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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsVladimir Putin New York Times Op-Ed — Calls Out American Exceptionalism
He also says he believes the gas attack was not done by Assad, but by rebels hoping to provoke an intervention.
The final paragraph of the op-ed is actually the most intense, as it directly responds to Obama's Tuesday night speech, and really one of America's core beliefs:
Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/vladimir-putin-nyt-op-ed-2013-9#ixzz2eddoXDcL
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Typical egomaniac, wants to fluff himself, lol.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)Keeps USA in the Straight and Narrow....
After all...the ONLY BULLY IN TOWN...eventually gets Run Out...on a Rail with Tar and Feathers all over themselves.
Wouldn't want that...
treestar
(82,383 posts)So they veto the UN doing anything. and there he is talking about the UN?
dballance
(5,756 posts)Seems the same phrases can be used to describe you given your posting history.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)46. Your assessment of Putin seems to apply to you.
Last edited Wed Sep 11, 2013, 08:59 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)
Seems the same phrases can be used to describe you given your posting history.
TreasonousBastard
(43,049 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Response to grahamhgreen (Original post)
Awknid This message was self-deleted by its author.
kentuck
(110,950 posts)Did he bang his shoe on the desk?
Although I think he might be putting too much stock into the idea of American "exceptionalism"?
msongs
(67,193 posts)dionysus
(26,467 posts)DevonRex
(22,541 posts)People need to realize he has a long list of people who aren't as equal as others, just in case you're willing to overlook the LGBT law. And you should not overlook it. Nor should you overlook that they are turning a blind eye, even encouraging, Neo-Nazis to lure LGBTs out of their homes to beat them up and call the state police to jail them. And now, the legislature wants to take the kids of LGBTs away.
dionysus
(26,467 posts)pom pom wavers, ect.
DevonRex
(22,541 posts)UtahLib
(3,179 posts)But he certainly seems to have the proper code words down when it comes to winning the approval of people who should know better. Yeah, let's trust this benevolent monster.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Or something like that.
Of all the nerve. A very backward society, no longer a superpower, trying to stay relevant and lecture the only remaining superpower! When he's the one whose "client" state used actual chemical weapons. Shameful.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)RT being a blatantly homophobic propaganda outlet for the Russian state view.
Autumn
(44,748 posts)There would be no down side to it, that would be a world changing event.
Hydra
(14,459 posts)He isn't. In any way. Yet with Snowden and Syria, he was able to take the moral high ground because the WH somehow lost it on the way to "Legacy."
Failure of epic proportions...
DevonRex
(22,541 posts)Anybody who buys Putin as the 'good guy' has one brain cell desperately searching for another to rub against - without success.
sheshe2
(83,324 posts)Snowed-in Now we have Putin
Yikes! Give me the BOG any day!
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)from resolving Syria than anyone else occupying the moral high ground? How is they guy who's sponsoring and arming Assad the good guy?
cprise
(8,445 posts)Or it ought to be.
America has virtually taken over the trafficking of arms to 3rd world countries, and Americans still have the gall to indulge an infotainment complex that portrays every Russian as evil unless they're desperately trying to get into "Amyeddikka". I.e. there is no good Russian unless they are a "Balky".
You know, the anti-gay law in Russia would not be out of place in the American South. And the insults Putin's party has visited upon democracy in his country... well, the same. Your outrage and demonizing would probably be better directed at India.
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)helping Russia find it's way to democracy while asking for the Lord's blessing. Let me guess which segment of America he might be targeting. If nothing else, he's a canny bastard.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Jefferson was a genius.
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)and who still travel abroad, we know this... the principles are still admired. The US, not so much.
And no, it is not a travesty. It was not calculated to please you, but calculated as a message to the chattering classes and the WH.
I got a bad case of flashback to the 1930s reading that essay. But I guess it takes knowing history to get it.
It is a remarkable piece of writing for the multiple layers that I am betting will be missed by quite a few.
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)having been born to a father who served 30 years in the Air Force, I have lived in countries other than America. We were stationed in Spain during Franco's reign where I was able to witness the damage that can be inflicted on the people of a country ruled by dictator.
I was being sarcastic in my first post. I have a pretty good grasp of history and am perfectly able to discern Putin's message and to whom it was directed.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)it is the internet. and that is a serious piece of advise.
