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Sat Nov 30, 2013, 04:21 PM

Interview with blacklisted comedian, Mort Sahl, 1968 quotes and warnings after JFK's death.

http://www.assassinationscience.com/AnHistoricalPerspective-MortSahl.html


Mort Sahl was black-listed after JFK’s death when he came out publically disputing the Warren Commission’s “lone assassin” theory:

“Once the neo-fascists became bold enough to slay the President on the street, they showed their hand. They showed how arrogant they had become.”


ARGO: What is the extent of the conspiracy and why is the government so desperate to keep the truth from the American public?

SAHL: We have determined that elements of the Central Intelligence Agency planned the execution and killed the President. Lee Oswald attended those meetings planning it. He was the only non-CIA man at the meeting. And he worked for the FBI. We then find that an FBI code clerk has a message come through, a twx, through the southern regional offices of the FBI, warning five days ahead that the President will be assassinated and we still later find Oswald saying, "I was a patsy," in the Dallas Police Station. The "elements" are in the Central Intelligence Agency. They don't want to lose their power. And they don't want to fall. It has become government by hoodlum. And I don't blame them. If I were them, I wouldn't want to fall either. I would pull out all the stops as well, as they have. On the other hand, while I know that neo-Nazis would want to kill a man like John Kennedy, I don't understand why liberals would want to protect them from prosecution.

ARGO: What would you say are the roots of this whole era?

SAHL: Fascism. It started with the death of Roosevelt. They moved in and they negated every treaty we made with every world leader who didn't fit the fascist/militarist mold. We went back on our word. As David Schoenbrun says very well, "I am not a dissenter for saying this. Those who betrayed American policy are the dissenters." We've gone back on the dream of national independence and we were the model for the rest of the world. Then when they followed our model, we attacked them for it. Shameful. No one has a right to stain the American flag. And unfortunately, we have people in this country who did it. If America goes, it will surely be an inside job.

ARGO: What will make the American people face themselves and, to use your expression, rise up like an army?

SAHL: Well, they have very decent instincts. If they didn't, the government would not have to hide the facts from them. They could give them any facts and the people would be insensitive. But, they have a sense of decency because they come from better stock then that. And so, once the truth is revealed to them, they're no longer under a cloak of ignorance. Public opinion will change things. There will be a ground swell. These people will resign or will be lost in the shuffle. But, you know, the country was structured so that we could have violent change without violent overthrow. I'm very optimistic in that sense. The principles of America may be better than the group currently practicing or ignoring them, as you will. But, the country has great relilience, and once they get the information, they my yet have time to save themselves.
Our job here is to give the young people time. We're just like the fellow in the movie The Seventh Cross. He works with the partisans. We've got to give the young people time to get here, to save America.

ARGO: Why is the trial that Mr. Garrison's pursuing really the trial of the American people?

SAHL: Because we have to decide. Once the neo-fascists became bold enough to slay the President on the street, they showed their hand. They showed how arrogant they had become. Now it's a question of symptom. That crime was a national symptom. If we can turn our back on that, we will pay a terrible price. That will be the end of this democracy. As a matter of fact, it's been dying since Kennedy's death. We have to cleanse our soul. It's much the same as the French when they regained their national honor, not by framing Dreyfus, but by admitting that they did.
---------------

Seems the CT began immediately, and the "investigation" is yet to be full and completed. As for me, I will stand with those who question, and I will stand proudly.

79 replies, 16075 views

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Reply Interview with blacklisted comedian, Mort Sahl, 1968 quotes and warnings after JFK's death. (Original post)
mother earth Nov 2013 OP
Politicalboi Nov 2013 #1
MineralMan Nov 2013 #2
YoungDemCA Nov 2013 #4
Art_from_Ark Dec 2013 #9
Enthusiast Dec 2013 #10
Spider Jerusalem Dec 2013 #11
cui bono Dec 2013 #54
HangOnKids Dec 2013 #58
SidDithers Dec 2013 #71
Th1onein Nov 2013 #3
Progressive dog Nov 2013 #5
colsohlibgal Nov 2013 #6
Octafish Nov 2013 #7
Scuba Dec 2013 #8
Bluenorthwest Dec 2013 #12
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #13
Art_from_Ark Dec 2013 #14
Raksha Dec 2013 #47
Eddie Haskell Dec 2013 #15
Samantha Dec 2013 #56
Octafish Dec 2013 #16
Raksha Dec 2013 #49
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #17
Octafish Dec 2013 #18
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #19
Eddie Haskell Dec 2013 #21
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #22
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #23
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #25
grasswire Dec 2013 #37
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #38
Octafish Dec 2013 #42
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #44
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #46
Octafish Dec 2013 #48
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #50
Octafish Dec 2013 #63
CanSocDem Dec 2013 #65
Octafish Dec 2013 #66
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #68
Octafish Dec 2013 #39
Raksha Dec 2013 #51
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #53
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #20
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #24
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #26
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #27
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #29
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #34
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #36
HangOnKids Dec 2013 #59
sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #28
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #30
sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #32
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #35
former9thward Dec 2013 #40
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #43
former9thward Dec 2013 #61
solarhydrocan Dec 2013 #62
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #69
sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #55
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #57
sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #64
The Midway Rebel Dec 2013 #70
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #33
HangOnKids Dec 2013 #60
Ichingcarpenter Dec 2013 #31
Archae Dec 2013 #41
MinM Dec 2013 #72
MinM Dec 2013 #73
sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #74
Octafish Dec 2013 #77
MortSahlFan Dec 2018 #78
upi402 Dec 2013 #45
Octafish Dec 2013 #67
dchill Dec 2013 #52
MinM Dec 2013 #75
upi402 Dec 2013 #76
DumpTrump20202020 Jan 2021 #79

Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 04:37 PM

1. I remember when he talked about the man in the bushes

 

And then they shut him down. I guess they were more scared of the truth then than now. Now, those that don't believe Warren and 9/11 commissions are considered nuts. I think just the opposite. If they had been truthful EVERYTHING would have came out. And if the 9/11 commission only looked at their conclusion, they would see the core beams aren't standing around 50 stories of debris like their little shitty NIST cartoon they made.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 05:12 PM

2. 1968 interview? Really?

Mort Sahl didn't know what happened. Why is this being posted here in GD? The website at that link is a prime CT site, full of "we didn't land on the moon" nonsense and worse. It's a crazy talk site.

http://www.assassinationscience.com/

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #2)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 06:32 PM

4. They know the rules about CT's here...

 

Yet the woo-believers don't care about that.

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Response to YoungDemCA (Reply #4)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 08:12 AM

9. Woo-believers?

I think that "woo" is always believing the official story, even after it's been revealed that official stories, like the Gulf of Tonkin Incident and the Iraq Weapons of Mass Destruction, have often been a pack of lies.

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Response to Art_from_Ark (Reply #9)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 08:56 AM

10. "woo" is always believing the official story. Yes it is.

Especially when the official story is so obviously full of holes. The American people doubt the official JFK story for good reason. No "woo" about it.

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Response to Art_from_Ark (Reply #9)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 08:57 AM

11. No, "woo" is beliving something for which there's not any evidence.

"Woo" is beliving that vaccines cause autism. "Woo" is beliving that no aeroplanes struck the WTC and that's just a cover-story for a false-flag op and controlled demolition. "Woo" is believing Barack Obama was born in Kenya. "Woo" is beliving Stanley Kubrick faked the moon landings in the Nevada desert. "Woo" is believing that some shadowy and sinister Mafia/CIA/LBJ/MIC conpsiracy killed Kennedy.

What do those things have in common? There's not a single bit of evidence for any of them and there's considerable evidence that contradicts those assertions.

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Response to Spider Jerusalem (Reply #11)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 12:21 AM

54. There's plenty of evidence that contradicts official stories as well. n/t

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Response to YoungDemCA (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 04:19 AM

58. Yet the post stands

 

Exactly how old are you youngdem?

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Response to YoungDemCA (Reply #4)

Thu Dec 5, 2013, 08:48 AM

71. The rules about CTs are ignored by Hosts...

so the woo-believers have free reign.

Sid

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 06:21 PM

3. And I stand with you.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 07:29 PM

5. A comedian's opinion is not evidence.

Fifty years and the same CT's never go away.
Garrison tried Clay Shaw and it took one hour for the jury to find him not guilty. So, if Mr. Garrison tried the American People, the American people were acquitted. It's time to move on.


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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 07:56 PM

6. Moon Landings Not The Same Thing

Very hard to fudge and fake the moon landing. Not an assassination. This is a common trick, to lump realistic questions with nutty stuff.

Spend a little time and listen to what the doctors at Parkland originally said about the throat wound being an entrance wound. Spend a little time perusing multiple film and pictures right after the murder - everyone, including law officers, are moving, running etc. toward the grassy knoll area. Look at the Zapruder film - it's clear the main kill shot was from the right front. Oh, look at the amazing amount of sudden deaths of people who might have had pertinent info -like Dorothy Killgallon - the House committee lost several who were about to testify, funny how that happens.

There was more than one person shooting and Oswald may not have been one of them.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sat Nov 30, 2013, 08:04 PM

7. Mort Sahl was correct. DUer Bobbie found this...

As Mort Sahl said in his autobiography "Heartland":

"Now you know there are murderers among us, killers of the dream. You know what they did.
I know some of you don't want to get involved, but you began your involvement when you began life.
Do it for the best friend you ever had, John F. Kennedy.
Do it for yourself.
You must do it, because there is no one else."

OP: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x602847

Thank you, mother earth. I stand with you.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 07:29 AM

8. "If America goes, it will surely be an inside job. "

 

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:44 AM

12. Mort was a very sharp and biting wit, he was on TV often during my childhood and I remember his

 

theories about the Kennedy assassination as well as many other opinions and quips of his. Mort wore black. I loved him.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #12)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:54 AM

13. He was the friends of jFK and Reagan had two degrees

he had an acribic intellectual wit that inspired, Chris Rock, Bill hicks, Jon Stewart, George Carlin and many more.

“Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they've stolen.”
― Mort Sahl

“Washington couldn't tell a lie, Nixon couldn't tell the truth, and Reagan couldn't tell the difference.”
― Mort Sahl

kick nominated

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #13)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 10:41 AM

14. I've got to remember that quote

“Washington couldn't tell a lie, Nixon couldn't tell the truth, and Reagan couldn't tell the difference.”

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #13)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:32 PM

47. Good one!

“Washington couldn't tell a lie, Nixon couldn't tell the truth, and Reagan couldn't tell the difference.”
― Mort Sahl

I don't think I ever realized how brilliant Mort Sahl was until I read this interview. That quote is just icing on the cake.

Is he still alive, BTW?

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 01:25 PM

15. The Case Against LBJ

http://meria.net/2013/11/meria-with-roger-stone-the-man-who-killed-kennedy-the-case-against-lbj/

Mac Wallace was LBJ's personal assassin. Wallace's fingerprints were found at the Book Depository shooting site.


According to Barr McClellan, the author of Blood, Money & Power: How LBJ Killed JFK:

Kinser asked Josefa (LBJ's sister) if she could arrange for her brother to loan him some money. Johnson interpreted this as a blackmail threat (Josefa had told Kinser about some of her brother's corrupt activities).

On 22nd October, 1951, Mac Wallace went to Kinser's miniature golf course. After finding Kinser in his golf shop, he shot him several times before escaping in his station wagon. A customer at the golf course had heard the shooting and managed to make a note of Wallace's license plate. The local police force was able to use this information to arrest Wallace.

Wallace was charged with murder but was released on bail after Edward Clark arranged for two of Johnson's financial supporters, M. E. Ruby and Bill Carroll, to post bonds on behalf of the defendant. Johnson's attorney, John Cofer, also agreed to represent Wallace.

On 1st February, 1952, Wallace resigned from his government job in order to distance himself from Lyndon B. Johnson. His trial began seventeen days later. Wallace did not testify. Cofer admitted his client's guilt but claimed it was an act of revenge as Kinser had been sleeping with Wallace's wife.

The jury found Wallace guilty of" murder with malice afore-thought". Eleven of the jurors were for the death penalty. The twelfth argued for life imprisonment. Judge Charles O. Betts overruled the jury and announced a sentence of five years imprisonment. He suspended the sentence and Wallace was immediately freed.

According to Bill Adler of The Texas Observer, several of the jurors telephoned John Kinser's parents to apologize for agreeing to a "suspended sentence, but said they did so only because threats had been made against their families."

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Response to Eddie Haskell (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 03:26 AM

56. Wallace's wife as well as Johnson's sister were enamored of Kinser (to put it politely)

Last edited Mon Dec 2, 2013, 01:40 PM - Edit history (1)

Your thread details the murder of Kinser, but there is so much more.

"Another strange death occurred at the end of 1961. Johnson's sister Josefa attended a Christmas Eve party at the LBJ ranch, returned to her home in nearby Fredericksburg, and died during the night, supposedly of a cerebral hemorrhage. Despite state law, no autopsy was conducted. Billy Sol Estes later stated that Wallace murdered her. 2/" (see page 167, Blood, Money & Power)

Johnson's sister, following her divorce, led a somewhat provocative life. She was deemed to be a threat to Johnson because of her loose lips. This book details how any perceived threat to Johnson's future would be eradicated, and his sister knew a lot....

The sentence of a court in Wallace's trial for Doug Kinser's murder is reproduced in McClellan's book at "Pictures and Documents: 16.

But Kinser was just another one of many of Johnson's victims. Henry H. Marshall refused to shut down at the USDA an investigation pertaining to Estes, which would expose Johnson's corruption and probably end his career.

At "Pictures and Documents: 30, is a reproduced copy of a grand jury's findings in 1984:

"Based on the testimony presented today, which was not presented in to the previous grand jury, it is the decision of this grand jury, that Henry H. Marshall's death was a homicide, not suicide. The parties named as participants in the offense are deceased, and therefore it is not possible for the grand jury to return an indictment." The findings were signed on March 20, 1984. The "parties" were Johnson, Carter and Wallace.

This book is amazing in its detail chronicling Johnson's life and career, as well as that of others who participated in the corruption and crime revolving around LBJ.

Sam

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 02:13 PM

16. Mort Sahl interview on MaeBrussell.com...

Originally published March 18, 1968:



ARGO: Why is the truth behind the assassination of President Kennedy the last chance of America for its survival?

SAHL: Because the evidence developed by District Attorney Garrison indicates that certain people had to take President Kennedy's life in order to control ours. In other words, as Richard Starnes of the New York World-Telegram said, the shots in Dallas were the opening shots of World War III. There's been a great change in this country since Kennedy. I'm afraid a great deal of our hope was interred with his remains.

