Women in Egypt stand strong against 'sexual terrorism'

[BainsBane]

The Muslim world DOES have active feminist groups. Here is one recent example.

"Faced with a spike in sexual violence against female protesters, Egyptian women are overcoming stigma and recounting painful testimonies to force silent authorities and a reticent society to confront "sexual terrorism." . . .

"We are not victims, we are revolutionaries. What happened to us has made us stronger and we will continue" to take to the streets, said activist Aida al-Kashef. . . .

"These attacks aim to exclude women from public life and punish them for participating in political activism and demonstrations. They are also an attempt to ruin the image of Tahrir Square and demonstrators in general," said the group. . .

"We do not want to use the term 'harassment.' What is happening today is sexual terrorism," said Inas Mekkawy, a women's rights activist with the group Baheya."

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/2013/03/06/Women-in-Egypt-stand-strong-against-sexual-terrorism-.html

[BainsBane]

1. How about we give some credit to women working to improve

their lives and their society?

[Turborama]

2. K&R Same minimal response when I posted about Mona Eltahawy's sexual assault in Egyptian detention

Well, it was a bit better: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x5069852

This OP went down well during the revolution, though: http://election.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x306505

The pics aren't on the OP now probably to FB messing about with urls (some good ones in the thread itself, though) but they are still here: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.493689677675.268523.586357675

A couple of my faves..







And there's this: http://www.egyptianwomen.info/

I'll try and find another thread I did about Libyan women during their revolution ...

[BainsBane]

5. Thanks for providing this

That's one tough woman!

[Luminous Animal]

27. But but that woman is wearing a scarf! Until she removes it she is a victim of Islam!

[BainsBane]

38. In the other thread

someone said that Egyptian women are too oppressed to truly protest, that unlike us they don't know what protest is. They just brought down a fucking dictatorship, but they don't really protest.

[bettyellen]

37. Loved these pics, thanks for reposting them.

[riderinthestorm]

3. Big K&R

Last edited Fri May 3, 2013, 05:14 PM - Edit history (1)

Edited to add why would you feel it necessary to make such a point that the Muslim world DOES have women protesters/feminist groups?

Has anyone said that there aren't any? You seem to be presuming that DUers aren't aware of, or are disputing, this fact?

[BainsBane]

7. Many

[riderinthestorm]

9. Can you please provide links where DUers deny that there are Muslim feminist groups? Thanks! nt

[Luminous Animal]

23. I've been told that by DUers but rules say we are not allowed to call them out.

I've also been told that, if they exist, they are not "real" feminists. Which I translated to mean they don't follow a western feminist tradition.

Muslim feminists need our respect to forge their own path. They need our respectful acknowledgment that they understand their culture far far better than western feminists do. Western feminists who are interested in supporting feminists in the Muslim world need to ask one simple question:

"What can we do for you?"

[riderinthestorm]

24. Just provide links then. Should be easy since there are "many" DUers who deny the presence of Muslim

feminist activists that you and Bains Bane are aware of...

That's not calling anyone out - that's simply linking.

Of course Muslim feminists need our respect. Are you also implying that DUer's don't respect Muslim feminists?

I'd love links to THAT as well if you think that's the case....

[Luminous Animal]

25. Links are as good as calling them out.

With Meta gone, I will not risk the hide. SOME Duers don't respect Muslim feminists. SOME DUers have flat out said that they don't exist.

[riderinthestorm]

26. Nope. Not true. Its documented facts and not calling them out by name. Just link the threads. nt

[Luminous Animal]

28. Um, no because it has happened to me. With juries, you take your chances.

I choose my chances carefully.

[riderinthestorm]

31. Noted. You got nothing. Thanks for smearing DUers without proof. nt

[Luminous Animal]

34. Thank you for not doing your own research and trying to push me

into a position of having a post hidden.

Google is your friend.

[riderinthestorm]

45. If you say it as a fact, you should provide proof when asked for a link

its not my job to substantiate YOUR claim.

Prove it or I will believe its false.

[BainsBane]

39. You can read the last thread

where you were so genteel toward me. Near the top of that thread.

[riderinthestorm]

46. I have no idea what you are talking about. Prove it with the "many" links you must have

to demonstrate that "many" DUers don't' believe there are Muslim feminist groups.

[BainsBane]

47. I told you where one example was

If you don't have enough initiative to consult it, you obviously don't care. Others have told you they have seen similar posts. Pick your fights elsewhere.

[riderinthestorm]

48. You got nothing. Clearly. Put up or shut up. I have no idea what you are talking about

or where to find your link.

If you don't have any proof of your claims you got nothing. I am asking for a link to a thread, hell the multiple threads that demonstrate "many" DUers believe there aren't Muslim feminist groups. You or Luminous Animal don't have to name names. Just link the threads. Doing that won't be banned.

Its another lie Bains Bane. More baiting of good DUers with lies.

I presume this will also be put to a jury. I hope you all understand the vague smears against good DUers with no backup.... Its detrimental to respectful discussion.

See the thing is I DO care. I care enough that I require you to back up your statements with real proof.

Put up or shut up about good DUers who simply don't agree with you.'

