Snowden "has damaged American international relations and compromised our national security"

[michigandem58]

Rep. John Lewis:

“News reports about my interview with The Guardian are misleading, and they do not reflect my complete opinion. Let me be clear. I do not agree with what Mr. Snowden did. He has damaged American international relations and compromised our national security. He leaked classified information and may have jeopardized human lives. That must be condemned."

http://johnlewis.house.gov/press-release/rep-john-lewis-no-praise-snowden

[PDJane]

1. The drone attacks and American hubris have damaged the American reputation.

Not to mention the war on whistleblowers. It's bullpucky.

[liberal_at_heart]

12. +1. Let's go ask the people of Pakistan why they won't get vaccinated for Polio. Then we'll know who

has damaged our reputation and put our national security at risk.

[PLANEFIX]

48. BULLSHIT

What Snowden did was honorable, an act IN service to the Constitution unlike traitors: Obama, most of Congress, and the SCOTUS. The biggest security threat to the US is the GOP AKA Nazi Party, totally anti-American in its values.

[kardonb]

61. bullpucky

is your post . Would you rather have another 9-11 ? I'll bet on our security measures to keep our nation safe from foreign and domestic terrorists . That is imperative ! Quit your eternal whining and complaining .

[HangOnKids]

66. Comic brilliance

You were joking right?

[BlueStreak]

101. A noun, a verb, and "911"

That's how the brain of an authoritarian works.

[frylock]

95. we didn't even need this shit to prevent the first 9/11..

go back under your bed.

[wtmusic]

116. Oh no!!! Anything but another 911!!!

Sorry you're afraid of your own shadow. I'm not.

[sheshe2]

2. This is what a Freedom Fighter Looks like.

Honoring a Freedom Fighter: Congressman John Lewis to Receive Ivan Allen Jr. Prize for Social Courage







Congressman John Lewis – an icon of American civil rights – has been named a recipient of the Ivan Allen Jr. Prize for Social Courage, Georgia Institute of Technology President G.P. “Bud” Peterson announced today. Lewis will be honored during events at the Institute’s Ivan Allen College of Liberal Arts on April 4, 2013.


“John Lewis put his life on the line for many years during the 1960s to bring about equality under the law for all Americans. His unflinching civil rights leadership and ongoing advocacy for social change throughout his career have elevated the causes of human rights around the world,” said Peterson. “It is our privilege to honor the life and work of Congressman Lewis through the Ivan Allen Jr. Prize for Social Courage.”


Lewis became known around the world at the age of 25 when he called on President Lyndon Johnson for federal intervention following a brutal attack on peaceful protesters by law enforcement near Selma, Alabama. Lewis’ appeal on that “Bloody Sunday,” March 7, 1965, turned public opinion against those trying to maintain the old social order of the South and moved President Johnson two days later to present to Congress what would become the Voting Rights Act.

“Congressman Lewis is one among us who has had the discipline and tenacity to stand tall, even in the face of physical danger, and he continues the struggle to change the world and make it a better place. His courage in the non-violent movement for civil rights and his ongoing work to build communities of trust provide both a watermark and a signpost in the quest for human rights and human dignity in our world,” said Jacqueline J. Royster, dean of the Ivan Allen College of Liberal Arts.

http://www.iac.gatech.edu/news-and-events/features/01/2013/honoring-a-freedom-fighter-congressman-john-lewis

Thanks for your OP, michigandem.

[treestar]

78. Thank you for that information sheshe2

I have been learning about him these past two days.

[peacebird]

3. No, Snowden leaked info about US Govt actions, those actions damaged US reputation internationally

All Snowden did was bring to light the bad acts of the US Govt and those bad acts were heinous enough to piss off the international community and US citizens.

[pnwmom]

68. Wrong. Snowden leaked information about US spying on other countries,

just as they spy on us.

He didn't confine himself to his claims about the US spying on its own citizens. He leaked information about the NSA spying on other countries and foreign terrorists.

[ohheckyeah]

102. Oh yeah,

that was a real shocker. LOL

[pnwmom]

105. Of course the fact that we spy isn't shocking. But giving out details to the Chinese newspaper

about how we were spying, including IP addresses, was harmful and unnecessary.