CONTINUED...

http://www.maebrussell.com/Mort%20Sahl/Mort%20Sahl%20-%20Argo.html



This is a man: Mort Sahl was and is unafraid to tell the truth -- even when doing so cost him his livelihood.

Of course, the truth we've learned and the history we've lived since then only support Mort Sahl.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #16)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:39 PM

49. He has certainly been vindicated both ways.

both by subsequent research in the years since that interview, and most of all by the history we've lived.

Re "Of course, the truth we've learned and the history we've lived since then only support Mort Sahl."

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 02:21 PM

17. Mort Sahl supported Alexander Haig for President in 1988.

"Following Kennedy's assassination in 1963, Sahl's interest in who was behind it was so great that he became a deputized member of New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison's team to investigate the murder.[2] As a result, Sahl's comedy began to reflect his politics and included readings and commentary on the Warren Commission Report. His earlier anti-Kennedy jokes and his onstage tirades against the Warren Commission alienated much of his audience. He was effectively blacklisted and his shows were cancelled. Sahl's income dropped from US$1 million to US$19,000 a year. (According to the Inflation Calculator of the Bureau of Labor Statistics, $19,000 in 1964 was the equivalent of $134,000 in 2008.) However, the rising tide of counterculture fueled his comeback.
In the 1988 presidential election, Sahl was the most prominent supporter of unsuccessful candidate Alexander Haig.[3]"

From Wiki.

Wow, a deputy for Jim Garrison too. I bet that made him feel important.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #17)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 03:02 PM

18. Have you ever felt important, The Midway Rebel? Like when doing a job?

There aren't many bigger jobs than trying to find the killers of the head of government. Why you find that a source of ridicule is your business, not mine.

As for Sahl supporting Haig: Big deal. He can support who he wants. What matters to me is he supported John F. Kennedy -- before and after his assassination -- and stood up in public to say so.

From what I remember, Sahl thought Haig had the sand needed to clean out the Washington-on-the-Potomac swamp, or cesspool, for those who think there's an important difference.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #18)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 03:35 PM

19. Woo-hoo personal attack.

I'm flattered and Ifeel important now. Thanks!

Yeah, so umm. You, Sahl, Haig, Castro, where will it end Octa? Deepthroat? (The porno, not the whistle blower.)

The sand needed to clean out Washington? Yeah, that's what Ron Paul says too.

You're so-called job is a middle-class hobby.

I actually read, write, and teach history for a living. My standards of proof are very high and, so far, your cut and paste has failed to convince me of a conspiracy that exists anywhere other than in your head. But carry on. Mort Sahl was a pleasant surprise and I agree with Woody Allen's assessment of Mort as the Charlie Parker of stand-up, but not so much with his conspiracy woo. I'm always learning from these threads. You, on the other hand, not so much.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #19)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:15 PM

21. Wow, a history teacher.

You must be impotent.

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Response to Eddie Haskell (Reply #21)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:25 PM

22. Gee Eddie. Some Democrat you are.

That's corny and not even funny. What else you got? Did you campaign for the nuclear warmonger General Haig for President too?

"However, authors Len Colodny and Robert Gettlin were highly critical of much of Haig's behind-the-scenes work as Nixon's chief of staff in their 1991 book Silent Coup: The Removal of a President. They described several episodes where Haig misled the president and others, particularly those surrounding the court battles over Nixon's White House tape recordings, and Ford's eventual pardon of Nixon in September 1974. Having conducted dozens of interviews of key participants, including Gerald Ford, Robert Hartmann, H.R. Haldeman, John Ehrlichman, John Mitchell, John Dean, Alexander Butterfield, Bob Woodward, Carl Bernstein, Samuel Dash, Seymour Hersh, Jeb Magruder, Gordon Liddy, Herbert Kalmbach, Robert Bork, and many others, as well as researching Congressional proceedings and a wide variety of contemporary news sources, the two authors were able to find many inconsistencies in what Haig claimed he had done. Haig refused to be interviewed for this book. Colodny and Gettlin stated that on several occasions, Haig seemed more concerned with shielding himself from investigation than in helping Nixon. Colodny and Gettlin also presented the most thorough explanation and analysis which had been seen, up to that time, of the so-called Moorer-Radford military espionage affair, an episode where Haig played a key role; several key documents from this matter wound up being hidden from public view, perhaps permanently, among Nixon's presidential papers.[12]

Haig caused some alarm with his suggestion that a "nuclear warning shot" in Europe might be effective in deterring the Soviet Union.[22] His tenure as Secretary of State was often characterized by his clashes with the Defense Secretary, Caspar Weinberger.
Secretary of State Haig, who repeatedly had difficulty with various members of the Reagan administration during his year-and-a-half in office, decided to resign his post on June 25.[23]

President Reagan accepted Haig's resignation from State on July 5, 1982.[24] Haig was succeeded by George P. Shultz, who was confirmed on July 16, 1982.[25]

From Wiki

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #22)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:31 PM

23. Thank you Mr. History

digging into the hidden govt. archives of wikipedia

Ran Paul does the same

woops I used that slur which you used to others.

