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Liberal_in_LA

(44,397 posts)
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 08:45 PM Jul 2013

Big Brother Turns Into a Racist Shit Show

note - A positive development white, black and brown have joined to denounce the racism on this season's Big Brother on forums all over the internet.

The contestants continue to have no idea of the consequences of their racism (3 lost jobs, hundreds of news articles)




Big Brother Turns Into a Racist Shit Show as Black Woman Gets Harassed

This season of Big Brother has been remarkable for having the most bigoted, openly hateful cast members in the reality show's 13-year history. Now they've decided to be more direct with their racism, targeting Candice, the only African-American woman in the house, by messing with her bed and personal property, and telling her, "Now will see the black come outta you."

In addition the lead racist in the house, Aaryn, put on an affect—rolling her neck, snapping her fingers, etc.—and asked, "Whatchu gone do, girl? Whatchu gone do?"


A third contestant, GinaMarie, got in Candice's face and yelled, "Is the black gonna come out?"

It got so bad that Howard, the only African-American man in the house, came into the room and physically removed Candice so that she wouldn't get in a fight. Candice then broke down in tears over all the racial slurs and what they've had to endure in the house. After he was done counseling her, and when he was finally alone, Howard himself began to cry.

The offensive remarks have been going on for almost the entire three weeks that the contestants have been living in the house, but they were usually expressed in smaller groups and only around other white people. This is the first time that the rampant racism that has been going on was so flagrantly directed to someone's face.

------------

Aaryn mocks Korean-American contestant Helen by using "Asian voice," talking about getting her nails done, happy endings, making rice, and squinty eyes.
GinaMarie mentions that she should punch Helen in the face to "uncross her eyes."
Aaryn refers to gay houseguest Andy as a "faggot" and "queer."
GinaMarie says that Howard and Candice are going to be an alliance because "the blacks stick together."
Aaryn points out that the black and white fish in the house's aquarium are appropriately segregated with the white ones on top and the black on the bottom.
Aaryn references Candice's skin color saying that you have to be careful in the dark "because you might not see the bitch."
GinaMarie refers to welfare as "nigger insurance."

And their comments within the game have affected their real lives. Aaryn was dropped from her modeling agency, and GinaMarie was fired from her job as a coordinator of beauty pageants. The contestants are barred from knowing about anything outside of the house unless it's a death in the family. (The last time production intervened in this way was to tell the houseguests about September 11, as one cast member's cousin, who worked in the World Trade Center, was missing.)

Eventually, CBS couldn't ignore the public outcry. The network began including the remarks as part of the storyline in the show. Last night's episode was aired with with the following disclaimer:

http://jezebel.com/big-brother-turns-into-a-racist-shit-show-as-black-woma-787995871

http://jezebel.com/big-brother-turns-into-a-racist-shit-show-as-black-woma-787995871


Rare, but Real, a Racial Divide in Prime Time
‘Big Brother’ Becomes a Lab Experiment In Overt Racism


---------

This season, though, race has become the dominant narrative thanks to a handful of white cast members who’ve turned the show, which runs three nights a week, into a rare opportunity to watch white privilege and unconscious racism in the field. It may be occurring in a sealed-off space, but it’s feasting on the oxygen of national network television.

Sunday’s episode was the most disturbing of the season so far. Aaryn Gries, a young white woman, flipped the mattress of Candice Stewart, one of the show’s black cast members, then taunted Ms. Stewart with an exaggerated, stereotypical voice: “What you gon’ do, girl?” and “Where’s yo class, girl?” She was soon backed up by another white cast member, GinaMarie Zimmerman, who screamed at Ms. Stewart, “You want the black to come out?”

This is execrable stuff by any measurement. The bullying is childish, but that’s standard on “Big Brother.” It’s the unchecked race privilege — the belief in the normative nature of whiteness, leading to blithe intolerance like that expressed by Ms. Gries — that is nauseating.

