Here's What Happens When Someone Wants To Use YOUR "PUBLIC" INFO To INTIMIDATE YOU.

[Segami]

It's unnecessary to review all the diaries on the subject of the NSA, the recent postal service info and so on. You've either read them or you haven't. If you have, perhaps you've taken a position on whether or not this is all a bunch of hysterical people with their hair on fire over nothing, or it's a window into uncontrolled surveillance of peoples private lives that violates our rights and need for privacy in our lives. Let me point you to how the GOP in North Carolina is using people's data to intimidate them...now...today...and possibly with government assistance.






If you've been following current events in North Carolina you know the recently empowered GOP legislature (and GOP governor) have been on a roll to slash and burn healthcare, unemployment benefits, taxes on the wealthy and corporations, and more. Yesterday they attached, and passed in the Senate, a very restrictive abortion clause to a bill about "Sharia Law." (This particularly odious action was cleverly designed to hopefully pass below the horizon of public view and opinion, but did not...although the protestors were told to be quiet because the only voices that mattered were those of the Senators.) In response, thousands of North Carolinians have gone to the capital building to peacefully protest. Hundreds have been arrested...booked, finger-printed...mug shots...the whole banana. These are the Moral Monday protestors we're talking about...good citizens from all walks of life.




Lo and behold, the Civitas Institute..a right-wing "think tank" and public policy influence organization founded and financed by Gazillionaire retailer Art Pope...who is also the appointed NC Budget Director...immediately put up several web pages with all the collected info on the arrested protestors. You can see it here, but I ask that you read on before going back to the Civitas site... http://www.nccivitas.org/. When you do visit this steaming pile of crap, be sure to page through the various options to see how they've turned intimidation into a game. So...you're a good citizen peacefully protesting...you're arrested for trespassing...and now here you are on the intertoobs...your name, address, sex, age, race, party, occupation, employer, salary if available, alleged voter registration violation (address not matching registration)....etc. There has been some speculation as to just how the Civitas folks were able to get all the data so rapidly...implying possible cooperation from someone in government.



Now, just for fun, imagine if the Civitas folks had all your postal, internet, email, and financial "meta data" and they listed some carefully selected magazines you subscribe to..web sites you visit...places where you've made purchases and how much you spent, you name it. Innocent or not...and none of their business...they could twist this to make anyone look like whatever they choose. John Q. Smith...subscribes to xyz magazine, spent money at the xyz club, was delinquent on property taxes last year, buys books on the following subjects...mother in nursing home under medicaid yet purchased a $900 xyz last week....sends emails twice a week to woman in Soviet Union... You name it... A totally misleading picture could be constructed to try someone in the court of public opinion. Doesn't matter if the magazine is Playboy or Forbes, the club is a "gentlemans club" or a golf club...it all depends on the story they're trying to construct for their audience. Heck, they could make someone look bad or suspicious for darn near anything...and it's none of their damn business even if technology has made it available. Now...go look at the Civitas stuff. Then decide whether or not you want to let the government, and by association those entities involved with the government or politics ...who might not like you for some reason....to have unfettered, unjustified, and pervasive access to your daily life and activities.


cont'




http://www.opednews.com/articles/Here-s-what-happens-when-s-by-Daily-kos-130707-757.html

[idwiyo]

1. K&R Someone will be here shortly to explain how it's all your (generic) fault because

a) you are using internet, mobile phone, credit cards, etc., etc.
b) signed agreements to give your metadata away (like there was an option for example not to, or ISP that will sell you services without that agreement)
c) Government will NEVER do such thing
d) you dont have anything to be afraid of if you dont do anything illegal
e) you hate Obama

[Segami]

3. Make it so......

[idwiyo]

4. ...

[BehindTheCurtain76]

108. NSAsses

Russ Tice from NSA said NSA has already been doing this to politicians and judges to the highest level for 10 years. it's all about leverage and blackmail to get them to play the game. I wonder if John Edwards boondoggle was known about by NSA...he was the only candidate that was talking about TWO Americas and TWO systems of justice.

[idwiyo]

111. I can only imagine what kind of dirt NSA has on politicians in France, Italy, Portugal, and Spain to

force them into violation of Vienna convention.

On a related note:

The imbeciles who are arguing that incident with Bolivian presidential plane wasn't a big deal seemingly can't comprehend the enormity of the situation.
It only takes ONE incident to set a precedent. From now on there is no doubt whatsoever that Vienna convention is 'just a piece of paper' and not a binding agreement.

Every single arsehole who was involved in that incident should be fucking charged by now and get their arses dragged into Hague and made an example of with the most severe and swift punishment avalable.

More than anything I want to know what is it that US government thinks Snowden has? I can hardly imagine anyone going apeshit at such spectacular level without much better reason than what was leaked already.

[BehindTheCurtain76]

117. Thank You

Some people would excuse pedophilia or murder if they thought it might cast a bad light on their favorite administration. Unless people start supporting only what is right instead of a 'team' then nothing will ever change. Of course Morales was illegally 'detained'...for all the little people out there, if you lock someone I'm a closet you will get charged with felony kidnapping. Nitpickers are such hypocrites.

[sabrina 1]

24. And that you don't own your own data!

I wonder if they realize how they sound when they argue FOR those policies?

So here's my opinion, THEY are the collaborators who are making the loss of our rights possible. I don't really blame the criminals, criminals do what they do and we were supposedly prepared to recognize them when they came along.

I blame the collaborators, those who excuse criminal behavior, who choose to hand over their rights to criminal elements, blindly and willingly, because without them, this would not be happening.

