General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsObama proposes Chained CPI, Obama proposes an income tax increase on the back of working families
Most understand that the Chained CPI will hurt seniors, especially woman who earned less during their working days and live a little longer than their spouses while facing their last years living alone.
But what may not be well known is that Chained CPI would be used not just for calculating Social Security and Veterans Benefits..... If the Government adopts Chained CPI for adjusting Income Tax Brackets, & wages grow more than the Chained CPI, your income rises faster than the Income tax brackets would. Over time many families would be bumped into the next income tax bracket. Currently the Income Tax Brackets are adjusted to CPI-U.
According to Congress Joint Committee on Taxation, if individual income taxes were indexed to the Chained CPI starting in January 2013, by 2021, 69 percent of the gains in revenue would come from taxpayers with incomes below $100,000, while those in the highest income brackets would barely be affected. For example, workers with incomes between $10,000 and $20,000 would experience an increased tax burden of 14.5 percent, while those with incomes over $1,000,000 would just see an increase of 0.1 percent.
Seniors dont have the same buying patterns as working wage earners and clerical workers, which is what CPI-W is tracking. CPI-W can't possibly represent Seniors buying habits.
Seniors spend more on housing and medical care than people still in the workforce who maybe decades younger and in the prime of their health. Substituting Medical care may be impossible in some situations, and I can't imagine how one can substitute a Nursing Home. 2 out of 5 seniors rely on Social Security as 90% of their retirement income, while in 2012 the average Social Security benefit for those 65 and older was less than $15,000.
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In addition, there are fewer opportunities for substitution in these areas of consumption. Also, because the elderly are a less mobile population, they may find it more difficult to change their consumption patterns. If accuracy is the main concern to be addressed by altering the Social Security cost of living adjustment, then the BLS could construct a full elderly index that more accurately tracks the consumption patterns of the elderly. There is no basis for assuming that a Chained CPI more accurately measures the rate of inflation experienced by the elderly than the current measure,however there is no doubt that it will lead to a reduction in benefits.
Center For Economic And Policy Research
BTW, The Center For Economic And Policy Research was founded by Economist Dean Baker.
CNBC reported about a year ago:
If enacted for 2014, the change would reduce government borrowing by $223 billion over the next decade -- $158 billion in spending cuts and $65 billion in tax increases, according to the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office.
CBO says its a 65 billion dollar tax increase over 10 years, as the Tax Policy Center notes, mostly on people with incomes between $30,000 and $40,000.
The Tax Policy Center looked at Chained CPI and its impact on income taxes:
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from Daily Kos
gateley
(62,683 posts)We KNOW the effects it would have.
We KNOW it would hurt people.
We KNOW it will most likely be in his budget.
We've already contacted our representatives and the WH.
What good does posting the same info do at this time? The threads just devolve into pro/anti Obama spats and we accomplish nothing.
There is no new eye-opening information about this.
What's the purpose?
hay rick
(7,636 posts)How many gun threads have we had? How many rape threads? This is vitally important to many people and if Obama's reputation is besmirched in the discussions, that's pretty trivial collateral damage
gateley
(62,683 posts)Until Obama comes and reads the threads on DU?
Until those who haven't contacted their representatives do?
I just don't see what we can accomplish by beating the same drum -- on either side.
So as long as it takes -- to what end?
pscot
(21,024 posts)but not everyone has said it.
gateley
(62,683 posts)tokenlib
(4,186 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)But it's not about us at DU anymore.
Those Twitter/Facebook/Google+ features mean that messages are being sent from here to the wider world. To be shared, passed around, and hopefully acted upon.
According to one pundit earlier today on MSNBC, the White House was surprised by the, swiftness and volume of dissent, on their Chained CPI proposal.
Which means all this exposing and sharing of information is having an effect.
Is it enough... time will tell.
nenagh
(1,925 posts)I'm without an MSNBC connection at the moment. ....
Listening to the Clancy Bros "All God's creatures have a place in the choir"
Was the first time I smiled all day.
Your news is the second smile. thanks for the word.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Or Finnegans Wake...
