I'm Almost Finished with the Warren book and I have a few thoughts

[Le Taz Hot]

Last edited Tue May 20, 2014, 07:16 AM - Edit history (1)

To the people who declare that she absolutely, positively WILL NOT RUN!11!1! I want to remind them that Warren was RECRUITED to run for the Senate. She had grave doubts. Her family urged her not to do it. But for decades she'd been gathering evidence of how the vultures in the banking industry preyed on the middle class and the poor. She'd been listening to the stories of real people for decades. When she was putting out feelers, exploring whether or not to run for the Senate, as so many had urged her to do, she talked to one middle-aged unemployed lady who walked 3 miles to see her speak (the woman no longer had a car). She told Warren her very heartbreaking story and asked Warren to make a commitment, right then and there, to run for the Senate so we could have SOMEONE representing real people. That's when she made the commitment.

Warren hasn't stopped listening and she'll never stop fighting. She has an innate sense of doing the right thing and I think if enough people call for her to run for the presidency, she will. She will because the people need her. She will because the country needs her.

I just read a column that E.J. Dionne wrote about her and, although I think Dionne is somewhat of a hack most of the time he's right on one point in the article. Hillary Clinton, and, by extension, the Third Way Democrats, will be facing a new electorate in 2016. There's a new populism in the air with the likes of people like Warren and Sanders that eludes the current crop of corporate-friendly cheeseballs who are now "representing" us -- in BOTH parties.

If she will continue to listen to the people, continue to do the right thing, she'll run. And she'll win the nomination and she'll win the presidency. I also predict that she'll be one of our greatest presidents at a time when this country desperately needs a voice for the people. She is that voice.

[Habibi]

1. K & R

[winter is coming]

2. I doubt she'll run in 2016, but I'm sure she'll continue advocating for ordinary people.

Wherever she is, she's not going to give Wall Street a pass.

[liberalmike27]

33. I hope she runs

That said, I hope both she, AND Bernie Sanders don't run. We don't want to dilute what is already going to likely be a minority of the votes. But who knows, maybe not.

Maybe if she got into the race early, she could at least get attention for the issues that matter to many of us, before the media destroys her, and brings Hillary forward, as they surely will.

If anyone is considering buying her book, perhaps you tuck that money away, and send it to a Democratic candidate for office instead. Most of these books tend to say the same things, over and over. Nothing wrong with a little reinforcement--FOX knows that. But when you read a lot of books like this, you find a whole lot of overlap, and as much money as is being thrown at Republicans by the rich and their Corporations, the Democrats are going to need the money.

[daleanime]

41. oh my.....

1-if Sanders runs, she won't. If she runs, Sanders won't. Both want many of the same things and are far too smart to fall into that trap.

2-"minority"? You wish.

3-If we try to make this a money competition we will lose. This is people vs dollars. It's time to change things around here.

[Jackpine Radical]

102. That's precisely my guess.

Bernie knows--has to know--he can't win, and the only point would be to force the conversation leftward, i.e. to expand Overton's Window. If Liz runs, he will have far less motive to do that. Yes, I imagine he's to the left of Liz on a lot of issues, but not far enough left to justify a Quixotic run at the windmills if she's in the game.

[JDPriestly]

55. Have you read the book?

It doesn't say the same things other books say.

I recommend that you read the book before you suggest that sending donations is a better thing to do that reading Warren's book.

We are buying copies of the book and handing them out.

Warren makes a case for fairness in our economic system. She is not a socialist but wants fairness, a commodity that is sorely lacking at this time and not even thought of as having value on Wall Street or in Congress.

What gets us nowhere is throwing money at the same old, same old, corrupt candidates who do not stand up for the middle class and the poor. That's what is hurting our country. Those are the people who are corrupt.

I want to see Warren challenge the third way candidate, whether Hillary or whomever.

I want to see more respect for the rights of individual Americans, fewer ordinary Americans in prison and corruption fought seriously. It is disgusting to read today that Obama played golf with a lobbyist for Bain Capital who specializes in tax issues. Absolutely disgusting.

[TheNutcracker]

103. Run Liz run!

[Aerows]

85. I absolutely do not understand

why anyone in the 99% isn't supporting her to the moon and back. She is probably the best thing to happen to politics (along with Bernie Sanders) as it affects the general populace in too long of a while.

[winter is coming]

87. You'd have to ask them, not me. I'd be delighted to see her run, and the same goes for Bernie.

Both of them are on the right side of the inequality issue, and their past behavior indicates that they're not just talking the talk.

[Aerows]

96. We need them in the debates

and their voices. We have gone so far to the right, even in the Democratic party, that it is amazing we haven't fallen over the cliff yet. We NEED Left voices.

[woo me with science]

113. The 99 percent *will* support her to the moon and back

if the corporatists are not successful in disposing of her candidacy in some fashion before she has a chance to run. Most Americans don't even know who she is yet, but every single measure of the country's mood predicts that she will be a formidable force once people know her message. The naysaying voices you hear now are the same predictable noise, from the same predictable group, that you always hear on DU. They are corporate commercials and nothing more.

I am hoping fervently that she or Bernie or Robert Reich or some other genuine progressive will make it to the platform, but I put absolutely nothing past the criminals who have hijacked this country to do everything within their power to make sure that never happens.

[lovemydog]

3. I would support her 100%

if she decides to run this next election. Of course, I'd support any democratic candidate over a republican. But I'd prefer that Warren get our party's nomination.

[Laelth]

4. k&r for Elizabeth Warren.

That kind of book is a prerequisite for running for President these days. The fact that she wrote and published it means, I think, that she's keeping the option to run open.

-Laelth

[struggle4progress]

5. Elizabeth Warren: ‘I’m Not Running for President’

Apr 21, 2014 5:04pm

In an interview with ABC News, Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., insisted she is not seeking a presidential bid despite suggestions that she could present a formidable threat to former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton in 2016.

“I’m not running for president,” Warren told ABC News’ David Muir in an interview at her home in Cambridge, Mass.

Asked about a recent story that suggested she is “Hillary’s nightmare,” Warren said, “I don’t get who writes these headlines or what they’re about. I think there’s just kind of a pundit world out there” ...

