We thought we voted for this man...

[kpete]

Peace Prize President Begs America To Let Him Bomb Syria





Peace PLEASE,
Mr. President
Or NO HOPE

there, i said it
kp

[darkangel218]

1. Unrec.

[villager]

2. Rec

[Erose999]

3. Rec +1

[Enthusiast]

108. Kicked and Recommended! nt

[darkangel218]

5. My unrec is better than your rec

Give it up.

[villager]

7. Eye of the beholder stuff...

Besides, it's already on the Greatest Page!

[darkangel218]

10. hehe..

That means my reply to the post will be too!

[villager]

13. If you're into Pyrrhic victories

(and judging from the politics evinced by that "unrec," you are!), then..

congrats!

[darkangel218]

20. Syria wouldnt be a "phyrric victory"

Stopping or at least trying to stop Assads ability to further use chemical weapons is well worth the effort.
Unless you think the value of innocent kids is not that much?
It wouldnt be the first I see on here " its not our problem, let Allah sort it out "

[villager]

24. Words in mouth much?

Didn't say any of that -- as you well know.

Just not convinced bombing for peace is in the best interests of Syria's kids right now.

Hence, Pyrrhic, since it could likely lead to the very thing that armchair combatants such as yourself claim they want to prevent.

[darkangel218]

26. Granted, we dont know if an attack would succeed.

But what's the alternative, do nothing?

Besides, at this point it doesn't look like an intervention will even happen, since majority of Congress is againt it.

Want to join the toothpick fight?

[kpete]

29. Peace is the ONLY thing left - worth fighting for

Peace is not an impossible dream, if all parties concerned determine that serious peace talks must be attempted before any new attacks on the Syrian regime are launched. We can still remedy the tragic flaw in American foreign policy by insisting that peace is the means as well as the end, and that no military action can ever be considered a last resort without going all out for conflict resolution.

http://www.rich-rubenstein.com/2013/09/syria-and-the-tragic-flaw-in-american-foreign-policy/

[Jakes Progress]

100. So we don't know, but blow up people anyway? That it?

How many dead people do you want?

Yeah. that was a little over the top. But no worse than your stuff.

Why not be a little brighter and not fall for the it's-one-way-or-the-other crap that the administration is trying (unsuccessfully) to sell. There are options between blow it up and endorse chemical weapons. A bright president - or one with decent advisors - would find those options and work on them.

Bombing is the republican thing to do. It is ronnie raygun's idea of what to do. It is dickie cheney's idea of what to do. Sure the republicans are voting against it now, but that's because we have a black president. If he were a republican (or whiter) they would be unanimously for starting another war. Aren't you a little tired of our guy being wrong because he keeps listening to the people who got it wrong before?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

28. The whole world is sitting it out until the U.N. reviews the evidence.

[darkangel218]

30. Is UN still investigating this?

I didn't know. Thought they said no to an intervention and that was that

[Rebellious Republican]

40. You are mistaken! They are still investigating. Thats the funny thing about the UN...

They do not have a knee jerk emotional response to a crisis. They investigate, evaluate and give careful consideration to their response. Cooler heads will prevail. It takes a little time, hard for many to wrap their head around in this instant gratification world in which we live.

"The United Nations has received at least 14 reports of possible chemical weapons use in Syria. After months of diplomatic wrangling, a team of experts, led by Swedish scientist Ake Sellstrom, arrived in Syria on August 18.

The U.N. team was initially going to look into three incidents, but its priority became investigating an alleged gas attack in the rebel-held suburbs of Damascus last week, which activists say killed hundreds of civilians.

Assad's government denies responsibility for the attack, and, like Russia, has suggested the rebels may be responsible.

