Ron Paul's campaign manager died of pneumonia, penniless & uninsured.

[elleng]

At CNN's Tea Party-indulging debate on Monday, Ron Paul, a medical doctor, faced a pointed line of questioning from Wolf Blitzer regarding the case of an uninsured young man who suddenly found himself in dire need of intensive health care.

Should the state pay his bills? Paul responded, "That's what freedom is all about: taking your own risks. This whole idea that you have to take care of everybody—"

As it turns out, Paul was not speaking purely in hypotheticals. Back in 2008, Kent Snyder — Paul's former campaign chairman — died of complications from pneumonia. Like the man in Blitzer's example, the 49-year-old Snyder (pictured) was relatively young and seemingly healthy* when the illness struck. He was also uninsured. When he died on June 26, 2008, two weeks after Paul withdrew his first bid for the presidency, his hospital costs amounted to $400,000. The bill was handed to Snyder's surviving mother (pictured, left), who was incapable of paying. Friends launched a website to solicit donations.

According to the Wall Street Journal's 2008 story on his death, Snyder was more than just a strategic ally: He was the only reason Paul thought he ever had a shot at the presidency in the first place.

http://gawker.com/5840024/ron-pauls-campaign-manager-died-of-pneumonia-penniless-and-uninsured

[Tarheel_Dem]

1. "You're on your own."

[Rectangle]

25. He chose to be sick. Too bad!

[kardonb]

30. sickening ?

this idea of taking care of your fellow humans comes straight from the bible( a book all these repugs just love to refer to , but don't seem to understand.

[Rex]

2. Wow.

The evil that some men do by standing idly by and watching...horrid.

[nessa]

3. Unless she signed something saying she would pay the bills, his mother cannot be held responsible...

They can after his estate but after that is gone they are out of luck. Maybe she did sign something, but I bring this up because I have a friend that a bill collector tried to collect from him, for his father medical bills even though he was not responsible. At first he thought he was responsible, because they lied and told him he was.

[elleng]

5. Right, and I hope/wish his mother,

who may have been the executor or 'personal representative,' had decent representation. Sounds like that may not have been the case.

[dflprincess]

24. I hope your friend reported that company to his state Attorney General

Quite a while ago there was an article in the Star Tribune about collection agencies bothering next of kin for bills (not just medical) that they were not legally responsible for. (Apparently it's especially easy to con elderly parents into thinking they owe for their adult children). Minnesota has some strict rules for collection agencies and an AG that enforces them - it was not pretty for the companies involved.

[Mariana]

27. Hospitals and collections agencies do hit up relatives of adults who die

hoping the relatives will not know they aren't responsible. Often they don't. This happened to two of my mother's friends, both of them elderly women. They were defrauded the same way your friend was. My mom's an accountant and she helps some of her friends with their finances. She found out they were paying these bills and told them to stop paying, and told them to get legal advice if they didn't believe her.

Anyone who does this should be locked up.

[TheCowsCameHome]

4. .i.e., he lived (and died) the Tea Party's wish for America

How ironic.

[dem in texas]

6. I wonder

Did he delay going to the Doctor because he did not have insurance, only going when he was so sick that he needed emergency care?

[Mariana]

28. Pneumonia can be very dangerous, even for young, healthy people.

My dad almost died of viral pneumonia when he was in his early 40's. He was in the hospital for weeks.

[tblue37]

42. Especially for the young and healthy sometimes. At age 34 my

sister almost died from it. At first she kept ignoring her persistent "cold" because she was so busy with 3 small kids, and mothers often take care of themselves last. Then, when she felt bad enough to finally try to see a doctor, the receptionist kept pushing her off, because the doctors were booked solid for 2 weeks--not uncommon, since certain forms of insurance coverage at the time enabled people to see a doctor for litttle or no co-pay for even the most minor issues. Finally, her mother-in-law found her collapsed and unconscious on the floor. When she took her to the emergency room, they admitted her immediately. The doctors said she was lucky that she was found and brought in then, because she probably would not have lasted another day.

In my late 40s I also became seriously ill with pneumonia. I had been masking my symptoms with DayQuil because I needed to keep making it to work. When I finally found time to see the doctor, I stopped taking the DayQuil so she would be able to actually see what my symptoms were. By the time I got in to see her, after a nearly one-hour wait in the waiting room, I had to be pretty much carried in, because I was too weak to lift my head and walk. They took me to X-ray in a wheelchair, with my head hanging down from weakness. I could have died, simply because like most relatively young, healthy people, I did not think my "little cold" was serious enough to take time off work or to see a doctor. (Of course, if employers were more reasonable about letting people miss work for illness, that would happen less often.)