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2014/04/elizabeth-warren-im-not-running-for-president/

[Fuddnik]

7. She told Stephen Colbert the same thing last night.

Stephen took it as a "maybe".

[struggle4progress]

14. He's a funny funny man

[Dawgs]

19. Over 79K posts and still don't understand how politicians work.

Either that or you're willfully ignorant.

She is definitely running.

[magical thyme]

23. Also doesn't understand basic grammar

"am not running" = present tense, i.e., "at this moment in time, I am not running for President."

Which does not rule out declaring to run next year, month, week or deven tomorrow.

Clinton is not, at the moment, "running for president." Jeb is not, at the moment, "running for president." Nobody, ever, is running for president. Until they are.

[Dawgs]

26. And couldn't have been more clear when she was asked, 'Are you running for President in 2016?'

She was asked it twice on Sunday Morning a few weeks back and both times she said, 'I am not running for President'. She deliberately did not say 'in 2016', and it couldn't have been more obvious.

[former9thward]

65. When you say "I am running for President" it triggers legal and campaign finance requirements.

So no one says that until the day they do.

[demigoddess]

42. you reply to a post that is

entirely a quote from Elizabeth Warren and you call the poster ignorant. Look in the mirror, STUPID!

[Dawgs]

45. We'll see who's stupid when she starts her 2016 campaign in about a year. n/t

[Dawgs]

46. Post #23 explains it for those that don't want to believe it. n/t

[struggle4progress]

48. ... "Are you writing this book because you're at least still considering running for president

in 2016?"

"I'm not running for president," Warren said.

"So there's no way you're going to run in 2016?"

"I'm not running for president. You can ask it lots of different ways. But I wrote this book because we can't wait longer. It's written out of gratitude for my start and the opportunities that America built for me, and how I think that's what we've got to do again. I'm committed to that" ...

Elizabeth Warren, the fighter
April 20, 2014, 9:57 AM
CBS News

[Dawgs]

51. Exactly. She's not running now, but maybe in 2016.

There's a reason she answered the way she did. Only someone that doesn't want to believe doesn't see it.

[demigoddess]

170. and then there are those who believe

what they want to believe. A Democratic president might do quite well if Warren were to take over Reid's spot. But, God forbid, we should think she could do anything else than run for president!!! Oh Gee, President H. Clinton, Speaker Pelosi and Senate leader Warren just isn't the same as getting your way!!!

[struggle4progress]

50. Transcript: Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., Talks To ABC News’ David Muir

April 22, 2014
By Arlette Saenz

... DAVID MUIR: Are you gonna run for president?

ELIZABETH WARREN: I'm not running for president.

DAVID MUIR: There's nothing that could change your mind?

ELIZABETH WARREN: I'm not running for president. We have issues we need to deal with right now in 2014. We’ve gotta deal with our kids who can't pay for college, with minimum wage, with Social Security -- with holding big financial institutions accountable. We've got Senate races in 2014. We need to make the focus right now, right now, right now ...

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/transcript-sen-elizabeth-warren-mass-talks-abc-news/story?id=23415394&singlePage=true

[Dawgs]

52. What's your point? EW is not running now. Doesn't mean she can't in the future. n/t

[struggle4progress]

63. Perhaps she says it best herself: "We have issues we need to deal with right now in 2014.

We’ve gotta deal with our kids who can't pay for college, with minimum wage, with Social Security -- with holding big financial institutions accountable. We've got Senate races in 2014. We need to make the focus right now, right now, right now"

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/transcript-sen-elizabeth-warren-mass-talks-abc-news/story?id=23415394&singlePage=true

Yeah, she's a smart woman. Maybe more folk should pay attention to what she says

[Hissyspit]

129. So she'll run in 2015?

[JDPriestly]

104. Merely proves Elizabeth Warren is no dummy. She can't be tricked and isn't playing her hand one

way or the other.

[struggle4progress]

53. Compare her background to that of Presidents in the last 50 years

She's a smart woman, and she's on the proper policy side, but she doesn't have enough political experience to mount a successful Presidential campaign in 2016 -- and she repeatedly says she's not interested

Lyndon Johnson
US House 1937 - 1949
US Senate 1949 - 1961
Vice President of US 1961 - 1963
finished Kennedy's term US Presidency 1963-1965
Total: over a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

Richard Nixon
US House 1947 - 1951
US Senate 1951 - 1953
Vice President of US 1953 - 1961
unsuccessful campaign for US Presidency 1960
unsuccessful campaign for Governor of California 1962
Total: over a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

Jimmy Carter
Georgia State Senate 1961 - 1966
unsuccessful campaign for Governor of California 1966
Governor of Georgia 1971–1975
unsuccessful campaign for US Presidency 1976
Total: about a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

Ronald Reagan
Governor of California 1967–1975
unsuccessful campaign for US Presidency 1976
Total: about a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

George HW Bush
unsuccessful campaign for US Senate 1964
US House 1967 - 1970
unsuccessful campaign for US Senate 1970
US Ambassador to UN 1971 - 1973
Vice President of US 1981 - 1989
Total: over a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

Bill Clinton
Attorney General of Arkansas 1977-1979
Governor of Arkansas 1979 - 1981
unsuccessful campaign for Governor of Arkansas 1979 - 1980
Governor of Arkansas 1983 - 1993
Total: over a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

George W Bush
unsuccessful campaign for US House 1978
worked on father's Presidential campaign 1988
worked on father's Presidential campaign 1991
Governor of Texas 1995-2000
Total: years of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

Barack Obama
Illinois State Senate 1997-2004
US Senate 2005 - 2008
Total: about a decade of real political experience prior to successful Presidential run

[JDPriestly]

105. Read the book. You will be surprised by Elizabeth Warren's experience. She downplays it but

it is definitely there.

[JI7]

82. i know how politicians work which is why i don't think she is going to run for PRes

at least not in 2016

[Beacool]

110. You are insulting a poster because that person quoted Warren?

Who's the willfully ignorant?