Later on Sunday, Ms. Stewart cried in the arms of Howard Overby, the other black cast member, and detailed other aggressions that had been directed her way, including being called “Shaniqua.”

------------

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/17/arts/television/big-brother-becomes-a-lab-experiment-in-overt-racism.html?_r=0

CBS put a disclaimer up before last night's episode, which Deadline relates to the George Zimmerman verdict. The timing for the racism controversy in the Big Brother house certainly seems all the worse when factoring in Zimmerman's acquittal. CBS' pre-episode disclaimer said: Big Brother is a reality show about a group of people who have no privacy 24/7. At times, the Houseguests may reveal prejudices and other beliefs that CBS does not condone. Views or opinions expressed by a Houseguest are those of the individuals speaking and do not represent the views or opinions of CBS. Viewer discretion is advised.”

CBS has also issued a disclaimer over their live feeds:
69 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Big Brother Turns Into a Racist Shit Show (Original Post) Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 OP
Aaryn will go down as most hated BB cast member ever NoOneMan Jul 2013 #1
maybe people like her and zimmerman would end up JI7 Jul 2013 #3
the house guests who refers to welfare as "nigger insurance" - her last name is Zimmerman Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #15
i read about it when this was first reported and that name stuck out to me JI7 Jul 2013 #18
yes. The racism never stops. Anything involving a "minority" houseguests unleashes racist comments Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #27
and all of these people come from places where they most likely talk like this everyday JI7 Jul 2013 #36
mom of Spencer (Hilter admirer, calls women "units" has tried to defend her bo Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #47
Aaryn ? i bet she learned from her parents and the spelling looks like they JI7 Jul 2013 #2
I had the same thought ... napkinz Jul 2013 #6
It seems a bit closer than merely looking like Aryan, kentauros Jul 2013 #56
Take it off the air. Ilsa Jul 2013 #4
No one gets between me and my Big Brother NoOneMan Jul 2013 #9
I don't know what the time frame is for "Gone". Ilsa Jul 2013 #14
It could be as long a 2 months before all contestants leave the house Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #22
Its always abusive NoOneMan Jul 2013 #35
This message was self-deleted by its author NoOneMan Jul 2013 #37
Amanda attempted to remind them, millions of Americans are watching. closeupready Jul 2013 #49
I didn't know Spencer was doing that NoOneMan Jul 2013 #50
Entertainment is rather more important to many people, I guess. LanternWaste Jul 2013 #57
Its more meaningful to life than politics NoOneMan Jul 2013 #61
Aaryn is a disgusting girl, Blue_In_AK Jul 2013 #5
Amanda is a racist also. She's referred to Candice as "Shaniqua" also Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #7
I'm sorry to hear that Blue_In_AK Jul 2013 #10
I'll take Helen, Howard, Candice as winners. Judd also. Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #13
I thought that was Kaitlin dmr Jul 2013 #54
Will Not Watch A Single Minute SoCalMusicLover Jul 2013 #21
Taking bets that she blames the job loss on "political correctness" JHB Jul 2013 #60
I Won't Take That Bet SoCalMusicLover Jul 2013 #63
to all those discussing the personalities here: it's fake, people. fake. HiPointDem Jul 2013 #8
Partially. The DR attempts to create motives and enforce story lines NoOneMan Jul 2013 #16
fake fake fake HiPointDem Jul 2013 #28
It would be more entertaining if that was true NoOneMan Jul 2013 #33
its all fake, the engineered controversy most of all. HiPointDem Jul 2013 #39
Ok, thats one isolated view. In reality, TV shows don't engineer bad ratings NoOneMan Jul 2013 #40
To a degree, Blue_In_AK Jul 2013 #17
ratings. so viewers can get all involved in the morality of all the fake people. HiPointDem Jul 2013 #20
Yep. And they lose their jobs and become pariahs. NoOneMan Jul 2013 #41
the pain the "minority" houseguests are feeling is real. This week black male houseguest carried Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #19
it's fake. the pain is fake too. the whole thing is fake, an orwellian exercise in seeing whether HiPointDem Jul 2013 #25
You can keep asserting this sans evidence or proof as your opinion. Chan790 Jul 2013 #48
s they both seem equally viable, who knows...? LanternWaste Jul 2013 #58
Something is rotten in Reality TV land. Rex Jul 2013 #11
"Please explain to me exactly how that's racist?" (***channeling Zimmerman supporting shithead***) alcibiades_mystery Jul 2013 #12
Yeah, I was going to ask if her gramma is Juror B37 Duer 157099 Jul 2013 #23
People get mad when a reality show actually shows reality? davidn3600 Jul 2013 #24
I can't believe that stupid show is still on, I got tired of that doc03 Jul 2013 #26
I guess some of us aren't as highly evolved as you are. Blue_In_AK Jul 2013 #30
Survivor has a few really good years after year one. Seasons where the contestants really struggled Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #31
OMG! This is why I don't watch reality tv avebury Jul 2013 #29
one thing about reality TV, it's much much more diverse than standard tv. People who aren't Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #32
It may be more diverse but it also avebury Jul 2013 #38
^^^ Me too. Ilsa Jul 2013 #34
i totally expected this to be about zimmerman's brother nt arely staircase Jul 2013 #42
That crap is all fake (just like all reality TV), Dash87 Jul 2013 #43
Don't quite agree... cprise Jul 2013 #52
So now when a DU post title says "Big Brother" Trillo Jul 2013 #44
exactly. big brother phrase means the tv show to most folks Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #46
OMG follow the link, it's horrifying Marrah_G Jul 2013 #45
Shows like this are scripted and as fake as it gets. kestrel91316 Jul 2013 #51
That's very true, but what's the point of the racist angle? GiaGiovanni Jul 2013 #53
It generates outrage and so increases viewership with people seeing what the fuss is about, kestrel91316 Jul 2013 #55
they do better with ratings when there are contestants who are popular and likable JI7 Jul 2013 #62
I would think it would turn off the younger generation GiaGiovanni Jul 2013 #69
This past decade of "reality tv" is why I do not watch much. Dawson Leery Jul 2013 #59
Right, because Friends, Murphy Brown, and Seinfeld closeupready Jul 2013 #65
I can't believe that this HappyMe Jul 2013 #64
season 15 Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #66
I usually watch this and some seasons contestants have been bad but these are the absolute worst! nt Raine Jul 2013 #67
Turning it into a shit show? Egnever Jul 2013 #68