[Uncle Joe]

7. That's the primary reason, that the right wing Libertarian Party is wrong, they don't believe in the

Preamble of the Constitution.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Allowing the people do die because they can't afford or don't have "health insurance" neither promotes the general Welfare nor is it a Blessing of Liberty.

Thanks for the thread, elleng.

[CTyankee]

8. The freedom to die...

I mean, who wants to be enslaved, right?

So die, and die quickly, right?

[SheilaT]

15. I guess the lesson here is that this man just didn't

die quickly enough. (Please understand I'm being ironic here.)

The really sad thing is that he's by no means the only one that this sort of thing has happened to, but hopefully will become much rarer after January 1, 2014.

[noiretextatique]

9. "freedom," my ass!

why don't think freedom fucks give up their health insurance? then they can have the freedom to go into debt...or die.

[Blue Owl]

10. Ron Paul, Anti-Humanitarian

and Colossal Dickbag.

[rurallib]

11. I wrote a post on this for our blog and got a response from the campaign

something to the effect that Mr. Snyder was proud to not have insurance etc.
Fuckers killed him and then tried to turn him into a martyr.

[Diclotican]

12. elleng

elleng

Another evidence, about "Universal health care" who I have access to - is the best solution to a grave illness who with proper treatment is absolutely treatable - and where the patient will recover totally..

I had Pneumonia allmoust two mounts ago - got really sick - managed to get to the local hospital - where the doctors was worried about how to treat me, as it was not the typical pneumonia but with proper medication - and a 3 week hospital stay I was able to walk out of the hospital again - well enough to get home and is now more or less totally recovered from my ilness... Wel it was little more complicated than just a pneumonia as I had a Kidney who also was not well - and some other problems - but now I am well - the kidney problem is more or less solved with medication... Wil go back to the hospital in december to do some surgery - all under the Universal Health care system I am able to have acess to...

If I had been living in the US, I would possible be dead now... As I do not have a lot of money (living on disability is something that do not make you a rich person)... But thanks to "universal health care" who in many ears over the atlantic sounds like pure communism - I was able to get well - and to tell the story....

Diclotican

[elleng]

13. Happy to hear you have received good care

in one of the sane places that provides universal health care.

[Diclotican]

21. elleng

elleng

I am very lucky to live in a country where we have universal health care. And the food was not bad either - to be in a hospital -even though I was not hungry at all for almost the whole hospital stay - the result of it, was that I lost weight almost 15 kg in 3 weeks time... Not that it was bad as I was somewhat over the first 100 kg - but it was a kind of brutal form of dieting... The first 1 week and a half I was not hungry at all - the last part of the stay I was starting to at least eat something - but even then, for the most part I was just sleeping and was not hungry at all.. First time I took on my ordinary cloth my trousers It was kind of far to big to me - and still is...
it was kind of a hard way of loosing waight I guess..
Diclotican

[elleng]

23. Sure is a hard way to lose weight!

[bullwinkle428]

14. "Should we just let him die? YEEEEAAAAAHHHH!!!!!"

I recall that sick exchange from that Repuke debate like it just happened.

[elleng]

16. Ditto.

[freshwest]

34. Yes the inner humanity of the baggers really shone through, huh? Same as they did this guy:

Tea Partiers Mock And Scorn Apparent Parkinson's Victim

Uploaded on Mar 17, 2010

COLUMBUS - In a scene reminiscent of non-violent civil rights confrontations from the 1960s, Ohio Tea Partiers quickly turned ugly when facing off with health care advocates in front of Ohio Rep. Mary Jo Kilroy's office Tuesday.

In shocking video taken by a Columbus Dispatch reporter Doral Chenowith yesterday, Tea Party protestors mock a seated counter-protestor with a sign indicating he has Parkinson's disease. They then proceed to hurl wadded up bills at him shouting, "I'll decide when to give you money!"

On March 17th outside of Rep. Mary Jo Kilroy's (D-OH15) district office teabaggers mocked and scorned a man who had a sign stating that he had Parkinson's. They told him "he's in the wrong end of town to ask for handouts", called him a communist and threw dollar bills at him to "pay for his health care".

To see more of the man they were abusing and his story, enter this search term at youtube. The video is in two parts:

Targeted by the Tea Party: Parkinson's Hero Speaks

Bob, the man with Parkinson's who was targeted by the Tea Partiers, sat down with ProgressOhio for an interview. He is 60 years old and was first diagnosed with Parkinsons 15 years ago. He has two masters degrees and a Ph.D. from Cornell. He taught at the University of Michigan and worked as a nuclear engineer.