Tell your students to read Howard Zinn
but I guess you never will.

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #23)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:33 PM

25. Wrong.

Again.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #19)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 06:00 PM

37. you read and write for a living but can't tell the diff between "your" and "you're"? nt

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Response to grasswire (Reply #37)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 06:03 PM

38. yeah a common error f ths waz my theesus i wud prrofred more

But since it ain't, I don't. At any rate, it is a bit of shit to take from someone who cannot seem to find the shift key.

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Response to grasswire (Reply #37)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:08 PM

42. The Midway Rebel did it again.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #42)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:16 PM

44. Yes, your correct.

It is a tactic of my misinformationist strategy.


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Response to Octafish (Reply #42)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:25 PM

46. Thanks for calling attention to my thread, again.

And the fact the history profession by and large considers those obsessed with a JFK conspiracy as buffs and soon they will be regarded as quaint artifacts of the past.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #46)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:35 PM

48. You're wrong there, too.

As for giving attention to your post, that's the point. Your words show you standing on the wrong side of history. Your post also shows what kind of person you are.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #48)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:46 PM

50. Okey dokey.

Have you ever figured out if LHO was the hero in all this yet?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2232672

Its baffling that from my words on an internet forum dedicated to politics, over one topic, you can tell what kind of person I am and you still have been unable to solve that mystery.

That says more about you than me.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #50)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 10:59 AM

63. Figured you for a friend of zappaman. Apart from slurs, you also don't add or know much.

So, when was Lee Harvey Oswald convicted of a crime? The guy died in police custody before he could say much of anything, other than: "I'm a patsy."

That's the term used to describe the fall guy in a criminal conspiracy. Odd thing, the national press didn't follow up much on Oswald's final statements and activities, otherwise they'd have found:

1. Oswald tried to place a telephone call to John Hurt, an active-duty U.S. Army intelligence officer, but was prevented by authorities from completing the call.

2. Oswald wanted to telephone John Abt, a relatively obscure attorney known for defending criminal conspiracies.

3. Oswald had no nitrates on his face, which would've have been present had he fired a rifle.

4. The Chicago plot on the life of President John F. Kennedy was broken up, in part, by a tip from a man named "Lee."

5. The FBI Dallas office destroyed a note written by Oswald minutes after his death.


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Response to Octafish (Reply #63)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 12:00 PM

65. Speaking of "John Hurt"....

 



...Though probably not the same one, I watched the TV film Challenger last night, starring John Hurt, and was struck by all too familiar dynamics of the Cover-Up and couldn't help but think of the importance of your, sometimes 'thank-less' work, in exposing the elements of "cover-up" in the Kennedy assassination.

Mort Sahl was one of the counter-culture hero's of the day and along with Lenny Bruce and the Smothers Brothers, they suffered the consequences of speaking the truth. Like the "Challenger" disaster, people were convinced to overlook evidence of a level of decision-making far removed from the government.

As always: Keep up the Good Work!



.

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Response to CanSocDem (Reply #65)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 12:43 PM

66. Thank you, CanSocDem! Dr. Grover Proctor does an excellent job filling in the blanks...

The Raleigh Call

Dr. Grover B. Proctor, Jr.

Combined from two articles published in Spectator Magazine
July 17 and 24, 1980

One of the most interesting and potentially important aspects of the John Kennedy assassination may not have anything to do with the murder itself. A story concerning the actions of the accused assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald, has simmered on the back burner of the investigation since its discovery ten years ago, and is considered by leading assassination authorities to be a key in the unsolved mystery.

Oswald's movements and statements inside the Dallas jail up to the time of his murder have always been a huge mystery, and any clues to what happened during that time are vigorously sought by all researchers. So when a story surfaced that Oswald attempted to place a call from the jail to a person whose name had not otherwise entered the assassination investigation, it was big news.

In short, it is alleged that Oswald attempted to place a call to a John Hurt in Raleigh, North Carolina on Saturday evening, November 23, 1963, but was mysteriously prevented from completing the call. Though there is speculation that the call was incoming rather than outgoing (for example, a crank call to the jail from someone by that name), private and Congressional researchers believe Oswald, for whatever reasons, was the one attempting the call. The implications of that call have prompted former U.S. Intelligence officials to speculate on Oswald's possible link with intelligence agencies.


How We Know What We Know

On the night of November 23, 1963, two telephone operators were working the switchboard that controlled, among other Dallas municipal offices, the jail. One of the ladies, Mrs. Alveeta A. Treon, made a statement concerning the events of that night to assassination researcher and attorney Bernard Fensterwald some five years after the assassination, but then refused to sign it on advice from her lawyer, according to Fensterwald. The following is a condensation of that statement:

Mrs. Treon arrived for work at the switchboard between 10:15 and 10:35 that evening, and was told by her fellow worker, Mrs. Louise Swinney, that their supervisor had asked them to assist law enforcement officials to listen to a call that Lee Harvey Oswald would be making soon. Two men, that Mrs. Treon thinks might have been Secret Service agents, subsequently came into the switchboard area and were put in an adjacent room where they could monitor the expected call.