JI7

(93,617 posts)
3. maybe people like her and zimmerman would end up
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 08:55 PM
Jul 2013

living in their own town. hated by the rest of the country and united in their bigotry.

 

Liberal_in_LA

(44,397 posts)
15. the house guests who refers to welfare as "nigger insurance" - her last name is Zimmerman
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:08 PM
Jul 2013

JI7

(93,617 posts)
18. i read about it when this was first reported and that name stuck out to me
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:10 PM
Jul 2013

looks lke there have been additional bigoted comments since then.

 

Liberal_in_LA

(44,397 posts)
27. yes. The racism never stops. Anything involving a "minority" houseguests unleashes racist comments
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:13 PM
Jul 2013

JI7

(93,617 posts)
36. and all of these people come from places where they most likely talk like this everyday
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:22 PM
Jul 2013

with other people they know. how else would they be so comfortable doing it on a tv show being watched by others.

i don't know if it's being clueless about the tv show, not thinking what you say is really offensive or what. but how can anyone not think the things they are saying here are offensive.

and it wasn't stuff like black people being able to dance or asians being good at math or gays into fashion type of stereotypes.

have family or friends of these people commented and tried to defend this shit ?

and the host of big brother is an asian also.

JI7

(93,617 posts)
2. Aaryn ? i bet she learned from her parents and the spelling looks like they
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 08:54 PM
Jul 2013

wanted something like Aryan

napkinz

(17,199 posts)
6. I had the same thought ...
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:00 PM
Jul 2013

Her name should be Aryan.

