President McCain would've invaded Syria by now. President Romney would've privatized Social Security

[Uzair]

No matter how many Bush policies Obama has kept in place, let's stop pretending that he's "no different", OK?

I don't see President Romney supporting gay marriage. Call me crazy, but I get the feeling he might not have been on the right side of that issue. I don't see President McCain passing any kind of health care reform. In fact, I get the feeling President McCain might have done something a little different on that issue. Perhaps President Romney might have only ordered airstrikes in Syria without any UN approval, but I think President McCain might have gone for a full, all out invasion.

I guess President McCain might have let GM go bankrupt, but we know for certain that President Romney would have. The Iraq war certainly would still be happening today under the leadership of President McCain, while I suppose Afghanistan wouldn't be ending in 2014 under President Romney. Would Osama bin Laden be dead? Hard to say, but I'm fairly confident that U.S. troops would be on the ground in Iran under President McCain.

No matter. The supreme court had TWO justices that needed replacing. I'm thinking that maybe, just maybe, President Romney would've appointed a couple of religious zealots there. President McCain would probably have called for more guns in schools after Newtown. President Romney might have ended all stem cell research altogether.

I know people love to pretend that President Obama ought to act a lot more like Michael Douglas in "The American President", but let's try and keep a little perspective, huh?

[Luminous Animal]

1. Ooga booga.

[Lady Freedom Returns]

2. K and R!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

3. Holding public servants accountable is the responsibility of the citizenry.

Even when they're Democratic presidents.

Not to mention that "Not as bad" is a piss poor campaign slogan.

[gcomeau]

29. There's a vast difference

...between holding accountable and delusionally assigning properties to a person that do not exist because someone wants to throw a tantrum.

[Life Long Dem]

31. +1 n/t

[choie]

55. it's the Obama fans

who are the ones "delusionally assigning properties to a person that do not exist."

[uponit7771]

64. like right wing driven "scandals"

[treestar]

38. Power of the government generally that would go to both D or R Presidents

Could be discussed, but the idea Obama has invented them and deserves scrutiny himself is what is insane.

People post as if every time there is a new President, the slate of laws, regulations and case law is cleared and we start anew.

Too many journalists do this, "Obama's this" and "Obama's that" to describe the "powers of the Presidency," which I guess seem dry and boring to them if they can't attack a person to it.

[freshwest]

4. K & R.

[Decoy of Fenris]

5. Us versus them. Us versus them. D vs. R. Liberal vs. Conservative.

“Even the humblest Party member is expected to be competent, industrious, and even intelligent within narrow limits, but it is also necessary that he should be a credulous and ignorant fanatic whose prevailing moods are fear, hatred, adulation, and orgiastic triumph. In other words it is necessary that he should have the mentality appropriate to a state of war. It does not matter whether the war is actually happening, and, since no decisive victory is possible, it does not matter whether the war is going well or badly. All that is needed is that a state of war should exist.”

Don't worry. Everything's okay. We're "Beating" "Them".

[Corruption Inc]

6. Since you can predict the future, tell us when we'll stop being spied on

"Try to keep a little perspective, huh?"

[xtraxritical]

35. Never, and it's been going on long before FISA was ever conceived.

The naivete here is off the charts.

[Maedhros]

44. And it needs to STOP.

The only way to stop it is to make government accountable to us, the citizens. Indifference to the erosion of our core civil liberties does nothing but embolden it.

[xtraxritical]

63. off the charts.

[bike man]

7. Are you a 'seer' like Granny Clampett? nt

[cali]

8. so what? I think people here know the sane parts of that.

but so what? Come back to reality. Just because thinks could have been worse, doesn't mean we should never criticize a democratic administration.

[Cooley Hurd]

11. ...perhaps the post originated from here:

[alsame]

16. LOL nt

[Hissyspit]

20. "Let's all go to the lobby, let's all go to the lobby..."

Wow, I'm 50 years old and I've never actually seen a map of the West Wing before.

[MNBrewer]

26. Were you circling the Misc. Office with no door?

[treestar]

39. None of the Miscellaneous Offices seem to have doors!

[MNBrewer]

47. OMG, you're right!

Except for the one to the dining room.

I wonder if Cheney is in one of them.

[treestar]

52. They are undisclosed locations!

You can sneak out to dine if hungry!

[MNBrewer]

53. Do they contain "man-sized safes"?

[Divernan]

37. So, do they get paid time and a half for Saturday?

Or is it strictly by the word count? The number of replies?