At about 10:45, the call from the jail came through, and both ladies rushed to take it. Mrs. Swinney handled the call, as it turned out; wrote down the information on the number Oswald wished to reach; and notified the two men of the call. Quoting from Mrs. Treon's statement: "I was dumbfounded at what happened next. Mrs. Swinney opened the key to Oswald and told him, 'I'm sorry, the number doesn't answer.' She then unplugged and disconnected Oswald without ever really trying to put the call through. A few moments later, Mrs. Swinney tore the page off her notation pad and threw it into the wastepaper basket."

After Mrs. Swinney left work at approximately 11:00 p.m., Mrs. Treon retrieved the piece of paper, and copied the information from it onto a telephone slip commonly used by the operators to record calls, so that she could keep it as a "souvenir."

Phone slipThat slip, which would turn up seven years later in a Freedom of Information suit brought by Chicago researcher Sherman H. Skolnick (a civil action filed in Federal District Court in Chicago, April 6, 1970, No. 70C 790), contains some startling things. It purports to show a collect call attempted from the jail by Lee Harvey Oswald to a John Hurt at 919-834-7430 and it gives another telephone number in the 919 Area Code, 833-1253. (The slip is reproduced in the Appendix of the 1975 book, Coup d'Etat in America by Canfield and Weberman, the first major work to deal with the "Raleigh call" and its implications for Oswald's links to intelligence agencies.)

What do we know about those two telephone numbers? The House Assassinations Committee gave one of its staffers, Surell Brady, reponsibility for investigating the "Raleigh Call." Though the committee's final report did not mention the call, Brady wrote a 28-page internal memorandum outling the results of their investigation of the incident.

In an insert after page 15 of the document, it is incorrectly reported that the two numbers listed on the telephone slip "were unpublished in 1963." This information was reported as having been supplied by Carolyn Rabon of Southern Bell Telephone Co. in 1978. However, a simple check of the December, 1962 Southern Bell telephone directory for Raleigh, North Carolina (which would have been current at the time of the assassination) and the December, 1963 directory (which would contain any new information and reflect any changes of listing status) shows that both numbers were published.

CONTINUED...

http://www.groverproctor.us/jfk/jfk80.html

PS: Thank you for the kind words, CanSocDem. The good doctor, and too many like him, has been hounded -- professionally -- in his work and private life for writing that Oswald was not alone. Ending his research and writing into the assassination of President Kennedy, he has moved from academia into the self-employed sector. Seems if Oswald was a lone nut, people would be able to say that without fear of retribution.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #63)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 01:20 PM

68. Facts not speculation.

1. LHO owned the rifle used to kill JFK.

2. LHO owned the pistol that killed Tippit.

3. LHO's palmprints were found on the rifle.

4. LHO was positively identified by a witness as the man firing the rifle.

5. No other bullet, or bullet fragment other than those that came from LHO's rifle have ever been found.

6. LHO is the only employee to leave the TSBD building after the shooting.

7. LHO was seen practicing dry firing the rifle over and over in the months prior to the shooting.

8. LHO admitted to his wife that he tried to assassinate General Walker

9. LHO's finger prints and shirt fibers were found on the "curtain rod" bag he used to transport the rifle.

10. LHO was a certified marksman with 8 to 11 seconds to fire the fatal shots at JFK.

So is LHO a hero or not?

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #19)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:49 PM

51. I am not impressed.

I know a retired history professor on another forum who suffers from the worst cognitive dissonance I've ever seen. He is quite capable of wasting incredible amounts of everyone's time arguing over points he simply refuses to understand.

History professors have their blind spots and biases just like everyone else.

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Response to Raksha (Reply #51)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 11:15 PM

53. Thanks for your honest opinions.

And the lack of personal attack.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #18)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 04:20 PM

20. What in the world is a Mid way Rebel?

A rebel from the south?
Midway?







I find that interesting. that someone would call themselves that but others never really 'stopped' bush or were warriors for pretzels against the establishment in any of their posts.

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #20)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:33 PM

24. I find it interesting all you have in this debate is personal attack and innuendo.

An thanks for taking the time to contemplate the syllogism and semiotics of my DU screen name. Even more flattery. You guys just do not know when to quit.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #24)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:35 PM

26. OK.. What is a midway rebel?

In the venue of American history? We would all like to know..... Put it in Civil war terms please.

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #26)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:42 PM

27. You should look into the actual facts of the JFK assassination as earnestly as you have my DU sn.

Seriously. All of you.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #27)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:44 PM

29. What grades to do teach history?

and in what part of the country?


You don't need to give me a state

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #29)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:57 PM

34. Kind of creepy.

As fuck. That you would want to know personal information about me. Why does that matter to you?