[Dawgs]

141. It's not my fault if the poster got insulted for not interpreting the quote correctly.

I was just pointing out that Warren said she's not running for president right now. Which is true. That doesn't mean she can't change her position at anytime. The poster is choosing to believe that she will never run. That is being willfully ignorant.

[JDPriestly]

56. Read the book. She answers when she is called.

We just need to call Elizabeth Warren.

Her life is a very positive story about a poor girl who said "yes" over and over when opportunities to serve and be useful arose. She will say "yes" if she is called. That is who she is. She will say "yes" even if she is busy baking peach cobbler. She will say "yes" if we want her.

Read the book and decide whether you want her to run.

[joshcryer]

70. Get to work.

[Aerows]

75. I already am. n/t

[joshcryer]

76. Link?

We need a website, forums, mailing lists, meet up locations, volunteers, whole nine yards.

[Aerows]

80. Those motivated to do so

are already working to draft her.

Instead of asking what someone else is doing, why don't you do something if you are interested in doing so?

And by the way, you only have to look on this forum to find an Elizabeth Warren forum. If you donate to her campaign, you are on her mailing list. I know both of those things, because I am motivated to somehow get her in the White House. Why don't you?

[joshcryer]

83. I was with draft Gore.

You have no clue how utterly insanely hard it is.

And then to be shot down?

I refuse to go through that again, and especially not for someone no liberal than Udall. Wyden would be my choice, and even then, no draft movement for me.

Those "motivated to do so" are not doing squat.

[Aerows]

84. You asked for a link

I gave you two. I've also written to her. To claim folks are not doing squat when you don't even realize there is an Elizabeth Warren forum right here on DU, don't realize that all you have to do to get on her mailing list is donate (which clearly I did) kind of shoots your argument in the foot, and reveals that I'm doing quite a bit more than "squat".

And I am not a defeatist, either, contributing to ideas like "it will never work", "you will just be shot down", etc.

See, that kind of defeatism is WORSE than squat. It is counterproductive, unless that is your intent (which given your comments about her, seems like I might be right on the mark).

[joshcryer]

90. Well good luck.

Don't toot your horn too much.

[Aerows]

95. You accuse folks of not doing "squat"

then you tell them not to "toot their own horn" when they describe the "squat" that they are doing?

LOL. OK.

[joshcryer]

122. Leg days are the hardest.

I don't see any significant "squating" from Warren supporters. Just talk, no effort. That's why I said not to toot your horn, because the draft Gore movement was probably the largest in modern history, and it still failed. And yet there's no real substantial Draft Warren movement. 86 likes on the "Draft Warren" Facebook page. This is in stark contrast to the Draft Gore movement which had over 200,000 supporters. Over 600 distinct meetup groups (for locals to talk strategy and push Gore to run). Die hard supporters.

Being out of touch is OK, I'm just trying to get you to say, hey, this is how things really are, because you're in for a really big disappointment if you think a few hundred forum posts and a few polls on a predominately liberal website are proof that Warren has a chance. It's just absurd. The political world doesn't work that way.

[struggle4progress]

6. Elizabeth Warren says she’s not seeking presidency

By Noah Bierman
Globe Staff December 05, 2013

... Warren wasn’t having any of it. She answered with an exaggerated eye roll that cut short any further talk of the 2016 presidential race.

“She doesn’t want to talk about it in any serious way,” said Johnston, a supporter.

On Wednesday, Warren became so sick of media speculation that she might run as a populist alternative to Hillary Rodham Clinton that she made her most definitive statement to date in an attempt to put the issue to rest, promising to remain in the Senate.

“I pledge to serve out my term,” which ends at the beginning of 2019, she said, when pressed during a news conference in downtown Boston with Mayor-elect Martin J. Walsh ...

http://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2013/12/04/elizabeth-warren-pushing-back-presidential-speculation-pledges-fulfill-her-senate-term/gMaKvOvWYYVBSTnjlngRAI/story.html

[struggle4progress]

8. “Senator Warren has said many times, she is not running for President”

Clinton vs. Warren?
November 15, 2013
Posted by Hendrik Hertzberg

[Scuba]

9. Please Elizabeth, pretty please with sugar on it.

[struggle4progress]

10. ... In the interview, Ms. Warren .. said twice that she had no interest in running for president ...

Populist Left Makes Warren Its Hot Ticket
By JONATHAN MARTIN
Published: September 29, 2013

[JDPriestly]

57. Do you want Elizabeth Warren to run?

I most definitely do want Elizabeth Warren to run.

First, I think a lot of Americans would identify with her.

Second, I do not want to see another campaign in which we get pulled to the right because no one who runs from the left. There is no point in talking about voting rights without talking about economic rights.

If we are to continue to function as a capitalist or mixed economy, we have to have regulations that insure some fairness. Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders are the only credible candidates whose records suggest they could believably argue for regulations that will insure fairness.

I love Bernie Sanders, but I know that the establishment Democrats will do anything to make it hard for him to run.

But Elizabeth Warren could run and could be elected. In fact, I think that if she runs there is a good chance she will be elected.

Millions of Americans are angry about the unfairness of what has happened in our economy since about 1964. The American middle class was on the rise. We all had hope. We hoped that Obama would keep his promise to restore that hope.

Obviously, Obama couldn't do that without help from Congress. And who was it in Congress that helped Obama, few as they were, to at least embarrass those many, many members of Congress who could care less about the poor and the middle class? It was Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren as well as Alan Grayson. Most of the other members of Congress have silently acquiesced to the horrible damage continued to be done to the middle class and poor.

Warren is an expert on bankruptcy as you probably know. She can handle numbers, big ones, little ones, and knows why American families are getting the short end in the marketplace.

I'm hoping that Warren will sponsor a revision of the bankruptcy and banking codes among others. I hope she will review our trade agreements for fairness, especially considering the international trade courts.

Give her a chance. Read her book.