Syrian U.N. Ambassador Bashar Ja'afari said he has written to U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon to ask that Sellstrom's team also "investigate three heinous incidents that took place in the countryside of Damascus on (August) 22nd, 24th and 25th where members of the Syrian army inhaled poisonous gas."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/28/us-syria-crisis-un-investigation-idUSBRE97R18F20130828

[darkangel218]

47. Thanks for the link.

Perhaps we should wait for the UN to decide then

[Rebellious Republican]

49. Your welcome, thats why I like this place, its a good source of information. That helps me...

informed decisions.

[DissidentVoice]

121. There is a reason

There is a reason why NATO (especially the British), the UN, ANZUS, etc. have said no.

[MyNameGoesHere]

41. Let Allah sort it out?

What are you a comedian like that big fat turd on the radio?

[darkangel218]

42. I was quotting what others were saying on here.

Why are you insulting me?

[darkangel218]

46. Care to respond?

Or you just throw insults and run. Lol

[beerandjesus]

116. I'll respond.

No one on here is saying that. You just made a false accusation.

Nice one about "throwing insults and running" given how lacking in substance your insult was.

[darkangel218]

128. My question was not directed towards you or anyone else.

Except the poster in question. Let him respond.

Welcome to DU btw

[marble falls]

52. One way to thwart Assad would be to not sell him the chemicals to begin with. Do you really ...

think the US did not know about this sale before it was even put on a ship? Poor civilians, eh? Why didn't anyone consider them before the western powers sold Saddam or Bashir WMDs?

If the majority of Syrians really wanted Assad gone, he'd be gone and frankly all the opposition would become new Assads murdering a different segment of Syrian society.

Its just one more chicken of colonialism are coming home to roost. Cut off all weapons sales to the rest of the world.

[darkangel218]

54. From what i read, the UK supposedly sold him chemicals

Which can be used to make bombs.
I don't know if US knew about it. I hope not



And you have a good point there.. if majority of Syrians would want him out, he would be gone. Example is the East Europeans revolutions back in the 89'-90'.

[marble falls]

60. That's right, UK sold it and there is no way in Hell the US did not know about it before ....

Assad took delivery. We knew what is on Russian ships headed to Syria before we turned those around, we knew about the tubes Norway was sending to Iraq before we turned them back, too.

The US knew. The NSA knew. CIA knew.

[darkangel218]

62. Damn...

[sulphurdunn]

64. Do you really believe

becoming involved militarily in someone's civil war will save the lives of children? Could you give me an example of when this has ever happened, because I can give you a couple of examples where American military intervention has killed and maimed uncountable numbers of children.

[darkangel218]

65. I cant give you examples. Nor am i going to say it would work.

It could work, it could fail.
I was just saying that doing nothing would be worse.

[sulphurdunn]

66. Starting a war would be worse,

much worse.

[deutsey]

81. Hey, it worked out well for the kids in Iraq after the US invaded

[a la izquierda]

88. I can give you an example.

Guatemala, 1961-1996. Want to read fun stories about children raped and murdered? Fetuses cut out of their mothers?
We didn't have boots on the ground. We trained soldiers to do this to their own people.
And we knew what was happening, but our government lied and denied. We did nothing, because what could we do as we armed and supplied these monsters.
And nobody have a shit.

So color me skeptical that anything we do will make a goddamned difference.

[nikto]

90. Great answer, a la iz

America's morality is very selective.

[a la izquierda]

91. It certainly is.

[sabrina 1]

73. So are we going to bomb Saudi Arabia also? There is even more evidence that they provided the

extremists in Syria, terrorists iow, with Chemical Weapons? Hasn't that been the greatest fear of all? That terrorists would get their hands on Chemical and/or Nukes? Yet no one seems concerned about those reports about which there appears to be little doubt?

[darkangel218]

74. Sure.

Theyre beaheding people.

[Erose999]

110. Tell me how US bombs and drones are gonna "save the kids"? I hate to sound callous, but

whether its by chemical weapons, conventional bombs from Syria, or conventional bombs from the US, those kids are doomed any way you look at it.

What the US needs to do is to work with the international community to come to a diplomatic resolution to end the violence. If intervention is required it should be the UN and the countries neighboring Syria. The US has a horrible track record as the world's mall cop.

