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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGrown Ups Don't Shoot Laptops
For over a week I have resisted watching Tommy Jordans You Tube rant about his daughter. From the descriptions I read, I figured this guy got about 15 minutes more fame than he deserved. Today, however, an editorial writer in the local paper had this to say
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Oh my! Read diary entries? Anyone who reads someone elses diary entry without permission deserves every ounce of hurt they get. Because people---especially young women---use their diaries as therapy, to express the anger that society does not give them leave to express in real life. Oh, and by the way, ever wonder why girls get eating disorders and cut themselves and attempt suicide? It is because they are not allowed to express their negative emotions in this fucked up Boys cant cry and girls cant get mad society we live in. And when you deny anyone the right to express their emotions, you are telling that (usually young) person, You are not good enough the way you are. Which leads to self hatred, self abuse and years of psychotherapy as an adult.
Speaking of money, I hope that the Ms. Jordan sends her dad a bill for her shrink when she has to spend a couple of years figuring out why it was ok for her dad to curse her on YouTube, but it was not ok for her to curse her dad on Facebook. And before you say Thats different, hes he grownup I want to add this:
When a parent acts one way and expects his child to act another, that parent is trying to be the child and trying to force his kid to be the adult.
Yeah, yeah. Bitch and moan about how much you have sacrificed for the kids, about how hard you work, about the six hours you wasted and the loss of $130. Tell us that you are deserving of unconditional love from your child, because of all the things you have done for her. Get it off your chest. But for Christs sake, do it in private or in the company of like-minded adults. Because here is a little secret. Your (still minor) child does not owe you a damn thing. When you decided to become a parent, you made a contract with that baby to love it, care for it, support it financially as well as emotionally. You did not sign on for a cruise on the I love you daddy Boat. We owe our kids unconditional love. If we do not get the kids we thought we deserved, we make do with the ones we have. And we love them for all the things they are---the pissed as hell as well as the sugar and spice, the tears and wails as well as the puppy dogs tails.
I decided I had to see for myself why a grown woman was proudly telling the world that she sneaks and reads her kids diary. So, I checked out Tommy Jordans rant. Here are the highlights:
First, bonus points for waving a cigarette around as he tells his daughter how she ought to act. Yes, in real life he probably cusses out his girl while smoking. But what kind of parent does it on YouTube? Answer: a parent who is proud of his faults. A parent who is telling the world (in its face) this is how I am, love it or leave me alone. Which raises the question, what kind of kid writes a Facebook entry about how mad she is at her family? Answer: a kid who is trying to tell the world this is how I am, love it or leave me alone. Hmm. A chip off the old block. Youd think the father would be proud that his daughter is following in his footsteps.
Double bonus points for doing exactly what the daughter is accused of doing---telling the public how angry he is at his familys failure to communicate. When a girl child does it, she is unnatural. When the grown up dad does it, he is cool. A cult figure. Gotta admire a man who is not afraid to act like a whiny brat in public!
Triple bonus points for telling us that he grounded his daughter for three months---no computer, no Facebook, no cell phone---for telling the world how mad she was. As a writer, I hate---no, despise censorship in any form. As a mother and a doctor, alarms go off in my head whenever someone brags about how they placed their steel toed boot squarely on their childs negative emotions, nipping those dangerous things right in the bud.
Quadruple bonus points for starting off his rant with the assurance that he must love his daughter and supply all her needs, because he spent six hours on her computer yesterday and 130 bucks. At this point, I can already see the problem. Dad here does not think he owes his daughter six hours or $130. He thinks he made a deposit in the Bank of I love you daddy, and he expects a return on his investment. So, when the daughter does not pay up, he figures he needs to Occupy YouTube, in order to let the public know that he has been ripped off---
Good lord, man! Youre supposed to be happy if your daughter is healthy, reasonably well balanced and not sniffing glue. Good parents do not keep a ledger. Good parents expect only one thing of their children---that they treat other people with the same degree of love and respect that their parents have shown to them.
