In Case You Missed This... And... Thank You Eugene Robinson - WaPo

[WillyT]

Obama administration mistakes journalism for espionage
Eugene Robinson - WaPo
May 20, 2013

<snip>

The Obama administration has no business rummaging through journalists’ phone records, perusing their e-mails and tracking their movements in an attempt to keep them from gathering news. This heavy-handed business isn’t chilling, it’s just plain cold.

It also may well be unconstitutional. In my reading, the First Amendment prohibition against “abridging the freedom . . . of the press” should rule out secretly obtaining two months’ worth of the personal and professional phone records of Associated Press reporters and editors, including calls to and from the main AP phone number at the House press gallery in the Capitol. Yet this is what the Justice Department did.

The unwarranted snooping, which was revealed last week, would be troubling enough if it were an isolated incident. But it is part of a pattern that threatens to redefine investigative reporting as criminal behavior.

And this...

If this had been the view of prior administrations, surely Bob Woodward would be a lifer in some federal prison. The cell next door might be occupied by my Post colleague Dana Priest, who disclosed the CIA’s network of secret prisons. Or by the New York Times’ James Risen and Eric Lichtblau, who revealed the National Security Agency’s eavesdropping program.

<snip>

More: http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/eugene-robinson-obama-administration-mistakes-news-for-espionage/2013/05/20/0cf398e8-c17e-11e2-8bd8-2788030e6b44_story.html

[ProSense]

1. Actually,

"In Case You Missed This... And... Thank You Eugene Robinson - WaPo"

...I didn't miss it (http://sync.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2875041), and everyone should stop making excuses for Fox hacks.

CONFIRMED: Fox News Hack James Rosen Is A Political Operative, Not A Journalist
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022897356

[WillyT]

2. Dear ProSense... It Ain't About Fox News... It's About The First Amendment...

I'm sure it PAINS most journalists to have to come to the defense of Fox News... but in reality...

They are coming to the defense of their entire profession.

And a journalist being a political operative is nothing new.

What IS new... is this Administration's behavior.

And NOT the kind of CHANGE most of us voted for.

Plus...

Comfort the afflicted, and afflict the comfortable.

- Finley Peter Dunne

[ProSense]

3. No,

"Dear ProSense... It Ain't About Fox News... It's About The First Amendment..."

...it "ain't about" the First Amendment, it's about Fox hacks: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022897356



Fox News Is a Terrible Advocate for Freedom of the Press
http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2013/05/fox-news-terrible-advocate-freedom-press/65419/

[WillyT]

13. Gotta Admit... I Admire Your Pluck...

[Number23]

31. Heh. I was wondering if you'd seen that Atlantic piece. Puts everything in perspective.

[jeff47]

11. No, this really isn't new.

Nor are the press in danger of imprisonment. Aside from their role as press, they haven't broken any laws.

If you ask someone with a security clearance for classified information and they give it to you, you haven't broken any laws. They have.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

6. That

Doesn't change the fact that spying, with the intent of imprisonment, against one of America's most hearled institutions, our press (and fox wasn't the only one - FYI), considered part of the bedrock of freedom, won't sit well with many Americans.

hopefully, this will serve as a much needed wake up call for our leaders.

[ProSense]

7. That

"Doesn't change the fact that spying, with the intent of imprisonment, against one of America's most hearled institutions, our press (and fox wasn't the only one - FYI), considered part of the bedrock of freedom, won't sit well with many Americans. "

...was completely fact-free and hilarious.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022897356

[WillyT]

8. You Said... "fact-free and hilarious"... REALLY... You Think The Diminution Of The 1st Amendment Is

hilarious ???

Well I certainly don't.



I know you feel the need to protect our President... but he's a grown up... he can take it.

In fact... he sort of said so yesterday.

[ProSense]

10. Well,

"You Said... 'fact-free and hilarious'... REALLY... You Think The Diminution Of The 1st Amendment Is hilarious ???"

...let me put this in front of you:



CONFIRMED: Fox News Hack James Rosen Is A Political Operative, Not A Journalist http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022897356

Yes, I said "hilarious," and frankly I'm not buying the faux outrage.

