Why haven't you heard about *these* women? What you missed while you were distracted by boobies

[HiPointDem]

Last edited Sun Apr 7, 2013, 03:48 AM - Edit history (4)

March 2013: Thousands of people took to the streets of the Tunisian capital demanding to end the rule of the Islamist government, which they accuse of assassinating prominent secular politician, Chokri Belaid











http://rt.com/news/tunisia-protests-belaid-eu-366/

March 2013: Tunisian students perform the Harlem Shake outside their school last month in defiance of a government ban.



http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/mar/14/harlem-shake-moves-radical-beat-tunisia

http://newsfeed.time.com/2013/03/01/the-week-in-harlem-shake-seven-videos-from-tunisia-estonia-and-the-skies/

March 2013: Shoe-Waving Tunisian Protesters Call on (Ennahda-tied) Minister (of women's affairs) to Quit (acted as apologist for child's rape)





http://www.yourmiddleeast.com/news/child-rape-protesters-call-on-tunisian-minister-to-quit_13925

http://www.moroccoworldnews.com/wp-content/themes/goodnews45/framework/scripts/timthumb.php?src=

http://www.moroccoworldnews.com/2013/03/84019/child-rape-protesters-call-on-tunisia-minister-to-quit/



http://www.news24.com/Africa/News/Tunisia-child-rape-demos-want-ministers-head-20130325

March 2013: Tunisians protest the replacement of the national flag by Salafist

Tunisians come together to protest against the Islamic Salafist group, who climbed the university to put up their groups flag, and denounce the red Tunisian national flag.

http://www.demotix.com/news/1096558/tunisians-protest-replacement-national-flag-salafist#media-1096486

Tunisians protest the replacement of the national flag and to celebrate International Women's Day.

http://www.demotix.com/photo/1114812/tunisians-protest-replacement-national-flag

February 2013: Tunisians demand resignation of new PM Larayadh

Hundreds of people demonstrate in Tunis to demand the resignation of the new Prime Minister Ali Larayadh and the arrest of the killers of (leftist) opposition leader Chokri Belaid. They protested against Ennahdha and demanded the fall of his regime.

http://www.demotix.com/news/1823992/hundreds-tunisians-demand-resignation-new-pm-larayadh#media-1823849

Here's one I particularly like from the same demo (but I can't copy it, just link): Does this woman look like she's been cowed into compliance by "the patriarchy"?)

http://www.reuters.com/article/slideshow?articleId=USBRE9150B820130206&slide=1

Oct 2012: Hundreds of protesters thronged to a Tunis courtroom Tuesday as a woman and her fiance who accused police officers of rape and extortion defended themselves against allegations of indecency.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/world_now/2012/10/tunisia.html



http://www.ctvnews.ca/polopoly_fs/1.981204!/httpImage/image.jpeg_gen/derivatives/landscape_620/image.jpeg

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/tunisians-protest-alleged-police-rape-of-woman-accused-of-immodesty-1.979955





http://www.thenigerianreporter.com/police-rape-woman-in-tunisia-then-charge-her-with-indecency-outraged-tunisians-take-to-streets/





Tunisian university professor and human rights defender Raja Ben Slama speaks Saturday in Tunis during a meeting of support for the woman standing trial.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/oct/03/tunisians-protest-charges-woman-police

Feb 2013: Tunisia Moves to Contain Fallout After Opposition Figure Is Assassinated

Protesters surrounded the ambulance carrying the body of Chokri Belaid, the general secretary of the secular Tunisian Democratic Patriots party, who was shot dead earlier Wednesday in Tunis.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/07/world/africa/chokri-belaid-tunisian-opposition-figure-is-killed.html

August 2012: Tunisian women protest against the islamist-led government they fear will reduce women's rights:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-19253289




http://blogs.cfr.org/coleman/2012/08/15/women-free-speech-and-the-tunisian-constitution/




http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1682492/Tunisia-Thousands-rally-for-womens-rights









http://rt.com/news/tunisia-women-rights-rally-609/

A Tunisian woman holds a sign (L) reading "Do not touch the symbols and gains of our dear country" during a protest calling for the respect of women′s rights and other fundemental rights in front of the headquarters of the National Constituent Assembly on August 9, 2012

http://rt.com/news/protests-tunisia-anti-government-350/




A Tunisian woman holds a sign reading "Together for Equality" during a protest calling for the respect of women's rights in front of the headquarters of the National Constituent Assembly

Thousands rally in Tunisia for women's rights (slideshow)

http://www.reuters.com/article/slideshow/idUSBRE87C16020120814#a=2

January 2012: Tunisians protest fundamentalist and salafist attacks on journalists







http://www.demotix.com/news/1023125/tunisians-protest-fundamentalist-and-salafist-attacks-journalists#media-1023082

Nov. 2011: Tunisians protest against extremism and censorship







http://www.demotix.com/news/951254/tunisians-protest-against-extremism-and-censorship#media-944936

February 2011 (1 mo after the 'revolution'): Tunisians protest Islamism, demand tolerance



http://hurryupharry.org/2011/02/21/tunisians-protest-islamism-demand-tolerance



http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4030780,00.html

[Wounded Bear]

1. K & R...good stuff! nt

[cliffordu]

2. I believe the insult should be "Attracted only to boobies"

As long as you're insulting some folks here.

[Squinch]

101. Is that the point of this post for you?

[BlancheSplanchnik]

113. wtf?

And you have the gall to whine about feeling "called out", too?


Yeesh.

[Bonobo]

3. Same as "When did you stop beating your wife"...

You start with a false assumption and then post lots of pics.

Bravo for nothing.

[HiPointDem]

5. Kind of like the multiple postings of pix of the same 10-20 women flashing their boobies, eh?

[Luminous Animal]

18. No, Bonobo. There are women fighting to maintian there rights in Tunisiia.

Rights that they've already taken for granted. FEMEN has done NOTHING to support them. FEMEN does not even acknowledge them. Their sole message is to free someone that may not even need to be freed.

[BainsBane]

38. Why on earth should this make you upset?

I thought you were interested in hearing women's voices? Suddenly not so much?

[Bonobo]

42. It starts with the silly and untrue accusation that

we were attracted and distracted by boobies.

It is silly, juvenile and offensive.

How is it possible that you cannot see that when you seem so attuned to things that offend YOU?