Ok, on to the tough love. I wont recap the whole thing, just the highlights.
Are you out of your mind?
You wont get off your lazy ass to look for a job.
I blew half my day upgrading your laptop.
I dont know how to say how disappointed I am with you
This one deserves special comment. Obviously this dad is not a fool. He knows that his family has serious communication problems. That is why his daughter is telling her Facebook friends about her problems rather than sitting down with the family to work them out. And guess what. If there is a communication problem, it is not the kids fault. Because she is not the parent, no matter how much her parent may wish that his daughter could be the perfect mother-surrogate that he thinks he deserves. Yes, he does think he deserves it. The rant about how bad he had it as a kid and how he had to leave home and work and put himself through college is supposed to prove to the world that he deserves a chance to be a child finally. But, in order for him to be the kid, his child has to be the parent. What kind of unnatural daughter objects to being told to drop what she is doing and get Dad some coffee? June Cleaver had orgasms when Ward asked her to do the same. She felt fulfilled when she could bake cookies with a big smile plastered across her carefully made up face. I am going to go out on a limb and suggest that Tommy Jordans parents were not the Cleavers. And he still has not forgiven them for that sin.
OK, back to the video.
You got it easy More self pity. We know you suffered, dude. You want to make someone pay, and your daughter is the easiest target. Man, you look like you are having some fun as you tell viewers to Put a boot up their own kids ass---right before you complain about her use of curse words.Note to everyone. If you cuss, your kids will cuss. Cussing is not a sin. It is natural language. If you want your child to develop the ability to express emotions with accurately---like saying I feel that you have belittled me with that comment. I have value too rather than snapping back with Fuck you, ass hole, you need to teach them those words.
The rest is history. This right here is my 45. And These are exploding hollow point rounds. You have to pay me back for them And, most disturbing of all, (because I am a bit sexist, I admit it. Even when the dad insists upon playing the role of the child, I expect the mother to make an effort to be a parent) Your mom said to put one in from her
Since no story is complete without the back story, here is my own back story. My dad was much too young to be a parent. He wanted my mother to be the perfect mother he never had. He did not want to share her with needy little kids. He came home drunk and waved a gun around and scared the kids(me) half to death and his wife, very sensibly, left him. Good for her. It was one of the best things she ever did for me (her child) and I am grateful as hell, even if he did continue to bitch and moan to his dying day about how much he loved and missed my mother. Another thing I am grateful for---when I was a kid crying in the backseat of the car and my father yelled back at me to shut up, my mother said She has a right to cry. Leave her alone. Now, that is good parenting.
xchrom
(108,903 posts)rustydog
(9,186 posts)to trivial irritants should shoot the hell out of their laptops because they are probably only watching
goober videos on youtube, mma beatdowns, WWF beatdowns, and non stop hours upon hours of warcraft games on the 'puter.
No matter how some people try to justify this act, there is absolutely no intellligent justification for SHOOTING YOUR KIDS COMPUTER!!! Unless you want to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are a certified idiot who should have the state take your kids away before you shoot one of them in one of your spastic fits.
ProfessionalLeftist
(4,982 posts)"... in this fucked up Boys cant cry and girls cant get mad society we live in.
Powerful and WAY true. I've been SLAMMED with that one all my life. It's extremely damaging.
Lint Head
(15,064 posts)abolugi
(417 posts)obviously from the reactions it received a lot people think it's o.k..
I, myself, was shocked by his reaction but even my husband kind of thought it was funny. Kids complain.They always have and they always will. If my parents would have heard some of the things I said about them..
Hell, my daughter did the same thing. I simply took her computer away for a month and made her feel guilty about it. It worked very well. I've been accused of being too mellow but I guess thats just me.
I've just come to the conclusion that some people raise their kids different than me. Not wrong, I suppose. Just different.
moriah
(8,311 posts)... would be to have given the laptop to the "cleaning lady".
That would be a relevant and thoughtful response.
jmowreader
(50,528 posts)the better solution would have been to make the daughter hand it over to the cleaning lady.
