I hate our education system.

[liberal_at_heart]

I had to help my son with his science homework tonight. He has autism and is in 9th grade general education science with no educational assistant. He is learning Boyle's Law. My daughter didn't learn this until her advanced chemistry class her senior year of high school. I didn't learn it until my first year of college. Between working the equation and doing the math that my son doesn't know how to do thanks to Common Core it took us an hour to do 1 problem. I hate Race to the Top and I hate Common Core. I hate Race to the Top and I hate Common Core. I hate Race to the Top and Common Core. Did I mention I hate Race to the Top and I hate Common Core?

[kelly1mm]

1. If possible, you should think about home school. My wife is a public school teacher. We home school

our kids (and have for 6 years) because of what she sees at work. Not saying home school is the best for all students but for many it works well.

[liberal_at_heart]

2. I've thought about it before, but haven't done much research as of yet. It can be intimidating, but

definitely worth a look.

[HuckleB]

25. I'd look at all other options first.

The percentage of home school students that I see in my practice as a mental health provider (and I hear similar things from other providers) is well beyond the percentage of students are home schooled. I'm not saying it's always a bad decision, I've recommended it for several of my patients, in fact. Still, there are many cons as well.

[mike_c]

3. I really don't mean to be snarky...

...but are we talking about the same Boyles Law? The ideal gas law?

PV = k (or P₁V₁ = P₂V₂)

Arithmetically it's just multiplication and division (for solving unknowns) so is the problem more about identifying the parameters from written problem descriptions?

This is an important topic for me, because I teach university life sciences classes and we find a majority of our incoming students are functionally quantitatively illiterate. That sort of problems is the kind I'd normally expect them to find second nature, rather than challenging, and that likely has to begin in high school (or arguably, even earlier).

[liberal_at_heart]

6. We all understand that the curriculum needs to be accelerated and that students need to be

prepared for college. However, this cannot be done at light speed. By doing it so quickly they actually skip over important curricula. My son is having to go back and learn multiplication and division because Common Core forced my son to skip 4th and 5th grade math in order to learn 6th grade math. And he is not the only one. My son's math teacher is seeing lots of kids with this problem. The same problem occurs when they do this acceleration with other subjects such as science. Why can't they accelerate the curriculum one year at a time instead of three to four years? If I had to guess I would say because billionaires and corporations are putting pressure on our government to produce competitive math and science majors now, and because those same billionaires want to privatize our public school system. They are trying to force these kids to improve and when they don't do it fast enough they punish them and their schools and teachers for it. Not to mention that my son is autistic. They don't have special education science and this school doesn't even have an educational assistant to help him. Instead of following an IEP where they can customize curriculum for special education students they are abandoning IEPs for Common Core and trying to force special education students to catch up to their general education peers.

[mike_c]

15. thanks for clarifying....

As I replied to someone else below, I didn't mean to comment on Common Core at all-- rather, on the difficulties we have with under-prepared students at university. A HUGE proportion of our students-- including science students-- require quite basic remedial math before they can proceed, and they never really become quantitatively competent. "The math is too hard" is one of the most common complaints I read on course evaluations, yet the math in question is really just simple arithmetic for the most part. I really do want K-12 to do a better job with math preparation in science courses as well as in math courses.

[liberal_at_heart]

40. I don't know who changed the way K-12 was taught but they need to go back to doing it the

way they did it a few decades ago. One of the reasons why your students can't do math is because they don't teach basic math skills like memorizing the multiplication tables. My daughter who is not autistic and is very bright but can't do basic multiplication in her head.

[HuckleB]

26. How did "Common Core" do that to your son that many years ago?

[Tigress DEM]

44. I think schools should learn from the tutoring academies - individualized learning works best

TEACH PEOPLE HOW to think not WHAT to think, by finding their best learning style or strategies to take in the information.

I'm visual and written. STRUGGLED with Algebra until I got to Geometry, Formula - letters - numbers - memorize BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH just COULD NOT get my mind to make sense of it, THEN add some basic shapes, theorems and examples of what the math LOOKED like and the BIG picture (ie: When you build a bridge you need to mathematically plan for the angles match exactly so you meet in the middle and to plan for your roof pitch to be exactly right in every area.)