Or Weila Waila...
nenagh
(1,925 posts)of new team members.. in a setting far from home..
Hence the choice of The Choir..
AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)gateley
(62,683 posts)their reps and the WH repeatedly. (I hadn't heard that about the WH -- good to know!)
I just think this gets our blood pressure up and gets us upset when at this point we're already doing what we need to be doing.
But if they repeated threads serve a purpose to actually accomplish something, then I stand corrected.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)FogerRox
(13,211 posts)gateley
(62,683 posts)You have nothing better to do with your time than to research just to tell me I'm wrong?
Fine. I'm wrong.
Worth the effort?
FogerRox
(13,211 posts)Very few people have done as much research on SS & Chained CPI as I have.
SO when I write an article, it usually is on a topic that hasnt been covered before. OR to the same as I do.
gateley
(62,683 posts)But there has been a LOT of threads about Chained CIP on DU. People are mostly just expressing their outrage and I don't know why I lost it on this one -- that's what message boards are for.
Again, sorry I was rude.
FogerRox
(13,211 posts)Youre right about that. SS/C-CPI 24/7
Samantha
(9,314 posts)I have been on this for the last two years, and I intend to stay on it until it goes away. Even if it is accepted by the Republicans and implemented, you will hear about this because it is simply unacceptable.
Sam
HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)Indeed!
Maven
(10,533 posts)These threads should stay alive until chained CPI is dead.
gateley
(62,683 posts)holding his feet to the fire. he did ask us to do that, you know...
HangOnKids
(4,291 posts)Somebody has a problem with that? Quite odd.
AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)shanti
(21,675 posts)but my trust level in pbo has waned considerably since 2008, and i voted for him twice. what else can we do?
Marr
(20,317 posts)I get the feeling you have posts all over the BOG forum.
Why is that? How could I possibly divine such information from the simple fact that you don't like seeing subjects repeated on an internet forum?
gateley
(62,683 posts)how many posts I have there. You've "divined" nothing.
TheKentuckian
(25,029 posts)Hell, this whole deficits hoopla could have been been chilled out years ago when the TeaPubliKlan Deficit Commission sponsors all dropped it but the 50 billion dimensional chess player resurrected the mess over and over again.
Folks aren't about to be quiet and move on to the next shiny object to placate feelings.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)Until the anger and hurt of this latest betrayal is surpassed by the next one?
http://savesocialsecurity.tumblr.com/
...or until our Democratic President come out and makes a statement at least as strong as this one?
You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their rhetoric, promises, or excuses.
[font size=5 color=green]Solidarity99![/font][font size=2 color=green]
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840high
(17,196 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)A maximum thread occupancy rule?
If you don't want read any more about it, don't click on the fucking thread.
This ain't rocket surgery, pal.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)The OP raises issues that have not been raised before.
If enacted, the chained CPI will be a catastrophe. We need to remember to do everything we can to prevent its enactment.
For many of, the chained CPI could push us into nursing homes earlier than otherwise. Chained CPI is designed to make middle class seniors who have Social Security and meager savings spend down what they have saved and give up on living in pain.
FogerRox
(13,211 posts)This how they get deficit reduction, not thru SS.
& thanks for making the point that most folks think C-CPI is about SS, it has a far wider ranging impact beyond SS.
Octafish
(55,745 posts)Last edited Tue Apr 9, 2013, 09:37 PM - Edit history (1)
Welfare for the wealthy. 400 billionaires worth more than 200,000,000 Americans. Corporations and the rich hiding trillions offshore. Imperial presidency, and no predecessor held to account for treason. Endless wars at home and abroad. Gotta go, Agent Mike's listening.
OldDem2012
(3,526 posts)...and this "package" is already DOA.
MotherPetrie
(3,145 posts)OldDem2012
(3,526 posts)MotherPetrie
(3,145 posts)proposals, regardless of his supposed political affiliation.
OldDem2012
(3,526 posts)FogerRox
(13,211 posts)DOA would be excellent.
Autumn
(45,120 posts)rec