NSA “Nothing To See Here, People” Types Thoroughly Embarrassed Again - WashingtonMonthly

[WillyT]

NSA “Nothing to see here, people” types thoroughly embarrassed again
By Samuel Knight - WashingtonMonthly
August 17, 2013 3:18 PM

<snip>

Remember when Jeffrey Toobin ho-hummed over Edward Snowden’s disclosures, and called him a “grandiose narcissist”?

What, one wonders, did Snowden think the N.S.A. did? Any marginally attentive citizen, much less N.S.A. employee or contractor, knows that the entire mission of the agency is to intercept electronic communications. Perhaps he thought that the N.S.A. operated only outside the United States; in that case, he hadn’t been paying very close attention.

What utter nonsense — transparent discourse policing. As if a cable news pundit calling anyone a narcissist wasn’t absurd enough, Toobin seems to think that the state of democracy is fine devoid of some pretty significant information. That the mere knowledge of secret surveillance programs, secret courts, secret legal interpretations, and secret legal opinions (even ones that reportedly find the NSA to be engaged in unconstitutional behavior) should be enough for Americans — one needn’t know the details. “Nothing to see here, people.” The problem with this painfully incurious and profoundly anti-journalistic outlook is that one cannot actually attempt to hold the government - or any self-interested defensive institution - accountable without information. As either a constituent, a journalist, or any other stakeholder, try grilling an official about suspected government practices without any actual knowledge or evidence. See how that goes.

Fortunately, common sense is winning. There definitely isn’t “nothing to see here.” Just as public opinion on the war in Afghanistan soured not long after WikiLeaks’ Afghan War Logs and the late great Michael Hastings’ profile of Gen. McChrystal were published in the summer of 2010, public opinion is turning against this dragnet surveillance, which our leaders see as an indispensable component of an eternal war. The results of a Washington Post-ABC News poll published yesterday found that almost 6 in 10 respondents — Democrats and Republicans alike — believe the government can’t justify its privacy intrusions. A few weeks after Snowden’s first disclosure, a separate inquiry by the news organizations found that concerns for privacy were at “the highest point in any Post-ABC News poll dating back to summer 2002.” It’s little wonder this is the case, given the Obama administration’s crackdown on whistleblowers, Holder v. Humanitarian Law, the case against WikiLeaks, and the feds’ reaction to the Occupy Movement (to say nothing of all the imagined persecutions of the Tea Party).

And earlier today, Virginia Republican and NSA critic Morgan Griffith said a recent House vote to starve funding for the agency’s fishing expedition surveillance would have passed instead of being narrowly defeated, had the Washington Post’s most recent revelation come to light ex ante facto...

<snip>

More: http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal-a/2013_08/nsa_nothing_to_see_here_people046440.php#

[Th1onein]

1. Kick and rec.

Thanks for posting this.

[WillyT]

2. You Are Quite Welcome !!!

[Skittles]

3. that includes plenty of naive DUers

[Electric Monk]

11. Naivete mixed with arrogance and condescension is a really ugly combination, too

while hiding behind the guise of "We support the President. Why don't you?"

[Demeter]

16. You forgot the willful ignorance component

The foundation of all the rest.

[Skittles]

17. I have a feeling much of that ignorance will wear off in 2017

sheer hypocrisy too

[Demeter]

18. I sure hope so; but we will need alternatives, too!

I'm tired of holding my nose to vote, if you know what I mean.

[Skittles]

22. I am sick of it too

it has been a long time

[Jack Rabbit]

39. My nose is getting awfully sore, too

It's getting so you can't breathe in voting booth, the stench is so overwhelming.

[SwampG8r]

45. how can anyone

give any credibility to anything they say?
any candidate they espouse to me will go immediately to the back of the line.

[bvar22]

23. The Bubble!

[font size=3]Its not just for Republicans anymore![/font]

[Cryptoad]

29. The Progressive Tea Party

can join them in there!

[HumansAndResources]

43. You Know the DLC-creating Koch Bros also fund the Tea Party - Right ??

I don't think the Pro Civil Liberties Leftists, who Clearly Do Not support the Koch's right to exploit us and our planet, are on their payroll. If there is a "Tea Party" in the Democratic Party, it is the Pro-Transnational-Corporate DLC.

[Marr]

49. +1

Well put.