[merrily]

122. "to further use" splits and infinitive and also assumes facts not in evidence.

I could care less about the former. However, you don't have any evidence that Assad was responsible and almost everyone I have heard talk about it qualifies their words in some way.

As in "that Assad was responsible is indisuputable.....in my mind anyway."

[Logical]

19. Rec to counter you! :-)

[darkangel218]

23. *pokes you with toothpick*

[totodeinhere]

25. Twenty recs to your one unrec. That's about the same ratio

as opposition to Obama's attack on Syria as opposed to support for it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/08/26/new-poll-syria-intervention-even-less-popular-than-congress/

[darkangel218]

27. My rec has super powers.

There!

[Liberal Veteran]

31. One "Oh shit" is worth 100 "attaboys". -nt

[darkangel218]

32. lmao!!!

[RC]

56. Recd to counter your unRecd

The man in office now, is not the man we voted for.

[panzerfaust]

57. Why unrec? Why not just have NSA remove the post ...

... along with disappearing the poster?



This is, after all, the Brave New America of Bu$h and Obama.

[darkangel218]

61. Psst! NSA only records stuff!

If they want to remove something, would be more than a post, doncha think?



On edit, I missed the second part of your post.

Agreed. Lol

[rhett o rick]

99. You should be voted off the Democratic Island. No place here for neocons. nm

[kpete]

76. ouch....

is that Captain Mike?

peace to you panzerfaust,
& the Captain
kp

[rhett o rick]

98. Ah yes. You present your argument so well. Since you said little, I get to guess what

your elusive point is.

1. Pres Obama is our savior and we must have faith.

2. We can save lives by spending hundreds of millions on missile strikes.

3. Maybe there is a clue in your name, "darkangel". You think we need to kill someone, anyone to avenge something. Doesnt really matter because we really like to kill.

4. The Military Industrial Complex is the matrix, and we must go along.

Help us out here. What is your argument to send missiles into Syria.

[merrily]

123. I often forget to rec. Thanks for the reminder!

[darkangel218]

130. You got it!

Lol

[leftstreet]

4. How embarrassing

DURec

[G_j]

6. K&R

[liberal_at_heart]

8. K&R

[pscot]

9. The Nobel committee got it wrong.

As did many of us. Projection: gets you in trouble every time.

[mimi85]

78. So you think that

we should have voted for McCain/Palin? Or Romney/Ryan? (BTW, what has that little weasel Ryan been up to lately, he seems to be MIA).

Or not vote at all? Or write in Perry, Bachmann, Paul or one of the rest of the clown bunch? Seriously, I would like to know.

[pscot]

87. You're right

Romney would have been worse. We were trapped in 2012. But I didn't vote for endless war in Eastasia, or mercenary service to the Saudi royals. Four the last 4 years, I've complained, but ultimately I've given Obama the benefit of the doubt. No more. This really feels like a betrayal. The proposed intervention is futile and destabilizing. And it's wrong. There are no good guys in this fight. We won't stop it by adding to the carnage.

[Skittles]

94. things are pretty bad

when the way to defend someone is to say they are better than McCain/Palin/Romney/Ryan/Perry/Bachmann/Paul.......roaches are better than them

[HumansAndResources]

102. No, Romney Surely Would Have Aided / Funded the Syran Taliban-Terrorists Too, to Start the Civil War

When we realize we are dealing with "Mob-Gang" of Billionaires, it makes it easier imagine what presidents face.

If it was 1st Term, we could ask if President Obama was considering the response to Jimmy Carter's CIA "cleanup" vis-a-vis the Iran-Contra / October Surprise retribution; this to spite Carter's going along with aiding the Afghan-Taliban (effectively destroying a nation) and letting Pakistan & North Korea get nukes to do it (Brzezenski - admitted). When we see the pictures of bodies and destruction in Syria, don't forget what "we" did to Afghanistan at Billionaire-Investor-Baron request - this is what "The West" did and does from the Middle East, Africa, Latin America, ...:



.... when we elect who the Billionaires tell us, on Tee Vee, "is electable." There Are More Pics Here

[brooklynite]

11. Will the Syrians enjoy the peace as well?

Or will the Syrian Government keep shelling and bombing them?

