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YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 04:49 PM Apr 2013

Southern DU'ers: Tell me about the South

In this thread, I wish to be educated and informed about an area of the country I'm only vaguely familiar with on a personal level, and an area of the country that I, frankly, do not really understand (politically and culturally).

I've been to Branson, Missouri; Orlando, Florida: and Longview, Texas for vacations, but other than that, I don't have much experience with the Southern states, other than knowing a few people who were born/grew up in the South.

In addition, I hope that other DU'ers who wish to know more about the South would also get a lot out of this thread.

Please, no region-bashing or broad-brush stereotypes in this thread. Trying my best to keep an open mind and an open viewpoint here...

Thank you.

102 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Southern DU'ers: Tell me about the South (Original Post) YoungDemCA Apr 2013 OP
I'm from Atlanta. Atlanta has little to do with the South. onehandle Apr 2013 #1
Can you elaborate? YoungDemCA Apr 2013 #2
Atlanta is a corporate bubble plus good restaurants. onehandle Apr 2013 #4
Georgia has pockets of enlightenment, specifically Macon. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #48
I lived there for 3 years, hated every minute. That was 30 years ago though. Hoyt Apr 2013 #62
I taught in south Georgia 30 years ago. FLyellowdog Apr 2013 #67
I'm sure it's true, as are segregated proms today. Hoyt Apr 2013 #69
You are welcome...I loved it and did it for 25 years. nt FLyellowdog Apr 2013 #98
It means the big cities are often cosmopolitan enough Warpy Apr 2013 #5
Atlanta is one of those cities that are bigger than you expect it to be. dawg Apr 2013 #12
Agreed. I do not live in Atlanta, but just northwest of the city. RebelOne Apr 2013 #21
I lived in Atlanta for 2 years Awknid Apr 2013 #28
Atlanta had the best airport food around before other cities started to catch up. bluestate10 Apr 2013 #46
I live here and don't agree Glitterati Apr 2013 #68
I'm a northerner but found this map interesting. reteachinwi Apr 2013 #3
Totally interesting treestar Apr 2013 #35
South Florida is alien country to me HockeyMom Apr 2013 #6
Northern Fla. is very southern, between Pensacola and Jacksonville dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #17
The Redneck Riviera. n/t Egalitarian Thug Apr 2013 #38
Most beautiful beaches in the US! Awknid Apr 2013 #51
Yep. Mississippi is the first place I ever saw emerald green water and a white sand beach. Egalitarian Thug Apr 2013 #52
Sorry Awknid - the most beautiful beaches in the US are in Hawaii.... KauaiK Apr 2013 #78
Can't argue with that, and I'm from the south DFW Apr 2013 #102
That largely depends on where you live in Florida. ... spin Apr 2013 #55
I don't know how much time you've spent in other southern places Victor_c3 Apr 2013 #84
The South has always been a net importer of federal money and services. Remember how a slave was byeya Apr 2013 #7
I live in carolina beach NC... karmaqueen Apr 2013 #8
Trashing. The bashing began almost immediately. Just like we all knew it would. cordelia Apr 2013 #9
I think the South is just a trigger of emotions Awknid Apr 2013 #30
Here's an idea customerserviceguy Apr 2013 #10
I hate to say this but ... spin Apr 2013 #60
You're absolutely right customerserviceguy Apr 2013 #85
You did and unfortunately I agree with you. ... spin Apr 2013 #94
Southern hospitality is real. rrneck Apr 2013 #11
Appreciate the post. One minor nitpick though... YoungDemCA Apr 2013 #16
I expect so. rrneck Apr 2013 #22
Grady McWhiney agrees with you. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #50
Thanks! rrneck Apr 2013 #70
Thre are some interesting arguments against his point of view. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #72
You've missed so much jazzimov Apr 2013 #56
Never visited much. rrneck Apr 2013 #66
Touche'......! dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #87
Not really Spider Jerusalem Apr 2013 #57
Downloaded to Kindle. Thanks! nt rrneck Apr 2013 #71
With the exception of the food, PotatoChip Apr 2013 #39
I had friends from Maine who Awknid Apr 2013 #41
Yes, I can see how that is possible. PotatoChip Apr 2013 #47
And my favorite Mainer was such a foodie! Awknid Apr 2013 #59
It's sad when we lose touch with good friends. PotatoChip Apr 2013 #64
There are other people of French descent beyond Cajuns RainDog Apr 2013 #61
Man, you hit it with lack of "serious intellectual conversation" trof Apr 2013 #92
Yeah, rrneck Apr 2013 #93
Unless it's a builder/contractor and then it's all about...you know. trof Apr 2013 #95
I just moved to New Orleans. Awesome city as long as you keep one adage in mind. Katashi_itto Apr 2013 #13
Only in Louisana rrneck Apr 2013 #26
Heheh! Katashi_itto Apr 2013 #32
I took several extended vacations in New Orleans in the '90s . . . markpkessinger Apr 2013 #79
You should either look at is as the most well-run Carribean city of the Gulf. Katashi_itto Apr 2013 #80
Southern culture, as you're no doubt aware... cbrer Apr 2013 #14
the larger cities are rather cosmopolitan. but i've lived in the rural south. KG Apr 2013 #15
I feel the same way Awknid Apr 2013 #37
The sad thing is that cable TV channels in some southern cities is FOX News and almost bluestate10 Apr 2013 #53
Southerner born and bred brer cat Apr 2013 #18
That's spot on! Awknid Apr 2013 #34
I live San Antonio, but moved from Wisconsin 30 years ago LeftInTX Apr 2013 #19
I'm sorry, but Texas is different from the South Awknid Apr 2013 #31
We were so different than the rest of the South Awknid Apr 2013 #33
It's like Dist. 13 in the hunger games....... without the Jennifer Lawrence types! nt rdharma Apr 2013 #20
What do you want to know? The south is a complex place...... socialist_n_TN Apr 2013 #23
The class differences are interesting to me... YoungDemCA Apr 2013 #24
Moreso in the more rural regions. As I said...... socialist_n_TN Apr 2013 #43
You might like Awknid Apr 2013 #49
I have lived and worked in Southern cities and small towns for over 30 years. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #25
Thanks for the interesting and informative post! YoungDemCA Apr 2013 #27
Nice description. How's y'mamma n'them? nt rrneck Apr 2013 #73
I always thought "your mom'n'em" was more N'Awlins than Deep South. KamaAina Apr 2013 #97
Southern coastal cities are a lot of fun, aikoaiko Apr 2013 #29
Lemme add to the point about schools. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #58
I agree with everything you said aikoaiko Apr 2013 #77
I've been all over the South and lived in TX, OK, and FL. I love the South. cherokeeprogressive Apr 2013 #36
Well, you already know most of the south is politically ohheckyeah Apr 2013 #40
Then you HAVE to travel through TN jazzimov Apr 2013 #42
Dude, you're making me homesick. rrneck Apr 2013 #74
Savage Gulf is awesome! Lars39 Apr 2013 #86
Live in northeast Atlanta neighborhood. gademocrat7 Apr 2013 #44
Born & raised in SC, lived in SC, FL, WA, PA Heddi Apr 2013 #45
You and i have such a similar path, heddi. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2013 #88
Born and raised in San Antonio, Texas. Aristus Apr 2013 #54
i can help SwampG8r Apr 2013 #63
I am in Detroit..this is what I sent to my friends in Virginia angstlessk Apr 2013 #65
Yeah marions ghost Apr 2013 #75
I was born and raised in Dixie Go Vols Apr 2013 #76
Born and raised in Sgent Apr 2013 #81
Go see MS. The Delta and the northeast part of the state are good Recursion Apr 2013 #82
Excellent post! Le Taz Hot Apr 2013 #83
Hot in the Summer. Humid all year around.. Tikki Apr 2013 #89
Born and raised in Alabama, live there now. bamacrat Apr 2013 #90
I live on the west coast of Florida and love it. NCTraveler Apr 2013 #91
What the South is, is big. Nothing is deemed inconsequential. nolabear Apr 2013 #96
I love the South - the food, the music, the slower pace, the lack of snow or bitter cold. cbayer Apr 2013 #99
Once you get outside the urban areas it's just like the north with one exception. Ganja Ninja Apr 2013 #100
Most of the South is very anti-intellectual, this is just a fact coldmountain Apr 2013 #101