[Cooley Hurd]

9. Awesome observation - absolutely irrelevant to the NSA snooping argument, though.

[pmorlan1]

25. It's called distraction

I am the great and powerful Oz. Don't look at that man behind the curtain. lol

[iandhr]

10. Ding Ding Ding

[forestpath]

12. Nah. My perspective is just fine and you can't shut me up.

[Logical]

13. He is better than the GOP but failed on many issues! n-t

[Bluenorthwest]

14. Amazing that you portray Republicans as instantly being able to get things they want done if elected

while explaining why Obama can't get stuff done. I think Romney would have passed out cold from fear by now and resigned citing the obscure 'Palin Precedent'. You think his will would instantly be law. Oddly I prefer my version as I don't see Republicans as having Super Powers.
And I guess it is pretty lucky for you that people pressured and interrupted Obama until he stopped agreeing with Mitt on marriage equality during the actual campaign, and threw out some words of support. If he had kept up what he'd said for so many years and for the bulk of his first term, you wold not have that card to play. Are you glad that we refused to shut up about it while the 'supporters' mocked our 'poutrage' now that you are touting his support for equality. Had we not, he'd still be with Mitt.

[jeff47]

22. Congressional Democrats have a record of rolling over for Republican presidents.

Congressional Republicans have the reverse record.

I have no reason to believe Republican presidents would get much more of their agenda. Because Congressional Democrats are terrible at stopping them.

[Puzzledtraveller]

50. ^^this^^ Bluenorthwest!

[DonCoquixote]

56. Oddly I prefer my version as I don't see Republicans as having Super Powers.

They do, they are called Billions of dollars and a loyal MSM that tenderizes brains.

[riqster]

15. K & R

Criticizing is one thing. Pretending Obama= Romney, or taking one's toys and going home is something quite else.

[David__77]

17. Of course Obama is way better than those creeps.

And I would hope that the goal of anyone here is NOT to politically destroy Obama, but rather to supportively demand more progressive policies.

[mimi85]

43. Succinct and to the point

Well said!

[DCBob]

46. Well said but, the attitude I hear from many Obama critics is more like destroying..

than supportively demanding more progressive policies.

[burnodo]

18. ...and President Palin would have organized a national wolf hunt by now.

All citizens required to obtain a gun, learn to shoot it, and find and kill all the disppproved of creatures.

[totodeinhere]

19. Romney could not have privatized Social Security. That would never get

through the Senate.

[JoeyT]

21. Obama = Bush is silly.

Which is why it isn't that common. Course it's easier to pretend a lot of people are saying it, that way no one has to bother addressing arguments.

Besides, "Not as bad as the worst president in history" is a pretty low bar.

Didn't do as much awful stuff as he could have doesn't recommend someone much either.

[timdog44]

23. You are so right.

We seem to complain about so many things about Pres. Obama we forget the good that he has done and the travesties we have avoided. And the Supreme Court appointments would be devastating.

[MNBrewer]

24. Thanks for the shiny object post to distract us from Obama's shortcomings.

It hardly matters what a hypothetical President McCain might have done when the issue at hand is the ACTUAL President Obama.

[QC]

27. And just imagine what President Satan would have done by now!

[woo me with science]

67. ROFL!

[pmorlan1]

28. McCain or Romney?

If McCain or Romney had been elected at least all of here on DU would be fighting against government spying and due process free assassinations rather than having some of us defend this stuff.

[BlueStreak]

30. Therefore we should all be happy with a president who pursues extreme authoritarian policies

Sorry, that's a bogus argument. I, for one, am not satisfied with the "Yes, he is 90% as bad as Bush, but that last 10% makes all the difference."

There is very little that would actually be different right this minute if Romney were President because we still hold the majority in the Senate.

If the argument is that the President has a lot of Executive power, well, then let's see Obama use it.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

32. yes and saddam hussain would have been worse than them all.

so lets keep some perspective that we dont vote to prevent the worse that could happen but to allow the best to happen

[Major Hogwash]

33. Excellent analysis.

Plus, McCain was trying to ramp up enough fear to invade Iran back in 2008.

The very idea that President Obama is not in charge of things is beyond the pale.
He's not only on top of it, he's leading the way!!!

[ReRe]

34. Oh yeah...

and Romney would have us in Iran by now...

[demwing]

36. OOh! You wanna know what's REALLY scary?

What if Zombie Reagan were President? Not only would he be Sir Ronald of Reagan, the Patron Saint Teabagtopia, but he'd be a damned flesh eating zombie as well.

