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HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
Tue May 6, 2014, 01:56 PM May 2014

The Shocking Carbon Footprint of Compost

http://appliedmythology.blogspot.com/2013/01/the-shocking-carbon-footprint-of-compost.html

"Most people think of composting as a very "green" thing to do, but few realize that composting actually generates a significant amount of the potent greenhouse gases (GHG), methane and nitrous oxide. Yes, composting is better than putting organic wastes into a landfill, but it is not the ideal way to handle large volume, organic waste-streams like animal manure. The better option is anaerobic digestion which I will describe at the end of this post.

These Emissions Are Not A Scientific Surprise

To a microbiologist, it is not surprising that these gases would be generated during composting. Methane and nitrous oxide are formed by certain microbes when there is not enough oxygen available (anaerobic conditions). In the middle of a large-scale compost pile there are micro-sites without oxygen. This occurs even in a pile turned frequently for aeration. This is particularly true during the "hot" phase of the composting process which kills pathogens and weed seeds. During the period of very high oxygen demand, some parts of the pile will run short and the anaerobic organisms will make methane and nitrous oxide.

..."



Well, I found it to be interesting, anyway.

23 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The Shocking Carbon Footprint of Compost (Original Post) HuckleB May 2014 OP
Um, ick. Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #1
When there is a balance of carbon to nitrogen of 25-30:1. TexasProgresive May 2014 #3
Thanks for that info Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #6
What you did there is indeed "composting". waddirum May 2014 #22
treated properly, animal waste is safe and beneficial for composting. in fact, entire animal piratefish08 May 2014 #18
This is not smart TexasProgresive May 2014 #2
agreed. Furthermore, the article is about very large scale (factory farm) manure piles magical thyme May 2014 #4
Absolutely right. silverweb May 2014 #5
Exactly. nt laundry_queen May 2014 #7
perspective...we need more of it Supersedeas May 2014 #9
Especially since the point of composting is to grow new (co2 absorbing) plants. n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #12
Thanks for confirming my hunch... sendero May 2014 #20
The only thing animal-connected I put in my compost pile Le Taz Hot May 2014 #8
Yes, I'm mostly talking about commercial-scale composting grapedoc May 2014 #10
Welcome to DU lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #13
It's not industrial exploitation of natural resources on an epic scale, it's compost and cow farts! killbotfactory May 2014 #11
thats why you turn a compost pile. this is nature doing exactly what it is supposed to do. piratefish08 May 2014 #14
it's the uncomposted waste from factory farms that is a REAL issue. piratefish08 May 2014 #15
What some don't seem to understand TexasProgresive May 2014 #16
the state of VT (where I live) is mandating commercial and then household composting over the next piratefish08 May 2014 #17
That is a good thing to do TexasProgresive May 2014 #19
My neighborhood Dorian Gray May 2014 #21
Well I guess we'd better pipi_k May 2014 #23

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
1. Um, ick.
Tue May 6, 2014, 02:06 PM
May 2014
but it is not the ideal way to handle large volume, organic waste-streams like animal manure.


I don't put 'animal manure' in my compost. The only animal-related product that goes in is egg-shells.

Adding manure to a compost pile seems like a great way to concentrate the sorts of bacteria you don't really want near your food.

TexasProgresive

(12,148 posts)
3. When there is a balance of carbon to nitrogen of 25-30:1.
Tue May 6, 2014, 02:52 PM
May 2014

and enough but not to much moisture + air the pile will support aerobic bacteria which will cause rapid breakdown of the organic material and at the end the fermentation will create so much heat that the bacteria kill themselves off. Any one of these factor off and the pile is not properly composting. Manure tends to higher nitrogen and so is a good addition to straw and other carbonaceous materials. Too much carbon and the pile never really heats, too much nitrogen and it stinks, water is critical and air. When there is not enough air the pile can be anaerobic and these are bacteria you don't want plus the pile stinks.

When you have a good pile and you turn it in the winter it will steam from the heat and the material will look ashy.

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
6. Thanks for that info
Wed May 7, 2014, 08:02 AM
May 2014

I never really looked into the details of how composting worked, I just knew that if I threw all my leaves, eggshells, and plant waste into the corner of the yard, eventually it compacted down and I could shovel it over a bit and take some to mix into new garden beds to loosen up the hideous clay we call soil. I don't think mine really heats up, so it's probably almost all carbon

waddirum

(976 posts)
22. What you did there is indeed "composting".
Thu May 8, 2014, 08:53 AM
May 2014

People think it is much more sophisticated than that (it can be if you make it), but essentially you just use a shovel and make a pile.

piratefish08

(3,133 posts)
18. treated properly, animal waste is safe and beneficial for composting. in fact, entire animal
Thu May 8, 2014, 06:51 AM
May 2014

carcasses can be composted in large enough piles with the right equipment. large scale composting is the same as small scale when done properly.