[struggle4progress]

62. I like what she says here: "We have issues we need to deal with right now in 2014. We’ve gotta deal

with our kids who can't pay for college, with minimum wage, with Social Security -- with holding big financial institutions accountable. We've got Senate races in 2014. We need to make the focus right now, right now, right now"

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/transcript-sen-elizabeth-warren-mass-talks-abc-news/story?id=23415394&singlePage=true

Maybe some of her many admirers should follow some of her excellent advice

[JDPriestly]

64. We are. We want her to have the attention of all who will be watching during the election

cycle in 2016. I do not think Hillary has a chance to win in 2016. I know a lot of people think she does. But history is not on Hillary's side. Every bill that Clinton signed including NAFTA and the repeal of Glass-Steagall as well as "welfare reform" will come back to haunt Hillary. Hillary should not run. Bill is still loved and admired across America. If Hillary runs, his legacy will be dragged in the mud. Warren should run.

Also, Hillary helped negotiate the TPP. That's going to be another fiasco.

Hillary should not run. She doesn't need the honor or the income. She has little new to offer the nation.

We need Elizabeth Warren to run. Let us see a competition between her ideas about economic reform and the status quo blah-blah of other Democrats who might run.

I will support Bernie Sanders if Elizabeth Warren does not run.

I know how strongly you support civil rights and voting rights issues, and I am on your side with regard to them. But we cannot have meaningful reform when it comes to civil rights especially racial equality, women's rights and voting rights unless we get some fairness in our economy. The only people speaking to the issues of fairness with regard to economic rights -- speaking so as to be heard -- are Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders and maybe Alan Grayson (although with less research and experience to back him up). I had hopes for Marcie Kaptur at one time but haven't heard from her much lately . . . .

For the reasons I explain here, I am surprised that you do not back Elizabeth Warren more. Please read her book. I'd like to hear what you think of her after you read it.

[Aerows]

77. "Maybe some of her many admirers should follow some of her excellent advice"

I hardly think people on a politically Democratic message board discussing politics don't realize how important GOTV and electing Democrats is for both Congressional bodies.

It's kind of like saying that people who frequent a vegan message board are only there looking for new ways to grill beef and chicken.

[JDPriestly]

106. Neither of my senators is running in 2014, and my progressive representative will win without

a fight. Last time I think he got over 80%.

We need to start now to get a good candidate to run in 2016. And Elizabeth Warren is that candidate.

How about your state? Are Democratic victories sure? If not, I hope Democrats will win.

[Cal33]

93. I'm with you. I wish Elizabeth will run. Our country needs someone

like her very, very badly -- in fact, our situation is desperate. We've done our
experimenting with Third Way Democrats. And I think they represent failure.
And time is not on our side.

I also realize that even Elizabeth wouldn't be able to accomplish much if, for example, both Houses of Congress should fall under GOP control. We've got to
make sure that this won't happen.

[The Wizard]

11. I have a friend

who so wants Hillary for a new mommy that he went into a sever depression when Obama won the nomination. He joined PUMA and other radical movements. With him it's Hillary or nothing. I believe he'd vote for Goering if Hillary didn't get the nomination. And if Hillary does get the nomination let's hope she'll recognize the Zeitgeist and come down on the side of the people rather than the big money. I'll vote for and work for a candidate who promises to jail the crooked bankers who looted the treasury and raped the working class.

[CTyankee]

18. Oh, I think there are plenty of progressives who like Hillary.

I wonder if the other side is working secretly to promote Warren this way because they think she can't win the presidential but Hillary could. Not saying any of those are here at DU, but maybe "out there" it's a ploy...

[Dawgs]

20. LOL! The desperation is thick in this thread. n/t

[CTyankee]

22. Some may pick away at Michelle Nunn because she isn't "progressive" enough...

and her father wasn't too well liked by progressives.

I like Warren a lot and would be thrilled if she won. But, she says she's not running so I believe her. I don't think she is lying.

[Dawgs]

27. I believe her too.

She said she's not running for president. I take that to mean that she's not running right now.

That doesn't mean she couldn't be in 2015/2016. As a matter of fact, in the past she has deliberately avoided saying 'in 2016'.

I think she's seriously thinking about running in the future.

[CTyankee]

29. while that's possible, I really don't know if that is what she wants.

who does?

[Dawgs]

28. In a national election, or a blue state, not being progressive enough would be a problem.

Most liberals in Georgia, like myself, will vote for Nunn to avoid getting Jack Kingston as our next Senator.

[eridani]

60. Yes--the ones who call themselves "progressive" because they are progressive on social issues

Otherwise, they're in the fight on the side of the 1% against everyone else.

[JDPriestly]

107. Read Warren's book. If you are a strong Democrat, you will understand that this is really a

Democratic grass-roots movement.

If you think Hillary is vulnerable due to a campaign to take away progressive votes, I think you miscalculate how little appeal Hillary has to progressive voters who, like us on DU, are well informed.

A Hillary run will be a rehashing of all of the errors and mistakes of the Clinton administration. She would not have nearly as easy a time of it as some of her supporters think.

Just read Warren's book and then respond to the threads by people who want her to run. Please.

[CTyankee]

128. I am on the list at the library to get her book and I look forward to it.

I'd be delighted if she ran. I would happily vote for her. But if she doesn't and HIllary gets the nomination and we progressives stay home, then voila, another Bush type or worse gets in and all we can do then is piss and moan about how awful it all is. I am not prepared to do that. For one thing, I have granddaughters and preserving Roe means a great deal to me. I spent a lot of my life working for reproductive freedom.

[bvar22]

39. "let's hope she'll recognize the Zeitgeist"

There is that "hope" thing again.


"and come down on the side of the people rather than the big money"
...and there is that "change" thing again.

[Lifelong Protester]

12. I'm behind her, whatever she runs for

I also just purchased the book and can't wait to get to it. Thanks for posting your 'review'.

[Omaha Steve]

13. They are scarred of Hillary

They are terrified by Warren!!!

K&R!

[LittleGirl]

15. ordering that book this week

and I agree with everything you have mentioned in your review. She's terrific.

won't vote for Hillary. Ever.