[rhett o rick]

29. Bullies wouldnt be effective w/o their enablers. nm

[markiv]

31. yup - never saw any bully in school

that went about their 'business', without blind eyes of classmates and teachers

[rhett o rick]

33. Or the open eyes of their authoritarian little buddies. You can see it happen here in DU. nm

[awoke_in_2003]

76. The term "Vichy" comes to mind. nt

[Katashi_itto]

121. Plenty of NSA water carriers here on DU

[rhett o rick]

122. They hate anything that upsets their status quo. nm

[idwiyo]

48. I beleive it all starts with "the haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy"

in a way that is not approved by the authoritarians. 'Happy' in this case includes everything - way of life, beliefs, political affiliation, you name it. It doesn't matter if what you do doesn't affect them directly, the actual idea that you are doing it is enough to make them want to stop you from doing it.

The only way to control that is by supporting a wide set of countermeasures, typically called 'laws', but only those that are approved by authoritarians of course.

This is why I am not buying the 'we need it to fight terrorism' BS. Like fuck they do. They want an ability to control everyone and gathering data about everyone is the best way to control them.

The most laughable part is that little authoritarian enablers honestly believe they have nothing to fear because they support the "government".

[Divernan]

83. What we have here is an infestation of Quislings.

A quisling (/ˈkwɪzlɪŋ/; Norwegian pronunciation: [ˈkʋɪsˈlɪŋ]) is a person who collaborated with Axis forces in occupied Allied countries during World War II - including members of fascist and collaborationist political parties and military and paramilitary forces. In contemporary usage, quisling is synonymous with traitor, and particularly applied to politicians who appear to favour the interests of other cultures (as in 1 percent/corporate cultures) over their own (99 percent).

The term quisling was coined by the British newspaper The Times in an editorial published on 19 April 1940, entitled "Quislings everywhere" after the Norwegian Vidkun Quisling, who assisted Nazi Germany as it conquered his own country so that he could rule the collaborationist Norwegian government himself. The Daily Mail picked up the term four days later, and the BBC then brought it into common use internationally. The Times' editorial asserted: "To writers, the word Quisling is a gift from the gods. If they had been ordered to invent a new word for traitor... they could hardly have hit upon a more brilliant combination of letters. Aurally it contrives to suggest something at once slippery and tortuous."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quisling

And the rationalizations put forth in support of NSA massive data gathering is indeed slippery and tortuous!

[Diclotican]

96. Divernan

Divernan

But Vidkun Abraham Lauritz Jonssøn Quisling got his due - he got shot at Akershus Fortress and Castle in 1945 - for the treason he did - when he was collaborating with the German occupying forces who hold Norway from 9 april 1940 - to may 8 1945 (even though the last german soldiers was not leaving Norway before October the same year)

It might end the same way with the enablers in the US too - they got their due when due process is finished..

Diclotican

[Divernan]

97. I'll be satisfied if these greedy bankers & war-mongering profiteers end up in prison!

The latest I heard from a high level banking friend is that NSA has been selling info to corporations.

[Diclotican]

101. Divernan

Divernan

Many of them should indeed end up in prison - both the bankers - and the war profiteers from the many wars the US are involved in...

I would not be surprised if the NSA, or the outsourced groups who do the job at the behalf of NSA, do sell info to corporations for money - it is a way of give the NSA "dark money" who they can use outside of national control.. NSA, the CIA and most of the other alphabet soup who is part of the US "security system" is far out of control for any civilian government today....

And that is absolutely a danger - when they also have the knowledge about your inner toughs or your personal money....

Diclotican

[sabrina 1]

112. I always wondered where that word came from. Thank you for a very imformative post.

[HiPointDem]

103. here's what i don'y get about that: the public paid for the public r&d that created the digital

age, & the public pays for the phone & the phone bill.

the public creates the 'content'.

so why don't we own our own data?

do we have to incorporate our persons to have that right?

[L0oniX]

27. K & R ...the usual nonsense ...it's the law ...right or wrong.

[JDPriestly]

47. Then let's petition the government (like the First Amendment says we can)

and change the law.

Woops! We can't. Why? Because the law is SECRET. We don't even know what it says.

That's one reason that this law and the activities performed under it are unconstitutional and therefore worse than illegal (if there is a worse that is illegal).

How can you petition the government to change a law if the law is secret and you can't even know what it says?

[L0oniX]

50. You "also" can't vote Goldman Sachs out of office. Petition? What's that???

You measure a democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists.- Abbie Hoffman

[JDPriestly]

90. Under the First Amendment to our Constitution, we have the guaranteed right to petition the governme

U.S. Constitution

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/first_amendment

The American right of petition is derived from British precedent. In Blackstone's Comment, Last published in 1765, Americans in the Thirteen Colonies read that "the right of petitioning the king, or either house of parliament, for the redress of grievances" was a "right appertaining to every individual."[3]

In 1776, the Declaration of Independence cited King George's perceived failure to redress the grievances listed in colonial petitions, such as the Olive Branch Petition of 1775, as a justification to declare independence:

In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.[4]

Historically, the right can be traced back[2] to English documents such as Magna Carta, which, by its acceptance by the monarchy, implicitly affirmed the right, and the later Bill of Rights 1689, which explicitly declared the "right of the subjects to petition the king."[5]

More:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_petition_in_the_United_States

Thus, secret courts that issue secret laws or rulings violate our right.

[L0oniX]

92. Good luck with that unless you are Goldman Sachs and what GS represents.

If all the people who yelled out for gun control didn't get any then ....whatever. They are ignoring us. We can't compete with billionaires.

[ReRe]

104. Hear Hear, JD!

While I was reading downward in your reply, agreeing with your words, I kept saying to myself... the Magna Carta... the Magna Carta... and there it was.