[Scootaloo]

48. I haven't seen that it's untrue at all

As HiPointDem noted, these sort of demonstrations and protests have been going on a while now. Where was DU? Absolute silence. Du'ers are so ignorant about Tunisia that I've had to explain its political system no less than seven times on this site, always to people who believe since Tunisians are Muslim, that Tunisia must be some frightening Saudi-style hellhole.

Now that this lady has taken her shirt off, DU'ers who have absolutely never, ever given a flying fuck have their faces plastered to the screen. They still have no idea what the hell they're talking about in most cases, and almost always make wild, sweeping, islamphobic generalizations - Tunisia is still absolutely identical to Saudi Arabia, apparently.

What's the one difference between the wild ignorance and total disinterest of before, and the wild ignorance and acute attention paid now?

[redqueen]

96. Hear, hear!

[randome]

99. What's the difference between Tunisia and Saudi Arabia?

Sharia Law is being pushed in Tunisia. That's what started Amina's protest, apparently.

But you seem to be saying there's nothing to worry about.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

115. absolute misinterpretation of the post you're replying to. n/t

[randome]

117. Huh? The poster implied there was no difference between Tunisia and Saudi Arabia.

I made what I thought was a salient point that there IS a difference. Namely, there is a real danger of Sharia Law being imposed in Tunisia.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

124. that's not what the poster is saying at all. She's BEEN saying that Tunisia and SA are vastly dif-

Vastly different. And that these Tunisian women are protesting PRO-ACTIVELY against the threat of Sharia law and extremist government.

I swear, I've never seen so many men speak out so passionately and repeatedly for ONE woman's rights and safety before.

So sad that for some men, that's all they can percieve, and they can't generate enough empathy to understand what the majority of women are trying to tell them.

[muriel_volestrangler]

149. Rubbish - DU talked about the assassination of Bouzid, and the protests

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014391697
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014402813

The difference is that no-one on DU got mad about the use of the word 'tits' in a thread title when those were reported. The first OP to discuss Amina Tyler was this one, quoting a British left wing article (written by a woman), which was the spread of Amina's story. It wasn't posted with photos; but it was quickly leapt as an outrage, because the British writer used the standard British slang "get their tits out".

This controversy is because some DUers objected to the use of the word 'tits', and some (often, but not necessarily, the same) objected to the concept of Amina posting her picture on the web, and Femen supporting and distributing them. That is the difference.

[BainsBane]

160. so glad to see someone else stand up against Islamophobia

and the uninterrogated lack of education about the Muslim world in the US.

[BainsBane]

144. You may not be

but it's clear some here are.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

116. there is no parallel btwn your whine and what the OP is saying.

No "when did you stop beating your wife" parallel here at all.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

4. These are intelligent and strong women whose voices must be heard.

Their dignity shines through in all these pictures.

I salute them.

[HiPointDem]

10. yes.

[JI7]

6. the truth is people just a few days ago were going on about "stoned to death"

and acting like tunisia was saudi arabia or afghanistan.

[Douglas Carpenter]

7. so you are trying to imply that Tunisian women fighting for their rights is doing anywhere near as

much good for Muslim women in Tunisia as European women exposing their chest?

[HiPointDem]

23. hard to believe, i know...european boobs are so terribly powerful....

[RainDog]

8. once again Femen brings issues to attention

as your headline indicates you understand.

[HiPointDem]

12. femen brought this to your attention? no, *i* did. femen brought *nothing* to your attention

but boobs, as you'd understand if you listened to their 'dear leader' speaking on the issues.

[delrem]

31. true

[bettyellen]

34. truth!

[BlancheSplanchnik]

125. WORD! what you said! every word! n/t

[Bonobo]

15. +1 Raindog. nt

[Luminous Animal]

22. Femen did no such thing. Tunisia has a vital activist women's movement.

Femen ignored that to create their own victim movement.

[bettyellen]

30. oh sure- this was their secret plot to promote this activism that's been happening all along... by

posting shit on Facebook. That's the ticket!

[Starry Messenger]

9. k&r

[JI7]

11. i see Che Guevara

[HiPointDem]

13. yes. it was a leftist who was assassinated.

[green for victory]

14. kr-those that are terribly concerned with womens rights in Tunisia are also

terribly concerned about the children accidentally drone bombed to death.

I'm sure of it. Nice post- that took more than a few minutes to put together.

[Major Nikon]

16. What's so bad about boobies?

[LadyHawkAZ]

17. Because we spent the past week or so

listening to people howling over and over about how ineffective it is to protest topless for the media, and how no one would listen to their message because teh menz were just staring at teh boobiez?

Yep, that protest sure was a failure, wasn't it? I think a lot of people at DU now know a whole lot more about Tunisia than they ever wanted to know, or ever thought they would. What an ineffective method of delivery that was, indeed.

I find it doubly interesting that you would post this, since you kept telling us that Amina was in no danger at all in this totally secular, no-fundies-at-all country and had nothing whatsoever to protest about, since Tunisia is such a bastion of women's rights etc. It looks like those fully clothed protesters think otherwise. Are you now agreeing that she DID in fact have a few concerns to protest about?

[Luminous Animal]

20. Yeah. We are finding out that FEMEN picked a country that has a vibrant women's movement

and a "victim" that may not need freeing at all.

[HiPointDem]

21. oh, bull. the line on all those threads was: tunisia is a hellhole for women & amina is in danger

of being stoned. nobody said shit about anything going on in tunisia until *I* challenged their party line.

you'll notice in these photos that women are out protesting in march 2013, everything from braless young women in t-shirts to old women in hijab. they don't appear cowed by the threat of stoning.

femen is crap and a distraction.

[redqueen]

97. Yes, thank you HPD for taking the lead on spreading the truth about Tunisia.

You took a lot of abuse for it, but didn't let the nasty attacks stop you from speaking up.

Thank you.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

119. this is an excellent post and so is the OP...as well as your standing up in the earlier threads.

THANK YOU!

Amazing, the determination of those who don't want to hear what you're saying so clearly.

Just a lot of defensive self-absorbed whining.
They love to dish it out.......

[LadyHawkAZ]

146. People talked about stoning because she was threatened with it

If we will take seriously the threats against Adria Richards, made anonymously on the Internet, why would we reject a public, documented threat by a known person?

[bettyellen]

27. Seabeyond caused a whole lot of DU to feign an interest in Tunisia and use the word "patriarchy "

for the first time in their lives. Not because of Femen, but because they hate Seabeyond.

And HPDem educated them because faux supporters were to lazy to actually read up, and instead spewed the funniest wild guesses about what was going on in Tunisia. You can't make this shit up.