[awoke_in_2003]

68. What about the civil war in Sudan?...

Should we get in that one too?

[Lady Freedom Returns]

96. They will keep it up.

The Syrian people are going to keep going through this this something is done.

[JackRiddler]

106. Did you care about the Syrians a year ago?

What about the Sudanese, as has been pointed out? Or the Congolese?

How come this question of "What are you going to do about the people dying in Country X?" is only ever relevant when the U.S. government is revving up to bomb Country X?

The U.S.G. didn't ask me whether they should give support to Saddam, back when they assisted him in gassing his people (and the Iranians) in 1987-88. But soon as they wanted to invade Iraq, then suddenly I was expected to present an alternative plan or stop protesting.

Hm? No one asked me what I wanted to do about Syria two years ago. Only now, just when I'm opposing the latest U.S. bombing plan, is it suddenly demanded of me that I have a plan for Syria.

Because, obviously, "bomb the fuck out of the place to justify the MIC continuing to eat 50% of your U.S. federal budget" is a great fucking plan. Right?

[Egalitarian Thug]

12. K&R You were supposed to have failed to notice or forgotten. n/t

[Douglas Carpenter]

14. I agree with your point. But I guess I am just not that shocked

Fox News and the right-wing nut brigade have succeeded in making anyone not absolutely batshit right-wing crazy look liberal and progressive in comparison. I knew from the very beginning of the campaign in 2008 that all the leading contenders fro President from both parties were going to fall into a certain consensus regarding the major issues including an embrace of our imperial order. If the Nobel Committee didn't realize that - then they must have been pretty naive.

[ZombieHorde]

15. We should nominate Charles Manson for a Nobel Peace Prize. nt

[jimlup]

16. Some of us knew exactly what we were voting for ...

The problem was and remains that the alternative was far far (nightmarishly far far) worse.

[kpete]

18. i know, i know

peace jimlup,
kp

[Logical]

22. I agree, and I voted for him in 2012 also. But only because he was better than Romeny. But...

the first time he conned me. I fell for it. n-t

[Generic Other]

17. Have they ever rescinded an award?

Because he deserves to lose it over his current drone policy alone.

[dipsydoodle]

21. Be more chance with Bob Hope.

.

[MissDeeds]

33. I was very conflicted

in the last two elections. I had huge concerns about Obama, but voted for him hoping he would use intellect and diplomacy to keep us out of wars and end the one(s) in which we were currently engaged. I regret that my concerns about him have been proven correct. He could have been a great president. Now he's just another politician who lost his values and principles on the road to power.

K&R

[bvar22]

34. We said "PEACE",

not "PEAS"!

[kpete]

35. you made me do it

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-xssyP_QcjxQ/ToHxCr9dyjI/AAAAAAAAAJ8/uTAVoGh92Uo/s320/peas+for+peace.jpg

[School Teacher]

36. I Voted Because I Wanted the Poor to Suffer Less

I was conflicted. We still had Iraq War, Afghan War and GTMO. But I decided to vote for Obama because I thought that the poor in this country would suffer less under Obama. It was for them. Did I make the right decision? We still need jobs. We might have Larry Summers running the economy. I won't make this mistake again. When the bombs drop on Syria I am registering with the Green Party and opening my wallet, my energy and a give them all I can. I am done.

[lumpy]

67. Some people must have thought they were voting for some sort of a god if they thought one

man could solve all our problems in less than 8 years, certainly with the bulk of leadership trying to bring him down.

[mick063]

82. There is only a select few that believe our President is a diety.

They are not hard to spot.

