or viewers) any favors by running episodes of each end to end to end for 6 hours-plus all night long. The same goes for A&E - oversaturation.

American Pickers turned me off long ago. Mike begged and pleaded with some old guy to sell him a particular piece of black Americana, saying he wanted it soooo badly for his personal collection, and that he'd been searching for this specific one for years, so the guy reluctantly gave in and sold it to him, thinking he had sold to someone who really appreciated it. Then Mike couldn't get back to his truck fast enough to call a customer to flip it for a quick buck.

[CBHagman]

18. How revolting.

What troubles me most about the way the media is run in this country is that the message of making money invariably comes to the fore. It's as though increasing profits is not merely the highest good, by corporate and societal standards, but the only good.

I'm not saying your average American or even your average cable subscriber automatically believes it, but the message comes across again and again.

If something is labeled the Learning Channel or the History Channel, it ought to live up to the billing. What I saw during the years I had cable was that very few channels lived up to the promise. TCM remains one of the few exceptions.

What's even more frightening is how virulently today's Republican Party opposes public broadcasting. You'd think the so-called family values crowd would cheer wholesome educational programming, documentaries, concerts, do-it-yourself shows, and science series -- well, maybe not science series -- but they claim it can all be had for a price on cable. Yeah, back-to-back episodes of staged reality shows are just the pinnacle of cultural and broadcasting achievement.

[woo me with science]

25. Well said, especially your first two sentences.

We live in a very sick corporatized culture, and we are propagandized 24/7 to embrace its sick corporate values.

[tularetom]

34. Well, the "Learning Channel" has Honey Boo Boo on so your point is well made

It was the only thing I ever watched where they had to have subtitles for people allegedly speaking English.

[alphafemale]

12. World's Worst Tenants is completely scripted and acted and has no educational values.

But it is such fun to watch.

[dipsydoodle]

17. I like watching American Pickers here in the UK

Last edited Sat Mar 16, 2013, 02:42 PM - Edit history (1)

Storage Wars too. Yes a lot of it is contrived but it remains good entertainment.

Reminds me of a friend's sister in OH who buzzed off to an estate sale on a Sunday afternoon. She picked up the stool for a Hammond B3 organ for $40 for her sister who had such a B3 in her living room but no stool. When the sale ended she wandered off into a barn and could see something covered with a dust sheet which when removed exposed a mint B3. She asked how much for it and the reply was £20 to save skipping it. It hadn't been put in the sale cos they didn't think anyone would want it !

[Fumesucker]

52. Long ago I bought a Fender Rhodes piano at the flea market for $20 and sold it online for a lot more

It actually ended up going to France, the artist was touring the US at the time and took it with him back to France.

The one I had looked just like this, even had the foot pedal.

[baldguy]

20. Instead of watching a couple hucksters haggling over a unique historical object for profit

I'd much rather watch a story of the history of that object - which is something neither of those shows ever do. Just as with all "reality" TV, there's very little reality to be had.

[madamesilverspurs]

22. Worst of the bunch of 'scavenger' shows

is the one about the "diggers". Real historians and legitimate archaeologists would never ever engage in such wholesale destruction of any site. I cringe to think of how much of the potential historical record will be destroyed by those 'inspired' to take a backhoe to a place more worthy of informed examination. This is anti-history.

[Posteritatis]

77. The fact that they even aired that poisonous garbage offends me. (nt)

[dballance]

28. Chum is a total waste of human flesh

If there were any reality to the show he'd have been fired long ago.

[dem in texas]

31. Pawn Stars Prices

I have been in the second hand and antique business for over 30 years and I think that Pawn Stars gives the most accurate pricing for collectible items. American Pickers, storage Wars, some of the others, forget about them, the prices are "pie in the sky".

[BlueStreak]

51. I agree. The storage wars stuff is really outrageous. They can find a box of used Kleenex

and will exclaim "that's a 90-dollar-bill all day long." Never mind the fact that there is no such thing as a "90 dollar bill". Add to the bogus factor the fact that they have all these "extras" hanging around making bids, but amazingly none of them ever wins a single auction.