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
1. I'm from Atlanta. Atlanta has little to do with the South.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 04:54 PM
Apr 2013

And now I live in Philly, with zero regrets.

 

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
2. Can you elaborate?
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 04:57 PM
Apr 2013

"Atlanta has little to do with the South".

What do you mean by this?

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
4. Atlanta is a corporate bubble plus good restaurants.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:01 PM
Apr 2013

Georgia is Mississippi with a little more pocket change.

I have little good to say about my native South.

Sorry.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
48. Georgia has pockets of enlightenment, specifically Macon.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:23 PM
Apr 2013

I was there for a few weeks, in the summer.
Talk about humid.....lordy.
But, found some very interesting people who are devoted to humanistic beliefs and values.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
62. I lived there for 3 years, hated every minute. That was 30 years ago though.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 09:02 PM
Apr 2013

I found it to be quite I backwards and bigoted.

FLyellowdog

(4,276 posts)
67. I taught in south Georgia 30 years ago.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 09:51 PM
Apr 2013

The principal of my school wouldn't allow the girls and boys to play together at recess for fear that the little black boys might touch the little white girls while playing games. True story.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
69. I'm sure it's true, as are segregated proms today.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 10:06 PM
Apr 2013

That said, thanks for being a teacher.

Warpy

(114,616 posts)
5. It means the big cities are often cosmopolitan enough
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:04 PM
Apr 2013

that the overall culture of the state is missing.

The south has a distinct culture, especially in the rural areas, that has kept it nearly theocratic and hostile to the rest of the country. They aren't bad people, they just have a very different culture, one that makes them suckers for politicians like Jesse Helms.

Living in the south gave me some great gifts that I didn't appreciate until later. However, I never regretted leaving like I was shot out of a cannon as soon as I'd saved the money.

As for vacationing there, next time try Knoxville or Gatlinburg, right on the edge of the Smokies. It's some of the most beautiful country in the US.

dawg

(10,777 posts)
12. Atlanta is one of those cities that are bigger than you expect it to be.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:57 PM
Apr 2013

It seriously has just about everything, and there are people from all walks of life and backgrounds.

RebelOne

(30,947 posts)
21. Agreed. I do not live in Atlanta, but just northwest of the city.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:54 PM
Apr 2013

I moved here in 1989 from Miami, FL, and I love it here and would never go back to Florida.

Awknid

(381 posts)
28. I lived in Atlanta for 2 years
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:29 PM
Apr 2013

It's still very Southern with all the negatives that go with that. But it's a Mecca for frustrated Southerners who want a bit more of a cosmopolitan lifestyle. It was a life saver for me who was stuck in rural Florida and freshly divorced. It's not perfect, but better than anywhere else in the south.

bluestate10

(10,942 posts)
46. Atlanta had the best airport food around before other cities started to catch up.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:12 PM
Apr 2013

Knowing that I would stay in the airport, I often looked favorably on flights that went through Atlanta, I knew I wouldn't starve.

 

Glitterati

(3,182 posts)
68. I live here and don't agree
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 10:05 PM
Apr 2013

First, Atlanta is as southern as any city in the south, but it IS run by southern Democrats. There ARE some good politicians there, but it's a horribly run city with terrible social issues ignored by those Democrats.

I admire Shirley Franklin, and current Atlanta mayor Kasim Reed, but both are disappointments as Democrats who like to play in the political sandbox of Republicans while ignoring the horrible social conditions of their city.

Atlanta has deep pockets of awful poverty and crime with a failing infrastructure ignored by these Democrats. Like much of the south.

The true workers against this are all a part of the MLK group of activists who have screamed and screeched for generations and are ignored by the likes of Franklin and Reed, and are dying off.

As someone raised in Chicago who moved to the Atlanta area (burbs, not the city) I love the south with friendly people who believe it is important to know and help neighbors and church members. The only problem is that help is tied up in religion and not social responsibility to each other.

The south is self segregated - by bigotry and hatred.

on edit:
I want to add the reason I posted this.........grrrr, that's what I get for getting on my soapbox.

What makes the Atlanta area a bit different than MOST of the south is the "northern influence" in the area. A lot of big corporate movement brought many northern citizens to Atlanta. IBM, Coca Cola, etc. move employees from different regions of the country into the area, so there are pockets of "New York, Chicago, Jersey, and the like" in the Atlanta area. Those groups of people, however, tend to live and work in the same areas, rather than spreading out, so there are lots of bedroom areas where the social climate is very different.





treestar

(82,383 posts)
35. Totally interesting
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:47 PM
Apr 2013

Like the border part of Texas and that western part of Mississippi being blue

 

HockeyMom

(14,337 posts)
6. South Florida is alien country to me
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:09 PM
Apr 2013

as a NYC born and raised "girl". To people who say that Florida isn't the Deep South, I give that a BIG ROFL.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
17. Northern Fla. is very southern, between Pensacola and Jacksonville
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:32 PM
Apr 2013

on the panhandle.
IMHO
Lived in that area for 2 years, traveled around No. fla. as far south as Orlando.

 

Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)
52. Yep. Mississippi is the first place I ever saw emerald green water and a white sand beach.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:34 PM
Apr 2013

I hope it has survived BP. One thing I found interesting living in the south is that no one I met outside Floriduh considers it a part of the south.

DFW

(60,189 posts)
102. Can't argue with that, and I'm from the south
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 04:00 PM
Apr 2013

But my younger daughter went to HPA for two years, so I got to see a LOT of very spectacular beaches while visiting.

spin

(17,493 posts)
55. That largely depends on where you live in Florida. ...
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:36 PM
Apr 2013

I lived in the Tampa Bay Area for 37 years and I found most of my neighbors and co-workers came from many different states and from the Caribbean, Central and South America as well as Asia.

I worked with people from Florida, New York City and State, Alaska, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Detroit, Chicago, Wisconsin, Mississippi, and from Mexico, Panama, Scotland and China. My neighbors were from Cuba, Puerto Rico, the Dominican Republic, Florida, Alaska and Columbia. Their political views varied widely. I knew many people who were strong Democrats and many who were strong Republicans. Oddly, most of the Democrats that I knew owned firearms.

Now that I have retired I have moved to North Florida where most people are native Floridians. There is a large cultural difference. I find the people in North Florida value religion higher than those in the Tampa Bay Area but that doesn't mean that they are more moral or better. They are largely Republican and hunting deer and feral hog is extremely popular here. College football is far more popular than the NFL, while both were popular in the Tampa Bay Area. For some reason, the people in north Florida drive far slower than those in the Tampa Bay Area and slow down to a near stop before making a turn.

