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sibelian
(7,804 posts)Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)
The Wielding Truth
(11,433 posts)With most of us online or wireless the reliable info on emergencies could get to us now. I'm thinkin'?
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)It's impossible to imagine that there might be a major emergency that would require emergency messages to be sent to the public over the Internet.
Why is the TV not enough? Because so many more people are on the Internet these days. All this order does is follow the people from TV to where they are more likely to be busy these days: on the Internet.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)RT sensationalized this and it is all over facebook. I have family that work for emergency response for the fed govt.. While I have my problems with the President, this is not one of them.
This is a better article.
Foreign news outlets cynically bash America's new emergency communications executive order
Summary: Russian propaganda arm RT.com slams an American emergency communications plan. Many Americans unknowingly retweet Russia's headlines.
By David Gewirtz for ZDNet Government | July 10, 2012 -- 06:55 GMT (23:55 PDT)
News is a funny thing, and yet, emergency preparedness is no laughing matter. As residents of the mid-Atlantic states have become all too aware, disasters do strike, communication systems do fail, and people do suffer because of it.
One of the missions of good governance is to provide support during times of emergency. The United States government is particularly good at this on a logistical level. Unfortunately, as we saw during Katrina, politicians can get in the way of a well-designed escalation system, causing systems to break down.
However, the bottom line is that the U.S. has implemented many forms of disaster management over the years, planning for everything from natural disasters to man-made disasters, to terrorist attacks, to the effects of war.
President Obama continued that management process last week with the issuance of the Executive Order Assignment of National Security and Emergency Preparedness Communications Functions.
It's an extension of previous emergency communications policies of the government, but this time it assigns specific responsibilities to the Departments of Defense and Homeland Security. It also sets up a new committee called National Security and Emergency Preparedness (NS/EP) consisting of key players from most of the major agencies.
This is a good thing. Emergency preparedness and escalation procedures are important. Assigning specific responsibilities ahead of time prevents turf battles, and helps restore critical services faster.
http://www.zdnet.com/foreign-news-outlets-cynically-bash-americas-new-emergency-communications-executive-order-7000000554/
ucrdem
(15,720 posts). . . so if any black helicopters were dispatched they've come and gone.
Snotcicles
(9,089 posts)ucrdem
(15,720 posts)Snotcicles
(9,089 posts)Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Its over "National Defense Preparedness"
Are you reading that?
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Feel better?
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)
MADem
(135,425 posts)
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)
Bobbie Jo
(14,344 posts)Like wading through teabagger bullshit.
MADem
(135,425 posts)Marr
(20,317 posts)them look bad, so yeah.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)over the past two years.
sibelian
(7,804 posts)
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)That's always been the case, and that is why the crackdowns are so brutal.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)
ohheckyeah
(9,314 posts)the Quakers - now that's a threatening and rowdy bunch. 
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)It is great to know if a flash flood is going to happen (or tornado or hurricane) so one can be prepared.
Sort of like the Amber alert system, which has saved 100s and 100s of children.
Or the silver alerts when an elderly person has gone missing.
If only they had these back in the 1970s, maybe Eton Paitz could have been saved when he was kidnapped
and maybe if they had advance notice in Japan prior to Tsnamami, it could have saved tens of thousands of lives.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)They already have cell phone emergency notification system.
Its not the Emergency side thats an issue.
Again "In explaining the order, the Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC) writes that the president has authorized the DHS "the authority to seize private facilities when necessary, effectively shutting down or limiting civilian communications."
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)And the EAS already (to use the hyperbolic term) shuts down those sources, as it interrupts to broadcast the special
message.
When there is new technology, one needs to keep up with them (much like in baseball, the steroid abuse issue, which players
find newer stuff not "specifically" mentioned. Best to include everything and anything to be prepared
As Benjamin Franklin said "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".
Back in the World War 2 days, and prior, they had alarm bells go off, and people went into fallout shelters, but it took
advance notice for people to enter them
Same in tornado's, where people need to get to places (depending on which state) and if there is no advance notice,
they would not be able to do so.
One bad thing about all the different TV stations now, as opposed to yesteryear, is one can be watching an old movie station
or movie, and have no idea a major event is taking place. That always worries me.
(though I was happy to see a few years ago, watching AntennaTV, a scrawl did appear to turn a news station on when Osama
Bin Ladan was caught. But many other stations don't do that).
djean111
(14,255 posts)You think the president needs to take over the internet or TV or radio in order to communicate? He needs us to be unable to communicate amongst ourselves? In an emergency, I can't phone or email?
"Seize control" means more than interrupting for an emergency broadcast.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)and just last week, a tornado indeed struck down in NJ. Not a major one, but it caused big damage to those that were
affected by it.
