Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

Billy Pilgrim

(96 posts)
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 10:20 PM Jun 2013

Unprecedented: Musician Goes To Prison Because His Fans Sell Drugs To One Another

Here in my home town of St. Louis we have, or had, a fun Grateful Dead cover band called The Schwag. They never disappointed, and their shows contained a lot of unique improvisation, of their own style. The lead singer owns a campground known as Camp Zoe where music festivals featuring The Schwag were held periodically.

Recently, Missouri law enforcement found a very creative convolution of existing law which allowed them to throw him in prison, a law which prior to this event only applied to landlords who own crack-houses. His fans were using and selling drugs on his land during a weekend music festival, and he is being held to blame for it.

This is absolutely outrageous. I'd like to get the word out. Please read the article. It is a horrific injustice. I think Rolling Stone should cover this to give it some national exposure.

This guy, Jimmy Tebeau, is a great person, who does not deserve to be in prison.

http://www.riverfronttimes.com/2013-06-13/news/jimmy-tebeau-crack-house-statute-schwagstock/

If you care about injustice in the world, please read this.

51 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Unprecedented: Musician Goes To Prison Because His Fans Sell Drugs To One Another (Original Post) Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 OP
Kick. PDJane Jun 2013 #1
The Police State is out of control... GReedDiamond Jun 2013 #2
Unless he sings a song called, "Let's all sell drugs at my camp ground," this makes no sense. n/t Ian David Jun 2013 #3
makes perfect sense if you think about it booley Jun 2013 #21
You have a point there. A few points. nt raccoon Jun 2013 #32
What the Flying F**k? marmar Jun 2013 #4
k&r n/t RainDog Jun 2013 #5
Michigan did the same thing with rainbow farms sigmasix Jun 2013 #6
That is absolutely terrible. Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 #9
Welcome to DU, Billy Pilgrim! calimary Jun 2013 #18
Reminds me of the Rainbow Farms murders. Jesus Malverde Jun 2013 #7
That makes me so freaking mad. Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 #10
The story was bumped from the news 7 days later...nt Jesus Malverde Jun 2013 #11
Welcome to DU, Jesus Malverde! calimary Jun 2013 #19
Kick burnodo Jun 2013 #8
The crack house law has also been used against rave promoters starroute Jun 2013 #12
I guess I was wrong in the use of the word "unprecedented." Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 #13
How about "outrageous" then? Or even "perverted"? (n/t) starroute Jun 2013 #14
Let's arrest everyone who's attended a Willie Nelson concert while we're at it. Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #15
this was a federal enforcement Niceguy1 Jun 2013 #16
Crap! calimary Jun 2013 #17
Um..his own security guards were selling drugs and he was apparently getting a cut. msanthrope Jun 2013 #20
I have not found anything to substantiate that claim. Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 #22
Read your own source. The feds bought from a security guard, and your perp was msanthrope Jun 2013 #39
No. He made money off the festival which they said was because of the drug use. dkf Jun 2013 #27
Have you seen the plea agreement? If you haven't, then why would you take the word of msanthrope Jun 2013 #40
Why do you assume they didn't see a copy of a doc when they wrote this article? dkf Jun 2013 #47
I'll take defense of the indefensible for 200 Alec. Warren Stupidity Jun 2013 #34
I think the sale of methadone, X, shrooms is indefensible. nt msanthrope Jun 2013 #41
Between consenting adults? tritsofme Jun 2013 #43
Yes. There are some drugs that should be regulated. nt msanthrope Jun 2013 #44
Methadone? Warren Stupidity Jun 2013 #45
And you should be the one to decide which drugs? SomethingFishy Jun 2013 #49
I've had clients go to jail for their methadone sales/buys. It is a 'street drug'.... msanthrope Jun 2013 #51
K&R Jamastiene Jun 2013 #23
If I ever want to get away with a crime Shankapotomus Jun 2013 #24
That article does not say what the law was exactly treestar Jun 2013 #25
'rogue event promoters' says it all. i bet people are selling and using drugs at mainstream HiPointDem Jun 2013 #42
The knowingly and intelligently requirement treestar Jun 2013 #50
Overreach. It's so easy to misuse the law if you are so inclined. dkf Jun 2013 #26
I went to their website... they are really good klyon Jun 2013 #28
Wasn't there a story some months ago about a motel owner being busted SwissTony Jun 2013 #29
Next you'll be telling me some were committing adultery in the rooms Dragonfli Jun 2013 #31
K & R !!! WillyT Jun 2013 #30
Pot in some form is legal in 12 states. Stop the Pot Wars NightWatcher Jun 2013 #33
Tell my nephew to get the fuck out of St. Louis. Fuddnik Jun 2013 #35
So rich high rise building owners can be jailed for leasing million $ flats to drug dealers? L0oniX Jun 2013 #36
Kick burnodo Jun 2013 #37
Well, the law is terrible, but only in the sense that . . . MrModerate Jun 2013 #38
This is ridiculous, but the title seems inaccurate. MadrasT Jun 2013 #46
kick Liberal_in_LA Jun 2013 #48

