Squeeling with glee over the Pope while condemning Duck Dude...

[Demo_Chris]

I've got to say that this seems hypocritical and silly to me.

Duck man is homophobic and misogynistic, but he has got NOTHING compared to the Pope. And where Duck dude is criticized for wanting kids to marry too young, and some have even called his position pedophilia, this pope is the leader of the largest child rapist support club in history.

The Pope thinks women cannot be priests because they are inferior and dirty and God wouldn't like it, but he thinks child rapists are just fine as priests. He believes that Homosexuals should be kept away from children, but child raping priests are just fine. He is a man who thinks that the deaths of MILLIONS due to AIDS is bad, but condoms are worse. And we have people here praising him.

I think it's perfectly fine that we criticize Duck Dude here. The guy is a homophobic sexist jackass. But if we are going to criticize the one, we damn well should be condemning the bigger asshole. And if nothing else, can we at least move these threads into the religion forum where they properly belong.

/rant

[Lex]

1. Do you think people here support ALL the Pope's ideas?

Or are just happy about him speaking up about poverty and class issues?

[theHandpuppet]

7. What would you think...

Last edited Tue Dec 31, 2013, 05:21 PM - Edit history (1)

... if the Pope spoke about class issues but was an avowed and unapologetic racist? Do you think we would see threads on DU like "I love this Pope!" or "Pope Francis for President!"? But somehow it's okay because Francis is a bigot against "only" women and GLBTs?

[LittleBlue]

2. I think most support the pope's economic stance

not necessarily everything else.

And I don't think it's because he's the pope, it's because so many others are silent on the issues of wealth disparity and marginalization of the poor. When the pope speaks out, his voice is magnified by the conspicuous silence of powerful secular leaders.

Even though I'm an atheist, I recognize the importance of someone who is there to give moral guidance. Someone who is forbidden to accumulate personal wealth or have children, and therefore has no profit motive.

[theHandpuppet]

9. Oppression by gender is a fundamental part of economic oppression

Millions of women around the globe -- and by extension, millions of their children -- are sentenced to lives of poverty and misery because they do not have access to contraception, health care and abortion. Nor will they ever see economic equality as long as they are considered inferior simply because they are women. If Francis truly wishes to impart some moral guidance, he can start by making it clear that women and GLBTs are equal partners in the battle against economic disparity.

[LittleBlue]

12. I believe he appealed to atheists just last week

to unite for peace.

[theHandpuppet]

13. Um... and that has what to do with my post?

Or would you rather just avoid the issues I was discussing?

[LittleBlue]

16. I was answering this

he can start by making it clear that women and GLBTs are equal partners in the battle against economic disparity.

I thought he made it clear that even if you were an atheist, you're welcome to join with him to fight for these issues. Well, here's the exact quote:

"I invite even non-believers to desire peace. (Join us) with your desire, a desire that widens the heart. Let us all unite, either with prayer or with desire, but everyone, for peace," he said, drawing sustained applause from the crowd.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/26/pope-francis-atheists_n_4504508.html

My point in posting this is to point out that he doesn't seem to exclude anyone from supporting the issues he raises.

[theHandpuppet]

17. Um... so you assume women and GLBTs are atheists?

I'm sorry... your post did nothing to address the issues I raised.

[idwiyo]

29. He invites even non-believers to desire peace? As if non-belivers in general don't?

Never mind "even".

Must be because we are lowest of the low warmongering dregs of human society who can't possibly "desire peace" unless invited to do so by bigoted homophobic forced-birther.

[Bluenorthwest]

66. Wow. Unreal. Francis says my family is 'a destructive attack on God's plan' and he

says it is the idea of Satan, 'the Father of Lies'. That's what you are trying to distract from.
And not all gay people and choice proponents are athestis. Prejudice upon prejudice among the Francis fans.... parfaits of prejudice

[joshcryer]

63. I doubt the duck dude is for shitting on the poor.

He'd probably agree with the Pope's sentiments.

[Richardo]

3. Such a courageous ground-breaking stance

[hrmjustin]

4. I saw something about the pope saying about gays adopting is bad. that was heartbreaking to hear.

[theHandpuppet]

6. But not a surprise

http://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20131230/local/lgbt-federation-in-argentina-not-surprised-by-popes-comments-on-maltas-gay-adoptions-legislation.500822#.UsKxcq8o6M8
Argentina LGBT federation 'not surprised' by Pope's comments on Malta's gay adoptions legislation

(excerpt)
"This case, demonstrates yet another time - as we have repeatedly said - that there is no will from Pope Francis’ part to change the doctrinal position of the Catholic Church with respect to the family and the lack of recognition of gay or lesbian parents.

