I know prostitutes

[Uzair]

One I met at a strip club and we're good friends. A couple of others I met through her, another I met the old fashioned way.

All of them are in it because they like sex. The money is a side benefit. My friend, she is an office worker by day, a stripper and escort by nights and weekends. She has a bachelors degree and lives a happy, normal life. Her clients are screened, and tend to be middle aged professionals in unhappy marriages.

The other two -her friends- are of similar mind. One has a boyfriend who is ok with what she does. She is in school, working on a masters degree. She told me the money is good and that she enjoys her work. The other is not in college, does not have any plans to go back to school, and is happy with her life as well. She works in a department store and strips and escorts on the side, again because the money is good.

All of them say they wouldn't do it if they didn't enjoy it. They like the sex, sure, but they also like meeting new people, they like the idea that they're fulfilling someone's fantasy, they like the money. They see themselves as professionals, doing a job. They're comfortable with their sexuality and don't care about the prudish views of society at large.

They also acknowledge that there is a dark side to their profession. This dark side, we all agree, comes from the illegality of it: sex slaves, trafficking human beings, child victims, brutal abuses. These victims are not protected by the law. They can't go to the cops because then THEY will be arrested. They live in a society that shames them.

Maybe others here have similar experience with escorts as me, maybe not. I don't know, but this is my anecdote. I haven't ever met a sex worker who was forced into it. I think there are two groups. And I think we all agree that the group of women who are forced against their will into prostitution are victims of rape, plain and simple. I do not deny their existence, nor do I pretend that they are anything but victims here. They are victims of their pumps, but they are also victims of their government, and victims of a puritanical society.

Long story short: it needs to be legalized and legitimized.

[Ohio Joe]

1. This will end well...

[jberryhill]

2. I want the "I Know Prostitutes" T-shirt

[Ohio Joe]

3. ok but... it's all you get

[caseymoz]

133. DUzy nominee! nt

[arely staircase]

10. DUzy

about once a day I read something here that really makes me laugh out loud, not lol. this is one.

[Tien1985]

12. The back should say

"All 3 of them!"

[arely staircase]

18. a actually want jberryhill's laughing cow avatar

on it somewhere.

[Buzz Clik]

26. You're welcome...

[jberryhill]

177. OMG it hurts

Damn the Internet is like magic!

The guys at the NSA are gonna love this!

[BainsBane]

123. second DUzy rec

[BainsBane]

161. Opps

Last edited Fri Jun 7, 2013, 02:10 PM - Edit history (1)

edit, doubled up

[BainsBane]

171. Meanwhile, your son's t-shirt says:

My Dad went to the Bunny Ranch and all I got was this lousy T-shirt

[arely staircase]

14. this is gonna be good

nt

[Chan790]

15. I have a .gif for that!!

[Dorian Gray]

139. Yes....

[Javaman]

162. This thread is proving to be a new classic...

we haven't had one in a while.

[L0oniX]

4. ...

[undeterred]

5. "All of them are in it because they like sex. The money is a side benefit."

[Sheldon Cooper]

6. I know, right?

Hahahahahahahaha!!!

[Skittles]

67. it's hardly amusing

it is downright sickening

[Taverner]

56. I hate to be the one to quote William Burroughs but...

I'll paraphrase - they ARE SO in it for the money

But the money can be very very good

[Squinch]

103. He believed everything they told him. Cause they're working their way through college.

They also think he's the best they ever had. No kidding. They said so.

[cherokeeprogressive]

134. And the biggest?

"I'm the Love Master baby... yeah... I'm as hard as Final Jeopardy baby... I can hold two cups of coffee and a dozen doughnuts right there baby..."

I don't even know why I put that in the post... It's funny as hell though.

[Squinch]

136. Final Jeopardy!

[BainsBane]

117. And what's really funny is he believes that

[undeterred]

7. "they also like meeting new people"

[BlueStreak]

54. Their greatest occupational hazard is a stiff neck, I guess

from all of that pleasant conversation they engage in, looking over their shoulder.

Seriously, this may be the most preposterous premise for a thread I have ever seen.

[undeterred]

78. Because women who want to meet new men and have sex with them

have so few options.

[Capt. Obvious]

9. I know drug addicts

They prostitute themselves because they love drugs. The sex is just a side benefit.

[Sheepshank]

69. and it's likely great fufilling sex...you know, the ones that are theapeutic

wow

[raccoon]

11. Somehow I doubt the veracity of this. nt

[Squinch]

105. Indubitably.

[darkangel218]

13. Youre not worth a hidden post.

[Skittles]

70. he likes paying to fuck women and feels the need to justify it

how's that?