I was originally born in Pittsburgh and grew up in northeast Ohio. After a tour of duty in the Air Force, I decided to move to Florida. I've enjoyed living in the Sunshine State.

Victor_c3

(3,557 posts)
84. I don't know how much time you've spent in other southern places
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 06:42 AM
Apr 2013

I visited/vacationed in Florida throughout my childhood. My father is from Panama City and my mother lived in Hollywood/Miami and I spent many spring breaks as a kid traveling between those two cities to see family.

After I graduated college I lived for a few months on the Kentucky/Tennessee boarder (Clarksville, TN) and I thought I was in the south when I lived there. Then I spent about a year in Columbus, GA. Georgia and Alabama are a total different level of "southern-ness".

Head to a place that is more synonymous with being "southern" and you'll see why people don't consider Florida part of the deep south.

 

byeya

(2,842 posts)
7. The South has always been a net importer of federal money and services. Remember how a slave was
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:10 PM
Apr 2013

0.6 of a person in the Constitution? Well, that still gave the south that much more population for the purposes of federal distribution of money and services.
The economy of the South has been, and is, based on providing an underpaid and compliant workforce. This is the model that is being foisted on the rest of the country now. The South wants to lure established companies to the parternalism inherent in this economic model.
If you look at a chart of what each state sends to the Federal Treasury and what each state gets from the Federal Treasury, you will see the whole region gets more than its share and has gotten more than its share for a long time.
Keeping the same class in charge is the name of the game.
A lot of foreign cars are assembled in the South - I don't think any, or many, are unionized. The South is the home of "Right to Work" and all the hypocrisy that goes with that misleading phrase.

karmaqueen

(714 posts)
8. I live in carolina beach NC...
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:19 PM
Apr 2013

I have lived here for 40 years.... I love it here and the people for the most part are warm and giving people. We have Democrats and Republicans and up until the last few years worked together well... I work on the political campaigns... we never have trouble getting people to volunteer for the Democrats and most are very liberal. Our town has always had many gay couples and I never really heard anything negative.. Things have changed alot since the nutty tea baggers took over the republican party.. Their ranting and ravings about all the nutty stuff brought people out of the hills who never followed politics before. It kind of feels like when I lived in the middle East. I lived in a town that was mostly Sunni Muslims, there was Christian Church, A Temple, and lots of Mosques people laughed and danced together and I loved being there.. Now when I see what the Shia groups and the taliban did to the Muslim label that is what the Tea party is doing to our Country.. especially the South.

Awknid

(381 posts)
30. I think the South is just a trigger of emotions
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:32 PM
Apr 2013

And there is no getting around that. I'm as Southern as they come (a daughter of the Confederacy!). But I see what the South is and it makes me very sad. Although I have to say I miss the food and hospitality!

customerserviceguy

(25,406 posts)
10. Here's an idea
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:33 PM
Apr 2013

Find a way to drive through the South. Several months ago, my lady and I went on a trip through West Virginia (for a wedding) then three nights in Kentucky, on to western North Carolina, two nights in South Carolina (where her sister and BIL moved from NJ a couple of years ago), and back up North just in time to catch Hurricane Sandy. Everywhere we went, there were friendly people, good food and drink (they have quite a microbrew industry in KY, it's not all just bourbon!) and good times. Of course, when you go to places that serve great beer, you're already in the company of people who appreciate the finer things in life that are still affordable to the average person, and they recognize that in you, as well.

First off, everyone is so darned polite! I guess half a dozen years in the greater NYC area has jaded me a bit, but it's really a wonderful contrast to the attitudes I get around here. Also, the pace of life is slower, be prepared to linger a bit, and use that opportunity to make small observations that you normally wouldn't have time to make.

Finally, I saw a sentiment on a menu at a wonderful barbecue restaurant in South Carolina, which said, "Celebrate all heritages", or words to that effect, when it had a US fifty-star flag and a Confederate flag on it. I saw a Civil War memorial on the Kentucky-Virginia state line that mourned the losses of all on both sides, and celebrated the fact that the sides were brothers again. Reconciliation is a part of binding up the wounds of any war, Abraham Lincoln and Nelson Mandela both knew that. You can honor a fallen enemy without embracing everything he fought for.

spin

(17,493 posts)
60. I hate to say this but ...
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:53 PM
Apr 2013

in my experience I have found people from NYC to be far less polite and considerate than those that I have met from any other big city. I've had several friends from the Big Apple during my life but they often tested my patience.

The pace of life in the South is often slower. I grew up in northeastern Ohio and when I lived in Mississippi I found it sometimes difficult to communicate with the natives unless I slowed down my speech. I actually got very good at imitating the accent and found I often got better service when I did. I never noticed this phenomena in Florida where I have lived for 42 years but when I return to Ohio, people tell me that I have developed a distinctive Southern accent.

spin

(17,493 posts)
94. You did and unfortunately I agree with you. ...
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 12:37 PM
Apr 2013

I almost feel that I am painting a large group of people with a very broad brush which I personally feel would show that I lack intelligence.

When I first noticed this, I asked several people who have considerable experience in the tourist industry or the airline industry what they felt about people from the Big Apple. They all reported that they had noticed the lack of politeness that I did.

I then talked to my friends from NYC and I got the impression that they took some pride in that lack.

Still I suspect that many New Yorkers are not as belligerent or impolite as the ones that I have met. I just haven't encountered any at this time.

On a positive note, the people that I have met from NYC have always seemed to be very intelligent.

rrneck

(17,671 posts)
11. Southern hospitality is real.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 05:40 PM
Apr 2013

People will help you if you need help and, especially in rural areas, will readily pass the time of day.

Southern humor tends to be rather oblique and difficult to decipher. That's because of the native clannishness of southerners. There are a lot of "inside jokes". When you get to know people you may be invited, (without knowing it), to play "lets see how far we can push him before a real fight starts". If you play that game reasonably well you will be accepted.

Most southerners and just about every redneck is Scots Irish and it shows. The Scots Irish are suspicious of elites, fiercely loyal to those near them, and not afraid to fight for what they believe. And at whiles, as most of the other early settlers to the United States considered them, dirty, drunken and combative. Hey, nobody's perfect.

The typical southern diet consists of fried everything. If you like pork BBQ, you'll love the south.

I'm sure you're aware that the south is politically conservative. That won't keep you from making friends and getting along with people any more than a conservative in Manhattan would. As an unabashed liberal I spent a lot of time on a lot of loading docks and construction sites and got along just fine. The secret is to pull your weight and don't get in people's faces. It takes time to broach difficult subjects with most people, and the south is no different. Most ideological problems are really class problems, so you will probably find you have more in common with southerners than you think.

You're probably less likely to run across serious intellectual conversation in the south outside of the more intense urban areas. Between the influence of poverty and religion education is not the best. That doesn't mean people are stupid, it just means that intellectualism is not that prized. It won't do any good to flaunt the letters after your name unless you can show them you can do something with them.

 

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
16. Appreciate the post. One minor nitpick though...
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:21 PM
Apr 2013

"Most Southerners and just about every redneck is Scots-Irish and it shows."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there actually a bit more diversity in terms of white/European background than that in the South-English, Scottish/Scots-Irish, Welsh, French (Louisiana), Spanish (Florida), even some German in places like North Carolina or parts of Texas?