The moran father handing it over is right up there with "your dog had to go to live on a farm."
moriah
(8,311 posts)Zalatix
(8,994 posts)it's the American way, darn it! Yeehaw, ride 'em cowboy, all that stuff.
Take your intelligent and mature opinions back out of my jungle, America is for us savages!!!
moriah
(8,311 posts)"What did that poor laptop ever do to you?!?"
Zalatix
(8,994 posts)They like to take sport in shooting whatever cannot fight back. The poor, unarmed Iraqis, minorities (when the law isn't looking), animals*, etc. I guess the sad part is we should be consoled that at least this time it wasn't a living thing.
(Now mind you, hunting for food and survival is one thing... but trophies and fur? Really?)
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)when she discovers a rant that her little brother puts about her on FB?
Or, if she is supposed to accept this as reasonable response from him how does she respond when a boyfriend or husband threatens her with a gun or even beats her?
He's ultimately teaching some indefensible lessons.
Fortran
(83 posts)people vomited onto him.
TheWraith
(24,331 posts)Fortran
(83 posts)xmas74
(29,670 posts)He acts like he did, he deserves the negative attention.
Fortran
(83 posts)xmas74
(29,670 posts)I'm used to the nasty, hateful comments, quite a few of which are on here.
That's why I didn't care where the guy was from. Idiots are idiots no matter where they are from and no matter what side of the political spectrum they lay claim to.
Rex
(65,616 posts)then I hope he is happy! Soon laptops will be shooting grown ups!!! Skynet now has a reason to obliterate us.
Cluster bombs inbound I am attacking their base from my throne!!!
KurtNYC
(14,549 posts)McCamy Taylor
(19,240 posts)I watched it through hoping for a punchline. There isn't one, so I suggest spending a minute or two to appreciate the guy's "Pappy" impersonation (gotta love that pipe, so "I'm from an era when we knew how to be fathers" . But after a while, it kind of drags.
jsmirman
(4,507 posts)No smoking gun in there, exactly, but he does seem to know specific details about "Tommy Jordan."
And now we know what "the clinic" was that Jordan refers to in the video.
obamanut2012
(26,046 posts)I can't play videos right now.
Raine1967
(11,589 posts)I have been reluctant to comment on this story since I heard of it and watched the video.
I really could not agree more. Hoax or not, the reaction by people to this is what I found so completely disturbing, for all the reasons you wrote above. He filmed this-- he did this to manipulate people and that is in and of itself really awful.
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)Dr. Frist to the courtesy video monitor, please."
Yes, remember how we all laughed at Dr. Frist's 'diagnosis' of Terry Schiavo via a short video clip?
And now we have you 'diagnosing' a family and all of its members from a FB clip. My how times have changed.
I am assuming you have never met the people involved here. But that doesn't stop you from analyzing them from your own perspective.
I hope that the Ms. Jordan sends her dad a bill for her shrink when she has to spend a couple of years figuring out why it was ok for her dad to curse her on YouTube, but it was not ok for her to curse her dad on Facebook."
Amazingly you have already determined that the events in question here will lead to untold psychiatric problems in future based on - on exactly what? Your say so?
"Bitch and moan about how much you have sacrificed for the kids, about how hard you work, about the six hours you wasted and the loss of $130. Tell us that you are deserving of unconditional love from your child, because of all the things you have done for her."
I just watched the video clip (for the first time). I heard nothing said about 'being deserving of unconditional love'. But you've decided that's what is being said - even though it wasn't - so I suppose we should all just accept your insight into people's minds, even if they are people you have never met nor interacted with.
"First, bonus points for waving a cigarette around as he tells his daughter how she ought to act. Yes, in real life he probably cusses out his girl while smoking. But what kind of parent does it on YouTube? Answer: a parent who is proud of his faults. A parent who is telling the world (in its face) this is how I am, love it or leave me alone."
