AP: Why Malaysia Airlines Jet Might Have Disappeared

[Hissyspit]

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/why-malaysia-airlines-jet-might-have-disappeared

WHY MALAYSIA AIRLINES JET MIGHT HAVE DISAPPEARED
By SCOTT MAYEROWITZ
— Mar. 8, 2014 8:07 PM EST

NEW YORK (AP) — The most dangerous parts of a flight are takeoff and landing. Rarely do incidents happen when a plane is cruising seven miles above the earth.

So the disappearance of a Malaysia Airlines jet well into its flight Saturday morning over the South China Sea has led aviation experts to assume that whatever happened was quick and left the pilots no time to place a distress call.

It could take investigators months, if not years, to determine what happened to the Boeing 777 flying from Malaysia's largest city of Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

"At this early stage, we're focusing on the facts that we don't know," said Todd Curtis, a former safety engineer with Boeing who worked on its 777 wide-body jets and is now director of the Airsafe.com Foundation.

If there was a minor mechanical failure — or even something more serious like the shutdown of both of the plane's engines — the pilots likely would have had time to radio for help. The lack of a call "suggests something very sudden and very violent happened," said William Waldock, who teaches accident investigation at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Prescott, Ariz.

It initially appears that there was either an abrupt breakup of the plane or something that led it into a quick, steep dive. Some experts even suggested an act of terrorism or a pilot purposely crashing the jet.

"Either you had a catastrophic event that tore the airplane apart, or you had a criminal act," said Scott Hamilton, managing director of aviation consultancy Leeham Co. "It was so quick and they didn't radio."

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[JaneyVee]

1. Any meteor sightings? Even one the size of a golf ball could wreck the plane.

They travel thousands of miles per hour.

[Cha]

2. This is so strange.. those poor People. May

Rest in Peace~

[elleng]

3. Passport Theft Adds to Mystery of Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/09/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-flight.html?hp&_r=0

[lostincalifornia]

4. Based on the recent events in western China, terrorism is a definite possibility. However, in most

Cases terrorists want credit for their actions, and up to now that isn't happening

It is an awful accident. The only thing that can be said is that it appears to have happened so fast that hopefully there was no suffering for the passengers, though the families will suffer terribly

[calimary]

12. That's the part that bothers me.

And there's a second report as well.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014749520

[malaise]

46. The two passengers checked in together and both were heading for Amsterdam

The plot thickens but we'll soon see them since there are CCTV tapes from the airport.

[seattledo]

5. Grasping at straws to blame anyone but themselves

This really is getting embarrassing.

[Lex]

6. What do you think happened?

It's weird there was no may-day call.

[A HERETIC I AM]

7. Why would you say that?

Last edited Sun Mar 9, 2014, 12:16 AM - Edit history (1)

With no evidence, no crashed plane to look at, no CVR or FDR recovered and no radio calls, they got diddly at the moment.

If they seem to be grasping at straws its because that's all there is within reach.

[AtheistCrusader]

28. Because it's an ususual mode of failure.

Even with a total loss of power, they can pop out a ram air turbine to keep the thing going, if they can glide at all. It will provide hydraulic and electrical power on that model aircraft.

A complete lack of radio calls is unusual. Not impossible, but unusual.

[RKP5637]

29. +1, n/t

[A HERETIC I AM]

40. That doesn't address the comment in post 5

[AtheistCrusader]

42. I don't think I followed the comment chain correctly.

That post was.... premature. At best. No one knows why yet.

[WinkyDink]

9. You said this in another thread. Why would you think the company would be responsible for a "very

violent" act? Unless you mean the security screenings were criminally inept.

My bet (and I've read extensively on airplane crashes), because of no pilot message, is an explosive device, aka, terrorism.

[Lex]

11. But usually the terrorist group wants recognition.

It's very odd.

[WinkyDink]

49. Who says it's a group?

[Lex]

60. The point is exactly the same whether one

Or a group. Or whether they are tall or short or medium height.

[Logical]

16. Ok,genius, what is your prediction so I can bookmark it. nt

[awoke_in_2003]

24. There are extremely few...

mechanical or structural events that would prohibit them at least getting a mayday out.

[Jenoch]

47. Who are "themselves"?

[KoKo]

8. It's a Boeing but seems to be an older model 777 not the Dreamliner

which has had battery problems but not any kind of in air disappearance like this one.

Does seem a strange event.

Maybe the passenger list will reveal more about who was on the plane for it to be a terrorist event.