"It is important to remember that during the Debate on Marriage Equality in Argentina, Jorge Bergoglio, as Cardinal of Buenos Aires undertook a war in God’s name against what he considered a devil’s plan to destroy the Argentine society."

Mr Paulón said Mgr Scicluna's declaration was no surprise as it clearly showed the true position of Pope Francis with respect to sexual diversity.

He said the most painful fact was Pope Francis’ silence in view of the increasing penalization and persecution of homosexuals around the world, especially in Asia, Africa and Eastern Europe. "Unfortunately there was not a single word from Pope Francis on India’s Court decision, the restrictive law in Uganda and prohibition of homosexual propaganda in Russia.”

[Bluenorthwest]

67. He has called such adoption 'child abuse' and 'discrimination in advance against the

child'. The OP makes strong points about the context of any RCC cleric accusing others of child abuse. Jebus said something about dealing with the plank in your own eye prior to bitching about the speck in your neighbors....Francis has not done one action to protect the children in his Chruch, not one thing has been done.

[Drew Richards]

5. Heard the same thing on fox 5 at the garage the other day...FoxRage oh my.

[SidDithers]

8. +1...

It's hugely hypocritical.

Sid

[1000words]

10. Folks usually see what they want in order to preserve an invested narrative.

Others are overcome with simple wishful-thinking. Look hard enough, hypocrisy is everywhere ... and everyone.

[cali]

11. and I've got to say that comparing the two seems ignorant as hell

First of all the Pope has said "who am I to judge someone who is gay?" Pretty different than duck dude. Secondly, the Pope has focused not on the social issues of homosexuality and women in the church but on economic injustice. Thirdly, although I disagree with the Pope on social issues, he sure as fuck hasn't said what you claim he's said.

[Live and Learn]

48. +1 nt

[joshcryer]

64. He's the fucking Pope, he can reverse DOCTRINE instantly.

Therefore his "who am I to judge someone who is gay?" is simply responded with "you are the fucking goddamn fucking Pope, and you can reverse said DOCTRINE instantly."

That's who the fuck he is.

It's a really waffling position to be sure. He doesn't want to offend certain sects in the Church but he doesn't want to do shit about it either.

[Bluenorthwest]

68. The difference is purely sartorial. Your wee excerpt is not even an accurate

quotation. That's how dismissive you are of this issue. You don't even bother to get your own quotes right. That 'who am I to judge' was not applied to all who are gay. You know that. It was part of a long rant against what Francis calls 'the gay lobby' which he said 'is very bad'. The 'gay lobby' attack was delivered on his private jet. For the poor of course, such jets are for the poor, always.
Francis is Phil in silk and with short hair. Two rich hypocrites, both in clear violation of many of Jesus teachings, both accusing others of that of which they are their own are in fact guilty of, predation, greed, mendacity...

Word games are cutesy stuff, but the fact is discrimination and inequal treatment is the ulimate form of judgement. A person who says I am unworthy of equality is judging me, not matter what self serving rhetoric that judging hypocrite wraps it up in. He judges us unworthy of marriage, he fought marriage equality in Argentian by calling it Satan's idea.
Talk about devils and point at the gays, but that's not judgement? Refuse us equality and fight that equality in secular law, but that's not judgement? Explain to us how one can say 'you are not my equal, you should not have the rights I have' and not be judging. Can't wait to see this explaination.

[pnwmom]

14. I wasn't aware that Duke Dude had put economic justice at the front and center

of his public concerns.

That's why many people here have been praising the Pope.

But you say: "The Pope thinks women cannot be priests because they are inferior and dirty and God wouldn't like it, but he thinks child rapists are just fine as priests. He believes that Homosexuals should be kept away from children, but child raping priests are just fine."

Based on your lies and hyperbole, your own bigoted hate approaches Duck Dude's.

[Demo_Chris]

18. Neither has this Pope. He is sitting on TRILLIONS...

Enough wealth to literally feed the entire globe, and if invested perhaps permanently, but he'd rather live in a palace and offer vague criticisms of others.

