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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSyrian War - Remember Yugoslavia ?? OK - But Let's Remember the Real Story.
In the context of Syria, today, many on the "Left" are citing Yugoslavia as a "good war" where we were, after all, not killing "black or brown people," for a change. Let us have a look back, and consider the real reasons for that war and the parallels to today's "proposed adventure" to "liberate" Syria.
Cut to the Chase: The Primary Reason for the Yugoslav war was "privatizing" resources, held by a socialist-government, for Transnational-Corporate Theft {6}. The Eastern-Bloc's resources and infrastructure had already been transfered to Transnational-Corporate hands, yet the people of Yugoslavia had not yet been stripped of their birthright and infrastructure-fruits of their labor. "Humanitarian concerns" - while very real - were incited by the West to be used for political calculus; if those were the primary reason for war, Saudi Arabia would have been bombed long ago.
To Incite the Yugoslavian Well-Planned War of Colonial Aggression*, the first US broke up the existing, signed, peace treaty (this was before major battles and so-called 'atrocities'). On March 18, 1992 the Lisbon conference reached an agreement between the leaders of the three ethnic factions {7}, but on March 28, after attending a meeting that day with US ambassador to Yugoslavia Warren Zimmermann, Bosnian Muslim leader Alija Izetbegović withdrew his signature; what was said at the meeting remains an unresolved topic of debate {8}. Does this remind anyone of the Gillespie meeting with Saddam Hussein? The "We don't have a defense-treaty with Kuwait" meeting? After the war, the Bosian-Islamist faction was no better off than they would have been under the Lisbon treaty; pawns in a game are rarely rewarded for their useful-idiocy (any more than American workers have been for supporting Koch-DLC candidates).
With the war started, the US then undermined the UN weapons-ban, and had the CIA coordinate the airlifting of Islamic fighters and weapons shipments, resulting in the creation of a persistent trans-national criminal network" {10}. Sectarian strife was minimal before the West began coordinating and inflaming it, primarily via economic means {6}, similarly to the method used recently to incite the "grassroots revolution" in Egypt.
NATO (the North Atlantic Terrorist Organization) backed the Nazi-allies (Croats) and the Islamic Fundamentalists in a bid to break up Yugoslavia and expand the Transnational-Corporate Globalist Empire. The Yugoglavians are left with the birth-defects to show for this "great crusade" for Transnational-Corporate Domination; {1} the US has blocked a UN probe investigating this correlation {2}.
The Yugoslavian War was one part of the "Arc Of Crisis" strategy Brzezinski had implemented to "get the Russians." This continued even after the end of the USSR, as peace with Russia was Squandered one more time. The Afghanistan proxy-war was another part in that strategy; we only found out a few years ago that the US STARTED the war with the Soviets there {4}, as then national-security (sic) director Brzezinski (CFR puppet of Rockefeller) proudly admitted - along with no regrets for those "stirred up Muslims" (aka "Terrorists"
he created to get the job done. That whole "Olympic Boycott" thing with the Russians via Reagan over their response to US aggression? Can you say Pure Theatre?
The Muslim Brotherhood (Egypt) are also former Nazi allies {5}, like the Croats, and were brought into the Western-Terrorist Tool Chest by MI-6 after WWII. They have been a key murder-squad to oppose "sectarian nationalism" - the use of the region's resources to better their own people (see: Nasser).
Another summation of the Real Motivations behind the US attack on Yugoslavia is presented by Dr. Michael Parenti {3}:
Between 1960 and 1980 (Yugoslavia) had one of the most vigorous growth rates: a decent standard of living, free medical care and education, a guaranteed right to a job, one-month vacation with pay, a literacy rate of over 90 percent, and a life expectancy of 72 years. Yugoslavia also offered its multi-ethnic citizenry affordable public transportation, housing, and utilities, with a not-for-profit economy that was mostly publicly owned. ...
The dismemberment and mutilation of Yugoslavia was part of a concerted policy initiated by the United States and the other Western powers in 1989. Yugoslavia was the one country in Eastern Europe that would not voluntarily overthrow what remained of its socialist system and install a free-market economic order. ...
U.S. policymakers also want to abolish Yugoslavias public sector services and social programs for the same reason they want to abolish our public sector services and social programs. The ultimate goal is the privatization and Third Worldization of Yugoslavia, as it is the Third Worldization of the United States and every other nation.
This same lesson applies to Kadaffi's Libya, which had the highest standard of living in the region, zero-interest loans for new businesses, and an almost-complete water pipeline (built using its own foundry employing its own people sans "outsourcing" or Bechtel) which could have helped feed millions of Africans. As Kissinger is purported to have said, "Control oil to control nations" and "Control food to control people." There was no "slaughter" happening there, until the US formed a "rebel army" of Fundimentalist-Islamacist head-choppers to initiate it.