As to Franco, yup, and what the US is becoming is not nice either.
orenbus
(44 posts)In other words are you saying Putin is playing multi-dimensional chess and he just called check-mate?
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)but you might think that for whatever reasons you might want to think that.
Some of us read history and realize how remarkable this is.
Try to keep up and add information. What else entered the Med today? The Moskva and her battle group. That my friend is ANOTHER hell of a diplomatic signal.
Unlike some here, some of us are interested in international relations, not stupid games you guys like to play.
By the way, if you answer or not, is imaterial, I will proceed to put you on ignore. I will not waste my time with useless banter
Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #62)
Post removed
cprise
(8,445 posts)A small child on "meds" with her plastic-y compliment.
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)I wasn't coming down on you but what might be perceived as condescension does not sit well with most people.
Peace
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Goodbye
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)And they've been losing ground on Democracy.
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)why he should receive accolades from Democracy loving people for gratuitously spouting platitudes referencing ideals that he has no intention of allowing in his own country.
Absolutely. The limits on freedom of speech for just one thing, are appalling.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)For much of the ideological left, U.S. power and influence is the single greatest threat to humanity.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)The vote has been repeatedly questioned there, there have been major discrepancies in the vote, and electronic voting machines are regularly used. Meanwhile many oligarchs have risen to power under Putin (while Putin did crack down on some it was more the ones who didn't fit the Putinist line, as opposed to their being rich).
cprise
(8,445 posts)meet kettle.
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)...he's canny enough to know they'll work, because what he's saying is true. It's no testament to him or his general veracity, per se. He's just got the upper hand here and he's using it. Good on him!
If it takes an old Commie playing world politics to help stop more baby killing, then I'll take it. Meanwhile, America is neither a democracy nor a republic. It's an empire. That's why we have so many military bases all over the world. We have to intimidate others protect our interests.
- We're a modern-day Rome. Ending and all.....
CakeGrrl
(10,611 posts)Who cares what authoritarianism he practices at home on journalists and LGBT?
Isn't his Op-Ed GRRRREEAAAT???
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)CakeGrrl
(10,611 posts)davidpdx
(22,000 posts)While agreeing with you at the same time.
CakeGrrl
(10,611 posts)I'm just SMH at the crazy/angry/weirdness that has overtaken this forum lately.
mimi85
(1,805 posts)Is it something in the water? A virus sent through our monitors? This place has been a bit off the rails lately, I agree.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)I have been pleasantly surprised to see a few people who were nothing but negative have a change of heart. Even the BOG has been getting pummeled lately.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)That's all he probably really wants.
CakeGrrl
(10,611 posts)After all, some bright minds were praising the racist "OathKeepers" for the Snowden love.
Crazy bedfellows.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)The sad thing is, Obama doesn't even believe in this idiotic "exceptionalism" garbage - he just donned that red-white-and-blue robe to make himself look sufficiently patriotic for election purposes.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)albeit not the exceptionalism part, are admired around the world... people like THE THEORY, and Jefferson and the Federalists are read by intellectuals in other countries. He was also KGB, so he learned about the US in deep ways, like spies around the world do. They learn about their targets.
This was a very calculated and well done piece, chockfull of warnings and references to the last pre WW period.
My take, since Einstein warned the world about WW III and WW IV, this was a warning for the US to stop being stupid and stop throwing it's weight around and ignoring international law, the international order we did indeed set up, including the veto at the UNSC.
I am sure people at State, the Pentagon, a few think tanks, and the WH, got it. It was not veiled at all.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)Putin is an asshole for calling for diplomacy only after the threat of force was used by the United States.
He had two weeks to call for a diplomatic solution.
What a sorry piece of shit Putin is.
BlancheSplanchnik
(20,219 posts)It's a good thing he feel trust towards President Obama, and he is correct that American exceptionalism is a problem.
Definitely we're not the only nation or people who think this way, but we do have a problem.
markiv
(1,489 posts)a concept, that american citizens have nothing but blood and treasure lost to show for it
BlueCheese
(2,522 posts)Well, not just American exceptionalism-- rather, that countries that have the power to do good things sometimes have the responsibility to do good things. There are a few such countries today, and U.S. is clearly one of them.