Today, I guess I teach whatever grade and state you happen to be in.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #34)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:59 PM

36. Ha.....LOL

figures

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #36)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 04:29 AM

59. Thanks Iching

 

The replies have me LOL.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:42 PM

28. Why was he black listed in a country that claims to grant all Americans the right to speak their

minds? That is precisely the kind of speech protected by the 1st Amendment.

Some interesting statements from him. He speaks for a majority of people.

Land of the Free. Another deception.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #28)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:49 PM

30. Because his tirades against the WC simply were not funny anymore.

He is a good example of how some people become obsessed with things to the point of detriment.

Nobody silenced him anymore than they silenced Jackie Mason.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #30)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:52 PM

32. So you're FOR censorship? I'm for the exact opposite, MORE speech. Those who support censorship

have always had something to hide, without fail.

Thanks for your response, not surprising at all.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #32)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:58 PM

35. No, I'm for night club owners booking the acts they want.

If you call that censorship, fine. I call it show biz.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #35)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 08:40 PM

40. That's what the blacklisters in the 1950s said also.

Radicals being shut out of the entertainment industry -- that is just show biz. Is that what you teach your claimed "history students."

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Response to former9thward (Reply #40)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:12 PM

43. So....Elia Kazan and Bud Schulberg were in on the JFK assassination too?!

My gawd! Just where does this conspiracy thing end, children?

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #43)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 10:27 AM

61. I pray you are just an internet "teacher".

You logic skills are so flawed I really pity if you are around real students.

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Response to former9thward (Reply #61)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 10:41 AM

62. + at least 16

"your a twoofer arn't ya"

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Response to former9thward (Reply #61)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 01:22 PM

69. Thanks, my students appreciate your empathy. nt

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #35)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 02:25 AM

55. I'm for night club owners who support the Constitution of the US and who are not influenced by

political entities to stifle speech.

Sahl was on the right track and it appears he made some people with something to hide, very, very nervous.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #55)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 03:55 AM

57. Yeah, I'm sure the night club owners were in on the JFK assassination too.





:

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #57)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 11:28 AM

64. Are you? I don't know who was in on the JFK assassination, yet.

I do know a little of the history of Blacklisting in the media and of entertainers who were blacklisted for their political views. Too bad you haven't delved into that history a little bit, you might see the potential for someone like Sahl becoming a target of it.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #64)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 01:26 PM

70. Well, if you can even insinuate that 60s club owners were part of the JFK conspiracy...

you could probably write a book and sell it to an audience eager to buy it.

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Response to The Midway Rebel (Reply #30)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:55 PM

33. So Morten Sahl equals Jackie Mason

interesting.

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #33)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 04:31 AM

60. But But But

 

Did you notice the impressive use of smilies?

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #28)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 05:52 PM

31. He was on Ed Sulivan's show all the time

when I was growing up.

After he said the Warren commision was a lie
he went from making 1 million a year to 19 thousand.


He was the first intellectual political comedian and even gave Lenny Bruce his start.

He was blacklisted just like others were in the 50s but now it was that you said too much on what you saw, investigated and witnessed.

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Response to Ichingcarpenter (Reply #31)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:02 PM

41. The Blacklists of the late 40's and early 50's were political.

Not talent driven.

People lost their livelihoods based on if they flirted with being a "commie," or if they wouldn't name names of those HUAC and McCarthy claimed were commies.

HUAC went downhill after their chairman was shown to be so corrupt he stank on ice. (J. Parnell Thomas)
McCarthy destroyed himself, especially on Murrow's program and in the Army hearings.
"Red Channels," the publication that was touted to be *THE* authority on who was a commie in Hollywood and who wasn't, went down in flames during John Henry Faulk's lawsuit against them, their sloppy "research" and mistakes were exposed.

Mort Sahl wasn't on a political "blacklist," the word got around that he was simply BORING.

People went to see comedians to get a laugh.
Not be lectured about the comedian's pet politics or cause.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #28)

Thu Dec 5, 2013, 09:50 AM

72. Sahl set up the Johnny Carson - Jim Garrison interview

Johnny Carson took a public relations hit for the way he came off in that interview and Mort Sahl was never invited back to the Tonight Show. Which, given Carson's clout, also goes a long way to explain the backlash Sahl received.

Steve Allen, the original host of the Tonight Show, had another talk show at this time and invited both Jim Garrison and Mort Sahl on. Unfortunately, and most likely conveniently, Steve Allen also invited wingnut 'B-1' Bob Dornan on that panel. Dornan effectively derailed that interview and Mort Sahl's career had been pretty well derailed too.

Here's an excellent piece on Sahl from 9 years ago in January...
"Heeeere's Justice!" 37 years ago this month, Johnny Carson spent 50 minutes with New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison

Sahl is one of my favourite undersung heroes of the Sixties, for having spent the capital of a successful career in the Quixotic pursuit of justice for the murderers of America.