I hope no one on this board bought into the "humanitarian lie" that was the Libyan war, but to those that did, remember this: When *peaceful unarmed* demonstrators in Bahrain are murdered - where the USA has a Naval Base - not a peep from the press, and CNN suppresses reporting from their own correspondent {9}. To keep the DLC democrats quiet, Bahrain buys the help of former Howard Dean campaign manager Joe Trippi {9}.
By contrast, when Western-armed Radical-Islamist murder-arson gangs begin a tidal-wave of armed-destruction in Libya and Syria - nations with long-standing religious tolerance - where there is a LOT of oil and a Russian naval base, respectively per, it is billed as a "Humanitarian Crisis" where the Islamacist "head-choppers" who want to exterminate all those with different faiths are the "good guys." CFR-mouthpiece Foreign Policy Magazine even boldy declares, "Two Cheers for Syrian Islamists" {10)
Ready to puke at the Glaring Hypocrisy, yet? Just Swallow Hard and remember your NewsSpeak:
Assad Chemical Weapons = Bad.
US Radioactive Depleted Uranium Weapons = Good.
Even though, clearly, the LAST thing Assad would do right now is use chemical weapons - and against civilians? Why? He was winning - THAT is why the "red line" had to be crossed. And who would have the motivation and means to do this? Remember those Libyan stockpiles Kadaffi gave up before getting a knife in the back? Were those shipped out of Bengazi along with the rest of the "Arms For Al Qaeda" CIA-wrapped gift-package? Maybe we will find out in 40 years or so, when Ms. Rice writes her memoirs.
This would not be the first time the blame was shifted to the victim of a chemical weapons attack. Remember when those "Evil Iranians" used chemical weapons in the Iran-Iraq war? At least, that is what Transnational-Corporate owned News-Speak told us at the time. But then, later, when our "ally" Saddam was no longer useful, it is revealed to us that it was HE who used them, though the fact it was done with Full US Backing and Support at the time seems to have missed the front pages of the NYT.
To clarify the Larger Picture, using Orwell's Animal Farm:
Four legs good, Two legs bad (War when a Rethuglican is president).
Four legs good, Two legs better (when a Koch-DLCer union-destroyer is president). (**)
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{*}Note that under the Transnational Corporate Model - we are **ALL** colonies, which explains the whole-sale sellout of US Working-Person's interests via outsourcing, union-busting, etc.
{1} "The United States also used DU ammunition in the Bosnia and Kosovo wars. Pediatricians in Sarajevo now report a fivefold increase in childhood leukemia."
http://www.warchildren.org/hidden_killer.html
{2} "... NATO officials had refused to cooperate regarding their use of depleted-uranium weapons. Pekka Haavisto, task-force chairperson, said his team was unable to determine the extent of pollution caused by uranium-tipped weapons. He said NATO refused either to admit using the weapons or to cooperate with the task force."
http://www.iacenter.org/depleted/un_du.htm
{3} http://www.michaelparenti.org/yugoslavia.html
{4} "Brzezinski: Yes. According to the official version of history, CIA aid to the Mujahadeen began during 1980, that is to say, after the Soviet army invaded Afghanistan, 24 Dec 1979. But the reality, secretly guarded until now, is completely otherwise Indeed, it was July 3, 1979 that President Carter signed the first directive for secret aid to the opponents of the pro-Soviet regime in Kabul."
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BRZ110A.html
{5} http://wariscrime.com/new/al-qaeda-from-serving-hitler-to-serving-the-cia/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relations_between_Nazi_Germany_and_the_Arab_world
http://www.youtube.com/ watch?v=eJUKWae6blg
{6} Chossudovsky, Michel (1997). Dismantling former Yugoslavia, recolonizing Bosnia. Capital & Class; Summer97 Issue 62, p1-12, 12p
{7} Friedman, Francine. (2004) Bosnia and Herzegovina : A Polity On the Brink
Postcommunist States and Nations. Pp 42-43. New York. Taylor and Francis.