[WillyT]

16. K & R !!!

[Leme]

17. I probably would vote for her

Last edited Tue May 20, 2014, 11:42 AM - Edit history (1)

over Clinton ( and Clinton over the alternative if Warren stays out etc).
-
I am not a "target" tho. I voted, Anderson, Perot, Nader, and a few Dems..McGovern, Carter ?, tankman, Mondale (also in primary..Moonbeam, Dennis, maybe Harkin? )
-
edit: I remember now, I didn't vote for Carter ( or any Republican for Pres. ever)

[davidpdx]

21. I'm still in the middle of reading her book

One thing I can say I am very impressed with her. I'll post my thoughts once I finish the book.

[mopinko]

24. if hillary is smart, she will name her veep

gonna have the first woman president, it would be nice to know we will have a woman president for 4 years, no matter what.

would be smart to just double down

[rhett o rick]

86. Vice President for Sen Warren would be a waste. Rather she stay in the Senate than

be VP for Clinton.

[mopinko]

88. ya got her on the bat phone, do ya?

you really think she would say no? she is an extremely good person, but i dont think she is quite a saint.

[Larkspur]

25. The President and executive branch are the least powerful of the 3 and that was by design

Warren will do more good for ordinary people by remaining in the Senate and pushing the Exec Branch to prosecute banksters and Wall Street fraudsters.

She is not term limited as Senator but she would be as President.

And as we see with Obama, a militant minority can derail the President's agenda and curb his legacy.

[northoftheborder]

35. She has a place to voice her ideas from her Senate seat.

As VP, she would be required to be in the shadow of the President. I hope she stays in the Senate the rest of her life. She has greatest influence there.

[Cal33]

94. She is limited by her age. She has 10 to 12 good years left -- not more.

[Aerows]

98. How many do you think Hillary has?

For that matter how many did you think Reagan had?

Intelligent people are intelligent people. Age is hardly a factor if someone is as sharp as EW is. And HC for that matter, even though I would prefer someone else.

[JDPriestly]

108. One or two progressive voices in the Senate cannot achieve much.

We need Warren to run for president. As a presidential candidate she can serve America best. We shall see what happens when she runs. If she wins, it would be a win for America. If she loses, America still wins just because voters heard her and see her and then she will have more power in the Senate.

[OKNancy]

30. The malcontents will find something they hate about her

and blast her as much as any other Democrat here on DU.*
Fortunately DU is not the real world and is a tiny minority of opinion, both about Warren or Clinton.

* voted against GMO labeling
* voted against the medical devise tax because so many manufactures are in Mass.
* voted to repeal or reduce the estate tax ( definitely not a liberal policy )

[Le Taz Hot]

31. I see the hatchets are in the ready.

That's OK. The woman took on some enormous opposition and came out smelling like a rose each and every time.

So, go ahead and continue your "opposition research." She's a tough lady and she's an honest lady and she fights for the poor and the middle class. It's something that the opposition can never claim.

[JDPriestly]

58. How did Hillary vote on these bills?

And what else was in the bills?

You cannot judge a candidate by what they voted against unless you know what else they voted against when they voted.

So, arguing that someone voted against something is meaningless unless you know why they voted against it.

Was the estate tax repeal part of a general tax overhaul that was flawed in other respects?

Was the GMO labeling bill also flawed in other respects?

If she voted against a medical device tax, that may also be because she was voting to make medical devices cheaper and more accessible to people with low incomes like seniors and the disabled. Healthy people don't use very many medical devices. I would vote against a tax on medical devices too.

[OKNancy]

67. Hillary was not in the Senate at the time these votes were taken.

Perhaps this article will help. http://www.nationaljournal.com/2013-vote-ratings/why-elizabeth-warren-isn-t-the-most-liberal-senator-20140206

If you really cared that much, you could also go to votesmart and see her list of votes.

I know I'm right... the agitators here are going to find something they don't like about her. Mark my words.
She will get the same treatment that Obama, Kerry, Pelosi, Reid, etc get around here.

[JDPriestly]

89. Because she and they do not stand up for the average American.

That's why the extremists on the right can treat them badly.

I like Kerry, Pelosi and Reid. I support Democrats. But I want Elizabeth Warren to run for president. A Hillary candidacy will just mean that the past is dredged up and swung around our heads.

We need to truly look forward. That means we need a candidate with some new ideas and without the ties to lobbyists and big money. That means we need Elizabeth Warren. If you read her book, you will realize that she is a sensible, practical person, not an extremist or crazy type, and that she can win.

Elizabeth Warren is speaking to labor unions, to progressive organizations, to organizations that protect consumers. She is a force to be reckoned with.

Hillary will be running on Bill's record. And while he did some good things, he made serious mistakes that cannot be defended.

I want a woman to run, and that woman is Elizabeth Warren.

[aquart]

118. I truly hate regurgitated right wing talking points on DU.

And the nonsense that Hillary is running on her husband's record and not her own is an insult to her and every woman who cheered her outstanding breakout achievements that are unmatched by any First Lady in our history.

Why don't you just call her Bill's little woman?

[joshcryer]

124. +1

WTF is this shit.

[joshcryer]

123. "Hillary will be running on Bill's record." No she won't. Absurd.

Like 2008 she will distance herself from Bill. Like 2008 posters like you will call her a liar (see: NAFTA).

Clinton will be running on a pro-woman platform and one that seeks to unify the sexes as well as income equality. It will disgust many here because, again, "Clinton is a liar, she can't be trusted." Fortunately the myopic aren't relevant in politics.

[VanillaRhapsody]

32. Why do people who seem to think that EW has so much integrity

believe she is lying when she says she is "not running for President"?

[Le Taz Hot]

34. I know this is an exercise in futility

as it has been explained to you many many times, including once in this thread but, just because I don't have to get up and start work for a couple of minutes, her it is: She is NOT running for president. Neither is Hillary. Neither is anyone else. Stating "I'm not running for president" indicates present tense. She has NOT stated, "I will not run for president." Those of us who still believe Democracy can be revived in this country will be spending the next year to year-and-a-half trying to convince her to do the right thing and give people someone they can vote FOR as opposed to "not as bad as," which, personally, I will never do again.

Now, go sharpen those knives.

[progressoid]

36. Good try.

But like you said, it's an exercise in futility.

[Leme]

37. futility

I still have a few walls with plaster saved for emergencies, better for my head than other walls.