Re: the Scots-Irish: I've read that most of them are descendants of the "Borderlands" people (near the borders of England, Scotland, and Wales) who settled in Ireland for a few generations before coming to America.

And of course, there's the ubiquitous "American" ancestry, especially common in the South, which often signals either Scots-Irish, and/or a big mix of different ancestries-a "mutt"!



rrneck

(17,671 posts)
22. I expect so.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:57 PM
Apr 2013

Especially now what with all them newfangled cars n' such.

Here's a map from Wiki



I was going more by the overall "personality" of the south, which certainly changes from place to place. And indeed, even though I live in one of those red counties, it ain't the south.

But fundamentalism and authoritarianism run strong in the south from the Presbyterianism of the Scots Irish.

One Hessian officer said, "Call this war by whatever name you may, only call it not an American rebellion; it is nothing more or less than a Scotch Irish Presbyterian rebellion."[41] A British major general testified to the House of Commons that "half the rebel Continental Army were from Ireland".[50] Mecklenburg County, North Carolina, with its large Scotch-Irish population, was to make the first declaration for independence from Britain in the Mecklenburg Declaration of 1775.

The Scotch-Irish "Overmountain Men" of Virginia and North Carolina formed a militia which won the Battle of Kings Mountain in 1780, resulting in the British abandonment of a southern campaign, and for some historians "marked the turning point of the American Revolution".[51][52]


As I understand it, the Renaissaince pretty much missed lowland Scotland. Apparently somebody in London wrote a memo on a cow to inform us since reiving cattle was the primary industry there. But unfortunately we screwed up and stole a blank cow and never got the message.

You're right about the borderlanders. The Scots Irish might even be traced back to the celts, but that's iffy. I have a fancy though that Hadrian dealt with my ancestors long enough and finally said, "Fuck it. I'm tired of dealing with you people. Stay on the other side of this wall". Then later, king James dealt with us for a while and said, "Fuck it, I'm tired of dealing with you people. Go to Ulster and run the Irish out of Ireland." Then after a while the Irish got tired of us and said, "Fuck it, we're tired of dealing with you people. Go to America." When we landed here all of the rich, clean organized Germans and plantation owners said, "Fuck it, were tired of dealing with you people. Go to Appalachia and fight indians". Then we became 'Muricans. Praise Jesus, we're home.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
50. Grady McWhiney agrees with you.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:28 PM
Apr 2013

McWhiney and Forrest McDonald were the authors of the "Celtic Thesis," which holds that most Southerners were of Celtic ancestry (as opposed to Anglo-Saxon), and that all groups he declared to be "Celtic" (Scots-Irish, Irish, Scottish, Welsh and Cornish) were descended from warlike herdsmen, in contrast to the peaceful farmers who predominated in England. They attempted to trace numerous ways in which the Celtic culture shaped social, economic and military behavior. For example, they demonstrated that livestock raising (especially of cattle and hogs) developed a more individualistic, militant society than tilling the soil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grady_McWhiney

I have his book: In Cracker Culture: Celtic Ways in the Old South

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
72. Thre are some interesting arguments against his point of view.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 10:13 PM
Apr 2013

But, in my mind, easily refuted.

jazzimov

(1,456 posts)
56. You've missed so much
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:43 PM
Apr 2013

You have never really visited the South, Have you?

it's obvious.

 

Spider Jerusalem

(21,786 posts)
57. Not really
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:46 PM
Apr 2013

the inland South was settled largely by people from the Scottish border country, either directly from the Scottish lowlands/north of England (Cumberland and Northumberland) or by way of Ulster (where a good many Scots border country Presbyterians went in James I's Plantation of Ulster). More than a quarter-million people emigrated from the Scots Lowlands, north of England and Ulster to North America between 1715 and 1775, and almost all of them ended up in the inland South (the Carolinas, the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia, Georgia, etc) and most of those first emigrants' descendants ended up moving west to Kentucky, Tennessee, Alabama, Mississippi, and so on. The Ulster Scots Presbyterians came to culturally dominate the lowland South to the extent that even people whose ancestral origins may be different in those parts of the country became culturally Scots-Irish (as an aside: the origins of the term "redneck" come from the Scots Covenanters, who signed an oath and declaration pledging to uphold Presbyterism as the established church of Scotland...many of them signed in blood, and wore red scarves to signify their support, hence "redneck&quot . Some of the disctinctive elements of this culture; social organisation based around the extended family, a distrust of outsiders, quick temper and use of violence as a means of settling disputes, and early marriage...the average marriage age in the Scots border country was the youngest in Britain, at around 19 or so, and the inland South continues to have the youngest age at marriage of American regions.

The South also, historically, experienced very low levels of immigration in the post-colonial era; much lower than any other part of the country (all those people in the South who put "American" for ancestry on the Census? Are probably descended from colonial-era immigrants).

There's a very interesting book, by David Hackett Fisher, called "Albion's Seed: Four English Folkways in America" that looks at American cultures through the lens of the persistence of the distinctive British regional cultures of the earliest groups of settlers (New England Separatists from East Anglia, Pennsylvania Quakers from the north Midlands of England, Virginia Cavaliers from the south and southwest of England, and from the Scots border country to the inland South). I'd recommend it as being worth a read.

PotatoChip

(3,186 posts)
39. With the exception of the food,
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:52 PM
Apr 2013

your description of the culture (oddly enough) sounds very much like Maine.

Very interesting. Thanks for your post.

Awknid

(381 posts)
41. I had friends from Maine who
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:00 PM
Apr 2013

Told me they had a lot of the same slang words I did coming from South Louisiana. It was due to the Canadian influence. My part of La. Was settled by the Nova Scotian Canadians or "Acadians". That is where the word "Cajun" comes from - Acadian. It's complicated.

PotatoChip

(3,186 posts)
47. Yes, I can see how that is possible.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:20 PM
Apr 2013

There are a lot of acadian Nova Scotia influences in this neck of the woods. My SO's family being a perfect example. They are of Scots/Irish heritage along with (probably) some French and Native American in the mix. They came down from Canada sometime before the turn of the century (1900) to work in the textile mills.

So I can see how there could be some close similarities. I just wish we also had among our folks whatever influence created your kind of Cajun food, though. Yum!... Ours is so bland!

Awknid

(381 posts)
59. And my favorite Mainer was such a foodie!
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:49 PM
Apr 2013

We were neighbors in NYC for a while. She chose to work in an Italian Deli as a cashier although she was well educated and could have any job. She put us Cajuns to shame with her hospitality too! I remember her bringing fresh clams from home to us 8 hours away. They were to die for! I wish I was still in touch with her.

PotatoChip

(3,186 posts)
64. It's sad when we lose touch with good friends.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 09:07 PM
Apr 2013

I hope you eventually get reacquainted with her.

Maine, or rather, the southern part of Maine (particularly Portland) is gradually becoming known as a great 'foodie' destination. But alas, I live a good distance from there, where the cuisine is pretty much the same old- same old. Otoh, seafood is quite inexpensive even though I'm a good distance from the coast too... There is always a silver lining if one looks for it, I suppose.

Nice chatting w/you! Hope to see you around DU again soon.