{8} Krnjevic-Miskovic, Damjan de. Alija Izetbegovic, 1925-2003. 2003. The National Interest. Volume 2. Issue 41. October 22. Washington, DC.
http://inthenationalinterest.com/Articles/Vol2Issue41/Vol2Issue41dkmPFV.html
{9} "Why didn't CNN's international arm air its own documentary on Bahrain's Arab Spring repression? A former CNN correspondent defies threats from her former employer to speak out about self-censorship at the network"
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/sep/04/cnn-international-documentary-bahrain-arab-spring-repression
Also: http://www.youtube.com/ watch?v=zB2DeZBgTEk
{10} Two Cheers for Syrian Islamists - By Gary Gambill
http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2012/08/23/two_cheers_for_syrian_islamists
{11} Mincheva, L. and Gurr, T. R. , (2007) Unholy Alliances: New Evidence on Linkages between Trans-State Terrorism and Crime Networks" Paper presented at the annual meeting of the International Studies Association 48th Annual Convention, Hilton Chicago, CHICAGO, IL, USA Online. Feburary 28.
http://www.allacademic.com/meta/p178915_index.html
Further reading on Yugoslavian/Balkan Propaganda on upholding the Big Lie:
http://original.antiwar.com/david-gibbs/2012/06/10/welcome-to-the-balkan-propaganda-machine/
** Primarily referring to Bill Clinton / NAFTA / GATT / WTO moves here, there wasn't much "union" left for Obama - at least in the private sector. But then, we haven't seen the TPP yet - because it is a Corporate-Government Partnership Secret. Also, please send a link if President Obama criticised Boeing for evading Union-Labor my moving manufacturing out of Washingon to a "Right to Work and Be Poor Anyway" state (or the car companies who made similar moves).
Recursion
(56,582 posts)It never ceases to amaze me how credulous people are about depleted uranium...
(Hint: it's not radioactive, and it's less toxic than the molybdenum it replaced.)
sir pball
(5,340 posts)Though I doubt anybody being blown to molecules with an APFSDS round really cares.
On a tangent - Armor-Piercing Fin-Stabilized Discarding Sabot rounds are pretty cool, a not-horrendous answer to the best armor we can invent. Pity WC is so much more impractical than DU.
HumansAndResources
(229 posts)Last edited Sun Aug 25, 2013, 01:42 AM - Edit history (1)
Of course, counting "killed today" versus the "will be killed over the next 1000 years" is not an easy task. Read the links i gave on Depleted Uranium - and if you want more, just ask. It was designed as a "last choice" weapon to be used After a Nuclear War, and it is very depressing the a Democratic President was the first ...
--- oops, I was wrong, Bush I was the first to deploy it in Gulf War I. Still sad that Clinton used it.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)No. It's a dense metal that is made into essentially huge javelins that are used to punch holes in tanks and armored bunkers.
HumansAndResources
(229 posts)The Dangers of Depleted Uranium is not "New" news:
In a declassified memo to General Leslie R. Groves, dated October 30, 1943, three of the top physicists in the Manhattan Project, Dr James B Conant, A. H. Compton, and H. C. Urey, made their recommendation, as members of the Subcommittee of the S-1 Executive Committee on the Use of Radioactive Materials:
- as a Military Weapon:
"As a gas warfare instrument the material would be ground into particles of microscopic size to form dust and smoke and distributed by a ground-fired projectile, land vehicles, or aerial bombs. In this form it would be inhaled by personnel. The amount necessary to cause death to a person inhaling the material is extremely small
There are no known methods of treatment for such a casualty
it will permeate a standard gas mask filter in quantities large enough to be extremely damaging."
http://www.voltairenet.org/article169437.html
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Major Doug Rokke is a leading DU expert, who has become a whistleblower against its use. ... When Rokke and his team were assigned to clean up the DU after the first Gulf War, all his men got ill within 72 hours with respiratory problems, rashes, bleeding, and open sores.
More on this here:
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_cathy_ga_070202_depleted_uranium_poi.htm
http://www.eoslifework.co.uk/pdfs/DU2102A3a.pdf
http://www.ippnw.org/pdf/mgs/7-1-ippnw-depleted-uranium.pdf
http://www.voltairenet.org/article169437.html
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Still believe what the Tee Vee says? Who owns that station? Same guys who own the MIC - why MSNBC (then primarily owned by MIC-contractor G.E. ) fired Donahue, ending their most popular show to get that "anti-war guy" off the airwaves.
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)about it.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)Depleted Uranium posts make this board look stupid every time they happen. Learn the basics before you post, please.
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)From: http://www.epa.gov/radtown/depleted-uranium.html
The person who doesn't know "the basics" is you.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)HumansAndResources
(229 posts)As you may be aware, there are radioactive substances you can hold in your hand because the type of radiation they emit cannot penetrate your skin, or a piece of paper - but if you get that same stuff into your body, you are DEAD. So calling this or that "less or more" radioactive doesn't really explain the issue.
There are different types of radioactive particles/waves, which themselves can have varying energy-levels. Then there is the matter of what/how it comes onto or INTO the body, and how the particles adhere and where. Other properties of the material should also be considered, such as what particle-size its material becomes upon use in, for example, an artillery shell. This affects how it spreads, how it gets into human beings, water, food, animals, etc.