[MineralMan]

16. Just yesterday, you claimed that

there wasn't a man who hadn't paid for sex. When it was pointed out by me and several other men that we had never paid for sex, you did not reply. You said that any man who said he hadn't paid for sex was a liar. I'm not a liar. I have never paid for sex.

Here's what you wrote, with a link to your post:

Seriously, grow the fuck up people. This is so stupid. Legalize prostitution and stop with this idiocy. I don't know a single man who hasn't paid for sex at one time or another. Anybody who says otherwise is lying, kind of like how some people are still so childish as to claim they "never masturbate" or "don't watch porn".

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2946469

Your posts seem all over the place on this issue. Since I haven't read enough of your posts to form any idea of who you are, I'll leave it at that.

[arely staircase]

20. well to be fair, he said he "didn't know" a single man who hadn't

that is possible.

[MineralMan]

23. Only in a very limited circle of acquaintances, I'd guess.

Last edited Wed Jun 5, 2013, 02:25 PM - Edit history (1)

I have a large circle of acquaintances, and only know of a few who have paid for sex.

When I was stationed in Turkey, while in the USAF, there was a perfectly legal brothel not far from the base. I was stationed there for 15 months. Some guys went to the brothel. Most did not. I did not.

[arely staircase]

24. very limited circle of acquaintances

also very possible

[Dorian Gray]

140. I know a lot of men

I have no idea whether they have or have not paid for sex. They don't discuss it.

[Uzair]

88. I don't know what you're getting at

Yeah, yesterday's post is kind of what prompted today's post, in addition to the other numerous threads on the subject. How, exactly, am I "all over the place" on this? Everybody I know has paid for sex at one time in their life. Some of the people I know happen to be escorts. I have related their views on their life choices here.

[MineralMan]

90. Yah, well, you never came back to today's post.

You might want to consider doing that.

I don't care if everyone you know has paid for sex. You did go on to say that anyone who says they didn't is a liar. You don't seem to know the same people the rest of us here know. Think about that.

[MattBaggins]

113. You need to hang out with better people

[grahamhgreen]

160. Judgmental much?

[JustAnotherGen]

102. Thanks for

The clarity on the OP's perspective.

[Kali]

115. I have an idea who that is.

they registered the day after Skinner replied to my inquiry here http://www.democraticunderground.com/12591326

which was also two days after the last post by the person in question and the same time period they changed their sig line to this:

It's been fun, folks. But when the umpire openly declares support for one team on the field - and also decides to publicly play fast, loose, & coy with the batting score as a manifestation of that support - it's time to move on. I wish nothing but the best for you all, friend & foe alike. Take care, stay cool, and drink one for me every once in a while. You folks are the best.

same posting style, same favorite issues - but no sig line! and I have made several suggestions to no avail

[BainsBane]

118. No, it's not

They are very different. All they have in common is a distaste for guns.

[maddezmom]

17. Cool story, bro.

[undeterred]

19. "They are victims of their pumps"

[arely staircase]

21. they should wear more sensible shoes

nt

[undeterred]

22. Shoes for meeting new people.

[arely staircase]

25. i know, right

nt

[msanthrope]

32. Truly trod upon, eh? nt

[Dr. Strange]

61. Pumpin' ain't easy.

Sometimes it sucks.

[Skittles]

72. F***-me pumps?

[pinboy3niner]

76. You know it's hard out here for a pump. nt

[arely staircase]

89. I drive a Cadillac, wear a perm cause I’m a G

Cuz I'm a motherfuckin P-U-M-P

[thucythucy]

79. All the pumps I know

are real heels.

[Dorian Gray]

141. Pumps

are a real danger to women, don'tchaknow.

[Xithras]

27. I doubt you do, but I actually dated one in college.

Your point is partially valid in that it's true that a large portion of prostitutes are there willingly and are not being abused. My ex worked as a high end travelling escort in the SF Bay Area and fully paid her way through UC Berkeley seeing only 2-3 clients a month. She had men fly her all over the world, once spent weeks in the Medditeranean with a client, and she charged for every minute of it. It was her choice, and one that she rabidly defended to the prudes who tried to attack her for it.

But if you think it's not about the money, you are gravely uninformed. I dated her. I met quite a few of the other escorts she worked with during that time. I couldn't count the number of conversations we had about the economics and safety of what they were doing.

Not ONE of them would have been doing what they did if they weren't being paid to do it. Even for high end escorts, the decision to enter that field is primarily economic. They had no problems or complaints about what they did, but they were 100% in it for the money.