[VanillaRhapsody]

137. No actually it hasn't .....what you are describing is called wishful thinking...and mind reading.

She said she isn't running. I admire her and believe she doesn't lie....why do you?

[Le Taz Hot]

139. And thank you for proving my point.

Carry on and try not to drop your pom poms.

[VanillaRhapsody]

140. You don't have a point.....you are reading into what she said.....

she didn't add the qualifier "at this time"....did she?

So are you a mind-reader or calling her a liar?

[Dawgs]

143. She didn't say "at this time" AND she didn't say "in 2016".

Which means it's VERY POSSIBLE that she could say, as early as today, "I'm running for president now", just as much as she can say "I'm not running for president in 2016".

You can interpret what she's said up until now as 'she will never run for president', and you can choose to interpret it as 'she will run in 2016'. What you can't do is say that she will DEFINITELY NOT run for president in 2016 BECAUSE OF WHAT what she has already said.

[VanillaRhapsody]

144. that is still "mind-reading" no matter HOW you slice it.....

People ARE considering running in 2016. And females in particular....

But you can read her mind....

[Dawgs]

147. So what? Are we not allowed to give our opinion on what we think a politician is saying?

This is a political forum, no? Politicians constantly say things that must be interpreted. When did it become wrong to guess what a politician might be thinking?

[VanillaRhapsody]

149. So you are joining the ranks calling her a liar?

Its not like she HASN'T repeatedly said specifically "I am not running for President"....yet instead of discussing actual candidates on a political forum....you would rather call her a liar and discuss what YOU think she is "really" going to do!

Why don't you discuss whether or not the moon is made of green cheese while you are at it....? Its just as relevant...

[Dawgs]

150. I do believe that she's not running. Why would she? It's 2014.

And, I don't discuss what makes up the moon because I don't care. I do care about seeing Warren choosing to run for president IN 2016. Hopefully one day she will choose to do it.

[VanillaRhapsody]

151. I believe her.....because I trust her. I take her at her word.....

why don't you? Because you are either a mind reader....or you think she is a liar!

If Joe Biden said "I am not running for President" ......would you second guess him or think he only means today not 2016? Would you think he was a liar too?

[Dawgs]

152. I just told you that I believe her. Why don't you trust me? Are you calling ME A LIAR?

She said she's not running for president. I believe her.

In one year she can say 'I wasn't running for president a year ago. Today I am running for president.' And, that's what I'm hoping she does. Get it now?

[VanillaRhapsody]

153. apparently not....

She isn't adding qualifiers....YOU are!

[Dawgs]

154. What qualifiers am I adding?

She said 'I am not running for president', right? I believe her.

I HOPE that at some point in the future she changes her mind. Am I not allowed to do that? If that's adding qualifiers (which it's not) then call go ahead and call me guilty. I can live with it.

[VanillaRhapsody]

156. the "for now" or "this time" or whatever the "Hip Progressives" are using these days...

she said she is not running....and you claim to believe her....YET here you are in a disagreement and you are defending the position of those that ARE calling her a liar and or are mind-reading her! hmmmmmm color me suspicious!

[Dawgs]

159. Wow! You are so scared of EW running that you call 'hoping she changes her mind' as..

disagreement with her.

I feel sorry you. You must be miserable by living in such in fear.

[VanillaRhapsody]

160. Not scared at all....are you trying to read MY MIND now too?

I will gladly vote for her if she ever wins the Democratic Primary. But I trust her and she said she is not interested in running for President.

[Dawgs]

161. There is NO DOUBT that you are scared. Don't need to read your mind. You've made it obvious.

And let me try to make the rest simple for you.

1) EW said she's not running for president. You and I both trust that she's not running for president.

2) EW may change her mind in the future. I hope she does. That's not mind reading.

If you need to respond, and continue to make a fool of yourself, go for it. This is my last post in this thread.

[Le Taz Hot]

162. This one lives for pissing contests.

Post after post after post saying absolutely nothing.

[VanillaRhapsody]

164. like you blend!

[Le Taz Hot]

165. Have since 2001

and this thread was worth 144 recs -- not my highest rec count but not bad for something that took me all of 5 minutes to write.

Now you have yourself a nice day. Y'hear?

[VanillaRhapsody]

166. who cares about your rec count? Is this some sort of scorecard?

it most certainly doesn't prove you right or wrong does it? 100 people agree with you on a site that boasts many many thousands and I am supposed to be impressed?

[VanillaRhapsody]

163. How would you know there is "no doubt I am scared" unless you can read my mind?

You certainly cannot see me doing this through your computer....

[JDPriestly]

59. She isn't lying. She is not running for president at this time.

Neither is any other candidate that I know of. Warren will run if she feels called to run.

Read her book. Just read her book and you will understand why I support Warren for president.

I have seen too many middle class families that might have had a chance in a fair economy be broken apart by he economic unfairness in our economy. We can have capitalism and still have ethical lending laws. We can have capitalism that provides incentives for middle class people and even poor people to save money. We can have capitalism that works for everyone.

But to do that, we have to enforce ethical standards in business and stop corporations that dominate their area of the economy. We need strengthening and enforcement of the laws and regulations that make our economic system fair. We need strong unions, and we need to encourage investment in education, manufacturing and other labor-intensive fields in the US.

Which country would suffer most if we stopped trading with China? with Japan? with Saudi Arabia? Just think about it a bit and then you will understand why I think we need to encourage investment in manufacturing as we have done with oil and gas exploration in the US.

[joshcryer]

127. No, she pledged not to run.

There's never been someone who specifically pledges not to run who then ran. It's always been "I'm not running at this time" or "I don't plan to run." A pledge is a promise. A promise that isn't kept (if in ones power, such as choosing to do something that they can choose not to do) is a lie.

[VanillaRhapsody]

138. You all are adding the "not at this time"....she didn't didn't say those words did she?

Then you are a mind-reader huh? Or calling her a liar.....

Which is it?

[Beacool]

112. Because they can't handle the fact that she's not interesting in running.

She has stated so repeatedly. I respect her enough to take her at her word. They think that she's playing coy. It's an exercise in futility trying to convince them otherwise.