[BainsBane]

54. You are the one looking for call outs

Despite being told where you could find examples. And you again insult me, ironically while saying something is detrimental to respectful discussion. If you want a respectful conversation, don't call someone a liar or a drunk. Stick to the subject matter.

[redqueen]

4. K&R! I love that she calls it terrorism, not harassment. Reminds me of this quote:

"As long as some men use force to subjugate females, all men need not. The knowledge that some men do suffices to threaten all women."
Marilyn French

[BainsBane]

6. Sexual terrorism is a perfect description

especially for what happens to the young girls raped and then shamed via social media.

[redqueen]

36. And for girls in general.

http://www.gotstared.at/blog/op-ed/touched-and-ached-for-life/

[Aerows]

11. Exactly what it is

And your quote is a perfect description of why it is.

[Warren DeMontague]

8. Good for them.

I wish them luck and success.

[Gravitycollapse]

10. Let them channel Solanas and Bobbitt

[Aerows]

12. Oh please

Just because some woman somewhere exacted violence on a man doesn't excuse sexual violence to any woman anywhere. Get a goddamn grip. It isn't about a desire for vengeance, it's a desire for vengeance to not even be necessary because violence never took place in the first place!

[Gravitycollapse]

13. I think you're confused. My post was not a joke.

[Aerows]

14. Violence produces more violence

Understanding produces more understanding.

[Gravitycollapse]

15. There are many in the world who do not respond to "understanding."

That's the cold reality of life.

If men want to exert their pitiful power over women through violence, let them be smashed with violence.

[Aerows]

16. Okay

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough, because I agree. I don't see self-defense as violence, I see it as survival. I have the opinion that self-defense is a right of everyone, and I make sure I can always do so, and surround myself with people that want to defend themselves and their friends.

[Bonobo]

17. So not ALL voices are silenced. Just most.

You seem to want to think that because the statement was made that "Their problems need to be given voice" was made by outsiders, that that is equivalent to saying that "No Muslim has a voice".

It is a false equivalency that you have to come to treat like a Gospel truth.

It is a straw man held together by twine.

If your position is that no one from outside a particular group can ever protest the internal problems visible from the outside within said group, then you are clinging tenaciously to a stupid position.

[Aerows]

18. I think

that you both argue about something you aren't a part of, and take your opinions into the argument with you without realizing that you both probably agree on a level in that you want to be civilized.

Now what civilized means, that could be a completely different story, but dismissing other opinions without thinking them through first, is also the dismissal of civility.

[Bonobo]

20. For some, the issue is tangential.

Some here really want to say:

"Men only care about women's rights if they get to see tits."

Some here really want to say:

"Men in the West are pigs that are happy to criticize sexism in other countries without being willing to recognize it in their own culture."

Some here want to say:

"Patriarchy and Imperialism are two sides of the same coin!"

Some are using issues to create strawmen to fight their own proxy wars.

That is what gives this a personal grudge feel to it. It is the lack of honesty. And yes, REASONABLE people would agree that there are many Islamic sub-cultutres where women's rights are trodden and REASONABLE people would agree that other women around the world have the right to make an issue out of it (even by flashing for attention).

[Aerows]

22. A grudge only lasts

as long as one person holds on to it.

The person that let go is free of it.

[BainsBane]

32. Try to remember

that everything is not about you.

[Bonobo]

33. Thanks, I try everyday. nt

[Gravitycollapse]

19. "So not ALL voices are silenced. Just most." - That could be said of essentially any state.

Not the least of which is the United States.

[Bonobo]

21. I absolutely agree. nt

[Rest In Peace Repubs]

29. Lets not forget......

these "PIGS" in Egypt have no problem raping women,even and especially foreign women,ie Lara Logan CBS News Corp, Has nothing to do with Islam But upbring.Pig is a pig even when Shir ia is involved !!!!

[Rest In Peace Repubs]

30. I 'm absolutely sure...

Mohamed (The Great Prophet)never rape any young girls he bought.

[Comrade Grumpy]

40. That's a really helpful post. Are you sure you're not lost?

[BainsBane]

44. And then

a jury let them post stand.

[War Horse]

41. Geller's Atlas Shrugs blog is that way -->

[BainsBane]

42. Sometimes it's hard to tell

which site one is on. BTW, I alerted on that poster's second post and a jury allowed it to stand.

[Liberal_in_LA]

43. k&r

[randome]

49. Any protest against the ruling patriarchy should be supported and encouraged.

It's not up to anyone to say a protest is not done the correct way so I'm not sure what kind of point you are trying to make here.

That sometimes protest comes from within? Um, okay. I support these women just as I support anyone outside the Muslim world who wants to point out discrimination.

Most of the posts in this thread so far seem to be about arguing with other DUers.

[BainsBane]

50. the point I'm trying to make

is that there are feminists in Egypt and other Muslim countries actively involved in improving their lives. Why should that disturb you?

[randome]

52. It doesn't disturb me. I think you're looking for an argument.

[Gravitycollapse]

53. Uhhh...you clearly are the one looking for an argument.

[ismnotwasm]

51. K&R