[KittyWampus]

140. fish are not aware they swim in water. IMO, when it comes to women's issues many good, liberal men

don't see the full picture and extent of the problem because they are swimming a culture. Their intentions are in the right place but their world view is still limited and conditioned

[bettyellen]

145. true! that so many were shocked that there would be dissenting opinions on protest methods

tells me that they have never done any activism themselves. (Beyond "liking" stuff on FB.)
Because when you are involved in planning, this kind of discussion is totally par for the course. The outrage was manufactured to target one or two DUers, but I think it was fueled also by ignorance of the fact that issues like this are routinely debated amongst activists. So, I think a lot of people couldn't see the larger picture, and went for the chum a few shit stirrers threw out about prudery and authoritarianism.

[opiate69]

150. Fish aren't probably aware of much of anything.

Bumper-sticker philosophy is vapid, no matter which "side" pushes it.

[BainsBane]

40. It's great that people here are starting to pay attention to Tunisia

and if FEMEN helped accomplished that, fantastic. What that does for Tunisia, however, I'm not so sure. Looks to me like these women are doing pretty well at speaking for themselves.

[polly7]

131. People here started paying attention to Tunisia about two and a half

Last edited Sun Apr 7, 2013, 05:57 PM - Edit history (1)

years ago. Remember? Hundreds of threads and articles.

Looks to me like you're making shit up again. Why the sock? http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=302058&sub=trans

Ugh .... I didn't even realize I was being 'educated' by both of you on the same thread. http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2605208

[msanthrope]

158. Socks and zombies--the OP should really ring a Bell. nt

[Number23]

179. Ahhhh... I knew there was a reason I took great delight in NEVER being on the same side of an issue

as the OP. That explains alot.

As for the Bain sockpuppet, there was a time that used to be grounds for a pizza delivery.

Edit: Hmm... just saw that the OP's sign up date was March of 2012. So I'm not sure if it is sock or not.

[msanthrope]

184. Oh no...it's a verified sighting. nt

[opiate69]

164. Her silence is deafening, no?

[opiate69]

185. ahh.. just saw your edit... unfuckingbelievable.

[JI7]

45. highpoint posted on that day the reality in Tunisia while others kept going on about first world

problems and stoning to death and other crap thinking tunisia was afghanistan or saudi arabia .

none of this is to say it's paradise for women in tunisia but the issue for them is actually more similar to women in america where it's not about them being forced to cover up as much as equality in things like work place the the exploitation of capitalism

[burrowowl]

19. Beautiful!

Go Women Go!

[Scootaloo]

24. Well, they're clearly for Sharia law because they hate boobies!

They hide it very well, but i have it on good authority that that is what's up!

[BainsBane]

35. they obviously aren't real feminists

because they have clothes on.

[bettyellen]

43. and "they talk too much" Femen does not approve of that!

[BainsBane]

52. That's another point of interest they have in common

With some of our friends here. Women who talk too much are so irritating.

[Whisp]

25. Thankyou, K&R

[Whisp]

26. I think I see a bit of cleavage there, I'm sure middle school boys will pay attention now!

[HiPointDem]

28. yes! i saw it too!!

[bettyellen]

29. Awesome show of solidarity!

It's great to see a huge crowd of all ages and so many men as well.
And what does it say about us that these images didn't make the MSM?

[HiPointDem]

36. Yes. There are plenty of men, for example, out there with women in front of that courthouse

in support of a woman who got charged with 'indecency' after she said she was raped by police.

contra the image projected by femen.

[Douglas Carpenter]

32. hey that's not what Muslim women living in an Islamist North African state are suppose to look like!

Didn't some one tell them that if they don't put on their burkas and their veils and complain about getting acid thrown in their face if they try to go to school - they are going disappoint a lot of westerners who want to liberate them? Who do they think they are fighting for their own rights when bare breasted European women are already taking care of that for them?!!

[SunSeeker]

33. Inspiring pictures. nt

[BainsBane]

37. But they can't speak for themselves

They need 19 yr old blonds in Europe to speak for them.
Who let them out in public anyway? Everyone knows ALL Muslim women have to wear burqas, can't drive, and aren't allowed outside the house.

[Luminous Animal]

39. Kick.

[smirkymonkey]

41. Great photos! Thank you!

It really makes me feel a solidarity with the women of Tunisia. I am so inspired by them. They are very brave.

[BlueMTexpat]

44. Thanks again, HiPointDem!

These are the women who are living and working in that society and who are trying to make it work for them and their families!

As it should.

And we should ALL support them. The RW causes they are fighting are exactly those that confront us in the US - and everywhere else - albeit under different religious labels.

[UtahLib]

46. Thank you for the visual of reality based feminist activism.

I hope your OP and this information will attract as much interest and support as the ones that were posted for what seems to be the sheer intent of causing controversy.

[Joe Shlabotnik]

47. I heard about these women, and the Femen protest.

And I applaud BOTH of them. I've followed both the Tunisian struggle, and the Femen for years before that, and frankly have nothing ill to say about the Femen, they have a history of brilliance and courage.

[HiPointDem]

51. all 20 of them.

[bettyellen]

132. can you please link to this "brilliance" Femen displays?

Maybe it's poor translations, but I haven't seen anything that goes beyond a few slogans. Brand building photo ops is about the extent of their work from what I have seen. I'd love to see them produce some results or truly provocative discussion about solutions. Anything?

[Demo_Chris]

49. The reason you chose this deliberately provocative thread title...

...is the reason those women exposed their breasts -- except they put a whole lot more on the line. Perhaps you should keep that in mind. None the less, good thread, excellent pictures. Well done and REC.

[HiPointDem]

50. No, that's not the reason I chose the title. The reason I chose the title was the portrayal by

various posters of Tunisia as a fundamentalist hellhole for women, and of FEMEN as some kind of voice in the wilderness for Tunisian women.

[Demo_Chris]

54. And yet you said NONE of that in the title. nt

[HiPointDem]

56. lol. i gave my audience some credit for being able to do inference. i guess i gave some too much

credit.

[The Straight Story]

53. So they are islamaphobes too and there is little to no islam there right?

Or something like that.

I am sure any minute now there will be folks swooping in to tell us how these women are wrong, imperialistic, etc and so and on.

Oh wait, they obeyed and kept their shirts on, so we won't try to pick them apart and spend time running around looking for reasons to complain about them.