TexasProgresive

(12,148 posts)
2. This is not smart
Tue May 6, 2014, 02:40 PM
May 2014

All organic material decays and carbon gases are emitted. This is the cycle of life. Green plants take carbon from the air and through the magic of photosynthesis converts it into food, fiber and whatever. When the plant dies or is consumed the carbon eventually gets back into the air.

Composting is not the cause of climate change, ruminants belching and farting are not the cause. The cause is taking massive amounts of carbon that was sequestered deep underground and burning it in power plants, cars and trucks and airplanes. That carbon long ago was in the atmosphere and somehow ended up buried. We have been putting it back in the atmosphere at an exponential rate from the beginning of the industrial age.

Composting is good.

 

magical thyme

(14,881 posts)
4. agreed. Furthermore, the article is about very large scale (factory farm) manure piles
Tue May 6, 2014, 02:54 PM
May 2014

not small, backyard compost piles.

Size matters. The small, correctly made compost pile will have good O2 access throughout.

sendero

(28,552 posts)
20. Thanks for confirming my hunch...
Thu May 8, 2014, 07:21 AM
May 2014

... that this article is more junk-science bullshit.

In any event, I have 2 compost piles and they are not going anywhere.

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
8. The only thing animal-connected I put in my compost pile
Wed May 7, 2014, 08:58 AM
May 2014

are eggshells. So, now rotting vegetables are bad for the environment? Really? Color me skeptical.

grapedoc

(1 post)
10. Yes, I'm mostly talking about commercial-scale composting
Thu May 8, 2014, 01:10 AM
May 2014

I first learned about composting as a kid in the early 60s from my grandpa who was an avid reader of Organic Gardening Magazine from Rodale. My job was often to turn his compost. I don't think that small scale, gardener compost or vermiculture is any sort of GHG issue, and it is certainly better than sending food waste to the land-fill. BTW, those of you who could also raise chickens might consider giving your food waste to Soldier Fly "grubs" who can turn almost any food waste into great chicken feed: http://catawbacoops.com/soldier-fly-larvae-as-a-cheap-food-source-for-chickens.html

killbotfactory

(13,566 posts)
11. It's not industrial exploitation of natural resources on an epic scale, it's compost and cow farts!
Thu May 8, 2014, 01:20 AM
May 2014

Don't be fooled, it's personal habits and livestock causing catastrophic global climate change.



piratefish08

(3,133 posts)
14. thats why you turn a compost pile. this is nature doing exactly what it is supposed to do.
Thu May 8, 2014, 05:39 AM
May 2014

farming 101. we have luxuriously rich farming soil and have never put a thing into it but compost.

TexasProgresive

(12,148 posts)
16. What some don't seem to understand
Thu May 8, 2014, 06:27 AM
May 2014

is that the green house gasses from the decay of animal and plant waste is normal. It does not add or take away from what is present. It will happen no matter what anyone does. If no cows eat the plant matter it will decay on its own when it dies releasing the carbon dioxide that it converted to sugars, proteins and fiber. It is coal, gas and oil that was sequestered safely deep underground whose carbon we are putting into the air that is the problem- it is not cows or their waste.

piratefish08

(3,133 posts)
17. the state of VT (where I live) is mandating commercial and then household composting over the next
Thu May 8, 2014, 06:40 AM
May 2014

few years. why? because those millions of lbs of uncomposted food wastes DO cause a landfill and methane problem. they DON'T cause a problem when properly composted. people unconnected with the land on BOTH sides of the issue need to educate themselves if we are ever going to escape the factory farm atrocities we are facing.....

TexasProgresive

(12,148 posts)
19. That is a good thing to do
Thu May 8, 2014, 07:03 AM
May 2014

The methane from natural sources such as household waste is a local problem because it tends to be concentrated. Some communities and using the methane from landfills to power equipment. But once again the greenhouse gases produced by the decay of natural plant and animal matter is just the natural cycle of life. It does not add or subtract from the overall greenhouse gases. The introduction of additional gases comes from fossil fuels only.

I live in a rural area. In the summer one can see a natural smog as a haze under the trees in the distance caused by the decay of fallen trees and leaves. They decay and produce nitrogen and carbon gases which react with the sunlight to make smog. That will go on regardless of whether in a compost pile or a landfill. There is only one way to stop it and that would be to sterilize the earth of plant and animal matter. Our earth was pretty much a closed system until the industrial revolution dug up and burned massive amounts of coal, then turned to oil and gas. This is what has caused the uptick of carbon gases in the atmosphere and oceans.

Dorian Gray

(13,469 posts)
21. My neighborhood
Thu May 8, 2014, 07:30 AM
May 2014

in Brooklyn is starting a composting pilot program. Every trash pickup day, they will pickup our compost bins, as well. Pretty cool.

pipi_k

(21,020 posts)
23. Well I guess we'd better
Thu May 8, 2014, 09:41 AM
May 2014

tell all the forest and jungle flora and fauna to stop doing what they've been doing for millions of years.



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