[brooklynite]

51. ON the assumption that everyone needs to earn money....

...what wrong with doing something you enjoy?

[Xithras]

53. I have no problem with prostitution

Clearly, I wouldn't have dated her if I did have a problem with it. I don't see any problem with allowing people who wish to voluntarily engage in sex for money to do so. I do advocate for regulation (license them as you would any other commercial enterprise), but I think that anyone who wants to do this for a living should e able to. If someone actually enjoys it, then more power to them.

My comment was directed at the suggestion in the OP that money wasn't a driving factor behind people becoming prostitutes. That assertion is a complete fiction...they are ALL in it for the money. Yes, there are many who actually do enjoy it. Yes, there are many who see themselves as a sort of "therapy" and enjoy the process of making other people feel better. But every one of them does it primarily for the money. There is NOTHING wrong with that, but to claim otherwise is silly.

[Dorian Gray]

142. I agree with you

anyone who buys the line that money has nothing to do with it has bought a whole lot of BS.

[BainsBane]

119. If you think those women are having fulfilling sex with Johns

well, lets just say it's highly unlikely.

[Dorian Gray]

143. And of course there's this

the obvious.

Not even fulfilling sex. Good sex. No way is the majority of sex with a john decent. I'm sure there are exceptions. But no matter what the OP claims the prostitutes tell him, NO WAY!

[Uzair]

92. That's your anecdote, this is mine.

Don't get me wrong, I didn't mean to imply that the money wasn't the primary motivation. But they're not exactly prudish about sex either. They like sex, they like getting paid for sex. If they didn't like sex, they wouldn't do what they do, no matter how much money was involved.

[BainsBane]

120. And you believe you gave her the best orgasm of her life too

They're pros. They are paid to convince you. Don't you watch Game of Thrones?

[caseymoz]

135. Actually . . .

Prostitutes have blogs now. It's easy to check on what he says against the accounts that they give. And no, I don't think they would be able to lie every day in their blogs.

His suggesting that they don't do it for money was just boneheaded, but he acknowledged he made a mistake in saying that.

From what I've seen, there are two kinds of people in sex work. That is those who have no moral objection or queasiness about casual sex to begin with, and even enjoy sex so much that getting paid for it was the next logical step. Think about it. If casual sex doesn't bother a person in any way, why wouldn't the do it for money? It's a no brainer.

The second kind are addicts. They were addicts before they got into the sex trade, or were well on their way, and they needed prostitution to support their habit. They get into it regardless of their moral objections, regardless of their inhibitions. These people should definitely not be in the sex trade.

What they both have in common is, they don't work for free. Oh, they might have friends they have sex with, but regarding guys meet in the same night and have sex with regardless of the chemistry? No. Never. And they keep friends (and family) and clients in separate emotional categories.

[Dorian Gray]

144. You forgot the third kind

one of the most prevalent kind, worldwide: Those who are trafficked into the business.

[caseymoz]

175. My post was about voluntary ones.

But I should have made that clear. Thank you. Of course it's different for slaves.

However, I'll also say they're not a big part of the sex industry. Tragically, it does happen, but it's far from the usual sex worker.

[noiretextatique]

164. it's precisely because there is so much money invovled

that 99.99% of people choose to be prostitutes. are you saying they would do it for free because they enjoy it sooo much? that's your fantasy, and probably that of a many men.

[sufrommich]

168. "If they didn't like sex, they wouldn't do what they do,

no matter how much money was involved."


You're either very naive or trolling for laughs.

[Whisp]

28. .....!

good one! now what is your main act?

[onpatrol98]

154. The Main Act!!!

Now, introducing the main act...

Buffy the bear in a tutu, dancing on top of a ball, while he holds a ring of fire and a whip.

Jump, Buffy! Jump!



Quick, someone cue the clowns...

[geek tragedy]

29. Cool story, goes well with your fairy tale of not knowing

a single man who hasn't paid for sex.

[arely staircase]

33. i think that is quite possibe in this particular case

nt

[geek tragedy]

36. I'm not believing any of it. nt

[FSogol]

30. Uh oh!

[tabasco]

80. Looks kind of like the tranja kid in an episode of Star Trek

Trekkies should remember.

[PDJane]

31. Truthfully, I know a few prostitutes, too.

Most of them are funny, most are under-educated, none of them hate sex, a lot of them both like and dislike men.....like in specific, dislike in general. I met a number of them through the legal profession, which shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. For a while, I lived next door to a prostitute. The reasons that they are prostitutes are as numerous and varied as the people that do the job, and it is a job.

Do I think it should be legalized? Yes, actually, I do.