Still not the greatest at math because I basically did whatever I needed to memorize and pass those classes to get on to other stuff.

Although for "exceptions to the rules" I like a good old auditory reminder, Conjunction Junction - Schoolhouse Rock. I before E except after C except when it sounds like A as in neighbor or weigh.


http://huntingtonhelps.com/ All individualized



http://www.vark-learn.com/english/page.asp?p=helpsheets

Academic Help sheets - Students and teachers can select their particular preference(s) to understand how they should:

take in information;
use information for effective learning;
and communicate more effectively.

Visual strategies for learning (V)
Aural strategies for learning (A)
Read/write strategies for learning (R)
Kinesthetic strategies for learning (K)
Multimodal strategies for learning (MM)

[Harmony Blue]

7. This is a bit too much for a 9th grade student

because most students start to be exposed to Algebra in 9th/10th grade. 8th grade is often where they are taught pre algebra math though so a student if given enough time can figure this out without the aid of Algebra.

But I will say this though...pre algebra skills are probably the most important math skills one can learn. Algebra, Geometry, Pre Calculus, Calculus, Finite mathematics, DE, etc are all important as well. But knowing relative percent differences, absolute percent, ratios, rates, probability, fractions, unit conversions, percent weights, etc are all far more important for science students at college level courses. And this is 7th/8th grade level of math, maybe earlier that is important to know. Even I struggle sometimes to discern the difference between absolute percent and relative percent difference from word problems.

[HuckleB]

27. I began algebra in fifth grade, which was odd for the time.

However, it is very common for students to engage with a great deal of algebra in middle school. Many students are beyond what used to be second year high school algebra by the time they start high school.

[pnwmom]

35. It's not a race, despite what they claim.

There is such a thing as developmental readiness and not all children's brains are ready for abstract math at the same time.

http://www.education.com/magazine/article/higher-math-grades/

In a 2008 letter to the editor of The Ventura County Star, Professor of Education Dr. Bruce Mitchell argued against California’s proposal. His letter referenced the studies of Dr. Herman Epstein, who believed that the human brain has rapid growth periods and plateau periods where no growth seems to take place. For most students, the middle school years occur during a plateau stage, and Epstein argued that "the plateau stages were not optimal times for the introduction of new higher-level thought processes, particularly algebra, which eighth-grade students fail more than any other subject. Historically, algebra has been most often offered in grades 10 though 12. That occurs during the age 14-17 growth-spurt stage, when it's OK to teach abstract reasoning concepts.”

[HuckleB]

39. Who said anything was a race?

Do you have a response to the actual content of my post? If not, why bother?

[pnwmom]

42. The OP.

Did you bother to read it?

It doesn't matter that "many" students are ready for Algebra in middle school. Not ALL students are, and when school is viewed as a "Race to the Top" many children suffer.

[sweetapogee]

9. no

Boyle's law is pressure & volume V is proportional to P
P1V1=P2V2
(pressure 1 X volume 1 = pressure 2 X volume 2)

the Ideal Gas law is Pressure, Volume and Moles

PV=nRT

(P= pressure, V= volume, n= moles, R= constant 0.0821 and T= temperature in Kelvin)

[mike_c]

13. I understand-- Boyles Law APPLIES to ideal gasses....

Sorry for the confusion.

[pnwmom]

10. But the boy is in 9th grade -- he's just starting Algebra. n/t

[former9thward]

16. Boyles Law is NOT algebra.

It is simple math. Multiplication and Division.

[pnwmom]

20. Doesn't matter. Algebra is also multiplication and division.

But a long mathematical expression like that will still be intimidating to a kid who's just started 9th grade.

[former9thward]

24. Only one who is mathematically illiterate.

A lot of parents are projecting their illiteracy on the subject onto kids. Our students are very poor in math and science. Parents come up with no end of excuses for it. BTW it is not "a long mathematical expression." It is about as simple as you get.

[pnwmom]

31. 1 + 1 is as simple as it gets. I'm not projecting anything.

I raised a PhD engineer -- a girl who likes math. But I'm also raising an artist. Not everyone has to be the same.