At least folks aren't complaining they are pretty white women (which, btw, I didn't think we were allowed to call women pretty anymore - we can only use words to describe others that apply to both sexes, or else we are sexist women hating pigs or something - but I digress) - and we are also not calling them euro-centric and whining about their protests being wrong.

Also noticed not all those women were covered up enough - which might offend other muslim women. We need to call em out on that too. I see a few had signs in english as well.

And one big thing missing in the story you posted (but may be in the details - I will spend all of sunday researching all of this to find out why they are screwing up) is the absence of.....the name of a group.

You give a group a name and easier to get press. And you mentioned that "Why haven't you heard" - well, apparently they we in the news (you found them) but not much was posted about them. I hear there are some folk here who are feminists and I am guessing they probably covered all this well in their group.

Not to mention there are protests all over the world all of the time. And if you want yours to stand out you need to do something different.

Just make sure if you're a woman and you protest not to take off your shirt - other women might want you to keep it on and get back in the kitchen.

[HiPointDem]

55. straw men, you guys love em. do you see anyone being stoned? if amina is going to be stoned,

these women are too.

they'll need a lot of stones.

[The Straight Story]

57. Talk about straw men - did I mention stoning in my post?

Nice avoidance - call a post something like a straw man and then run off.

One thing it has helped me to do though, this whole argument of which feminists suck and should be shamed and which shouldn't, is open the door for us evil men to search the news everyday for women protesting about something so we can complain about how they are doing it wrong and need someone else to enlighten them.

Before if a man said anything negative about a feminist group protesting it was because we hated women and wanted to oppress them. Now we just have to criticize how they are dressed and others will jump in with thread after thread about how those women are bad.

[HiPointDem]

59. no. but all my posts on this topic are in response to the many many posters who painted tunisia

as saudi arabia and claimed amina was likely to be stoned, claimed women in tunisia were cowering under the patriarchy that ran their lives, blah blah.

i don't think FEMEN are feminists, i think they're political psyops. i wonder why they set up their 'international headquarters' in a majority-muslim neighborhood in paris, i wonder where they get the money to jet all over europe -- and now to africa, i wonder why the same faces can be seen in all their protests, i wonder why the press gives them so much coverage when they can only pull 40-odd 'protesters' all across europe (half of them the same faces seen in their last dozen protests) while giving so much less to non-naked women engaged in political struggle.

I wonder why the US is in bed with tunisia's salafists helping to train and arm the 'rebels' in syria at the same time tunisia's salafists are recruiting men to go to syria to fight alongside the rebels.

I wonder why the fundies in tunisia are financed by US allies in the gulf.

I wonder why the islamist government in tunisia is doing neoliberal austerity on behalf of the imf and similar international institutions.

questions, questions.

[redqueen]

103. Excellent, excellent insights and questions. nt

[The Straight Story]

177. Good questions

I spent some time looking over my own posts on the area over the years. Seems like I posted a few without mentioning boobs.

"as saudi arabia and claimed amina was likely to be stoned, claimed women in tunisia were cowering under the patriarchy that ran their lives, blah blah. "

So now patriarchy is blah blah? You do know she was beaten and threatened right?

"I wonder why the US is in bed with tunisia's salafists helping to train and arm the 'rebels' in syria at the same time tunisia's salafists are recruiting men to go to syria to fight alongside the rebels. "

Do you wonder why now or did you before?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1786137

"I wonder why the fundies in tunisia are financed by US allies in the gulf. "

Wait, there are fundies there? Maybe you should tell femen that. Oh wait. They already know.

I wonder why the islamist government in tunisia is doing neoliberal austerity on behalf of the imf and similar international institutions.

Have you wondered that in other posts about them? Or are you wondering it now because there is awareness from some women taking off their shirts?

Searching on your name here and Tunisia...a lot of recent posts. So maybe their tactics worked and you are now paying more attention?

[JI7]

58. your posts are lame and it's all about you isn't it ?

i feel embarrassed just reading what you wrote.

[chervilant]

111. + about a gazillion.

Sadly, the relentlessly derisive and defensive posts tend to be generated by the same few folks who WANT to be perceived as feminists.

[MattBaggins]

155. And in your never ending crusade to be the cantankerous old stodge,

you once again miss the point by a mile.

[The Straight Story]

159. Now that sounds rather ageist to me

old stodge, cantankerous -

One definition:
1. A grouchy old man.

Now it says old, and man - ageist and sexist (why use a word like that?)

cantankerous - difficult or irritating to deal with

So basically I am a grouchy old man who is difficult to deal with. Could have used that instead (though a jury might not like it - but then I don't serve of juries anymore or alert except on spam)

And I don't miss points. I keep close track of them and have learned many things. But I do chose to ignore some in certain cases when there are other, broader, points to be understood.

And see, once again - the problem is showing itself. Letting others here know they are too dumb (or old and grouchy) to get the point.... i.e. we don't understand certain things so need educated on them.

Maybe in all this fuss there are some points others might like some folks to get as well. And it certainly is not just me trying to make them.

A lot is get the ideas, points, have the same values and goals - but don't really like being treated like idiots and constantly told we are haters/sexists/etc and so on because we might have differing takes on issues.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

60. We're seeing them only because of the naked protests - your premise is 180 degrees wrong.

Your suggestion that the naked protests are bad because they're distracting attention from these other protests is utterly, totally, diametrically opposed to the truth.

You're posting these pictures, and hence drawing attention to them, precisely because the naked protests led us to pay attention to Tunisia, rather than to anywhere else, demonstrating that they were a good thing and should be applauded.

[HiPointDem]

61. no. we're only seeing them because i posted them. unlike any of you femen supporters.

many of whom labored under the delusion that tunisia had sharia law.

have you heard any of the brave FEMEN talking about women protesting in tunisia?

no, here's what the fearless leader is talking about:

https://twitter.com/femeninna

she's a ninny. further ninniness at about 3.0 in the video.

#t=0s


the ninny claims there was no feminism in ukraine until she came along.

a quick check on the internet says that's absolute crap.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

62. Can you honestly claim you'd have posted them if not for FEMEN?

And even if you can (which I frankly doubt), how many replies do you think you would have got?

[HiPointDem]

64. there have been postings all along about what's going on in tunisia. they never got any response,

because they didn't have boobs and didn't follow the script. i haven't posted about tunisia, but i've posted about africa. it gets zip. no boobs, just politics.

i didn't post this because of femen. i posted it because of the idiotic comments about tunisia by DU posters.