RainDog

(28,784 posts)
61. There are other people of French descent beyond Cajuns
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:56 PM
Apr 2013

My family includes people who were from Quebec who migrated to the south. These people arrived in the south b/c of the rivers. If you notice, there are a lot of French-named places along rivers in the eastern U.S. My ancestors, tho, were from some of the same area as many Cajuns - the area around the coast of France including Cherbourg. They never made it to Louisiana.

The Cajuns were deported from Nova Scotia and were sent back to France by the British. In France they settled in the northwestern fishing areas. The French didn't want them, either, so eventually they were able to make a deal and settled in the Louisiana Purchase territory.

I'm from the south and always felt more at home around people from all different cultures, not the Scotch-Irish culture. I don't know that my family's ancestry had anything to do with that, tho. I think difference was always interesting to me, rather than threatening, probably because I had good experiences in that way when I was a kid. Vive la différence.

trof

(54,274 posts)
92. Man, you hit it with lack of "serious intellectual conversation"
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 12:21 PM
Apr 2013

I'm in a small town in coastal Alabama.
My wife, the director of our local library, and a few members of our Friends of the Library group are about the only ones in town I can have a serious intellectual, national or international affairs, or political discussion with.

I miss that from my years living in New England.
BTW, I was born and raised in Alabama.

rrneck

(17,671 posts)
93. Yeah,
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 12:30 PM
Apr 2013

I found that after about ten minutes I've said all I need to say about stock cars and deer hunting.

 

Katashi_itto

(10,175 posts)
13. I just moved to New Orleans. Awesome city as long as you keep one adage in mind.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:00 PM
Apr 2013

"It's Like an Amusement Park that can Kill you."

Otherwise as long as you remember that your fine

People are wonderfully friendly here too!

rrneck

(17,671 posts)
26. Only in Louisana
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:19 PM
Apr 2013

will you see a chef jabbing a big wooden spoon into a boiling pot and yelling, "Get back in dere!"

markpkessinger

(8,912 posts)
79. I took several extended vacations in New Orleans in the '90s . . .
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 05:17 AM
Apr 2013

. . . haven't been back post-Katrina. Absolutely loved it. My impression of it pre-Katrina, however, was that culturally speaking, it wasn't really a typical Southern city. For that matter, it didn't really seem like an American city in many respects!

 

Katashi_itto

(10,175 posts)
80. You should either look at is as the most well-run Carribean city of the Gulf.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 05:32 AM
Apr 2013

Or a still a French Colonial that speaks English. But it's not an American city.

 

cbrer

(1,831 posts)
14. Southern culture, as you're no doubt aware...
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:13 PM
Apr 2013

Is one of many sub-cultures in America. Some of the common clichés about the old south are true. Such as a perceived gentility, social grace, and extreme racism.

Having said that though, we've been fully enveloped by the rest of American culture. Now, in order to find evidence of those former, more positive traits, you have to move down to smaller communities. People where I live (Savannah) still wave when passing on the road about 50% of the time. Our architecture survives through preservation, and our formerly grand industries, i.e. cotton, tobacco, the 5 "P"s (pine, peanut, peach, poultry and pecan). are still cultivated, but now have historically accurate, tourist type presentations to romanticize and profit from our past.

In order to find the continuing racism, one needs to travel no further than the Governors office. It's a fact of life. Pervading the sub cultures here so thoroughly, that stepping outside of this paradigm yields an almost immediate cultural shock. "Those damn Liberals"... This is, thankfully, less widespread than formerly true. But it is still very real.

I suppose it's neither fair, nor accurate to say that many Georgians can be manipulated emotionally. Not only is this true for many people, but for Georgians, it requires a specific set of hot buttons. Well known by politicians, and used at every opportunity.

Our natural resources weigh heavily in our culture. Hunting, fishing, boating, camping are all quite prevalent here. Our climate of course, plays into these activities too.

I suppose it's unnecessary to point out that using these observations to make generalizations about Georgians isn't fair on an individual basis. One of the things I love about our shared political philosophy is that I probably don't need to say that.

Hope this helps. Peace out.

KG

(28,795 posts)
15. the larger cities are rather cosmopolitan. but i've lived in the rural south.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:18 PM
Apr 2013

nice enough to drive through and visit, but it's a whole 'nother story if you live there.

Awknid

(381 posts)
37. I feel the same way
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:49 PM
Apr 2013

In a way I feel like a traitor, but the folks there just don't realize what they are. I left the South in 1980 and lived there again for a while 10 yrs after. It seemed unbearable. My great great grandfather fought in the civil war, etc. etc. Family started the town. Yada yada yada....I should be proud. But it needs to change! It really needs to change. I blame Fox News.

bluestate10

(10,942 posts)
53. The sad thing is that cable TV channels in some southern cities is FOX News and almost
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:35 PM
Apr 2013

nothing else. There is no incentive for the powers that be in the South to allow a diversity of information.

brer cat

(27,588 posts)
18. Southerner born and bred
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:32 PM
Apr 2013

Brer Cat's sister here. We were raised primarily in the Atlanta area, both lived in the Washington, DC area for a few years as young adults, and now live in a small rural area in the north Ga. mountains.

Southerners are very friendly. They are curious about strangers, but wary of them as well. There is still a lot of prejudice against blacks...sigh. They tend to be religious. Many drive pick-up trucks and most of those have rifle racks in the back window. Except for during deer season, you will mainly see long levels in the racks, though. They have no use for intellectualism but respect intelligent folks. Just don't rub it in their faces. Don't get in a hurry in a check-out line, they are going to pass the time of day with the cashier. That's the best place to find out what is going on around town, who got snow last night, who died, who had a baby... Extended families are important. Don't talk badly about folks...it might be their cousin you are talking to. They tend to be passive aggressive. They are fiercely loyal to friends and family.

I could go on, but maybe that is a glimpse into the southern soul.

Awknid

(381 posts)
34. That's spot on!
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:42 PM
Apr 2013

The thing I remember about the South was everyone asking "How's your Mama?" And really meaning it. They truly wanted to know.

LeftInTX

(34,302 posts)
19. I live San Antonio, but moved from Wisconsin 30 years ago
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 06:41 PM
Apr 2013

The main difference is infrastructure. Less parks, sidewalks stuff like that.
The people are friendly and very open.
Work environments tend to be more relaxed, but pay and long term job security isn't as good as up north.

The real nut jobs seem to exist on TV.

Although I have been to areas where those types exist, I'm not really acquainted with people like that. I think they exist everywhere. For some reason they seem to have bigger mouth piece in the south!

Awknid

(381 posts)
31. I'm sorry, but Texas is different from the South
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:34 PM
Apr 2013

Just like The Cajun area of Louisiana is different from the South

Awknid

(381 posts)
33. We were so different than the rest of the South
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:38 PM
Apr 2013

That when I grew up and moved 50 miles away to Baton Rouge at age 19, I almost had a nervous breakdown! It was totally different than Lafayette. But that isn't really relevant to your question. Sorry.

socialist_n_TN

(11,481 posts)
23. What do you want to know? The south is a complex place......
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:11 PM
Apr 2013

I was born here and have lived in the south all my life. As a child in a small town, as a teenager and young adult in a mid size city, and for the last 35 years or so in a pretty big city. In addition, my ancestors have been in the south since they came over from Europe. And yes, Scotland, Ireland, England primarily. I've also traveled all over the country, spending a few weeks at a time in various small towns, medium cities, and larger cities all over, so I've got something of a comparison data base.