I trust Janet Napolitano to do the right thing. She hasn't proved me wrong yet, and the people who elected her governor of her state,
gave her very high support rates prior to her being HS director.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)
kentuck
(115,397 posts)I see.....dumbasses.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)As long as he is "safe" he doesn't care about the Constitution or anything else.
truth2power
(8,219 posts)there are a significant number of DUers who see through these tactics.
Response to hobbit709 (Reply #40)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)Wouldn't you want to be warned?
Probably not.
premium
(3,731 posts)Seize, as in, send armed agents physically into these places and seize them in times of "national security", whatever the hell that means these days.
Are you ok with the suspension of the 1st and 4th Amendments?
Oh yeah, I forgot, of course you are, you've made that clear before.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)premium
(3,731 posts)and history has proven FDR wrong about the detention camps for Japanese Americans during WWII.
Are you ok with the seizing of comm. for national security reasons, whatever the hell that means these days?
That would be a RW position.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Enlighten me as to what MILITARY - and I chose that term very carefully - threat faces us. We lived with the Soviet Unions thermonuclear missiles pointed at us for 45 years without turning into a police state. Enough missiles to destroy the damned planet dozens of times over.
Now, in the name of "fighting" an "enemy" with no army, no navy, no air force and no marines, that can at best inflict spotty damages compared to that which is inflicted in a war, the United States lays the foundations for turning itself into East Germany at the drop of a hat.
This is madness beyond comprehension.
TheMadMonk
(6,187 posts)...it's your turn.
WE tried this just with SMS here in Australia regarding bushfires. The governments "good intentions": a) crashed the system, and many of those who should have received warning did not get it until hours after any danger had passed, and b) if they were on the "wrong" network received no warning at all.
I'd far rather rely on my neighbours' television watching habits than an emergency notification system which both fails to deliver and fucking well robs me of the ability to scream for help.
WE have a national (51% owned) telco which lacks the capacity to deliver simultaneous TXTs to just a few hundred/thousand people in a rural cell tower's footprint. Somehow I doubt you with your 100% privatised telecommunications networks will ever convince a multitude of carriers to install enough redundant capacity to service every device in a urban tower's footprint, and in fact given the two way nature of the manner in which cell devices operate, I do not believe it is possible deliver mass communication, via a system built around one to one connections.
If it's not possible, and any attempt to make it happen would crash the system, one has to wonder about true intent.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Albeit the Aussie loonies are a couple decades behind us. I have a friend in Sydney that is politically active on the national level. She tells me it's quite scary. She has been following US politics very closely for decades and knows what she is seeing evolve.
Godspeed to you all down under.
Apophis
(1,407 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Hmmmmm....
riqster
(13,986 posts)"the authority to seize private facilities when necessary, effectively shutting down or limiting civilian communications." ?
djean111
(14,255 posts)It does not specifically say control because that control is granted elsewhere.
Section 706 of the Communications Act of 1934, as amended, confers authority to the President in the matter of suspension of all rules and regulations pertaining to the use and operation of telecommunications facilities, public or private during wartime emergencies.
This order extends 706 to the internet and telephones.
This is not about the weather.
And "wartime emergencies" is probably an amorphous thing at best.
After all, we are constantly under surveillance because we are always at war with "the terrorists", right?
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)riqster
(13,986 posts)There is a valid concern, but freak-out headlines that are not supported by the source material do not help.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)It is too dangerous, they think, during large scale police actions. Think about the marathon bombings and the man hunt. They shut the city down. I am sure they would have much preferred to shut down any private flow of information too. This is another weapon for the police state.
rtassi
(629 posts)Yea the President is Seizing control so he can give us more Grandma Alerts ... You people scare me more then the government does!
ForeignandDomestic
(190 posts)nt
DeltaLitProf
(881 posts)But thanks anyway. Keep playing. Have you considered joining prisonplanet.com where this sort of thing is met less skeptically?
MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)A lady asked Dr. Franklin "Well Doctor what have we got a republic or a monarchy?" "A republic" replied the Doctor "if you can keep it."
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)Russia did that.
Gorby tore down all the walls
The Russians tore down Gorby
Now Russia has what Gorby tore down in the guise of Putin being now in office is the same as what came before Gorby
MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)1. You are deluded
or
2. You're trolling
Since I can't say you're trolling, I guess I'll have to go with #1.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)and do you think Putin is the bastation of a democratic leader?
He just got himself named for a 3rd term in a place that has term limits.
MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)3. Oblivious I guess is a 3rd option.
(Psssst. I was referring to your idea that Ben Franklin was talking about Obama's victory.)
and no. I think Putin is at best a cleptocrat and at worst an actual Fascist.
former9thward
(33,424 posts)In a place that has term limits. But that's ok because you support him and he is a 1%er so entitled.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)I supported Bill Thompson, who I support in 2013 for Mayor. Though I am alright with Christine Quinn and Anthony Weiner too.