[ohheckyeah]

106. Seriously?

They already knew whatever they needed or wanted to know. Just like the US knows about the Chinese spying....there was a long story on 60 Minutes about the evil Chinese spying on the poor USA.

I really just couldn't give a shit less that the Chinese have some IP addresses and info about US spying. BFD

[marions ghost]

4. He's in the same category as a lot of Congress

...supporting the party. A lot of them don't want to admit how little they really understood about the NSA agenda.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

5. Well, at least he's consistent

on the gov talking points.

[Thinkingabout]

6. Snowden is a thief, he "revealed" what was already in 2005, he is now charged

With espionage which was revealed to him when he accepted employment to work in the NSA. He must be somebodies patsy, will anyone claim him?

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

7. Many other's think he's a patriotic WHISTLEBLOWER

Edward Snowden is a modern day Paul Revere with a thumb drive full of news that Tyranny is coming!


Edward Snowden's Dad Calls Him 'Modern Day Paul Revere'
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/edward-snowdens-dad-calls-modern-day-paul-revere/story?id=19554337

Hmmm... who knew how influential a DU meme could be

[Thinkingabout]

10. Far from the truth, had Snowden used the whistleblower channels in place for him to follow

Then perhaps he could be a whistleblower. He did not so he is not a whistleblower, he has committed espionage.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

11. Ah, you don't have all the truth

other people are entitled to their opinions as well, thank you very much.

Revealing crimes to the people, can never be a crime, only to totalitarians, maybe.

And by seeking sanctuary in another country has given hope to many other men and women of conscience to step up.

And that my friend has ALL the totalitarians in gov shitting all over themselves. BET!


FYI: If he was committing espionage, you would have never heard of him.

[Thinkingabout]

13. Here are the facts, he has been charged with espionage, the facts as they currently stand.

How do you conclude if he committed espionage I would have never heard about him? If this was he reason was to have people hear of him it is a dumb reason. He could have floated in a balloon, people heard about that incident also, just another dumb publicly stunt.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

14. Gov are notorious for false and trumped up charges, especially our own

espionage is the act of spying, which typically involves keeping your identity secret, so you can continue to do it for a long time, forever ideally or until you retire, and accepting personal gain, usually in the form of money.

He did the exact opposite, in fact, he did exactly what most whistleblowers do, they go to the press, and guess what, often they remain anonymous. And he also has endured tremondous self-sacrifice, rather than any gains for his whistleblowing.

that should be easy enough to understand.

[Thinkingabout]

35. He did not follow the protocol for a whistleblower therefore he is not a whistleblower, he stole

Files, he gave information about the operation he was working, therefore charges have been brought against him. Trumped up charges by Snowden has been brought on the government. If Zniwden is innocent get back here and prove it.

[Ed Suspicious]

54. +1. The warmongers, neocons, and neolibs make me sick.

[Thinkingabout]

57. Preach on, Bubba, you are showing your true side,

[millennialmax]

62. Anyone that disparages a great man like Rep. John Lewis is not a Dem, Liberal, or Progressive.

That's a pretty basic fucking litmus test.

[Number23]

58. Try decaf. Or Jesus.

Last edited Fri Aug 9, 2013, 02:25 AM - Edit history (1)

And anyone that tosses around pictures of dead children goes to the bottom of the dung heap for me. Your post is over the top and those children and their grieving mother don't deserve to be the latest playing chip in Unhinged Bingo.

[ronnie624]

65. It isn't easy, looking at the end result of your government's foreign policy, is it?

Any American who doesn't feel guilty and angry while viewing those photos, needs to see more of them.

[Number23]

67. Anyone that thinks that posting pics of dead children is a way to promote

or discuss ANY issue is too far gone to even be worth talking to. And I mean seriously fucking GONE.

[ronnie624]

93. "too far gone"?

Gone where? Can you muster a coherent reply, instead of an attempt at vague insult?

The fact of the matter is, if you saw such images every time our bombs killed women and children in other countries, they would eventually penetrate the barrier you seek to construct against consciousness of the reality of US foreign policy, and your outrage would be turned to demanding an end to the aggression. The owners of the media establishment recognize this, which is why the photos are essentially hidden from view.