[WillyT]

18. You Did That Already... I Got It The First Time... Why Are You Hijacking This Thread ???

[kentuck]

28. I just do not see the evil that you see in the highlighted text??

It proves nothing, imo.

[woo me with science]

35. I am frankly shocked that Prosense would link to the "Corpsenews" thread,

in which her attempts to argue this nonsense were thoroughly discredited.

I encourage everyone to read through the longest subthread.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022897356

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

14. Well, that's

Your MO.

Don't address the content, "hey, look over there..."

Distract from the issue raised.

[sabrina 1]

37. You don't seem to understand. The 1st Amendment should be defended no matter

who is involved. Even a political hack should be free from government spying. If they want to go after Fox, I'm all for it. Sue them for lying to the public, for defamation and investigate Murdoch for the crimes HE is suspected of, ie, HIS spying on people who had a right to privacy.

But none of this should ever be done by government spying. And we are tested the most regarding our commitment to the 1st Amendment when we find ourselves defending IT because some political hack became a target.

It is NOT about any one reporter or political hack posing as a reporter, it is about the very dangerous practice of the government spying on the press.

This administration has gone after whistle blowers more than any other that I am aware of in recent times. That has had a chilling effect on the public's right to know.

You defend these practices if you wish, but don't expect others to look the other way simply because it is our party doing something wrong, IF they did wrong. If the Bush administration had been spying on Media Matters eg, the Left, including you I believe, would have been screaming, while the other side would have claimed that MM are just 'political hacks' paid for by Soros.

So no, it is not about Fox, or any individual. It is about whether or not our own government is spying on the press. That would be a total violation of their oaths of office.

[woo me with science]

38. Thank you. nt

[Swamp Lover]

9. In that case the DOJ's behavior is even more reprehensible.

If Rosen was working on a story and found a source of classified information, then the age old struggle between the gov't and the press would be understandable. But, if the DOJ is going after political enemies, then heads should roll and people should end up fired, in jail or both!!!

[ProSense]

22. I remember

In that case the DOJ's behavior is even more reprehensible.

If Rosen was working on a story and found a source of classified information, then the age old struggle between the gov't and the press would be understandable. But, if the DOJ is going after political enemies, then heads should roll and people should end up fired, in jail or both!!!

...all the cries about how Fox Noise is a propaganda outlet, some demanding that the FCC pull its license, it's fascinating that anyone is defending one of its hacks, who had a clear purpose to disrupt for personal and political gain. The claim that the DOJ was "going after political enemies" is utter nonsense. That is the red herring that makes the criticism of a legal search warrant bogus.

Rosen was seeking out classified information for personal and political gain. The target for prosecution is Kim. Leaking classified information is illegal, and if you get caught up in the leak of such information, you can expect to be held accountable.

I also don't buy into the notion that anyone is shocked that reporters become targets during a criminal investigation into the leak of classified information.

Fox News Is a Terrible Advocate for Freedom of the Press

And, in fact, Fox News has, since 2008, had someone on the payroll who understands the perils for journalists once prosecutors begin hunting for leaks: Judith Miller, the ex-New York Times correspondent who went to prison in 2005 rather than give up her sources during the investigation into the leak of the classified identity of Valerie Plame, wife of Iraq war critic Joe Wilson. She went on air to address the White House leaks matter last summer, and while, not exactly dissenting from the consensus Fox News view that people should go to jail over the Sanger book, she wasn't nearly as zealous in her support of a prosecution.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2013/05/fox-news-terrible-advocate-freedom-press/65419/

Reporter Says He First Learned of C.I.A. Operative From Rove
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022850304

This case is more like her Iraq reporting...

The Source of the Trouble

Pulitzer Prize winner Judith Miller’s series of exclusives about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq—courtesy of the now-notorious Ahmad Chalabi—helped the New York Times keep up with the competition and the Bush administration bolster the case for war. How the very same talents that caused her to get the story also caused her to get it wrong.

- more -

http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/media/features/9226/

...and like I said, I wouldn't be surprised if his goal was to attempt to spin us into war. Kim spent the time since 9/11 advising the Bush administation, including Cheney, about the "dangers posed by North Korea": http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022871121

[Swamp Lover]

24. I don't give a tinkers dam who is in the Whitehouse or whose side Fox is on....

...if the weight of the government is brought down on political activists or journalists or just the average Joe, then those of us who are defenders of civil liberties should be alarmed.