We ought to be able to take free U.S. History classes online and better yet free classes on Constitutional Law. And if there is one for each or both of them, why don't I know about it? Hell, it might be a good thing to sign up all of three branches of government to take these classes, since it seems like they have forgot all of it. Either that or there's another Constitution that they're working from and I would love to see that thing!

[JDPriestly]

105. That would be wonderful.

My high school history classes didn't even scratch the surface. I've read a lot, but my knowledge is somewhat disorganized when it comes to American history, and I love it.

[ReRe]

106. Ha! I can't believe that.

You have an excellent grasp of U.S. History. I don't know why some are put off and are bored by history. Takes all kinds, I guess. I think the reason I have always liked it is because I was very close to my old grandmother who was sharp as a tack. She was born in 1880. She would tell me stories about when she was a little girl, with no TV or radio. It was like a living history class when I was around her...

[Fantastic Anarchist]

91. Very well said. nt

[idwiyo]

102. Yeah, that and how one should martyr themselves and go to prison because that's what Real Patriot

would do.

Or something equally asinine.

[abelenkpe]

2. We need laws and regulations that prohibit such things

[starroute]

8. If we did, they'd only be used when Anonymous doxed people

And never on the Art Popes of this world.

Inequality is a one-way mirror. They always get to look in on you, and you never get to look back at them.

I haven't felt altogether comfortable with Anonymous doxing people. It can focus attention on the guilty, but it's also been known to misfire and harm the innocent. However, any attempt to criminalize it would become just one more tool of repression.

[abelenkpe]

12. So we can't rely on

Government to protect people from rich and powerful individuals and corporations, or for needed benefits and services during times of distress, then what good is it at all?

[moondust]

74. Speaking of Anonymous...

This NC thing would seem to be a ripe target for them to obtain and release personal information on everyone who works at Civitas and everyone associated with them. Plus their internal documents.

Hello Anonymous?

[rainy]

35. Will we ever be able to get it without a bloody fight?

Power gives up nothing without a fight! I'm thinking we could have a peaceful reclaiming of our rights but enough people would have to be onboard. A sea change of mindset is needed.

[Pale Blue Dot]

5. Holy shit.

I just checked the http://www.nccivitas.org/ website. I urge everyone to take a look. It's terrifying.

[abelenkpe]

13. +1000 very scary

[think]

18. Screen shot with mug shots

[URL=/][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

[L0oniX]

20. Now appearing on mugshots.com and forever indexed by Google...

along with Google ads for removing mugshots for $399.

[think]

25. Is there a family plan?

[L0oniX]

28. Well ...there is a "Hottie" section.

[sabrina 1]

32. Is there a way someone could start a website using those exact same photos to

honor them? I know there are ways to get things up on Google but have no idea how it's done.

Using certain words that will attract more hits etc. And than another website, a Hall of Shame, featuring the faces of the criminals who are responsible for this.

From the beginning it seemed obvious that the Massive Surveillance programs they are trying to pass off as for our 'security', had nothing to do with security.

The scandal they are trying so hard to cover up is that this data mining is all for Business purposes. I wonder how much they paid to get that information?

And who sold it to them?

Is the one of the first glimpses into what this Surveillance program is all about? If only we had some good investigative reporters, like Mike Hastings RIP, who could dig into this and expose this massive scam that is actually being defended right here on DU.

[lark]

42. Apalled and dismayed.

I can't believe the # of people on this progressive site that are actually saying that they don't have a problem with our big brother surveillance state. Don't know whether it's because Obama is president so there certainly couldn't be anything currently wrong with it or they have no imagination, foresight or knowledge of history - probably there's both kinds.

[aquart]

120. Well, thank you for your support.

Maybe not everyone sees complex national and international issues in simplistic black and white. Snowden is shocked that spies spy. I ain't.

But to get hysterical because the government does what Google does?

Eh. My 92-year-old mom is still furious that Social Security numbers are being used for I.D. when the government absolutely, positively promised they wouldn't be.

[reusrename]

75. Love this idea!

I can ask around a little bit.

[sabrina 1]

113. If you can't stop them, then beat them at their own game, and we get to use their

ill-gotten info free as a bonus. It would be like taking the weapon out of their hands and using it against them.

I hope someone does it, this is a shameful, scary thing to do and it definitely needs some serious pushback.

[mahina]

63. Thanks for this. The photos were taken down. It's chilling to see.

.

[think]

65. They are still up on the site. It is revolving picture number 2 I think

[October]

51. There's a GAME associated with those shots???

Omg these people are sick to the core.

[Enthusiast]

68. Sick?

No more sick than these guys.

[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

[TalkingDog]

71. Ermmmm.... Zombie Nazis?

Non-existent, so I don't think that's a good example.

Howz about:

[lastlib]

57. Chilling. Giving these people power would be like going back to the fourteenth century.

I could see our nation becoming Afghanistan on steroids.

[truth2power]

6. K&R. Thanks. Keep getting that info out there. n/t

[AllyCat]

7. THIS is the real reason behind doing all this surveillance.

Sure, maybe we'll catch a terrahist at some point, but THIS will help control all us uppity democracy nuts. Cannot believe I am seeing this with Democractic control of two "houses". Appalling.

[tsuki]

21. Let's face it. To the government and the 1%, these are the terrorists. nt

[SunSeeker]

54. The government did not do this. A right wing private individual did this.

The way I see it, the government is the only thing standing between us and the 1% feeling free to do whatever they want to us. Government regulation is what stops the 1% from dumping sludge in our waters at will, failing to at least pay a worker what was promised, etc. To bash the government, particularly in response to a post about what a private right wing individual did, is just insanity and shows how well the Republican anti-government meme has taken hold in our society.

[lastlib]

59. And yet, when government aids and abets that right-wing individual.....

... (or group), it is not exactly friendly to the rest of the people.

[SunSeeker]

62. How did the government "aid and abet" Pope with his website? nt

[lastlib]

64. obviously it gave him the mugshots

and the related info.

It promulgated the laws and regulations that enabled him to have the info and post it. It gave him tax cuts and other financial/legal assistance that enabled him to finance it.

[SunSeeker]

69. That is all public info available as required by open government laws the people demanded.

You offer absolutely no evidence for the inflammatory assertion that the government "aids and abets" Pope to put up this website. The government has nothing to do with his website. Pope is an anti-government nutbag. The government did not target him with tax cuts just so he could put up his website. Everyone got tax cuts, including the middle class, under Obama. The government did not give Pope "financial/legal assistance" to start the website. How about you direct your anger at Pope, who actually did this?

[Blanks]

73. Whoa, a voice of reason on this thread.

If I remember correctly the democrats were for a strong government to keep the wealthy from oppressing the poor.

Apparently that's accusing them 'their hair is on fire'.

It seems to me that emails between the scumbags at Enron revealed when that scandal broke just what kind of despicable shenanigans went on.

I want the government to have legal authority to subpoena electronic documents when big business is trying to screw the people over. I guess that makes me pro-surveillance.

It's a question of where do you draw the line. Are the 'hair on fire crowd' unknowingly fighting for the bankers. Are they fighting to prevent the 'behind closed doors deals' that the bankers used to coordinate the crash from coming to light if the democrats do gain control of the house after the next election and vote to fund Dodd-Frank? Or is this 'debate' engineered to prevent the democrats from taking over the house? I guess we will see.

It's like the sweet little old ladies who wanted to make this a better country by prohibiting the manufacture and consumption of alcohol. They couldn't have known that the mob would be the ones that benefitted. Of course now we have the knowledge of how prohibition didn't really benefit the people who fought for it, and it happened to the 'tort reform' folks too. You'd think people would try to let this play out in their minds with some kind of similar historical incident.

That isn't enough to get people to stop and think about who is really going to benefit if the 'hair on fire folks' get their way, whatever that is. Can somebody tell me where they think this is all going to lead? It looks like an anti-government campaign to me too.

[AllyCat]

79. Government agency (NSA) set up to make this possible for private individuals

How did this "private right wing individual" come by this information?

[SunSeeker]

80. No, the NSA has nothing to do with this.

Arrest records are generally available under FOIA and state public records "Sunshine Laws" that are designed to make government records available to the public. Usually private information like home addresses and such are exempted from such laws, but that information is generally readily available on the internet, via facebook, etc. Ever do a Google search on yourself?

[AllyCat]

81. Yes. And now that all that info is sitting in government or contracted-out-private company databanks

all it takes is the right amount of money (and I wonder who has that kind of cash) to get everything you need on one person. I mean, who needs Googlemonster?

[SunSeeker]

85. Arrest records are not held by "contracted-out-private company databanks."

Booz Allen did not give Pope these records. The arrest records in questions are held by the local arresting authorities in NC. They are available to everyone. You can't get them from the NSA, nor can you get from the NSA what you can get from Google. The data the NSA is collecting is telephone meta data, and it is not available to you or any private citizen via a FOIA request. Again, the NSA has nothing to do with this incident.

[AllyCat]

86. Everyone has their price. Why collect the data?

[SunSeeker]

87. The local authorities are required by law to maintain arrest records.

Do you have any evidence that Pope bribed some government official for this information, that is otherwise available for free?

[AllyCat]

107. So all these people arrested should have their OTHER personal information available to the highest

bidder? Of course they are required to maintain arrest records. But this is beyond arrest records. This is a bunch of other stuff. They take all this meta data and twist it to something that makes it sound like these dastardly protesters are just the scum of the earth. Who knows where they got all this data. Maybe they got it all at intertoob sources that any of us could find "for free". But, boy, there sure is a bunch of data collected on people who some in power might not like.

But I can't imagine in a free America and all that ANYONE would EVER try to get their hands on that information. So you can defend the people who have collected this stuff on you, and me, and everyone else, but ultimately whoever does this without a warrant has violated Constitutional law. Will you bark about this when the next non-D POTUS collects data on us all?

[SunSeeker]

109. Wow. I'm not defending anyone. I'm just saying Pope is to blame.

He is the one who put the site up, using readily available information. And you are right, who knows where he got the info, but he could have gotten easily by way of public records requests and the internet. This was not meta data. I just wish you'd direct your anger at the proper individual. I see that is a lost cause.

[Melinda]

100. NC's Budget Director did this; he is a Govt Official w/access to whatever he likes - collaboration

between a right wing millionaire who has bought his position in govt (as well as buying the State house and its reps), combined with Citizens United, and assisted by Ed Gillespie ('member him?) and the govt he bought and paid for are the parents of this.

Take a moment and read a bit about Mr. Pope:

Art Pope Exposed
Pope, Citizens United, and NC
Art Pope, Koch Bros, and owning NC

NC is owned and operated by Art Pope, period. And NC is not the only state owned and operated by the 1%. I do hope you read the links and follow to see how not only the State govts, but our very Federal govt are being assimilated and operated by Corporations - the 1%.

Call it what it is - fascism is here.

[SunSeeker]

110. None of those links say NC's budget director did this.

I totally agree with you that Art Pope is an evil right wing millionaire, but he did this, not the NC budget director. Pope used information readily available to him, he did not need to own NC to put up the Civitas website.

[Melinda]

114. Oh. for heavens sake, you couldn't be bothered to READ the links!!

"...But now, after being appointed the most powerful position in N.C. Gov. Pat McCrory's cabinet -- director of budget policy -- Pope is again the target of national scrutiny." <<<< From the very first link

Here's a brand new, shorter one:

"James Arthur "Art" Pope (born May 5, 1956)[1] is a North Carolina politician, businessman, attorney and philanthropist. In January 2013, he became Budget Director for North Carolina Governor Pat McCrory"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Pope#Public_service_and_political_involvement

Stop feigning ignorance - you sound like PR for Art Pope.

[SunSeeker]

115. So we're in agreement that Pope did this.

Last edited Tue Jul 9, 2013, 01:47 AM - Edit history (1)

I read your three previous links. Really. I was not feigning ignorance. The info was not in the 3 links you first provided. Of those three links, the first (and I watched the 2 minute video) talked about his Koch connections, about how he basically funds Republicans in NC. The remaining 2 links were from 2011 and said nothing about the budget director position; as your new link points out, he did not join McCrory's cabinet until January of 2013.

I wasn't sure what you were trying to say, it seemed that you were suggesting Pope did not do this and that instead some NC bureaucrat posted the site. I've been going back and forth with someone one one this thread who insists the NSA is to blame. I honestly thought you were going there as well since you jumped into the same subthread.

Regardless, we appear to be in agreement. Pope is the person behind the Civitas webpage. He probably does have easy access to state info, but seems all of the info he posted could be gotten through public records law requests. And he does not need to do illegal surveillance to get it. Arrest records are publicly available records. It appears that everything on that Civitas site is stuff you could dig up with an internet search.

Is there something on the Civitas site that could only be obtained from private state records? If so, is there an NC law that protects those records from being released--something that Pope could be charged with violating? I'm just asking. I'm not from NC. I know there are such laws here in CA.

[Melinda]

116. I don't know if he accessed State held info or not, but I do know that Bossism is alive & well in NC

And the history of political bosses is well documented in that they have used inside information to harm their enemies. Like you, I'm from CA - I'm north of you in central Cali, so NC is foreign to me too.

I do know that the right-wing machine ugliness has no limitations, and it's my belief, based on the history of Pope's actions to buy the State and his work to suppress the vote, that he's one of the ugliest. Bossism has been around since democracy was put in action, and it's well documented that where political bosses own those in power, that power is abused.

It's the 1%, it's the right-wing that owns at least 2 branches of our govt, and the executive is policy driven by the Third Way... we do know, for instance, that the executive branch did in fact access CIA information to illegally expose Valerie Plame. Cheney did so without any consequences - he got away with it lock, stock, and barrel. I fully expect Pope and Co. to use any and all smear tactics to harm their perceived enemies, and so nothing surprises me when I learn about tactics such as Civitas. It's nasty, dirty, and goes against the concepts of fair play that we all learn as kids.

Boss Pope is sending a message with the Civitas site. He's trying to intimidate. And unless people speak up and expose his machinations, the people of NC and this country will continue to lose their voices and freedom of expression.

And so I guess we do agree on Pope and Civitas - the full truth will be revealed at some point, or so I hope. Context is everything, and I should have read more thoroughly before posting. Sorry about that. 5:00 am comes early, and so it's bed for me. G'night.

[rainy]

38. you are so right! It will be used against the only ones who can

up seat their power.

[sabrina 1]

43. Yes, it's all for the purpose of Corporate Persons who will use it without the oversight

Congress would have if they had not transferred their duties to Private Corporations like Booz Allen.

Think of the multiple, and profitable purposes this data mining can be used for. As you pointed out, to control the people, and the occasional Whistle Blower and courageous Public Official who might foolishly decide to speak out. And the money, first from the funding they get from their puppets in Congress under the pretext that it 'will catch terrorists'.

Then they SELL the info to other Private Corps, like HB Gary eg, who were proposing a smear campaign against Glenn Greenwald, to 'persuade him' to stop talking about The Chamber of Commerce etc. Looks like someone got that contract.

I think the whole scandal they are so desperate to hide is that none of this was ever about our security or about terrorists, it was to USE the fear mongering to sell the data and you can imagine, as Ron Wyden said, how angry the people will be when they find out the massive scam they have been subjected to.

[AllyCat]

45. See? They are creating jobs...jobs watching people who don't need watching.

Of course, the 1% are great at creating wealth for themselves while providing NO VALUE to the economy and actually decreasing the value of the hard work everyone else puts into our communities.

[kestrel91316]

53. Democrats only control the Senate. The repukes control the House of Representatives.

[AllyCat]

78. Two houses = White HOUSE and Senate

[SunSeeker]

58. This has nothing to do with NSA surveillance. There is no "Democratic control of two houses."

NC has a GOP legislature, as the OP states. This is the work of a right wing individual using what is readily available on the internet to intimidate people he disagrees with. Please direct your anger where it belongs. It is really counterproductive to the progressive cause to self-immolate when it is the Republicans who are passing around the matches.

[AllyCat]

77. Two houses = White HOUSE and Senate

I am just surprised that this has happened with this set of leaders in office. I'm not "directing anger". Just expressing my surprise. However, since YOU are angry, can you help me understand how anything our government is doing regarding this issue is "progressive"? Because I think I need to not be a "progressive" if I missed the memo that one of our values is spying on innocent Americans.

[byeya]

9. I moved to NC a couple of years ago - it is indeed a cesspool of reaction and hate.

Imagine, if you don't live here, the majority of people being Jesse Helms clones - that's NC for the most part.

[mnhtnbb]

14. We've been here since 2000. Remember, NC went for Obama in 2008

so, the majority of people really aren't Jesse Helms clones.

More people voted in 2012 for Dem candidates to the House of Representatives
but due to the gerrymandering by Repubs after the 2010 election, Repubs ended
up elected by about a 2 to 1 margin.

There are a lot of moderates in the state. They bought the McCrory BS that he
was a moderate and are now sorry they did.