Any of the candidates will be good for Hillary in 2016.
former9thward
(33,424 posts)I am familiar with Weiner and Quinn. Who is Bill Thompson? Is he on the council or in government there?
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)William Colridge Thompson, Jr., known as Bill or Billy, was the 42nd Comptroller of New York City. Sworn into office on January 1, 2002, he was reelected to serve a second term that began on January 1, 2006
[img]
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former9thward
(33,424 posts)hobbit709
(41,694 posts)TheMadMonk
(6,187 posts)... to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
The power to co-opt is the power to silence.
Bad enough that a government claims the right to control the most potent means of communication WITH the people.
FAR, FAR worse that they claim a right over the only effective means of communication BY, FROM AND BETWEEN the people.
BLUNT AS A BOWLING BALL: The government could well have dragged the EBS into the 21st C very simply by expanding the existing system to all extant means of MASS COMMUNICATION, but instead it chose to do so, by offering to cripple the most effective means individuals have to communicate with each other.
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)So what is the difference getting an emergency message on my computer?
snooper2
(30,151 posts)
ucrdem
(15,720 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I hope those susceptible to FireOnFireitis will look into this a little further.
They will find that this Executive Order is a part of a series of National Security/Emergency Preparation Executive Orders that include the Continuity of Government, the National Transportation Infrastructure and a couple of other areas.
They will also find that this Executive Order is nothing new, it is a re-issuance of Executive Orders dating back to 1982 and 1984 ... Oh, wait ... {Cue scary music} ... 1984!
ucrdem
(15,720 posts)But I guess we're not supposed to remember that one. 
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Funny story ...
Back in 2000-something, I read (I think here) that GWB had signed an Executive Order "giving him control of all communication" and the narrative expanded to other Executive Orders that if implemented would amount to martial law.
I freaked straight The-F-Out!
Then, I actually read the Executive Order ... all the way to the end. And guess what I found? You guessed it ... the 1982 and 1984 Executive Orders!
But I'm sure, this too will be ignored for the larger, greater hair in fire.
Duckwraps
(206 posts)
treestar
(82,383 posts)I didn't know where it came from - never got those before.
I wonder if this is what that's all about?
99Forever
(14,524 posts)... you always hatred Obama....
... and racist...
FREEDOMS!
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Invariably I get accused of that
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Your post is one big lie, top to bottom,
Whether your hatred of Obama such that you peddle malicioys lies is based on race is impossible to determine.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)virtually no civil liberties when I permanently move to China this fall.
This isn't what I voted for, but who gives a fuck anymore? Not me.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Waiting till school is finally done 
Most importantly at least they don't pretend they are a democracy.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)I am Asperger's and haven't been able to find a decent job in 20+ years in the profession I was trained for - law. And I graduated from the same law school in the same class as Michelle Obama. But I was born and raised working class in addition to being Asperger's. There isn't enough Harvard Law School in the world to overcome being both working class and Asperger's in today's American legal profession. Shit, at least in China if you have brains they will put you to work somewhere doing something productive. Not in the US, which is according to several studies the most class-immobile society in the developed world save for the UK.
See this post for my thoughts on your second point: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023189922#top
The US and China are on almost perfectly convergent courses. Though I think in 40-50 years China will probably be a more free society than the US. This will be the Chinese century. Bank it.
ETA: I've only been in Fuyang City for two and a half days. Every bite of food has been spectacularly, impossibly good, and every dish has come from some local hole in the wall with ten tables.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)They outspend us in science, and most importantly know how to play the long game.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)They understand that the long game is the only one that counts and have understood that for centuries. They are a supremely pragmatic people.
Nothing more Chinese has ever been said than Deng Xiaoping's famous statement that it does not matter whether the cat is black or white as long as it catches mice.
Catherina
(35,568 posts)I don't mean to derail anything but this immediately popped into my head 
dotymed
(5,610 posts)from the carpenters Union inviting me to work in Canada. I would love it. Unfortunately they didn't check the disabled list.
If there were any way, I'd already be there.
BTW, Canada is expecting to need 10,000 Union carpenters within this year, from the U.S. They already have a huge carpenters Union (compared to us). They are planning a complete overhaul of their infrastructure.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)cashectomy on what used to be the middle class and the redistribution of every last penny to the 1%. I think Canucks are getting the better deal.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)
Initech
(108,677 posts)
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)I'm sure Hitler had one too. Since the Emergencu Broadcast System was FDR's creation, does this mean he was as bad as Hitler?
Response to Katashi_itto (Original post)
peacebird This message was self-deleted by its author.
djean111
(14,255 posts)The really funny part is thinking this is meant for Amber Alerts or storm warnings.
We already have those.
And those warnings do not effectively shut down or limit civilian communications.
dotymed
(5,610 posts)When the DHS came and took over, everything went to hell.
The agents had to have been picked from our enormous prison population. I have never seen such uneducated, unkempt bullies all in one place, especially since they were "in charge."