Why waste your time?

[VanillaRhapsody]

146. because its fun watching them flail around like flounders!

[joshcryer]

126. They believe she would renig on a pledge.

Which is basically saying they believe she is a liar.

[VanillaRhapsody]

145. EXACTLY.....they "trust her"....except they don't!

These would also be the same people that will pivot and hate her at the first sign "President Warren" wasn't as far left as they are!

[Phlem]

38. Just got shut out of a pro Obama cheerleading thread where

this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1024&pid=4719

was referred to as cliche.

What do think? Cliche or not. I'm a supporter of EW so you know where I stand.

[Le Taz Hot]

40. There are the old guard BOG individuals

and, seemlingly out of nowhere, a new set of BOG individuals who all showed up at about the same time with the same message. Hmmmmm. The Blind Loyalists will do anything and say anything against anyone not supporting their Chosen One. They do it now with Obama and the Blind Loyalty will carry on with Hillary. But, it's a new day. I'm convinced. There's a new populism in the air and Elizabeth Warren personifies that populism. The Democratic Party can get on board or be forever relegated to irrelevancy. It's their choice.

[Phlem]

43. Love this! ^^^^^^^

-p

[winter is coming]

68. The "hive, DEFEND!" reflex does seem to have largely shifted from Obama to Hillary.

Apparently, he's already a lame duck. Seems a bit early for that, to me.

[VanillaRhapsody]

148. Pot meets Kettle!

MAO!

[VanillaRhapsody]

158. So being Democrats and supporting Democrats on DU is now called "blind loyalty"?

Elizabeth Warren has said REPEATEDLY she is NOT running for President! She is NOT a candidate....she is not going to oppose anyone!

Get "convinced" to follow whomever wins the Democratic Primary! Elizabeth Warren is telling you that it won't be HER!

However it seriously looks like it WILL be Hillary Clinton because her approval ratings among Democrats and everyone else is through the roof and hasn't been seen since Eisenhower! Are you calling them all "blind Loyalists"? Or are you just chewing your sour grapes?

[VanillaRhapsody]

157. Everyone here is a "supporter" of "EW"

I like her very much. However I consider her a truth teller....and she has repeatedly said she is NOT running for President and I honor her decision.

[Fearless]

44. She has my vote over anyone

From any party.

I can't wait to say Madam President. She would be a perfect first woman president.

[ieoeja]

47. The first thing people running for President typically do is write a book. Call me when she does.

Oh, wait.

[OldRedneck]

49. I finished her book and here's my $0.02

I'm supporting Hillary because she can win. I'm VERY UNCOMFORTABLE with the Clintons' associations with the big banks and all the usual Wall Street suspects.

I think Warren would be better in the Semnate where she has a lifetime seat and where her influence will expand dramatically.

REMEMBER THIS: In 2016, with Hillary at the top of the ticket where she's poised to take a record number of states, Democrats will be defending only 10 Senate seats while Republicans must defend 23 Senate seats. There's good chance in 2016 for Democrats to take both House and Senate . . . and to take the Senate by a large margin.

Leave Warren where she is; she can do much more good there.

[MannyGoldstein]

73. Can you name a couple of tough fights that Hillary's won? Ever?

Warren's won several - she got the CFPB started, and beat Massachusetts' most popular politician after starting 20 points behind in the polls.

[JDPriestly]

109. As I said above, if Hillary runs, all of Bill's mistakes and more will be slung around by the TV.

I do not think that a Hillary run would mean a Hillary victory. Not at all.

Let's see how Hillary would do in a primary in which she was running against a true populist like Warren or Sanders or both. I don't think Hillary would do well at all.

[joshcryer]

125. Of course they will, but the American public will dismiss it.

It won't gain traction because Clinton will show herself to be distinct from Bill, despite what the naysayers think.

[Helen Borg]

54. I would quit my job and work on her campaign

[zentrum]

61. We'd work our

....asses off for her if she runs.

[DesertDiamond]

66. I've said before and I'll say again. I want a woman to be President someday soon. But when...

was the last time Hillary Clinton stood up for us, the people? I'm open to anyone who can give me something, some reason to think she'd be great for us. The people.

[winter is coming]

69. The thing I find most interesting about Warren...

is talking about her on DU quickly leads to a rash of "She's not running!" posts. It's as if, "She's not running!" is a garlic necklace to ward off vampires.

[MannyGoldstein]

71. Some people really, really need us to know she's not running

Really important. Urgent.

Abandon all hope.

[Beacool]

114. It's in response to the myriad of posts insisting that she's running, all facts to the contrary.

What does she have to do to be believed by her loyal supporters?

[winter is coming]

133. No; if that were so, I'd expect to see periodic, casual responses with an air of mild amusement

and/or annoyance. Instead, it's more like having an Emergency Containment Squad, determined to keep an outbreak of dangerous notions from infecting the country, as if our very lives depend upon no one entertaining an inappropriate idea.

[Benton D Struckcheon]

72. I hope you're right.

That's a bold prediction, but it's always been true that the person who captures people's imaginations early on is the one who gets the nomination. McGovern did it in '72, Carter in '76, Obama in '08. They were all discounted by the Establishment when they started, and had completely upended it when they got the nomination. We'll see.

[Aerows]

74. I would walk on broken glass

and carry a bucket of gasoline through hell to get her elected if she decides to run.

[reformist2]

81. I would too.

[roody]

78. I worry for her personal safety.

[Utopian Leftist]

79. From your hands to the ears of Goddess

I pray that you are right.

We desperately need a true progressive to take hold of the reins before the whole country goes off the rails on a crazy train.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

91. we're in an era now of citizen participation.

Through the dark era of dumbya, we knew our voices were worthless. We saw our votes and voices stomped continuously .

PBO'S time is showing us that we CAN be heard, once again---IF we act. Again and again.
Even when it looks bleak,
even when we're tired or enraged or depressed.

THAT really is the hope and change.

This is the preparation for an Elizabeth Warren.

We have the gift of the innertoobz now, which connects us all. It's easy enough to add your voice. And TO HELL with anyone who says, "OHHH it won't work. Don't bother. Petitions don't help." Screw that---you got that kind of attitude? Go apply for an ops position with your local repuke office.

