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Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:15 PM

The Moment that Frank Zappa warned us about?

[font size=3]“The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it's profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater.” [/font]---Prophet & Philosopher Frank Zappa



The curtain is pulled back, and....

[font size=3]John Kerry is meeting with Kissinger today for advice on Syria[/font]




"It can't happen heeeeere,
cause I've been checking it out"

59 replies, 8439 views

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Arrow 59 replies Author Time Post
Reply The Moment that Frank Zappa warned us about? (Original post)
bvar22 Sep 2013 OP
Bragi Sep 2013 #1
MichaelSoE Sep 2013 #45
dgibby Sep 2013 #2
99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #22
kentuck Sep 2013 #3
PoliticAverse Sep 2013 #5
bahrbearian Sep 2013 #6
PoliticAverse Sep 2013 #7
MelungeonWoman Sep 2013 #16
Jackpine Radical Sep 2013 #21
alsame Sep 2013 #8
dballance Sep 2013 #48
pscot Sep 2013 #38
rtassi Sep 2013 #41
wandy Sep 2013 #4
disidoro01 Sep 2013 #9
BelgianMadCow Sep 2013 #10
snagglepuss Sep 2013 #13
99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #25
BelgianMadCow Sep 2013 #28
Amonester Sep 2013 #49
BelgianMadCow Sep 2013 #58
postulater Sep 2013 #11
alsame Sep 2013 #12
Oilwellian Sep 2013 #14
randr Sep 2013 #15
Oilwellian Sep 2013 #24
Theyletmeeatcake2 Sep 2013 #40
DeSwiss Sep 2013 #17
BlueJac Sep 2013 #18
TroglodyteScholar Sep 2013 #19
Initech Sep 2013 #50
ET Awful Sep 2013 #20
arikara Sep 2013 #56
sorefeet Sep 2013 #23
Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #26
truedelphi Sep 2013 #30
Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #37
grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #27
truedelphi Sep 2013 #29
Junkdrawer Sep 2013 #31
NightWatcher Sep 2013 #32
scarletwoman Sep 2013 #33
rhett o rick Sep 2013 #34
ProSense Sep 2013 #35
L0oniX Sep 2013 #36
99Forever Sep 2013 #39
dreamnightwind Sep 2013 #42
Deny and Shred Sep 2013 #43
stlsaxman Sep 2013 #44
MuseRider Sep 2013 #57
NealK Sep 2013 #46
NealK Sep 2013 #47
MotherPetrie Sep 2013 #51
Octafish Sep 2013 #52
shotten99 Sep 2013 #53
LuvNewcastle Sep 2013 #54
Catherina Sep 2013 #55
woo me with science Sep 2013 #59

Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:21 PM

1. I'm disappointed

I was hoping I'd go home today and, finally, at long last, the plastics all melted, and so is the chrome.

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Response to Bragi (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 09:43 AM

45. luckily the brain police can only broadcast and not receive at the moment.

my secret thoughts are still mine and i only have to attempt to filter out what they want me to believe.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:24 PM

2. Nothing says "looking forward"

like collaborating with Kissinger.

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Response to dgibby (Reply #2)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:03 PM

22. +10 good one. ~nt~

 

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:28 PM

3. Why would Kerry do this??

Is he that stupid or is this a move for bipartisan support?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #3)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:46 PM

5. The expressed reason is that Kerry wants to learn from Kissinger's experience dealing with Russia.

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #5)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:49 PM

6. Or he is asking how he can avoid International Court if he decides on a coup somewhere.

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Response to bahrbearian (Reply #6)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:51 PM

7. A cynic might say that's why he met with Kissinger on the anniversary day of Chile's coup. n/t

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #7)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:05 PM

16. Thanks for that bit of info.

Their type loves anniversaries so.

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #7)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:48 PM

21. Not just the anniversary, but the 40th anniversary.

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Response to bahrbearian (Reply #6)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:55 PM

8. +1

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #5)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 10:23 AM

48. Well that makes total sense - NOT.

 

Considering Nixon and Kissinger were in office when there was still a USSR and both sides had one finger firmly planted on the buttons of MAD and now we're in a completely different environment politically and economically I can totally see why his counsel is requested.

Putin is waving his penis just like US leaders do to try to remain relevant. In this case, if it keeps us from entering into a civil war which has no direct threat to the US and it prevents us from bombing more people in an act that will only inflame the rhetoric that the US is pursuing a war on Muslims then I'm okay to let Putin win this round.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #3)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 10:19 PM

38. To reassure Dr.K.'s clients

and partners. A meeting with Kerry is worth millions in consulting fees.

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Response to pscot (Reply #38)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 08:25 AM

41. +1

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:31 PM

4. Discusting.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:56 PM

9. Why is this surprising?

Has anyone been listening to Kerry in the last two weeks. He has been off the chain crazy. We can talk strategy all day long but Kerry wanted to bomb the shit out of Assad. I'm guessing it's because Kerry had to pick the check up when they dined together in 2009.
Being slighted like that sticks with a person

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:59 PM

10. I happened to be reading the comments at the Guardian

on the article about Zuckerberg saying the govt "blew it" on the NSA. (A lame attempt to prevent further damage from having been an obedient traitor to his customers, imho).