Pawn Stars is like any other "reality" show in that they figure out the cheapest production is one where they spend at least 10 minutes each show with the characters just sassing one another. That gets old really quick, so I rarely watch the program anymore, even though it does have some good moments.

And lately it seems they waste a big part of every half hour with the "drama" of dickering the price. Sorry, that just isn't interesting. I don't need to watch that stupid little dance. To me, what is much more compelling is the unusual items, the history behind the items, the inflated expectations of the owners -- and sometimes a real surprise on the upside.

[pipi_k]

32. I don't

mind either of those shows. Like you said, there's a lot of good historical information on them, and no obnoxious bullshit drama like on "Hardcore Pawn", which I absolutely despise.

Chumlee is a trip, and I often suspect that when he's not on the show, he's probably a college graduate who speaks with a cultured British accent.

Or not.

[Whisp]

33. the name irritates me: it's a takeoff from Porn Stars

and the show irritates me too. I might have seen parts of 2 or so by accident and then I Go Click.

[tularetom]

36. The interaction between the characters is all scripted

Apparently the show's producers don't think the historical value of the items being sold is sufficient to hold the viewer's interest so they feel they have to introduce all this phony drama to make people watch the show.

It's a device that was first used on American Choppers. Constant tension between the father and son was the thread that ran through every episode, totally faked and it detracted from the actual content which was watching the crew build these custom motorcycles.

But if you want to watch a show-and-tell of historical artifacts, give Antiques Roadshow a try. You get the same kind of stuff without the bogus interaction between the principals.

[northoftheborder]

38. Interesting conversation and opinions about these shows, and the channels.

First, let me say, I am a dedicated viewer of "American Pickers". Yes, I know it is staged, but I love the characters and their friendship, the odd characters they run across, and plowing through junk looking for treasure has always been a favorite hobby of mine and our family! They do inform about the picks they find, and I've learned a lot from Frank and Mike although I am NOT interested in advertising signs and oil cans, bicycles, or motor cycles, or cars! But lots of their finds are very unique and interesting. They try to give a fair price, and even pay more, if the person truly has no idea of the items' value. Also, donation to museums for some rare items is done. The pawn show I cannot abide, simply because the dynamic between the family members is awful: sarcastic, downputting, and yes, that's staged, but why enjoy watching that kind of behavior - not entertaining to me - and the laugh you refer to as awful sounds like a heavy smoker's laugh.

But I agree with many of you, in general, who think the History Channel is a terrible waste of air time. It is getting worse and worse. Most of the shows are pathetic and written for the lowest common denominator in intelligence level and culture. It could be so educational, yet also, fun to watch, with some talent and actual historians involved. Have you ever watched "History Detectives" on PBS? It manages to be interesting and educational. I would fight to the death for PBS and NPR. They are islands in the midst of the ocean of sewage and sharks known as "media".

[Benton D Struckcheon]

39. A note on the History Channel and why it probably does what it does

This morning we went to the local library for their annual book sale. You can always get interesting, neglected books for very little.
The most interesting find this morning was a book simply titled "America", on our history from 1753 to 1783, copyright 1925 by the VFW's Americanization Department. No lie.
Bought it because it had all kinds of first hand accounts of things like The Boston Massacre, Wolfe's defeat of Montcalm at Quebec, etc. I have to sit with a pair of scissors because every few pages I run into the fact that two pages are still attached to each other, and so I have to use the scissors to cut the pages so I can read what's in between.
Think about that for a second. This book, containing what I can tell you is some truly interesting primary source material from our early history, was published in 1925 and by this evidence has sat around unread from that time until just now, with yours truly being the first human being to actually read what's between its covers, 88 years after publication.
And you wonder why The History Channel has to resort to Pawn Stars and American Pickers (both of which I find entertaining for the same reasons that others here have cited, by the way)?

[JI7]

47. i have interest in history but i'm no scholar

so sometimes when i'm talking to someone about anything i might mention something which i assume they would/should know but too many times people seem clueless about what i'm talking about.

there are also a few times where the person does know and they are surprised i would know something . they probably have experience of people being clueless.

[Paulie]

43. I like pawn stars

You can tell its scripted, like the sitcoms of old. When they don't make a deal the fake smile drops and grunpy cat appears on their faces as they head off camera.