They would even bully people at convenience stores.
One of the (very large) guys from my crew put one of their (huge) "agents" in his place one day. This ass parked his govt. vehicle so close to us in a store parking lot (there was plenty of room for him to have not done this) that we had to exit our vehicle on the passenger side.
Our guy went in the store and dressed this fool down. Then he told him to get his ass out there and park correctly. The DHS "agent" said that as soon as he made his purchase.....my guy said "now, you stupid SOB."
The "agent" did it now.
God, we laughed...
think
(11,641 posts) pnwmom
(110,254 posts)But nowadays, more people are on the Internet, so that's an appropriate place to send emergency messages.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)"The following is a test of the Emergency Broadcast System." Guess what, they shut down and limit civilian communications to deliver that message and conduct that test.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)The "control freak" nature of an Executive Order like this leaves me more than a bit unsettled.
TheMadMonk
(6,187 posts)...in a manner which has already been demonstrated here in Australia, crashes the system.
Additionally, several high interest events in recent history have shown us what happens when too many mefones try to simultaneously Instagram "Das Umdrehung".
I have no problem with emergency services co-opting 10, 20, 50% of the available bandwidth to ensure reliable communication with each other, but to grab the lot and render it unusable to ANYBODY including emergency services, speaks to an agenda which DOES NOT have the best interests of the citizenry at heart.
nolabels
(13,133 posts)Like dude, they were wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy ahead of you about 237 years ago. It's called Ex post facto law and is specifically called out as off limits in the same piece of paper that gives the authority to every thing else.
U.S. Constitution - Article 1 Section 9
http://www.usconstitution.net/xconst_A1Sec9.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_post_facto_law
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)during the reign of His Chimperial Highness and the reichwing stooges on the Supreme Kourt.
nolabels
(13,133 posts)The right wing nut jobs have some great fantasy about some great collective round up that will signal the the start of the Obama (or insert favorite bogeyman here) new era. The real truth is that new era is already here and it started decades ago. What the oligarchs do that sit on top and what they have been doing for while is incrementally taking liberties and opportunities as We the People (public) find and maybe begin to use them in our daily lives. It's the classic boil the frog. I would say mostly that the goons running the levers in cyber-security state that we are living in actually think that the entire public is the enemy and control is everything. The idea that it is part of government and it makes it not so much different from things like the departments of water and power. The only difference is the delivery is not electricity or water but a pliable population that can molded to the liking of those pulling the strings from above (the corporate largess). It's the idea that it's (or we the public) are a commodity that can be controlled and modulated and thus profited from with such apparatus.
I don't know why but somehow i would think pointing out a executive order like this would be more appropriate
Executive Order -- Improving Critical Infrastructure Cybersecurity
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2013/02/12/executive-order-improving-critical-infrastructure-cybersecurity
Government today is just a firewall or another layer between the haves and the have-nots
cali
(114,904 posts)hell, what do I mean "seems". It is an overreach.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Savannahmann
(3,891 posts)I now have the ability to get alerts from the Government. Those include Amber Alerts, and messages from the President in an emergency.
http://www.gottabemobile.com/2011/08/26/your-phone-will-soon-be-an-emergency-alert-system/
The idea is that since none of us are watching TV as much, or listening to the radio when we drive, that the cell phone is the only reliable method of getting the information out in a timely fashion.
Then there is the prioritization of the communications (telephone) networks. That is a normal wartime procedure. When you made a long distance call during World War II the operator would ask you if this call was really necessary, as though the war would be lost by you making a call to tell your Mother that your wife just had a baby, and she (your Mother) is now a proud grandmother.
The idea is that the Government phone calls are far more important than any others, and that they must go through quickly and unimpeded. So if they have to make you wait, then tough because you're just going to have to wait.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)That's stretching it a bit in my opinion.
Savannahmann
(3,891 posts)I just gave the information, provided the link, and explained the theory. I thought I pointed out how ridicules it was in my explanation that informing your mother of the birth of a new child would cause us to lose the war, but....
Governments are always self important. Governments are always authoritarian, using what ever power you give them, and whatever power you don't specifically prohibit them from using, to get what they want.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)I'm still on my first cup, blame it on CDD, caffeine deficiency disorder.
Savannahmann
(3,891 posts)If I really get annoyed, I'll send a PM insulting you. So far, only one particular poster has been dumb enough to post the insult into the thread. I laughed so hard I nearly had to change my underwear. My dog was nibbling at my ankle to check on me, and my cat left the room.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Also people listen to the radio in the car by the millions. You say 'none of are are' and that is absolute BUNK. Falsehoods. Something you made up and just said. You did not offer support for your assertion because there is none.
Savannahmann
(3,891 posts)The reasons they said they were doing it. Lighten up my friend.
kentuck
(115,397 posts)Did the President make a wise decision? Or maybe just a little hasty?
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)The last president who bucked TPTB was a guy named Jack Kennedy and we all remember what happened to him.
zeemike
(18,998 posts)That might happen in the US...
No communications no effective protest.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)We have a winner. And with communications shut down and a lapdog media no one will see or care when the tanks roll in. Won't happen under Obama, but bet on it in the next Repuke administration. Remember what they did to Occupy? Ratchet that up a couple of thousand percent. It won't be pepper spray next time.
Response to hifiguy (Reply #42)
kentuck This message was self-deleted by its author.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)
Gin
(7,212 posts)tularetom
(23,664 posts)but every time we bitch about why he hasn't done something progressive by Executive Order, all we hear is "His hands are tied by Congress. He's not a dictator."
No doubt, no doubt.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts) piratefish08
(3,133 posts)GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)Water .... slowly .... getting .... hotter.
" DON'T WORRY. OBAMA HAS GIVEN US ALL FREE HOT TUBS. YAY! "
iamthebandfanman
(8,127 posts)how dare you question our president !
Catherina
(35,568 posts)LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)to organize their actions. Flash mob strategies, for example, are pretty dependent on instant communications among people who are unhappy with their governments.
To slightly update Pogo, "The government has found the enemy, and they is us."
Apophis
(1,407 posts)You know, in the name of national security.
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)Maybe Occupy had best start investing in carrier pigeons, semaphore flags and heliographs or something.
dotymed
(5,610 posts)The patriots in Anonymous will quickly find a way to bypass this communications take-over, so if we need to organize, we can.
Actually, we should have organized long ago.
Marr
(20,317 posts)Information.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)The backdoor to extra-constitutional government is unlocked and available to any POTUS who chooses that path under the coercive pressures of the apparatchik.
atreides1
(16,799 posts)But at least he's doing it quietly and without any fanfare!
Apophis
(1,407 posts)Already in this thread I've seen supporters of this!
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)apathetic to give a shit. They have been deliberately been made that way by TPTB for the last thirty years.
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)piratefish08
(3,133 posts)with a cheering squad no less.
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)Obama already has the authority to send emergency messages by phone and TV; now he can send them by internet. That is the only sense in which communications are "seized."
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)The pissed off threshold.
loudsue
(14,087 posts)This country is going backwards very quickly. Very. Quickly.
It seems that the government wants to control every.single.thing.
Every day I become more disappointed in Obama.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)You just need high placed folks in the security forces who are capable of scaring the democracy out of the elected officials.
Modern history suggests that these 'soft' coups by people trying to protect their nations happen to republics of all sizes.
We are watching the pieces being put in place for a great 'enabling'. John Yoo scouted the way, now the bridgehead is being constructed.
loudsue
(14,087 posts)That is the whole purpose behind hate radio/faux news/corporate media. Make people afraid of what other people believe, and you have a true mental illness epidemic.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)We will celebrate the 50th anniversary of the actual coup on November 22 of this year. That is the day America died along with Jack Kennedy. It has been straight downhill ever since.
loudsue
(14,087 posts)That was the day America died. But the REAL coup came at the direction of the Powell Memorandum, by former Supreme Court Justice Lewis Powell:
(From Wikipedia)
Based in part on his experiences as a corporate lawyer and as a representative for the tobacco industry with the Virginia legislature, he wrote the Powell Memorandum to a friend at the US Chamber of Commerce. The memo called for corporate America to become more aggressive in molding politics and law in the US and may have sparked the formation of several influential right-wing think tanks[5] as well as inspiring the U.S. Chamber of Commerce to become far more politically active.
In August 1971, prior to accepting President Nixon's request to become Associate Justice of Supreme Court, Lewis Powell sent the "Confidential Memorandum" with the title, "Attack on the American Free Enterprise System." Powell argued, "The most disquieting voices joining the chorus of criticism came from perfectly respectable elements of society: from the college campus, the pulpit, the media, the intellectual and literary journals, the arts and sciences, and from politicians." In the memorandum, Powell advocated "constant surveillance" of textbook and television content, as well as a purge of left-wing elements.
This memo foreshadowed a number of Powell's most notable[neutrality is disputed] court opinions, especially First National Bank of Boston v. Bellotti, which shifted the direction of First Amendment law by declaring that corporate financial influence of elections through independent expenditures should be protected with the same vigor as individual political speech. Much of the future Court opinion in Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission relied on the same arguments raised in Bellotti.
Powell actually went into great detail in letters and memorandums -- especially in concert with Adolph Coors--- about how to take over ALL media, all influence over colleges, churches, and, of course, all governments (city, county, state, federal). With Ronald Reagan being the spawn of the Powell manifesto, the fascist/corporatist takeover of the USA is almost complete.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Though I must point out Powell wrote that before he was nominated to the Court, where he proved to be the essence of reasonable moderation most of the time.
I think he would be horrified by what has been made of this.
ForeignandDomestic
(190 posts)and they desperately don't want those thought crimes spreading, so they want to be able to have the power to cut it off at the path!
Harmony Blue
(3,978 posts)This can't be real...right? 
byeya
(2,842 posts)the indefensible. It won't be too long before the posts start appearing with the results from the scribes.
"Stay on the message laddies"
DCBob
(24,689 posts)
ileus
(15,396 posts)when the newest Iphone is released or starbucks creates a new morning coffee.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Who knew Star Wars could e so prophetic?
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)
Zorra
(27,670 posts)If an effective mass general strike occurred, they would shut off our ability to communicate with each other, and then order a nationwide curfew.
Maybe Egypt scared them into this.
byeya
(2,842 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)as squarely as it can be hit.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)heaven05
(18,124 posts)there something else going on here besides our rights being abridged? I knew the internet could/can be cut off at any time. Radio and television also. But to put it on an directive for all to know it's coming. Something unsettling here.
maybe a little bit scary
?
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)Judging from the responses, I'd say no. Read beyond the big scary headlines, and you may become enlightened (or, at least properly informed).
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)The order says this is pursuant to section 706 of the Communications Act of 1934 (47 U.S. C. 6066), which states, in part:
“The President, if he deems it necessary in the interest of national security or defense, may suspend or amend, for such time as he may see fit, the rules and regulations applicable to any or all stations or devices capable of emitting electromagnetic radiations within the jurisdiction of the United States . . . and may cause the closing of any station for radio communication, or any device capable of emitting electromagnetic radiations between 10 kilocycles and 100,000 megacycles . . . and the removal therefrom of its apparatus and equipment, or he may authorize the use or control of any such station or device and/or its apparatus and equipment, by any department of the Government under such regulations as he may prescribe upon just compensation to the owners.”
Obama’s executive order authorizes the heads of Homeland Security and the Office of Science and Technology Policy to make recommendations to the President on how he might enforce that 1934 law.
It also empowers the head of Homeland Security to make sure, “in conditions of crisis or emergency,” that the executive branch maintains “priority communications requirements through the use of commercial, government, and privately owned communications resources.”
Now I’m not doubting that the executive branch needs to prepare for emergencies, but I do worry about the accretion of power in the hands of the President—any President.
The Electronic Privacy Information Center notes that Obama tried to accomplish the aims of this executive order legislatively, but failed to do so.
“Under the executive order, the White House has also granted the Department [of Homeland Security] the authority to seize private facilities when necessary, effectively shutting down or limiting civilian communications,” the group notes. “ In 2011, Congress considered similar provisions in cybersecurity legislation, which would have allowed the government to disconnect communications traffic in times of national security. Following public protest, Congress abandoned the proposal.”
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)Sec. 7. General Provisions. (a) For the purposes of this order, the word "agency" shall have the meaning set forth in section 6.1(b) of Executive Order 13526 of December 29, 2009.
(b) Executive Order 12472 of April 3, 1984, as amended, is hereby revoked.
(c) Executive Order 12382 of September 13, 1982, as amended, is further amended by striking the following language from section 2(e): "in his capacity as Executive Agent for the National Communications System".
(d) Nothing in this order shall be construed to impair or otherwise affect:
(i) the authority granted by law to an agency, or the head thereof; or
(ii) the functions of the Director of the OMB relating to budgetary, administrative, or legislative proposals.
(e) This order shall be implemented consistent with applicable law and subject to the availability of appropriations.
(f) This order is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by any party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person.
Now, go read up on EO 12472 and EO 12382. Chill your poutrage. Seems you're spending today posting vague EOs by a President YOU think is a "moron".
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)I think he's a very complex individual.
You seem to be trying to force the conversation into something confrontational.
As you said "Chill your poutrage. Seems you're spending today posting vague EOs by a President YOU think is a "moron".
Question about your statement: Since when was a EO ever vague?
Your statements aside. This last portion is for promoting transparency
"This memorandum is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by a party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person."
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/TransparencyandOpenGovernment
All the other entries you list simply reinforce the directive postulated.
But you are welcome to interpret it any way you like.
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)It's getting SO obvious.
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)temmer
(358 posts)
ananda
(35,080 posts)One or two things happen, and then wham! we're
a seriously fascist police state.
Response to Katashi_itto (Original post)
Post removed
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)It just says the Obama can send emergency messages over the Internet, just like it already can through the TV. But the Internet reaches more and more people these days so it could be that much more important as a way of reaching people in an emergency.
dballance
(5,756 posts)I'm assuming you alerted and got the "Impeach Now" post hidden. Thank you. I haven't read the order yet but now I will.
greatauntoftriplets
(178,948 posts)Someone I went to grade school with posted a thing on Facebook saying that President Obama should be impeached for the trip to Africa, which she described as a "family trip" -- I took it to mean vacation. I controlled myself and didn't reply, but thought
Whisp
(24,096 posts)Wish we can jury that kind of shit here.