Sad for all onboard though.

[okaawhatever]

18. I think you may be confusing the 777 with the 787. It was the 787 that had the battery problems. nt

[cherokeeprogressive]

43. I think you should read KoKo's post again...

KoKo's post stated:

"It's a Boeing but seems to be an older model 777 not the Dreamliner" (The Dreamliner being the 787)

then continues with

"which has had battery problems..." (meaning the Dreamliner has had battery problems)

[okaawhatever]

44. Oh, okay got it. Thanks nt

[dreamnightwind]

10. No flash was seen

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/09/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-flight.html?hp&_r=0

Using a system that looks for flashes around the world, the Pentagon reviewed preliminary surveillance data from the area where the plane disappeared and saw no evidence of an explosion, said an American government official who spoke on the condition of anonymity because the subject matter is classified.

[DallasNE]

35. A Small Explosion, Like A Shoe Bomb, Likely Would Not Produce A Detectible Flash

Outside the aircraft. They are designed for instant depressurization and catastrophic failure. But even that would not instantly impact the pilot, giving them time for a mayday call but little else.

[Major Nikon]

48. Instant depressurization requires a big hole

Even then it's not necessarily catastrophic.

[Agschmid]

56. See this...

Aloha Air Flight 243... Only one fatality and this was a severe mid-air decompression that landed.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aloha_Airlines_Flight_243

[Major Nikon]

57. I'm familiar with it

Depressurization is certainly not a catastrophic event in and of itself. The structural integrity of the airframe is the primary requirement for keeping the plane from augering in.

[octoberlib]

13. Just grabbed this off of Twitter.

https://twitter.com/AFP

Agence France-Presse ?@AFP 8m
#BREAKING: Malaysia probing possible terror link in jet mystery: minister

[mokawanis]

14. Might be a dumb question but

why aren't they finding debris in the ocean? Did the plane and every single thing on it just sink to the bottom?

[Gravitycollapse]

15. They are searching a massive area and don't know exactly where it impacted.

Not only do they not know the exact point of impact but they also are fighting the currents which carry away and disperse parts of the wreck.

It took several days to find any evidence of the Air France 447 crash under similar circumstance. Even then they only found bits and pieces.

[mokawanis]

17. Thank you for that information

My heart goes out to the family and friends who are waiting for answers.

[okaawhatever]

22. One of the safety experts said that if the plane broke up in the air the debris field could be

scattered for ten miles. That's once they find the debris field to begin with. Since they last had coordinates at 35k feet, and traveling at a speed of over 500 mph the search radius will be huge. It seems they've found the oil slick so that will help. Also, the speed on impact determines how far into the ocean the aircraft goes. Obviously, the deeper into the water, the harder to locate.

[go west young man]

33. 500 mph at 35,000 feet

and not sure of the last position equates to small parts scattered over hundreds of miles and carried on the tide.

[Logical]

19. Fuel tank explosion like TWA 800! nt

[FarCenter]

20. Sudden disappearance over water is rare, but it happened in the early days of the Comet

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Comet#Operational_history

Metal fatigue caused the fuselage to suddenly rip open.

[Gravitycollapse]

21. It happened just a few years ago with Air France 447.

[FarCenter]

23. In that case, there was very bad weather; in this case, flying conditions were fine.

However, another difference is that this plane disappeared over water that is about 60 to 75 meters deep.

[Gravitycollapse]

30. Actually, 447 crashed due to pilot error combined with mechanical malfunction...

Namely, iced over pitot tubes which gave invalid airspeed measurements causing the flight computers to go a bit wonky. But the pilots seem to have overcorrected, assuming the computers were still in anti-stall mode, and stalled the aircraft.

The weather was not out of the ordinary for that region of airspace.

[DinahMoeHum]

25. Why not "Ask The Pilot"? - Patrick Smith

http://globalnews.ca/video/1196335/interview-pilot-patrick-smith-comments-on-missing-malaysian-plane


"I know people want answers right away, but. . .critically, in a case like this, what we have to do is step back and realize we are not going to get an answer right away. . ."

[Deep13]

26. here's a list of possibilities:

1. It crashed.

[Lex]

31. How and why

seem to be part of the discussion as well.

[Deep13]

36. gravity nt

[Lex]

39. How a plane crashed = gravity?

Genius.