Legalization would ensure health checks and screenings, allow women to get out from under the thumb of pimps and users, and make the profession safer. It would also ensure that under-age children would have stronger protections, and ensure that the women themselves would help with enforcement. It would also make it harder for police to threaten the women with various repercussions, like removing their children or charging their husband or significant other with living off the avails of prostitution if they didn't comply with whatever the cop wanted at the moment.

It has nothing to do with rose-coloured glasses. Unlike the OP, I've seen the harder, grittier side of the profession, had women crying in my office over whatever shit was coming down the pike at the moment. I've talked to children forced to perform sex acts. I've talked to women with HIV/AIDS because of the profession.

There are ways to fix this, but it means leaving judgement at the door and looking for solutions, and as long as the "My religion says you can't do that" attitude is prevalent, it won't be fixed.

[arely staircase]

34. nice post

I have only known one. A woman who has been a friend since high school and was a high end escort for a while. other than that, just the teevee.

[Laelth]

130. Legalization also means accepting prostitution in your neighborhood.

Because the political will to allow that does not generally exist (prostitution is a NIMBY enterprise), most politicians are happy leaving it illegal.

I take no stand on the legalization issue here, though I have argued in the past for legalization and regulation, but happyslug explains fairly clearly why criminalization is our preferred method of "regulating" the profession in this thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2948817.

-Laelth

[Squinch]

146. That's a very good point made at the link. Thanks for it.

[Laelth]

150. My pleasure. n/t

-Laelth

[caseymoz]

176. Great post.

You've given, I think, an accurate, balanced picture.

I know some people in the sex industry. But sadly, I also know a few who were sexually assaulted by their clients. It seems the business gets more dangerous when the economy turns bad.

And they would have been prevented, or at least preventable if prostitution were legal.

[cbdo2007]

35. I currently work with one in my office....

we all know and you hear whispers when she takes long lunches in super short skirts, but she's really a nice person and doesn't flaunt herself around the office at all. She doesn't seem overly sexual but she does have a disdain for men in general. I don't know...she's just a regular person who has this thing she seems to enjoy doing for the attention and the extra cash, and it allows her to take her kids on really nice vacations and stuff. It's really just not a big deal.

[H2O Man]

37. oh

[siligut]

38. Give my regards to Don Quixote will you?

I agree that it should be legalized.

[Nimajneb Nilknarf]

39. As a worldly 18th Century scholar and diplomat who also has met a few prostitutes, I must say

[hedgehog]

42. Scholar of the 18th century, or scholar from the 18th Century?

[Nimajneb Nilknarf]

44. Please refer to my Journal. I introduced myself a couple of weeks ago.

[hedgehog]

47. Welcome and make yourself at home.

[Nimajneb Nilknarf]

48. Thank you, sir!

[hedgehog]

50. Well, it's ma'am, but you're welcome!

[Nimajneb Nilknarf]

63. Oops, I assumed your moniker was a reference to adult film star Ron Jeremy.

[hedgehog]

68. Oh, my!

[arely staircase]

91. you are posting from the 18th century?

nt

[sufrommich]

167. He's Benjamin Franklin, of course he is. nt

[riderinthestorm]

40. Can you explain how legalizing prostitution means no more sex slaves, trafficking or child abuse?

Furthermore, can you also explain how a child prostitute would be arrested?

I don't recall Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus, or Michelle Knight being arrested either for being held as 'sex slaves". Did I miss something?


I'm not even going to try to get into the rest of your OP... just simply not worth it.

[PDJane]

41. Is that aimed at me, or at Uzair?

[riderinthestorm]

74. Oops!! Uzair...

My bad. I should never try to post when I'm in a hurry.

[Major Nikon]

84. Can you explain how the reverse is true?

[riderinthestorm]

87. The question is for Uzair, based upon statements in his OP.

Beyond that I am utterly uninterested in getting into a fight about prostitution today.

[Major Nikon]

95. And my question is for you based on your response

I neither asked for a fight or care to have one. Your intentions may be different.

Your question appears to assume the dichotomy that prostitution should be either all illegal or all legal, when there are many other choices available.

[riderinthestorm]

98. Well it doesn't assume anything. Its simply a question for Uzair based on his statement.

Asking how legalizing prostitution will stop the other stuff that's all.

FWIW, I don't believe it should be illegal. The laws should be changed asap especially in light of for-profit prisons. Stuffing a for-profit prison with non-violent "offenders" like prostitutes would be their dream wouldn't it?

Most prostitutes need other help than prison.

I just don't believe it does any good trying to portray legalization as some kind of "fix" for all sex crimes.