Why doesn't CBS do the right thing and cancel the show?





kentauros

(29,414 posts)
56. It seems a bit closer than merely looking like Aryan,
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 02:40 PM
Jul 2013

as it's a direct anagram.

I'll have to look at the video later, but I think I'd have reacted with something along the lines of "I don't need to do anything as your actions and words have already condemned you. You do remember this is being aired on national TV, right?"

Too bad "Aryan" can't be an anagram for "stupid"...

Ilsa

(64,371 posts)
4. Take it off the air.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 08:58 PM
Jul 2013

The two African Americans shouldn't have to endure that kind of abuse. Shut it down. Send that bitchy white girl home, no more media for her.

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
9. No one gets between me and my Big Brother
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:04 PM
Jul 2013

Look, the house hates these girls (and the one guy). They are as good as gone. One will hang around and theyll try and drag them because they are inelligible to win already due to jury votes.

Ilsa

(64,371 posts)
14. I don't know what the time frame is for "Gone".
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:07 PM
Jul 2013

I just don't think abuse should be tolerated.
I don't watch the show. I won't watch that.

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
35. Its always abusive
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:22 PM
Jul 2013

Lots of times its mysoginistic bullying. Some people don't know how to manipulate people otherwise, but rarely do they ever win. Likely at least one will be gone in a week, but when you get someone so hated, people see them as valuable; you get to the end with one of them and you automatically win. Abuse vs winning money. Its their call

Response to Ilsa (Reply #14)

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
49. Amanda attempted to remind them, millions of Americans are watching.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:24 PM
Jul 2013

It's a popular show.

So now millions of Americans are going to remember their remarks, the controversy surrounding them, how they antagonized other contestants, all kinds of shit.

Even IF, just for argument's sake, there were others in the house who felt as Aaryn does or who sympathize, THEY surely realize Americans are watching, and they'll really have to evict her and GinaMarie and Spencer. Though for some reason, Spencer's remarks haven't been televised as of yet.

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
50. I didn't know Spencer was doing that
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:46 PM
Jul 2013

There are always racist and misogynistic comments on the live feeds that they edit out in past seasons. For some reason, they decided to really show it this season (maybe it has something to do with Trayvon Martin). Funny how they are only picking some villians but leaving others unexposed.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
57. Entertainment is rather more important to many people, I guess.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 02:48 PM
Jul 2013

Entertainment is rather more important to many people, I guess.

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
61. Its more meaningful to life than politics
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 03:17 PM
Jul 2013

Hey, its just fun. OTOH, politics are an abusive exercise in frustration that always leaves the people fucked and helpless (but feeling oh so empowered while they are exploited). So why not kicked back for a few hours and chill?

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
5. Aaryn is a disgusting girl,
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 08:58 PM
Jul 2013

and I think she will pay for it once she's outside the house. I couldn't believe her reaction when Amanda very diplomatically tried to set her straight on her racism. The girl is a lost soul, and I'm glad she lost her job. I don't think she'll be in the house too much longer.


(And, yes, Big Brother is my guilty pleasure. It's a great social experiment.)

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
10. I'm sorry to hear that
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:05 PM
Jul 2013

because I actually kind of like her. I'm rooting for Helen, though.

 

SoCalMusicLover

(3,194 posts)
21. Will Not Watch A Single Minute
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:11 PM
Jul 2013

I normally kind of follow the show a bit, just to see who the personalities are in the house. But not this season. I know more than I care to at this point, and I won't even watch and root for these bigots to get kicked out, nor will I watch if/when they do get voted out.

Let CBS and the sponsors feel the impact. Perhaps they should screen their contestants better. There is no excuse for this. I'm sure there are plenty of mature, non-bigoted individuals who would have done anything to be chosen to be in the cast. Perhaps Aryan got picked because she's attractive looks wise. Seems to be a requirement, along with being under the age of 30. Couldn't they ever consider having some older cast members, ones who are not immature a-holes.