The most recommended (600+) comment goes as follows:

"Secret courts, secret laws, and secret interpretations of laws have absolutely no place in a democracy. Moreover, their existence surely precludes a society having any right to call itself a democracy.

America has clearly become a fascist, authoritarian state: non-transparent, dictating to its citizens laws that have been created in secret."

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Response to BelgianMadCow (Reply #10)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 03:33 PM

13. /\This.

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Response to BelgianMadCow (Reply #10)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:08 PM

25. +100 yep. BREAKING NEWS: the cold war is over

 

and USA's "Intelligence" agencies are among the worst "terrorists"
on the freaking planet.

The US needs to get over itself being the "cop of the world",
but not just the cop, also the judge, jury and executioner of
the world.

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Response to 99th_Monkey (Reply #25)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:34 PM

28. funny thing is, it would seem that the US public indeed thinks

behaving like judge, jury and executioner doesn't make sense, given the response to possible war on Syria.

Be it in discussions about the US, Russia, or Germany in the eurozone crisis, I keep reminding myself to differentiate between the governments of a country and its people. I don't know when the disconnnect between those two has ever been so great. It's very worthwile to check out the comments on the (conservative quality newspaper) Frankfurter Allgemeine.

I have strong doubts we live in democracies. But I don't doubt that people are waking up.

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Response to BelgianMadCow (Reply #28)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 12:01 PM

49. We live in a worldwide plutocracy.

US, EU, RUSSIA, CHINA.

The Plutocrats OWN Them All.

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Response to Amonester (Reply #49)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 03:40 PM

58. I take it you are familiar with the plutonomy report from Citigroup?

"We project that the plutonomies (the U.S., UK, and Canada) will likely see even more income inequality, disproportionately feeding off a further rise in the profit share in their economies, capitalist-friendly governments, more technology-driven productivity, and globalization."

full memo linked here:
http://rwer.wordpress.com/2010/11/11/citigroup-attempts-to-disappear-its-plutonomy-report-2/

So here, Citigroup doesn't throw the EU, Russia and China "on the pile". From my point of view, only the EU wasn't a plutocracy. Then came the EUrozone crisis and now it's full steam ahead...

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:59 PM

11. "Every day is just another rotten mess.

And when it's gonna change, my friend, is anybody's guess."

I memorized entire albums of his in the late 60s lying on my parent's living room floor with my head between the speakers.

It was a message I heard nowhere else.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:59 PM

12. "Rather than meeting with Kissinger for advice,

John Kerry would better serve the cause of peace by consulting with those like Garces who have spent their lives pursuing peace. The only reason Henry Kissinger should be pursued is to be held accountable, like Pinochet, in a court of law."

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/kerry_kissinger_and_the_other_sept_11_20130911/?ln

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 03:54 PM

14. That is a perfect example

The curtain is now being pulled back and I sure don't like what I see.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 03:55 PM

15. The fact that he chose Killinger

over Madeleine Albright speaks volumes.

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Response to randr (Reply #15)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:05 PM

24. Really?

That curtain was pulled back years ago:

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Response to Oilwellian (Reply #24)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 08:12 AM

40. We think the price is worth it?Yeah because

Some other poor fuck has to pay !!! I hope there is a hell for these pieces of shit!!

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:28 PM

17. K&R

 

“He who controls the past controls the future. He who controls the present controls the past.” ~George Orwell, 1984

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:30 PM

18. WTF

Quit then Kerry if you don't have any good ideas. You are spineless now for some season, oh shit I should of guessed, BIG OIL and PNAC! One hell of a good reason to sell out. Coward!

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:41 PM

19. I long to hear what Zappa's take on today's world would be...

But so much of what he said over the years still holds true....

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Response to TroglodyteScholar (Reply #19)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 12:32 PM

50. Oh I know, FZ was truly a man ahead of his time!

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:42 PM

20. The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig . . . .

and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which. - Animal Farm, George Orwell

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Response to ET Awful (Reply #20)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 02:00 PM

56. Indeed.

n/t

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:05 PM

23. Kerry is even acting weird since

he got this job. He is like the buddy you worked with for years and he gets a promotion to foreman and turns into a kiss ass company man, and tries to work your ass off. Bully.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:12 PM

26. 2009 - 2010.

 

The only people left not staring at the brick wall are those that have their eyes squeezed shut.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #26)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:42 PM

30. And that is,

"Because Obama."

(He's friends with Jay Z!"

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Response to truedelphi (Reply #30)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 09:50 PM

37. It wasn't because the President was elected, more the President's election was

 

made irrelevant as the decision had already been made long ago. Our remaining choices going forward come down to which group of huge, parasitic corporations you prefer to grow at the expense of American workers, the brick wall.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:26 PM

27. Yes, it is.

 

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:41 PM

29. Whenever K's name is mentioned,

"Weasels Rip My Flesh."