[randome]

67. So you agree the 'boob' protests were effective then.

[HiPointDem]

70. lol. yeah, it was all about getting *me* to post pictures at DU of tunisian women protesting,

good job, femen!

kind of roundabout, but good work!

[JI7]

71. no, DU is not the world, the women in the OP have been protesting for years

to keep and gain their rights. just because YOU don't see or know something doesn't mean it's not happening.

[randome]

76. So what's your point then?

I'm here now and I'm asking questions about Tunisia. Care to take a stab at answering some of them or do you not want to talk about the issues unless I approach you from the 'correct' direction?

[JI7]

79. the OP is in response to the idiots who were crying about stoning to death, women forced to cover up

or they will be executed and other shit from people who knew nothing about tunisia and thought it was like Saudi arabia. idiots like Bush who think all arab/muslim places are teh same.

as i said that's what got supoprt for the war in iraq. never mind that saddam had nothing to do wth islamic fundamentalism all they saw was a place where people are arab and mostly muslim so they must all be the same.

[randome]

82. So the OP is not about discussing solutions in Tunisia?

It's just another self-referential DU post?

If Sharia Law is imposed in Tunisia, yeah, stonings would occur. We've heard of it happening. What can we do to support the Tunisians?

[HiPointDem]

93. "What can we do to support the Tunisians?" = funny you didn't ask that question on the boobie

threads you posted all over.

[randome]

95. Yeah, mostly because of posters who wanted to start threads about boobie threads.

Or who wanted to complain about a few dozen women exposing their breasts.

Instead of arguing tactics, we should have been discussing problems and solutions.

[MattBaggins]

157. Mitt Romney saved Detroit by being against saving Detroit

thereby forcing Obama's hand

[randome]

65. You know, we CAN read. Sharia law is trying to be imposed there.

That's what the majority of posters have been pointing out.

[HiPointDem]

68. oh bullshit.

[JI7]

69. no, people were saying she was going to be stoned to death , talking about women

being forced to cover up and women being executed . people really thought/think Tunisia is Saudi Arabia .

the right wing is trying to ban women's rights in america also.

[randome]

73. And if Tunisia DOES tip over into Sharia law, that's what would happen.

Why all this vitriol about breasts? Does it matter what got the attention? Breasts or this post by itself?

How about we discuss the issues instead?

Such as: what is the opinion from knowledgeable DUers? WILL Tunisia tip over the edge?

If it does, what should be the U.S.'s response?

[JI7]

77. the Arab Spring Revolution was what brought in the Islamic Conservatives to Power

and women have been fighting them to prevent them from taking away their rights. they will protest as they have been doing already. you act like they are just sitting around not doing anything.

[randome]

78. I am NOT acting that way. I am asking questions. Care to answer some of them?

Such as: should the U.S. (or the U.N.) take a stance on Sharia Law imposition?

[JI7]

81. the US has ties to Saudi Arabia HAHHAHAH

the women and men in tunisia will fight for their rights as they have been doing already.

[randome]

83. Is there any way we can support that? Other than on DU?

Amina's Facebook page might be a good place to start? If she gets, oh, I don't know, thirteen gazillion 'likes', maybe that would help?

Does the protest movement itself have a Facebook page?

[JI7]

167. i'm not on facebook, not sure how/why it would matter how many likes

there are .

the best as someone in the united states is to be informed about what our govt does in relation to other nations and try to influence it that way.

[HiPointDem]

85. maybe it should start with its allies, the ones who are funding the fundies in tunisia.

and start with itself, the ones making common cause with the salafists in tunisia -- both of whom are assisting the 'rebels' in syria: the US by helping arm and train them, the tunisian salafists by recruiting tunisians to go fight in syria.

why is it that every us-backed 'democracy' fight in the middle east goes fundie?

why isn't the US backing the pro-democracy protests in bahrain?

questions, questions.

[randome]

86. Here is a link about the funding.

http://www.tunisia-live.net/2011/08/25/political-parties-in-tunisia-and-their-alleged-relations-with-foreign-countries/

A lot of rumors, apparently. Nothing concrete.

Maybe we should start a white house petition page about Bahrain?

[HiPointDem]

89. the new islamist government is imposing austerity at the behest of the IMF. They are doing the

same bullshit on tunisian social programs, right down to pushing an increase in the age for social security benefits and talking about the problems with the social security trust fund.

'just rumors' my white ass.

[randome]

91. You know, we could cancel couple of military programs and help them out with that austerity thing.

I hate to ever agree with a Conservative but Sharia Law is something to be feared. Maybe we can get Conservatives worked up about that to help?

[bettyellen]

126. wow, she couldn't go beyond the few slogans and answer any questions....

no wonder they lash out about women who "talk too much", it's a preemptive strike.

[R B Garr]

143. So Inna Schevchenko of FEMEN explains that one of their goals

is to change the cliched image of feminists from being ugly, brainy women who talk too much to young sexy topless women who have the power to expose themselves for their own empowerment and not for men's enjoyment. In the meantime, they are swarmed by smirking men enjoying their show. I guess I'm still confused. So far, all I've really learned from FEMEN is that the ones with the trenchcoats and go-go boots look the hottest so far.

[randome]

63. And would you have posted any of this if not for the so-called 'boobie' protest?

[HiPointDem]

66. there have been other posts about tunisia. i haven't seen you and your fellow-travelers there.

i didn't post this because of the boobie protest. i posted it because of the portrait of tunisian painted by the boobie-philic.

[randome]

74. So FEMEN got my attention.

Do you want me to feel embarrassed about that? Screw that.

Now I'm posting about Tunisia.

Should the U.S. help out with potential refugees if Sharia Law gains a foothold there?

[HappyMe]

72. Well, now I have.

If it weren't for the 'boobs out' protesters, you wouldn't have posted this.

Shirts off or on doesn't matter. They are all fighting for their rights, that should be the only thing that matters.

[HiPointDem]

75. then why didn't i see you in anything but boobie threads?

[HappyMe]

87. How do you know that I didn't read other

threads and make no comment?

[HiPointDem]

88. whatever.

[Shankapotomus]

80. Why can't both Femen

and this movement both be right?

Additionally, Femen never discredited the protests of Muslim women.

It was some Muslim women that challenged the credibility of the Femen movement.

It seems Femen goes too far in their eyes. That it is not necessary to challenge basic mores of decincy to protest. However, my interpretation of Femen tactics is the further you go over the line, the more ground you stand to gain. Once you've gained that ground and put patriarchy in its place, you can then roll back your extremism and put your shirt back on.