And in any case economic justice is meaningless without equal rights. You want to end poverty? Give women reproductive freedom everywhere on earth.

But then, I would be happy if the Champion of Child rape just released the names and crimes all of the tens of thousands of Priests who were involved in raping and torturing children. But he's not, he is sheltering them and allowing the sexual carnage to continue. Because he would rather have a kiddie rapist as a priest than a woman or an openly gay man. Fuck him.

[pnwmom]

20. Nonsense. The wealth of the Catholic Church is spread out over the world,

in countless parishes. Even if they were all shut down today, there would not be "enough wealth to literally feed the entire world."

And you obviously haven't been paying any attention to Pope Francis, just your preconceived notions about popes in general, or you would realize he doesn't live in a palace, but in a simple guest-house with ordinary priests.

[Demo_Chris]

21. Mitt Romney doesn't live in a mansion, just a simple room. He's humble you see. nt

[Brainstormy]

41. The guest house is a nice PR touch

got to hand it to him. But while most church finances our secret, most modest estimates of the wealth of Vatican City alone put it at the 18th wealthiest nation. This doesn't include ongoing or future endowments, land, etc. And as to the history of how that wealth was acquired, an adjective like "sordid" is only the beginning.

[pnwmom]

43. I'd like a link to those "modest estimates." Do you have any idea

how small Vatican City is? That's just nuts.

[Brainstormy]

75. Herre's just one

http://www.nationsencyclopedia.com/economies/Europe/Vatican-City-POVERTY-AND-WEALTH.html


I found several.

[pnwmom]

77. That statistic also has no source or explanation as to how they came up with it.

"It is estimated" tells us nothing. This is a user-based encyclopedia, so it is only as good as the anonymous people who contributed to it.

Even so, the statistic is about estimated per capita "wealth," not total wealth as you implied.

[Bluenorthwest]

69. The Vatican itself has prime commercial real estate spread out over the best bits of

the world, that's for sure. The Bulgari Shop in London, for example is held 'for the poor' in trust I suppose. The Vatican is one of the world's largest real estate owners, also one of the primary holders of the world's other investment vehicles, stocks, bonds, precious metals, you name it, Francis collects rent on it. The Archbishop of NY, the Bigot Tim Dolan is the single largest owner of NYC real estate there is. The local Chruch holdings are in his name. This is Doan, who paid off the child abusers, then lied about it, then got caught lying and is stil in power because Francis seems to like him. He sure speaks freely for Francis without Francis correcting his criminal ass.

[neverforget]

23. Lol! Trillions? Billions? Yes. Trillions? No.

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/14/16957985-inside-the-vatican-the-8-billion-global-institution-where-nuns-answer-the-phones?lite

In his homily at Mass late Wednesday, Pope Benedict XVI spoke of “sins against the unity of the Church,” hinting at the office politics of an organization worth at least $8 billion but which features a switchboard operated by nuns.

[pnwmom]

32. By way of comparison, Bill Gates has more than 67 billion even after

giving away billions to his foundation.

And the Church's wealth is spread out over parishes all over the world.

[warrant46]

28. Catholic Popes are the modern day version of the anti-Christ

[pnwmom]

34. Anti-Catholic bigots have been preaching this line for centuries.

The KKK, for example, said this about Popes.

[Bradical79]

37. What about non-Catholic Popes? -nt

[kcr]

15. Does the Duck Dude do the same things the Pope is being praised for?

If not, it doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense to compare the two.

[Johonny]

22. because you know it is hard to find threads condemning the catholic churches various stances here

that upper corner google site search says it is not so hard...

[Vashta Nerada]

24. It sucks seeing Democrats on a Democratic website support a misogynistic homophobe.

The Pope.

But hey, his economic stance is superb. And he drives a Renault with 983745903745879034 miles on it. And he's Batman at night, sneaking out into the darkness to save one homeless person at a time.

[warrant46]

30. He's all that and more

The friendly face of evil

[phleshdef]

60. Its always good when we see formidable institutions move the right way on some things.

We should still protest bigotry against GLBT and anything that attempts to stifle a woman's right to choose. But I see nothing wrong with supporting a person or an institution on an issue when he/she/they is/are getting it right.