GReedDiamond

(5,542 posts)
2. The Police State is out of control...
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 10:32 PM
Jun 2013

...the Drug War is the model for how all "law enforcement" will be carried out, apparently.

Sick shit this is.

Ian David

(69,059 posts)
3. Unless he sings a song called, "Let's all sell drugs at my camp ground," this makes no sense. n/t
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 10:56 PM
Jun 2013

booley

(3,855 posts)
21. makes perfect sense if you think about it
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 02:17 AM
Jun 2013

Think of this guy as a much easier target then the actual drug dealers.

Think of all the money vacuumed up by the "investigation" and the money from the sale of his property which because of drug laws will go the very police dept that arrested him.

Think of the prosecutor and police chief that boast about the "major drug dealer" they put behind bars. Think about how they were not going to do that much "investigation" and come away with nothing.

Think about how Tebeau's belief that some drugs like weed were fine rankled authoritarian mind sets. And it didnt' matter if he thought some drugs like meth were still bad or if he even used drugs himself. He was guilty by association.

It makes a very sick kind of sense.

sigmasix

(794 posts)
6. Michigan did the same thing with rainbow farms
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 11:09 PM
Jun 2013

Right before 9-11 the state of michigan pulled the same thing on a good person. It was in vandalia Michigan and the feds and state cops ended up ending the life of the owner of rainbow farm and his partner. I had the honor to meet Tom a few months before his execution. Tom was throwing a small get together in a big old house on M60. The house had a history of being part of the underground railroad. my wife and I were given a tour of the house by tom wherin he told me of his plans to rejuvenate the old home. He spoke to me about the way the prosecution and the feds worked together to make him look like a drug dealer and a bad guy in general. Tom was foolish in his end decision- if he had walked away from the farm they wouldnt have been able to create the situation that escalated out of control and ended with 17 bullets in Tom's back. Lot's of good americans have been destroyed over a weed. The pressure of history will soon see national de-criminalization

calimary

(89,950 posts)
18. Welcome to DU, Billy Pilgrim!
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 12:29 AM
Jun 2013

Glad you're here! It IS absolutely terrible! My son has a band. I'm gonna make sure he knows about this.

Jesus Malverde

(10,274 posts)
7. Reminds me of the Rainbow Farms murders.
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 11:11 PM
Jun 2013
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainbow_Farm

Rainbow Farm was a pro-marijuana campground in Newberg Township, Cass County, Michigan, that was involved in a fatal police standoff on September 3, 2001. The campground was run by Tom Crosslin and his life partner Rolland "Rollie" Rohm, and was home to two annual festivals, "HempAid" and "Roach Roast", which ran from 1996 through 2001. The operation ended with the burning down of all the structures on the property and the deaths of both Tom Crosslin and Rolland Rohm.

calimary

(89,950 posts)
19. Welcome to DU, Jesus Malverde!
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 12:31 AM
Jun 2013

Good to have you with us! Stunning that was about a week before the World Trade Center attacks. In 2001. THAT recent.

starroute

(12,977 posts)
12. The crack house law has also been used against rave promoters
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 11:32 PM
Jun 2013
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/news/emdef1.htm

March 7, 2001

NEW ORLEANS, LA--A local music promoter and a concert hall manager who face up to 20 years in prison and $500,000 in fines simply for staging the electronic dance music events known as "raves" said today that the charges against them amount to censorship and have asked a federal court here to dismiss the case.