[HiPointDem]

84. "Femen never discredited the protests of Muslim women." femen never *acknowledged* the

protests of muslim women unless they were femen protests with boobs.

femen has, however, dissed muslim women and dissed feminists generally. the leader refers to women as 'girls' on a regular basis.

she claims there was no feminism in ukraine until femen came into the picture.

#t=1502s

if this idiot is a feminist, i'm jesus christ.

[Shankapotomus]

90. As a feminist,

you are really all out against Femen? That certainly gives me pause to reexamine my position. I will suspend my support for the time being.

However, you must admit, a Muslim women's movement is fraught with its own ambiguity. I mean, protesting for women's rights within the confines of an inherently sexist religious code seems just as hypocritical as they alleged Femen to be.

And there's one more thing:

To me, it seems a logical tactic, when faced with the possibility of forced modesty, to go to the other extreme in order to head such draconian edicts off at the pass. In other words, I'm just speculating here but, my sense is Femen's thinking is "Oh, you're going to go to the extreme of dictating to us what we wear? Okay then, we're going to go the opposite extreme as a response and maybe you'll rethink your position to saner middle ground?" In still other words, a bargain. "You want that. We want this. Let's meet in the saner middle."

[HiPointDem]

92. that logic might have some power if femen had a mass movement behind it. it doesn't. so far

as i can tell, it has almost no popular support behind it, which is the reason it couldn't field more than 40 protesters all across europe for its 'topless jihad day' (half of which were the usual suspects, the leader and her politburo seen in every other femen 'protest').

[Shankapotomus]

98. 40 or 4000

An appropriate tactic or misguided. I do still think Femen is no intentional gimmick. I believe these women are in genuine fear of their rights eroding.

[HiPointDem]

100. here's another opinion:

The real problem is that nobody knows from where they get their funding. The average salary in Ukraine is $319/month, but these women, who are otherwise out of work, have enough money to live in the expensive city of Kyiv and to travel all over the world. It is also quite difficult and expensive to obtain a visa from Ukraine to other countries (especially for young women, and for the unemployed), but the women of FEMEN have visas dripping out of their passports. They are being backed by a person or an organization with money and influence, and they aren’t saying who that is.

In the end, I don’t know whether I think that this is a kick-ass group of strong women who have reclaimed their bodies for political purposes, or a pawn of the patriarchy. Having written this out, I am leaning towards the latter. I don’t know any smarter, more thoughtful people than our commenters, so I have a plea: How does this group read to you? Is there something that I am missing? Will somebody please tell me how to feel?


http://persephonemagazine.com/2012/02/09/femen-ism/

[Shankapotomus]

105. Interesting article

Femen does incorporate women that have less than model looks, though.

But you've convinced me it's probably at least best to suspend judgment on Femen until more information comes to light.

Even before Femen, feminism and center relationships were a topic of interest for me at DU. But the boobies are just getting in the way of the discussion now.

[HiPointDem]

112. here's another data point:

an interview with amina conducted by a male tunisian blogger named Sofiene Chourabi, who was a big voice during the rev against ben ali.

and here's chourabi being hosted by freedom house post-revolution --

http://www.freedomhouse.org/article/freedom-house-hosts-tunisian-journalist


freedom house, while it was founded by left-leaning new dealers, has been taken over by the right and is funded mostly by the US government.


here's its board:

http://www.webcitation.org/6BPzYVkUf

then start reading up on freedom house and its people.

diana negroponte for example:

Diana Mary Villiers Negroponte...an English-born American trade lawyer...the wife of John Negroponte, the former United States Deputy Secretary of State and former U.S. Director of National Intelligence.

A descendant of Charles II's mistress Barbara Villiers, Duchess of Cleveland, and George Villiers, 4th Earl of Clarendon, who served as Queen Victoria's three-time Foreign Secretary, she was born in London. Her father was Sir Charles Villiers, a merchant banker who was the chairman of British Steel from 1974 until 1988; her mother was Sir Charles's second wife, the former Countess Marie Josée de la Barre d’Erquelinnes....her uncle, British Ambassador Sir Peter Wilkinson...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diana_Villiers_Negroponte

[HappyMe]

102. So what if there isn't a massive

amount of women doing this. That doesn't make their point any less valid. Just because 40,000 didn't show up doesn't indicate lack of support. You can support a cause without showing up. The fact that thousands didn't show up also tells me that maybe there is some fear there.

[HiPointDem]

104. like the fear that such tactics are counterproductive.

[HappyMe]

106. Criticizing tactics when sitting here in the US,

in the safety of our own homes, banging away on a keyboard is pretty damn easy.

I'm sure that they don't care that you don't like their tactics. I happen to think it's brilliant.

I don't see anything wrong with 'we have boobs, get over it' and 'don't tell me what to wear'.

[HiPointDem]

107. i'm not talking about people here in the us. i'm talking about why women haven't joined in

protesting femen-style en masse in places where femen is protesting. like europe.

maybe because they don't think it's particularly effective.

[HappyMe]

108. I think it's very effective, but I see

we will have to agree to disagree here. I said that it is easy to criticize their method here in the US.

Shirts on or off, at least they are doing something.

[bettyellen]

128. Criticizing tactics (and women's choices) while sitting safely in an office in Paris......

is exactly what Femen is doing. They sneer at the type of protests pictured here because they are full of old people who talk too much. Way to build a coalition, "girls"!

[HappyMe]

129. Well, looks like the criticizing machine

is well under way. Good luck to all the girls, clothed and unclothed.

[bettyellen]

130. as it was from the very first post on Amina's protest- every article led with "are the boobs

a distraction". Is Femen ever effective? And then people here piled on when feminists proceeded to discuss exactly that.
Apparently discussing the contents of articles posted here is an outrage. LOL.

[HappyMe]

133. Apparently protesters that

don't comply with what the posters here think is the outrage. Further, people that don't agree with the with the feminists here are also the outrage.

If they protested in burkas 'patriarchy' would be hollered. They take off their shirts and it's still 'patriarchy'. Cover up those shameful boobs! How dare you!

It still got their cause noticed, like it or not. I'm sure they don't care if a few women on the internet in the US don't agree with them.

I'll support whatever I want. Hell, if there was a protest nearby, I may just bare 'em.

[bettyellen]

134. Why does it bother you these conversations happen at DU-they are happening all over the blogosphere?

if you think it's just feminist posters at DU who are discussing this type of protest you are sadly mistaken. These conversations have been going on for years- and there is never wide agreement on how effective they are. I think a lot of people are mistaken that anyone is saying they need to comply with anything.

[HappyMe]

136. It doesn't bother me. I usually stay out of it,

because it turns into a 200+ post circular argument. Just like gun threads.

I don't tend to frequent the 'blogosphere' because any yahoo can have a blog. Getting to the good, reasonable stuff is a pain the ass.

[bettyellen]

138. to me, it's really weird that the first two articles posted were all about the method of protest

... it's validity, etc. And less abut Amina herself and her or Femens messages. Which kind of says something in itself.

But when feminists here proceed to debate (contentiously in fact) the article cited, they are totally berated for not being "onboard".

WTF is THAT about? Every political group I've ever been involved in has had parallel discussions - do you go for stunts and easy press or will that serve you poorly? It's not exactly as if these are new concepts to many of us. We should feel free to discuss it without being insulted by fellow DUers. Makes me think they have never been part of a political action in their lives if they think this is about prudery or authoritarianism or attacking Amina herself.

[HappyMe]

142. What you think is a 'stunt' I happen to think

was incredibly effective. Because I hold that viewpoint, I am told I'm wrong.

We aren't going to agree here. At all.

[bettyellen]

147. And that is okay by me. It's nice to disagree and not resort to vilifying others here, no?

Point being, that is exactly the opposite of what happened here.

[Mnemosyne]

94. Wonderful photos, but a data warning would be nice. nt

[theKed]

109. Where were you...

...when they protested, thousands strong, last year?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014193100

...when they protested in February?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022439884

...when Hillary Clinton spoke up about women in Tunisia?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002432662


But, naturally, this thread isn't some type of retaliatory post.

[HiPointDem]

114. and where we you and all the feminists who love boobs so much?

hilary, pfft. hilary has ulterior motives.

[randome]

118. 'Feminists who love boobs'? That's the point you want to debate?

Good God, if anyone can't stop talking about boobs, it's you and yours. The effort has been made to point this thread in a more constructive direction but you STILL want to talk about boobs!

[theKed]

123. I haven't been posting threads on the topic.

[sufrommich]

110. You mean it's not 40 topless women

in Europe doing all the legwork? I'm shocked.

[madmom]

120. Have we gotten so righteous that we dare tell someone else how to protest?

[treestar]

121. Terrific!

Good job. Probably more about what most real people are doing.

[opiate69]

127. But!! But!!!!....

Last edited Sun Apr 7, 2013, 01:52 PM - Edit history (1)

Redqueen and Christiane Amanpour, and Rached Ghannouchi say Tunisia has "so far steered clear of such instability"!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2625387

http://amanpour.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/29/how-tunisia-dealt-with-the-islamic-question/

While Islam has always been the main religion in Tunisia, politics have long been secular.

Ghannouchi said the status quo for dealing with Islam and the constitution is the path for Tunisia and hopes to have an election over the constitution by June of 2013.

Egypt is struggling through its own constitutional process, with mass street protests and clashes, but Tunisia so far has steered clear of similar instability.

[ohiosmith]

162. This post was alerted on. The jury voted 6/0 to let it stand.

At Sun Apr 7, 2013, 04:07 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

But!! But!!!!....
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2630232

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

This is an over the top call-out. Meta was removed from DU for a reason.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sun Apr 7, 2013, 04:25 PM, and the Jury voted 0-6 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: It's not a "call out" over the top or otherwise. It's a factual account of previously made comments. Leave it.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Not sure how this is a call out. Posters two links both quote the same piece by Christiane Amanpour.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: sorry, I just don't see a call-out here...
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[opiate69]

163. LMAO! My, my.. seems I may have a serial alerter on my tail! Thanks for the heads up, smith!

[ohiosmith]

165. My pleasure o69!

[ismnotwasm]

135. K&R

[LittleBlue]

137. Let me get this straight

Just to show how FEMEN takes attention from other protest groups, you post a response to their protest. A response that you wouldn't have posted had FEMEN not existed, thereby granting these other groups an audience they wouldn't have had without FEMEN.

Brilliant.

I wonder if it will dawn on the OP what he's just done.

[bettyellen]

139. So we give credit to Femen because they routinely ridicule these types of protesters?

You think they are a false flag operations and this is all a psyche out? Whoa.

[LittleBlue]

141. Just saying, this thread wouldn't

have had more than 10 replies without FEMEN.

Wish we had a "Classic threads" forum, this surely qualifies.

[JI7]

168. that's pretty pathetic , for the goal of Femen to be replies to some thread on DU

but i think that is what is considered important to some here .

[opiate69]

169. Are you aware of what "raising awareness" means?

I'm told all the time how DU is "one of the biggest Progressive sites" on the web. Kinda seems like any group trying to get a message out to progressives might want to get us talking about it here, as well as other places..

[JI7]

170. people should be informed, people screaming about Iraq and Tunisia as if they are AFghanistan

and SAudi Arabia does nothing to help anyone.

[opiate69]

171. Except, as has been pointed out to you naysayers time and again,

the reason all these women in the OP, and yes, Amina herself along with FEMEN, are protesting is because the country of Tunisia is in real and serious danger of becoming like Afghanistan and Saudi Arabia. At least, as far as Sharia law is concerned.

[JI7]

172. no, they are not in danger of being like Afghanistan or SAudi Arabia , it's like saying

the united States will be like Afghanistan or SAudi Arabia because republicans try to pass the shit they do.

the cultures are different. egypt and syria are other places where people will resist it being turned into saudi arabia and afghanistan.

there are issues of specific rights , risk of losing them, working to gain others etc. but that's the same as in other places.

screaming like wingnuts about shariah law coming to the united states , turning into communism because of health care may get a lot of media attention but does nothing to help anyone.

[opiate69]

173. No, it's not like saying that about the U.S. ffs. Do you have any knowledge of the history of the ME

Ask Afghan women how their lives were pre-Taliban? Or, Iranian women about pre-revolutionary life? These Tunisian women (and men) know full well the dangers they are facing, and that's exactly why they are out there protesting.

Directly from the OP:

March 2013: Thousands of people took to the streets of the Tunisian capital demanding to end the rule of the Islamist government, which they accuse of assassinating prominent secular politician, Chokri Belaid

March 2013: Tunisian students perform the Harlem Shake outside their school last month in defiance of a government ban.

March 2013: Shoe-Waving Tunisian Protesters Call on (Ennahda-tied) Minister (of women's affairs) to Quit (acted as apologist for child's rape)

March 2013: Tunisians protest the replacement of the national flag by Salafist

Tunisians come together to protest against the Islamic Salafist group, who climbed the university to put up their groups flag, and denounce the red Tunisian national flag.

February 2013: Tunisians demand resignation of new PM Larayadh

Hundreds of people demonstrate in Tunis to demand the resignation of the new Prime Minister Ali Larayadh and the arrest of the killers of (leftist) opposition leader Chokri Belaid. They protested against Ennahdha and demanded the fall of his regime.

Oct 2012: Hundreds of protesters thronged to a Tunis courtroom Tuesday as a woman and her fiance who accused police officers of rape and extortion defended themselves against allegations of indecency.

August 2012: Tunisian women protest against the islamist-led government they fear will reduce women's rights:

January 2012: Tunisians protest fundamentalist and salafist attacks on journalists

Nov. 2011: Tunisians protest against extremism and censorship

February 2011 (1 mo after the 'revolution'): Tunisians protest Islamism, demand tolerance

[JI7]

174. again, the Middle East/Arab/Muslim World is not one Country or the same

afghanistan and iran have their own history which involves Soviet Union, United States interfering and people coming out against those allowing the fundamentalists to take power.

the Tunisian Revolution also resulted in a conservative Islamists coming to power. but the people are resisting it as shown by the protests . all of this shows it is not going to turn into saudi arabia or afghanistan.


just like the united states is not going to end up with shariah law or turn communist if we provide health care and education as some communist states might have done.

[opiate69]

175. OMFG...

the Tunisian Revolution also resulted in a conservative Islamists coming to power. but the people are resisting it as shown by the protests . all of this shows it is not going to turn into saudi arabia or afghanistan.

My point exactly... because they are fucking protesting against it!

[JI7]

176. no, your point shows that even conservatives coming to power doesn't turn it into

Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan.

women in the united states are still having to fight to keep abortion rights ,and fight for many other rights.

[idwiyo]

182. I am joining you after seeing response to your post. OMFG!

[opiate69]

183. At this point, I think they`re just arguing for arguments sake.

[Coyotl]

148. Whatever works for you!

But, I prefer to speak for my own attentions.

[Deep13]

151. Al hamdu-allah for Al Jezeerra.

You won't see this in American media.

Also, I was never distracted by "boobies." If anything, I was distracted by the indignation over that form of protest, as if the patriarchs and the feminists were somehow on the same side. But you are right in suggesting that this is more important.

[RetroLounge]

152. More boob outrage from hof'ers.

I'm glad I log in every few weeks to see what the latest prudery outrage is about.



RL

[The Straight Story]

153. Remeber the dongle thing? Well this lady was beaten, threats of death and acid being thrown on her

And yet she is somehow the bad one in it all:

The young woman, who goes by the name of Amina Tyler, provoked the ire of Islamist groups when she posted the pictures of herself online with the words "My body belongs to me" and "Fuck your morals" emblazoned across her naked breasts, in feisty homage to the Ukrainian women's power group Femen.

Shortly after, she disappeared from public view, raising fears that she had suffered reprisals at the hands of extremists and giving rise to a number of rallies around the globe supporting her.

In the interview with Canal Plus television's special reports show "Effet Papillon" broadcast Saturday, a tired-looking Tyler said she was afraid for her safety in Tunisia.

The young woman said she had received several death threats by telephone and via her Facebook account -- phrases like "You will die" and "We will throw acid at your face, things like that", she said.

"I need to leave Tunisia, I'm afraid for my life and the lives of my family. There are a lot of rumours about what the Salafists want to do to me," she said.

After the photos appeared, Tyler's family drove her home, she explained, where her cousin "destroyed her telephone SIM card" and "beat her".

http://www.middle-east-online.com/english/?id=57962

The dongle lady was a hero for posting about a joke she overheard and seen as a victim.

This lady showed her breasts and protested oppression of women and somehow she and others are islamaphobic and not open minded enough.

Cover your breasts ladies and report jokes you overhear. When people made comments about the one lady and her form of 'protest' we were sexist and didn't understand.

It gets confusing after awhile.

[valerief]

154. The US press blacks out massive US protests. Why would they cover international

ones, especially when it makes the ruling class look bad?

[CrispyQ]

156. One photo says Game Over & another Game Not Over.

Great shots! Thanks for posting!

[one_voice]

161. Kudos to these courageous...

women. I support them all. Including the ones that take their tops off. We must have our voices heard, tops on or off, I stand with them.

Women took off the bras they burned their bras. We've come a long way, we still have a ways to go.

These women in other countries have so very far to go, they need us to stand with them. I will plant my feet with a sister on the right with no top, and a sister on the left with her top.

The message must be heard.

K&R

[riderinthestorm]

166. There have been a regular group of people posting about Tunisia and the ME

for the past couple of years. Leveymg, Arctic Dave, Dave_777, muriel vogelstranger, Comrade Grumpy, dipsydoodle, Hissyspit, Twilight Gardener and just a couple of others besides myself. Its always notable because there are only a few posts and then the thread drops, especially the women's rights threads (or the dwindling lack there-of in post revolutionary Arab states).

Do you see many of those posters on these threads? Of course you don't. You know why not? Because we already KNOW all of this - its not news to us and blockbuster threads that are really about flogging agendas aren't interesting.

What IS interesting is how few to NONE of the rest of you have ever bothered to weigh in on those threads. I don't recognize ANY of the posters on this thread and most of the others as ever having chimed in (except those I've mentioned as "regulars&quot .

I sure hope a policy-full post of thoughtful analysis on ME and North African political current affairs receives even a tenth of the views that these posts are getting. What a change of pace that would be.

For now however, I'll take these blockbuster threads as evidence that FEMEN and Amina have done their job - they've got you to at least LOOK at the situation.

[idwiyo]

178. +1 not that they would ever admit it.

[Number23]

180. Moronic. That you could take something that is important and try to use it to beat people over the

head shows a definite lack of conscience, and possibly intellect as well. "Distracted by boobies." God help us, this OP and the folks cheering it are embarrassing.

Serious props to the women of Tunisia, Amina included.

[Little Star]

181. k&r

[smirkymonkey]

186. K&R, Thank You! Great thread, inpiring photos!

Thanks so much for this!
These photos are so inspiring! I love them!