From the cover of Time


to "conspiracy monger"


That strikes me as the trajectory of an honourable man.

There's an interview with Sahl a couple of months later in 1968, before the epochal one-two of Dr King and Robert Kennedy, that is as prophetic as anything I've read from that time:

ARGO: Why is the truth behind the assassination of President Kennedy the last chance of America for its survival?

SAHL: Because the evidence developed by District Attorney Garrison indicates that certain people had to take President Kennedy's life in order to control ours...


http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2005/01/heeeeres-justice.html

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Response to MinM (Reply #72)

Thu Dec 5, 2013, 11:23 AM

73. BTW you can follow Mort Sahl on twitter

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Response to MinM (Reply #72)

Thu Dec 5, 2013, 11:55 AM

74. Thank you so much, I definitely agreee with you that this was an honorable man.

In a society that is apathetic about justice, it is extremely difficult to have a conscience and to feel a duty to insist on it.

It speaks volumes about this one that a citizen has to remain silent when they have questions about events as huge as this one, or suffer extreme consequences.

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Response to MinM (Reply #72)

Wed Dec 18, 2013, 09:38 AM

77. Outstanding post!

Integrity.

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Response to MinM (Reply #72)

Sat Dec 29, 2018, 09:22 PM

78. Mort has been working since 1950!

 

And he's always fresh... I had to go to SF to meet him on 3-4 occasions. He was nice enough to exchange my work for his, with signatures, but also a very sincere, and concerned conversation.

After one show, the producer left his phone on, and he's the same man off the stage. I remember him saying "Look what they're doing in America" and talking the entire time about how to make the show better. I never saw a man more dedicated to humanity, yet, taking ALL the risks when he was on top.

Remember, he was the first guy to really nail it to Joe McCarthy...

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 09:22 PM

45. Nothing will happen unless we have a REAL MEDIA

As long as we have the facade of a media, the people will stay fooled by propaganda.

I disagree with Archae. Throughout history, lambasting rulers has been the stuff of theater and humor.
I agree with Octafish;



" 'ARGO: Why is the truth behind the assassination of President Kennedy the last chance of America for its survival?

SAHL: Because the evidence developed by District Attorney Garrison indicates that certain people had to take President Kennedy's life in order to control ours. In other words, as Richard Starnes of the New York World-Telegram said, the shots in Dallas were the opening shots of World War III. There's been a great change in this country since Kennedy. I'm afraid a great deal of our hope was interred with his remains.'

CONTINUED...

"http://www.maebrussell.com/Mort%20Sahl/Mort%20Sahl%20-%20Argo.html



This is a man: Mort Sahl was and is unafraid to tell the truth -- even when doing so cost him his livelihood.

Of course, the truth we've learned and the history we've lived since then only support Mort Sahl. "

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Response to upi402 (Reply #45)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 12:51 PM

67. Thank you, upi402.

There's more to write on the Duquesne conference, including the media's role in America's incipient idiocracy.

"An agent told me: 'If you don't say, "Oswald did it," you're not going to get on television." -- Lisa Pease

Thank Moon and all his minions we have DU -- and thinking DUers.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Sun Dec 1, 2013, 10:13 PM

52. K & R.

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Thu Dec 5, 2013, 09:16 PM

75. "My Grandfather Came from Lithuania--Though Lou Dobbs Tried to Stop Him"

August 25 / 26, 2007
"My Grandfather Came from Lithuania--Though Lou Dobbs Tried to Stop Him"
Mort Sahl's Punchline
By PAUL KRASSNER

On May 11, 2007, Mort Sahl turned eighty. He was a pioneer in stand-up comedy. He broke through the tradition of jokes about airplane food, Asian drivers, booze and frigid wives, instead sharing his wit and insights about political hypocrisy, racism, marijuana laws and monogamy. I first met Sahl in 1953 when he was a guest speaker in a course I was taking at the New School for Social Research. I was inspired by his satirical approach to serious issues.

"Every word I do is improvised," he once told me. "I don't rehearse anything. I start it on stage."

In the beginning, though, he would write key words on a rolled-up newspaper, which became his trademark prop. In 1960 he wrote jokes for presidential candidate John Kennedy, and Sahl's picture graced the cover of Time magazine in August during the conventions. When Kennedy was killed in 1963, Sahl endangered his career and was blacklisted as a result of becoming an associate of New Orleans D.A. Jim Garrison in his investigation of the JFK assassination...

http://www.counterpunch.org/2007/08/25/mort-sahl-s-punchline/

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Response to MinM (Reply #75)

Fri Dec 6, 2013, 12:48 PM

76. ‘To all you with the guns out there. You may be able to slay the dreamer, but you haven’t slain the

‘To all you with the guns out there. You may be able to slay the dreamer, but you haven’t slain the dream.’
-Bobby Kennedy

(from your link)

Thanks!

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Response to mother earth (Original post)

Mon Jan 25, 2021, 01:22 PM

79. WOW!

 

Not only an amazing interview, but a nice thread overall!

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