[Major Nikon]

100. I think some sort of legalization scheme has to be part of reform

Underage prostitution, trafficking, and human slavery can and should be a part of enforcement, but I just don't see how you get there if all prostitution is forced underground. It only makes it harder to differentiate between what is consensual and what isn't.

I don't think the "fix" is to make it all legal and then hope it gets better. I think the fix is going to involve ample regulation of what is to be legalized and ample enforcement of what should remain illegal. As far as helping prostitutes go, I'm not sure even most want that. For the most part they seem to want to be left alone. I think their input should be valued for whatever reform measures are implemented.

Honestly I don't think meaningful reform stands much of a chance in the US. There are too many who would want it to fail for what amounts to puritanical reasoning.

[jazzimov]

110. I'm not uzair, but if I may he NEVER said any of that!

What he said was:

They also acknowledge that there is a dark side to their profession. This dark side, we all agree, comes from the illegality of it: sex slaves, trafficking human beings, child victims, brutal abuses. These victims are not protected by the law. They can't go to the cops because then THEY will be arrested. They live in a society that shames them.

uzair never said legalization would eliminate any of these.

That being said, I could argue that it would greatly reduce some of it. Under the current laws, if a prostitute is abused she is reticent to go to the police for fear that she would be arrested. If we legalized and regulated prostitution, then that would be greatly reduced.

In a way, it is legalized if a person registers as a "sex therapist". Perhaps we should simply expand and simplify these requirements.

Some people still have fantasies about owning a "sex slave", and some will still have fantasies about children. However, if we can separate these perverts from people who do not fall into these categories, then we have the resources to focus on those particular issues.

[backscatter712]

174. Can you explain how banning drugs has led to an end of drug abuse and trafficking? n/t

[In_The_Wind]

43. Hello ~ Uzair

You have a lot to learn about this topic. [img][/img]

[Capt. Obvious]

45. K&R

Why isn't this at the top of the Greatest Page?

[arely staircase]

46. Senator, I served with prostitutes. I knew prostitutes. Prostitutes were friends of mine.

Senator, you're no prostitute!

[BainsBane]

121. DUzy!

[MADem]

179. I thought they all were...and the Hill was just one big brothel...! nt

[hedgehog]

49. When the prostitutes you know told you all this,

were they on the clock?

[dlwickham]

52. did you misspell clock

sorry couldn't resist

[Aerows]

55. Interesting narrative

sibling.

[MindPilot]

57. You have failed the DU purity test.

You posted poorly. I'm sorry.


DU Rule 203.89.34-45 Porn & Prostitution: The idea or suggestion that any woman who participates in porn or prostitution does so of their own free will is prohibited. (The aforementioned shall not apply to porn or prostitution involving homosexual men.)

[lunasun]

104. it can be so Mao like here

[Taverner]

58. Legalize and regulate because they ARE in it for the money

And all jobs deserve regulation, protection and representation

[Gormy Cuss]

59. Funny, I've never met a prostitute who wasn't forced into it by economic circumstances,

or addiction. Now I know there are some who do go into the profession voluntarily, I've just never met one.

The ones I've met were doing it out of necessity. They were feeding an addiction (their own or their partner's) or looking for some cash to pay the bills because they couldn't make enough to stay housed and clothe their kids without it. Not a one of them said they were doing it because they liked sex. It was just something they could do to make money. None of the addicts still turned tricks after becoming sober.

But hey, I grew up in a very low income community. Things are different there.

[HiPointDem]

77. and on the high end they're not 'forced,' but it's one of the few ways to make big money that's

relatively easy to get into, with low start-up costs.

again, the motivation is economic.

nobody goes into prostitution because they like sex. if you like sex, it's easy enough to find partners.

[cbdo2007]

82. not cause they like sex...but because they like the attention.

I mentioned above that I currently work with an "escort" at my normal insurance office job....she doesn't really need the money, nor does she really have any other vices or addictions she is needing money for, but you can tell she is starved for attention and has the attitude that "if someone will pay you a few hundred bucks to have sex with you, it's the ultimate compliment".

[HiPointDem]

83. so your friend is attractive enough that people will pay her a couple of hundred for sex but she's

starved for attention?

something wrong with this story.

she doesn't *need* the money is not synonymous with she doesn't *want* the money.

[lumberjack_jeff]

106. I know lots of people who are "forced" into commercial fishing by economic circumstance.

I'm not sure that rational economic behavior is necessarily a good metric. What would the prostitutes you've met have done for a living without a market for sex?

I have no doubt that transacting in an underground economy tends to promote the use of the products sold there.