I saw a man smoking on camera. Amazingly, you were able to determine from that trivial fact that he 'is proud of his faults', and is sending 'the world' a message - a message which you fabricated out of your own head. I could be wrong - not having your incredible insight - but the smokers I've known smoke because they enjoy it, and there is no message attached.
"what kind of kid writes a Facebook entry about how mad she is at her family? Answer: a kid who is trying to tell the world this is how I am, love it or leave me alone." Or it could be a pissed-off kid just venting to her friends on FaceBook. But apparently YOU have all the answers, and it couldn't be as simple (and obvious) as that.
"... alarms go off in my head whenever someone brags about how they placed their steel toed boot squarely on their childs negative emotions, nipping those dangerous things right in the bud." Steel-toed boot? Negative emotions? Let's not even consider the idea that a parent might think it wise to curb their child's negative behavior by warning of the consequences of said behavior.
"Quadruple bonus points for starting off his rant with the assurance that he must love his daughter and supply all her needs, because he spent six hours on her computer yesterday and 130 bucks. At this point, I can already see the problem ..."
Yes, of course you do, Dr. Frist.
"Dad here does not think he owes his daughter six hours or $130. He thinks he made a deposit in the Bank of I love you daddy, and he expects a return on his investment."
Astoundingly, you KNOW what this man - a perfect stranger to you - actually thinks and doesn't think. I'd have to say that Dr. Frist was a rank amateur compared to you. Having the ability to KNOW what someone is thinking or not thinking at any given moment is truly remarkable.
"He knows that his family has serious communication problems. That is why his daughter is telling her Facebook friends about her problems rather than sitting down with the family to work them out. And guess what. If there is a communication problem, it is not the kids fault. Because she is not the parent, no matter how much her parent may wish that his daughter could be the perfect mother-surrogate that he thinks he deserves. Yes, he does think he deserves it."
Again I am duly impressed with your ability to KNOW the inner workings of someone's mind - including knowing that this dad "wishes" his daughter be a mother-surrogate, and "thinks" that's what he deserves. As if you even had a clue what goes on in this family - or any other, for that matter - other than your own.
Kids, especially teens, are often uncommunicative with their parents - and vice versa - because they choose to be. It is not always the kids' fault, any more than it always the parents' fault. In fact, 'fault' is not even always the appropriate word to describe a lack of communication. There are times when parents and/or kids prefer to communicate on certain topics with solely with their age group or confidants of their choosing - which is not a failure on anyone's part.
"The rant about how bad he had it as a kid and how he had to leave home and work and put himself through college is supposed to prove to the world that he deserves a chance to be a child finally."
I didn't hear any 'rant'. I heard a simple statement (which millions of kids have heard from their parents and grandparents) about what their personal experience growing up was. Again, your assumption that anyone making such a statement is trying "to prove to the world" that they deserve to "be a child finally" is preposterous.
I had never watched this video clip before tonight, but I have read most of the OPs on the topic and the replies - because I found it comical that (a) such a non-event became a topic of such melodramatic proportions, and (b) that people who hold themselves out to be liberal/progressives were so quick to jump to utterly ridiculous conclusions without so much as a dollop of evidence.
I have seen replies insisting that there was physical abusse and/or sexual molestation of the daughter at play here, that using a gun to destroy the daughter's computer was 'proof positive' that this dad intended to shoot his daughter in future, etc., based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever.
I've also seen broad-brush statements about "people like that", implying that southerners, gun-owners, and everyone else one chooses to categorize as "those people" are, by nature, always up to no good and should be viewed accordingly.
I originally read this OP because you usually choose to write about topics of political or social importance. You've missed the mark entirely on this one - and I find your psychiatric analysis, based on what YOU believe total strangers to be thinking, wishing, or trying to convey, downright laughable.
McCamy Taylor
(19,240 posts)I am commenting upon the character that some guy chose to play on an internet video in order to get his 15 minutes of fame. For all I know, he does not even have a daughter. The fact that the video has gone viral--and that a facebook friend even lauded the sentiment it expressed---means that the character of the gun shooting "dad" is now public domain, and I would be remiss if I did not point out what an extremely bad parenting model he is.