[adirondacker]

37. Spot On. Awesome! nt

[mike_c]

30. it's MEANT to be challenging....

Learning is challenging. It simply is, especially when you're building new knowledge. I spent most of my morning struggling with five pages in a textbook, working through them over and over until I got the underlying concepts and could anticipate the problems. Some times you despair that you'll never get it. Then you start over. It just works that way.

As educators, we need to stop trying to push the message that "learning should be fun" without the corollary message that "overcoming hard challenges is what makes it fun."

[pnwmom]

32. Did you miss the part about this kid having autism?

Isn't it just possible that the parent knows better what the boy is ready for than a teacher who teaches 150 other kids over the course of the day?

Or DUers who don't know him at all?

[HuckleB]

28. That was back in the day.

Now, most middle schoolers are at least half-way through what used to be the first year of algebra in high school.

[duffyduff]

11. Read her post again. Her son has a disability.

Common Core is utter bullshit that was spearheaded by the likes of Bill Gates.

These reformers deliberately cram inappropriate curriculum down students' throats as a way to scapegoat teachers when the kids inevitably fail.

I couldn't care less what you teach at university level. It doesn't mean you know anything about child development. It's pretty obvious you don't when you trash K-12.

[mike_c]

12. well, the fact remains that most of our students are quantitatively illiterate...

...or nearly so, and it's their primary and secondary school experiences that aren't adequately preparing them. That's simply the way it is, and we need a solution. Since I don't teach K-12, I don't have any direct stake in Common Core. Indeed, I don't know squat about it. However, I do find it disturbing that very simple arithmetic is being held up as an example of work that's too difficult for high-schoolers. That's precisely the attitude that seems to underlie the diminished quantitative competence we see in American college students. My response up thread was not about Common Core-- it was about whether simple math is appropriate for ninth grade high school students.

[Nevernose]

14. Nothing you wrote is true

I understand that you believe it, but the fact remains that nothing you say is true.

[mike_c]

21. well, I'd invite you to our classrooms if that were possible to see for yourself....

I'm describing my personal experience over 25 years of teaching in higher ed. We have joint committees in MATH, BIOL, and CHEM at my institution whose sole charge is to try to find solutions for quantitative illiteracy. I'm on them, as well as my own department's Curriculum Committee. We see the institutional data.

Do you mind explaining why you think I believe these things, but they're not true? I mean, I'm there every day. Everything I've said is my personal experience, and is a near universal topic of conversation among my colleagues. What evidence can you offer that this is not true?

[liberal_at_heart]

38. the fact is not all kids learn the same or at the same rate. We need to quit treating them like

robots. Other countries do a much better job at educating their kids and most of the countries that are more successful at it, do so by treating the kids as individuals and teaching to their strengths. The teachers who are in the classrooms should have more power over customizing curriculum based on each student's abilities, not some committie or government official.

[former9thward]

18. You are entirely correct.

You are getting flack because most of the parents are quantitatively illiterate but don't want to admit it.

[HuckleB]

29. No, they're not.

Do some appear to be so. Sure, but so did your peers at that age.

[CK_John]

4. The function of Common Core is to break teacher tenure, bring in 30 and under teachers,

and turn the school system into money pits for the charter crowd. It has nothing to do with your child or children getting an education.

[femmocrat]

5. + 1000

And richly reward the test-makers.

[HuckleB]

23. Can you explain your theory on this?

I'm generally opposed to Common Core, though for other reasons. Just curious.

[bhikkhu]

8. Well, I hope it goes ok

I'm currently studying toward a chemistry exam myself, and I think Boyle's Law is one of the more interesting and simple ones. It does lend itself to a direct conceptual understanding, and there is only the relation of two aspects to grasp. Its a good opportunity to practice the math as well...My own daughters are in about the same place - one in 9th grade, studying science and geometry (here they do two years of algebra in junior high), and my older one also took plenty of math and science in 9th and 10th grade.

Perhaps I tend to look on the bright side, but I've always enjoyed learning things like that, working out problems, and learning new things. If you can instill that enjoyment of learning in a kid, just add "time" and the battle is all but won.