[Deep13]

62. What can I say, I'm a Renaissance man.

[WinkyDink]

65. Like Steven Wright? "The sign said 'Breakfast Anytime', so I asked for eggs during the Renaissance."

[WinkyDink]

50. Sarah Palin, is that you?

[Deep13]

63. She doesn't believe in gravity because it is only a theory. nt

[CJCRANE]

58. To crash something needs to get in the way. There aren't many hard objects in the sky.

To drop out of the sky something needs to happen to the plane's structure or it's engines.

[Deep13]

61. yup, then it runs into the ground or sea. nt

[onenote]

27. What is strange is that if there was a mid-air explosion over water

there likely would be a visible debris field on the surface of the sea.

[Lex]

32. A large swath of ocean

may be part of the problem in finding the debris immediately?

[RoverSuswade]

34. Did this happen in one of the "Bermuda Triangle" areas?

There are supposed to be 12 of them around the globe.

[longship]

37. Maybe an invisible flying big foot from a UFO pulled it down.

You never know!

[Madam Mossfern]

52. I was thinking that....

sucked into another dimension.

[Hissyspit]

38. @AP: BREAKING: Malaysian air force chief says radar indicates missing Boeing 777 may have turned bac

@AP: BREAKING: Malaysian air force chief says radar indicates missing Boeing 777 may have turned back

m.twitter.com/AP

[countryjake]

41. So now they're searching on the west coast of Malaysia, too.

Missing Malaysia Airlines plane: Flight MH370 could have made a turn back, says Hishammuddin
http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking-news/se-asia/story/missing-malaysia-airlines-plane-flight-mh370-could-have-made-turn-back-a

"Our main focus is to find the aircraft. There is a possibility that the plane had to make an air turn back so we have to expand the search area," he said.

The search area had expanded to the west coast of Malaysia.

He said Malaysia's Department of Civil Aviation and the Royal Malaysian Air Force were looking into the reasons for the turn back, and would announce their findings later.

He also said he spoke to Singapore's Defence Minister Dr Ng Eng Hen on Saturday who agreed to deploy three Singapore vessels to help with the search.

[xfundy]

45. Seems to me it could be

something more sinister than just a crash. Who was on the plane, for example.

[PCIntern]

51. Recall the passenger list from the Chicago crash many years ago...

there were some significant folk on that plane.

[mainer]

53. Malaysia Airlines has good safety record and is a fine airline

I've flown it to Kuala Lumpur and to Vietnam, and was very impressed. I know a lot of business travelers who like to use this airline.

[AngryAmish]

54. A few years back a 777 lost all nav and radio due to coffee spill

Actually almost all electronics were lost. They had a back up text message type thingy (I'm not a pilot) and the 1st mate first punched in that they were hijacked, then later corrected that it was no radio.

So if ccaptain here lost all nav and radio he would have been flying blind at night. If he turned around and was looking for hime he could have flown into the sea or a mountain.

[Major Nikon]

59. The "text message type thingy" sounds like the transponder

It transmits a 4 digit octal code that identifies the aircraft to ATC. 3 codes are reserved for emergencies. One is hijack, one is comm failure, and one is for all other emergencies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transponder_%28aviation%29#Code_Assignments

[FreeJoe]

55. Putin

Aren't we supposed to blame everything on him now? That commie terrorist makes me so mad!!!

[RoverSuswade]

64. Sarah Palin and Linseed Graham are already blaming....

President Obama.

[Tsiyu]

66. According to some in the Extreme CT camp

( I am not one of them in this instance anyway BTW, merely reporting ) there were 20 Chinese and Malaysian employees ( Freescale? ) - who were working on semiconductor research for the US - aboard that plane.

The day before the crash, Thanh Hoa ( in Viet Nam ) airport declared it would be closed for five days (this is a military-turning-civilian airport I believe and is near the flight path ) ostensibly due to foggy conditions.

The CTers here say the plane was hijacked to Thanh Hoa so the Freescale employees could be kidnapped and tortured for information.

According to this theory, the Chinese are responsible and neither the plane nor the passengers will ever be seen again. This is why no terrorist organization is claiming responsibility.

I think the plane is on the bottom of the ocean or in the jungle, but it does seem like a strange set of circumstances surrounding the way this all unfolded. Those poor passengers and their families suffer either way.

[anneboleyn]

67. The BBC is reporting some debris sightings (apparently a door has been spotted)

[Tsiyu]

68. They did find a door which looks like a cabin door

50 miles south of Tho Chu island, in the same area where some slicks were seen Saturday.
Some have debunked but this could be it.

Although many ships pass through here and could cause oil slicks so there is that, too.

I sure hope they find it soon.