The Moral Monday protesters are not all left leaning Dems. There are people
joining in who say they've voted Republican their entire lives.

Unfortunately, we are stuck with the gang of right wing zealots until 2014.
NC is one of 12 states without access to recall.

High education/high population counties like Durham, Orange, Buncombe, Wake and Mecklenburg
consistently vote Democratic.

So while I would agree with you that there are too many Jesse Helms clones in the state
I wouldn't go so far as to call the entire state a cesspool. But if you wanted to apply
that description to the current General Assembly, I would agree with you!

[SaveAmerica]

46. I'm glad you still have that in you

I've grown tired of defending those of us that you have described in your post. I think our (Democrats) biggest problem is that we are not as big mouthed as the haters. I find a similar mind-set about the military- that it's majority Republican but the reality is the numbers reflect the rest of America, it's just the right wing hatefulness is loud and in your face.

People need to stop hating on NC because of the big-mouths.

[marions ghost]

56. What a grotesque lie

---

[TalkingDog]

72. Hyperbole, bigotry and generalization. I'm from a very red county in NC.

We're the ones who ran the Klan rally out of Harmony last year. (yes, me and my local Iredell county friends started the action and participated directly)


If a very red county can do that, it simply means that you are full of shit.

[snooper2]

10. LOL

FYI- the bold only works if you only use it on 12% or less of the text



Location: Wasilla

Case number: 10-87521

Type: Assault IV DV

Text: On 09/12/2010 at approximately 2257 hours, Alaska State Troopers
contacted Mauro Miranda, age 29 of Wasilla after receiving a report of a
disturbance at a residence on Willawaw Way in Wasilla. During the
investigation, it was determined Miranda committed Assault in the Fourth
Degree DV by causing pain to his girlfriend by throwing an object and
striking her in the head. Miranda was arrested and transported to
Mat-Su Pretrial Facility where he was held without bail.

Author: LTW0
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 1:13 AM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 1:46 AM


-------------------------------------------------
Location: Glennallen
Case number: 10-87423
Type: SAR, Plane Crash
Text: (On 09/12/10, at approximately 1600 hours, Alaska State Troopers
were notified of a "SPOT" (personal GPS emergency locating beacon)
activation. The Spot was registered to Wayne Humbert, 30 yoa of
Anchorage. Investigation revealed Wayne Humbert and three friends,
Robert Wesley Price the pilot, 30yoa of Anchorage, Brad Vassau, 23yoa of
Anchorage, and Grant Smith were flying to the Paxson area to go moose
hunting when the plane crashed shortly after a take off in a remote
area. At 1812 hours, Alaska Wildlife Troopers who arrived on scene
prior to other resources located the crash site near the Alphabet Hills
in the Paxson area. Rescue Coordination Center (RCC) was contacted and
responded with a helicopter and a C130 to the area. All passengers were
transported to Mat-Su Regional Center by RCC. The three passengers were
reported to have minor injuries, and the pilot to have injuries of a
more serious nature. The National Transportation Safety Board has been
notified and is continuing their investigation.
Author: ENC0
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 10:13 AM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 10:15 AM



-------------------------------------------------

Location: Sutton

Case number: 10-87551

Type: Criminal Mischief IV (DV)

Text: On 09/13/2010 at approximately 0322 hours, Alaska State Troopers
responded to a report of a disturbance on McPherson Rd in Sutton.
Investigation revealed that Arthur Paulson, age 44 of Sutton damaged the
property of another whom he had a past domestic relationship with.
Paulson was arrested and transported to Mat-Su Pre-trial where he was
remanded without bail.

Author: DBK1
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 11:13 AM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 11:04 AM



--------------------------------------

Location: Wasilla
Case number: 10-87612
Type: MVC-D/Hit and Run
Text: On 09/13/10 at approximately 0900 hours, AST received a report of
a hit and run damage only motor vehicle accident in Wasilla.
Investigation revealed that Bette White, age 63 of Wasilla, was involved
in the accident and left the scene without contacting AST or the other
involved driver. White was issued a misdemeanor citation to appear in
court at a later date and released at the place of contact.

Author: LEP0
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 10:13 PM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 10:34 PM



--------------------------------------

Location: Wasilla

Case number: 10-87815

Type: Warrant Arrest/False Information
Text: On 09/13/10 at approximately 1600 hours, AST contacted James A.
Drain age 30 of Wasilla, during a traffic stop in Wasilla. Investigation
revealed that Drain had an outstanding arrest warrant for the original
charge of escape. Drain provided a false name and date of birth during
the contact and was also charged with making a false report. Drain was
arrested and transported to the Mat-Su Pretrial Facility in Palmer where
he was remanded into custody and held on $5,750 bail.

Author: LEP0
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 10:13 PM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 10:36 PM



-------------------------------------------------

Location: Chickaloon

Case number: 10-87661

Type: MVC-D Commercial

Text: Text: On 9/13/2010 at approximately 0956 hours, AST in Palmer
responded to mile 84.5 of the Glenn Highway for an overturned commercial
motor vehicle. Investigation revealed Keith Lincoln age 34 of North
Pole was traveling northbound on the Glenn Highway near mile 84.5 in a
Crowley Petroleum tanker truck carrying approximately 40,000 pounds of
liquid propane when he collided with a guardrail and rolled his tractor.
The tanker trailer detached and rolled approximately 500 feet down a
steep embankment. Fire personnel responded and determined the tanker to
be in-tact. No propane was leaked from the tanker. Personnel from the
Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC) responded and are
assisting with recovery. Damages to the guardrail are estimated at
$10,000. AST investigation continues.