[rgbecker]

92. Run, Elizabeth, Run.

[Vattel]

97. I hope she runs.

It would be great to have a president that actually has expertise on economics.

[Aerows]

99. I'll be honest

I read a Washington Post article today, and frankly, it seems like everyone on Wall Street is terrified she could run and win.

Scared shitless of her popularity and her populism. You know what that means to me? She NEEDS to be in the Oval Office.

Mealy mouthing about holding people accountable while looking the other way doesn't get the job done, and EW has been up front about her mission from the beginning. She doesn't equivocate or weasel word things.

That's why I think she could be the best thing to happen to this country for a long (too long) time.

[Cleita]

100. I hope to find it at my library soon. Thanks for the heads up. eom

[spooky3]

101. We need to find the woman you described in pgh 1 and

thank her--and then ask her to speak again with Sen Warren!

[Beacool]

111. Oh gee, here we go again.

It'll be inauguration day in 2017 and someone will still be suggesting that Warren will definitely, absolutely, for sure, be running.

How about respecting the woman enough to take her at her word? Does she have to take a blood oath?

Mark Twain had it right, denial ain't just a river in Egypt............

[Jasana]

115. We desperately need her voice in the Senate....

but if she decides to run for prez, I will be behind her all the way.

[aquart]

116. NO ONE WHO SUGGESTS PITTING OUR MOST MAGNIFICENT WOMEN AGAINST EACH OTHER IS A FRIEND.

It's divide and conquer.

And shame on any of us who gets taken in by this sucker ploy.

[Le Taz Hot]

117. I've no idea what that means.

[BlueMTexpat]

131. +1000! eom

[winter is coming]

134. WTF? We're talking about an election, not a cage match.

When did "may the best man (er, person) win" become "divide and conquer"? Who's "allowed" to compete in the 2016 primary?

[Le Taz Hot]

136. Apparently, we're just supposed to wait around

for the coronation. They are getting their chonies in a bunch about Warren, aren't they?

[winter is coming]

142. But Warren has endorsed Hillary! And Bernie's an old Socialist who's not a Democrat!

And... and...

I've seen people say that the nomination is Hillary's for the taking. I've even seen people claim that X won't run if Hillary does, as if Hillary were some unstoppable juggernaut. If she's so inevitable, why is so much effort spent on quashing the notion that other-than-Hillary is an option worth exploring?

[aquart]

168. Disingenuous, much?

Proposing Warren against Clinton in a FIRST race is exactly a cage match. The goal is to have them cancel each other out.

We weren't stupid enough to pit Elijah Cummings or Cory Booker against Obama. But you want Warren against Clinton? SHAME!

[winter is coming]

171. No, I'm quite serious. Who's supposed to decide when candidates are "allowed" to run?

Why do you think Warren and Clinton would "cancel" each other? Surely not simply because they're both female; that would be incredibly shallow.

You seem to think that the candidates who appear in a primary election should a priori be limited by someone other than the voters to an "acceptable" slate. That is what I'd call shameful.

[emsimon33]

119. Elizabeth Warren is the hope that Obama spoke of and then wasn't

[supercats]

120. Agree 100%

We need Elizabeth Warren to be our next President!!! The country needs her, the people need her, and the world needs her to be that shining example. She is change I can believe in!!!

[cantbeserious]

121. Kick And Recommend

eom

[BlueMTexpat]

130. It is nice that you believe that, but if you at least

give Elizabeth enough respect to believe what she herself is saying now and what she actually has done, i.e., "urge" Hillary to run in 2016 (http://blogs.rollcall.com/hawkings/16-senate-women-say-run-hillary-run-in-2016/), it is quite clear that, if Hillary runs in 2016, Elizabeth will not.

If Hillary does not run, then we have a whole new ball game. But not until then.

In the case of Elizabeth's run for the Senate, there was no other woman in Massachusetts who could have commanded such support against Scott Brown. The Senate is an excellent training ground for her and I love what she is doing there. Right now, MA needs her.

Hillary has the stature, experience and global respect that no other American woman can command at this time. By global respect, I don't necessary mean international leaders, although she does have that from her SOS and First Lady experiences, because they can't vote in US elections. I am talking about the US expat community - and we do donate significantly to US candidates.

I literally adore Elizabeth Warren in just about every way and sincerely believe that she will indeed run for President some day. When she does, I will be firmly behind her candidacy, assuming I am still on earth. But if Hillary runs, "some day" for Elizabeth will not occur in 2016. Elizabeth herself needs more seasoning and experience at the national level (she herself knows this), and definitely more experience at the international level which is absolutely crucial in this highly interconnected world. If Hillary runs in 2016, Elizabeth will certainly inherit Hillary's already impressive network of support in the future and that is all to the good.

Many here will disagree with these assessments and they are certainly free to do so. But as someone who has lived and worked abroad for the past 20 years (as well as another eight years combined before this stint) at fairly senior international civil servant levels and also worked for the USG among other employers (public and private) on the domestic front, as well as being a long-time observer of the US political scene and a life-long Dem supporter who is a woman (sister, wife, mother, aunt, grandmother, etc.), I certainly have good reason to believe that my experience and common sense are on-track.

[Le Taz Hot]

135. And many of us disagre with you.

I'm not going to say why here because it has all been said before and will all be said again. This is a thread about my impressions of Elizabeth Warren's latest book, what it says about her and what it would mean for this country and it's current state of oligarchy if she decided to run.

With your vast experience, superior wisdom and unequaled common sense I'm sure you're capable of starting your own thread extolling the virtues of Hillary Clinton. And since there are dozens of new Clinton supporters on DU, almost out of nowhere one might say, along with the current prolific fan base, I'm sure there will be plenty of her supporters here to gladly agree, with almost orgasmic exuberance, support said thread. Feel free to do so.

[BlueMTexpat]

167. Well - I guess that I've

been thoroughly told off.

[B Calm]

132. She is a winner!

[riverwalker]

155. from your keyboard to Gods ears

the country needs her.

[woo me with science]

169. kick