This twit probably won't even care, when she is eventually told, probably live by Julie Chen, that her outside occupations have been impacted by her racism. She's a blonde bimbo, and she'll probably bounce back somehow. She'll get new work eventually, maybe being hired by someone who is unaware of her antics on the show. Either that, or she'll marry some guy who wants her for her looks, and maybe divorce him to collect alimony.

Bigots like her don't care much. although I expect her to come up with all sorts of explanations and excuses when she hits the outside. She'll maintain a strong resolve, because that's what bigots do. It will be like telling someone from Westboro "church," that they are insensitive pricks.

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
16. Partially. The DR attempts to create motives and enforce story lines
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:08 PM
Jul 2013

The people are real. They don't always have to play their parts that are given to them. These racist personalities may be very real, but perhaps they are being edited in when they were normally edited out.

Remember, Big Brother is aired 3 hours a day, every single day live, unfiltered. It used to be live almost 24/7 with internet feeds. The people really do show their personalities in those windows.

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
33. It would be more entertaining if that was true
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:18 PM
Jul 2013

They do their best, but sometimes the cast members take over. A few seasons ago a group of 4 boring girls that spent their nights sleeping and reading the bible made it to the end. Do you think BB would engineer a situation where their ratings plummet because no one wants to watch boring people do boring things or sleep all day?

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
40. Ok, thats one isolated view. In reality, TV shows don't engineer bad ratings
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:32 PM
Jul 2013

They try the opposite. BB shows consistently eliminate interesting people that are "threats" leaving boring people at the end. Its the way it normally shakes out.

Its probably more real than the Zimmerman trial ever was, but that's not saying much.

Past members have done reveal alls about the influences in the DR and how narratives are formed and enforced. This, we understand. But those are mostly real people

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
17. To a degree,
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:09 PM
Jul 2013

but it's hard to keep up "fake" 24/7. Of course, they are reality TV people, but still "people" nonetheless. And why would anyone fake being a racist to the extent that these girls do? What benefit do they gain?

 

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)
41. Yep. And they lose their jobs and become pariahs.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:36 PM
Jul 2013

Like Adam lost his job with the mentally handicap kids

 

Liberal_in_LA

(44,397 posts)
19. the pain the "minority" houseguests are feeling is real. This week black male houseguest carried
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:11 PM
Jul 2013

black female from the room where she was being mocked and quietly explained that it wouldn't be good for them to get angry.

 

HiPointDem

(20,729 posts)
25. it's fake. the pain is fake too. the whole thing is fake, an orwellian exercise in seeing whether
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:13 PM
Jul 2013

viewers will transfer their feelings of injustice to some fake people on tv.

ohhh, bobby was so meeeean to dina!! he shouldn't do like that!! it's wronnng!! racist!!

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
48. You can keep asserting this sans evidence or proof as your opinion.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:16 PM
Jul 2013

It's still going to remain self-evidently and objectively false.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
58. s they both seem equally viable, who knows...?
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 02:54 PM
Jul 2013

"seeing whether viewers will transfer their feelings of injustice to some fake people on tv."

And here I thought it was an exercise to see which tin-foil hat wearing individual who actually believes he's clever enough to see through "fake people" will be the first to see through their nefarious plan, and thus give them the prize-money.

On the other hand, as they both seem equally viable, who knows...?


"ohhh. they're all so faaaake" it's not real! fake people made out of silicon!"


Six of one, half a dozen of the other (except for the fake ones, of course).

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
11. Something is rotten in Reality TV land.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:05 PM
Jul 2013

I hear Little Honey Boo Boo is having a 'smell' episode.

 

alcibiades_mystery

(36,437 posts)
12. "Please explain to me exactly how that's racist?" (***channeling Zimmerman supporting shithead***)
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:05 PM
Jul 2013
 

davidn3600

(6,342 posts)
24. People get mad when a reality show actually shows reality?
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:12 PM
Jul 2013

There are racist people in the world. That's reality.