Author: TRS1
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 10:13 PM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 10:40 PM


C Detachment


-------------------------------------------------
Location: Savoonga
Case number: 10-87046

Type: Assault III
Text: On 9/11/10 at approximately 0400 hours, the Savoonga Village
Public Safety Officer received a report of a disturbance. Lynne
Noongwook, 37yoa, of Savoonga , was contacted by the VPSO and
subsequently arrested for Assault III.
Author: AMW0
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 10:13 AM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 10:38 AM


-------------------------------------------------
Location: White Mountain
Case number: 10-87336

Type: Probation Violation
Text: On 9/12/10 at approximately 0300 hours The Village Public Safety
Officer responded to a disturbance at a residence in White Mountain.
Tyrone Buffas, 28 yoa, of White Mountain, was contacted by the VPSO and
subsequently arrested for violating his probation.
Author: AMW0/DZH0
Received Monday, September 13, 2010 10:13 AM and posted Monday, September 13, 2010 10:35 AM

http://www.dps.state.ak.us/pio/dispatch/Trooper%20Dispatches%20of%2009-13-2010.20100913.txt

[Laelth]

11. k&r for exposure. n/t

-Laelth

[AtheistCrusader]

15. Super hard to send e-mails to the Soviet Union these days.

Point otherwise taken

[markiv]

16. an inevitable devolution of the mugshot extortion sites

throughout much of the coutry, web sites pick up mug shots from sheriff departments, and p-lace them on their sites for entertainment. they also make their site with the mugshot the first return on google if a person's name is googled

for an 'administration fee' of usually $100, you can get the mugshot taken down

raw extortion right out in the open, and the gov depts that feed the info couldnt care less

and this happens even if the person is not convicted, and ends up never having ever been convicted of anything, in their entire lives

(I havnt been arrested, this hasnt happened to me, but i do believe in the 'First they came fore
the...' principal)

You'd better believe I dont trust them with 100 percent data collection

what you see in the OP, is just one more roll of 'The Blob'

[markiv]

19. I'm actually kind of glad this happened so soon

not because I wanted injustice for these people, but because I was certain this was going to happen.

I didnt think it was possible, likely or probable, but as certain as death and taxes, and I was also certain that as long as it was presented as anything less that 100 percent proof that it had already happened, that the majority of people would dismiss it as paranioa

[JoeyT]

17. It wouldn't even have to be something you'd actually done.

If people knew XYZ group had access to the everyone's phones and emails, it would be a simple matter to forge one making it look like you'd done anything they wanted and most people would believe it.

[bunnies]

22. police logs and internet searches.

Most of that basic info can be gotten from public police logs. No surprise. But the other information isnt really that hard to get either. I randomly checked 6 of the names the site had salary info for & every single one of those people is on Linkedin.com. I do not have an account there, so I cant see the "full profiles" but I can see where they work, where they went to college, etc. I didnt even bother to check their facebook profiles, which is usually also a plethora of information.

Therefore, its possible that most of this info came from the people putting it out there themselves. If I can find it, anyone can.

edit: clarity

[RILib]

23. salary?

Where are they getting the salary information? It's probably public for government employees, but for others?

I was already angry but seeing this is making it worse.

[markiv]

30. i didnt look through all of them, but i only saw public employee's salary listed nt

[Eleanors38]

26. And some wanted to reveal concealed-carry permit holders.

[RC]

40. We are not allowed to know about that.

4th Amendment, privacy, you know.

[Eleanors38]

123. As well it should be. I remember when in Texas one

need read off the plate number of someone's auto and the live operator using a new-fangled computer read us back name & house number. Great for getting a mailing address for billing, deliveries, and such. Great, too, for exes with murderous intent, the reason that "public information" went confidential.

Now, we only have newspapers trying to pry out concealed-carry license records so that they may baldly assist controller/banners in their schemes to "shame," "stigmatize," and "ostracize" neighbors for reasons not known until a scarlet list was posted everywhere.

Yeah, the precedents are like clowns: "They're already here." (Joni Mitchell)

[Bernardo de La Paz]

34. Stay on this story. Thanks for posting. nt

[dembotoz]

36. about 2 years ago there was a facebook hater who did some research on me via linked in and public

stuff

putting stuff up that took some work to get.

nothing of real damage
my life is well.... very dull


but enough that I went back and cleaned up my profiles etc

clean your shit up
don't let them hang you by your own stuff

[MsPithy]

41. Can you briefly, tell us what you did to

to clean your shit up?

It would be greatly appreciated.

[Sunlei]

37. NC Budget Director has the time to bully every protestor. Art Pope= hateful, anti-usa.

I wish there were millions of protestors. In small groups they can handle 100 arrests, they won't be able to arrest 10,000 people a week.

Tell Art Pope to quit slacking on his state budget job because he's going to have to add millions to cover Americans RIGHT to protest.

[rainy]

39. Here's how to reach Art Pope

http://artpope.com/about-art-pope/contact/

[Zorra]

44. Thank you, Segami. Privacy is important in maintaining personal and collective liberty. nt

[suffragette]

49. Last week, I received an email and text about a credit card purchase

Called and discovered someone had tried to use it at a Walmart in Arkansas. It was declined and no idea what they were trying to buy. But an online purchase at something called Gun America or something similar had gone through. God knows what they bought and thank Goddess it's corrected now.
But that's the type of info that could be collected and attached to someone and if that's ever done on the Internet, it is, up there forever.
Databases are not error free and they make it possible for those errors to replicated so many times that it's hard to catch and correct it all, if you even know where the multiple bad entries are. Even those people who say they have 'nothing to hide' could have something that could be viewed or twisted onto being 'suspicious' listed and connected to them.

And it's clear there are unscrupulous people who would do just like the GOP in NC and try to use it to attack.