Being a Marxist in a VERY conservative region is pretty interesting, but it also informs me quite a bit about my region. This is the most obviously class based region of the country. It's a holdover from the antebellum past, but in some ways, it's almost feudal. The cities are, mostly, like other big cities. It takes a certain amount of tolerance to get along in a city, so even if you're the most racist bastard out there, in a city you're going to have to rely at one time or another, on people of different races for SOMETHING. So even racists learn to cope with cultural and racial differences to a greater or lesser degree. The mid size and smaller towns are a little more obvious in the class differences. The money in these places is usually old (several generations) and they do control the power politically and socially to a certain extent.

It's a little more laid back than almost any other area of the country, which is good. But it's also home of more hypocrisy. The working class here has been beaten down for generations and acceptance of your place is pretty much the norm. That said, some of the most radical and revolutionary socialists around are southern. It seems like when you face this type of classism for all of your life, IF you're NOT beaten down, you're ready to make a BIG change and not just incrementally.

What else do you want to know?

 

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
24. The class differences are interesting to me...
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:18 PM
Apr 2013

I take it that economic and social inequality is pretty stark in the region?

How would you describe the different classes in the region?

socialist_n_TN

(11,481 posts)
43. Moreso in the more rural regions. As I said......
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:02 PM
Apr 2013

It's usually old money, several generations. It actually reminds me somewhat of what I've read of Russia before the February revolution in 1917. And of course it's overlaid with racism. Even the lumpen and working class whites are infected with it, turning the African-American population into the lowest rung on the totem pole. It's a LOT better than it was when I was a kid, but it's still there.

You've got the traditional Marxist classes, but there's a whole lot less consciousness of it down here than elsewhere. And class consciousness elsewhere is not great, so that should give you an idea. That lack of class consciousness makes it difficult to organize. Also as I said above, the working class is so beaten down for generations that it's hard to get them out of it. That's also why religion is so big down here. They've actually got nothing else to look forward to except equality in Heaven when they die. They turn all of their innate anger against the system inward instead of outward.

Awknid

(381 posts)
49. You might like
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:24 PM
Apr 2013

The book by Malcolm Gladwell, "Blink". It explains the attitudes of southern cultures are actually a left over from the agrarian cultures of Scotland and similar areas. That is: It's all about reputation! They did not have much law enforcement, so they had to deal with it themselves. So instilling fear was important. They took it to extremes with things like Hatfield & McCoys. But those who were feared were not taken advantage of.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
25. I have lived and worked in Southern cities and small towns for over 30 years.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:18 PM
Apr 2013

and visited a lot more.
What rrneck says is true.
People who just visit the South usually go to the cities, where one can get a superficial picture of what the South is like.
Me, I am from a long line of Irish American folks, and feel comfortable with the clannish behavior, which, in the small towns,extends automatically to your neighbor.
I deliberately chose to retire in a small ( pop. 6,000) town here, because I knew people will come to my aid if needed.

I find the communication much like Japanese culture. Polite, seemingly friendly on the surface, but takes awhile to get to know people underneath.
We don't talk about politics unless we know each other well enough.
Took me 2 years to get to know my roofer, who struck me as gruff and withdrawn.
Not so, come to find out..little by little he opened up, loves to tease, really loves to try to get my dander up about Obama, in a sparring way. Now I can call him about anything, knowing he will know who has what I need.

bad mouthing people is not done, and folks will avoid suggesting a roofer or plumber rather than tell you anything negative. OTOH, if they say so and so is "real good", it is worth checking out.

One thing that stands out is people hate to tell you no.
Drove Mr. Dixie, who is from Cal. stark raving mad at first.
He would get all sorts of answers in his quest for an item at the hardware store, but never get a direct no,
would come home empty handed, madder than hell.
And he could not figure out why someone who had agreed effusively to show up to do a job did not show up,
instead of saying to his face they did not want to do the job for what ever reason.
People here LIKE to help out, and will jump at the chance to do something for you if they can.
But there is an unwritten score card of who owes who a favor, and the fun game is to get someone owing you more than you owe them. I am pretty good at that, since we give away our organic free range eggs and are always home, so pick up the mail and paper for traveling neighbors.
A lot of good food gets sent to us in return.

Oh..the accents.
I cringe when I hear movie people try to fake accents. There is NO one "southern accent"
There are many southern accents, deoending on age, origin and race of the person speaking.
Some accents are dying out.

Another thing..." you aren't from around here, are you?" means: I don't know you, I can't "place " you, so I won't trust you with anything but polite greetings. you are an outsider until I decide otherwise.
If they want to get to know you, they start asking questions I regarded as intrusive and highly personal, back when I did not know better.
Later I learned to mention working nearby, or knowing someone they were sure to have heard of,
or mentioning indirectly how long I have lived in the South.
" I used to have a house across town on such and such a street, next to Mrs. so and so"
will be greeted with " Oh, I know her, she goes to my church", and the conversation becomes warmer.
I usually say "I wasn't born here but I got here as fast as I could and I will only leave feet first", and watch people smile and relax. They...we..are very proud of our area and like it when people tell us they like it.

People of all ages will strike up a conversation at the store, or on the sidewalk, post office, etc.
Perfect strangers just stop and talk to you.It is a pastime.
It takes me 30 minutes to do my grocery shopping but an hour to get home from the store.
I love it.

Yes, there are racists and bigots and tea party morons....some of them live up the street.
yes, there is a dearth of intellectual conversations, but "while in Rome, do as the Romans do" works well for me,
and I am pretty good at the all important small talk.
( You ALWAYS ask about the family when you meet)
The positives of low housing costs, lack of real winter, a strong sense of community, plentiful sunshine, low crime rate, friendly and supportive neighbors, makes up for a lot, living here.

Oh...look what I did.
I chatted on and on...just like a southerner.






 

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
27. Thanks for the interesting and informative post!
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:20 PM
Apr 2013

Your response and others have been fascinating reading for me.

aikoaiko

(34,214 posts)
29. Southern coastal cities are a lot of fun,
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:29 PM
Apr 2013

I was born and raised a yankee outside of NYC, but I've really enjoyed living in Savannah.

Southern coastal cites are typically blue islands in red oceans.

If you have kids you have to be prepared for private school because there is a good chance you won't live in a district with a decent school. Good secular schools run between 9-12k/year in Savannah.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
58. Lemme add to the point about schools.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:49 PM
Apr 2013

The reason that Alabama has very very low property taxes is because of racism.
Property taxes are local, by county.
They pay for the schools.
There are 2 kinds of schools: "private", for the white kids that can afford them
and "public" for the poorer kids, largely non-white.
Every week in the newspaper (which contains many typos and atrocious grammar) there are school and class pictures and the segregation is glaring.
This is a very very very old part of the racism.
When I was looking to buy a larger house here, the real estate lady pointed me to a rapidly growing town nearby which has a lot of newer houses, and they had pretty high prices.
turns out, it is the area where most of the "private school" families live.
She naturally assumed I would be interested in living in the "most desirable" area.

Home schooling is big here, getting bigger.

People here are smart, overall. But not big boosters of education, as a rule ( there are, of course, exceptions...3 Pulitzer winning writers are from my town)
Happily I have other outlets to get my brain scratched..

Thanks, DU!!!!

aikoaiko

(34,214 posts)
77. I agree with everything you said
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 12:15 AM
Apr 2013

The private schools grew in numbers and size after Brown v Board of Ed.

School Desegregation did not work as many had hoped.

 

cherokeeprogressive

(24,853 posts)
36. I've been all over the South and lived in TX, OK, and FL. I love the South.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:48 PM
Apr 2013

I love the food, I love the hospitality, I love the weather. I love the sound of cicadas, the smell of rain, and the different accents.

There isn't much I don't love about the South. On a scale of 1-10 I give it a solid 8. If I ever leave the mountains of Southern California, Austin is a possible destination. I loved the hill country of Texas.

ohheckyeah

(9,314 posts)
40. Well, you already know most of the south is politically
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 07:58 PM
Apr 2013

conservative. Virginia isn't the deep south - northern Virginia and the southern parts of Virginia are very different. Richmond is different from say Virginia Beach and both of those are different from Roanoke. I live in rural southwest Virginia and find it to be stifling politically but I have my liberal friends and some members of my family that help to keep me sane.

I love the mountains of Virginia and rural life suits me. The best thing about the south are southern hospitality, sweet iced tea and biscuits.

I've lived in big cities - Alexandria, Richmond, Virginia Beach, Miami, Phoenix, and Tucson but I'm more at home in the country surrounded by trees and wild critters.

jazzimov

(1,456 posts)
42. Then you HAVE to travel through TN
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:02 PM
Apr 2013

I would advise avoiding the usual "tourist traps" , Although this simple advice would involve avoiding the Great Smoky Mountain Park which is an entirely different ecology and a very unique experience. If you get off the trail, you will see and experience things that are not represented anywhere else in the Continental US, or in the World for that matter.

As far as the "people" I encountered, I am a White Suburban Male so I can only say that as long as I didn't try to hide that people were more than willing to help me out with things I didn't know. But there is a lot of knowledge about the local flora and fauna that should be taken seriously. Much of it is common sense, like how to recognize poison ivy and what mushrooms NOT to eat.

But, if you want to see the most wondrous and beautiful bounties that God and/or the Universe has to offer - come to Tennessee. Forget the tourist traps, although they are better than most. Visit the Cumberland Plateau.

As just an example, hike up to Virgin Falls. The hike itself is beautiful, and I recommend that you take advantage and least plan 2 days so that you can camp at Big Laurel Falls. I have made this site my base camp many times, and I love the river which feeds it which can also offer natural showers and whirlpools. The site itself would be a destination, except that it is halfway to Virgin Falls.

As you gradually climb the trail, you eventually come to a split. Left will take you down to the Caney Fork River and a picnic area, and then a steep incline. Right will take you toward a more gradual incline, but also among some seasonal waterfalls. You may or may not be able to hear and/or see these waterfalls from the trail. I wandered once from the trail to enjoy Sheep's' Cave, and was underwhelmed.

Whichever path you choose, you will come upon Virgin Falls at the same place. And it will take your breath away.

The view to Virgin Falls is about half-way up. If you wish, you can climb to the source or take a long hike trip around to the source. It comes out of a cave, flows down a short stream, and then Falls. The water falls about 200 feet, and then disappears into a rock-laden cave below itself.

The water comes from nowhere, and disappears into nowhere. But whether it is "full" or just "trickles" over the cathedral rocks, it is most beautiful thing that you have ever seen. It is a religious experience.

And then there's other campgrounds......

For instance, Fall Creek Falls... the largest waterfall east of the Mississippi and source of many scenes from ......






Lars39

(26,540 posts)
86. Savage Gulf is awesome!
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 08:20 AM
Apr 2013

Definitely off the beaten track, but well worth the effort to get there.

gademocrat7

(11,941 posts)
44. Live in northeast Atlanta neighborhood.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:06 PM
Apr 2013

Springtime in Atlanta is beautiful. Dogwoods and azaleas are everywhere. Largest Hindu temple in the Southeast is very close to my neighborhood. In this area people stop or slow down when a funereal cortege passes by.

Heddi

(18,312 posts)
45. Born & raised in SC, lived in SC, FL, WA, PA
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:11 PM
Apr 2013

The south is like anywhere else: There are good people, there are bad people. There is poverty, there is wealth. There are beautiful places, there are places full of strip malls and blight.

Born & raised in Charleston, SC, Lived there til I was 25 then moved to Seattle for roughly 12 years. Have also lived in Florida on and off a few times, and now live in Philadelphia.

There is nothing magical or special about the south. There is hospitality everywhere. In fact, I've met the most consistently pleasant people I've ever met in my life here in Philadelphia. People in Seattle were frosty, but made super great friendships that will last my entire lifetime as well.

There's this myth about the south being more hospitable, more genteel, slower....Maybe 50 years ago...not now, at least not the big cities. Got family in Atlanta, Charlotte, Myrtle Beach, and have been to every state east of the Mississippi and south of the Mason Dixon.

Criss-crossed the country by car 4x's in the last 5 years. Small towns, whether in the northwest, southeast, midwest, breadbasket, are different than big cities. They're generally slower going, simpler, wary of strangers. And I've seen *no* difference between a small town in the middle of WA or ND or SC or GA or FL.

Big cities are faster paced, talk faster, walk faster, drive faster....Fargo vs Charleston vs Orlando vs Seattle....all the same.

I lived in Yakima, WA for 4 years while I went to nursing school. Saw and heard more outright racism and racist langauge and remarks than I ever did in Charleston. Or at least on the same level, let's say that. 2 hours east of Seattle and it was like I was on a different coast. Seattle has high asian population but in the city suburbs a small black population but a growing African immigrant population (Somali, Ethiopian, etc). Have heard perfectly educated liberal "more progressive than thou" people refer to those immigrants as "stinky blacks' and make comments like "Why do they smell so bad" and "I wish they'd overdose on Curry or whatever the fuck they et that comes out of their pores...." No idea that it's offensive and racist. Normal people, bachelor's degrees at University of Washington clueless that it's offensive to suggest that a group of people are inherently stinky because of where they come from.

It's the same as any other place. Just more mythological, for some reason. I lived there and I don't get it.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,161 posts)
88. You and i have such a similar path, heddi.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 10:25 AM
Apr 2013

I was born n raised in Wash. and my dad worked construction, so we lived in a LOT of small towns all over the state, both sides of the mountains.
Got my degrees at U of W...tho never heard a lot of rude talk about other people.
course, that was in the 70's......we had other things on our mind.
Seattle used to be like a big friendly small town.and ended moving to the South after half a lifetime in Wa.

tho, like you, I lived in other places and drove across the country 4-5 times.
and ended up for the last 30 years living in the South, which I love. It's like kudzu...it grows on ya.

Aristus

(72,188 posts)
54. Born and raised in San Antonio, Texas.
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 08:35 PM
Apr 2013

I have a feeling that Texas would be a lot more progressive than it is if so many Texans were less interested in living out the legend of Texas, and instead, living in the reality of Texas.

Make of that what you will.

But...

You have people wearing cowboy hats and boots who have never, and will never, rope cattle from horseback.

You have people sporting guns, and advocating for their public display in cities where, in the 19th Century (The "Old West&quot there were strict ordinances prohibiting the bearing of arms.

The fallen of the Alamo are revered because they "fought for freedom", even though the major figures were slave-owners, or advocates for slavery, who were fighting to expand the institution to Mexican Texas, which had outlawed slavery.

Texas executes more people annually than all the other states combined, and often cites "deterrent" as a justification; all the while ignoring the fact that Houston, for example, has an astronomical crime-rate.