Bob was able to have a $150,000 surgery that greatly increased his quality of life, thanks to Medicare and the Cleveland Clinic. He attended the event in Columbus because he believes in giving back and thinks everyone should have access to affordable health insurance and quality health care.

Yet this is how the man was treated as the Tea Party was promoted by mainsteam media. There was a reason he was sitting there, but look at the crowd. And they still say they are not vicious and people vote for this?

I posted this video again and again as a warning in the summer of 2010 as I was arguing with people who said they were not going to vote. This is who got elected and we are still living and dying with the results right now. This is the mentality of those who control the HoR and many states.

[AZ Progressive]

17. The last part shows just how savage and inhumane Ron Paul and other GOPers are

"After Snyder's death, Paul posted a message to the website for his Campaign for Liberty — a pre-Tea Party organization which served Paul as both presidential marketing tool and platform to promote his non-interventionist, free market ideals.

He wrote:

"Like so many in our movement, Kent sacrificed much for the cause of liberty. Kent poured every ounce of his being into our fight for freedom. He will always hold a place in my heart and in the hearts of my family."

And that, friends, is what freedom is really all about."

Nice way to encourage others to be freedom loving.

[sulphurdunn]

18. Higher order animals, especially

mammals, tend look after one another as a survival strategy. It is very effective. Libertarians like Paul employ an individualist survival strategy more appropriate to lower life forms than to humans.

[MindMover]

19. LIBERTARIANS ....

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/41483660@N04/6657578499/" title="libertarianism-anarchy-for-rich-people, on Flickr"><img src="" width="500" height="630" alt="libertarianism-anarchy-for-rich-people"></a>

[A Little Weird]

29. Good toon!

I never thought about it that way but that has some truth to it.

[freshwest]

36. +1

[Ed Suspicious]

20. "The bill was handed to Snyder's surviving mother (pictured, left), who was incapable of paying."

Why? Why the fuck should his mom be stuck with the bill? Is that standard op? Shouldn't the debt die with the person?

[elleng]

22. Yes, it should die with the person

unless she had agreed somehow to pay.

[davidpdx]

26. As far as I know, no they don't have to pay it

My father died in 2003 and had bills up the gazoo including a mortgage and car loan. Now granted he lost the house and we turned the car over to the lender, but there was no money to pay his bills. The companies have to write it off.

[Mariana]

31. I think it's standard for hospitals (and collections agencies)

to send out bills to surviving relatives, even though the relatives aren't responsible. They hope the relatives will be fooled into believing they are obligated to pay. Sometimes, especially when it's a collections agency, they lie outright and tell the relatives they are responsible.

[elleng]

33. Guess people don't know how to deal with matters after a death in the family.

At least I knew enough to retain counsel to deal with probate matters for my husband. I send counsel all bills + correspondence, and don't worry about such things.

[Egalitarian Thug]

38. You would probably be surprised at how often this scam works.

[Mariana]

40. I'd believe it.

If it didn't work, they wouldn't do it.

It doesn't help any when stories like this one are published. It reads, "The bill was handed to Snyder's surviving mother (pictured, left), who was incapable of paying." as if it's the most natural thing in the word for her to be on the hook for her adult son's hospital bill. Maybe she signed something and she really is liable, but the article doesn't say that. So, people read this story and others like it, and then when it happens to them, they don't question.

[LibertyLover]

43. When my mother died

she had a credit card bill from a department store, a small amount, for a purchase she'd made shortly before her death. The card company came after me. I explained that the person who had incurred the charge was dead and I was not responsible for her debts. I informed them that I would submit the bill to her estate for payment. The bill collection agency person got very annoyed and implied that my credit would suffer as a result if I didn't pay up immediately. I didn't bite and continued on the next several calls that followed to state that I'd submit the bill to the estate. Finally I was told not to bother. So I didn't.

[The Last Dem.]

32. Some times,

when signing in if you have no health Ins. They ask someone with you to co-sign for you, if you don't pay up they come after the co-signer

[BluegrassStateBlues]

35. Libertarian utopia. At least he died free from the enslavement of free/affordable health care. nt

[Egalitarian Thug]

37. The term is, I believe, poetic justice. n/t

[Jamaal510]

39. But Ron Paul is fighting for all of our freedoms here--

the freedom for us to watch him and other politicians have better health care than us.

[B Calm]

41. Despite what republicans claim they are, taking personal

responsibility is NOT one they own!

[Scurrilous]

44. K & R