Snowden’s Worst-Case Scenario: What If No Countries Take Him? - TIME

[flamingdem]

http://world.time.com/2013/07/02/snowdens-worst-case-scenario-what-if-no-countries-take-him/

So until someone takes him, he’s at the behest of Russian authorities. “A transit zone is, of course, always part of the territory of the state in which it’s placed. It’s a myth that it is somehow not part of the state. It’s very often the case that states will establish these transit zones in order to reduce the legal rights and entitlements of individuals in transit,” says Goodwin-Gill. “All states play these little games with jurisdiction.”

Stephen W. Yale-Loehr, an international law professor at Cornell Law School, thinks Snowden will be in Moscow “for a long time.” But, he says, he may find help in Article 28 of the United Nations Convention Relating to Refugees, which specifically requests that member-states give “sympathetic consideration” to those who can’t obtain the necessary documents from their home-country.

As the you’re-not-welcomes stock up, here’s his worst-case scenario. “The Russian Federation could expel him since he is currently in the transit area without a valid travel document. They could expel him back to the country that he came from,” says Douglas McNabb, an international criminal defense attorney who specializes in global extradition. That’s Hong Kong, the Chinese special administrative region where Snowden originally sought aid after leaking a trove of NSA surveillance documents.

In March, a high court in Hong Kong ordered its government to establish review procedures for asylum applications. That’s not yet in place, meaning that applicants can stay there indefinitely until that process is set up and they’re accepted or denied. But that would place Snowden in Hong Kong illegally and, for two reasons, not bode well for him. Hypothetically, McNabb says, Hong Kong authorities could grab him after he disembarks but before he has the opportunity to apply for asylum, then hand him over to the U.S. as a courtesy. Alternatively, if Moscow expelled him back to where he came from last, then Hong Kong could do the same, which would theoretically put him back in the U.S.

Read more: http://world.time.com/2013/07/02/snowdens-worst-case-scenario-what-if-no-countries-take-him/#ixzz2XvE4igj1

[hrmjustin]

1. Someone will take him in the end.

[flamingdem]

2. At the end of that article a lawyer recommends

that he blanket many more countries with requests.

He hasn't tried Somalia yet

[hrmjustin]

3. Cuba or VEN. would take him in the end if no one else will.

I think Ecuador is showing it is having second thoughts.

[flamingdem]

6. Not Cuba! Cuba didn't even let Snowden transit through Havana

Remember all those reporters who got on that flight only to find an empty seat that was the one Snowden has purchased? Cuba won't risk a problem with the USA and has an accord to return US fugitives.

Venezuela is apparently having second thoughts due to the USA being its main trading partner.

[hrmjustin]

27. He might be forced to come home.

[flamingdem]

29. I think this is in Putin's hands

If some country steps up he will probably let him leave but if not, home sweet home

[hrmjustin]

32. He probably got everything he was going to get from Snowden and he figures why rock the boat for him

[hack89]

7. The problem is getting him there

there are no direct flights from Moscow to Venezuela while the Aeroflot flight to Cuba flies over US airspace.

[flamingdem]

12. Obama said it's not worth scrambling jets over this

but more important is that Cuba won't let him land there.

His last chance was Pres. Maduro's private jet direct to Caracas but Maduro said no.

In fact I think he said: "Por dios, ni modo" as in no way or Hell No!

[hack89]

15. The US would merely deny access to our airspace

no need to scramble jets.

[flamingdem]

19. Seriously, they can do that?

Is there a case where they've done that?

If the country in question knows they won't be pursued then its not really a threat

[hack89]

23. Yes - Google "denied access to us airspace". Happens quite frequently. nt

[hrmjustin]

25. Despite what the president says, if they know the plane is over the US it will be forced to land.

[hack89]

33. No - they will simply deny it entry into US airspace

which is why Aeroflot won't even attempt to fly Snowden to Cuba.

[hrmjustin]

34. He might be safer by boat.

[hack89]

35. Unfortunately Moscow is nowhere near the water. nt

[hrmjustin]

36. They could find a way if the are determined but I don't think they are.

[totodeinhere]

49. The Venezuelans could charter a flight and have it avoid US airspace. n/t

[hack89]

57. Yes - but how much do they really want to push the issue?

I doubt they care that much about Snowden.

[MjolnirTime]

50. the US Prison System is his future home.

[randome]

4. Has he tried the Island Of Misfit Toys yet?

I mean look at the scenery!



[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[Major Nikon]

8. Duzy!

[flamingdem]

11. Looks like he'd fit in there with his red hood!

[tularetom]

5. They definitely don't want him back here

Because if he was here they'd have to arrest him and put him on trial and if he was on trial some very unpleasant facts would probably come out.

I guess they could immediately send his ass to Guantanamo but they'd have a lot of splainin to do if they did that. Even our lame ass liberal media might start asking questions.

[CakeGrrl]

9. On what basis do you make that claim?

Why, then, revoke his passport? Because the State Department is just being pissy and vindictive?

[truebluegreen]

10. +1

[alcibiades_mystery]

16. ROFL

Oh, Lawd it's hilarious.