[uponit7771]

52. Link and quote...thx

[bvar22]

63. Here are a few.

ALEC at 40: Turning Back the Clock on Prosperity and Progress
Democratic Leadership Council

Among the DLC's biggest benefactors last year (contributions of between $50,000 and $100,000) were ARCO, Chevron and the drug giant Merck. Other big underwriters include Du Pont, Microsoft and Philip Morris (which has kicked in $500,000 since Lieberman became DLC chairman). There is no evidence that the DLC has trimmed policies to accommodate its patrons, but some contributors say the money has helped ensure an open door to Lieberman. "We've been able to have a dialogue with the senator and his staff," said Jay Rosser, spokesman for another DLC benefactor, [font size=3]Koch Industries[/font], an oil-pipeline firm that is also a big GOP donor.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Democratic_Leadership_Council

and

According to SourceWatch, a project of the Center for Media & Democracy, the brothers are "leading contributors to the Koch family foundations, which supports a network of Conservative organizations and think tanks, including Citizens for a Sound Economy, the Manhattan Institute the Heartland Institute, and [font size=3]the Democratic Leadership Council.[/font]"

http://www.democrats.com/node/7789

Just Google "Koch Brothers & DLC" for enough links to choke a DC Lobbyist.

I'm surprised you didn't already know about this.
Of course, we've been telling you about this for years,
but surely NOW you believe us?

[uponit7771]

69. thx, doesn't looks like the DLC is funded by the kochs though

[bvar22]

70. That is just bizarre.

Here's a little challenge.

Lets see if you can repeat the following
"Koch Industries gave funding to the DLC and served on its Executive Council",
and then respond with:

[font color=firebrick]"doesn't looks like the DLC is funded by the kochs though"[/font]

Please do that again for us.



Documentation:

One member of the DLC’s executive council is none other than [font size=3]Koch Industries,[/font] the privately held, Kansas-based oil company whose namesake family members are avatars of the far right, having helped to found archconservative institutions like the Cato Institute and Citizens for a Sound Economy. Not only that, but two Koch executives, Richard Fink and Robert P. Hall III, are listed as members of the board of trustees and the event committee, respectively–meaning that [font size=3]they gave significantly more than $25,000.[/font]

http://americablog.com/2010/08/koch-industries-gave-funding-to-the-dlc-and-served-on-its-executive-council.html

[Mnpaul]

71. Koch had people on the board of trustees

And for $25,000, 28 giant companies found their way onto the DLC’s executive council, including Aetna, AT&T;, American Airlines, AIG, BellSouth, Chevron, DuPont, Enron, IBM, Merck and Company, Microsoft, Philip Morris, Texaco, and Verizon Communications. Few, if any, of these corporations would be seen as leaning Democratic, of course, but here and there are some real surprises. One member of the DLC’s executive council is none other than Koch Industries, the privately held, Kansas-based oil company whose namesake family members are avatars of the far right, having helped to found archconservative institutions like the Cato Institute and Citizens for a Sound Economy. Not only that, but two Koch executives, Richard Fink and Robert P. Hall III, are listed as members of the board of trustees and the event committee, respectively–meaning that they gave significantly more than $25,000.

The DLC board of trustees is an elite body whose membership is reserved for major donors, and many of the trustees are financial wheeler-dealers who run investment companies and capital management firms–though senior executives from a handful of corporations, such as Koch, Aetna, and Coca-Cola, are included.
http://americablog.com/2010/08/koch-industries-gave-funding-to-the-dlc-and-served-on-its-executive-council.html

[bvar22]

73. *****crickets*****

Not surprising.






You will know them by their [font size=3]WORKS.[/font]

[L0oniX]

56. Enjoy your stay. n/t

[Cryptoad]

64. Thanks,,,,,, nt

[99th_Monkey]

4. K & R ~ nt

[forestpath]

5. K&R

[MisterP]

6. don't they mean "totally vindicated"? 'cos that's what the apologists keep claiming...

[uponit7771]

7. For the most part there IS nothing to see, not anything people are going to do anything about

...outside of stoking.

15 amendment is being torn asunder daily by the GOP and folk are worried about what "could" be happening (cause there is no solid proof systematic spying is happening and looking at public info is NOT ... NOT spying) with the 4th ?!?!

I don't trust this shit...

A basher and a fuck up (who ran away to Russia to get away from suppression?!!?) who hired on to company for the explicit reason of stealing are telling Americans that America's government is bad...

unnn

[Cryptoad]

28. The Progressive Tea Party

may not want to own up to it but we have a two Party political system.

NSA is overseen by judges on the courts. Judges appointed by the executive branch,,,, I know which Party I want to appointing the Judges whose job it is to protect our rights and it damn sure isn't the GOP.

Thank Goodness that both Tea Parties followers are declining!

[uponit7771]

31. Yeah, I didn't know there were so many "gov bad" democrats till now. Seems kind fishy to me...

...now Raund Pauls are quoted here and there too.

Shit seems fishy

[Cryptoad]

33. Me thinks

there are pretenders among us!

Hell they are now proclaim the GOP victory in 2016 here.

I put nothing past the GOP operatives

in no level too low for them to sink to!

geez

[uponit7771]

38. YES!! Coordinated and out disproportional outrage relative to what the GOP is doing to the 15th amen

[NealK]

40. "there are pretenders among us! "

Irony is not dead.