[Number23]

100. If all we saw in the news was images of dead children every time a war was conducted anywhere

in the world, all we'd ever see in the news would be dead children. I, and I would say the vast majority of people with even the most basic understanding of the word "humanity," do not need to see gut-renching pictures of dead children and their anguished parents in order to be for or against an issue. The fact that you apparently do does speak volumes about the stupor you have put YOURSELF in.

I put those that see nothing wrong with throwing pictures of dead children around in the same category of pro-lifers who have literally the EXACT same beliefs as apparently some of you on this web site. They also resort to using craven pictures of dead children, in their case fetuses, in order to make their point -- in this case to end abortions. And the only thing that's happened as a result of those methods is that they have repulsed, disgusted and enraged the very same people that they were trying to reach. Their tactics have had little effect on abortions performed.

But it is nothing short of astonishing that there are a (thankfully) very tiny group on the "left" that want to engage in the exact same tactics. These folks then sit back open-mouthed with shock when people have the exact same reaction to their idiotic, manipulative, exploitative actions that people have to anti-abortion protestors. Duh.

[ronnie624]

107. Those who oppose abortion,

usually support policies that result in the deaths of large numbers of children in other countries, so their beliefs have little in common with mine.

You, like most Americans, need your nose rubbed into the truth. It is, apparently, the only thing that will penetrate the numbness caused by exposure to pervasive pop-culture propaganda. It finally worked for the children of Indochina (the ones who survived the US fit of aggression there, at least).

[Number23]

111. The beliefs may be different. But the methods are damn near identical

Take with that what you will.

If you think so little of Americans (which you apparently do), you can always find a non-American web site that discusses non-American politics and ask them what they think about unfeeling, unthinking idiots who like to wave pictures of dead children around. Would LOVE to hear the results of that little exercise.

[ronnie624]

112. You have never bothered to explain

why you believe exposure to the horrible images depicting the results of US foreign policy, is a bad thing.

I think it forces self-absorbed and distracted people to deal with these sorts of issues on an emotional level, and perhaps prompt them to question the decisions behind US foreign policy. It clearly does little to appeal to them on moral and intellectual grounds.

It isn't America I think little of. I question the American government's policies that result in conflict and hardship for people in other countries. According to our constitution, I have a right and an obligation to do so.

US foreign policy is clearly a topic pertaining to US politics, so I don't know why I would go to a "non-American web site", if my goal is to convince groggy Americans to question their government's conduct.

[Number23]

113. I should not have to explain to any DECENT human being why posting pictures of dead children

is disgusting, exploitative and most importantly, completely counter productive. This is a political web site which means that the vast majority of people here are not "groggy." What purpose would anyone serve by posting such foolishness here? Your condescension of Americans seems almost as high as your own apparent self-value which appears to be ASTRONOMICAL.

If you are unable to "question your government" without resorting to cheap, exploitative and really just plain sickening tactics, then perhaps you need to let someone else do your "questioning" for you.

Done here.

[ronnie624]

114. Right.

Displaying pictures of the dead children caused by US foreign policy, is worse than the actual killing of them.

And I'm an indecent person with seemingly high self-value.

And I hate America.

Got it.

[treestar]

83. +1

That poster has anger issues and has picked Snowden to latch onto. Almost dangerous. I hope he/she is just an internet warrior, and not likely to do something really stupid.

[Number23]

115. We won't have to worry about his anger issues or propensity for posting pics of dead children

anymore. At least for a while until usGovOwesus3.5Trillion shows up.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=303173&sub=trans

[treestar]

119. Sometimes you come back from vacation

to good news!!!!

[BainsBane]

60. You know a lot of the world would consider you and I every bit as guilty

as the rest of the "jack booting thugs" you assail in your hidden post. We pay taxes to support those wars. We elected those leaders. I don't know how you can so easily vilify others without reflecting on your own role, and that each of us plays, in US foreign policy.

[Cha]

70. St snowden hacked, ran to Hong Kong and then leaked.. like a sneak thief in

in the night. His Iceland gig didn't work out but, no worries.. he loves him some Russia..