Skittles
(171,595 posts)that would solve THAT problem
Whisp
(24,096 posts)o yay, so easy. Why didn't I think of that.
Skittles
(171,595 posts)DONATE
you'll never get rid of IMPEACH OBAMA ads in a FREE COUNTRY
Whisp
(24,096 posts)Skittles
(171,595 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)here at DU. They just want an excuse to hate Obama and the federal government.
Same hateful idiots reccing every such thread.
Baitball Blogger
(52,299 posts)the racketeering that goes on in my community.
Response to Katashi_itto (Original post)
madrchsod This message was self-deleted by its author.
GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)Yeah. I'll bet he did.
We are so screwed.
jsr
(7,712 posts)Regardless, I trust the President to do the RIGHT thing always. After all, he's like a vehicle that can only make RIGHT turns.
Silent3
(15,909 posts)Could be excessive even at that, but you make it sound like an extension of surveillance by cutting the title off at "communications". That's misleading.
In the current climate at DU, however, anything but joining in on the frenzy and getting mad as hell, based on facts or not, counts as being an "authoritarian", I suppose. Misleading posts in the service of generating anger could be viewed as a public service by the "true" champions of liberty.
Silent3
(15,909 posts)I see that's now been edited, only after the feeding frenzy from the original title got started. Edited mere moments ago, like just before you responded to my post. Curious.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)of the article as close as possible.
ucrdem
(15,720 posts)djean111
(14,255 posts)this means we cannot be alarmed about it now that it has been brought to our attention?
This is like telling the frogs being boiled that hey, you knew the water was getting warmer!
ucrdem
(15,720 posts)It pertains to emergency preparedness and we've seen how national emergencies can be handled badly (Katrina) or well (Sandy). I prefer the Obama approach.
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)This is about giving Obama the authority to send emergency messages to the public through every means, not just through the TV. Since more and more people use the internet these days, being able to send messages directly through it -- "seizing" the Internet just as the TV is "seized" while an emergency message is playing -- could save lives in an emergency.
madrchsod
(58,162 posts)the core of this issue was passed in 1934.
yes i fell for this bullshit russian 'fox news' source.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)
BumRushDaShow
(169,349 posts)
sufrommich
(22,871 posts)anti government conspiracy theories,all the time. This whole thread is Alex Jones nonsense.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)nolabels
(13,133 posts)professor and taught US Constitutional law has a syllabus or at least a set of notes. Seem that there is someone that has gone far afield from any of the ideas that might have been taught there
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)
jehop61
(1,735 posts)Why didn't you bitch about it then? We had an election after it. Or perhaps it was not as dire then as your leading us to believe? Hello Mr. TROLL
Demit
(11,238 posts)We forfeit the right to be scared if we don't say we're scared soon enough? Explain why, please.
Th1onein
(8,514 posts)I did not know about this order. It is probable that others did not know about it, either.
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)they would be screaming their heads off!
This doesn't mean what the OP says it does. Snopes is your friend.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Th1onein
(8,514 posts)But the fact that you would ask me that while neglecting to explain what it has to do with this order makes very clear that you don't care about whether I'm enlightened about it, but rather want to use that fact as a battering ram to somehow prove your supposedly superior intelligence.
Please proceed.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)EXECUTIVE ORDER
- - - - - - -
ASSIGNMENT OF NATIONAL SECURITY AND
EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS COMMUNICATIONS FUNCTIONS
This has nothing to do with spying. It's about guaranteeing the federal government the ability to conduct emergency communications to the general public. Read through the hype.
The OP troll breathless exclaims "In explaining the order, the Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC) writes that the president has authorized the DHS "the authority to seize private facilities when necessary, effectively shutting down or limiting civilian communications."
Well, that's exactly what happens every time you hear that annoying tone on your tv, followed by "This is a test of the Emergency Broadcast System. This is only a test."
Th1onein
(8,514 posts)We already have had that system in place for decades. Are you saying that this 2012 Executive Order is necessary for the Emergency Broadcast System and that's all?
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)You tell me what the big deal is.
What language in there is so explosive? Why is it that only Putin's mouthpiece is hyping it, and that's a year after the fact?
Th1onein
(8,514 posts)Then you accuse me of having my hair on fire. Geez.
Welcome to my ignore list, geek tragedy.
DCBob
(24,689 posts) pnwmom
(110,254 posts)The President has given himself the authority to send emergency messages to the public through all means of communication including the internet, not just through phones and TV.
The internet is "seized" only in the sense that the TV is "seized" while an emergency broadcast is being issued.
kenny blankenship
(15,689 posts)You want him to only seize Republicans' communications or something? That wouldn't be bipartisan at all. So how could he get Republicans to go along with cutting Social Security if he treated them that way? This is how Grown Ups® in the Vital Center® Get Stuff Done®! Watch and learn, you leftard whiny babies!
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)to people who are on the Internet, not just to those who happen to be watching TV.
pinto
(106,886 posts)I live near a nuke plant, we routinely have TV interrupted - or as RT would put it "taken over" - for a test of the Emergency Management System.
ProSense
(116,464 posts)http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/ndrp.asp
Sorry to interrupt.
dballance
(5,756 posts)I read the order. It really sounds a lot like the already existing Emergency Broadcast System (and I'm stretching to find that in there) that has yet to take control of our lives and start spewing propaganda. It seeks to be able to ensure the Executive Branch can maintain communications. I missed any part of the order that says it allow the DHS or President to seize all communications in the US. If someone else can point me to that section I'd appreciate it.
The article is from RT. Not exactly the most balanced reporting source. Frankly, after reading the order then reading the article - again - its reporting is horrendous on the subject. Progressive.org does no better.
Zen Democrat
(5,901 posts)mick063
(2,424 posts)The wing nut prophecies are coming true.
pnwmom
(110,254 posts)Last edited Sun Jul 7, 2013, 01:05 PM - Edit history (1)
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/executiveorders.aspgeek tragedy
(68,868 posts)mick063
(2,424 posts)I am agnostic.
Chained CPI has inspired me to poke with a stick whenever the opportunity arises.
Catherina
(35,568 posts)"quietly signed his name to an Executive Order on Friday" but had not even 1 second to address the growing diplomatic scandal and crisis that is directly related to this Executive Order.
Wake the fuck up America.
"Wake the fuck up America."
Welcome to Obama's Amerika
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023191175
Didn't you post this Executive order a year ago? I never heard about it in the media but I see it was on the White House web page.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Russia Times. Not to be trusted blindly.
Catherina
(35,568 posts)I don't know why you weren't on my ignore list, but you are now. I prefer not to waste my time reading such subservient opinions that only defend the most indefensible assaults on the American people.
Be well but goodbye.
treestar
(82,383 posts)You ONLY will believe the worst of the American government, which BTW, is made up of the American people and duly elected representatives.
All you can resort to is personal attack and not listening to things you don't want to hear.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)janlyn
(735 posts)when it comes to lack of trust for my government. However I base that mistrust on factual information I have researched. I do not go running for the hills when someone hollers that the sky is falling. The reason, because I have learned that most people are full of shit, and will lie or stretch the truth to suit their agenda.
That being said I have read the entire thing and nowhere does it say that the government can't do what they have always done through the powers of the FCC.
And while I do believe that our rights ARE being eroded, I don't believe that adopting right wing tactics of exaggerating or telling outright lies helps at all.
Cry wolf enough times and when the real issue occurs know one will believe a freaking word. For gods sake people what happened to reading comprehension, attention spans needed to do the research and critical thinking skills.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)this wins the prize.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)From 2012, and it merely extends the emergency broadcast system to the Internet.
Froth away, Teabagger wannabes.
Peacetrain
(24,288 posts)Seriously.. good bye!
With more and more people watching TV.. netflex.. listening to the radio.. communication with internet phones.. OF COURSE we want our emergency broadcasting extended to the internet//
Hokum ..that is what you posted hokum..
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Addition by subtraction.
Benton D Struckcheon
(2,347 posts)it approaches absolute zero in its moronity quotient, as do the responses from the folks who are actually agreeing with this unbelievable claptrap.
For this I didn't need to leave the far right politics sections of some of the forums I go to. Why, when I can get the same paranoid bs right here? Extraordinary. Beyond belief.
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)that DUers are far better informed than the average citizen.
And if you have any doubt of that, this thread should serve as proof positive of that notion.
I will add the thingy - not for you, but for the sarcasm-impaired who need it spelled out for them in visual form in order to understand it.
kentuck
(115,397 posts)I never heard about it? Anyone else?
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)but this just creeps me out. I am so 20th Century.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)This is a year-old EO regarding the Emergency Broadcast System.
VOX
(22,976 posts)RT (Russia Today) seems to have a vested long-term interest in casting Americans in a negative light. They've also spent much airtime on Ron Paul, New World Order bunk, etc. Anyone can confirm this via Google.
Any source that's not allowed to be critical of Vladimir Putin can't be considered very reliable.
bunnies
(15,859 posts)
Deuce
(960 posts)bunnies
(15,859 posts)Unfuckingbelievable. 
FrodosPet
(5,169 posts)LOLcats are far more important than emergency communications.
http://cheezburger.com/5694586112
Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)For the hilarious freakouts.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Think of it as entertainment
Californeeway
(97 posts)so we can warn more people of major emergencies and disasters and save lives...............
.........and somehow we are supposed to read dark intentions into this.........
*sigh*