Inside the Hyperloop: the pneumatic travel system faster than the speed of sound

[dkf]

The “cross between Concorde, a rail gun and an air hockey table” will deliver passengers between US cities faster than the speed of sound.

So when Mr Musk, 42, announced that he would be publishing plans for the Hyperloop on Monday, August 12 - tomorrow - scientists were sent into a tailspin.

They will have to wait for Mr Musk to post his “alpha design” on the internet then but he has dropped several hints about its features, including that the system will be powered by solar panels.

In recent weeks a large part of the mystery appeared to have been solved. A technology enthusiast in Canada called John Gardi published a diagram of how the Hyperloop might work. He went on to ask Mr Musk on Twitter: “Can you give me some basic clues? What diameter of tube so I can start designing stations and throughways?”

To his extreme surprise Mr Musk replied: “Your guess is the closest I’ve seen anyone guess so far. Pod diameter probably around 2m.”

Mr Gardi, who describes himself modestly as a “tinkerer”, came up with a tunnel 9ft in diameter, raised above the ground on pylons. His tube could be made from materials already used for sewer pipes. It would form a continuous loop between two destination points. Giant turbines would blast a stream of air into the tube. The two-metre wide pods, carrying people, would be moved by a rail gun - a tube that uses magnets to accelerate material passing along it.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/10235261/Inside-the-Hyperloop-the-pneumatic-travel-system-faster-than-the-speed-of-sound.html

[NYC_SKP]

1. Elon Musk can make things happen. Tesla. Solar City. SpaceX.

All successful.

[reformist2]

2. Who wants to be the first?! (Not me!)

[dkf]

3. Rider you mean? Yeah I'll wait for them to iron out the kinks

[pscot]

6. Kinks would be bad.

[NuclearDem]

4. ...

[Electric Monk]

5. cost prohibitive?

[DirkGently]

7. Musk claims it would cost a fraction of high-speed rail.

It's a wild idea, but he seems pretty good at backing up wild talk regarding tech

Musk first mentioned the Hyperloop during a “fireside chat” in July 2012. At the time, he estimated it would cost around $6 billion. For comparison, Phase 1 of the proposed California high-speed rail system will cost an estimated $68 billion to connect San Francisco to Los Angeles through the Central Valley and Palmdale, according to an April 2012 report by the rail authority.

http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-hy-hyperloop-design-coming-soon-20130715,0,5378557.story

[Starry Messenger]

8. Elon Musk Admits Hyperloop Is Maybe Too Crazy to Build

http://valleywag.gawker.com/elon-musk-admits-hyperloop-is-maybe-too-crazy-to-build-1067798053

"Musk originally said the "alpha" design of the Hyperloop—which sounds like it's basically a giant gun that blasts you from San Francisco to Los Angeles—would be published this month. He might've gotten ahead of himself, according to a recent chat with investors:

I think I kind of shot myself if I ever mentioning Hyperloop, because obviously I have to focus on core Tesla business and SpaceX business and that's more than enough, but I did commit to publishing a design and provide quite a detailed design I think on Monday and then invite critical feedback and see if the people can find ways to improve it and then you can just be out there as kind of like a open source design that maybe you can keep improving and I don't have any plan to execute, because I must remain focused on SpaceX and Tesla.

[Safetykitten]

9. I smell a science fiction movie. "Attack Of The Hyperloop Blob People".

[DirkGently]

10. Hyperloop Inferno: Circle of Fire!

[muriel_volestrangler]

11. This combination of 'pneumatic' and 'faster than sound' seems rather strange

'Pneumatic' implies that air pressure is driving the pods from behind (though it also claims they are "moved by a rail gun" - though that could be just for acceleration). But an object travelling than sound, inside a tube not much bigger than it, is going to have some damn weird aerodynamics (for a start, a sonic boom, at ground level, right next to people).

I suspect the 'faster than sound' bit won't be true. How do you keep something going faster than sound with pneumatic pressure behind it? You'd need a supersonic wind tunnel hundreds of miles long - and they don't come cheap.

[dkf]

12. My queasy stomach is not re-assured but the idea is fascinating.

[Recursion]

14. Now imagine a vacuum in front of the pod

That's the only way I could see that happening.

[muriel_volestrangler]

18. Now imagine the air from behind rushing past the pod

Either it's a good seal, to preserve the vacuum in front - in which case you have enormous friction at 800mph+, or it's not, in which case you are blowing air at supersonic speeds through a narrow gap, and trying to remove it somehow. Which makes the idea of a this being a simple pipe that Gardi suggests rather unlikely.

How are we supporting the weight of the pod? With wheels would mean something like the supersonic land speed record holder - not cheap. Maglev? Again, this means it's not just a simple pipe, and not cheap. Some subtle aerodynamic design in which the pressurised air from behind is also pushed under the pod to support its weight? Again, what stops the air escaping at the front?

[Motown_Johnny]

19. it is unlikely that it would be driven by air pressure

I assume that the tube would resemble a pneumatic tube on steroids, but that is where the resemblance would end.


This would be more like a mag-lev in a tube.


The 2m diameter is pretty small. I am picturing a cylinder where one side opens and allows passengers to walk right up to a line of chairs. People would be seated behind one another, since trying to do that with people next to each other within 2 meters seems impossible. Luggage would need to fit above or below the seat.

[muriel_volestrangler]

20. Maglev seems physically feasible

but I'd question that it could be a tenth of the cost of high speed rail. If the tube is evacuated (at least mostly), it will decrease air resistance.

2m diameter would be enough for 2 people, side by side - it's the size of a car.

[Motown_Johnny]

21. But a car isn't usually 6 feet tall

and if we assume this is cylindrical then some problems present themselves. If you try to put two people next to each other, both are ducking the curvature of the wall to get into and out of their seats (assuming the wall is in place at the time). Also, on most long trips some type of bathroom facility is usually available. If you want to try and leave an isle to walk to and from a facility within the transport then having 2 people next to each other isn't a possibility.


The tube being evacuated also solves the sonic boom problem. There would be no buildup of air pressure on the front of the cylinder so there would be no boom.



I hate to think of what the TSA will put passengers through. An "Underwear Bomber" style attack on this thing, when traveling 700+ mph., would be a real mess.

[muriel_volestrangler]

23. No, a car is considerably shorter, and thus this is easier to get into

Even if this did just have a door on one side, people can move to the seat away from the door, in the same way they to to the middle of a bench seat on a car (or the window seat of an airplane). Or it can have doors on both sides.

It's not a long trip. That's the point of this. They're claiming half an hour for LA to SF. If they do want to use it for significantly longer trips, then, yes, you would need either some way of allowing people to walk (crouching) to a toilet, or have each pod under control of anyone in it, so that they can request a bathroom stop, as you do in a car.

[XemaSab]

13. 30 minutes from LA to SF?

Amazing.

[Shankapotomus]

15. Just for the record

I'd like to add this whole national tube transport thing was my idea and I thought of it. There would also be a smaller and more local tube system that would deliver groceries you ordered on the Internet directly from the store to your house. So if you're going to thank anyone for this idea it should be me.

You're welcome.

But I digress.

[Motown_Johnny]

17. I'm pretty sure it was Josh Groban

[Shankapotomus]

22. Okay now you're talking crazy

Just listen to yourself.

[arely staircase]

16. this is going to be even bigger than the Segway. nt