"These nations, including Russia, Venezuela, Bolivia, Nicaragua, and Ecuador have my gratitude and respect for being the first to stand against human rights violations."

http://wikileaks.org/Statement-by-Edward-Snowden-to.html

And, hates the USA.. what sacrifice?

[treestar]

81. That statement is just incredible, isn't it?

It is the United States that stands up first against human rights violations. And well before the countries he mentions. They only want him for the publicity value.

[Cha]

99. Hey, treestar.. Many human pretzels on board

twisting in the wind.

I hear Rachel did a good show the other night explaining why PBO's "political snub" was warranted.. and highlighting Russia's human rights' abuses.

[treestar]

80. He broke the law and he did not have to

This country actually has whistleblower protections. There were channels for him to go through. And that is why this is the greatest country in the world. He had a way he could expose "crimes" (not that he did) and could have taken it. He did not have to break the law, which is what President Obama said on Jay Leno, and it is true.

He's another pathetic attention seeker like Julian in the Ecuadorian Embassy. They make up a drama about how they are saving the US, of all countries, from an imaginary tyranny, and try to live their own made-up drama.

[ohheckyeah]

103. Have you not read

that other former NSA whistleblowers tried to use the channels with no success or do you choose to ignore it?

[Recursion]

32. Two big problems

Revealing crimes to the people, can never be a crime

Two big problems with that.

One, he hasn't revealed any crimes, he's revealed the troubling extent of legal surveillance.

Two, revealing crimes can, in fact, itself be a crime.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

34. Only for the totalitarians

mahalo Recursion

[Recursion]

36. OK, so how about my more important point

He's revealed the extent of troubling legal surveillance, not "crimes"

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

39. See Post #38

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023431513#post38

RECURSIVELY

[Recursion]

43. I saw it, but I didn't see a point

What was the point there, other than "I'm really angry!!!"?

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

45. Follow your name

I thought I already told you that.

[PLANEFIX]

40. Re: Two Big Problems

No he revealed MASSIVE TREASON, a war by paranoids and cowards on the Constitution via the 4th Amendment which forbids the NSA actions. All American public officials FIRST DUTY is DEFENDING the Constitution, protecting American lives and property are secondary. Without the Constitution we have no protection, anyway, which is why conservatives are so eager to shred it.

[Recursion]

42. Again, metadata has no 4th amendment protection

None. Never has.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

44. And neither do you, now

How you like dem apples!?

[Recursion]

46. Sure I do, so do you

That's why the SOD data (and I certainly hope this program stops now) has to be "re-investigated" cleanly, because nothing the NSA trawls can be used in a court.

[Fumesucker]

73. Well, that data can't be used in court until it's been properly laundered at least

Have you been following the "parallel construction" threads about the DEA hiding the sources of intel they are using from not only defendants but prosecutors and the courts?

When police start hiding what they are doing from prosecutors you have a real problem with your law enforcement apparatus. When it's for the purpose of enforcing the moral and social equivalent of alcohol Prohibition which everyone recognizes as utterly failed then the problem is critical.

[Recursion]

74. Right, that's the "clean re-investigation" thing, which should stop yesterday

However, the abuse itself is a sign that the 4th amendment still exists; otherwise it wouldn't be necessary.

[Fumesucker]

77. I don't believe for a moment that the abuses will stop unless people do serious jail time for it

And I think the likelihood of anyone doing any jail time at all over this ranges from nonexistent to infinitesimal.

[Recursion]

84. That logic certainly didn't work for drugs

Not sure why so many people think it works for governmental crimes.

[Fumesucker]

86. That sounds like an admission you don't think it's possible to fix the abuses then

You're probably right, nothing can stop abuse of this sort of spy program, which is why it should be done away with.

[Recursion]

87. I think abuses can be nudged back, over time

But, yeah, in general it's difficult to get back power from any organization.

[wtmusic]

117. Metadata? A bit slow on the draw, aren't you.

NSA spying flap extends to contents of U.S. phone calls

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57589495-38/nsa-spying-flap-extends-to-contents-of-u.s-phone-calls/

[snappyturtle]

47. +1

Welcome to DU !

