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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDoes anyone really think the Tsarneav Brothers...
Last edited Tue Apr 23, 2013, 05:08 PM - Edit history (1)
were connected with islamic terrorists when they couldnt even figure out all the surveillance cameras which would be surrounding the event..
Give me a break... You think the supposed terrorists handlers of these two wouldnt have figured that out... Especially since they wanted to live.
The airport surveillance at the airport on 911 didnt mean a thing... Those guys
considered themselves dead...
Leslie Valley
(310 posts)n/t
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Taverner
(55,476 posts)Even the big, Hollywood ending planned - where they go to NYC and go out with a big bang
El Fuego
(6,502 posts)malaise
(269,187 posts)I lot of foreigners who migrate believe America is what they see on TV and via Hollywood.
Add Borat to that in terms of their self importance and then see their reality.
Stupid fucking morons - Darwin deals with them - pity some of them take innocents with them.
FarCenter
(19,429 posts)Taverner
(55,476 posts)When it came time to face the music, one went out in a "Devil's Rejects" sort of way
And the other, failed suicide and tried to escape on boat - at least 10 miles from water
avebury
(10,952 posts)bulbs in the universe. I think the older brother was just pissed off that his life didn't go the way he thought it should (Golden Glove boxer, US Olympic Boxing team, Gold Medal) and couldn't realize his personal responsibility in trashing his dreams (domestic assault costing him US Citizen). I also think he had issues with authority figures (yelling at the Iman in the Mosque) and nobody was going to tell him what to do, what to think or control him. The older brother had such a controlling personality I just don't see him taking orders from anybody.
The younger brother doesn't come across as much of a leadership type and probably just went along with whatever his brother wanted.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)is hte same reason that consiracy theorists are incorrect.
Criminals cannot keep their mouths shut. They always brag.
The 19 on 9-11 knew they would die. If others were involved, they would have talked.
Criminals are stupid in the first place.
Look at the Lennon killer. He stayed there and wanted the world to know. And now gets all expenses paid for life.(may he never be released on parole).
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)It also sells..
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)remember, I would wager most republican voters are NOT fans of the draconian republican leaders anymore than we are.
They are just trapped.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)I think 30% of all republicans hold favorable feelings towards Tea Bag Philosophy.
I would say at least 40% of all republicans have a strong bias against minorities..
They rob them of their hard earned taxed dime
I also think 85% of them favor a draconian approach to the war on terror.
think they are not as trapped as you think..
True Earthling
(832 posts)both parties were equally guilty of wanting to hang the bombing on their opponents constituents... shameful politicizing of a tragic event that effects all U.S. citizens... using it as a tool for political gain. Shame on anyone from either party who was of that mindset.
I've seen plenty of comments here conjecturing that the bombing was initiated by RW types... now that it is not the case the thinking has shifted to the RW was "praying" for them to be Muslim... no matter who did it the RW was going to connected to the bombing in some nefarious way. The rift in this country will never have a chance to heal as long as either party has distorted views of each other... I'm sick of the demonizing of RW'rs as some kind of sub-human evil who have nothing in common with Dems. If it did turn out to be tea partiers, I'm sure 99.9% of those in the RW would condemn such tactics... there are extremist elements in just about every organization.. RW'ers and Muslims do not have a monopoly on extremism.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Bachmann, West, Gohmert, Peter King, Rick Perry Anti-Science Anti- Choice, anti social equality..I can name you 50 hate radio commentators on the right. I can name maybe 2 on the left...Unless you think you can compare Rachael Maddow to Russ Limbough. Dont get into this argument with me. Youll loose every time..
Dont give me that bullshit about democrats and republicans being the same...
Do you honestly thing that 99% on the right would condemn the bombing of an a
Womans Health Center... Bullshit!
True Earthling
(832 posts)in YOUR mind...because you will always find a way to twist my words like you did here. I didn't say repubs & dems are the same. I said we have some things in common... we are not separate species. I'll leave it at that.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Last edited Tue Apr 23, 2013, 07:16 PM - Edit history (1)
Please tell the things the right wing and the left wing have in common...And besides
Bernie Sanders and Allan Grayson Tell me what other democratic currently elected
politician represents the far ideology..
VOX
(22,976 posts)Most good progressives I know are sick of this as well -- but such diverse issues as women's rights and reproductive rights; racism, LBGT rights and xenophobia; a decent living wage and responsible & ethical behavior by corporations; weapons proliferation and loopholes; universal and affordable healthcare; illegal, immoral and unpopular warfare, etc. -- should ALL have been addressed and corrected by now. But they're not. In fact, they're all arenas of terrible risk, thanks to the continuing efforts of right wingers.
And because of those efforts of right wingers -- who insist that the focus of everything should be first-person singular, instead of a greater good -- people are dead and dying, homeless, jobless, paid less, and live in fear. Anyone who would inflict such pain IS sub-human, in that they cannot or choose not to feel anything positive about their fellow humans.
Which is why, as sick-making as it is, the fight against those who would snuff out the flame of decency and humanity is a never-ending task.
madville
(7,412 posts)The left wing here was hoping they would be right wingers, hundreds of posts in fact.
malaise
(269,187 posts)onenote
(42,768 posts)In communication with? Wouldn't be a shock. Directed and planned? More questionable. But neither the shoe bomber nor the underwear bombmer, both of whom had documented contacts with Al Qaeda were exactly rocket scientists.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)I thought this guy was just a nut case...
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Those guys who carried out the 911 attacks all looked very composed ... Both the Shoe Bomber and Underwear bomber(empty stare) looked out of their fucking minds.. Maybe recruits like the 911 terrorists were more difficult to find after the attack....