[HangOnKids]

46. Love You!

Nailed it!

[L0oniX]

58. ^^^this^^^

[TBF]

61. Nailed it :) nt

[WillyT]

35. Wrong !!!

DULink: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023178708

[Cryptoad]

36. Reading is a critical skill....

that link you gave confirms everything I said......

try reading what I said a little slower maybe that will help,,

Federal Judges are appointed by the Oval Office.

If you want the GOP appointed judges looking out for your rights ,,, keep up the Tea Party tactics.

I know I want judges who were appointed by a Democrat in the White House doing these jobs not a Judge appointed by the GOP like Roberts.........

geez........

[HangOnKids]

47. Did your break from DU help your reading skills?

Maybe Willy should try that? Could it help him?

[Cryptoad]

62. What break?

[HumansAndResources]

44. Stranded in Russia by the State Dept, You Mean??

He was on his way to Latin America when, oops - no passport. Russia was not his choice. Are you just misinformed?

He gave up an easy and wealthy life to Tell Us the Truth. Yet you Insult Him. Why??

Anyone who doesn't know history - that the US-Government has been a participant in war-crimes across the globe, for centuries, under both parties, has their head in the sand. Yeah, I'd call that "bad." A greater awareness of anti-liberties tactics - and these coming home to roost in the USA - is a Very Good Thing. We can END this behavior with a Real Grassroots-Run Democratic Party.

No one here promotes the GOP or Rand the Koch Brothers Tool, so you DLC guys can call off your attempted framing of the Pro-Civil-Liberties / Anti-War wing of the Democratic Left the "Enemy Within". We know who the enemy is - just follow the money.

[hueymahl]

8. Thanks

Right vs. Wrong -

That is what this boils down to. There is not a whole lot of "grey" in what the NSA is doing.

[sabrina 1]

9. Their worst nightmare is happening. They have lost control of the 'message' although why there

has to be a 'message' rather than simple facts, is and always has been, beyond me.

Not only that, but the Left/Right/Ron Paul/Rand Paul games they played and some of us for a while, simply aren't working anymore.

Keep the people divided, and many of us fell for it for a long time, was how they remained 'safe' from scrutiny. But some things, and this they don't seem to get, are far, far more important than political game playing.

The day the people unite on some of these issues, is the day they will lose control. And it appears, starting with the Wall St. Bailouts, that has begun to happen.

The propagandists keep trying to play the old cards that used to work 'you're a Paulbot if you oppose these programs' or 'only racists' oppose these programs, have spectacularly failed, not only that, they have become COMEDY, the worst thing that can happen to a propaganda machine.

Maybe some of them will finally start taking their jobs seriously, realizing that job is NOT to facilitate the bottom line of Corporations, but is it, and I know this is hard for them to accept:

TO DEFEND AND PROTECT THE CONSTITUTION OF THE US!

Sorry to shout that part, but our elected officials have gone way, way off course and someone needs to remind them why they are there. It is NOT to secure profitable jobs in the private sector for themselves and their buddies.

[hueymahl]

37. Always enjoy your posts

+1000

[Civilization2]

54. Those who favor 'party' over democracy doom both. Great post,. calm clear and concise.

Yes the standard propagandist attacks on reality are failing the corporate-military and its deluded supporters,. finally.

[n2doc]

10. Leave Barack Alone! Hasn't he suffered Enough?

You Meanie!

[WillyT]

12. LOL !!!

[n2doc]

15. Just riffing off of another thread

DU is pretty schizophrenic these days.

[wildbilln864]

13. ha! n/t

[cantbeserious]

14. Kick And Recommend

eom

[Catherina]

19. "Fortunately, common sense is winning". There definitely isn’t “nothing to see here.” n/t

[markpkessinger]

20. K&R! n/t

[tom_kelly]

21. My guess

is that there will be a series of bank failures again soon. Their table has already been set for the feast and nothing will cancel their plans. They understand that this will be the last shindig so they're going to go for broke. They realize the masses will rise hence the need for all this surveillance. The worldwide surveillance will be very important once other countries realize that their money has been stolen too. No bailouts this time. They will use this opportunity to install their world order. World, meet chaos.

[Civilization2]

24. likely scenario,. too-late capitalism is is laugh after laugh,. .

too bad the greedy seem to get what they want,. for the short term anyhow.

<sharpens pitchfork> <swills home-brew and packs the bong with home grown> Grid what grid?

[Purveyor]

25. K&R Thank You for posting... +1

[Bolo Boffin]

26. Funny, I don't feel embarrassed. Oh, that's because I've never said "nothing to see here."

Count me as a "something to be seen and has been long before Snowden's 'revelations' and as it turns out, what's happening is working well within the parameters of the Constitution (no thanks to David F. Addington et al.), but, sure, let's repeal the Patriot Act and the AUMF, too, I'm 100% behind that" person.