[Gormy Cuss]

107. Really? The fishermen I know all did it because it was family/local tradition or

just because it paid better than land based jobs that they also could have taken, like day labor and low skill construction trades.
When I say 'forced' I'm talking about couldn't get another job because of lack of education, training, job experience,child care, or in the case of addicts, lack of ability to focus on anything but their habits.

To repeat: I'm talking actually could not get a legit job, not just opting for the higher paying more dangerous job.

[lumberjack_jeff]

108. "just because it paid better than (the) jobs that they also could have taken"

To my mind, you haven't clearly established a difference.

I think that in general, people make choices for a variety of smart and dumb reasons.

Undoubtedly, drug addicts have fewer job options, and in those careers, cling to the lowest rungs. Nevertheless, their choices in one realm constrain the universe of choices in other realms.

[Gormy Cuss]

116. Yeah, their choices like addiction or having kids with men who died.

I'll repeat: the difference is these were people who could not get legit employment, not ones who chose to take a higher risk job for better pay.

[bowens43]

129. Funny , I have never met a person with a job wasn't forced into it by economic circumstances.

what a silly argument, of course they do it for the money.

[Gormy Cuss]

131. Not according to some on this thread. n/t

[unblock]

60. the vast majority of people who merely "like sex" don't become prostitutes.

even people who crave sex usually don't become prostitutes. the vast majority of people capable of becoming prostitutes are likely also capable of getting plenty of sex without charging for it.

the key difference is the money, so it's rather disingenuous to dismiss the money as a mere "side benefit".


i had a psychiatrist a long time ago for a while after a severe car accident (for ptsd/depression while i was recovering physically). at some point, chit-chatting at the end of a session, he mentioned that a lot of his other patients were prostitutes. in fact he said "thank heaven for hookers" because he loved having them as patients, they were entertaining; their troubles were challenging; and they were good for business, they always were able to pay their bills.

granted his perspective is a bit skewed as he only sees the self-selecting prostitutes that choose therapy, but he said, "most prostitutes have deep-seated problems well before getting into the business, but if they didn't before, they soon develop them." i rather suspect that much of the latter arises from its criminalization and the fact that this enables others to take advantage of them.

i tend to agree that decriminalization and regulation would be at the base of a much better public policy in this area, i don't think we can be dismissive of the psychological aspects, which are for the most part problematic. becoming a prostitute is usually not simply a matter of a calm, rational, unpressured, objective career decision.

[Yavin4]

62. Do you also know where they go?

A little inside joke for you "A Dance with Dragons" readers.

[shawn703]

64. Choose your response carefully

If asked that question and someone is pointing a crossbow at you.

[LadyHawkAZ]

65. Escorts are the closest thing to legalized work

as you can get in an illegal environment. It's a completely different world from street work. I knew a couple of workers from the Pahrump brothels who had something of the same attitude as you describe, but it's not the norm for outdoor workers. The element of safety matters a lot to a person's mindset.

I've never known any that did it for the sex. It's never sex while you're at work. It's work. You're there to provide a service; there can be an element of fun to the new experiences, but it's not sex the way sex is when you're off duty. Even I didn't think like that, and I have about as healthy a sex drive as a person can get. I can count the number of times I got off on the job on one hand and have fingers left over. If that's what your friends are doing, they're a rarity, not the norm.

On the whole I agree with you, but it's not a great idea to think that the pleasure your friends take in their job is a universal experience. Your average worker sees their job the same way your average waitress does: it's a living.

[sinkingfeeling]

66. Let us know how their lives turned out in about 20-30 years. I guess none of your

friends are concerned with their personal safety or long-term health.

[DeSwiss]

71. The government needs to stay the fuck out of people's bedrooms. - :-/ K&R n/t

[quakerboy]

81. Not if those people are having sex with kids in their bedrooms

By and large I agree with you. Anything between consenting adults should not be subject to government, even those things I might find personally baffling or distasteful. But a bedroom is not a magic protection for doing things to those who don't want to participate, free of coercion.

[sibelian]

73. You will have noticed that several here have responded to you as if their position is "consensus".

You will find that interesting, I'm sure.

[HiPointDem]

75. "All of them are in it because they like sex" = garbage.

[napoleon_in_rags]

127. "None of them are in it because they like sex" = garbage

That's the talking point I've heard floating around lately. The reality is that millions of people world wide are ensnared in human trafficking and exploitation, but they are still a fairly small minority of sex workers world wide. Redirecting focus away from the real human trafficking situations by diverting it into a crusade against other non coerced sex workers is downright criminal in my eyes.

[HiPointDem]

128. the reality is you don't need to prostitute yourself to get sex. just go into a bar. you prostitute

yourself to get money. whether coerced or by choice, prostitution is about money.