[Blanks]

129. That's right. The constitution created the balance of power.

Unlike other governments - where one man has enough power to make significant changes in a short period of time. Our government intentionally moves slow and if one party has enough members, and their constituents wish it so - they can obstruct progress for a long time.

I haven't given up on the president. I don't understand what he's doing on Syria, but he seems extremely gung ho to do something that goes against who he claimed to be.

I haven't ruled out the possibility that he is setting up the republicans to do something that they don't want to do just so they can oppose him.

If he bombs Syria anyway, I'm going to be disappointed.

[Raksha]

89. Good for you! I was done in 2012 - I voted for Jill Stein.

I'm still a registered Democrat, though.

[liberal_at_heart]

103. I seriously thought about voting for her. I wish I had now.

Her platform was phenominal.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

37. Kick & Rec

[LittleBlue]

38. Terrible president

If he had campaigned on his eventual policies, he wouldn't have made it out of the primaries.

[panzerfaust]

55. Now Be fair: Yes, a terrible *Democratic* president, But a fine *Republican* one.

Yes, I do have voter's remorse.

[LittleBlue]

58. ...

[sarcasmo]

39. Kick!

[markiv]

43. when you give out a Nobel Peace Prize for FUTURE acts.....

you're just asking for it

you dont test Murphy's Law, much safer to assume it still works

[Rex]

44. I don't think he will.

And I think after Congress votes majority 'no...he will decide not to go to war.

[cantbeserious]

45. Hope And Change - Does Anyone Still Believe That Nonsense

eom

[Bosonic]

48. A fairly 'ouchy' placard spotted at a demonstration

outside the US embassy in Lebanon.



On the 'we thought we voted for' theme...

[panzerfaust]

51. Obama was awarded the Peace Prize for, as Bu$h himself pointed out, NOT being Bu$h

Had Obama simply continued not being Bu$h, then he likely would be remembered in our history as one of our greatest presidents.

However, he chose to continue Bu$h's worst abuses, and has added many of his own. Between the two of them, these soulless clowns will be recalled as those who, finally, brought totalitarian government to the United States.

President Washington did warn posterity of this risk, but we chose not to listen - preferring the illusion of security to any meaningful right of individual conscience.



As president George Washington warned in his Farewell Address:

The spirit of encroachment tends to consolidate the powers of all the departments in one, and thus to create whatever the form of government, a real despotism. A just estimate of that love of power, and proneness to abuse it, which predominates in the human heart is sufficient to satisfy us of the truth of this position.

[George II]

84. Didn't George Washington lead the fledgling republic into war?

[Paper Roses]

50. K&R n/t

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

53. No, you think you voted for a bike courier from the occupy rally who goes by Spliff

I guess he had a bit of a tan and you're confused.

[Skittles]

70. SCHEDULING SEN. WALTER SOBCHAK FOR ASS KICKING

*EGREGIOUS*

[great white snark]

59. When you say "we" who are you speaking for?

Certainly not me but do continue your prolific tirade.

[Bobbie Jo]

72. Nor me.

The mob mentality here has taken on a life of its own.

As if we weren't already infested with trolls without the neon welcome mat.

[CakeGrrl]

75. +1000

[Cha]

83. Let them wallow in their ignorant soundbite

black and white mentality, snark. Anyone with a brain knows there's more to it than President Obama getting the Nobel Peace Prize and his wanting to end the chemical bombing and wholesale slaughter in Syria.

But, carry on now.. rah rah red meat rah rah.

[chervilant]

125. When I read posts like yours:

Let them wallow in their ignorant soundbite black and white mentality, snark.

I have to wonder: do you converse like this face to face, using condescension and sarcasm? Do you honestly think verbal bullying promotes your position? Do you think you're getting respect from other DUers, other than your fellow BOG members? Do you not see how you're doing the very thing about which you are ranting?

I've developed a strategy for eliminating such vitriol from my experience of this forum. (I'll trust that you understand this strategy, and will not waste time posting a response that I choose not to see...)