[AzDar]

52. K & R

[Smarmie Doofus]

55. Of course. K and R n/t

[DhhD]

60. Now with the new Roberts Voting Resolution, predetermined person can be pulled

out of the voting line, detained, searched, charged with a felony. In my opinion, secret societies like Mr. Pope supports, are past voter purger lists. I believe that now a GOP Governor can call out a state militia to look for these people. After the election, they will be released on down graded minor charges. I think that the scenario that I am describing here is a facsimile of the treatment of poor minorities in the South after the Civil War, and is again to happen today, being made possible by the recent SCOTUS majority of five.

Corporatist know that they must win the next election. Registering to vote is not private and will be turned over to secret societies within the government. Damn the 1% for harvesting out lives.

[SunSeeker]

61. Much worse can happen. Ask Edward Teller's family.

Posting home addresses, etc. has long been an intimidation tactic of the anti-choice nutbags. It encourages the craziest among them to take these people out, like they did with abortion doctor Edward Teller, who was shot at his church.

This website you describe is the work of a private individual. It has nothing to do with NSA surveillance. There is no evidence secret "government data" was used for that website. It appears to be standard right wing intimidation tactics available to them in our open society.

Art Pope's intimidation efforts using the Civitas website is an important story, I appreciate the post. Sad you had to couch it with an anti-NSA gloss to get people to read it, but whatever works...

[WCLinolVir]

66. OK. Well please let it be known that if you call them to complain they will call you back.

[phone]. It was probably the IMHO you folks are scum sucking. Francis DeLuca called me back. I told him in my opinion his group was un-american, and he said what about people who post their info online. Big difference. He said if I live in Arizona what do I care? TSS. He also assured me all the info was already public. He asked me my name, which I chose not to give. I asked him if this phone call was intended as intimidation like the info of the protesters.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

67. Thanks for posting. K&R

[SnakeEyes]

70. It's pretty simple

Basically everything there is a matter of public record.

[Duppers]

82. Art Pope, fast facts

http://www.artpopeexposed.com/fast_facts

[KoKo]

84. Good Read! Recommend

[sulphurdunn]

88. If the Civitas site

has facts to support its thinly veiled insinuation of 501c3 violation by the organizations it smears, it should present them. Also, it is both comical and ironic to see the consternation of people who love Latin names and the legacy of Imperial Rome more than the Roman Republic they claim to admire, bemoaning CEO compensation among the Plebes. The average conservative intellectual is an authoritarian with slightly better than average verbal ability, servile ambition, and little else to recommend.

[HiPointDem]

89. big kr. i have seen similar things happen in employment situations. very dangerous stuff &

most people don't understand how deep the ramifications go.

a spy agency that can capture & store all digital communications can also *fake* those communications should they wish to target someone.

[blackspade]

93. Exactly.

[Douglas Carpenter]

94. knr... this is what can be done already with resources .. It is absurd to imagine that a vastly

expanding surveillance state will not at least in time turn into an engine of control.

[Progressive dog]

95. So sue Civitas, get the ACLU to sue ,

everyone knows who posted the data and they can be forced to disclose the source of the material.

you're arrested for trespassing...and now here you are on the intertoobs...your name, address, sex, age, race, party, occupation, employer, salary if available, alleged voter registration violation (address not matching registration)

If you are booked for a crime, most of this information is given to the police. In the not so distant past, the name, address, and age of people given traffic tickets was published in the local newspapers. Now only people charged with felonies get this treatment. I'm a registered democrat and that info is readily available from the board of elections.

Note that this has nothing to do with any Metadata or the NSA, no one had to know who you called to find this data.

[cantbeserious]

98. Thank You For Sharing

eom

[Blanks]

99. This is a story about the abuses of a republican controlled state house...

It should be a call to arms for taking action to vote out these republican controlled state assemblies.

Instead we are whining about the government over-stepping. This story had to really be tortured to turn it into yet another anti-NSA thread.

Good job though.

[liberal_at_heart]

118. K&R

[intaglio]

119. Please start thinking

What is written on an envelope or is in meta is public because everybody can see it

1) Get this through your skull - it has, repeat has, to be public or else your mail, your phones and your internet would not work.

2) It has to be capable of being seen, not just by your mailman or your service provider but by all of the persons or computers it passes

3) Not only that but the envelope or meta describes what, legally, can be publicly scrutenised.

Conduct a thought experiment, what would happen if you wrote all of your most embarrassing secrets on sheet of paper and posted the unsealed and unfolded sheet through the post? Do you honestly believe that any postal worker or member of the public could be prosecuted for reading that unsolicited confession? Any court would throw that case out and laugh at you for being so ignorant because you would have no reasonable expectation of privacy from such an act. Envelopes and meta circumscribe what a postman, or member of the public, who glimpses the document is allowed to see without a warrant.

I the same way, when you subscribe to a magazine and receive hard copy do you really believe that no-one can see that magazine being delivered, or seeing the logo of that publication on the covering?

Do you really think that anyone visiting sites called, for example, "Jihadi Tips" or "Evil Abortionist Addresses" or ringing helplines with those names should not have the contents of such visits and calls examined in exactly the same way that letters to similar publications would be examined? The only real difference is that the "nasty evil" Government (in which you are inciting so much hatred) is looking at transcripts of internet transactions and logs of calls to document visits to such nauseous sites rather than at envelopes the postal service

Do you think that payments you make online to Uncle Robert in Bolivia should not be looked at in the same way that bulky envelopes addressed to Uruzgan Poppy Co-operative in Afghanistan should be examined?

Like so many others you are an outrage junkie who cannot see the difference between what is - and has to be - public and what you think should be obscured.

[Eleanors38]

124. You may wish to check my #123. It's already been done.

[Ilsa]

125. Is it possible for us all to crash

their servers? I obviously don't know much about this sort of thing.