Kind of hard to fit that in a headline, I grant you.

[AppetiteForApathy]

27. I completely backed away from the NSA debate.

Because I feel both the proponents and opponents of these programs are lying their asses off, either intentionally or unintentionally.

[bvar22]

30. Its NOT REAL!!!!

I REFUSE to believe ANY of it.
Its ALL hype!
Somebody is just making all this stuff to help the Republicans!!!

Our government LOVES us,
and only wants what is GOOD for us,
whether we agree or not!

Snowden is a coward and a traitor,
who really is insignificant,
and we will use all the power of the government to catch him
and make him apologize........after we punish him.
Now THAT is the END of DISCUSSION!!!!



Lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalala.
Can't hear you.
Its not real.
I REFUSE to even look at all that "evidence",
because all that "stuff" is just hype.
Lalalalalalalalalalalala

[WillyT]

32. You Bad...

[NealK]

41. Lol!

You forgot to mention Greenwald but that's about it.

[ConcernedCanuk]

55. Sad that we've got to the point

.
.
.

where the sarcasm tag is no longer needed;

everyone gets it.

(sigh)

CC

[woo me with science]

57. Bwah!

[L0oniX]

59. DUzy

[Oilwellian]

65. Heeee!

[Mnpaul]

72. I'm wondering....

if the NSA can listen in on what's being said inside that bubble.

Cone of Silence anyone?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

34. It's getting pretty hard to see the 4th Amendment through the crowd of spies and politicians.

The 1st Amendment is getting kind of blurry when it comes to freedom of speech and the press also.

[ProSense]

42. Another NSA "Bombshell" Starts to Fizzle Out, as Greenwald Pushes Government Conspiracy Theory

Another NSA "Bombshell" Starts to Fizzle Out, as Greenwald Pushes Government Conspiracy Theory
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023478767

[HumansAndResources]

48. Isn't the "Conspiracy Theory" Frame getting a bit Old?

History is made up of conspiracies - usually to trick the poor into dying in wars for the rich. Grade School history was boring because all that was stripped out and replaced with half-truths and 'patriotic myths'.

Of course, when you consider that schools were designed to create, "A nation of workers - not thinkers" (John D. Rockefeller) per the Foundation-Heads who designed them - it is not surprising that the goal is to turn young minds off to history, which would pull the curtain back behind the system of "manufacturing consent" (Chomsky) allowing for the continuing trend of citizen-disempowerment to continue.

In our dreams...people yield themselves with perfect docility to our molding hands. The present educational conventions [intellectual and character education] fade from our minds, and unhampered by tradition we work our own good will upon a grateful and responsive folk. We shall not try to make these people or any of their children into philosophers or men of learning or men of science. We have not to raise up from among them authors, educators, poets or men of letters. We shall not search for embryo great artists, painters, musicians, nor lawyers, doctors, preachers, politicians, statesmen, of whom we have ample supply.

- Rockefeller’s General Education Board - Occasional Letter Number One (1906).

[NealK]

51. Rockefeller was one evil dude.

Did you know that Mr. Burns was based in part on him?

"The show's creator Matt Groening principally based Burns on his high school teacher Mr. Bailey. Drawing further inspiration from oil tycoon John D. Rockefeller, David Rockefeller and fictional character Henry Potter from It's a Wonderful Life, Groening made Burns the embodiment of corporate greed".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Burns#Creation

[L0oniX]

60. ...because we all should blindly believe our government.

[Douglas Carpenter]

50. There is nothing here than everyone didn't already know and releasing this information

greatly endangers American security and it is a crime. They already put in place the strongest safeguards so there is no overreach. and they were already going to fix the overreach that doesn't even exist in the first place.

Besides, the Guardian newspaper uses cookies, Snowden's girlfriend was a pole dancer and Greenwald was way behind on his taxes ten years ago.

Anyone who cannot see this supports Rand Paul.

[KoKo]

74. You forgot the Sarcasm. The latest story about Greenwald might jar

some awake. But, then there are those who never noticed the "boxcars" going past their houses on the way to the "Detention Centers"....i.e. "Concentration Camps" until it was too late to do anything about it.

We have a small window of time to do something. The Heathrow Fisaco with Greenwald's Partner is a Wake Up Call.... We need to heed it!

[blkmusclmachine]

53. .

.

[midnight]

66. 6 out of 10 people, and it was bipartisan, don't think govt. can justify it's privacy intrusions...

I wonder if this bipartisan group thinks this, because they know it's against the law?

[99th_Monkey]

67. But isn't it all "just hype"?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023474183 
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3478767

[gulliver]

68. I'm still waiting for something to see.

There is still no evidence of any harm to the privacy of even a single individual. It's a tempest in a teapot, and the uproar is distracting us from real problems.