[donheld]

105. She is speaking for me.

[liberal_at_heart]

107. me too.

[forestpath]

63. K&R

[blkmusclmachine]

69. Fooled ya!

[blkmusclmachine]

71. TWICE!

Suckers.

[bravenak]

77. I love Obama.....

Bama....

Ama....

Oh this must be the hate Obama echo chamber. Amber. Ber.


( see how I made it echo?)

[Wolf Frankula]

79. But At Times It Seems We got This one

Wolf

[DeSwiss]

80. K&R

[heaven05]

85. we've got Iraqi oil

saudi's sell us their oil. Don't we have enough oil already? We don't need another pipeline for oil. Through syria.

[rosesaylavee]

86. K&R

Not sure why I thought it would do anything... but wrote an email to him thru the whitehouse.gov site...

Very sad.

[Not Sure]

92. That turned out to be a case of premature congratulations

Bet they wish they could have that one back, eh?

[treestar]

93. You would think he was planning an aggressive attack

on another country in order to claim its territory. A country completely at peace.

All of this rhetoric overlooks the chemical attack. As long as you can convince yourself it didn't happen, or that you don't have to care about it, you can rant on like this.

The comments on the peace prize are ridiculous. That prize is not for doves or anti-war no-matter-what people. There are times we are stuck with war, or it would be giving into evil people and rolling over for them. It's how the person deals with it and the influence they have.

[GeorgeGist]

111. If only he used cluster bombs like US,

We could say OK!

[Heywood J]

113. Meanwhile, last week...

http://www.businessinsider.com/us-to-sell-cluster-bombs-to-saudi-arabia-2013-8

The international community is not happy with the United States and Saudi Arabia amid news that they have inked a deal for hundreds of millions of dollars of controversial and potentially unethical cluster bombs.

The $641 million deal would send 1,300 cluster bombs to America's closest ally on the Arabian Peninsula, through U.S. defense contractor Textron, according to a Pentagon release on the contract.

[Kablooie]

95. What ever happened to him?

What is he hearing that made him change his mind about casually dropping missiles on other countries?
I'm sure this is not the kind of response he would jump to when he first became president.

Maybe there's a constant droning of violence and war that washes over him every day and is designed to desensitize a president after a few years.

Whatever it is, this is not the same guy that I voted for.

[MotherPetrie]

97. K&R

[BillyRibs]

101. REC! +1000

This fool needs to hear the message loud and clear!

[Common Sense Party]

104. Joe Biden warned us. He was off on the date, though. "Gird up your loins," he said.

He said it would happen in the first 6 months--he meant first 6 years.

A generated, international crisis to test Obama's mettle.
He's gonna need us.
Need our help.
To stand with him.
Initially, it won't be apparent that we're right.
Obama will clean the Augean stables.
We'll be asking 'why is this thing so tough?
Why are they down in the polls?'
They'll have to make the tough decisions.
"Remember the faith you had at this point because you’re going to have to reinforce us."

Remember?

Prophetic?

Pathetic?

You decide.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2008/10/biden-to-suppor/

[Art_from_Ark]

109. Maybe he admires Ronald Reagan a little too much

[GeorgeGist]

112. One of his role models.

[gtar100]

114. He should have said no thank you to the Peace Prize.

He's turned it into a joke.

[Renew Deal]

115. Do you support Reagans decision on Chemical weapons in Iraq?

[jsr]

117. His steering wheel is broken

The car can only make right turns.

[DontTreadOnMe]

119. If Obama does strike Syria, and it turns out successful - such as Assad steps down...

I think Kpete should be the first to close his account on DU.

[reusrename]

127. Well, according to Obama that outcome would be an abject failure.

The purpose is NOT "regime change" in Syria.

[truebrit71]

120. Turns out that was a little premature, no?

[warrior1]

124. unrec

[VanillaRhapsody]

126. I predict some coming back to the fold suddenly....