Can we please dispel this myth that military people are at full battle rattle 24/7?

[MindPilot]

There are at least three posts I've seen today asking "how could a shooting rampage happen at a military facility what with every body carrying around bazookas and machine guns?"

Most military people get through their entire tour of duty without ever touching a firearm after boot camp.

Personal possession of a firearm is prohibited on-base, they must be stored in the armory, and have to be checked out if you want to go hunting or to the range.

On base the only people who have guns are MPs and those actively engaged in training. The guns you do see, like the ones used in parades and formations, are mock-ups.

So to repeat, for the most part military installations and facilities are gun-free zones, with some of the tightest rules and harshest penalties there are.

[VanillaRhapsody]

1. Funny how the military thinks that the servicemen do not need to walk around base with weapons and

keeps them locked up. But the RKBA will never acknowledge that even the military disagrees with their position.

[MindPilot]

4. True, and that applies to everyone.

Even the well-disciplined highly-skilled Marine sniper who can put a round between the eyes from a mile away, doesn't get to take his weapon into the NCO Club.

[wercal]

6. Ever been in the military?

I have.

The weapons stay locked up in the arms room, not for safety reasons, but because it would be an accountability nightmare.

In order to make sure that nothing has been lost or misplaced, or damaged, while training in the field with weapons we would do a 'sensitive items' report twice a day. All leaders had to physically make sure their subordinates still had weapons, codebooks, night vision, etc. It was a pain in the ass...and guess what, all three of those items were locked up in the arms room 90% of the time. Not because the night vision goggles could hurt somebody...but because its a pain in the ass keeping track of them when you aren't using them.

[VanillaRhapsody]

11. My father was career military...

I have lived on a base or two...I think it is two-fold actually....I don't think the military wants to project that image while working state-side...do you?

[wercal]

18. Half and half I guess

To some extent it depends on the branch and the base. Some bases, like this Naval Yard, are in dense populated areas, and have an 'image' to protect. The Army bases I was at were more remote, and image wasn't really a problem.

Heck, even when I was in Korea, we didn't walk around with weapons all day long. It was the same as CONUS, for the most part, with a few exceptions - and nobody really cared about image there.

[NickB79]

12. Plus, soldiers often need extra cash

It's not like we pay them very highly for the work they do, and they usually have families to support.

Can you imagine the temptation to sell a few pieces of high-value equipment that could be easily smuggled off-base?

[wercal]

17. I spent 5 straight days wandering the training area, looking for night vision goggles

Turns out a guy who was on his way out of the Army smuggled them out of the arms room, during the confusion of issuing out equipment for a training exercise.

I was an 'Arms Room Officer'...and I told the E-4 Armorer not to let ANYBODY in the arms room...no Platoon Sergeants...no officers...nobody.

[NickB79]

35. A few years ago a coworker asked me if I wanted a new scope

He claimed he had a friend in Iraq that was rotating back to the states, and this friend was going to bring back some mil-spec equipment that he claimed the military was just going to destroy anyway. Sights, scopes, a few other pieces of small hardware.

I politely declined; the last thing I need is to go to jail for buying stolen military gear.

[wercal]

38. Good decision

A guy working at Burger King once tried to sell me an AK47 out of the blue.....ah, no thanks.

[tazkcmo]

30. I was an armorer in the Army.

I had many, many, many security inspections, accounting audits, etc. The Army was very serious about their weapons being secured when not in use. You can't even take a picture of the exterior of an arms room much less the interior. As for when they were issued to our soldiers the accountability continued as you said. Not a bunch of John Wayne crap going on that's for sure.

[MineralMan]

2. Mostly, the people who ask those questions have no military experience.

You are correct. Weapons are issued to combat troops in battle zones and military police elsewhere. Everyone else is unarmed. The military is very big on that. Unless you're training or in a combat zone, you aren't going to be carrying firearms.

The military is very smart about firearms.

The ribbon is the USAF Expert Marksmanship Ribbon. Earned with a perfect score with the M-16 at the range. That was the last time I had any firearm in my hands while serving in the USAF. I can't remember any time when I could have accessed one, either.

[wercal]

7. Alot of people are also under the mistaken impression that everybody lives on base,

like in basic training. They have some vision of guys in bunks, in a large open building - with no concept that many (sometimes most) get in a civilian car and drive home at night...I don't know what they think everybody would do with their weapons when they went home at night.

[MineralMan]

9. Quite true. People have funny ideas about the military.

[wercal]

21. People get their impression of the military from the movies

Most movies are either about basic training or combat.

It wouldn't make an exciting movie to chronicle daily life on base.

[MindPilot]

13. I know. Sad to hear these young guys with a familiy

talking about how they are going to join up and live on base.

You don't get to live on-base in family housing unless you are like E4 or above. And there is usually a looooong waiting list. My dad was in the USAF for 25 years. In all his different assignments, we lived on base exactly twice. The rest of the time--on a wait list, and renting off-base.