Don't blame the show...blame society.

doc03

(39,086 posts)
26. I can't believe that stupid show is still on, I got tired of that
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:13 PM
Jul 2013

and Survivor the first year and never watched since.

 

Liberal_in_LA

(44,397 posts)
31. Survivor has a few really good years after year one. Seasons where the contestants really struggled
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:16 PM
Jul 2013

to survive and find food and shelter. One that stands out in my memory - the season where the contestant caught the pig and later fainted into the fire, the contestants had gotten so hungry the host brought them rice.

Now it's more about the whispering in the bushes about alliances and votes.

avebury

(11,197 posts)
29. OMG! This is why I don't watch reality tv
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:15 PM
Jul 2013

(well except House Hunters International and that is for the international locations).

Reality TV is the 21st Century version of the public going to the Colosseum to watch the gladiators. It is the dumbing down of American society. Pacify the masses with cheap entertainment and they won't stand up to the 1% and Corporate interests.

 

Liberal_in_LA

(44,397 posts)
32. one thing about reality TV, it's much much more diverse than standard tv. People who aren't
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:17 PM
Jul 2013

thin, blond and young are allowed to participate.

avebury

(11,197 posts)
38. It may be more diverse but it also
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:24 PM
Jul 2013

caters to discouraging intelligence and distracts way too many viewers from paying attention to what is going on in the world and in this country. It is amazing how many people do not have a clue about what is really going on in the US and the long term consequences that they and their descendents will face.

Stupidity is encouraged and desire, intelligence and education is not.

Dash87

(3,220 posts)
43. That crap is all fake (just like all reality TV),
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:44 PM
Jul 2013

not that there isn't people like this in real life.

cprise

(8,445 posts)
52. Don't quite agree...
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:59 PM
Jul 2013

The producers deliberately look for a mix of people who have rough edges that are likely to clash (for "real&quot . Having an overt racist on a Reality TV show is probably overdue.

That's not to say participants don't sometimes conspire to make a big scene; its probably more common than most viewers think.

Trillo

(9,154 posts)
44. So now when a DU post title says "Big Brother"
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:06 PM
Jul 2013

It's about a fictional TV series and not about Orwell's construct?

Interesting. Searching for "Big Brother" at Boogle results in a page of results, not one of which is dedicated to Orwell. In order to receive those results, "Orwell" needs to be included.

Psyops at work.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
51. Shows like this are scripted and as fake as it gets.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:48 PM
Jul 2013

Anything for ratings................

The only reality TV I have ever watched was Survivorman and shows like that. In spite of their FAKE scenarios and drama, I find them more or less educational.

 

GiaGiovanni

(1,247 posts)
53. That's very true, but what's the point of the racist angle?
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:32 AM
Jul 2013

Are they really upping their viewer base with this abuse? And if they are--well, that's an ethical question and TV networks are not known for ethics.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
55. It generates outrage and so increases viewership with people seeing what the fuss is about,
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 02:23 PM
Jul 2013

and it also serves to perpetuate racism, which is sufficient goal in itself if you are racist.

JI7

(93,617 posts)
62. they do better with ratings when there are contestants who are popular and likable
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 04:03 PM
Jul 2013

and when there is good strategy and other game play involved. this type of stuff is what keeps people wanting to tune in.

the ratings did go up a bit after the news started reporting on the controversy. but overall they are still down and behind the other networks, including when others have reruns of shows.

 

GiaGiovanni

(1,247 posts)
69. I would think it would turn off the younger generation
Fri Jul 19, 2013, 07:49 PM
Jul 2013

And aren't those the viewers advertisers really want?

Raine

(31,179 posts)
67. I usually watch this and some seasons contestants have been bad but these are the absolute worst! nt
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 10:54 PM
Jul 2013
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