[Bluenorthwest]

70. I think that what you propose takes more effort than most are putting into it.

If you decide to both protest and support the same person and institution on various matters, I suggest that a certain skill level might be required in order to avoid seeming to dismiss the sheer bigotry and sexism on the way to praising the rhetoric about economic issues.
It is for example, not really honest to judge a group as unworthy of equal rights in the eyes of God and claim that you do not judge them. That's the Pope's stance, his judgemental actions are simply not judgmental. When he says 'You should not have the rights others have' that is not judgemental? Does saying 'who am I to judge' really mitigate the facts of his actions, which are extremely judgemental? I sure don't think so.

[Vashta Nerada]

76. Did you support Pope Benedict?

Because he spoke out against capitalism many times as well.

[Drew Richards]

25. Funny I read the boards daily and I dont know of anyone "squealing with glee" over this pope

I do see many, rightly heralding this man, for this man being different than the one before him for coming out with more populous ideas. It seems to me you are the one being hypocritical or maybe just impatient...even Obama could not wave a magic wand and change all past injustices in a day...how about you give him some time and see what kind of Pope he becomes.

[notadmblnd]

26. Do you have the links to the pope quoting what you claim are his stated positions?

[warrant46]

31. Here you go

Google

www.google.com

[pnwmom]

35. You won't find those quotes there, but you'll find plenty of anti-Catholic bigotry. nt

[notadmblnd]

36. NO, the OP brought it here, the OP needs to prove it.

other than that, they have no credibility.

BTW, I am no supporter of any religious figure by any means.

[Shivering Jemmy]

42. Lame

Failed to even post a real hyperlink.

[warrant46]

50. Here you Go 2

https://www.google.com/

[idwiyo]

44. Google is your friend. Actions speak louder than words.

Have a look at what he does vs what he says (or what others think he said).

[notadmblnd]

47. Thanks for your advice.

Yeah, this is my first trip on the intertubes and I wasn't aware of the google so you'll have to pardon me for asking someone who came here and posted crazy sounding accusations against another person to provide some proof of those accusations.

[idwiyo]

49. Well, did you google it? Took me less than 1 minute to find proof to those "crazy" accusations".

Don't know about you but if I see something that sounds crazy I do my own research. Just in case.

[notadmblnd]

52. yes, I did. I googled exactly the following words

"The Pope thinks women cannot be priests because they are inferior and dirty and God wouldn't like it, but he thinks child rapists are just fine as priests. He believes that Homosexuals should be kept away from children, but child raping priests are just fine. He is a man who thinks that the deaths of MILLIONS due to AIDS is bad, but condoms are worse"

Here's my result (0.35 seconds)
"Homosexuals" (and any subsequent words) was ignored because we limit queries to 32 words.
Search Results

Squeeling with glee over the Pope while condemning Duck Dude ...
www.democraticunderground.com › ... › General Discussion (Forum)
19 hours ago - 7 posts - ‎6 authors
The Pope thinks women cannot be priests because they are inferior and dirty and God wouldn't like it, but he thinks child rapists are just fine as ...

In order to show you the most relevant results, we have omitted some entries very similar to the 1 already displayed.
If you like, you can repeat the search with the omitted results included.

https://www.google.com/search?q=%22The+Pope+thinks+women+cannot+be+priests+because+they+are+inferior+and+dirty+and+God+wouldn%27t+like+it%2C+but+he+thinks+child+rapists+are+just+fine+as+priests.+He+believes+that+Homosexuals+should+be+kept+away+from+children%2C+but+child+raping+priests+are+just+fine.+He+is+a+man+who+thinks+that+the+deaths+of+MILLIONS+due+to+AIDS+is+bad%2C+but+condoms+are+worse%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US fficial&client=firefox-a
sults:

[idwiyo]

54. Translation: What I don't know can't upset me.

Helpful tips:

pope+francis+gay+marriage

pope+francis+women+ordination

pope+francis+pedophilia

pope+francis+excommunicating+priests

[notadmblnd]

56. Why are you so enthusiastic in defending the hyperbole of the OP

Who I'll point out hasn't bothered to respond. You and I both know that the OP's words are blatantly false. Are you an alter-ego of theirs or just a tag team partner?

[idwiyo]

59. New pope is a homophobic forced-birther and protector of institutionalised pedophilia.

Actions speak louder than words.

[mr blur]

27. It's simple - just don't give a fuck what he says about anything.

He's about as enlightened as your average Islamist Fundie. And just as poisonous.