[brooklynite]

147. ...and then go to your "respectable job" in the morning?

If you enjoy sex, and people are willing to pay you for it, what's wrong with charging?

[HiPointDem]

169. i said, prostitution is about *money*. i didn't express an opinion about that *fact*.

[brooklynite]

172. That's like saying my interest in Planning is about "money"

Absent being independently wealthy or a stay at home spouse, people have to get a job. The question then becomes, what job do you take, and on what basis do you make the choice? Enjoyment of the work is frequently a basis on which to choose.

[MineralMan]

85. I see that you've had lots of replies to your OP, but that

you have not returned to the thread to respond to those replies. Is it your intention to do so, or are you just dropping this in the forum and moving on to other things. The old turd in the punchbowl trick? That's really not considered good form on DU, just in case you weren't aware of that.

Please reply to criticisms of your original post. There are many of them.

[Uzair]

93. I don't spend my time here 24/7

And there aren't any valid criticisms of this OP that warrant a response.

[MineralMan]

94. I see. Well, OK, then...

I'll keep that in mind from now on. Seeya.

[Quantess]

96. Weak answer.

But it's okay.... you don't have to respond if you got nothin'.

[Uzair]

97. What do you want me to respond to?

Please, enlighten me on which reply in this thread I ought to respond to.

Should I respond to the numerous "cool story bro" type posts? What, exactly, would that accomplish? Should I respond to the people who say they don't know any escorts who weren't forced into it? I explicitly put into my OP that I don't deny their existence. (And why are people so quick to believe THEM? Why not call bullshit on their posts?) Should I reply to the few judgmental prudes who can't possibly fathom the idea that it's possible for consenting adults to exchange money for sex, or who think it's immoral or against Jesus or some shit?

If DUers want to be lame, I'm not going to engage with them. Sorry. Frankly, I've done too much just by replying to you. This will be the end of it, though. Please refer everybody who can't have an adult discussion to this post.

PS on Edit: Maybe some of you might want to respond to the numerous others in here who AGREE that it should be legalized and/or ALSO know escorts themselves. I'm not the only one, you know. Maybe some of you need to get out more, I don't know.

[Quantess]

99. You are lousy at argumentation.

It's okay, not everyone can be good at presenting their arguments convincingly.

At the same time, how about taking the back seat and listening to what other people have to say? It could save you from looking like a numbskull in the future.

I gave you my scenario below...

[Squinch]

148. Maybe your characterization of your prostitute friends' motives was so absurd

that it made posters doubt you actually knew them. The others who claim to know prostitutes are not making the same kind of absurd claims. Maybe it doesn't have anything to do with judgmental prudery. Maybe it's just your writing style.

[noiretextatique]

165. complete

kudos to you for challenging this

[Quantess]

86. I have also known prostitutes who were junkies.

Or more accurately stated, they were junkies who became prostitutes because they needed money to get their fix. Pretty fucking sad.

I also happened to live on a notorious "prostitution street". I got propositioned as though I was a hooker once when I was wearing sloppy jeans and a sweatshirt and walking my dog! Edit to add: I got propositoned as though I was a hooker nearly every fucking day no matter what I was wearing, just walking to and from places in my neighborhood, minding my own business!

Another thing to consider: Human trafficking. Akin to sex slavery. You would never know, if you're just the buyer of sex. They don't tell you this, $$$dear customer$$$

[treestar]

101. Don't believe it

If they liked sex, they'd find a steady man/boyfriend, which would be a better way to have fun sex.

[redqueen]

109. Or proposition attractive people who are also good dancers in clubs.

Just sayin.

[Squinch]

145. Ever see the guys who troll the streets where the prostitutes work? Those girls are not

in it for fun sex. It seems to me there are some here who are desperately trying to absolve themselves of guilt about some kid they exploited. (Cause, hey, the way she was dressed, there was no way he could know she was 15.)

[redqueen]

157. That is a truly horrifying and sickening thought. nt

[Squinch]

158. Yes it is.

But with so many here saying it's not a big deal to see a prostitute, and with such a large proportion of prostitutes being underage, it is a likely scenario.

[freshwest]

173. I've known three kinds of prostitutes very well. One was my closest friend for years. Anyway...

[Honeycombe8]

111. That is such a crock. Prostitution is not about sex, just like rape isn't. It's about money.

You don't need to sell your services or body parts to engage in sex. It's something women do because they desperately need money or because they have psych. problems.

It's degrading and lowers a person's self-esteem. They're treated like pieces of meat, if not robbed or beaten up. It's not glamorous. There's no Social Security, paid days off, sick leave, FMLA, benefits.