I don't see President Ron Zombie supporting a strict "no brain eating" policy. I bet Obama never at your brains...

[Fumesucker]

61. You are assuming the OP would be in danger from brain eating zombies

Too late I fear.

[yellowwoodII]

40. As Good As We're Going to Get

So, President Obama isn't Jesus Christ? Well, I think that he's as good as we're going to get. So I support him.
Now if he would get us into war with Syria or Iran, that could be a dealbreaker. But I think that he's doing his best to keep us out of there.

[hughee99]

41. It's amazing how much power repuke presidents have, they can start

wars and privatize enormous federal programs... A Democrat can't even relocate a few prisoners from a prison on a military base in Cuba to a prison in the US because he doesn't have "that kind of power".

[DonCoquixote]

57. Yes

Because the MSM is the loyal arm of the right wing, and the right wing has billions to fund their congressbeasts, even if, and especially if, they act stupid.

[truebluegreen]

42. Just stop it.

We didn't elect McCain or Romney. I voted for Obama twice and I would again, given the alternatives, but that doesn't make him right on everything. He's WAY wrong on this.

I don't care if it is legal. It shouldn't be, and at the very least the constitutional law professor should be saying let's shine some more light on this, let's find a better way, let's not have secret meetings to define secret rules for a secret program whose application and efficacy has to be kept secret.

ETA: http://www.politicalcompass.org/uselection2012 An interesting overview of the presidential candidates from 2012, via a UK website....

[Herlong]

45. I don't know if any of that is true

But I have to be in the here in the now to make sure I don't leave a world I would not want to live in for my children. Barack said what Barack said.

[frylock]

48. you must be real proud of your president with that low bar you just set

[Puzzledtraveller]

49. Oh the delfections, so sad and funny at the same time.

I don't normally log in on the weekend or even visit DU but this has been too much fun.

[villager]

51. "If you want your 4th Amendment back, you must support Sarah Palin!"

Ah yes, it never gets old...

[cherokeeprogressive]

54. I get SO jealous of clairvoyant people.

Got any lottery, megamillions, or powerball numbers for us?

[Lasher]

58. Unrec.

What a stupid OP.

[Autumn]

59. A couple of has been losers that were never elected to the Presidency.

So the point is moot.

[LWolf]

60. Presidents McCain and Romney

would have met vigorous opposition to their agenda.

Instead, Republicans are getting more stuff on their list than they would have in your scenario.

[NoOneMan]

62. Which hypothetical president would of passed universal health care and really tackled climate change

That one has my vote.









(real answer: none. Policies are pre-defined. Presidents' jobs are to make that policy palatable to 50+% of the masses, who can symbolically express their will and put them in power in a cathartic act. Presidents are not "kings". They are fairy tales, as are their parties, that we just can't damn well stop believing in. No one is here to set us free and save us from the hell that's coming, so lets stop pretending they are here for any reason other than to pacify us while the machine rolls off the cliff)

[CakeGrrl]

65. K/R

If the "Obama = Bush" crowd keeps up the current level of freakout and can't muster a trip to the voting booth for a while, we may have a Repub sweep of the WH, Senate and House.

I wonder how 'Republican' all of President Obama's accomplishments (and despite the caterwauling, they are numerous and impressive under the circumstances) will seem once the RW gets a true foothold?

And this loss will conveniently be blamed on PBO, because he magically managed to prevent people from completing their ballots or taking themselves to the polls.

[DiverDave]

66. WOW, I sure feel better now!

FAIL

How stupid do you think we are?

[KG]

68. hilarious.

[LostOne4Ever]

69. Vote Republican and you get theocratic authoritarianism

Vote Republican and you get theocratic authoritarianism. Vote democrat and you get secular authoritarianism. Vote for a third party or don't vote at all and you are voting for whichever authoritarianism comes up on top.

The problem is the public who would gladly trade away freedoms for the ILLUSION of protection of their current mediocracy from a scary foreign boogeyman they know nothing about.

Should a dem even attempt to try and stand up to this they will be painted as weak on defense ideologue who is willing to risk everyone's safety... and the public will lap it up.

The only way to fight it, is to work a PR campaign to make the people realize they are more likely to have their safety threatened by an unscrupulous police state than they are from terrorist while at the same time working for change within one of the two major parties and getting them elected.

[DCBob]

70. Iran and N. Korea too.

bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran!