General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSo, did anyone in Watertown refuse police entry into their home? If so, what happened?
Last edited Sun Apr 21, 2013, 01:12 PM - Edit history (3)
I would think this would be the question the civil libertarians would be asking, but I haven't heard anything about this.
Update - I now have the answer to that question - wow.
I can't be certain of the date, but this is Watertown, Mass. - 14 Oak Street, to be exact, which was definitely within the police perimeter. You can verify with Google maps - streetview.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)I didn't hear anything about anyone not letting them search.
LisaL
(44,974 posts)I think everyone complied. So I guess we will never know what would have happened if someone didn't comply.
ProgressiveProfessor
(22,144 posts)A quick look around the outside and they moved on. I looked but could not find it.
I have a friend living nearby but was outside of the cordoned off area. He would have refused, but they never knocked on his door.
There have also not been any reports of homes being forcibly entered. That should have made the media had it been done.
Bay Boy
(1,689 posts)...I wouldn't be too excited about a warrantless search happening in my domicile, no matter how badly I wanted this guy caught.
former9thward
(32,077 posts)1) In an operation like this the police could care less about a grow operation. 2) Even if they did any evidence would be tossed because it was obtained without a warrant.
treestar
(82,383 posts)If there are going to be any prosecutions coming out of it.
Bay Boy
(1,689 posts)but, in my hypothetical situation, I wouldn't know what the police 'could care less about' and wouldn't be aware that the info would be tossed because of the lack of a warrant. And even if I did know this two things I would fully expect they would make a little mental note of the activity for future reference.
Mariana
(14,860 posts)and destroy all traces of it. The cops may not bother you about it now, but they may very well take notes for future reference. You'd always be wondering when they might start scrounging around for enough new evidence to get a warrant to search your place.
Dreamer Tatum
(10,926 posts)noted.
Bay Boy
(1,689 posts)...I don't have anything illegal in my home, just throwing something out to discuss.
The Straight Story
(48,121 posts)63 pot places shut down the other day by feds in CA with nothing better to do.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)A grow operation, even just a closet with a couple of plants will put you away for a long, long time some places.
TeamPooka
(24,254 posts)vis a vis the public good.
Almost any hypothetical individual with a grow room, a lot of drugs (for sale), a body in the basement or a house full of stolen goods etc would care most about their personal well being in that situation versus essentially offering to go to jail because the police were looking for a terrorist.
And just because they don't have a warrant today doesn't mean they won't be back with "probable cause" that leads to a warrant tomorrow.
.
nessa
(317 posts)Assuming it's accurate...
reformist2
(9,841 posts)I would have been really upset if that had been my house. I have two small dogs, one of which doesn't not take kindly to strangers coming into her home. If I was not allowed to corral them first I would be so afraid that they cops would have shot my dogs.
dballance
(5,756 posts)However, in this particular event, unless you had a meth lab or grow lights and a pot farm in your basement they were so focused on finding the suspect I doubt much of anything would come from minor stuff. Stuff on other occasions they might bust people for. Like the smell of pot leading to search for pot in the residence for instance.
Poll_Blind
(23,864 posts)PB
egduj
(805 posts)It made them feel all safe and comfy.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)The "hot pursuit" exemption holds that police do not need a warrant.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)It can be you. What if the suspect was hiding near me is how I'd look at it.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)They had already been through his home, I presume since he only lived a few blocks from where the initial shootout happened in Watertown.
treestar
(82,383 posts)You clear one house, the suspect can go in there. Not like he's not moving.
And indeed they did not find him that way. It was the blood that the boat owner saw.
westerebus
(2,976 posts)they had probable cause...hot pursuit of an armed and dangerous person in the immediate area of a shoot out...that's probable cause.
Unless they have someone who saw him go in that house, it's not probable cause, and not exigent circumstances. They need consent or a warrant to search.
westerebus
(2,976 posts)Some one saw them enter a house, that's not a requirement of probable cause, but it would help.
Under the circumstances that a crime had been committed (which it had), that the person(s) suspected of having committed the crime (which they were), was attempting to flee (which they did), and a pursuit was in progress (which it was), did the police have probable cause to search the area for an armed and dangerous person?
You really think a judge is going to say no?
The reality is the definition of probable cause is much broader. The discretion allowed to police in hot pursuit is even broader.
dems_rightnow
(1,956 posts)Wow. Unless they saw the guy run in to a home, it's not a hot pursuit.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)Police need to wait for a 911 call, and then they can barge into that house - and *maybe* a few adjacent ones - without consent. But that's it.
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)had a duty to look for him in a home holding people hostage.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)by all means file a complaint in court, and contact the ACLU.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)If the police feel there is an imminent threat, they can enter without a warrant.
An armed suspect who has already shot two police officers would be considered an imminent threat even by the strictest standards.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)They don't need to see the guy run into the house. Police just need reasonable suspicion that he might be in there. Same goes for evidence that might be destroyed before a search warrant can be obtained.
EC
(12,287 posts)they didn't enter the homes. Just knocked and questioned and searched outside.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)EC
(12,287 posts)It could have been taken at one of the houses where they went for persons of interest we heard about. I didn't see any indication that this is where they were conducting the search.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)EC
(12,287 posts)they do pan to some of the neighborhood and there is no searching like this going on anywhere else...there is something in particular about this house I think. Wouldn't there had been scores of complaints from the people whose houses were searched like this if this is how they went house to house?
LisaL
(44,974 posts)Response to reformist2 (Original post)
Post removed
Xithras
(16,191 posts)Nothing new there.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)baldguy
(36,649 posts)I'm not gonna stand in his way. That's not giving into authoritarianism, that's giving into the survival instinct in my brain stem.
LisaL
(44,974 posts)As a result, Dorner was able to hide right under their nose for days in an empty house.
cliffordu
(30,994 posts)JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)Hard to believe that there aren't DOZENS of videos like it.
I mean given that we're living in a police state and all.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)baldguy
(36,649 posts)Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)Did not hear anything about people giving the cops a hard time.
The house in that video remind me of what they did in hostage situation sometimes when they are not sure who the bad guys are. Bring everyone out with their hands up, frisk, verify and then let them go.
Also there was an issue with a house oak st, I'm trying to remember if it was the basement door open and a possible explosive in the basement or if it the one where a kid in a hoodie ducked back into a basement boor when he saw the cops (he was just out trying to take pictures).
The only people I see having a problem with this is people who don't live here.