[Cali_Democrat]

17. Wow you fucking fail

The Justice Department already filed a criminal complaint in US district court. In the next 60 days a federal grand jury will likely indict him and he will be officially charged.

This is the US federal court system, not Gitmo.

[rug]

30. And that system has Rule 16 regarding discovery

(E) Documents and Objects. Upon a defendant's request, the government must permit the defendant to inspect and to copy or photograph books, papers, documents, data, photographs, tangible objects, buildings or places, or copies or portions of any of these items, if the item is within the government's possession, custody, or control and:

(i) the item is material to preparing the defense;

(ii) the government intends to use the item in its case-in-chief at trial; or

(iii) the item was obtained from or belongs to the defendant.

[Major Hogwash]

41. Maybe we could do a prisoner swap like we used to do in WWII.

We'll give them Glenn Beck in exchange for Snowden, and then they can torture him all they want for wearing a Boy Scout uniform.

What liberal media are you talking about??

[MADem]

47. We have an arms dealer that belongs to Russia. He's a spy, too.

They likely want him back, and if all ends well, they may get him. They'd like this all wrapped up, I'm sure, before Obama visits Russia in the fall...

[MjolnirTime]

51. everything's going to come out, regardless. Snowden will go to prison.

[truebluegreen]

13. So, I guess this means there is no country in the world

that anyone would want to live in that the US can't bully or blackmail into compliance with "our" will.

Doesn't that make us feel proud? American Exceptionalism! Yea!

[flamingdem]

14. It's true that the USA still has a dominant position

in the world. Sometimes through a positive history and sometimes through historical coercion as the dominant economic power it has been for so long.

[truebluegreen]

20. IMHO it is not a good thing

if it ever was.

[flamingdem]

22. I agree we're not always the good guys

Not at all. But other super powers like China and Russia are worse.

[truebluegreen]

31. Don't you get tired of the "lesser of two evils" argument?

I sure do.

Guaranteed Not As Bad As China or Russia! I feel so much better.

Some day I would like to have a government that tries to live up to our best aspirations.

[flamingdem]

37. I would vote for

Bernie Sanders but I'm a realist and don't expect that kind of candidate for another decade or two.

[truebluegreen]

40. I would too...

but I am more of a pessimist than you and don't expect that caliber of candidate ever. I think our system is designed to weed them out, especially with the Big Money running the show.

[flamingdem]

42. With Immigration Reform there might be hope

12 million more voters, something like that, could tilt things to the left!

[baldguy]

18. If I stole a govt car, should I be able to ask for asylum?

Why is this different?

[flamingdem]

21. I think this is why many countries hesitate

.. wondering if anyone like this has been on the world stage asking for asylum before.

[treestar]

28. He just does not qualify for asylum

He is fleeing criminal prosecution. That's not grounds for asylum.

[Cha]

24. Brazil, India, and Poland say NO. Enough shit to deal with..

without adding Snowen to their list.

Germany: No official response, but Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle has been quoted as saying he “could not imagine” the request will be approved.

Where in the world will Snitch(China Russia) Snowden end up? the saga continues..

[flamingdem]

26. As Herman Cain says, I think that means: Nein Nein Nein

[Major Hogwash]

38. Cain didn't even know where Beckibeckistan was at.

Talk about a ginormous ignoramus spectaculus!!
Cain was the ultimate example of a dying species about to become extinct.

[randome]

39. But doing so in a way that entertained us!

[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[flamingdem]

44. I miss the pizza man edit: I withdraw that statement

what was I thinking!

[Major Hogwash]

52. It was so sad. Like "that's all you guys got?" I mean, he was stumped by the Libya questions.

And yet he wanted to get on teevee!!

Jesus Sesame.

[CakeGrrl]

46. But, but...our Allies are so disgusted with us, they'll want to do this! Right?

or not.

[flamingdem]

48. Not a one!

Well there's always Lichtenstein.. you never know

[Cha]

58. That's the Propaganda on the Internet.

[MADem]

43. Iran and North Korea would take him!

Of course, they'd probably sell him, too...if the price was right!

[flamingdem]

45. Like I say North Korea is into NBA not NSA

and Iran requires him to convert to Islam (jes kiddin')

[ucrdem]

53. Welcome to under the bus Ed

I'm sure Julian and Glenn would try to help but they're taking tea at the palace with the PM, sorry.

[flamingdem]

54. Which palace? Would that be:

China, Iran or Myanmar maybe?

Jury is out on the Russkies

[ucrdem]

55. No Hyde Park for Ed, but no Quantico either.

He'll be well taken care of I have no doubt.

[flamingdem]

59. The story will be of less interest to Assange and Greenwald if

Snowden becomes a Llama tender in Bolivia. Bolivia seems like his best best to avoid Quantico.

Plenty of "snow" there up there in the Andes to keep Eddie spewing out treatises on his enemigos.

[Thinkingabout]

56. If you think the US is so unfair then travel to Hong Kong, then to Moscow, then to?

Maybe the US would be a better place, even with being arrested. Watts ya mean, no internet or computer time, well that's cruel and unusual punishment.