[idwiyo]

45. +1

[Le Taz Hot]

33. One more time

for those who didn't catch a clue the first time -- utilizing phrases like "squeeling (sic) with glee . . ." destroys your credibility and makes you sound hysterical. Never mind that it completely undermines your argument."

[notadmblnd]

38. We need a SMH icon

Cause all I can do is Shake My Head at what that person posted.

Or maybe even a Charlie Brown "good grief" smiley.

[Le Taz Hot]

40. It dumbs down the board as a whole.

I hardly ever post anymore because there's nothing to post to. Just shit like this.

[notadmblnd]

46. So true.

I've been here a good 10 years and I know you have too. But I'm afraid that the atmosphere of hate and intolerance that has been created here the past couple of years will cause DU to lose all credibility.

Then I think; that maybe it's these folks real agenda?

[BainsBane]

39. Condemning the Pope while jumping all over feminists on DU

seems hypocritical to me.

[liberal N proud]

51. lol

[Deep13]

53. People aren't lauding the pope because of his stance...

...on gay rights or other gender matters--there is precious little reason to do so--but because of his excoriation of capitalist values and his embracing of Christian humility.

I really don't care about that duck guy. I had never heard of him before all this hoopla. I will note, however, that he did not attack homosexuality as conduct, but homosexuals personally--comparing them to pedophiles and animal-fuckers. Also, he defended racial segregation.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

55. Yeah, I'm a little bored today, too.

[840high]

57. I don't squeel. Unrec.

[Cha]

61. You probably don't

squeal either.. I know I don't.

[MattSh]

58. Oh God...

Not this shit again...

[BobUp]

62. Excuse me but

you left racist out of robertson's tool kit.

[tavernier]

65. I love these discussions where body parts are strewn all over

the bloody screen. Word grenades whizzing through the air, accusation and insult bombs exploding by the dawn's early light.

Nice to see DU alive and well on this first day of 2014.

Happy New Year my cantankerous, entertaining friends!!

[bemildred]

71. Your premise is false. The Pope gets plenty of flack here.

(I mean i see your argument, but the premise is false, the Pope and the Catholic Church come in for plenty of flack here. We support what the new pope is saying, and we do not support the Duck Dude, that is all there is to it.)

[Drahthaardogs]

72. Your OP and follow-ups are just nonsensical rantings of a misinformed person

1) The reasons you give for WHY the RCC will not ordain women is WRONG. Please look it up.

2) You ascertation that the Pope can change infallible Doctrine is WRONG. Please look it up.

3) Your statement that this new Pope thinks child rapists are fine as priests is WRONG. Please look it up.

4) Your statement about Francis's stance on condoms is WRONG. Please look it up.

5) Your fallacious argument about the Church coffers is wrong. Please look it up.

6) This Pope has done more to clean up the Vatican Bank in the last six months than the previous 25 years.

Why don't you take about 45 minutes and actually educate yourself on Church teachings and Doctrine? There is lots wrong with the Church, but how can anyone debate your positions, which are fallacious?

Now, please do not bother responding to my post, because I will not engage you. You obviously have NO IDEA what the you are talking about, yet that does not stop you from making an OP rife with misinformation. You then follow it up with , absolute bunk, bunk, and more bunk which you defend passionately and with great vigor.

If you want to have an intelligent discussion on where and why the Church's teaching are antiquated or perhaps just wrong, you let me know. If you continue to post outright lies, leave me out.

On EDIT:

I will provide a link to help you get started

http://catholicism.about.com/od/beliefsteachings/f/Women_Priests.htm

[treestar]

73. Major difference

The Pope is saying good things, not harping on the opposition to gays, limitations on women.

Second, why are you blaming the Pope for pedophile priests? That's too easy. The people to blame are pedophlies, priests or not.

[KittyWampus]

74. Straw Man, no DU'ers are "squeeling with glee" over the Pope. So your entire OP is off base.

Overwhelmingly, DU'ers simply appreciate the Pope's emphasis on economic justice.

That said, I would argue with Pope Francis that to further the cause of economic justice, the Catholic Church has to recognize the value in allowing women to use birth control even IF the Church would only go so far as to allow it within confines of marriage. At least it'd be a start in making Church dogma less hypocritical.

There is nothing in Christ's teaching that suggests enjoying sex while not wanting children is anything less than healthy.