[wercal]

19. When I first got to Fort Riley, I went to the housing office

I asked if there was any available O-1 housing.

Answer: No.

I asked if there was a waiting list to sign up for.

Answer: Howling laughter....and "you go ahead and sign up, you'll be PCS'd out of Fort Riley before your name comes up."

[sammytko]

31. Times have changed. I was single and allowed to live in base housing

There was a surplus of houses and they have to meet a certain occupancy rate, so they let single E-5 and above live on base.

This was at a small base in Oklahoma.

BAQ was so low there, it was better to live on base. I was paying out of pocket to live off. But in the San Antonio area, BAQ was double my house payment!

[MindPilot]

8. I was in the Navy during Vietnam

And my dad was 25 years in the USAF.

I qualified in boot camp, and that was the only time I fired a weapon.

[MineralMan]

10. Yup. If your job wasn't shooting, you didn't have a weapon.

What would you do with it, after all? I was a Russian linguist. Who would I have shot at?

[MindPilot]

14. I was an electrician.

So, I might have been tempted to use it as a last resort for dealing with uncooperative equipment.

[MineralMan]

34. Well, there is that...

[Jackpine Radical]

26. Even in combat zones, when you're in base camp,

your weapons are locked away unless you're on guard duty. At least that's the way it was in Vietnam.

[kestrel91316]

28. IIRC that ribbon is one of the many my dad had. Of course the nicest one was his DFC.

And yeah, the only weapon he handled professionally after that was the one he had on him when flying in Nam for self defense in case he got shot down.

[Rex]

3. They have armories to store weapons.

Unless it is a battalion of MPs, most military people are not armed with anything but their wits. Not until they go to the armory and draw weapons.

[FarCenter]

5. Relatively few casualties result from small arms fire

Artillery, bombs, rockets, machine guns, mines, torpedoes, grenades, etc. do most of the actual killing in battle.

[Tx4obama]

15. It was an office building with one way in. So, how on earth ...

... did he carry an AK47 through the front door without anyone noticing?

[onenote]

22. Maybe he didn't

A more logical explanation may be that he got the assault rifle from the DC cop he shot early in the incident.

[Tx4obama]

23. That could be. But it wouldn't explain the double barrel shot gun. n/t

[onenote]

25. three years ago, a nutjob with a rifle shot the guard at entrance to Holocaust museum

He didn't use the gun after he got through security, he used it in order to get through security.

on edit: Apparently there are recordings from security cameras at the entrance that should shed some light on what transpired.

[Lasher]

16. According to my experience you are correct, but don't bet your life they are unarmed.

I have stood guard duty in the Army in Fort Gordon, GA; Fort Jackson, SC; and at Camp Nabors, in Seoul, Korea. In every case I was issued a rifle but never any live ammo.

But one time I was responsible for guarding about 20 Model 1911 .45 caliber pistols with belts, holsters, clips, and a shitload of ammo. This was because the soldiers using them had returned from the range after the armory had closed, so the weapons couldn't be secured as usual. I was left overnight with orders from the Officer of the Day to keep one of those sidearms loaded and ready on my person at all times and the rest of them under my direct control. I was under a direct order by him to relinquish those weapons only to him personally when he returned in the morning, and to kill anyone else who tried to take them from me.

Like I said, don't bet your life on it.

[Jackpine Radical]

27. And on payday the money was handed out by an officer

backed by an armed NCO.

[Motown_Johnny]

20. Not everybody.. but there should be armed security there.

I doubt that anyone here things the whole base is battle ready all the time.

[hunter]

24. Real life is like that too.

The guy who is going to shoot you is going to shoot first, and he probably has more experience.

Fucking guns.

[phantom power]

32. +oo

The rest of us, also, would like to not live our fucking lives at 'full battle rattle.' And yet, that is exactly what the NRA argument boils down to. If only we were all armed at all times, and ready to "defend ourselves," it would all be just groovy. Well, that sounds like a whole world living their lives at full battle rattle to me.

[Skittles]

29. military culture is very foreign to most people, MindPilot

the vast majority of folk have never even been on a military base

[Solly Mack]

33. True.

[bluedigger]

36. The Army still has to qualify annually doesn't it?

I would assume the Marines do as well. It's a slight exaggeration, I think, to say that "Most military people get through their entire tour of duty without ever touching a firearm after boot camp. " Maybe the Air Force and Navy, but they are not the majority of the armed forces. Your overall point is true, however. It is exceedingly rare to see weapons outside of training exercises or off the firing range on a military installation. Certainly not at a naval post devoted to naval architecture and comprised largely of DOD civilians.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

37. Military bases and facilities are NOT "gun free zones."

They are "CCW free zones."

There's a major difference.

There are people with guns on these military installations. Just not private citizens, and not always members of the military.

And allowing private citizens to be armed on a military base....well, I think the stupidity of that course of action speaks for itself.