As I stated, if Rosen was being investigated becasue he sought out sources of protected information, then let the age old dance between the gov't and journalists (or activists) begin. The DOJ should investigate and Rosen should resist (just as anyone from NY Times, or Mother Jones or Wikileaks would). But if the DOJ was attemptiong to intimidate a political opponenet, then, even though I am on the same side as the administration, I have a problem with the DOJ.

I won't be a hypocrite and support this in one side and then shake my fist at the other side when they do the same thing.

[ProSense]

25. Funny

"I don't give a tinkers dam who is in the Whitehouse or whose side Fox is on...."

...I don't give a damn about Fox hacks, but the hypocrites do.

[Swamp Lover]

30. If you are not interested in supporting civil liberties that protect their side as well as ours...

..you are part of the problem, and not the solution.

[sabrina 1]

43. All of that may be true. And, for all we know the whole thing could have been a Rove plot

as happened with Dan Rather, to lead the DOJ into spying on Rosen, then to turn around and act all moral etc. We KNOW how Fox/Murdoch/Rove work, which is all the more reason to STICK TO PRINCIPLES.

When this administration decided NOT to go after the war criminals and their lying propagandists, when they decided to 'move forward', leaving these criminals free to continue their criminal activities, and I have no doubts about the criminality of the Fox empire, they walked away from the rule of law, they condoned Rove and Bush and Cheney and then thought that these deceivers who invented these policies would not scream and yell if Democrats USED Bush policies.

What WERE they thinking? Did they think that be being nice to War Criminals, THEY would be nice to THEM when they continued policies that should have been condemned and fought from the moment they surfaced??

Now Democrats have walked right into a trap, and it may very well have been set for them, BECAUSE they refused to prosecute the criminals who are out to destroy this country.

Rove must be smiling. As he was when Rather was set up.

And when Assange was set up.

The media in this country is disgraceful. They remained silent when Wikileaks' funding was illegally cut off by the US Government, they should have condemned that illegal, oppressive collusion with the Big Banks, but they didn't.


When you abandon clear principles, you open yourself up to just the kind of trap we are now in.

The Left warned about this IF Democrats continued to utilize Bush policies. No one should be surprised that Rove and Fox would take advantage of that weakness.

[DirkGently]

4. He's right. It is a pattern. And all the excuse-making we're seeing

would simply not occur outside of a transparent motive to defend this administration. This selective crackdown on unsanctioned leaks (and only on the unscanctioned ones) started under Bush, and it's getting worse. This is how government becomes opaque and unaccountable to the citizens.

[ProSense]

5. It couldn't

"He's right. It is a pattern. And all the excuse-making we're seeing would simply not occur outside of a transparent motive to defend this administration. This selective crackdown on unsanctioned leaks (and only on the unscanctioned ones) started under Bush, and it's getting worse. This is how government becomes opaque and unaccountable to the citizens."

...possibly be that the media are defending their own and those jumping on the bandwagon refuse to acknowleged the facts.

Stop the Leaks

By WILLIAM P. BARR, JAMIE S. GORELICK and KENNETH L. WAINSTEIN

<...>

As former Justice Department officials who served in the three administrations preceding President Obama’s, we are worried that the criticism of the decision to subpoena telephone toll records of A.P. journalists in an important leak investigation sends the wrong message to the government officials who are responsible for our national security.

While neither we nor the critics know the circumstances behind the prosecutors’ decision to issue this subpoena, we do know from the government’s public disclosures that the prosecutors were right to investigate this leak vigorously. The leak — which resulted in a May 2012 article by The A.P. about the disruption of a Yemen-based terrorist plot to bomb an airliner — significantly damaged our national security.

<...>

At the time the article was published, there were strong bipartisan calls for the Justice Department to find the leaker. Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. gave that assignment to Ronald C. Machen Jr., the United States attorney for the District of Columbia, who is known for his meticulous and dedicated work. Importantly, his assignment was to identify and prosecute the government official who leaked the sensitive information; it was not to conduct an inquiry into the news organization that published it.