El Fuego
(6,502 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)El Fuego
(6,502 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)a little mixed up...as usual..
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Brother Buzz
(36,469 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)probably simply brainwashed.. Like many younger brothers..obviously not to this extent..
wercal
(1,370 posts)The shoe and underwear bombers were fairly hapless - yet they are connected to Al Quaeda.
Some things make me wonder...
- Where did the igniters come from?
- Can one learn to make a cell phone bomb merely by watching Youtube?
- How did the older brother finance his trip to Russia?
- Why did the Russian government 'key in' on the older brother and ask the FBI to check him out? I.E. who/what did he deal with in Russia?
Bottom line, Islamic terrorism doesn't necessarily have to be 'organized'. These two didn't need some sort of authorization from a central authority to wage their own micro-jihad. So no, they might not have necessarily been on the Al Quaeda payroll...
but...
It is only responsible to search out who else these two associated with, and investigate whether or not they were part of a larger group. I'm sure that's happening right now (without your permission I'm afraid).
Now here is the important part: Even if it turns out that these two acted completely alone, it will not mean it was a mistake to investigate further.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)But the issue of right wing politics and right wing media pushing the story that these guys were definitely attached to Al Quaeda makes me ill... Its a right wing wet dream...
I feel 90% sure you wont find a terrorist connection here.
wercal
(1,370 posts)Do you have a link of a politician or media type stating that these two were definitely attached to Al Quaeda?
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Its the right wings media wet dream and to question that is pure ignorance.
wercal
(1,370 posts)You stated that this idea was being spouted by politicians and right wing media.
But the only example of this is a blanket declaration that I should tune in to Fox News?
Come on. Did you really hear it or not?
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)All speculation I guess....
But does Alex Jones insanity count as Terrorism?
wercal
(1,370 posts)But Alex Jones is nutbar factor 6 crazy.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Hope this one of many helps..
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/23/lindsey-graham-enemy-combatant_n_3140078.html
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)dkf
(37,305 posts)He was praying at a mosque notorious for its shootouts with the Russian Government while his father went to a mosque that was more moderate.
If he didn't learn a few things about bombs and other activities I will be pretty surprised.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Keep stoking the fire?? Right Wing loves it..
dkf
(37,305 posts)If he was there to spend time with his family wouldn't he go to the same mosque?
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)What difference does that make..??
Make your point....
Rex
(65,616 posts)I think he hooked up with somebody in Russia, I kinda do feel he had an agenda. The younger one, no idea maybe just following in big brothers footsteps.
Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)Random knuckleheads is what they are.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)I've had thoughts of this afterwards
whathehell
(29,095 posts)So far, those doing the checking say "No".
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Im just making the point that the right wing has been doing their best to link these two guys to Al Qaeda... And it really pisses me off..
If you read some responses to my thread. Some are conflating Democrats to Republicans
on this issue..
whathehell
(29,095 posts)then you don't have to worry about it.
The Right Wing tries all kinds of shit that doesn't conflate with fact.
It doesn't pay to get upset every time they do it, you'll be upset 24/7 and get an ulcer.
After the "Obama was born in Kenya" farce, I knew all bets were off in terms of how far they'd go.
I glanced at the thread, and didn't see the Dem/Repuke analogies, but I'm sure they'll come
up en masse soon enough.
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)Not all bombers are suicide bombers. I think this kids should rot in a jail cell for the rest of his life.
cali
(114,904 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)What's this 'partying' you speak of?
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Credibility... I dont trust any right wing site on these issues..
I have not checked however into this source. It was the first one I linked to.
But I heard it on MSM as well..
http://rollingout.com/culture/dzhokhar-tsarneav-partied-after-boston-marathon-bombing/
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Why do you think it would be all geniuses doing this sort of murder?
Plus, there are as always, 1001 other ways to write the story. The seeming lack of concern for the cameras could be sheer stupidity, could be because their superior told them cameras would be taken out, or that after the explosions they would be spirited away to a safe house. 'Don't worry about being seen, you will vanish in the wind'. So if they had 'handlers' perhaps the handlers lied to them and simply sacrificed them. Perhaps they were told they were one team out of dozens.
Or perhaps they were too stupid to think it through. But being on camera does not instantly mean they were acting alone there are as many reasons as you'd like to explain any action by anyone.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)How did the Handlers know that they would die during the attacks?
When did I say geniuses?
You are really stretching it here... But Ive been wrong before.
jessie04
(1,528 posts)Follow the money...
Where did they get the money for...
Guns
Bullets
Trip to Russia
Rent/Mortgage money
Car
Clothes
College
I don't believe for a minute these 2 idiots acted alone.
still_one
(92,422 posts)square bomber were not the smartest either, and yes they might have had outside contact
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)However right now what do you think the chances are that they did indeed have contact with
an established terrorist organization which is on the map of the CIA..
Ill say 20%.. Whats your number?? must be pretty high if my reasoning is so flawed..
still_one
(92,422 posts)Home, who knows, I don't
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)I've read or heard that they belonged to a group. Sounds like they were wannabees.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)of terroist videos and sites.
I haven't heard tht they have been linked with any terrorist group. They were so stupid that it seems as if they were acting on their own. As I said...they were wannabees.
Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)Did they had ever had any contacts with any outside groups or individuals that might be called Islamist terrorist? It is possible. In fact just as most Irish Catholics would have known people connected with the IRA or Sinn Fein it is reasonably probable that most or many Chechens would have known people connected with militant Chechen separatist groups - some of which would be of Islamist fundamentalist in nature. But so far there is no evidence whatsoever that any groups or even any individuals participated with them in anyway whatsoever regarding the Boston Marathon attacks.