But, it is entertaining and mostly harmless.

[spanone]

48. to zee lounge

[liberal_at_heart]

49. most tv shows are poorly produced but you are right

there are still tidbits of real information in there too. I get frustrated trying to watch science shows on Discovery Channel or the Science Channel because of the poor production but I can't help but watch because I love what I learn by watching them.

[Erose999]

54. The problem is that it frames the history as a monetary transaction. Doesn't really focus on

learning for the sake of learning, just the monetary value of objects.

I'd be much more interested in a show about the "experts," and their research. Especially the museum curator guy.

[JCMach1]

57. History of ephemera and a bit of social history in shows like these....

So, it's all good.

[olddots]

59. Theres nothing real about 96% of reality shows

unless you think fox news is news -----most of the people on them are a lot smarter off camera,

[union_maid]

62. I enjoy Pawn Stars

Storage wars is pretty dumb, but if it happens to be on, sometimes I watch it. A lot of the stuff they count as profit looks a lot to me like the junk that anyone acquires given time and if you're inclined to hang onto things rather than toss them right away. I would imagine that finding really valuable items in a public storage facilty is a pretty rare event, so it wasn't to surprising to learn that most of those finds are planted. I've never caught Pickers or Hardcore Pawn.

I don't mind the faked up interaction between the principles on Pawn Stars. It's hokey, but that's how a show creates a character. I always appreciate the explanation of how they arrive at what they're going to offer once a retail value has been arrived at. Having dealt, in the past, in used and sometimes collectible items - mostly books and vinyl records - it seems very realistic to me. Sellers show understandable distress over being offered so much less than market value, but the reasons are solid. They clearly have a lot more money to work with than we ever did in our little shop, but the point that having acquired an item, now they might have to sit with it for a long period of time is key. You want full value, you have to find the collector yourself.

I do agree that it's a shame that the History Channel, Discovery and even Arts and Entertainment have failed to live up to their originial promise. On Discovery they have plenty of junk science, Arts and Entertainment is light on the arts part and even when HC does history, if it's an area that I'm not familiar with I would check the facts before accepting the version they're presenting. But I'd still rather watch any of it than a single episode of Fear Factor. Yuck! Yet popular, or at least it was.

[In_The_Wind]

69. I have never watched either one of those shows.

[union_maid]

72. Well, it's not like you've missed all that much

Pawn Stars is fun if you have any interest in collectible things. It's also very undemanding TV. You can have it on and only watch the bits that catch your interest. If you're interested at all. But it's not like you're missing out on anything of any importance whatever.

[Posteritatis]

74. I imagine there's options out there better than contemporary reality TV. (nt)

[Hoyt]

78. These and news shows I like in the background when doing other things like playing my mandola.

You can kind of watch while concentrating on something(s) else.

[LadyHawkAZ]

79. I refuse to watch Pawn Stars

I don't really like most of the sell-stuff/buy-stuff shows. They smell too much like propaganda to me: "Sell Grandma's jewelry for less than half its value! Take the money and go buy this storage locker full of junk! You never know... wink wink!". But then I don't like TV much to begin with, so maybe it's just me.

[doc03]

80. The thing I don't like about all these so called reality shows

is they are staged. I just don't buy the idea all that stuff just randomly
walks in the store.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

82. I like Antiques Roadshow much better.

I learn a lot.

[pipoman]

88. When AR first began airing in the US

it was the UK version on PBS maybe in the 1980's. Their main sponsor was Maine Antique Digest . My mother bought me a subscription every year until she died. I wrote several freelance articles for MAD, and have learned about many things and kept up with values all these years..it is a great publication that I wouldn't have known about without AR.

[Incitatus]

86. In 30 minutes you may learn a few facts about 3 or 4 items?

The rest is scripted drama and commercials. As far as educational programming goes, those shows are pretty low on historical information for the time. But if it gets some people watching and learning who find more informative methods of learning boring, then good for them. You learn more from those shows than regular sitcoms.

Edit: An acquaintance recently told me he learned that the Chernobyl disaster was caused by a war with aliens and Russia. He said he learned it from The History Channel. I was a little skeptical of that, but for some reason I wouldn't be surprised if he did get the idea from one of their shows.