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

49. ^^^ THIS ^^^

Welcome to DU, and thanks for speaking plainly

[wtmusic]

118. Where are these "whistleblower channels"?

I think they're a figment of your imagination.

[ucrdem]

16. That "DU meme" was cooked up by Larouche attorney Bruce Fein

in a letter attributed to Snowden's father and released to the media on July 2:

In the letter, written by attorney Bruce Fein "in collaboration with" Lonnie Snowden, the two say that by leaking information on the National Security Agency's vast domestic and international surveillance programs, the younger Snowden has "forced onto the national agenda the question of whether the American people prefer the right to be left alone from government snooping..."

"You are a modern day Paul Revere summoning the American people to confront the growing danger of tyranny and one branch government," the letter says.

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/edward-snowdens-dad-calls-modern-day-paul-revere/story?id=19554337

More on the patriotic attorney:

Snowden attorney speaks for Rand Paul, Lyndon LaRouche, and the 4th amendment

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023182088

[Cha]

18. Oh my. Propaganda Central.

Mahalo, ucr.

[ucrdem]

19. Exactly.

Seems to work too, all too well.

And you are very welcome Cha!

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

20. I first mentioned it on DU on Jun 16

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023028931

So you can take that out of quotes.

[ucrdem]

21. It seems the Hong Kong papers beat you to it

by your own admission too:

Just one of the comments from abroad (China) that I found apt.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

23. yeah, as i stated, and shows your post to be incorrect

but I'm sure the conspiracy theorists will refuse to recognize this FACT, too.

let's give'm a minute...

[ucrdem]

24. Something tells me the Hong Kong papers had a little help.

Like Mr Snowden had a little help.

[usGovOwesUs3Trillion]

25. see what i mean ;)

But there is no denying that it was mentioned on DU way before that other site. accept maybe by conspiracy theorists.

Mahalo, ucr.

[Historic NY]

28. +1

[Historic NY]

27. Larouchites are A--holes.

I've been listening to his Bullshit for more than 40 yrs.

[Mojorabbit]

59. No one cares about Rand Paul.

He is not a scary anything. He is a two bit politician. I wish you all would quit trying to put him and
his father out there as some sort of scarey boogeyman.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

108. Yep. Rand Paul was the dumb SOB we always poked fun at...

...until overnight, he became the sinister genius secretly running the Greenwald-Snowden Operation behind the scenes. I really dislike the stupidity and the lack of creativity that leads to this sort of gibberish.

(Ipad edit)

[frylock]

15. you guys have had a couple months now to prove that he's somebodies [sic] patsy..

so far you haven't shown jacking fucking shit for evidence.

[JackRiddler]

26. Getting tangled up in your talking points, I see.

Which is it, thief and spy or just guy repeating what was "already" (known, presumably) "in 2005." Cos there's no consistency in what you think you're thinkingabout.

[rhett o rick]

55. Do you know what corporate lacky means? Someone that bows down and kisses the feet of

our corporate lords. No self respecting Democrat would choose Booz-Allen/ The Carlyle Group over their fellow humans. Shame on you.

[Egalitarian Thug]

71. I see you got the memo. n/t

[geek tragedy]

8. John Lewis also voted for Amash-Conyers against the surveillance state.

He believes in Snowden's cause, but not in Snowden the person.

[Recursion]

33. I think Amash-Conyers was a pretty good amendment

And I'm a paid shill for the surveillance state, or so I hear...

[AverageJoe90]

9. It appears my conclusions were incorrect.

My apologies to the good Rep.; I thought he HAD backed Snowden 100%.....guess I was wrong about that.

Thanks for helping clear this up, MichDem. You've earned a kick & a rec from me.

[Cha]

17. Yes, thank you, michigandem! And, no thanks to the Guardian yesterday for

spinning Rep John Lewis' words to fit their st snowden agenda.

Bet, GG is pissed at John Lewis. too bad.

[Egalitarian Thug]

22. So what would the radical troublemaker John Lewis of 50 years ago think of

the politician John Lewis today?

Would young John Lewis be so concerned about having to raise $15K a week to keep his job, or would he have charged right in and done what he thought right and the consequences be damned?