My opposition to involvement in Syria is mostly because I don't see how our intervention will help anything and could quite likely make things worse. But I do think when there are serious crimes against humanity happening, the U.S. and other wealthy or powerful nations have a responsibility to act where others may not.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)anti-American stance.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)Everything. Every-fucking-thing.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)The best way to insult a dictator is to accuse him of bring a flunky of the US.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)Openly homophobic bigot, praised, I swear at times, just to fucking rile me up. I frequent the Latin American forum and some of the most egregious posters would follow me there and chime in about shit.
It sucks because some of these actors are just little known nobodies and no one would understand the context but if you came out and started openly praising Macky Sall or something you'd get a permaban fairly quick because people would care to dig up his position on stuff. But if it's a "left leaning" person (not literally, I think Maduro is a right wing conservative, who uses faux-populism to rally the left), or an "anti-US" person you have free reign.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)who assumed Nicaragua's government would be good on women's issues because they're leftwing.
She will soon be a 'former professional activist.'
babylonsister
(170,962 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)who wins, great spectating.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)Going to be great. And I know a lot of our Putin lovers are going to get perma'd. Can't wait.
(Some of the more messed up ones will lie low though.)
lunasun
(21,646 posts)so very true imo too
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)We claim we believe in Democracy and yet we subvert it when the people chose someone that's not on the payroll.
Pretzel_Warrior
(8,361 posts)Poorly poo is my hero!!!!!
The Putin worship is getting thick here just as my controversial "shirtless Putin" thread referenced.
Dawson Leery
(19,348 posts)joshcryer
(62,265 posts)They had more freedoms five years ago than they do now. Hell, they had more freedoms a year ago than now.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)It is infuriating, honestly, that a major nation has been moving in that direction.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)So Putin has been channeling the right wing neonazi ultra nationalist element of Russia United to push back against the activists who have been protesting in Russia for years. No way to know for sure Putin's personal feelings. At one point he basically was neutral on it, live and let live, but after the law was passed he just denied that it was regressive at all.
The main argument used by the anti-gay law people is that it came with a very strong libel law so no one can falsely accuse anyone of being gay, but that doesn't prevent them from truthfully accusing people of being gay! Which is what the abuses have been about lately!
It's not really too surprising as we saw with the post Regan era policies of tearing down everything that we'd begun building under Carter.
MattSh
(3,714 posts)And not a peep out of the DU.
Whoa! Look! Shiny thing over there!
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)Am I missing something?
MattSh
(3,714 posts)Voter suppression laws are anti-minority, Josh.
Anti-choice laws are anti-woman.
And that covers anybody who is not white.
You don't have to pass "pro-white" laws to be pro-white.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)Yes, that's atrocious, but you know it's state level, what Putin signed was federal, after a few of Russia's states had signed off on similar laws. It would be akin to the US signing voter suppression laws in at a federal level because a few states here voted for them. It's insane.
In the US there will always be states that have freer voting rights, in Russia there will never (until the law is overturned) be a place where an LGBT Russian can openly express themselves without risking "distributing gay propaganda."
ZRT2209
(1,357 posts)Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)But I already knew that from some comments he made to other world leaders at the G20 last week. Not news, no biggie.
I'm surprised at how good his writing is, if he did it himself. It's interesting that a president of Russia would make the move of writing an Op Ed directly to the American people, you don't see that every day. I'll give him a few points for thinking outside the box and executing it well.
Other than that, it's hot air. Spin. An attempt to manipulate public opinion a bit, for some extra wiggle room. None of that matters at all.
Underlying the whole thing on a subliminal level, I get the feeling that Putin thinks this democratic thing is kind of fun, and sort of enjoys playing with it (as long as it benefits him). After all, what is writing an Op Ed? It's something we do all the time. Deep down, I think he admires it, in spite of himself. He'd screw us in a heartbeat but nevertheless, he'd equally like to be part of "the club" of leaders of nations that are old democracies.
Monk06
(7,675 posts)despicable and hateful in the eyes of the world.
The very idea of a people thinking their country is the greatest, wealthiest most powerful country in the world, by dint of some God given gift, is absurd.
I thought that idea died with the Romans and the Germans. American Exceptionalism is just Manifest Destiny by another name. It is an arrogant, foolish doctrine and viciously destructive.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)All their "help" is accomplishing is making a horrible situation worse.
The whole crew are nothing but a pack of self-serving egomaniacs looking for statues of themselves.