"The prosecution by the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) is part of a novel -- and entirely unconstitutional -- strategy to curtail use of the drug Ecstasy, which has been associated with raves, by using federal 'crack house' laws," said Arthur Lemann, a local attorney who is representing one of the defendants.

Youth culture expert Douglas Rushkoff as well as music industry professionals are speaking out against the prosecution of rave organizers as an unfounded attack on a vibrant music culture. The American Civil Liberties Union has also said that it opposes such prosecutions on constitutional grounds.


http://bbs.clubplanet.com/new-york-new-jersey/68455-jury-clears-club-la-vela-any-crackhouse-law-violations.html

Tallahassee, FL, Nov. 27 -- After less than two hours of deliberation, jurors in the Club La Vela trial returned with a verdict of "not guilty" on all charges for defendants Patrick and Thorsten Pfeffer. This precedent setting case deals a major blow to federal prosecutors who for the second time this year have tried to use a 1986 law designed to rid neighborhoods of crack houses against persons who manage nightclubs that play electronic dance music.

Although the Pfeffer brothers were accused of violating federal narcotics laws, no drugs were ever found on them or inside their club (similar to the New Orleans case.) Instead of drugs, trial prosecutors showed the jury BlowPops, gum, and glow sticks - items seized in a April 27th raid on the club. The assorted candies were presented as "evidence" that Club La Vela patrons were using drugs. Prosecutors also showed the jury a picture downloaded from Club La Vela's website of a man giving a massage to another man - this too was introduced as "evidence" of drug use.

 

Billy Pilgrim

(96 posts)
13. I guess I was wrong in the use of the word "unprecedented."
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 11:39 PM
Jun 2013

Unfortunately that doesn't make me feel any better.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
15. Let's arrest everyone who's attended a Willie Nelson concert while we're at it.
Fri Jun 14, 2013, 11:48 PM
Jun 2013

Next, we will arrest everyone who's seen a Sherlock Holmes movie or read a book. Eventually, we will purge society of these drug users....

Now, if you will excuse me, I have to pick up some anti-depressants at Walgreens.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
20. Um..his own security guards were selling drugs and he was apparently getting a cut.
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 01:01 AM
Jun 2013

Which is why he pled guilty.

 

Billy Pilgrim

(96 posts)
22. I have not found anything to substantiate that claim.
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 08:41 AM
Jun 2013

He was charged with violating the Crack-House law, not with taking a cut of drug profits from his security guards.

If you have a link I'd appreciate it.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
39. Read your own source. The feds bought from a security guard, and your perp was
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 07:36 AM
Jun 2013

depositing way....and I mean way...too much unaccounted for cash.

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
27. No. He made money off the festival which they said was because of the drug use.
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 09:23 AM
Jun 2013
profited handsomely from the popularity of his festival as a result. The plea agreement explicitly states that the government could not prove Tebeau himself ever bought or sold drugs.
 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
40. Have you seen the plea agreement? If you haven't, then why would you take the word of
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 07:39 AM
Jun 2013

a criminal as to what's in it? FYI...the sentencing report is what you want to see.

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
47. Why do you assume they didn't see a copy of a doc when they wrote this article?
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 11:56 AM
Jun 2013

What access to verified documentation do you have?

tritsofme

(19,887 posts)
43. Between consenting adults?
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 08:03 AM
Jun 2013

I think the federal government probably has more important things to worry about.

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
45. Methadone?
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 10:47 AM
Jun 2013

Generally the goto boogeyman drug is methedrine not methadone. You need to work on your drug warrior talking points.

Ecstasy and psilocybin are good examples of recreational drugs that should be regulated just as we regulate tobacco and alcohol. Instead they are criminalized, and consequently commercial transactions are in the unregulated black market.

SomethingFishy

(4,876 posts)
49. And you should be the one to decide which drugs?
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 12:54 PM
Jun 2013

Gimme a fucking break. Judging from your posts you have no idea what the effects are of "Methadone" "X" or "Shrooms".