His office, which has an experienced national security team, undertook a methodical and measured investigation. Did prosecutors immediately seek the reporters’ toll records? No. Did they subpoena the reporters to testify or compel them to turn over their notes? No. Rather, according to the Justice Department’s May 14 letter to The A.P., they first interviewed 550 people, presumably those who knew or might have known about the agent, and scoured the documentary record. But after eight months of intensive effort, it appears that they still could not identify the leaker...after pursuing “all reasonable alternative investigative steps,” as required by the department’s regulations — that investigators proposed obtaining telephone toll records (logs of calls made and received) for about 20 phone lines that the leaker might have used in conversations with A.P. journalists...The decision was made at the highest levels of the Justice Department, under longstanding regulations that are well within the boundaries of the Constitution. Having participated in similar decisions, we know that they are made after careful deliberation, because the government does not lightly seek information about a reporter’s work. Along with the obligation to investigate and prosecute government employees who violate their duty to protect operational secrets, Justice Department officials recognize the need to minimize any intrusion into the operations of the free press.

<...>

William P. Barr was the United States attorney general from 1991 to 1993. Jamie S. Gorelick was deputy attorney general from 1994 to 1997. Kenneth L. Wainstein was assistant attorney general for national security from 2006 to 2008.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/21/opinion/stop-the-leaks.html

Reporter Says He First Learned of C.I.A. Operative From Rove
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022850304

Leaks could sink Obama Whitehouse (2012)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022843810

The AP's being investigated by a grand jury for who they coordinated with in Congress over the leak.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022848186

AP Leak ended informant's rare opportunity, why DOJ went after AP records
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022869034



http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022879122

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

12. Stop

"Stop the Leaks" is nothing new in politics... nor is going after the leakers... though improsoning the press is heretofore usually associated with "banana republics".

Hopefully, this doesn't become part of the new normal transformation we've all been enduring since 911.

[ProSense]

15. You have no idea what you're talking about. n/t

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

17. If

you say so?

But apparently more here seem to feel that way about your opinion on this matter.

Another reason why I hang here

[Skittles]

20. that one has a vested interest in protecting EVERYTHING Obama does

that's a "PRO"

[ProSense]

21. Actually,

"that one has a vested interest in protecting EVERYTHING Obama does...that's a "PRO""

..."that one" simply refuses to jump into the echo chamber of silly.

How does it feel in there?

[Skittles]

23. we all know it is more than that

we are not SILLY

[ProSense]

26. If you

"we all know it is more than that we are not SILLY"

...only knew how beyond silly that went, you'd be embarrassed.

[woo me with science]

34. Excellent post.

We ignore the pattern at our peril.



Chilling Legal Memo From Obama DOJ Justifies Assassination of US Citizens
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101654954

Obama seeks longer PATRIOT Act extension than Republicans (December 2013)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x380450

When it comes to civil liberties, apparently Democrats are just as bad as Republicans.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022101960

NSA's Massive New Spy Center to Track Your Emails, Internet Activity, and Phone Calls
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101620852

Obama Quietly Signs Abusive Spy Bill He Once Vowed to Eliminate
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022104861

Obama repeals Magna Carta, asserting powers our forefathers denied to Kings
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101655620

Obama's Memo on Killing Americans Twists 'Imminent Threat' Like Bush
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101654919

Obama no better than Bush when it comes to security vs. civil liberties.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022355307

Obama Admin Seeks Permission TO LIE In Response To FOI Requests - Even To The COURTS
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2185303

NDAA on trial: Obama Administration fights ban on indefinite detention of Americans
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101748688

Obama administration complicit with private prison industry: President Obama's IncarcerNation
http://www.nationofchange.org/president-obama-s-incarcernation-1335274655

Obama, Democrats Push to Make Bush Spying Laws Permanent
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022084702

NDAA, signed by Obama, is a direct attack against legitimate protest and dissent
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022064803

NSA Whistleblower: All Americans under constant surveillance, all info. stored, no matter the post
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002193487; http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021935289

Bipartisan Congress Disgracefully Approves the FISA Warrantless Spying Bill for Five More Years
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022087323

While Public & Media Focused on 2nd Amendment, 5th Amendment Quietly Dismantled
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022390581

How the Obama administration justifies extrajudicial killing of Americans,
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022318187

Judge Says Under Law Executive Branch Can Commit Acts That Sure Do Seem Unconstitutional
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022122464

Obama Justice Dept. says wiretap lawsuit should not proceed
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014337039

NDAA Lawsuit- Hedges v. Obama, The Last Thin Line of Defense
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022357078

Federal authorities step up efforts to license surveillance drones for law enforcement
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022383596

Big Banks and FBI worked together vs Occupy
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022095056]

FBI Investigated 'Occupy' As Possible 'Domestic Terrorism' Threat, Internal Documents Show
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022061578

FBI Documents Reveal Secret Nationwide Occupy Monitoring (Updated the OP)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022057064

Public Buses Across Country Quietly Adding Microphones to Record Passenger Conversations
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021965291

Street artist behind satirical NYPD 'Drone' posters arrested
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021920967

The Obama DOJ urged the Supreme Court's endorsement of strip searches.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002521527

Obama Administration Fights to Allow Warrantless GPS Tracking
http://sync.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1074474

Anonymous to FBI: hey, dudes, maybe you could take a break from...investigating activists....
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022145621

Half a billion dollars for drones to spy on Americans
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021876414

From Bradley Manning to Aaron Swartz -- The Government's Inhumane Persecution of Brave Truth Tellers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022276941

The sight of Army helicopters and the sound of gunfire...on Houston's south side
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022276742

Kiriakou and Stuxnet: the danger of the still-escalating Obama whistleblower war
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022275570

Can the DEA Hide a Surveillance Camera on Your Property?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022237059

Social Media and the Stasi
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021888029

Homeland Security Wants to More Than Double Its Predator Drone Fleet Inside the US, Despite Safety/Privacy Invasions
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014312823

CIA Behind Bizarre Censorship Incident At Alleged 9/11 Plotters’ Gitmo Trial
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022280285

“I Am Wearing My Conviction As A Badge Of Honor.”
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022275128

Meet the Contractors Turning America's Police Into a Paramilitary Force
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12525281

How Secrecy Corrodes Democracy
http://election.democraticunderground.com/101655009

Obama Quietly Issues Ruling Saying It's Legal For The FBI To Break The Law
http://election.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7545687

US Pulls Plug on Iran Cable News (Press TV)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014394770

DHS Watchdog OKs 'Suspicionless' Seizure of Electronic Devices Along Border
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022339091

The Obama administration is aggressively growing private prisons
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022568681

The Obama administration's legal battle against whistleblowers, federal unions
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022672473

Obama administration mistakes journalism for espionage
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022897689

[Skittles]

16. Eugene Robinson reminds me of William Raspberry

I don't say that because they are both African-Americans but more because of a similar writing style - simple and eloquent, easy to digest and not afraid to say it like it is......wonderful columnists (Mr. Raspberry passed away last year).

[WillyT]

19. Me Too...

[tularetom]

27. Actually the part about Bob Woodward being a lifer in federal prison sort of appeals to me

but otherwise I agree with him, this is not something I want any administration to be even thinking about let alone doing.

[kelliekat44]

29. Except. Eugene, it was not an unwarranted investigation. nt

[dsc]

32. I do wonder what these same people's opinion

of Mr. Assange was.

[treestar]

33. How are we supposed to find out who the

Leaker is? Just because peos are reporters they can't ever be investigated? No one is arresting them or stopping th from publishing anything. They are looking f for the crimenal who breached security and shut off opportunities for further infiltration.

[woo me with science]

36. Huge K&R. Thank goodness for principled Democrats.

We are living in very disturbing times, and it is good to see that principle and respect for our fundamental values still outweigh partisanship.

[George Gently]

39. No.

If a "journalist" breaks into my house because he knows I have some info he wants, he will not be prosecuted for publishing the info, but he will be prosecuted FOR BREAKING INTO MY HOUSE.

This nonsense is starting to remind me of the Catholic priest scandal.

The priests "inoculated" themselves by confessing.

Like the news business supposedly "inoculates" itself by publishing.

If these people commit crimes in order to get information, they are subject to criminal prosecution -- just like the rest of us.

[hrmjustin]

40. Welcome to DU my friend!

[George Gently]

41. Good morning and thank you.

[hrmjustin]

42. Your Welcome and we are happy to have you.

[woo me with science]

44. kick