I suspect that many out there who initially praised the dude are now squirming uncomfortably as the inevitable backlash occurs. They should not. This is a learning experience for everyone. The way we react to fiction---including the fiction that calls itself nofiction---tells us a lot about ourselves.
Now, here is a bit of free psychoanalysis. When we feel the need to defend a fictional character, it usually means that we identify with that character.
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)you decided to not only psychoanalyze a character you now say is fictional, you actually told us what he was thinking, what his motives were, what he was intending to project, the 'message' he was conveying, etc.
All this from a video clip made by someone you don't know, have never met, and now don't even believe to be a real person anyway.
You would be "remiss" if you didn't point out what a bad parenting model he is? Remiss in what way? Has the entire universe been waiting for you to weigh-in on this topic? Does the world look to you for the last word on whose parenting skills meet with your approval? I think not.
If your comment about "feeling the need to defend a fictional character" was directed at me, you have missed the mark by a long shot. I neither condemned nor defended
the man in this video - fictional or real.
What I did do was point out the incredible absurdity of anyone viewing a video clip of a total stranger and going on and on about knowing what that person was thinking, feeling, or any other number of things about them that you are in no position to know.
It is one thing to offer an opinion as to someone's words or actions, and to express whatever conclusions (rightly or wrongly) you might have drawn as a result.
It is quite another to be arrogantly insistent that you know he thinks this, you know he expects that, you know he said this in order to convey that, you know what goes on in the privacy of someone else's family based on a few minutes of a FaceBook video - all of this about someone you have now concluded is fictional anyway - which begs the question as to why you offered your free psycho-babble analysis in the first place.
As for your "bit of free psychoanalysis", I will take it to be worth exactly what I paid for it. Nothing.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Thanks for saying what I was thinking (and more)
KurtNYC
(14,549 posts)Viral videos are not "non-events" -- not when they go to 30+ million views. This video, which is a hoax btw, set off a national dialog on Facebook, gun play and how to raise kids in the modern world.
I have a theory that the things which set us off the most when we see them in other people are exactly the same things which we beat ourselves up for.
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)Yeah, for sure. Just like the video of the talking dog - which was all over FB last summer - set off a 'national dialogue' on how much dogs like to talk about maple-flavored bacon.
KurtNYC
(14,549 posts)Dr. Phil, India Times, ABC News, The Los Angeles Times, People Magazine, Metro, USA Today, The Today Show and many others have weighed in. One may feel the subject is beneath them (and then write 1500 condescending words on it) but one cannot deny that this video was a phenomenon.
Sarcasm is the least efficient mode of communication.
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)pointing out that the bobble-heads in the media are talking about something these days usually serves as confirmation that it's a trivial non-story.
As we all know, the MSM doesn't "do" news anymore. Instead they prattle on about viral videos - just like their 'coverage' of the talking dog clip when it went over the 15 million views mark.
If going viral on FB equates to 'changing the national dialogue', I can't wait to see what impact Shit Italian Moms Say has on the national conversation.
BTW, I didn't write 1500 condescending words on the topic - the OP did. What I wrote about was her condescension in attributing inner thoughts and motives to someone she doesn't know - someone who she now says doesn't exist anyway.
That makes the OP even more astonishing - purporting to being able to read the mind of, and know the motives of, someone who isn't even real.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"media are talking about something these days usually serves as confirmation that it's a trivial non-story....
Hence, the GOP primaries are trivial non-stories? The blizzard conditions in the Balkans are trivial? The analysis of the response to the Fukishima reactor is a non-story? Or is that little bit of bumper sticker philosophy merely relevant when and only when it validate your own positions?
(I certainly hope your response isn't a trivial, non-story...)
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)but then, I think you know that.
If you want to believe that a FB video of the 'laptop dad' has changed the national dialogue on parenting, be my guest.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Well, for one segment on one drive home anyway
People really DO take themselves too seriously
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"That doesn't stop you from analyzing them from your own perspective. ..."