[emulatorloo]

88. Disgusting post.

Lewis is no liar or coward.

[Egalitarian Thug]

90. What???

[emulatorloo]

91. You wrote the slimy attack, you own it

Clear insinuation that Lewis of today is a craven liar and coward, who only gives a shit about keeping his job, not "what is right."

--------------------
22. So what would the radical troublemaker John Lewis of 50 years ago think of the politician John Lewis today?

Would young John Lewis be so concerned about having to raise $15K a week to keep his job, or would he have charged right in and done what he thought right and the consequences be damned?

----------------------

That's what you wrote.


In case you forgot, Lewis voted for the Amash Amendment.

[Egalitarian Thug]

92. I'm perfectly aware of what I wrote. The mystery is how on earth you got from those words

to whatever nonsensical meaning you assigned to them inside your head.

Enjoy your impotent rage...

[emulatorloo]

94. Nice try at deflection.

No "rage" here, just low tolerance for disingenuousness.

Deny all you want, it is all there in black and white.

[Gman]

29. Just like the person that tells a wife her husband is having an affair

Damages their marriage.

[LittleBlue]

30. It wasn't the leaker, it was the secrets he leaked

Our relations are jeopardized because we act like schoolyard bullies with no parental supervision.

[liberal_at_heart]

31. exactly. The world already has an opinion about us based on how we treat them and most of the

time it is not good.

[mick063]

110. We are unifying the world

Against us.

The Southern Hemisphere was outraged with the "plane incident". France and Germany publicly scolded us until quiet diplomatic channels told them to STFU.

Now, people are wondering why Putin is risking damage to US relations.

People with their eyes wide open understand that it isn't about Russian-US relations. Putin is gaining points with the remainder of the world that dislikes our surveillance. Some world leaders are likely privately cheering Putin for making this stand. For years, we have scolded other nations about violating citizens rights, holding ourselves up as an example to emulate.

This NSA/FISA bullshit has exposed our citizens rights rant as pure hypocrisy for the entire world to see.

[morningfog]

37. Yet he was still engaging in non-violent civil disobedience.

"In keeping with the philosophy and the discipline of non-violence, in keeping with the teaching of Henry David Thoreau and people like Gandhi and others, if you believe something that is not right, something is unjust, and you are willing to defy customs, traditions, bad laws, then you have a conscience. You have a right to defy those laws and be willing to pay the price."

He can be both motivated by his conscience while engaging in civil disobedience and damage American international relations. I think he has done both.

[libodem]

41. Yeah right

Whatever?

[Lugal Zaggesi]

50. ...and may have jeopardized human lives.

"He has damaged American international relations and compromised our national security. He leaked classified information and may have jeopardized human lives."

So, what do you say Oswald old boy? Will you join me in helping the Yanks and spying for the NSA?
Oh Oz! You've killed him.

http://news.firedoglake.com/2013/08/02/nsa-pays-150-million-to-british-spy-agency-in-secret/
The NSA could possibly be using GCHQ and other foreign intelligence agencies to bypass what little domestic surveillance laws there are in a quid pro quo – you spy on my citizens and I’ll spy on yours. In a sense, it is legal arbitrage.

The Western intelligence agencies are expected to spy on foreigners and leave its own population unmolested so paying each other and sharing an alliance is a way to spy on each other’s citizens without technically violating their respective laws. In any case why should the GCHQ have any qualms about spying on American citizens and handing the information over to the NSA? Especially when it’s getting over $150 million to do so.

[snappyturtle]

51. Yawn. nt

[DeSwiss]

52. If this is your ''complete opinion'' now......

...then you should have just kept your damned mouth shut. Since you end up taking back anything good you might have said previously.

- Fucking politicians ain't worth spit......

[hrmjustin]

53. It will be interesting to see if there was a video or a tape of the interview.

I tend to take the congressman at his word.

[DeSwiss]

63. Now let's see.....

...Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor? Gandhi or traitor?

- {ad infinitum}

[hrmjustin]

64. .

[millennialmax]

56. Preach it, Rep. Lewis. You are a national treasure. eom

[CakeGrrl]

69. So the pro-Snowden crowd who crowed that Lewis would be 'under the bus' yesterday

Are doing EXACTLY that today to a man who faced down Jim Crow.