[Emelina]

17. Kids will attain the goals we set for them.

It is good that students are challenged. Too often all our schools do is under-stimulate the gifted, over-tax those who need help and just concentrate on conforming the rest.

Perhaps it is time to end age-based grades. Also, we need to look more to Piaget than to Skinner as a guide in setting up modern education.

[HuckleB]

22. Good post.

I'm not hot on ending age-based grades, because there more to school than academics, but I know we're not serving either the gifted or those who need more help. That's for sure.

[HuckleB]

19. Common Core is not the greatest thing in the world, but it is not to blame for this.

It's only been around for a very short time, and your son is in 9th grade. Now, that doesn't mean our education system is wonderful, but if you're going to attack it, well, it would be good to stick to facts.

Also, I learned Boyle's Law in middle school. My second grader is, granted, in a school for "gifted students," and it's hard to keep up with him, but he's learned it. I understand that it may not make sense for your son to learn it now. Still, your post is very confusing.

[Smarmie Doofus]

33. You have LOTS of company.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11247603

Money and politics are driving this admin's ed agenda and its a catastrophe for everyone involved ( psssst: it's SUPPOSED to be) but esp for kids in special ed.

[LeftyMom]

34. That's grade school math.

If your child can't do grade school math he shouldn't be mainstreamed in science. Unless the high school science curriculum is complete crap he won't be able to do the work, because the work involves significant math.

You shouldn't be raising hell that your kid is being asked to do this. You should be raising hell that your older child wasn't.

[adirondacker]

36. Isn't Boyle's law something to do with Constant corporate Pressure to produce Volumes of Gas with

increasing Temperatures?

I agree with the OP's opinion of education in this country. I've known plenty of great test takers that have Zero critical thinking skills.

[liberal_at_heart]

41. I think Race to the Top may be even worse than No Child Left Behind. At least No Child Left Behind

pretended to care about all the children. Race to the Top is very Darwin. Those of you strong enough to learn fast enough will succeed. Those of you not strong enough to learn fast enough, well.... No one says what is suppose to happen to those who can't learn fast enough. Maybe no one cares.

[libdem4life]

43. This is a non-progressive post. You do what you do with your situation. My son was mildly learning

disabled and Gifted and Talented. There was No Program for him...none...zero...zilch. As a professional elementary teacher, I home schooled him for Kindergarten and we both had a ball. Since he was an "only", I bucked up and put him in 1st grade...and volunteered. He already knew how to read and to do math, and the classroom was boring and he had problems...even when I was there. Just restless, talking, goofing off, driving the teacher nuts...et al. 'She and I talked...as they were not teaching phonics at the time...and he knew phonics, and she suggested that he would not do well, as we both knew.

There was one other choice...start a Charter School for him and some of our friends were interested, for similar reasons. It was a daunting process, as there were none in California. The Director of the Preschool Coop...both Left Democrat...and I had to work within the community groups, the school district, and were required to get 100% of the teachers at one school before we could apply. We went to Sacramento and had to deal with an upstart Republican legislator who was the lead. We gagged, and went because if was necessary. It took us months, but finally public interest and one school gave us what we needed, and went with us 100%. The Charter was the first parent-initiated charter in the state.

Do I feel guilty as I see how the Republicans are now using it? Yes and no. I only had one child, brilliant and challenged, and he was failing and I and other parents tried hard to get the Gifted and Talented Program reinstated...no funds or teacher. It's easy if it's not your child.

It's still going strong...that was 20 years ago...and in our area, it's not what apparently seems the national conspiracy to gut public education, but can see the problem from a political standpoint.

When I taught in the 70s, it was different. The 90s were abysmal, at least in California. No phonics, calculators in 1st grade, no book reports (or reading requirements) as they didn't have the time to read them, no spelling lists, computer/spell check in 2nd grade on up. Enough to send any old time teacher into depression. He did poorly in Middle School and High School public schools for the same, basic reasons.

So, there are many stories...not all of them PC.

[masoncharest]

45. liberal_at_heart

I think Boyles’s Law is really interesting, but problem is that it’s take more time to finish it.