I, for one, am not buying what you're trying to sell.

[MattBaggins]

112. tend to be middle aged professionals in unhappy marriages

Legalize it if we get to tell the wives...

Oh that's right legalize it crowds believe they deserve it.

Those sound like real nice people you got there.

[Harmony Blue]

114. I can see prositution legalized within 20 years in the U.S.

The war on drugs and prostitution has been an utter failure and a waste of tax payer money.

[BainsBane]

122. Now this is a funny thread

I needed a laugh.

[olddots]

125. I know therapists

[BainsBane]

126. Perhaps you should provide referrals?

[jakeXT]

124. Why tax and regulate prostitution, when nobody wants to do it with Wall Street ?

Prostitution has exploded in Miami in recent years, with an influx of Eastern-European sex workers looking to fleece big-spending American johns.
http://gawker.com/miami-prostitutes-mistake-new-jersey-mom-for-rival-hook-511154294

[quaker bill]

137. This much I know

Whenever one says "people can not be like that" they are nearly always wrong. There are 350 million of us in the US, so pretty much all the imaginable bases are covered. There probably are some "happy hookers" out there, some self-impressed burglars, fraudsters with "high moral standards", and perhaps even a few seemingly well adjusted homicidal maniacs.

Denying the notion that you heard this would be roughly as silly as making public policy on the notion that you did.

[Dorian Gray]

138. Good story

You know, Amsterdam, where prostitution is legal, has one of the highest rates of human trafficking.

Legality doesn't immediately rid us of the criminality.

There are definite arguments for the legalization of prostitution. I'm willing to discuss those. But it doesn't magically rid us of the dark side of it, either.

[pinboy3niner]

149. And prostitutes know you

You don't even wanna know what they're saying about you.

[randr]

151. This post is an excellent example of how well prostitutes ply their trade

Convincing a John that they enjoy what they do and that they are actually "friends" is standard procedure.
Keeps em coming, so to speak.

[Sheldon Cooper]

152. Seriously.

Does he not realize that??

[Nay]

163. I know. It's pretty damn funny. I burst out laughing, actually. nt

[Nimajneb Nilknarf]

155. Indeed. I once saw a young seaman put before Captain's Mast for cavorting with a prostitute.

Before his flogging, the ship's master asked the sailor if he had anything to offer as an excuse for his conduct.

He replied "Sir, I thought she was truly smitten with me!" The entire crew burst out in uproarious laughter and applause. The Captain was not amused.

The young man learned a valuable lesson that day.

[Jokerman]

170. "Oh no no no, she REALLY digs me."

Said by the guy who had just dropped $300 on a stripper.

[rdking647]

153. ive known a couple of prostitutes

back in teh day in my old career i knew a few high end escorts. they were all in it for the money. they didnt care about the sex but liked being treated to classy dinners,vacations,sporting events etc..... all on the clients dime. they were doing it by their own choice. one of them was a single mom and used her earnings to support her kid in a pretty nice lifestyle.

but the escort world is a world away from street walkers/low end call girls. they are mostly doing it unwiliingly,either by force or economic necessity. theres a world of difference between someone charging $75-100 per "act" and a high end escort getting 300-400/hr or more

[Marrah_G]

156. That is quite a story

[grahamhgreen]

159. So there I was, interviewing a room full of courtisans in Thailand...

There were about 12 of them. Various ages (added: 25-45) and looks. At one point, the questions became re-directed at me.

"Do women in America really not make you pay for sex?' they asked with anticipation.

"No, of course not", I said, and the room erupted in laughter.

"What's so funny?" I asked.

"They so stupid!" was the reply.

Also,

There is a book about the OP called "The Happy Hooker". In civilized countries, prostitution is legal, regulated.

If one considers them victims, jailing them for how they make money only makes them a victim twice.

Most of the ones I've met were in it for the money, and yes, were very sexual creatures.

[Jokerman]

166. My friend knew a prostitute...

He let her into his home where she found out that he kept cash in the house and had many valuable things. She told her boyfriend who picked up a gun and kicked in my friend's back door. My friend is now dead, and the prostitute and her boyfriend are serving long jail sentences.

What does this anecdote tell us about prostitution? Not a damn thing, just like your story. There are as many stories about prostitution as there are prostitutes.

I agree with legalization because I know that prohibition doesn't work. The key is to fix the economic and social problems that drive people unwillingly into prostitution and then regulate and protect anyone who remains.

[bitchkitty]

178. So knowing four hookers makes you an expert?

You're kidding, right?