Some of these factors ALSO concern Dep-Uranium being a toxic heavy-metal, as are other non-radioactive materials used in artillery shells (as you pointed out upthread). A study as to how the use of THOSE may be killing people might ALSO be warranted - but those findings would not excuse Dep-Uranium use.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)That's what drives me insane when this board starts talking about this. People can't hear "uranium" and "radiation" without losing their minds. The problem is it's toxic. But it's less toxic than the metals it replaced.
muriel_volestrangler
(106,210 posts)sir pball
(5,340 posts)..and even then you don't make sense.
Off to Avernum..
HumansAndResources
(229 posts)If you keep reading more, you will have the, "OMG, Everything I Was Taught Was A Big Lie" moment. And then your intellectual-life begins anew.
Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)As for Bahrain, the government is still violently suppressing the people and not single word is spoke about it.
PowerToThePeople
(9,610 posts)Makes sense though.
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)As a Soviet satellite state it is unsurprising that ethnic divides would cause the country to fall into ruin as the USSR broke up and the Eastern Bloc broke away. The Soviet satellite states fared poorly in most cases as far as I recall.
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)joshcryer
(62,536 posts)As I'm concerned it was still a satellite state as it was still on good terms with the Soviets when the Bloc fell.
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)as any other decolonized country was in the postwar period, like "nehruvian" india or "nasserist" egypt
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)Granted, Tito did get rid of a huge chunk of the Soviet era policies at the end. But 20-30 years of Soviet influence is going to create a large divide. Having a country with significant ethnic divide then suddenly have a sense of self-determination, they'll be at each others throats.
This happens every damn time a dictator is disposed in such scenarios and is often why people support the benevolent dictator over the ensuing conflict that is sure to occur.
HumansAndResources
(229 posts)Then, Bosnian Muslim leader Alija Izetbegović met with US ambassador to Yugoslavia Warren Zimmermann. After that meeting, he withdrew his signature. Coincidence??
Something had to be done to end that socialism. Transnational Corporate Rules say that Only Nordics are allowed to be socialist. All others Shall Be Bombed until they re-consider.
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)much as the other non aligned countries did
i dont know what 20-30 years of soviet influence is supposed to mean. the whole world was under soviet influence for 20-30 years, it was the first workers' state and it was the only real rival to the USA. yugoslavia wasn't an island.
joshcryer
(62,536 posts)The colonized Eastern Bloc was basically the Soviets' bread winner.
It is no magical coincidence that the breakup of Yugoslavia coincided with the dissolution of the Soviet union. It was the ultimate power held by one person (Tito was "lifetime President"
. Once Tito died they simply invented a rotating presidential order with the top elites in charge. It was the same formal system for all intents.
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)(2) the eastern bloc countries had more autonomy than the member states of the eu do
(3) the eastern bloc countries had the very opposite of a colonial relationship to the soviet union - they exported finished goods in exchange for soviet raw material
man you are just not posting in good faith
Recursion
(56,582 posts)Which is to say, not at all. (As a general rule, if your country's name includes the word "Democratic", it's a safe bet you aren't.)
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)
leftstreet
(40,680 posts)Every time you turn around there's a new rent-an-insurgency forcing western imperial leaders to go on tv and sound all somber and serious
Fuck occupations!
tritsofme
(19,900 posts)That's the gist I got from the first few paragraphs of this dribble.
Don't see very many of these around anymore!
HumansAndResources
(229 posts)... but not an apologist for the exploitation of people by corrupt Barons of the "capitalist" sort either. It is indeed sad that Soviet workers had, in many cases, better standards of living and social-safety-net than American workers do today - but that is a measurement of our fall since the "New Deal" - not "how swell" the USSR was with "The State" micromanaging everyone's lives and their shares of the planet.
Hell, even the New Deal allowed a handful of Elites to claim to "own" or otherwise control our birthright - the Earth's Land and Mineral Resources. The next "Deal" we get better be OUR Offer to Them - "Hey, buddy, you didn't make that. It is ours." From that point, we can have actual "free trade" and "free association" and all those other "free" things that Crony Capitalism claims to offer everyone, but are REALLY only available to the wealthy "owners" from whom the 99.9% are forced to "rent our bodies" for "permission to exist on Earth."
As to the foreign policy of the USSR vs the USA - better take a look at Latin America - Operation Condor, and the now admitted-knowing aid to "Gas 'Em Saddam Hussein" http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014576674 before you get on an American Exceptionalist high horse.
mbfromnm
(5 posts)Thanks for posting this critical information. It fully fits with everything I know about this pattern of destabilizing any country that does not do our bidding.