Not so much analysis as it is simply stating that childlike behavior should remain with children only...
Summer Hathaway
(2,770 posts)what is 'child-like behavior'?
The OP has attributed thoughts and motives to someone she later decided wasn't even a real person - which strikes me as child-like behavior in the extreme.
raccoon
(31,105 posts)Jester Messiah
(4,711 posts)I'd make sure he lost a valued possession right back. After all, kids do follow the examples their parents set for them. "Oh, is that a bullet hole in your nice new flat-panel big screen? How -ever- did that get there?"
pennyfor
(11 posts)Everything comes from a family and if a child has poor bahavior - it is the arents who should be blames for that
KurtNYC
(14,549 posts)They take the parody as far as you can go (and both actors nail his speech pattern).
McCamy Taylor
(19,240 posts)jorno67
(1,986 posts)Jester Messiah
(4,711 posts)Response to McCamy Taylor (Original post)
jorno67 This message was self-deleted by its author.
laundry_queen
(8,646 posts)And I agree with every single word. As someone who had parents that expected perfection even as they acted like assholes, I could fill up all the bandwidth in the world with how much that fucked me up. As you said, I was never allowed to get mad. Ever. Hell, I wasn't even allowed to be assertive. And that was only the beginning. I think your analysis of the family (and societal) dynamic is spot on.
tramadoc
(3 posts)Everyone of you people on here sit back and judge a man that you know nothing about. You feel the need to be a "keyboard warrior" and call a man names from afar. Not a single one of you who has called him names such as, and I quote, "Carolina Hillbilly", have the balls to say it to his face. I am a liberal voter. I feel that this best describes my political leanings because the religious right is so far out there its not even funny. But you people honestly kill me. I am a gun owner. I have a concealed carry permit and pretty much am armed all the time. I own a couple of assault rifles because that is my constitutional right. I don't hunt because I feel no need to hurt a defenseless animal. I served in the military and am proud of my service to this country. I also live in NC like Tommy Jordan. I enjoy watching MMA and train in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and Muay Thai. I think WWF wrestling is fake. Not everyone from NC is a moron and "hillbilly" as it was termed. If you think what he did was wrong, that is your right. To sit back and bash him and call him hurtful names is not. Call me a gun nut or a zealot. It doesn't matter to me. Personally I would have never shot the laptop because that's not how I roll. I myself would have taken it away from her or given it to someone that needed and appreciated it. In closing, those of you who have taken to hurling insults on an Internet message board at a man you do not personally know are flawed. Your character leaves a lot to be desired. Me? I'll sit back with my cache of weapons that I have legally obtained and watch the drama unfold. Once again, I am a liberal voter and I own weapons because the Constitution of The United States of America says I can. My family, home, and property are protected if anyone tries to break in and/or bring harm to my family. The US Government taught me to shoot very well. Break into my home and you can see how well.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)You had me until you threw out the WWF wrestling is fake bit. Damn, that came right the fuck out of left field
Then you go into some end-times rant about keyboard warriors wanting to break into your home? Odd, but whatever it was worth the read LOL. Oh, and skip your next jiu jitsu class and spend the time learning basic paragraph structure
I guess you needed to follow the other posts that were made in reference to persons from the south. Someone had made a comment regarding MMA, guns, and WWF wrestling. I had so many things I wanted to say that everything seemed to run together. Cognitive thought be damned. I never made mention to keyboard warriors breaking into my home. I think you may have combined two different trains of thought into one giant train wreck of non sensical ramblings. I am ADD and sometimes my thought processes get a bit track. If reference to your comment regarding proper paragraph structure, thank you. I am an educated man and have my B.S. from The University of Virginia and my MPH from The University of North Carolina. I'm pretty sure I remember that from Freshman English. I just got going on a rant and as I said, cognitive thought be damned.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)JonLP24
(29,322 posts)I didn't like what I saw but you noticed things that I didn't. The bold, the cigarette, I love all of it.