Oh and by the way "methadone" is not a street drug, it's a synthetic used to help addicts detox from the physically addicting properties of Heroin..

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
51. I've had clients go to jail for their methadone sales/buys. It is a 'street drug'....
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 04:09 PM
Jun 2013

hell..what opiate isn't? I'm pretty good with the rest of the drugs listed being illegal.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
25. That article does not say what the law was exactly
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 08:49 AM
Jun 2013

The best approximation to be found:

Crack house statute is a federal statute codified in 21 USC § 856 which makes it a felony to knowingly open, lease, rent, use, or maintain any place for the purpose of manufacturing, distributing, or using any controlled substance. It permitted the Justice Department to prosecute property owners who knowingly and intentionally allowed others to use their property to hold events for the purpose of distributing or using drugs. For example, it was used to prosecute people such as motel owners and car repair shop owners who knowingly and intentionally allowed their premises to be used for drug distribution. The statute is amended by the Illicit Drug Anti-Proliferation Act of 2003 which makes it more feasible to successfully prosecute rogue event promoters.


http://definitions.uslegal.com/c/crack-house-statute/
 

HiPointDem

(20,729 posts)
42. 'rogue event promoters' says it all. i bet people are selling and using drugs at mainstream
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 07:48 AM
Jun 2013

venues too -- but i doubt they're going to prosecute ticketmaster.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
50. The knowingly and intelligently requirement
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 01:16 PM
Jun 2013

is going to be tough to prove for the case in the OP. Generally it is probably a bear, but the lead singer of the band, come on, is quite unlikely to be knowingly in on drug dealing. Everyone "knows" there are drug dealers there but not in the sense the statute seems to require. Ticket-master would be even harder to have a case on - there's no way they are in on the drug deals as they don't have to be to make a buck.

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
26. Overreach. It's so easy to misuse the law if you are so inclined.
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 09:18 AM
Jun 2013

Parse it all to pieces and manipulate it beyond recognition. Sad.

klyon

(1,697 posts)
28. I went to their website... they are really good
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 11:20 AM
Jun 2013

sorry to hear about this bull shit
If they apply this law anyone that provides a venue for festivals and rock shows could get arrested.
Did they confiscate his property? I didn't see that in the article.
When I lived in the St Louis area I followed a Dead cover band called Whitehorse. They played all over the area. Many times at Chuck Berry's place out in Wentsville. He had lots of problems with underage drinking and got shut down from time to time.

SwissTony

(2,560 posts)
29. Wasn't there a story some months ago about a motel owner being busted
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 11:45 AM
Jun 2013

because drugs were apparently being sold in the rooms of the motel?

Who would have guessed?

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
31. Next you'll be telling me some were committing adultery in the rooms
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 04:38 PM
Jun 2013

Bad hotel owner forcing good folk to commit adultery!

NightWatcher

(39,376 posts)
33. Pot in some form is legal in 12 states. Stop the Pot Wars
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 05:42 PM
Jun 2013

The Feds should fire all employees of the DEA.

Fuddnik

(8,846 posts)
35. Tell my nephew to get the fuck out of St. Louis.
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 08:18 PM
Jun 2013

He plays lead guitar for the Pink Floyd cover, El Monstero.

 

L0oniX

(31,493 posts)
36. So rich high rise building owners can be jailed for leasing million $ flats to drug dealers?
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 08:40 PM
Jun 2013
 

MrModerate

(9,753 posts)
38. Well, the law is terrible, but only in the sense that . . .
Sat Jun 15, 2013, 10:09 PM
Jun 2013

The state shouldn't be interfering with the intoxicants its citizens chose to imbibe unless the resulting intoxication poses a risk to the public.

That having been said, it does seem as if Tebeau is guilty of "maintaining a drug-involved premises" as described in the article.

However, the relief from such injustice is to fix the overarching prohibition laws, which cause much more damage than ruining the life of a single person.

MadrasT

(7,237 posts)
46. This is ridiculous, but the title seems inaccurate.
Sun Jun 16, 2013, 10:56 AM
Jun 2013

Shouldn't it be something like: "Property Owner Goes To Prison Because People On His Property Sell Drugs To One Another"?

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Unprecedented: Musician ...