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:47 PM

31. And THAT'S when it gets real....

If you think Assad was brutal when his gloves came off....

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:11 PM

32. Wasn't it also Zappa that said...

I can take an hour on the Tower of Power as long as I gets me a golden shower.

Oh man oh man, I'm so fantastic...

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 07:23 PM

33. Kissinger, the undead. So thoroughly evil even Hell won't have him.

Feasts on the blood of infants, bathes in the blood of fresh-killed virgins, powders his hair with the ground bones of his victims. Oh, yes, the zombie vampire statesman himself. The walking Curse of the World. Foul creature of the charnel ground.

Like Kerry, I would meet with him - unlike Kerry, I would come armed with a sharpened wooden stake and a heavy mallet.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 07:26 PM

34. I am wondering why they would consult Henry. Any ideas? nm

 

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #34)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 07:32 PM

35. Kissinger has close ties to Putin and Russia

Kerry Consults Kissinger on Getting to Yes With Russians

By Indira A.R. Lakshmanan

Secretary of State John Kerry is consulting Henry Kissinger, the 90-year-old embodiment of Cold War foreign policy, before heading off to negotiate with his Russian counterpart over Syria’s chemical weapons.

After meeting today with former Secretary Kissinger at the State Department, Kerry will bring other U.S.-Russia specialists on his plane when he flies to Geneva for two days of meetings starting tomorrow with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, according to a U.S. official who asked not to be identified because he wasn’t authorized to comment.

<...>

Though the meeting with Kissinger was planned before the latest developments in Syria, Kerry was eager to draw on the older man’s experience in communicating effectively with Russian diplomats, the U.S. official said. Kissinger pioneered the policy of détente with the Soviet Union and served as secretary of State and national security adviser to Republican President Richard Nixon. The U.S. official described Kerry as a fan of Kissinger’s 1994 book, “Diplomacy.”

<...>

Early last year, Kissinger met in Moscow to discuss world affairs with Russian leader Vladimir Putin, whose press secretary described the men as “old friends” and said that they had previously met eight to 10 times, including over dinner at Kissinger’s home in New York...In Putin’s book “First Person,” he recounted a conversation with Kissinger in the early 1990s when Putin, then an aide to the mayor of St. Petersburg, picked up the German-born American diplomat at the airport.

Kissinger impressed Putin by saying that he too got his start as an intelligence specialist, and that former Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev withdrew his nation’s forces from Eastern Europe too quickly.

“I told him what I thought and I will repeat it now: Kissinger was right,” Putin wrote.

- more -

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2013-09-11/kerry-consults-kissinger-on-getting-to-yes-with-old-foe-russians

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023649540

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 07:54 PM

36. This is what can happen when you don't prosecute war criminals. n/t

 

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #36)

Thu Sep 12, 2013, 10:32 PM

39. ^^This^^

Surprise is for chumps.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 08:26 AM

42. Dr. Strangelove himself

Hello Henry, it's like you never left.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 08:29 AM

43. Frank was right about a lot.

Like TV for instance - I'm The Slime from 1973

I am gross and perverted Im obsessed and deranged
I have existed for years But very little had changed
I am the tool of the government And industry too
For I am destined to rule And regulate you

I may be vile and pernicious But you can't look away
I make you think I'm delicious With the stuff that I say
I am the best you can get Have you guessed me yet?
I am the slime oozin out From your tv set

You will obey me while I lead you And eat the garbage that I feed you
Until the day that we don't need you Don't got for help...no one will heed you
Your mind is totally controlled It has been stuffed into my mold
And you will do as you are told Until the rights to you are sold

That's right, folks ... Don't touch that dial

Well, I am the slime from your video Oozin along on your livingroom floor

I am the slime from your video Cant stop the slime, people, lookit me go


Another thing was his take on narrowing retro movements from his autobiography. He observed that American culture was embrtacing retro things that were increasingly recent. Eventually, we would go retro to now, and cultural growth would stagnate.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 08:41 AM

44. Well, well, well... looks like they found "Dr. Henry Creosote"

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Response to stlsaxman (Reply #44)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 02:22 PM

57. Of the many things I thought when I saw that picture

I did not think of that. Good observation. All we need do is slip him one thin mint (I think that was the line).

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 09:51 AM

46. K&R

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)


Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 12:40 PM

51. No depth to which they won't sink

 

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 12:46 PM

52. What Zappa said. What Zappa said.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 01:20 PM

53. C'mon people.

Even though Kissinger has been wrong about almost everything, doesn't mean he shouldn't be heard. I mean this half-jokingly, I should add.

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 01:38 PM

54. Why is Kissinger still alive when we have all these drones lying around?

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 01:45 PM

55. Ah... that fresh smell of hope and change m/t

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Response to bvar22 (Original post)

Fri Sep 13, 2013, 04:26 PM

59. kick

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