In defense of a disgruntled employee who broke laws, cut and ran.

Check.

[emulatorloo]

89. Yes, today Lewis is a greedy coward and liar

who is only concerned about protecting his job.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3431927

[Cha]

72. Here's more of John Lewis' quote from his website this morning..

“News reports about my interview with The Guardian are misleading, and they do not reflect my complete opinion. Let me be clear. I do not agree with what Mr. Snowden did. He has damaged American international relations and compromised our national security. He leaked classified information and may have jeopardized human lives. That must be condemned.

“I never praised Mr. Snowden or said his actions rise to those of Mohandas Gandhi or other civil rights leaders. In fact, The Guardian itself agreed to retract the word “praise” from its headline.

“At the end of an interview about the 50th anniversary of the March on Washington, I was asked what I thought about Mr. Snowden’s actions. I said he has a right as an individual to act according to the dictates of his conscience, but he must be prepared to pay the price for taking that action. In the movement, we were arrested, we went to jail, we were prepared to pay the price, even lose our lives if necessary. I cannot say and I did not say that what Mr. Snowden did is right. Others will be the judge of that.”

http://johnlewis.house.gov/press-release/rep-john-lewis-no-praise-snowden

Yesterday, John Lewis was their hero and today..? Yesterday, I could tell even in the way the sleazy guardian had spun it that John Lewis didn't think Snowden had paid the price.

So, glad John Lewis exposed the guardian for the cheap snowden shillers they are. he is their bread and butter after all.

But, you don't mess with Civil Rights Leader John Lewis.. and try to say he's equating snowden to Ghandi for crissake.

[Kolesar]

76. John Lewis' third paragraph was masterful

The third paragraph of your excerpt, of course.

[hobbit709]

75. We damaged international relations when we started invading countries for no reason.

[magical thyme]

79. our own actions are what damaged our international relations and compromised our national security.

And our going insane over Snowden simply highlighted how weak we have become.

[DontTreadOnMe]

82. Here is a question for all the Pro-Snowden folks here...

So if your son came to you and said, "Dad, I have some information that I want to expose... but I am going to have to flee to China, then live in Russia for the rest of my life. I am going to be a fugitive for the rest of my life."

How many here would reply with" Yeah son, sounds like a swell idea."


BONUS QUESTION: Can someone point to ANY Snowden released document that show an actual crime. Please refer to the law broken. If you can't name the actual crime and come up with just "theories" to a crime, then your post should be placed in the "SORRY NO FACTS, MA'AM" column.

[frylock]

96. just because it's legal doesn't make it right..

so the shithead cowards in congress voted to approve of unfettered surveillance. that's it. end of story. move along, folks.

[Octafish]

85. Really? Then what good are all them H-Bomb and Nuke Submarines and Bombers and Missiles good for?

Think: Who is going to attack the United States? Al Qaeda?

They needed to have Bush on vacation for 9-11 to work.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

97. The NSA has damaged American international relations and compromised our national security.

[SomethingFishy]

98. Yeah, it's the same thing with Manning...

Guy exposes war crimes. Guy goes to jail. People who committed War Crimes are given a huge pension, free health care and protection and sent on their way.

[mike_c]

104. Snowden didn't damage American relations-- the Obama administration did....

Blame the messenger. Right. Snowden was simply the means by which they got caught.

[MrMickeysMom]

109. They keep having this problem understanding what THE PROBLEM IS, don't they?

I wonder why? ... Is it from putting cell phones too close to your ears? ... watching too much CNN or some MSNBC spinners?... Fox?

It's simple if you understand that time and time again where erosion of fundamental rights are messed with, sooner or later the people are going to remind their government that constitutionally, we have these rights. They are self-evident. I don't need a manufactured post League of Nations fragment that has gone out of control to run rough shot over my every move. I don't need to be placated about fearing someone's profiling me for any electronic conversation I've ever had and to be told what TO and what NOT to worry about. Who made rules "for the people" less than "for the industrial complex?

The answer is whoever has your member of congresses ear in Washington, and the ponzi scheme in Wall Street.