SwampG8r

(10,287 posts)
63. i can help
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 09:03 PM
Apr 2013

i am now at the ol boy stage in age and southern born and bred
the meals are the best anywhere
the women are the smartest meanest sweetest things you ever met and every old southern lady you meet used to be the same way
the choir music is better
the whiskey is better and newer
in general the people like a good time cold beer live music
when we dance we dance in the streets from new orleans to savannah(greatest city on earth)
we are always fixin to get ready
we do all the same stuff everyone else does

angstlessk

(11,862 posts)
65. I am in Detroit..this is what I sent to my friends in Virginia
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 09:14 PM
Apr 2013

The racism in the Detroit news comments is truly amazing..I am from Norfolk VA...and I am sure it was an integral part of the south during the civil war..and WE are not as racist as folks who post to comments on the Detroit news sites.

Detroit is what? 90% black..of course most of the crime is by blacks,...they are 90% of the population..

And I admit there are more murders, robberies etc than the national average..but so is unemployment and poverty...are they related..how can they not be?

When I go to a store that not only has panhandlers, but folks who sweep the parking lot for a couple of bucks..I always drop a 5 dollar bill out of the truck so someone who is cleaning the parking lot will get a small bonus

marions ghost

(19,841 posts)
75. Yeah
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 11:08 PM
Apr 2013

Norfolk

All my relatives are from the mid-Atlantic--MD, VA, NC.

In the South don't be quiet when you're with people--that's considered weird and rude. Ya gotta chat. People from other places find this burdensome. Relax. It doesn't matter what you say--just babble about anything, whatever comes to mind. Don't worry about accents, just chat.

Go Vols

(5,902 posts)
76. I was born and raised in Dixie
Sun Apr 14, 2013, 11:25 PM
Apr 2013

worked all over the country.

I would pick Charleston S.Car. as the best,LA prolly second as people were more than nice there,but not many trees.

Tennessee suits me fine tho,although we have idiots for politicians,the people for the most part are great,help you any way they can.

My little town of 8000 gets this yearly, http://www.bonnaroo.com/ , plus there are alot of union jobs here for a small town.

Sgent

(5,858 posts)
81. Born and raised in
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 06:00 AM
Apr 2013

Northeast Mississippi -- the poorest area of the entire country at the time of LBJ's poverty programs. I grew up in a (comparatively) progressive town of 25,000, with good schools and less historical racism (volunteer integration, no private schools) than many other areas, but my parents worked in rural areas (less than 2,000 people).

The best description of my area of the area was written by Faulkner. Its a little dated (pre-television), but he does an excellent and accurate job of describing the rural hills, and much of the thought process of the area.

If you haven't read Faulkner, I suggest starting with the novella "The Bear", then going into absalom, absalom! As I Lay Dying and The Sound and the Fury are his most well known books, but are very difficult to read until you get used to his style.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
82. Go see MS. The Delta and the northeast part of the state are good
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 06:05 AM
Apr 2013

Plus the gulf coast. It's beautiful and the people are very nice. Best food you'll ever have in your life, which will be 20 years shorter because of that food.

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
83. Excellent post!
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 06:28 AM
Apr 2013

This Californian is looking forward to reading the responses. I've been to two Southern cities: New Orleans (LOVED it!!!!) and Atlanta, GA.

Tikki

(15,141 posts)
89. Hot in the Summer. Humid all year around..
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 10:38 AM
Apr 2013

I lived in Louisiana for a year. Very humid.
Personally, I don't do humid. But then again, I don't do severe cold either.



Tikki

bamacrat

(3,867 posts)
90. Born and raised in Alabama, live there now.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 10:39 AM
Apr 2013

The south is one of those places that if you are from it, no matter how much it pisses you off or embarrasses you, you love it. There are hateful bigoted people here, poor people who vote based on their view of the bible or righteous morality as opposed to their own best interest. One thing that is sad but true is the most bigoted here are those with limited experiences. Most everyone I have come in contact with that was outwardly racist or hated this or that, didn't have any experience with what they hate.

We talk a bit slower. Southern hospitality is a myth, if you are a nice person you're a nice person. Just because someone who says ain't a lot is nice doesn't make it exclusive to the south.

Our food is better. Maybe not healthier by any means, but its better. Some will argue that, but its a waste of time. Southern food is the best food.

Oh and college football is #1, even in front of NASCAR. One team above all and that's Alabama.

Roll Tide.
(The commercial is pretty spot on, if you haven't seen it, google espn rolltide)

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
91. I live on the west coast of Florida and love it.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 10:55 AM
Apr 2013

I travel all over the state. There are so many beautiful places.

Overall:
Some of the most beautiful places in the country/Some of the biggest eyesores in the country.
Some of the most progressive people you can find/Some of the furthest right wing nut jobs you will ever run into.
The area I live in is extremely diverse/The area I live in is highly segregated.
Some of the best food you can find/Some of the worst food you can find.
Canadians love to come down and give us their money/We love them and their money, just not their driving skills.
More retirement communities than you can count/More colleges than you can count.

Florida really has it all. The good and the bad. The bad we do have can often be very extreme.

nolabear

(43,850 posts)
96. What the South is, is big. Nothing is deemed inconsequential.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 01:00 PM
Apr 2013

The people (self included) are emotional in all directions. We hug your neck, cry at the drop of a hat and laugh like utter fools at both tragedy and triumph. A lot of the culture is variations on the theme of trying to cope with huge feelings about life's vicissitudes. Blame somebody, eat or drink something, pick a fight, write a song or a novel, go to church, practice extreme forms of lOve and hate because the weather will kill you, the varmints will bite you, you're either poor or one generation or neighborhood from it and so insecure, and the rest of the country treats you bad. Your people have done awful things and you have to find ways to cope. Those ways encompass the very worst and the very best of humanity.

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
99. I love the South - the food, the music, the slower pace, the lack of snow or bitter cold.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 02:28 PM
Apr 2013

I particularly love the areas around water (Gulf, Atlantic Coast) that tend to be tropical.

There are big problems with poverty, racism, classism - that just can't be denied. But when you spend time with individuals, it tends to fade away.

If you really want to experience it, I highly recommend a road trip completely off highways. Eat at local places. Sleep at mom & pop motels. Go to local festivals or musical events.

Orlando and Branson are not representative of the south, imo, as they are set up for tourists. I don't know about Longview, but many (including those that live there), don't consider Texas the *south*.

Ganja Ninja

(15,953 posts)
100. Once you get outside the urban areas it's just like the north with one exception.
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 02:39 PM
Apr 2013

Like the north once you get outside the cities it's full of rednecks but unlike the north there are some blacks that live in the country too.

And I'm originally from Michigan.

 

coldmountain

(802 posts)
101. Most of the South is very anti-intellectual, this is just a fact
Mon Apr 15, 2013, 03:51 PM
Apr 2013

It's so anti-intellectual it has distorted our nation. Just compare education spending and results with the rest of the nation. If it weren't for sports, they wouldn't even have schools. Go over to Statemaster, they got dozens of education comparisons and the South does bad in all them. Surely if they put the effort into education that they do in football, they wouldn't be last in everything.

ww.statemaster.com/graph/edu_per_of_peo_who_hav_com_hig_sch_inc_equ-completed-high-school-including-equivalency

They won't admit the Civil War was about slavery and them losing was good for mankind. Until the South does that, it will lag the rest of the world because all that luggage is slowing them down.

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